It's not real estate investors, entrepreneurs and agents. You're in the right place. Unlocking the secrets to real estate investing in entrepreneurship. Welcome to the Times Young vaults hosted by R. J. Bates the third years, All right. Excited to have Daniel Moore on the titanium vault today. Daniel, how you doing?
Doing excellent, man. I appreciate you having me on here.
Yeah, absolutely. So Daniel is the cofounder of Propel Leo, and we're going to go into more about that later on in the episode. But, Daniel first I want to start off with talking about what it is you do in real estate investing and how you got started.
Well, currently, right now I'm sourcing and looking proud, predominantly for seven figure plus deals. I mean, I'm looking for the really big properties where I could only do, you know, one or two a year, but pull a really good return. Like I just closed a 60,000 square foot commercial warehouse under contract right now for eight, an eight figure deal of a land property. So I'm really looking for a land investment on that one. But really anything that's ah, much bigger deal working close seven figure return. That's where that's where that's where I'm focused on right now. But that's a far away's. Away from where I was 10 years ago when I first got started in this business. Let's start
there. Let's go back 10 years ago when you got started and walk us through how you got started in how you've progressed all the way to where now you're doing eight figure deals.
Well, um, the very 1st 1 that I had ever done. I have to rewind off of that a little bit. And I just tried starting a moving company and doing some moving whenever I was about 18 1920 years old and missed my back. Good. I mean, by that time was done moving. I was I was beaten, and through that time I start reading some books about how they're financially independent. People made their wealth and almost always pointed back to real estate. So I got the real estate book at a really young age. I was probably intrigued by real estate by the time I was 2122 I pulled my trigger on my very first property when I was about 23 I'm not really good with dates and stuff like that. But reading books is is an awesome opportunity to kind of gather some information. But at the same time, it doesn't really give you the real world education that you need when you're out there in the field. And at 23 years old, I found the very first property that I wanted to do. It was a it wasn't actually a townhome was a two bed, two bath town home in the middle of downtown Dallas, right out there by the old east side of downtown, and it went vacant. The entire the entire neighborhood went vacant overnight. The property was owned by a landlord that went into foreclosure. So now there's 27 town homes that are 110% vacant right there by downtown Dallas. So it didn't take long before everything was vandalized, and that was the very first property I've ever looked at. And at the time, I didn't know what hard money loans where I didn't know what private capital was. So I called up. The real estate agent on that property was about 7 4000 a dish and I called up, I called up a landlord and culture landlord called the real Estate Agent up Member station says where you pre approved by and they end up getting me and touched my mortgage banker and the mortgage bankers like, Yeah, you're preapproved for so to buy apps like 70 $80,000 in the home was only listed for like 44 something, anything. It's a slam dunk. I got this house and we go through the appraisal process and everything else and the appraiser comes out there. He's looking at the house. This house has no windows, no front doors, no air conditioning, no hot water heater, no electrical panel. All the copper has been stolen out of it. The route has been cut open. It is. It is a shack. And the appraiser's like, you know, we can't loan on this. Do you have to have all of those things here before you can do alone? You have to have windows. You have to have everything. I just rattled off. You have to have all that alone. So you're freaking out. But I knew this is an opportunity, and I wanted to take it so at the time I was living in Watauga, which is about a 45 minute to an hour drive from where I was at and I was renting. I was written and at the time was making like, 12 bucks an hour. So I wasn't wealthy by any means. My my my bright idea that age was I got a list of repairs back from the lender and the repairs said, You know, you need to fix all of that stuff and my bright idea that age was Well, okay, I'll go and take all my stuff out of storage or I'll take all my stuff out of my rental, put it in storage bail on my least with my rental, and I'm gonna move into this r E O in the middle of winter. So quite literally middle of winter. I don't own the house. It's still in our EO. I move in and I move into the hot water heater closet of this house. And over the next 234 weeks, I'm in there getting electrical fixed, getting the getting the windows replaced, getting getting the hot water heater installed, getting the air conditioning system functional. I did all of that to a house that I never owned. And 3 to 4 weeks into it, I call my bank up. And I'm like, Hey, all the repairs that you wanted to be made have been made. Uh, would send another appraiser out there, And so they send the appraiser back out, that the original one, he comes out, then he takes a look, and he's like, Well, you know, I wouldn't want to live here because I know me rehab now. So I just took care of their list. It looked like crap in there, but with their with their list taken care of, I