The Titanium Vault hosted by RJ Bates III
RJ Bates III, affectionately referred to as the Viking Wizard by his students, started his real estate investing career in 2014 after attending a real estate education program that put him $65,000 in debt. RJ contracted his first deal he found on the MLS and wholesaled it for a $7,500 assignment fee. That was the end of his former life and the beginning of his venture into becoming a real estate investor. Since that moment, RJ has become an influential figurehead in the real estate investing industry. He has successfully purchased and sold over 2,000 properties all across the USA including wholesale deals, rehabs, rentals, owner finances and short term rentals. One of his passions is being the host of The Titanium Vault Podcast where he interviews the top real estate investors and finally, RJ has won back to back Closers Olympics earning him the reputation as the King Closer!
The Titanium Vault hosted by RJ Bates III
If We Have a National Association of Wholesalers Who Would You Want to Lead? | Pardon The Disruption
Welcome to Pardon the Disruption, an entrepreneurship debate podcast featuring RJ Bates III, Steve Trang, Chris Jefferson, Jimmy Vreeland and Eric Brewer.
Topics Discussed:
1. Lately, many music fans have been criticizing the sudden and unreasonable increase in concert ticket prices in the past year. For Real Estate investors, what’s a reasonable price for attending a live event/mastermind to improve their business?
2. What’s your favorite type of property to purchase?
3. When looking for deals and sellers, what are your criteria for qualifying and disqualifying a deal?
4. If we have a national association of wholesalers who would you want to lead it?
5. With the Arizona Diamondbacks and Texas Rangers given next to zero chance to win the World Series at the beginning of the season, How can entrepreneurs who come from a poor background change their generational future despite the odds being against them?
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I'm not sure Am.
Eric Brewer:I getting like a countdown. That's what the five, four, three, two, one, one.
RJ Bates III:Oh, we're high. There he is. Yes, I promise the rest of the show is going to be better than my start. There I'm the guest host. Are J base, the third, filming for Potter? Our boys out?
RJ Bates III:there learning how to be a host. We're looking forward to today's episode, especially considering the fact that after three victories in a row, they push me to be the host and I could no longer compete. So, if you don't know how the show works, we're going to have six questions, five of which are pretty selected, one of which is directly from you guys, the audience. The guys will have 45 seconds roughly to answer and then after that they'll pick up the question and they will choose whoever answered the best. If I can't decide which I rarely struggle with this I'll take it to the chat, and whoever wins the chat vote will get the point. Let's start off today by introductions. E.
Jimmy Vreeland:B Eric. Are you doing today, man? Great low energy kickoff to the call. Today our jam already have to sleep.
RJ Bates III:Thanks, jimmy. You can go to the chat. Eric, you're muted bro.
Eric Brewer:That's a great start to tell we gotta get this out of the gate. Let's tell Jimmy his name for the rest of the show is going to be Robert, sorry, much like Robert Corey who played for the Spurs, but since he has a little colesaur on his lip, for the remainder of the show Just gonna focus on jay members. I thought he's too some kind of surrogate 来.
Jimmy Vreeland:Come on man anyway.
Eric Brewer:Come on a podcast and say it's the hub like With vulnerability and transparency here, right. So Anyway, happy to be here. Good to see RJ Shout out the Potter learn into be a real estate agent. I hope he's having some success.
RJ Bates III:There you go, mr Train, how you doing.
Steve Trang:Great start to the show. I watched mr Beast video this morning talking about how important the first five seconds is, like the most critical thing in Any YouTube video. So we had 10 subscribers when we send people watching live. When we started right after our days, intro went down to four. So it's gonna be great show. I'm looking forward to this.
RJ Bates III:Awesome. You're probably not gonna win today, cj, the reason why we're all started 12 minutes late. How you doing today?
Chris Jefferson:I'm doing fantastic, man. I'm feeling rested, I'm patient, feeling timely. So it's good to be here, good to see everybody. Jimmy, I hope you're doing well. Let's get to it, yeah.
RJ Bates III:Yeah, no. Next we have PTD's version of John Federman. How you doing, jimmy?
Jimmy Vreeland:Hey there, robert story here I've also lately. My latest affiliate agreement has been with Valtrex. So Uh, jimmy veal dot com, slash val tracks. If you have any stores you need to take care of, oh man.
RJ Bates III:All right, let's get into it. Question number one Lately many music fans have been criticizing the sudden and unreasonable increase in concert ticket prices in the past year. For real estate investors, what's a reasonable price for attending a live event? Slash mastermind To improve their business, eric.
Eric Brewer:Uh, I think there is no maximum price. You know, at the end of the day, if we're talking about A real estate mastermind, a real estate meetup, a mentor, whatever it may be, if you're getting value out of it, I wouldn't put any Cap on it. If I can go there and spend a hundred thousand dollars to be Surrounded by people for three days that I get two hundred thousand dollars worth of value out of as an investor, anything that I can see an ROI on is a wise investment, regardless of the price. Um, so I don't think there's a cap you can put on it. It's all about what you get out of it.
RJ Bates III:All right, steve, what?
Steve Trang:about you. Well, unfortunately, uh, I see a lot of similarities between my answer and erics. It really comes down to what you believe you're gonna get out of it, right, if you're, if you go into a mastermind, thinking is going to help you add this much top line and eventually bottom line to, uh, your business, then you know a multiple, a fraction of that should be what you'd be willing to invest. I give an example here A long, long time ago, when I was trying to get pace morby to sell me his deals, he was telling me he was going to the samler office Right where all the home vesturaries guys are hanging out every friday. For me personally, I was willing to spend twenty thousand dollars To be in that room because I know there's no way I'm not going to do at least one twenty k deal in that room in the next 12 months. So I think it just ultimately comes down to what you think you'll get out of that mastermind.
RJ Bates III:So we just found out that steve's one deal he does a year is twenty thousand dollars.
Steve Trang:Yes, that's what we found out vulnerability, vulnerability CJ. What about you?
Chris Jefferson:Yeah, I mean, I think you're paying for experience, right? Uh, if you're going to a mastermind or meet up, you're paying for the experience gained From that, just like going to a big time concert. So, you know, I think you pay whatever you need to pay, that you can afford To get in the room and then actually have money left over to take action on the information that's given. Uh, I think you got to make sure that you're able to lead with value when you go to these types of things, but I don't think there's a price on it. You know, uh, whatever that experience has worked to you, uh, I think you spend the money and make sure you get yourself in the room and you take full advantage of Making sure you live that experience.
