E44: Agata's Session #2: Fear of Being a Narcissist, Bad, Evil + Relationship OCD (ROCD)

If you struggle with ROCD + fearing you might be narcissistic or a terrible person, then this episode is for you. Agata returns to the podcast after our session a month ago, where we did some transformational inner work on her ROCD. Today, she brings forward fear and shame that's been coming up for her that she could be a narcissist, which has been arising due to thoughts that she might be better than her partner or more out of his league. 

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Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:00

Everybody, welcome back to another episode of the For Love We Heal podcast. It's June 4th today, and I've got another episode for you. Uh I invited Agata back on the podcast to do another session together. We had a session about a month ago and it went really well. Uh so I wanted to have Agata back on to follow up with how things have been going, which she reported very well, very minimal RSD, almost none, uh, since our last session. Although keep in mind she's been doing a lot of work on herself. So um, but uh really happy to hear that. And we did another amazing piece of work together uh where where she had a lot of fears of being bad or being a narcissist, um, and a lot of shame around that. So we got to a bit of that core shame and loneliness. So we did a lovely piece of work together and healed an exile of hers that was coming up for her, uh, which uh which I really want you to get a sense of what this is like because this is what healing looks like with the IFS model, so it's what you can expect through your healing work as well. Um, but before we dive into today's episode, I want to announce my new RFCD Healing Circles, which is uh intimate group of 10 people where we meet weekly for an hour and a half on Wednesdays from 4 to 5:30 p.m. And this is uh essentially group therapy where there's group sharing, processing, and and group therapy and coaching uh with an intimate group of individuals who are all struggling with relationship OCD. I've gotten a lot of feedback from our support groups and uh those in the ROCD course in community that they're looking for more regular meetings uh of groups because of how powerful the groups have been so far for really feeling less shame and isolation and and loneliness. Because I mean, think about like I don't know if you experienced this, but I remember when I was going through ROCD, like nobody really understood what I was going through. And I didn't feel like I could really talk to anybody because when I would talk to family or loved ones, no one really seemed to understand it. And and worse, you know, worse is that you try to confide in someone because you're feeling so much guilt and shame and fear and anxiety that you want to be able to talk to someone, but they say the exact thing that we don't want to hear, which is, well, I mean, if you're unsure, why don't you find someone you're more sure about? Which is just it's it's the last thing we want to hear when we struggle with relationship OCD because we we really do love our partner, we really do want it to work out. We're just stuck in so much doubt, fear, avoidance, and anxiety that's hard to really see that uh clearly. Um, so uh I wanted to create these groups because not not only did those in the course and community express interest in having more regular groups, I wanted to provide a space where I can help you reduce isolation. And honestly, too, to give you a lower cost option than one-to-one support, because for the price of essentially one session with me, you can get six hours of groups like uh every week for an hour and a half, six hours of groups a month for like a fraction of the cost of what one-to-one sessions would be. So um also too, if you're on my waiting list, it would get you'd have the opportunity work to work with me directly in groups uh before a spot comes available in my practice, which uh which can be quite some time now because I have quite a long waiting list. So if you want to be part of our groups, there's 10, there's uh uh nine spots available now. I just released it yesterday, so those will probably fill up quite quickly. So uh if you want to be part of the group side, sign up now. These are on-growing groups as well, so you know, uh it's not like a six-week or a 12-week program. It rolls over every month. So as soon as a spot comes available, you'll, you know, I'll be sending out emails, you'll be notified of when you can sign up. So you'll be able to just stay for as long as you like. You can cancel any time. Uh, you're just committed to that one month that you do sign up. Uh, you know, for uh and it's it's 289. It's 289 for for the month. So so not bad at all. Uh so if you'd like to sign up, the link will be in the in the description below. Uh so I'd like to uh why don't we get into today's episode and uh and I hope you enjoy, and we'll see you in the next one. Everybody, welcome back to another episode of the For Love We Hill podcast. I'm happy to have uh a gata back on the podcast. We had done a session, I don't know what it was it like a month ago or something.

SPEAKER_03 4:43

I think it was exactly a month, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 4:44

A month ago, and I wanted to have a gata back a gata back on because last time we did uh quite a uh a nice piece of work together, and I wanted to follow up with you to see how things are going and maybe do a little continuation of of that. Is that right?

SPEAKER_03 5:00

Yeah, that's great, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 5:03

So tell us a little bit about what how you've been doing since you came on last and since we did that piece of work together.