was able to get a loan. And from that point forward, you know, I took that one, rolled it into another one, roll it into another one, rolled it into another one, and by the time hit property number four, I lost a big chunk of change. Rolled out of that one, wants a written, went to reading and through reading. I started, you know, thinking maybe multifamily was the book I should have. And I tried buying an 83 unit apartment complex when was like 25 or 26 years old. I got it into escrow, got all that rolling, but ended up not getting close. That one. So I lost my earnest on that one. I lost that deal. So even though I did really good on my 1st 1 cashed almost six figure check on my first deal, rolled it into another one into another one into another inside of about a year and 1/2 to 2 years. Almost 1/4 $1,000,000 by the time I was 25 26 then from there tried buying that apartment complex in the lost money on that one house and almost lost every single bit of it. I mean, it went from there, back down to about 9200 grand. So I had a really big loss back to back to back there. I wasn't happy. I wasn't happy at all,
right, So So what? All those deals that you were doing where those all rehabs were any of those buying holds with a single family? Multi family? What were you doing when you were just going? Deal, Deal
Everything up until that point was single family rehabs. I knew nothing about rentals. I knew nothing about investing it really as a whole. I was buying from wholesalers I was buying from real estate agents. But when you really start breaking down the business, I had no clue what an investor was or how an investor operated. I came from a construction background, so my background was I could look at a house and I could tell how much it would take to fix it. But I couldn't tell you what would be worth. So I was really depending upon wholesalers and depending upon agents to tell me what these homes would be worth. And that's really where I got myself burned on. Property number four was, I believe, the wholesaler that told me that would be worth X, and I didn't have enough intelligence to know better. And that's where I burned myself on property number four. And then, after being big burnt on, that's probably number 45 And then, after being burnt on that, I tried jumping straight into an 83 unit apartment complex once again with no true knowledge about what I was doing. But even with that being said, I was able to get another contract. I was able Thio get through. S girls able to source a key principle to back me for the loan. But everything as we got towards the closing table, key principles, better half started putting the brakes on things, and I I lost that deal as well. So going off those two big losses, it was a bit of an eye opener for me.
So it's safe to say the abundance mindset is not difficult for you to come by, though. It sounds to me like you immediately wanted to take over and dominate the market as soon as you got into investing. Is that correct?
I would say that is that is very correct. I mean, I was a very ambitious young man. I wanted to. I wanted to be a retired multi millionaire by the time I was 30 and I was doing what I thought I needed to do to do it, and I was taking some really hard, hard lessons going through that face. But it was lessons I was willing to take.
So after you made it through that phase, what happened next? Where did you go from there?
So I mentioned that I picked up books I'd pick up books to try and educate myself on what I needed to learn next. And if you ever go into a library or a bookstore and you go into the financial freedom section, you're always gonna find books about real estate. And one of the biggest books you'll always find in that area are Robert Kiyosaki Siri's of Rich Dad, Poor Dad Books. So I became very familiar with his philosophies and things of that nature. And then my wife calls me up one, and she's like, Hey, I got an email from Robert Kiyosaki and these come into town and he's doing, you know ah, free event. Maybe we should go. And as naive as we were back in those days, we were really thinking we got an email from sake and fighting to come to one of his events. So we went, Yes, we went to one of those little three hour classes that sold you on a three day course, and so he went and bought the three day course like 199 bucks. And honestly, that was a really good good thing for me because I didn't know what short sales where I didn't know what some of the creative financing models were. I didn't see the power of the leverage and everything else like that. I was. I was a very naive young man. I didn't understand the business at all. So going to the three day class with Robert Tia sake's rich Dad. Poor dad. At that time, I believe they were calling. I believe it was rich. That education, um, I was exposed to a lot of things I've never heard of I'd bought from also. I don't even know what a wholesaler did. I didn't understand how a wholesaler operated. I just bought from them. So going to that three day class, I learned a lot and ultimately going to the three day class. I bought their training package and I got a training package from Rich Dad. And I can't give you exact timeline because I'm bad with times. But within about 6 to 8 months, I achieved my wife and I had achieved the the Rich Dad Hall of Fame for 2013. So out of all of the students enrolled in their programs, my wife and I were selected as one of a very select few number of people that were awarded the Hall of Fame for that year, and we achieved that through basically retiring ourself in about 6 to 8 months.