RJ Bates III:All right, jimmy the uh. The floor is wide open for you to actually answer the question here.
Jimmy Vreeland:I would like to see a clear pathway to double my money. So if it's 25, like, oh, can I do two or three deals, make my money back pretty quick, especially when you're starting out and maybe cash might be tight. I'd say you want to see a clear pathway to double your money.
Steve Trang:I'll say this. So, uh, chris jefferson over here invited me to go hang out with him at click funnels in orlando, florida, and then he stood me up, right, but it was a thousand bucks right to go to click funnels. And there was one thing I took away there that I already know is going to make me an extra six figures right in the next year. So, like what is a worthwhile investment for me, a thousand dollars was a steal To take away. That one thing I learned right. So I think when people go in there like, oh, it costs too much. If your attitude or if your focus is on cost, I have one thing and this is not going to be a popular thing, but you're just going to stay broke if your focus strictly on cost, you're not focused on value, you have Unconsciously put a limit on how much money you can make.
Eric Brewer:So I have, on a side note, I'd like to maybe make a suggestion about how we can earn extra points, and it's to come up with a funny nickname for jimmy and and an alignment with his current lip situation. So I have one here In the vein of real estate. I would say that he does self storage, self for like so rich self storage. I have other ones, but that's my one for round one. I think I should get some consideration for bonus points. Well, I actually had an intelligent thought while erica was going on.
Jimmy Vreeland:But For mastermind in particular, like, the way you get your ROI is you get out of that room and you actually implement Whatever one thing you learn, like Steve, whatever you learn to click funnels. You know great that you had this Epiphany, but it's a, would you agree? It's on you to implement and make sure you get that return. Oh, for sure.
Steve Trang:I mean, I took that concept and I implemented it right away Because, like there are, there are mastermind junkies that I think they love being.
Jimmy Vreeland:Infotained and they never really Executed and whatever their one thing is so.
Chris Jefferson:If you're spending money to go somewhere like an event, meet up, mastermind, whatever you should have a game plan. You should be going to that event or mastermind with some sort of game plan on what you're looking to extract from it and a plan on how you plan to do that. You should be looking at who the speakers are. You should be looking at who's holding the mastermind. You should be vetting that person out, seeing do they have the information that you need? Is it going to be available at this particular event? And then you go in in a targeted way and you extract it.
Jimmy Vreeland:Yeah, that's absolutely cool. Go ahead, Steve.
Steve Trang:Yeah, I was saying Tent is absolutely key and, to Chris's credit, even though he stood me up completely for a Drake concert, you left early. You left early. He stood me up for a Drake concert. What he did do was he did send me a really well thought out. I was like, hey, if I were you, here's how I would attack this event. So, to his credit, he did do that.
Jimmy Vreeland:And then, most importantly, after hours, you want to keep it clean because you don't want to end up in any type of situation where you have lip sores.
Eric Brewer:Good point Good point, all right.
RJ Bates III:So what I'm going to say after this is, first and foremost, I want to know why I wasn't invited to any of this stuff that CJ invited Steve to. It's definitely no way CJ's getting the point.
Chris Jefferson:You were doing YouTube live. Oh, there you go.
RJ Bates III:I would say all of y'all's answers were pretty similar. What I enjoyed the most about Jimmy's is as he gave specific hey. I want to understand how I'm going to get my money back and how I'm going to double it, then also really appreciate the part about hey you need to implement. So point to Jimmy on this one.
Jimmy Vreeland:What about that clean?
RJ Bates III:Yeah, there you go. Question number two what's your favorite type of property to purchase, Jimmy?
Jimmy Vreeland:Beautiful Midwestern 1200 square feet, three bedroom, two bass just beautiful, hiding in plain sight wealth producers. I love them. They ran out for like 1200 bucks. The rent goes up like 70 bucks a year. It's glorious. It's the greatest wealth producer hiding in plain sight.
RJ Bates III:There you go, better known to the rest of the world as shit boxes. But okay, we appreciate that, jimmy Eric. What about you?
Jimmy Vreeland:You'll notice in any market fluctuation. No one in St Louis is pissing and moaning because it just continues to pump. It doesn't go up, it doesn't go down. It's beautiful.
RJ Bates III:Just continues to pump.
Eric Brewer:Eric, what about you? What Jimmy didn't mention about the $1,200 a month rent is that's a six unit in St Louis, total rent for 1200 and each of them are three bedrooms. I would say for me I'm in the Northeast when I get a phone call about a three bed, two bath brick rancher on a third of an acre where we are, there's literally a buyer, a tenant, cash, conventional. I can do anything with that house. So in my particular market a rancher is super high in demand. We always say that it's a great first or last house. Right, where someone's buying their first house, they need something affordable. Ranchers generally around here about 1,100 square feet and then when you're downsizing and maybe you're getting elderly and probably have cash which we like, right, it's a good last house because they don't want to deal with steps. So for me it's a small, less than 1,600 square foot brick rancher.
RJ Bates III:All right, Steve, pretend like you bought properties before. Which one's your favorite purchase?
Steve Trang:I will readily admit I'm not going to win this one, because I don't have an avatar for a house. I really only have a few simple criteria. I'm looking for a 3-2 at median and below, and not too far away from the middle of the city. Right, because for me, all I'm looking at is this, something that will move, no matter what's going on in the market. Right, market's going up, market's going down. I'm always going to save at median below, because people always need to buy and sell. The thing that's always scared me is if it's well above median or it needs a significant amount of work, I don't want to buy those properties. I don't want to deal with major rehabs. I don't want to deal with what we're dealing with right now with interest rate spikes. It's harder to move when it's above median. So for me I'm not as crystal clear as these two gentlemen. I'm looking at 3-2 median price and below, and not too far from the middle of the city.
RJ Bates III:All right, what about you? Cj.
Chris Jefferson:When I heard this question, the first thought I had was more long-term stuff. For me, anything under $100,000 across the country that's, in more densely populated areas where you would call or consider it has population growth trajectory. There's a lot of activity happening in these areas. I'm looking for houses under $100,000, right Merging market. Population growth is on the uptick. It lets me know that, regardless of what part of the cycle I get in on, there's going to be some appreciation down the road that I'll be able to take advantage of. Those are definitely my favorite type of houses to pick up.
