Driving the Future: Inside Clemson's New School of Mechanical and Automotive Engineering - Dr. Zoran Filipi, Clemson University

Clemson University recently launched the School of Mechanical and Automotive Engineering, a program with undergraduates and graduate students and faculty dedicated to innovating the latest in automotive technology and design.

We sat down with the school's Founding Director, Dr. Zoran Filipi, to understand the structure of this school, what students are learning, and the fascinating ways Clemson is partnering with automotive OEMs on cutting-edge research and development.

Dr. Filipi is truly an expert and out-of-the-box thinker, and every automotive and engineering program will find great value in the strategies Clemson has deployed.

Inside this episode:

• The strategy behind combining mechanical and automotive engineering programs - and how students & employers benefit
• The incredible value of putting grad students through a full product cycle
• Partnering with automotive OEMs on product development
• Autonomous cars and EVs - the state of the market
• Advice to automotive programs about how to innovate and evolve

3 Big Takeaways from this episode:

1. The new school combines the strengths of both programs: Mechanical + Automotive engineering in one school enables students to apply the knowledge they're learning in mechanical engineering and put it to work in automotive applications. Students (both undergraduate and graduate) will be prepared for the rapidly evolving automotive industry, including the shift towards electric vehicles.
2. Deep Orange puts students through a two-year complete product development process: From market study to product design, ideation and prototyping, graduate students build full prototypes of futuristic vehicles - both EV and ICE. Better yet, these projects are done in partnership with automotive OEMs, helping to bring new technologies and designs to market.
3. Autonomous vehicles are on the way, but expect electrification to come first: Autonomous vehicle technology has made great progress, but we're still far away from seeing fully autonomous cars on our everyday commute. However, electrification is at full-scale production levels, including incentives to bring the manufacturing of EVs, batteries and charging stations here in the U.S.

Resources

To learn more about Clemson's new school, visit: https://news.clemson.edu/clemson-university-forms-new-school-as-globe-switches-to-electric-vehicles/

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Episode page: https://techedpodcast.com/clemson/

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Chapters

• 1:57 Dr. Filipi's fascinating career in automotive research
• 5:09 Clemson's new School of Mechanical and Automotive Engineering
• 7:47 Careers in automotive R&D
• 10:37 2-year product development experience for grad students
• 20:30 State of the market: Autonomous cars & EVs
• 26:59 How can automotive programs pivot to EV?
• 30:27 Advice for 15-year-olds

Transcript

Matt Kirchner: 0:08

Welcome to the tech ed podcast where we visit with leaders who are shaping, innovating and disrupting technical education. People who are not afraid to think differently, not afraid to try something new, all with the goal of securing the American Dream for the next generation of STEM and workforce talent. Welcome back to this week's episode of The Tech Ed podcast. If you listen often, you know that we love talking about advancing technologies we love talking about in the automotive sector, electric vehicles, hydrogen vehicles, we love talking about autonomous vehicles. You also know that we talk a lot about convergences that are taking place in areas like advanced manufacturing and other technologies. Convergence is like the convergence between information technology and operations technology. We call it the it ot convergence. We talk in some cases about the convergence between art and manufacturing and how there's so many commonalities in those worlds. Today, we're going to talk a little bit about another convergence. This is the convergence between advancing automotive technology and mechanical engineering. This is going to be an absolutely fascinating discussion. I've been looking forward to it for some time. Our guest on this episode of The Tech Ed podcast is Dr. Zoran Phillippi. Dr. Filipi is the founding director of the School of Mechanical and automotive engineering at Clemson University. Dr. Filipi, thank you so much for joining us on the tech ed podcast.

Zoran Filipi: 1:36

My pleasure. It's great to be with you. And I look forward to this conversation.

Matt Kirchner: 1:41

So we look forward to it as well. You've been working in the hybrid and alternative powertrain and cutting edge mobility field for quite some time. I would love to hear a little bit of an overview as we started out of your career, some of your research interests and in how you got to be where you are in this great role at Clemson.

Zoran Filipi: 1:57

Yeah, so it's been more years than I care to admit, I guess. And I was always driven by this passion for vehicles and powertrains, especially early on IC engines. And the energy kind of you know, came from the desire to change the world change the world for the better. Right. So I started with IC engine research and my PhD involved some modeling of the combustion process to eventually create a predictive tool to study a system issue. turbo charging and downsizing for fuel economy. Great. This was long time ago, this was long time ago. But I think there is a constant from those early days all the way to today, which is basically to go from fundamentals. In this case, its fundamentals of energy conversion or storage, all the way to the system level, to show how would you make these technologies reality at some one, how to enable them. But number two, you know, really critical? What is going to be the ultimate potential? Is this worthwhile is this going to change the world for the better? What I learned over time, too, is that there is a long path from that early research and discoveries to technology. In fact, often it's about 20 years. This is the role of the university basically make discoveries and search for these new pathways to technologies that will change the world for the better. So more than 20 years ago, this desire. And its knock again to combine the fundamentals and the system level led me into the hybrid electric propulsion area. And this guidance has been very to me enriching and invigorating, because I ventured into the new realm kind of was an opportunity to learn new things with my students to meet some of the new faculty. And honestly, you know, to create some of those opportunities, opportunities for conversions, where on different disciplines kind of meet up work together. And a constant has been, you know, developed these predictive modeling simulation tools that allow you to explore this vast space that leads to new technologies. So check verify some of the new ideas way before they are a reality way before any hardware becomes available.