SPEAKER_03 5:12

Um, so I've been doing great to the point that I was wondering, oh, what I'm gonna do today, you know, because like relationship anxiety or ROCD-wise, I don't think I've experienced anything uh bad or negative lately. Uh maybe I had a little bit of um like a comeback around my period, you know.

SPEAKER_04 5:37

So I'd say like when it comes to female hormones, it's still the I'm sure the I'm sure the I mean probably 90% of my following or 85 are are female, so the luteal that like many will uh be uh uh resonate with the luteal phase where you know things uh you know anxiety and obsessions typically heighten during that period anyway, right? So so what you're saying is for the most part, no ROCD. No except you know, on your period like when you're yeah, like right before my period, yes.

SPEAKER_03 6:19

Uh right before I had like very cool moments at some point because maybe remember last time I said that I started feeling more like in my feminine, and by that I mean I just started going to like hill classes, dance classes, you know, and I've been surrounded with many women, like beautiful communities supporting each other, you know. I love that I get so much energy from them. And from that, like I I love it a lot, but sometimes it makes me feel so good about myself, so confident and like empowered, to the point that I'm going to like extreme, and I'm thinking, and sometimes the thoughts would pop up of being like, Oh, you're much better than your partner right now, you know, stuff like that. Uh, which is I I really don't like it, and and I think that's something I would like to focus on today, but uh just I wanna give a bit of context here. But uh, like sometimes during those moments, I would have think the thoughts like, okay, all of those women they see me this way right now, they see me maybe as a beautiful, cool, uh, like that's what I'm getting from them, you know. So, what if they would now know that I'm with you know a partner that is shorter than me, for example, and then what if they would judge me suddenly and they would think that I'm settling or something like that? And I have those thoughts frequently um when I'm in like this triggered state uh during the classes, but very recently, like last month, I had this thought, and then I had another thought, very automatic thought, that just said, just let them like just let them judge you. Judge you, and I was like, Whoa, like I didn't expect to have because you know, usually I would like force myself to have those thoughts, being like, No, I'm not gonna, you know, let them like okay, that's fine, they can judge me, but there would be still a bit of like anxiety, whereas on that during that moment it was just like automatic, like pure trust, like, yeah, just let them that's it, just let them like so you know who you chose, you love that person, and it doesn't matter what they think.

SPEAKER_04 8:33

That's it, that's beautiful.

SPEAKER_03 8:35

That was great, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 8:36

That's transformational, that's amazing, yeah. That's what it starts to become. It starts to become less of a uh this like need to sort of counter counter the thoughts by saying, No, let them, and more of a an opening into a trusting that it doesn't really matter what they think, that you trust your own decision, and whatever they think is what they think. It doesn't it doesn't mean anything about you ultimately. Yeah, so I love that.

SPEAKER_03 9:02

Exactly, and it's like it's not like I'm you know fully free from from ROCD thoughts, like from intrusive thoughts. They are there, but I just pay way less attention to them, and I think that's right. That's the difference. That's right. I would still sometimes maybe look at my partner and be like, oh, I'm not attracted to him, but then we'll be just like, Oh yeah, that's fine. I'm just right now not attracted to him.

SPEAKER_04 9:27

Well, that's where I'm at.

SPEAKER_03 9:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 9:30

Like I don't uh, you know, I I'm I'm pretty much at the same place where it's like, yeah, I mean, we're not gonna be attracted to our partner all the time. But whatever, you know. It's like okay, okay. And then I'm just pleasantly surprised. It passes, and then when they are, yeah, you're pleasantly surprised, and you're like, oh, they really look really nice today, how I'm enjoying seeing them in this way, and then another day might not be the same, but it just doesn't, it doesn't hit hard anymore. It doesn't hit. It's just it's just the we have might have the thoughts, we might have these experiences, but they kind of just float past us and not take hold anymore, right?

SPEAKER_03 10:10

Yeah, exactly. Because like even you know, like during our last session, I was talking a lot about acceptance, and I feel like that's the the missing piece that you know everybody talk about. They everybody were like just accept it, just accept it. But I think especially at the beginning of your journey, you don't really fully understand what does it mean and how to get there. Like it takes a long time, and you need to actually like I don't know, physically understand what does it mean to just accept everything that's happening. So, like if you feel like yeah, you're not attracted to your partner, just accept it. If you feel like you want to break up, just accept it. It doesn't mean you have to do this, but just accept that this is the state that you are at right now.