Steve Trang:I just wanted to go on the record that Chris Jefferson is the cause of lack of affordability in housing. He is going out there buying 100K houses so poor people or less wealthy people can buy houses. I just want to put that out there and just let him marinate.
RJ Bates III:I get clarification on your answer. Are you saying the value is below $100,000 or the purchase price? No?
Chris Jefferson:no no. Purchase price purchase price Purchase price is under $100,000. The yield on those is better than you're going to get anywhere else. I think that's what Jimmy is saying right about St Louis and what he's doing out there. By far they're the best type of properties to pick up in my opinion.
Steve Trang:We need to crucify people like CJ. This is the lesson I'm taking from this.
Jimmy Vreeland:I love CJ. I like my market, but some days I get a little envious. I want to go play in the big leagues like RJ. Dallas seems like really awesome and hard and only the best can survive there.
RJ Bates III:It's really awesome until you pay property taxes.
Steve Trang:It's only like 5% or 10% of the property value. Yeah, that's it.
Eric Brewer:You should drive a volunteer round two. Funny name for Jimmy, because they're just using the list. Shout out Chris Jefferson, he'll know who this person is. I don't know that anybody else here is as connected that me and CJ are, but I'm going to go round two. My name for Jimmy is Pussell Simmons, a historic hip-hop legend, one of the innovators of Rappers we know it, a true entrepreneur, we deserve the place in round two. I'm going Pussell Simmons for round two.
Steve Trang:Yeah, a serial sexual harassing producer Perfect, that's what we're going to go with for Jimmy on this one.
Eric Brewer:Did Russell get canceled, supposedly.
Jimmy Vreeland:I like that guy. That's a shame he got canceled so accusations are pretty strong, let's move on from Pussell.
RJ Bates III:Simmons, I think we've heard enough of that so.
Jimmy Vreeland:Eric, are you like brainstorming notes for each round? I?
RJ Bates III:see you're in a lot of riding right now I wish Eric would put half as much effort in his answers as he is the nicknames he's coming up with.
Eric Brewer:We want to serve a purpose here. Rj, We'll tell you what year is next Thursday.
RJ Bates III:I'm going to go with on this one. I'm going to go with how specific he was with his buying criteria. I'm going to give Jimmy the point again. I like CJ's answer, but it was just too vague. I mean, it's just hey, under 100,000 in a growing city. So I'm going to go with Jimmy on this one. Question number three when looking for deals and sellers, what are your criteria for qualifying and disqualifying a deal, jimmy?
Jimmy Vreeland:I want a house, can make a decision and willing to sell the house in the next 90 days. I'm sorry, I wish I had a better answer, but I kind of stole that directly from Brewer. We've adopted the Brewer method of going on every appointment possible.
RJ Bates III:Rividing answer as always, jimmy.
Jimmy Vreeland:He blew out all his specific ACL on question two Look there's been a discussion Like do you disqualify any appointments and if it hits those three criteria we go.
Eric Brewer:This can actually be a lengthy conversation. I think the least amount of qualifying you do for sellers, the better. The more qualifying you do for a deal, the better, and there's a little bit of both of these in the question. Right, it actually says deals and sellers. I think too many people overqualify sellers. They think they have to be motivated. Well, what's your definition of motivation?
Eric Brewer:Everybody has a different reason why they might be willing to sell a house at a discount. Everybody says like even Jimmy, we got to stop with the 90 days. Unless you're only planning to do business for the next 90 days, you should be out meeting people that might be thinking about selling four months to 40 months from now and starting to establish a relationship that puts you top of mind. So when they are ready, you're the person that they're more likely to contact when it comes to the deal. Now we got to get much more specific, Much like what Steve talked about, Chris and Jimmy actually everybody but me on the last question is how specific we get when we want to get a deal. Too often people try and throw things against the wall and hope that it sticks. They get locked up in a bad deal because they didn't qualify it enough, and it should be bed baths, location, condition, size of renovation and exit price right. Like for us, we're staying at or below medium price right now. So less qualifying sellers, more qualifying deals.
RJ Bates III:I like that answer.
Steve Trang:Steve what about you? I'm really looking at for sellers is motivation and a little bit of equity, right? They have to sell. If they have to sell, they're somewhere they need to be. I think so many people that are trying to wholesale or buy these houses like, oh, they want to sell, that's great. The reality is 90 plus percent of the population will never sell their houses to someone like us, right? So for us, we're looking for someone that has to sell. They've got motivation. There's a life event, A life event has occurred where they need money. Now that's all we're looking for. There's all these other qualifications I see these other people talking about. I think if you're over qualifying, people lie to you on the phone. People just straight lie to you on the phone. If you believe everything they tell you, you will over qualify the prospects. I just need to know that you have to sell or you have. There's someone where you need to be.
RJ Bates III:All right, ordered by you.
Chris Jefferson:Cj, yeah, I mean look on deals. We're looking for people that have a sense of motivation, they have a timeline that they're looking to sell that fits within, generally speaking, 36 year 90 days. We've been doing this long enough to know that any leads a deal if you know how to make it a deal. And so for us, we're just looking at what our buy buckets are, whether it's a innovation, whether it's a seller finance wrap that we're looking to do a fix and flip or rental property, whatever bucket that we're trying to fit it in, or if it shows us that it fits in, rather we're going to go qualified to fit in that particular bucket. But that starts with. Is there a motivation to actually sell the property and accept an offer and a discounted offer at that right, and is there a timeline that they're actually looking to move forward in the transaction? And for us, we try to identify people that are looking to sell within 30, 60, 90 days. Oh, and that's. I guess that's it. I mean no discussion whatsoever.
Steve Trang:Well, Jimmy's wrong. Jimmy's wrong, but I can't tell you exactly where or why he's wrong. So when you say qualifying. Like everybody has that ideal beautiful three, two like let's say somebody calls they're motivated and they have a one one, is it?
Jimmy Vreeland:my mindset is, we can get it low enough. We'll we'll get it low enough. We'll get it low enough, we'll get it low enough. Is it? My mindset is, we can get it low enough, we'll find a way to sell it Like, is that?