So what were you doing to achieve that? We're wholesaling rehabbing. What were you doing to achieve the Hall of Fame?
Uh, essentially, if you're familiar with the game of, um, cash flow. Robert Q. Sake's cashflow game. I really analyze my financials and going through all those flips and doing all that stuff I got, I guess what you call Hood Rich. I mean, I grew up extremely poor. I grew up in some unusual situations and is the first time in my life I ever saw money. So I had, you know, the 12 acre ranch with a 35 100 square foot house for my wife and myself to live in. No kids got cars, got a $30,000 stereo system. I got all this toys, and I started looking at how that was affecting me. And so what I did at that point in time, I was still a full time employee. At that time, I liquidated most all of my assets sold off my ranch, sold off my car so long my stereo system sold off all the stuff that I could liquidate and said, You know what? I'm quitting my job and we backed out of the job. And once we backed out of the job, Um, I was doing everything I could to get going, and I was trying to do wholesaling us, trying to do rehab, just trying to do all those different sounds things. And I wasn't really becoming successful. And I started seeing my bank accounts started to dwindle even more and more and more. And then finally, I just buckled down and said, This is what I need to do. So what I did is I paid $1200 cash for a mobile home, out in the middle, out in the middle of nowhere and lot rents on the mobile home. But I moved into a mobile home park. That lot rinses like $225 a month, so I went from needing $7000 a month five to debt service. All of my loan's going down to being lone free, living in a mobile home for tuning 50 bucks a month, plus just living expenses Plus, I had a semi decent bank account at the time. So what I did from there started buying more and more mobile homes. As I started buying more, more mobile homes, I buy him. I turned around and owner finance them on a note, and I use that note as cash flow. And I just started buying notes or about trading notes using mobile homes. So in a very short period of time, I went from meeting 7000 month to survive and even really about 2000 month to survive. And I was able to really fast, really quickly. Owner finance The mobile homes increase in excess of $2000 a month in passive income, and that's predominately why we're able to achieve the rich, that hall of fame throughout that time. We're still doing some rehabs in some hole sales, but was really the mobile homes that retired me at that earlier than age. Financially retired.
Amazing. That's a great story. So are you still doing mobile homes now? Are Is that something that you stopped Eventually?
I stopped doing mobile homes about a year and 1/2 ago, and that was mostly because um, I really broke down everything I was doing in my business. And there's many different ways to make money in real estate in many, many, many different ways to make money in real estate. And I looked at all of them. I said, Which ones do enjoy which ones, though I don't know which ones make me the most money, Which ones are the most time consuming? And I really narrowed it down to I really enjoy rehabbing. Rehabbing makes me a lot of money. I'm tired of doing everything else. So if it's not a rehab, then I'm not doing it. So I really move straight into doing nothing but rehabs and rehab. Essentially my cracks here for rehabs. I need 15,000 per month. I'm on a deal triple net every month, So if I've got a deal, is gonna take me a month to do it. I need 15,000 triple net on it after I pay everything off any 15 grand on it, it's going to be on that deal for three months. I need 45 grand to triple net, and so I really started nit picking. What I was buying was in 2015. I did 67 houses across multiple strategies, but it almost killed me. I mean, I was I was busting balls every single day out there doing this. And in 2016 I only did 23 house. But in 2016 I made more money than I didn't 7 15 And then going into this year, I mean, I started once again looking at this all over again. It's like, all right, It took me 23 properties last year, but I only made X amount of dollars. You know, when I say only X amount of dollars, many people would be okay with the money I made, but I'm wanting to get further and faster. So I started saying, What can I do? Thio Take this to the next level. And so early early this year, end of last year. In the last year I did a A $1,000,000 new construction project, did a really nice payday on it. And I was like, I liked that payday. I'm tired of doing these 50 60 $70,000 deals where I'm making 30 40 $50,000. You know this new construction project I mean, you know, several 100,000 on one deal. So I was like, What can I do to start moving into deals where I'm doing? Seven. Figure eight Figure, nine figure deals? I haven't made its nine figures yet, but instead of making hundreds of thousands of dollars on a deal making millions on the deal and that's really where my focus is gone over the last year is just moving into $1,000,000 deals.