SPEAKER_06 10:55

That's exactly right.

SPEAKER_03 10:56

Yeah, and that's just so transformative. Like, I think that was my missing piece that helped me to now where be where I am right now.

SPEAKER_04 11:04

That's amazing. You've come a long way. This is great.

SPEAKER_03 11:08

I mean, it's been what like five years now? So yeah, yeah, it's a long way, but it's a journey.

SPEAKER_04 11:15

Yeah, it took me about that long too. You know, along the way, I would like, you know, I I'd go to therapy, and then after therapy, I'd have like a week where I felt really good, and then and then I'd crash for another week, and then you know, I'd sort of like come out of it, and then I'd fall back down, and I'd come out, and the but the periods got longer and longer, and then it was about probably about two years, two to three years before before I felt somewhat okay, and then about four or five to where it it's where it we're talking about now, where it's just like whatever, you know what I mean? It's like, well, who cares?

SPEAKER_03 11:54

And that way you can just focus on literally anything else.

SPEAKER_04 11:57

You actually have capacity to focus on anything else, like work or like your hobbies, or as you're saying, your dance classes with other people now. It's interesting you're saying now there's these thoughts that come up for you around dance where all these women are appreciating you and whatever, and then the the thought of it sounds like it's catches you to some degree, right? Like maybe I'm no, what was it?

SPEAKER_03 12:20

I'm maybe I'm better than my partner, or what's the maybe yeah, maybe uh uh I am better, maybe I am out of his league. I don't know what those are like nasty little thoughts.

SPEAKER_04 12:32

Yeah, maybe I'm out of his league.

SPEAKER_03 12:35

Yeah, and then there's another part, and I think that's the part I would like to mostly work on, which is like judgmental towards me, being like, oh, I'm the narcissistic right now, I'm the narcissist right now, I'm the self-absorbed. And it's this very weird part of me that constantly stops me from reaching certain level of I don't know, comfort, confidence, empowerment. I don't know, because it's like it doesn't trust me. Yeah, it thinks that I will go into extreme. So, for example, if I'm feeling good about myself, if I'm feeling confident, it always is there to kind of stop me at certain point before I will turn into this like self-absorbed mean girl, for example, you know, that wants all the attention or that that I will it like undermines you, yeah, yeah, like maybe. I don't know, it's like uh it's I'm I'm just scared that I'm gonna become a narcissist, you know, that I'm gonna become someone that is ultimately evil. And oh wow, and it's like I don't know, I genuinely don't know where it does it come from, because it can show up in literally every like social aspect of my life in relationship, like romantic relationship as well. Because you know, then it will be like if I'm staying with my with my partner despite lacking attraction, what if ultimately I will hurt him because I am just choosing something that is bad, you know, that I'm doing something bad, I'm doing something wrong, so that make makes me a bad person.

SPEAKER_04 14:11

That's the shame. Yeah, that's the shame moon.

SPEAKER_03 14:16

I just know that this is always the same part that is like I cannot do certain things, or maybe to the to the like bigger extent, because it's like no, be careful, you're gonna become narcissists now. Like you are a narcissist, you are a narcissist, yeah. You are a narcissist, and if you're gonna go there, it's like it holds me, so I'm not gonna become like yeah, I hear you. I think you know what I mean.

SPEAKER_04 14:42

Let's focus on that one then. Let's focus on that today.

SPEAKER_03 14:46

So it stops me from actually unleashing it. Yes, yes, or something. I don't know.

SPEAKER_04 14:52

The beast, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 14:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 14:54

So let's so foot, let's fo you ready to do that then? We'll do that today.

SPEAKER_03 14:58

Yeah, I think so. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 15:00

You got anything else you want to share before we go in inside?

SPEAKER_03 15:04

Um, I'm just genuinely curious where it will take me, because I have no idea where to go. Like, you know, last session I had an idea uh where will I end up. Um and right now I genuinely have no idea.

SPEAKER_04 15:21

Well, that's good. You're curious, so let's see where it takes us. Yeah, that's great. So focus inside and find you could do it eyes open or close, but find the part of you who's sort of that stops you from reaching certain levels of confidence and empowerment by by saying certain things like you're the narcissist right now, or I'm the narcissist right now. That fears becoming bad or evil. See if you can locate it somewhere.

SPEAKER_11 15:59

Just gonna drink the thing.