Eric Brewer:the difficult part with a one one is what is low enough. There's probably very little to no comps. You know, generally when you stay at or around the median price, there's more buyers, there's more comps. It's easier to predict. And this is where we get tough into, like, whether you're talking about wholesale or not, like a lot of wholesalers are going to say lock it up, shop it. And as long as you're clear about due diligence, like if you take two weeks and try and sell it and there's no buyers, no big deal.
Eric Brewer:But I think when we're very loose about the language of what is cheap enough for a one one, jimmy, if you're keeping it, that's up to you. You're like, hey, maybe I can get $80 a night rent and St Louis on this one bedroom, one bath, and you know that works out to be a couple hundred bucks a month. But I think the more loose we become with the style of property we buy, the more difficult it is to responsibly disposition it and that's how we end up getting stuck or backing out of a deal at the final. You know the final hour.
Jimmy Vreeland:Like how far will you guys come off that ideal three to below 1600?
Eric Brewer:Oh, very it. Just it becomes more difficult to establish an exit price as you move away from the median or comps because you're making an educated get like what's the difference between a two bed and a one bed? Is it half, since it's got half the number of bedrooms? I don't know. There's generally not comps for one bedroom, one bath, at least not where I'm from. They don't have one bed, one bath like newer construction condos or something like that Just gets really hard to project what ARV or an exit price would be.
Chris Jefferson:Yeah. But I think that comes down to exit strategy, right. Like if I'm looking to do a seller finance wrap and it's a free and clear, I don't have any PG on it and it's a one one and I feel like I can wrap it to somebody, create some margin, upfront down payment, I can create some cash flow as well, like I'm going to take that deal on when I'm going to run it, right. But my point is ultimately and I think we're all saying the same thing is you have to have some sort of buy box, like a pre designated buy box.
Chris Jefferson:When I run into investors out here that are newer into the business, they have no concept of what they're actually looking for. They have actually really no clue at all. They just want to do a deal. So they're at every re-e-meeting, their Comment in their email and every single Facebook post where somebody says they've got a deal. They have no targeted effort on what they're looking for. So I think the true point really is to make sure you have some sort of actual buy box that fits your business, that you can actually put it in your buy buckets and make money.
Steve Trang:So it's not what interest rates are cash flow interesting?
RJ Bates III:Oh, steve, you just keep it. Keep it going from last week, huh. Watch it, eric. Watch it now.
Eric Brewer:Hold on, hold on. For this round. I Would say for Jimmy we're gonna go football, since we just kicked off football this week, and I'm gonna go with a Previous Pittsburgh Steelers quarterback by the name of Bobby blister. His actual name was Bobby brister, but for today we're going Jimmy Vreeland. Bobby brister probably played against the st Louis Cardinals. No wonder they left right, like when you got six units that rent for 1200 bucks, what athlete that finally made some money wants to live in a six unit for $200 a piece? That's crazy. All right, so Bobby, bobby blister for round three.
Jimmy Vreeland:Yeah, if you're good years with the Steelers right Little side arm, yeah.
Eric Brewer:Yeah, bobby, blister shout out.
RJ Bates III:Let's go wrangle it in boys. Okay, sorry, let's get back to this show here. I'm really CJ. I really liked your answer there about the wrap and and I was leaning towards you, but then you went down this path of a like everyone's got to get their buy box and everything and I felt like you went too Specific down this path. I mean, what about the wholesalers out there? I mean we're talking about Disqualifying sellers and deals. There's always a buyer for two, one or even the one one, like Eric's answer. I'm gonna give him the point there. Moving on to Steve, do we need to do our our ad here?
Steve Trang:Yeah, guys. So if you guys are ever running PPC ads, you know what an headache in that marriage is to keep up with the latest changes, the latest algorithm Adjustment. So I used to run my own PPC campaigns and then I found Bateman collective. I was relieved to find PPC partner who actually understands the real estate industry our true experts in PPC makes PPC work. Do what I did get a free consultation with Bateman collective. Go to bateman collective. Comm slash PTD.
RJ Bates III:So I love it. One of my editors took one of my answers from last week's PTD and they actually saved my part where I said my answer is sponsored by Bateman collective. Hilarious, let's go, eric. Question number four if we have to create a national association of wholesalers, who would you want to lead the association?
Eric Brewer:This is so I don't have a name. By all means, if someone Matches my description, I'd love to have it volunteered, but here's what I have down as notes. That would be important to me Someone that is able to lead. A lot of times I see in, like local real estate agencies and things of that sort, where it's just the most senior person that Happened to you know, put their name in the hat and end up with the position, but they don't know how to lead.
Eric Brewer:And what do I mean by leader? So I want someone that has experience in our field. They they bring a proven track record. They have credibility in this particular business of wholesaling, right, I don't think it should be borrowed from Standard real estate. It shouldn't be someone that's a lender. It should be someone that has experience in this.
Eric Brewer:And then I think, the final two things that we would look for. If we ever end up as, like, advocating for the profession we look at, like the, the board of realtors, like they probably spend more money on lobbyists Than any other nature of profession to protect that industry, I would want someone that that is an advocate for our profession. And then, like we talked about last week with flip, with dick right. We would want to have someone that is brings unity to the community. Every single person here Generally is involved in some type of education and we might have a product to sell, and we all get together every week and have a good time and we support each other for the most part, and I would want someone that that would bring the community together and eliminate a lot of the BS that takes place where people talk Down about others in an effort to prop themselves up. That's what I would be looking for as a leader of this industry.
RJ Bates III:Well, I think that's the first time anyone's taken three minutes to not give an answer. We appreciate that, eric. Steve, hopefully you can tell us who you want to lead this new association of wholesalers.
Steve Trang:So when I was thinking about this, the first person I was kind of think was RJ Bates. But then I was thinking this guy cannot. He has very, very few man like tangible social skills and like emotional EQ, right, so that's thinking probably Chris Jefferson, because Chris he's. He's worn all different hats. I think he even own a brokerage for a bit, right.
Chris Jefferson:But he really.
Steve Trang:He's really anti realtor and I think he can't play well in the sandbox right, and I think there's room for realtors and wholesalers. So I think, looking at it, jerry Norian's been talking about this for some time. He's passionate and he's done both sides. He's done the wholesaling and he's done the realtor thing, he's done the owning a brokerage thing. I think he sees value in all the different areas. I think he can play well. I don't think he's, you know, constantly blasting other industries for no reason whatsoever. So I think probably Jerry Norian, he's been an advocate for wholesaling for quite some time.