It's funny because just hearing your story for five minutes, I mentioned you don't struggle with the abundance mindset. But what I love about what you just told me was is it wasn't about the fact that you did 60 something properties in 2015. You enjoyed doing fewer properties the next year, but you made more money. And so often I'm asked, How many properties have you wholesale rehab last year in the past 12 months? And I always tell him, I don't know. I don't keep track of that. I can tell you how much money I've made. That's that's the whole reason why we do this. And for May, I don't I don't care about the volume of properties, but it's more about how much money am I making and how is that impacting the growth of my business? So I think that's very valuable information to look at the fact that more properties, less money almost killed you. You're able to do fewer properties, make more money in your life better. And now you're even trying to capitalize that on Maur by going to hire in deals that are a whole nother level as an investor, very certain, very important for newer investors to understand that because I think so often, especially in like the wholesaling arena, which is what I'm in. It doesn't sound like you've done much wholesaling, but a lot of times they have the mentality of I'm gonna go out and I'm going to get as many properties as possible and made my whole selfie. But if you go out and you acquire appropriately at the right price, you can make more money and wholesale less property's less headaches, less less transactions to coordinate better, better business plan.
I love the people that have both been in this business for a while. I really do like how you put that. I mean, I didn't start it. It was all about volume. I needed to do morning doom, or and then I started getting wise, like like you have. And it's not about how many properties I do. It's how much money I make. Who cares how many properties do as long as I make X amount of dollars? And then I just really started analyzing. What can I do to make that X amount of dollars and still have freedom still have a life? Because that's why we get into this is we want to have a better life. And, you know, working 80 hours a week isn't a great life.
No. And it's funny because I get people that look at me kind of sideways. Sometimes when they say I'm a property done the past 12 months, I don't know. I could go look it up. I mean, I have it in my system, but that's not a number that I track, and I want to know on a regular basis. I couldn't even tell you how many deals I've done in the past two weeks, to be honest with you,
but you know how
much money I've made, all right, and that's just that's what's the important number. That's why we're in this and, like you said to make a have a better life, you know? So let's talk about another aspect of your career in real estate investing, and that's propel Leo. Won't you tell people what propel Leo is? And then kind of tell the story about how that came about?
Yeah. I mean, propelling who is is, is interesting. It's definitely missing my business partner and his baby. But two or three years ago, there was some issues in my business issues that I needed resolved that software, seemed like it would be the solution and hasn't a mastermind at that time. And with Mate Lester, my business partner. And, uh, you know, I kind of express some of those issues to him, and he's like, Oh, man, I I can solve those issues where you just kind of outline how you want it to look and I'll take care of before Because he was a software developer as well as a real estate investor. In a couple of months into that, he had me a prototype of what I was looking for, and as time progressed, I started asking him form or Mawr in Faras, the product went, and now now you see what propelled Leo's today, and that is the ability to get true in Dallas. Cops 24 hours a day, seven days a week. Be a real estate brokerage. Eso That was a struggle for my business At the time I was wanting people to work with me. I wanted to help them out. But how do I get them? Comes without just Bird overflowing my broker. So I talked to my broker and was like, Hey, how can we make this happen? And the broken came in was like, Let's do this. And so we were able to pull together. The cops were able to pull together the lead management worth a multi user system and then the lead lists. On top of that, I don't know if you know that, but we do. Probate Sweet affidavits of Airship noticed the trustee sales, an appointment to substitute trustees all under the propel yo dot com platform. So it's ah, it's ah, it was not something I'd ever intended on doing. It's not like five years ago I was like, Hey, let's build a software company. It was just something that kind of evolved into what it is today.
That's awesome. So how much of your time do you think in a weekly basis is dedicated to propel Leo as it but truly become like passive income for year. You involved on the day to day basis of it.