SPEAKER_04 16:02

Sure, sure. Whether that's like through words, like you might hear it in your mind, or you might just see how do you normally experience it.

SPEAKER_09 16:15

I mean, it usually feels like fear mixed with the thoughts.

SPEAKER_04 16:20

Yep, yeah. Is there fear and thoughts? Like, are they different? Or are they the same?

SPEAKER_03 16:27

I think mostly thoughts, but I can definitely feel the squeeze in my belly.

SPEAKER_04 16:32

Okay, so notice the squeezing in your belly.

SPEAKER_03 16:35

It's like belly between belly and chest.

SPEAKER_04 16:39

Yeah, that's right. Okay, so focus on that. So focus on the fear. And that's the fear of being a narcissist or becoming one.

SPEAKER_03 16:50

Yeah. That's I'll just be like too full of myself. And then, you know, people will think of me that I'm that I am like this, that I am just this, I don't know, nasty person.

SPEAKER_04 17:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 17:07

You know.

SPEAKER_04 17:07

Ah, that's right. Okay, okay. So we'll we'll start there then. Does that feel right?

SPEAKER_00 17:12

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_04 17:13

Okay, okay, good. So, how do you feel toward that part of you that carries that fear?

SPEAKER_03 17:23

I just I just want to understand why.

SPEAKER_04 17:27

Yeah. Yeah. Do you want to understand why from your head or your heart?

SPEAKER_10 17:35

Hard question.

SPEAKER_04 17:36

Um notice where you are where you want to understand why. Where is it coming from?

SPEAKER_03 17:44

I think from my heart. It's like going around here.

SPEAKER_04 17:48

Good. So just let it know. You want to understand. You want to understand more. See what happens when you bring curiosity to this part of you.

SPEAKER_03 18:09

I don't think it wants to let me know because the brain fog showed up again.

SPEAKER_04 18:15

Oh, hi, brain fog. Welcome back. Welcome back. So focus on that, Agata. The brain fog. And let's ask it, what are you concerned would happen if we got closer to this fear?

SPEAKER_11 18:42

I don't know.

SPEAKER_07 18:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_11 18:46

Just blank right now. Nothing really happening.

SPEAKER_04 18:50

Okay. Can I talk to the blanking part?

SPEAKER_00 18:53

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_04 18:54

Okay. We talked last time, did we, blanking part or brain fog part? Okay, well, welcome back. It's good to have you here. I just want you to know I probably said this to you last time. I think it's great that you're here. I don't I don't have any intention of getting past you or through you. But I'm wondering if you're willing to share with me a little bit about what you're trying to help with right now.

SPEAKER_03 19:25

I think I'm just nervous right now.

SPEAKER_04 19:27

You're nervous. Yeah, yeah. My guess is that there's lots of shame in there. Is that right?

SPEAKER_00 19:39

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_04 19:40

Okay. And that stuff, oh my god, shame is like really hard to feel. I mean, it's one of the most intolerable of human emotions. And uh, yeah, there's some emotion coming through too.

SPEAKER_00 19:54

Hmm.

SPEAKER_04 19:55

Is that the shame or is that something else?

SPEAKER_10 19:59

No, I think it's shame.

SPEAKER_04 20:01

Okay. So can so if I was to talk to the shame, can you hold back just a little while longer so that I can get permission from these dissociative parts?

SPEAKER_00 20:13

Hmm.

SPEAKER_04 20:14

Okay, okay. Cause my my guess is that if we go to you too soon, then they might not like that. They might close the doors tighter. So I would like to be able to get to you, but in a way that's safe for the whole system. Okay. How did do you see that brain brain fog part and blinding part? Did you see how I was able to negotiate with that that shame?

SPEAKER_11 20:41

Hmm. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 20:43

Yeah. Yeah. How's that for you to see that we could actually ask shame to pull back its energy a little bit?

SPEAKER_08 20:51

It's bizarre.

SPEAKER_04 20:53

Yeah, it is, isn't it?

SPEAKER_08 20:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 20:55

It is. So that I want you to know, like, if you were to if you were to ever give us permission to heal that shame, I can actually have we can actually do it in a way that doesn't overwhelm the system.

SPEAKER_00 21:08

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 21:10

So because my guess is that it's not all that fun to keep that shame all locked up like that.

SPEAKER_10 21:16

Yeah, no.

SPEAKER_04 21:17

Okay. Would you would we have your permission to be to heal that shame?