RJ Bates III:That's probably who, who I Suggest you know, that was an interesting strategy. You could have just said Jerry Norton, but instead you looked right at the judge, said his name and then said he would suck.
Steve Trang:Interesting strategy, I thought you first, you were my first, first thought. I appreciate that CJ?
RJ Bates III:What about you I?
Chris Jefferson:Mean. Look, this thing has been attempted a couple of times. I think Jerry's been working on this for a little while. I think he's gotten a quarter of a mile with the efforts, right, you know, the fact of the matter is, at this point, trying to get an entire industry of you know they call us the industry misfits right, I think it would be incredibly difficult. I think it'd be a tall task. I think it would take somebody with some, you know, connectivity, some leadership. My first thought, I think, is Leon G Barnes. All right, shout out to Leon. The reason I'm gonna say Leon is this guy's always in a suit, for whatever reason. Right, he's gonna need you know he's gonna need one of those right to go out to Capitol Hill and try to lobby to get something done. You know he's he's always like very friendly. You know, people like that sometimes made me a little bit nervous, right, like sometimes.
Chris Jefferson:I'm like why is this guy always friendly, right? Why is he always being nice? I think that's something that's really important for the job, so I'm gonna give it to Leon G Barnes. I think I'd hand him the baton and say, hey, go deal with this shit down in Capitol Hill. See what you can get them.
RJ Bates III:CJ, you might have been absent the week that Leon expressed to all of us that he loves studying serial killers. That's why I, you, in no.
Jimmy Vreeland:He is incredibly well informed all the time.
RJ Bates III:Mr Federman, what about you?
Jimmy Vreeland:I was actually. That's my answer. I soon as Federman's done with his time in the Senate, I would love to be in an organization when he leads, because I'm with CJ if they got a national association of wholesalers, it's a bunch of cowboys, it's a bunch of misfits. It would be like herding cats and he would be great at it, and then I think he'd also be open to bribery. So I think those with some cash could also hook ourselves up. So Federman's my answer.
RJ Bates III:I love y'all's debates.
Eric Brewer:Time for me to offer up my next.
Jimmy Vreeland:Boy, don't you? So we start this Federation, or what what's it called.
Steve Trang:Association. It's not a new term, jimmy.
Jimmy Vreeland:Do you think it's gonna kill opportunity for the newbies? Because it's gonna it's gonna Increase the barrier to entry.
Steve Trang:Have you noticed? Have you ever?
Jimmy Vreeland:thought man.
Steve Trang:The National Association of Real estate made it really hard to become a realtor.
Eric Brewer:No, not at all.
Jimmy Vreeland:It has created a barrier to entry. Yeah, that's fine.
Steve Trang:Is that barrier to entry is waking up?
Jimmy Vreeland:I mean, what I love about wholesaling is that anybody, anywhere, anytime, can just get after it. I love that about wholesaling. We even have to go through a brain-numbing course like you do have to become a realtor. It takes some of the shine off it for me.
Steve Trang:The only restriction is you have to have a very serious felony conviction. Like listen, I'm all for the realtors, but also there are a lot of really bad ones out there. Like the only thing that stops you from becoming a licensed realtor is you have to have a really bad conviction.
Jimmy Vreeland:Dude, my realtor course. I was constantly getting threatened to get kicked out of it. It was hell on earth, like that's my numbing time.
Steve Trang:Jimmy, that might be more reflection upon you than it is about the industry.
Eric Brewer:That was just social distancing.
Chris Jefferson:I don't think being a wholesaler should have a background check. I think that'd be pretty lame. I mean, let's face it right, like wholesalers we're doing the work that nobody else wants to do, like straight up, and we keep the economy moving when it comes to real estate. Yeah, I mean back then.
Steve Trang:But the association is different in regulation right. Just because it's a national association realtors doesn't mean it's a regulated industry. Those are two different things.
Chris Jefferson:Sure, sure. But when I think of the national association of realtors, when I heard you talking just now, whose course would they take? Like, what are they going to take RJ Bates' course, Eric Bruis' course, my course, your course? They're going to go to Jimmy's when his house is in St Louis and take a course with him. How do you even figure out what the information is that somebody's got to take?
Steve Trang:The law. I don't think it's necessarily the course part right, Because again, that's the regulatory part. It's just someone advocating on our behalf on Capitol Hill, but do you think this?
Jimmy Vreeland:industry has that type of scratch Like. I'm getting nervous just thinking about it. Where the national association of realtors, they have that type of scratch to lobby.
Chris Jefferson:And wholesalers do not have the sort of community approach with each other that like realtors have, for example.
Eric Brewer:That's kind of the idea, but like, wouldn't that be a better fit? Well, it hasn't worked.
Jimmy Vreeland:Berkshire Hathaway is a publicly traded company and they have some cash to burn to lobby and do that type of thing.
Chris Jefferson:Jerry was trying to do this years ago. What happened? I think he's still trying. Well, I mean last time when I first heard about it, I think it was like six years ago.
RJ Bates III:RJ is the one that's interviewing him.
Steve Trang:Rj, why don't you give us a? Get us at the speed.
RJ Bates III:As far as I know, I believe Jerry is still marching down the path to get this established. How much money?
Chris Jefferson:has this panel? I haven't given zero towards it, so how much has this panel contributed towards the effort?
Steve Trang:Zero, no, unintentionally, can we value my influence millions, I think that's Jimmy and I's point Right.
Chris Jefferson:Like rounding up a whole bunch of wholesalers to try to accomplish this, it's going to take an insane amount of money to do it. Jerry's got a lot of cheese I don't think he's got that much cheese right. Like that's going to take a monumental amount of money to be able to try to accomplish. I don't see it happening. I think it's a great hypothetical thought.
Jimmy Vreeland:We would have a lot more fun than a realtor convention, but I don't think we'd get much more done.
Eric Brewer:Before we run out of time for this round, I'm going to go with and this is my favorite so far RJ. Pay close attention. Country Music Star, billy Ray Virus. Billy Ray Virus. Y'all Looking forward to the Christmas album, Billy, and can't wait. Love the holidays. Eric, can you please post your doodles?