It really is both. Like, right now, we could essentially shut down the doors to propel Leo and have massive amounts of cash flow every month. But we are not satisfied with what Billy always we want propel Leo to be bigger. So we're putting massive amounts of time into growing this company. So I want to say massive amounts of time. I'm working 40 hours a week on Propelled Leo. Like I also said, I really narrowed down the number of real estate investments I'm doing. Not that I'm making less money doing real estate investing. I'm just narrowed down the number of deals I'm doing, like here in 2017. I personally know how many deals I've done. I've done like four, but those four and I'm only like little ways through 3/4 of the way into this year, I've already made almost double what I did last year. I'm doing less less deals, so it takes less time, but I'm making more money. I'm just I'm just using my money, my money, my money, my time and my money differently than I used to, but with propelling, I'm, like, 40 hours a week on it. I enjoyed. I don't know if you've noticed that we put together that TV studio to kind of get some educational stuff out there. Get some, get some stuff like that out there. So, um, I really enjoy it. We have a full studio all the time of people coming in. I really look forward to when you come in. Uh, that's gonna be a It's gonna be a fun time. I think
I look at you. You put me on blast. So you know, I have to show up everyone that's listening. I have a little bit fearful of the cameras and the lights in his studio. So But eventually I told Daniel that I will make it out there and I will I will be a part of his show. I
think you said seven months, right? Seven
months? Yes. Sometime sometime next summer. I've
got you on the calendar.
Yeah. Um all right. So for people who aren't familiar and I'll put a link up there for propel Leo but dive in a little bit more about the service and kind of the cost for a newer investor and how that could help them in their business.
And then also, I mean, if I'd like to kind of follow us, they can also check out our YouTube channel and stuff like that. I don't know if you know about this, but we're putting together the Propel Leo Academy. I went through the education circles. I went through the guru's. I paid for a lot of mentorships, and some of them were great. Some of them were absolutely horrible. But I came from a background where most of my friends including, you know, everyone, my entire family, we didn't have money. So one of those traveling salesmen came in saying we could make you rich doing real estate to give us 50 grand. A lot of the people that want to get rich don't have 50 grand, So I'm really looking forward to putting together the service through the polio academy to educate other people on how to use real estate to get financially free, and it not be $50,000 that not even be thousands of dollars I'm talking about, You know, hop on propel leo dot com. Look at our academy and then have access to the education that you want to move forward with it. I have that abundance mentality. Give people what they need and it'll come first. Full circle. When do you
anticipate that rolling out?
The academy is in development right now? I hope by the end of this month, early next month having it live. Right now we have Grant Kemp with creative cash flow coming in and doing a full blown subject to training owner financing wraps. That's about 75 80 videos long. He's already shot about 20 of those videos. I mean, all the way from teaching you how to use a 10 B two calculator to how to analyze the deal. How to negotiate the deal. Things to concern yourself with contract all the way into debt, servicing it, verifying your loans, verifying your underlying leans, verifying your insurance. He is a full blown teaching this stuff. This isn't a sales pitch, so that is a full blown education. Of course, I have already put together the basics course where I go through the different strategies and explain what they are. I'm going through how to analyze the deal, how to run cops on it. I'm also going through a foreclosure, foreclosure, training, things all that should be coming out over the next couple of months.
That's amazing as a fellow investor, and you know my side of things. I majority of our revenue is from wholesaling. And so a lot of times when I wholesale a property, it's to a newer investor straight out of an education program. This is something that's desperately needed. There's too many education programs out there that are charging far too much money for not enough education. So from another investor, thank you for creating that. And I hope it's 1/10 of what you just said. It's gonna be because that's that's amazing. And that's a need. And I always tell people as investors, we are problem solvers by nature. That's what we're supposed to do way solve motivated sellers, problems, distressed properties. We solved that problem on dhe for you, too. Solve problems for investors. People in your community community with both propel Leo and the propel. Yo, Academy, thank you for everything that you're doing for for this industry.
I I don't know howto how to respond to that man other than thank you. Um, I tend to be somewhat humbled at times, but, um, I I look forward to helping people, and I hope I hope that other people reciprocate that they see that. And, you know, it kind of takes this real estate investing industry on a new movement. I feel ashamed to be associated with those suit and tie salesman to fly around the country saying, Give me 50 to $100,000 to teach you how to do real estate when really all they do is is do everything they can to extract as much a cz they can out of your back pocket. And I don't want to be associated with that. I don't wanna I don't wanna be. You're part of that.