SPEAKER_11 21:25

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 21:27

I really appreciate that. Sorry. Thank you. Thank you. You got and you know, you you can act as like maybe you can stand by, and if it if you ever get scared or feel like it's gonna be too much, you can just jump right back in.

SPEAKER_00 21:44

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_04 21:45

Okay, thank you. Can we bring Agata back with her loving heart?

SPEAKER_10 21:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 21:52

Alright, okay, gata. So so notice that shame and that fear.

SPEAKER_03 22:00

I actually must now notice it more like like above my head, like in front of my head. It's like a thought, it's like constant pictures of people just judging me.

SPEAKER_04 22:15

Ah, okay, that's it. So notice those pictures of people judging you. Okay. And how do you feel toward the pictures?

SPEAKER_03 22:30

Really upset and scared and I mean it's it just feels like rejection, you know.

SPEAKER_04 22:40

Yeah, that's the pain, right?

SPEAKER_10 22:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 22:42

So invite the pain to go to the pictures, but see if you can be with the pain, like in a loving way. Like let the pain know, let the parts know that you're here too. You can help them. Yeah, we're here for you. You don't have to do this alone anymore. See if that helps.

SPEAKER_03 23:25

Still just sad, but it's more like like a warm kind of sad.

SPEAKER_04 23:30

It's a warm sad, it's compassion. It's compassion. Gently hold that compassion, sort of extend it gently forward toward that pain and see what happens. Notice what happens. Yeah.

SPEAKER_10 24:11

Even if they reject me.

SPEAKER_04 24:13

Uh okay, good. And how old is she in there?

SPEAKER_03 24:18

It's hard to tell. I actually don't don't know if that's a young version of me or is it just me?

SPEAKER_04 24:28

That's okay. That's alright. Is that version of you aware of you?

SPEAKER_03 24:43

It's it's weird because you know, last time it was clearly another like person as in like me, it could visualize me, but this time it's more like a point, like a I don't know, like energy or an energy, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 25:03

Or a what? Or what time period?

SPEAKER_03 25:08

Uh it's just like a point.

SPEAKER_04 25:14

That's good. That's good. Just stay noticing it. That's great. What's it like to feel it? Like you you feel warm and sad, but if you feel the edge of the shame and the rejection, what's that like? How's it how do you hold that in your body?

SPEAKER_11 25:36

Yeah, I just feel again getting warmer as in like nervous warm.

SPEAKER_04 25:45

Yeah, that's it. Okay, that's it. Good. Just the edge though, right? You don't need we don't need to go fully into it. Can you stay just at the edge there?

SPEAKER_00 25:57

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_04 25:58

Okay, so notice that nervous warm feeling.

SPEAKER_11 26:02

Yeah, like my body tense up.

SPEAKER_04 26:06

Yeah, that's right. That's right. That's very good. It's good to feel this. It's good to feel this.

SPEAKER_07 26:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 26:24

See what else you notice about it. Any other images or sounds or words that come up?

SPEAKER_03 26:42

Like, you know, I had those pictures um of people judging me, and then I felt compassion, and now those pictures are gone.

SPEAKER_05 26:51

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 26:52

So I'm trying to seek maybe the other source of shame.

SPEAKER_04 27:00

Don't don't seek, just be, just be with it.

SPEAKER_03 27:02

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 27:03

What we're gonna what we'll do is uh if if I may, we'll just so part that carries all that shame, are you still there? Okay, good. And dissociative parts, the blanking one, and the fa and and you um the brain fog, you're there too.

SPEAKER_03 27:24

Yeah, it's still on guard.

SPEAKER_04 27:26

Good, good, be on guard. That's great. That's great. What I'd like to invite you all to do is if you're willing to, is create a little bit of space inside. Almost as if you imagine uh the the the moon uneclipsing the sun. So that as you move away from the heart, you can feel the warmth of compassion. You can see the light, the radiating warmth that's there. To where you'll notice that there's somebody in here, there's the adult agata that is able to be with you all with healing energy. See if that helps.

SPEAKER_11 28:35

Yeah, um the squeeze in my belly came back, so Okay.

SPEAKER_05 28:46

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 28:48

Is your heart open?

SPEAKER_00 28:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 28:51

Good. So just know let these parts look at you and get a sense of you here with them that there's somebody else in here that can really help.

SPEAKER_07 29:11

That's it.

SPEAKER_04 29:17

That's it. No, what's that? What's the effect that it has on them to see you there with them?