Jimmy Vreeland:and tag me today. You got it, I'll tag you so in this round.
RJ Bates III:it reminded me of something that we do here at our office. We have a quote board where we completely leave out the context. And the guy that showed us the video, and the guy that showed up with a cold sore on his lip, he said the thing I love about wholesaling see, we would leave that part out and we would start the quote right here. It's anywhere, anytime, baby. That would be Jimmy's quote. We see that, with your cold sore on your lip, jimmy, we see that, buddy.
Eric Brewer:With your hammer. Yeah.
RJ Bates III:Point goes to CJ. I thought his answer of Leon was solid and then also the points he made following that. Eric, keep up the laugh and we'll take your point away, all right.
Eric Brewer:What's going on with the answer? He got credit but no point. He led you right down a path there. Yeah, jimmy, you love it. Jimmy was all pumped up and then he gave the point to CJ Jimmy's answer sucked All right question number five.
Jimmy Vreeland:My answer was great, RJ.
RJ Bates III:Hey, question number five OK, cj, you ready With the Arizona Diamondbacks and my Texas Rangers. That's right, baby, you're playing in the World Series you got to go to the game. There's zero chance to win the World Series at the beginning of the season. How can entrepreneurs who come from a poor background change their generational future despite the odds being against them? Cj.
Chris Jefferson:Yeah, I think the first thing's first is just recognizing that your financial situation or, quote unquote, being poor isn't a real limitation. The only limitation to me in doing what we've done is self. So, with a bit of determination, with a bit of real effort, with some patience, I think that, regardless of your economic background, especially if you come from one of poverty, I think you actually have a leg up. I think you have less expectations than other people. I think you have less pressures than other people. You don't have as much keeping up with the Joneses to do as so many people often do. So I don't see it as a bad thing. I don't see it as a hurdle, really, either. I see it as an opportunity, and a big one, if you could be intentional and be determined to put some effort for it.
RJ Bates III:OK, jimmy, on this one, what I want you to answer is how can they change their generational future despite odds being against them, unlike whatever CJ just said?
Jimmy Vreeland:I kind of like CJ's answer, but where you start doesn't matter. What's going through my mind when I saw that picture was my favorite jocco video about good Like as long as you're still breathing, as long as you can still get up, you've got to fight in the game. And so wherever you start and like I just said on the last answer, the greatest thing about wholesaling is anybody, anyplace, any time, can get in this game and follow a few principles, be an honest person, a few business disciplines and you can change generational wealth for you and your family. That's why wholesaling to me is so much fun.
RJ Bates III:Jimmy said I'm doubling down on anyone anywhere, anytime. Eric, what about you?
Eric Brewer:Yeah, I think a couple of things come to mind Belief, right.
Eric Brewer:I think our background or where we come from or where we grow up can have as much influence as we allow it, to, both positive and negative. I think if you look at some of the people a friend of mine is a huge Elon Musk fan and he was talking about Elon Musk and how his father was just a bastard, like literally maybe one of the meanest humans ever alive, and it's created this just unrealistic work ethic that Elon Musk has and the guy just, he sleeps on the factory floor, he works, he's never happy, and some of the most extraordinary accomplishments of humans in the United States and all over the world were born from horrible circumstances and backgrounds. And the real thing that those people had, and the same thing that these two teams had, was a belief that they weren't attached or handcuffed to that background, that they were destined for greatness and had it inside of them regardless of the circumstances. And then they took that belief and they carried it over to their daily actions and it turns out that they were capable of everything they dreamed of.
RJ Bates III:Like that, Steve. What about you?
Steve Trang:I think the answer is pretty simple but really difficult to execute, and it's just changing what's between your ears. Right, it's the mindset. It's a lot like what Eric said the belief component right, because you have a lower set of expectations. So you think this is the way to go. But there's a lot of opportunity if you can change your mindset. Specifically, if you look at most people that have normal upbringings, they don't have terrible lives and so they'll just follow the traditional path. They'll go to school, go to college, get a job and work for a very, very long time.
Steve Trang:It's when life sucks that you want to do something about it. I want to change my family legacy, right? So I think first, it's changing the mindset. It's that you have this adversity that causes you want to change what's going on. That's just for you, but for everyone around you and people that come along after you and this is a really simple answer. This part is just all the information and knowledge is already out there available, right Between YouTube, podcasts and this, and that Once they can get past that mindset following what they see online, you can get really far with just free information. So I think those are the steps you've got to take.
Jimmy Vreeland:It's the greatest country in the world. Rj it's the greatest industry in the world. You put your mind to it, you can do anything, it's glorious and you want to use that anywhere.
Chris Jefferson:So a couple things real quick, right. I think where you start does matter, right? Everybody's not starting at the same spot. But, more importantly than anything, like you got to identify what Lego blocks you got right. If you want to go build something, first and foremost, everybody isn't starting at the same spot. So take inventory of what Lego blocks do you got to build with right now and which blocks are you missing to do what it is that you want to accomplish, right, like, if you want generational wealth and you want to own property and all these different things, what's going to take some money to do that right?
Chris Jefferson:And so an error that I see a lot of people make is they come into this business from a poorer background and their intent is generational wealth, and so they go straight for trying to acquire property and hold it. They go straight for trying to do fix and flip because they think that's going to make them money. I think why Jimmy's probably so passionate about wholesaling is like I am right Is wholesaling creates cash for you fast, and if you want to build a portfolio, right, it takes a lot of money to do so. Everybody's favorite number we ask them how many units they want is 100 units Newsflash.
Chris Jefferson:I don't know if anybody realizes this or not. 100 units isn't shit. It's not a lot of property, right? And if you've got 100 doors, it's not going to be making you a ton of money either Certainly not generational wealth, right, unless you're buying an appreciating market. It's like I mentioned earlier, right, they have density, right, and a couple of other things that I said. But ultimately, yeah, I mean, I don't know that, that's kind of my perspective on that, but I think everybody has an opportunity, not at the same spot.
Jimmy Vreeland:And then Jerry Norton and Jason medley helped me out on this a lot. Like Jerry Norton, I like I asked him like who should be buying assets? And he's like people who have a cash machine. And then I was like who should be wholesaling? He's like people who don't have a cash machine. And then you know, medley calls it, passive income comes after a hyperactive active income. But I do think there needs to be a separation. Like you start wholesaling to create your cash machine. Once your cash machine is built and running and secured, then you start acquiring assets to build the long-term wealth.