Absolutely. And and on top of that, there's people that are coming out of these education programs that aren't educated enough to become an investor. And so they they're losing losing their life savings. But then there are also tarnishing the name of real estate investors just because they don't understand how to handle a transaction for the fact that they're spending as much as they are in education. If they're still ignorant in certain aspects of the transaction. And I'm talking all the way down to what? What is earnest money? What is an option, period? I mean, they're they're not educated in just simple basics. So this is a huge need. It's ah, it's a passion of mine and everybody within my company. This is why I'm doing the podcast. I want appreciate people like you. I want to get free, free content out there for people. Listen, and And I've learned this just from the few podcast interviews that I've done with other people that have very successful podcast programs, and I've had people rejected me and thank me for for what I taught them in my interviews, and I didn't feel like I said anything that was mined. In fact, afterwards, I was like, I don't think anybody's gonna want Oh, I didn't bring anything of value and then I have people telling me No, it was amazing and you've inspired me to become a wholesaler or rehab. And so it's love that it's why I decided to do this, to be honestly, this is not comfortable for me. It's not something that I ever thought I would do, Just like you said with Propel Leo It was not something that you had in the in the plans. You just saw a need and you solved it for me. I saw something where I could get back and I could get back to something that I'm passionate about, which is real estate investing. These the greatest career out there. Like you said All you goto financial freedom section at Barnes and Noble and majority of it says real estate. A certain point time it says real estate. And for me, I've always known that. But until I actually got into real estate investing, I did not realize the impact that it could have on my life and everybody that works for me. And it's just it's such a passion for me. And so hearing someone else going out there and doing other things for the industry to make it better, it's very much needed, and I appreciate everything that you're doing. They're so awesome stops you. So one thing I want to talk to you about as well because I think this is vitally important for everyone that's new is what is your why why do you do everything that you do? Why are you trying to go out and do seven and eight your deals? Why are you creating propel Leo in the academy and all of these things? What? Your wife,
that is something that I've always had asked myself for a while. And you know, the answers changed a little bit over time as I have grown and I have mature and other people have pushed me in different directions. But ultimately I think my why is and this this might seem outside of the normal. But is is growth. Growing up, I was told by a lot of people, a lot of people that did a lot of bad things to me in my life, that I would never be anything. So making sure that I leave this world doing more than anything everybody ever thought I could do is really I think, what really drives me beyond beyond money beyond family, beyond many other things, there was a lot of people that when I was growing up, told me I'd be nothing. And I think really, what drives me more than anything is my fear of that being true. I don't ever want to die knowing that I was nothing. So it really pushes me to do a lot more than I ever really should.
Well, I will say this. You have a great story. You've proven a lot of people wrong with your past so far and everything that you've done and you're doing so you should be proud of that. If the people that are out there that are listening, if they want to reach out, they want to contact you, what's the best way for them? They're gonna
hate you. It's best. By email. Daniel D. A N I E l at propel leo dot com That's P r o p E l i o dot com or just going to our website for polio dot com and reaching out to us on the forms that we're releasing. I plan to be very active on those forms, so if you have questions reach out to us. They're on the forms on propel Leo, probably due for release mid September.
Awesome. Daniel, thank you so much for taking your time out of your busy schedule today to talk to us and share your story. It's truly inspirational for myself and hopefully forever. One that listens and keep up the good work and we'll see you down the road.
Thank you, R j for having me and thank you for doing this. I think the things that you're doing are goingto help many people. I know it will. I mean, it's people like you that are out there trying to help people versus trying to take advantage of people That, I think, was what this industry really is about. And I think more of us, just like us, are stepping up to make that happen.
Yes, sir. Thank you, Daniel. We'll talk to you soon.
Have a good energy
about by what? Thanks so much for listening to the titanium vault with your host R J base that hurt more imposing. To stamp the date, visit www dot podcast on the titanium vault dot com and on facebook dot com slash the titanium vault. He enjoyed the episode. Please read and review, and we'll catch you next time