SPEAKER_03 29:27

I just feel a bit more calm, but as in not as warm, as nervous as before.

SPEAKER_07 29:38

Yeah, that's good. Notice that.

SPEAKER_03 29:41

Yeah, but the squeeze in my belly, the I think the the one that I associated with shame is still there.

SPEAKER_04 29:50

Yeah, yeah, that's right. Let that be there, but notice that warmth and calm too. And let this just extend that warmth into the t the the um your belly. Let it know you really feel it there. Really feel it.

SPEAKER_07 30:38

Let's see what that's like. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. That's right. That's right. See what it's see what that's like for it.

SPEAKER_03 31:14

Yeah, I think this part is confused because like how can I know?

SPEAKER_04 31:20

How can you know? Yeah. Well, you might ask it, what makes it so why is it so worried about you becoming a narcissist?

SPEAKER_02 31:38

Then I'll I'll be this bad person that hurts others.

SPEAKER_07 31:45

Oh. Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_03 31:48

And that nobody wants to be a friend with someone like that. Nobody wants to be with someone like that.

SPEAKER_07 31:55

That's right.

SPEAKER_04 31:56

That's right. So you'd be alone?

SPEAKER_11 32:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 32:01

Yeah, bad and alone then.

SPEAKER_11 32:03

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_04 32:04

Oh, that's right. Yeah. That sounds like it would be really terrible.

SPEAKER_00 32:11

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_04 32:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 32:18

That's right. Notice what these emotions are.

SPEAKER_03 32:28

I'm just really sad and it's just very scary and sad place to be, and you know.

SPEAKER_07 32:43

I know.

SPEAKER_04 32:45

You okay with all those emotions?

SPEAKER_10 32:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 32:48

Yeah, just just be with all that. Let it know it makes sense. Makes sense why it would be so scared of that. And like what maybe where did it learn that being bad was so scary?

SPEAKER_08 33:25

The only thought I had was like, like, it isn't it obvious that being bad is bad.

SPEAKER_04 33:31

Yeah. Well, bad is I don't believe that anyone's really bad, but maybe this part learned that there were consequences for certain things in life, and well where there was an interpretation that you were bad, and there were negative consequences for being a bad kid.

SPEAKER_02 34:03

Um something came up which is strange. Um I just started seeing um me being just alone um when I was a kid.

SPEAKER_03 34:17

That's the one. 'Cause um just uh do not share too much, but um I know that I would spend a lot of my childhood alone.

SPEAKER_07 34:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_10 34:34

Maybe my mom was also very young when she had me, she wanted to have her own life.

SPEAKER_07 34:39

Ah, that's right. That's right.

unknown 34:45

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 34:46

So notice that child, you as a kid, and that's it. Notice how you feel toward her.

SPEAKER_08 35:00

That's really sad.

SPEAKER_04 35:02

That's really sad, isn't it? Yeah, that's right. That's right. Can you go be with her? Go be with her. Let her share with you what this was like for her. It's been really sad. She's felt really alone.

SPEAKER_03 35:48

You know, I've been when I was alone I would do so many things, like hobby-wise, like I would play piano, I would draw, make movies in in video games, I would do a lot of things that I'm grateful for because it's I developed so many skills as a child.

SPEAKER_07 36:13

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_10 36:14

But I always wanted to share those as well, you know.

SPEAKER_07 36:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 36:20

I do just show off, get some attention as well.

SPEAKER_07 36:24

That's right. That's right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_10 36:32

It was just me.

SPEAKER_04 36:34

It was just you. Is she aware of you?

SPEAKER_10 36:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 36:40

Okay. Let her really feel feel you there. Let her know you're you see how alone she has been.

SPEAKER_10 36:55

That's a just admiring what she can do. All those things.

SPEAKER_04 37:19

Let her really admire her for all of that, right?

SPEAKER_00 37:23

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_04 37:24

Yeah, show her that you really see like how talented she is and notice what the effect that that has on her is to be s really seen and acknowledged.

SPEAKER_10 37:56

And she's happy she can show it to someone.

SPEAKER_04 37:59

I bet she is. I bet she is. Let her s if she wants, she can show you even more or tell you more about how she feels.

SPEAKER_07 39:29

Notice that joyfulness. That joy.

SPEAKER_03 39:51

No, I'm just still feeling sorry that she she's alone. I mean now I'm with her, but that that's you know that that's her reality that and so is my reality.