Chris Jefferson:But you don't get rid of your cash machine to go start building long-term wealth.
Jimmy Vreeland:You can't cash machines too fun, how could? You ever get rid of that.
Chris Jefferson:But that's what most people do, right, jimmy, is they start out wholesaling. I made this mistake myself before. Right, yeah, they start a wholesaling, get a little bit of money. Then they start trying to go do any and everything else when you don't. You should never get off your cash machine, you should only add to that.
Jimmy Vreeland:Yeah, especially yeah, cuz in my world with the W2 investor, they're like, oh my god, I want to get ten rentals and quit my job. And I'm like, no way bro, not a chance. Like you have W2, you have a cash machine. You got to ride that thing for as long as it'll, it'll put out for you. Pause, sorry, and that's kind of how I got this situation on my lip, though, yeah.
RJ Bates III:I mean, there's no better way to end this question than another quote.
Jimmy Vreeland:I'm gonna get a football for you.
Eric Brewer:Eric, hit it famous last words from Eagles great Donovan McScav.
RJ Bates III:There he is. Point for question number five is gonna go for Jimmy. Jimmy came on strong there after During the little debate. I really like that and the Jason medley quotes those are. Those were really good. Love that, all right. Question number six with inventory still seeming low One of CJ's favorite topics Would you recommend someone buy a new build with the risk of it being built in a rush manner with defects to meet demand, or an older built home with them? Yeah, there you go. There's a question, jimmy.
Jimmy Vreeland:To live in or as an investment?
RJ Bates III:Yeah, to live in.
Jimmy Vreeland:I don't like new houses. I don't like how they aesthetically appear like I live in a hundred year old house. I like things were built solid back in the day, so I'll take, I'll take a nice rehab any day, and then I just new houses, I don't. I don't like their aesthetic appeal, and then I they're built so fast, I don't. I don't know if they're gonna last the test of time. All right, what about you, eric?
Eric Brewer:Couple different things working here. What I don't love about new construction is, generally, the price is is gonna be on the higher end. You can go find an older home. Maybe it's renovated, maybe it's in good shape, probably at or near the median price for your area. So I worry about new construction. When it comes To budget value, that's probably the first place where you're gonna see dips. If you buy a $600,000 new construction in an area that has a median price of 400. You're generally gonna see that top-end dip Before the middle is. So I think there's a lot more risk with new construction in regards to the price that you pay and possible value. If and when the market slows back or pulls back a little bit. My vote would be for the older home.
RJ Bates III:Love it, steve. This is your opportunity. I think in all the times I've ever hosted, you've never gotten a point. So let's really buckle down and focus.
Steve Trang:Okay, good, I'm not gonna get point this one for sure. So I would say it the it's the wrong questions being asked, right, and I think that's the problem. It's I should have by this or that. Really, it's what can you afford? How long you plan to stay in there, right, I think, how far you will in a drive. There are so many factors that go into buying a home. It's not just I want a newer home or an older home. It comes out affordability, if figure. It comes down to how soon you want to buy again, how soon you plan to buy and sell. There's so many factors here. I don't think you can just say you know it can just boil down to one or the other. But Right now I guess if there's in a vacuum, which is one of those two, I'll go with a new book because they can buy down your rate. But I think this is just an oversimplification. If you're looking to buy a house, there's way too many considerations besides New build or an or an older home.
RJ Bates III:Greed, what about you? Cj.
Chris Jefferson:Yeah, I think Steve's right that there's a lot of variables that play, but, like if we just remove some of those for a second, you buy new and there's a reason that new still continues to thrive. Generally in certain markets, especially what we're experiencing right now, they've got buyer incentives that most home flippers can't match Because they're building on production. More importantly, when you buy a new, you're escaping a lot of deferred maintenance. Sometimes I think people mistake older renovations for being new homes. They're not new homes, they're older properties that have been renovated right. So there's a lot of deferred maintenance that still takes place on the older home.
Chris Jefferson:Most people that are buying properties financially are not in a position to be able to absorb Maintenance over the years on a lot of these properties, which is why they start to run into disrepair. We've all bought properties where they were renovated five, six, seven years ago and now it's beat the hell up again because the person couldn't afford to keep Up to deferred maintenance on the property. So I think the best bet for sure, especially in our current market, is to buy a new. And I'm saying that it's somebody who renovates houses, right, but I definitely think that makes more sense.
Steve Trang:I think the writing answers whatever RJ says.
RJ Bates III:Hey, listen honestly on this, I think it's uh, it's important for us to understand, with the inventory being low, the importance of the new construction that is needed, uh, but doing it the right way and we could this is a pretty Uh hot topic on this show about the inventory levels. I mean, I guess, since we kind of all agree open up the the conversation a little bit about the, the importance of investors doing these new constructions the right way, is there something that could be done to make kind of eliminate this even being a question where we're saying, hey, these new builds are not built to the same standards as houses built in the 60, 70s, 80s. Why is this even a conversation?
Steve Trang:I mean it comes down to, I think uh, we, we are For better, for worse. We're a capitalistic society, right, like a builder is building a house for maximum profit. They're not building this for a long-term durability. They're not building this property so that you know that you can live in this house for the next 30 years. They're looking at what is a house that I can build for the lowest cost, that someone's willing to pay the most amount for.
Chris Jefferson:So I mean Steve, I'm look, I'm a builder right, I've built a lot of houses over the last few years. Look, builders are playing the same game that we're playing as renovators. Let's not. Let's not act like people aren't renovating houses and trying to source and find the the most inexpensive materials as possible. But it was a profit.
Steve Trang:Say it again, but that goes back to what I'm saying. Like they're trying to build it for lowest costs so they can get the maximum.
Chris Jefferson:But that's builders and people who renovate properties we everybody does that I agree like that's the process. So it's not. It's not like if you buy an older renovated home, like somehow you're gonna have better quality materials. There's going to be instances where that's true, just like there's going to be instances where you buy from a builder who cares more about the quality, the durability, the type of products that they're putting in the property. You just got to do your research on who you're buying from, whether it's a fix in flipper or whether it's a question why is this happening?