SPEAKER_07 40:04

Yeah, yeah. That's it. Is that grief?

SPEAKER_09 40:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 40:23

That's it. That's it. Time to grieve. That's it. Let her not let her see share this together like that.

SPEAKER_04 40:50

You know, there's a lot of feelings of sadness here and grief.

SPEAKER_07 41:34

Good. Good.

SPEAKER_02 41:38

I just I I just want to hug her and say that I love her and that our our mom loves us as well.

SPEAKER_10 41:49

Oh even though she's not there, she really does love us.

SPEAKER_07 41:54

Oh, that's it. Okay, good.

SPEAKER_04 41:56

Be with her in that way too if she's open to it.

SPEAKER_07 41:58

That's right.

SPEAKER_04 42:44

Yeah. There's a change in your body. What's that?

SPEAKER_09 42:49

I just feel calm now.

SPEAKER_04 42:52

Good, good, good. Okay. Feel free to not answer what I'm about to ask, but there was a mention of some badness and shame. Is that has that been cleared already, or is have you is that hers?

SPEAKER_11 43:18

I think that there could be something. I'm not 100% sure.

SPEAKER_04 43:24

Okay.

SPEAKER_11 43:25

Um but I feel much better.

SPEAKER_04 43:29

This is more of the aloneness then than the shame.

SPEAKER_03 43:33

Uh I think I'm not 100% sure, but I think she might have feel that p she's alone because something is wrong with her.

SPEAKER_05 43:46

Uh okay. Okay, gotcha. Okay. Okay. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 43:52

That's right. She's feeling much better now, right? Having you there with her. Okay. Okay. She wanna leave there? Does she want to come into the present moment?

SPEAKER_08 44:05

Can I take her with me?

SPEAKER_04 44:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 44:08

Would she like to go with you?

SPEAKER_02 44:15

I would like to show her where we are at now.

SPEAKER_04 44:19

Bring her out of there. Take her to where you are now.

SPEAKER_07 44:29

That's uh that's uh that's uh beautiful Yeah, she thinks I'm pretty cool too.

SPEAKER_05 44:58

She thinks you're pretty cool. I would agree. I would agree. That's good.

SPEAKER_07 45:11

That's great.

SPEAKER_04 45:16

See if there's anything else you might need here. Maybe give her a chance if there's anything else she might want to unload or release, or if there's anything else she feels she might need from you.

SPEAKER_03 45:41

No, I think she she's happy to see who who we've become you know that I was able to spend time with her that she could show me everything she would she was working on.

SPEAKER_06 45:59

Yeah. Yeah, good.

SPEAKER_04 46:03

There's no rush. Stay with her for a little bit here, just spend some time with her. You can show her around more, let her get her let her get her bearings or her footing here in the presentation.

SPEAKER_03 47:12

Yeah, they don't really need to come forward.

SPEAKER_07 47:15

Okay, okay, good.

SPEAKER_03 47:18

I mean they see that it's just nice and it's it feels like dunno open, wide, spacious.

SPEAKER_04 47:31

Yeah, that's uh so feel that spaciousness and that openness. Let that let probably I don't know, there's more space for that now. So you can let yourself, your body, um create more space for that openness. You're able to access more of that now.

SPEAKER_03 48:42

I think uh I just started kind of like checking how is it how how am I feeling and is that you know shame around being too bad or too narcissistic still there? And I think it could be still there a little.

SPEAKER_07 49:01

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 49:04

Yeah, that's that's what I was curious about. So that we got a piece of it, but not all of it. Yeah. But there's layers, right? One the one of these layers was being alone. Yeah. Right. Another layer is maybe shame and being bad and all that stuff. So that's we can save that for another day, but you can let those parts know you're aware of them, and when the time is right, you'll be there for them too.

SPEAKER_11 49:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 49:36

Yeah. And just see if any of these I mean, probably good it'll be good to check in on this one that you healed today for a little bit. Um, but you can see if there's any specific requests that this part has or any other parts have before we start to close up today.

SPEAKER_03 50:04

I don't think there is specific requests, but I can see how it's it's more like curious and open to to be seen next time. Like, you know, previously I was too scared to go there, but now it's like okay. Like yeah, like I can see it's it can work, you know.

SPEAKER_04 50:28

Oh good, good. Yeah, that's great. Thank your system for like re you know, trusting more and more. Can let them know we could do this again and we can do another one to where we maybe go to that shame next time or something. Yay, okay. So if it feels right, you can come back to the room. Very nice, very nice. How are you feeling as you s transition out of there and come back to me?

SPEAKER_03 51:27

Uh much lighter and like the only like thought voice that's like echoing in my head is like, yeah, I'm pretty cool.

SPEAKER_06 51:40

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 51:41

But it's not in this like narcissistic way anymore. Like, it's not like I'm oh Jesus, I'm being selfish and self-absorbed. It's just like, no, I am pretty cool. It's it's okay.

SPEAKER_04 51:54

Yeah, that's good. I think too, you know, I don't know why why not like can we allow ourselves to be that way too sometimes, you know what I mean? Like sometimes we're just like I call it like grandiose, you know? It's like we feel and and and that's also we can you can remind your parts that like that's also protective. Like like I was in therapy yesterday and I realized and I I knew this kind of on an intellectual level, but I got to meet a part of me that was like, I'm better than people, and I you know, whatever. And I it was because I felt so worthless. I've got a worthlessness part in there, you know. So if I am put myself above people, then I don't have to feel below. And so really we can look at that and go, it's okay if we just have these protectors that are trying to protect us from feeling so worthless and unworthy and stuff, you know. And narcissism's a lot different than that.

SPEAKER_03 52:59

Yeah. I mean, it's like on the logical, rational level, I know that I love a narcissist. Like even yesterday I also was in therapy, and it's I actually was talking about those kind of things. So that's why today I kinda it's been fresh, you know. I mentioned something about my past uh that made sense why I might feel this way. Um, but basically my therapist also said, like, okay, if you were a narcissist, like true narcissist, you wouldn't actually think of other people's and and their feelings, you know. And yeah, like I get that, and and I also like agreed with her, but but there's still that here still was there, yeah, exactly. But oh, what if I will agree with her and that will actually make me then narcissist? Yeah, yeah. I won't have this like part that stops me from going there, you know.

SPEAKER_04 53:57

Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 54:00

Which is yeah, interesting.

SPEAKER_04 54:03

It's interesting. I mean, you know, I mean, intellectual understanding sometimes does it, but not always, especially with like obsessive parts, right? Yeah, because they're very often very young and they don't have a ability. The shame's so strong that it's anything that could be remotely that could remotely put you in a position to where you would be bad is uh intense fear, and that fear often overrides logic, right?

SPEAKER_03 54:29

Exactly, yeah. And with with logic, with thoughts, you can think so much, you can think of so many different ways, and like logic like you know, people say that there is a common sense, but everybody has their own sort of common sense, their own perspectives on certain situations and things. So, like, there's so many different interpretations that we can have. So then what makes one interpretation real compared to another?

SPEAKER_06 54:58

Exactly.

SPEAKER_03 54:58

And there is so much nuance in in everything that we can literally think of so many different ways.

SPEAKER_04 55:05

Yes, that's really unto smumble here. That's right. Oh, we're good. No, no, yeah. So great. So why don't we, if you want, we'll do another one and then maybe next time we'll uh we'll do the shame piece.

SPEAKER_03 55:19

If it's if it comes up, because it's a hard one because like I felt there is something in there, but I wasn't really sure.

SPEAKER_04 55:27

And I thought if there was like intellectualizing at that point, or well you'll see, you'll you'll see, and we can touch base and you feel it out, but I I think that shame the the core shame, the core pain of shame is often very challenging to get to because it's so concealed within us that and it's so painful that our parts will be like, Well, look there, look there, look there, but don't look here, right? And and they'll dissociate and stuff. So so um, but it was interesting to hear at the end of the session that your parts were like they weren't they were scared of going there, but now they feel like they could do that, or they feel like they're more ready.

SPEAKER_03 56:14

So yeah, it's like you know, they it's like the audience watching what's is happening here and being like, okay, maybe maybe it's okay to go there, you know. Exactly.

SPEAKER_04 56:28

Exactly, yeah. Yeah. Well, thank you so much uh for coming back on and uh and maybe we'll touch base again and we'll see if it feels right to do this again.

SPEAKER_03 56:38

Yeah, absolutely. That's great. Thank you so much for having me here. Like I love it. I love it, I love it.

SPEAKER_04 56:44

Oh, yeah, thank you. Uh we'll end the recording, I'll talk to you for a minute on the other side. Okay, thanks everyone for listening, and uh we'll we'll see everybody in the next episode.