Jimmy Vreeland:Well, I think I'm a cj a little bit. I think we also have old salty bastard bias when we're like back in my day we did everything properly, and all these new sons of bitches like they don't do anything right. So To say, all new construction probably isn't done as well I I think that's a bold statement.
Eric Brewer:I don't think that's what he said when he said was Anybody that's building homes is doing it for profit, and anytime you're doing it for profit, there's a balance of quality and margin. They're not just saying I'm going to build the best house, regardless of price.
Jimmy Vreeland:But like the dude in the 60s buying houses he was working on for a profit too.
Eric Brewer:Yeah, they didn't have the same access to cheap materials. They had mortar and brick and stone.
Steve Trang:In the 20s.
Eric Brewer:They couldn't the building materials you?
Steve Trang:can build. If you really looked at a house where they say like, yeah, this was the build, like you look at this whole subdivision, right. And then there's a one house that the developer built for him and his family, like that's the house we all want, because we know Everything was measured twice, three times. You know the tile, you could just roll the marble down the whole house on that's got a custom.
Chris Jefferson:It's called a custom home.
Steve Trang:A custom home built for him. Is that a custom?
Chris Jefferson:He owns the company, owns the dirt right, right. Yeah, I'm gonna defend the way you guys defend realtors.
RJ Bates III:All right, um, on this one, I'm I am gonna go with Steve. I thought Steve had a great answer. Yeah, well, listen, I think you congratulations, steve, your first point ever.
RJ Bates III:There's, there's too many variables to be able to say one way or another and and I think it opened up you know, conversation and talk more about why this is even a conversation. Before we announce our winner and get out of here, I want to say Shout out to you guys for watching. Our watch count almost stayed identical. That means you guys stayed on here for all 50 minutes that we've been live. We really appreciate that. Make sure you subscribe to the channel, okay, because we're trying to grow this part of the disruption channel from scratch. Uh, and we need the support of you guys. If you could share this video out there to your following, it'd be very much appreciated. On today's winner somehow Is jimmy vreeland Cold, sore and all. Jimmy. Sign off. Tell the people what you think about today's episode.
Jimmy Vreeland:You know, sometimes when you're down on the mat, you got a cold sore. You don't even know if you want to get up in the morning. You don't even know if you want to See anybody. You just want to lay in bed all day. Just remember you got to dig deep. Other people have cold sores. They can't hide them all. They got there's medicine out there for that. So you get out there, you get your ass up and you do what you got to do that day. Cold sore, no.
RJ Bates III:Man, that is one hell of a victory speech right now. What about you, man? Say goodbye to the people jimmy's the real cream player.
Eric Brewer:I mean a but uh. Anyway, before I get to that last because I want to make sure I get this in In the spirit of wu-trang, the wu-trang clan, I want to do a little shout out to infect the deck For jimmy's infection that he has on his lip, and wu-tang, we're gonna go infect the deck. Listen, today was like a calm, very minimal debate. Nobody really got too excited. Oddly enough, cj got really defensive on the builder thing. Not sure where that came from, but uh, he got really his back squared up, the hair stood up on the back of his neck and he really got excited about the builder thing. So I'm gonna dig into that and probably, uh, twist that a little bit more as the the weeks go by.
Eric Brewer:But I had fun today. Rg, I think you did a great job. I can't believe how you bite your tongue. He sits through all the answers and he has this discipline of not cutting people off or speaking over people, and I notice how much more attention he pays than potter, which I respect a lot. But I had fun. I'll see you on it.
RJ Bates III:Thank you, eric. That was very kind. I think it's because last week, during my birthday, you said if I could give rj one thing, it would be patience. So thank you for giving me patience, eric.
Jimmy Vreeland:Hey, did you ever watch the macaw for group on Saturday night live when we were growing up?
Eric Brewer:the guy wins one show and now he's just bulldogs over buddy. What is?
Jimmy Vreeland:happening right now. Have you guys ever watched that? Like the macaw, show. He's like hey stop being so lippy, but but he's like no wrong, like dude, you gotta. Let me judge one show. It'll be awesome, all right.
RJ Bates III:The audience will love. It Sounds like a sea speed. Can you say goodbye to the people?
Steve Trang:Uh, so I want to apologize. Eric makes a great point here as well. Uh, rj did demonstrate some strong emotional intelligence, so I apologize for that. We do help people close more sales, so go to close more salescom to figure out more about that. Last time jimmy was here, we figured out what his hot button was and it was anytime. You compare him to our, our honorable senator, uh, john fetterman, right? So we figured that's his hot button. And now we know chris's hot button His builders. We're again. I'm with eric, we're gonna figure out what this is. But you know he, he can come out here with the, with the open houses and the kroger trays. We're gonna figure out what's going on here with the builders situation.
Eric Brewer:That's the selfie he posted Last week. It must have been with two guys that sit on the national builders association.
RJ Bates III:I don't know if I'm supposed to uh spill this or not. But, eric, actually I just kind of A text and I'll let you ponder on this if you want to add anything to it before we sign off, because we're a little bit early actually. Um Word on the streets is is that jimmy's cold sore actually came? Came from his uh one night he spent with nancy palosi? So, CJ say goodbye to the people.
Chris Jefferson:I'm out. It's been real. Uh, start flipping deals dot com. We got a class tonight at 7 pm Eastern. I'll see you there. It's good to see all you guys. Congrats, jimmy RJ. Uh, fair job. I like the new uh poster in the back. Uh, as well, you keep finding these little nicknacks.
Steve Trang:Uh.
Chris Jefferson:So good for you. Uh, your background no, I mean the aesthetic in the background is really starting to come together. Uh, so congrats on that. It's good to see all of you. Much love.
RJ Bates III:All right, uh, eric, you want to add anything before we sign off, or are you good?
Eric Brewer:No, I've done. I was gonna do lip van winkle, but I feel like it's. I'll say I think it's gonna be around for next week. So uh, uh, we'll save it. Uh, I have a couple other ones, but uh, yeah.
Steve Trang:Oh, proof that eric can multitask, or this is just the reason why he did so poorly, is one of these two things. There you go. I had fun.
Eric Brewer:That's all that matters.
RJ Bates III:There you go, congrats, lip van. We go on victory. Appreciate it fellas. Thank you, uh guys, we had fun tune in next week. We appreciate you.