Matt Kirchner: 4:17

Sure, that makes so much sense. And it really when you think about it, you know, disproving a theory is almost as important as proving one right? Because if we're going to invest all this time and energy and, and capital in a new technology and bringing that to market and way that's way too late to realize that that that technology didn't work. So it sounds like a lot of this work is really around conceptual ideas, and then figuring out what might be commercially effective down the road. You know, I worked with a gentleman for a long time, who was a prolific business and real estate investor and one of his favorite lines was the money you make is in the deals you don't do. And so it was really, really important to do that, that research on the front end. So as we moved from some of the topics of our research, I tell us a little bit about the school Mechanical and automotive engineering and how your research work has led you to say, Hey, we should converge the world of mechanical and automotive in that type of collaboration as well.

Zoran Filipi: 5:09

The idea for the school is basically to combine two departments with different strengths, right? So very complementary, to create something new that will invigorate the unit, you know, that will invigorate faculty in both departments, when it comes to research research opportunities, as well as enable us to develop a new undergraduate program and you will be AAS degree in automotive engineering. You know, once we mentioned, if we just mentioned the automation, right? The revolution really taking place in both manufacturing and on the vehicle side, it becomes clear that you know, modern vehicles technologies like that are manufacturing are not only about mechanical engineering. As a mechanical engineer, I've heard you know, I have to admit that right. So we've been preparing, you know, we have been preparing and we have been part of the change, you know, for years now, on the COI car campus, Clemson University, International Center for Automotive Research. And this is where we started the pioneering program, graduate program in automotive engineering. So until now, it was masters and PhD program. The whole idea is to prepare for the future and prepare the time for the future. Well, you need multiple disciplines, you need skills, students or graduates need to acquire skills in multiple disciplines, but also learn how to work with other these people from other disciplines. And also have an understanding of the system complexities integration. And basically, we that we prepare for the modern workplace be really prepared on day one for what's waiting for them and what the expectations are out there in the automotive industry. So in the School of Mechanical automotive engineering, we are looking to capitalize on the strengths of the largest department largest undergraduate program at Clemson in mechanical engineering, and, of course, many pockets of excellence, many strengths in individual disciplines. And this forward looking automotive engineering multidisciplinary program, which has the pulse of the automotive industry and is very much plugged into what is happening now the transformation that already started, as well as the future what we anticipate what we anticipate will be the future.

Matt Kirchner: 7:31

So when you're talking with students about engaging in this new undergraduate degree, what are some of the careers that entice them. So if I'm if I'm going to spend my four years at Clemson, and then I'm going on to a career, swimming, I'm not going into graduate school, what are some of those careers, what gets the students really excited.

Zoran Filipi: 7:47

So what they can expect are basically courses as well as some unique experiences, right. So what we have learned over time, this is something very important for us here at Clemson. So students really crave these young folks really crave opportunities to get their hands on some hardware, right? To be able to run some labs, for example, themselves, just think of yourself in the test cell, where there is this hybrid electric powertrain and there is a battery system as well. And, you know, one of the team members is working basically on the thermal management, for example, the battery system, but somebody else is working on the optimal control for the entire entire propulsion system. So just imagine yourself as a student coming in, and bringing a piece of software, uploading and being able to see the effect of that, being able to see the results in terms of performance, efficiency, all the key attributes or the key attributes of the system. So what we are going to offer this undergraduate program are the opportunities for the students seeking careers in automotive industry and dreaming now not only about America, mechanical aspects of the vehicle, but also think about the software defined vehicles, the context, right. Think about electrification, and all the news that we have heard lately, including here in South Carolina, the significant significant acceleration of this transformation. So the new Giga factories are basically going to pop up all over the country very, very soon. And therefore, you know, the young generation now has a different perception about these future vehicles, but is equally excited as I was when I was a youngster, about the prospect of working on these exciting topics and these exciting technologies when they graduate.

Matt Kirchner: 9:37

Fascinating. So it's sounding like first of all great hands on experiences in the undergraduate program, which to me is really, really important. And then to your point, Dr. Filipi, just all of the different changes in the automotive market that are taking place in real time. And you know, what, when I was coming of age and going to school and working in manufacturing, the model was really Yeah, it was Ford, GM and Chrysler at least in the US, and then you add all these tier one and tier two suppliers and it to that, you know, to that kind of central automotive market. And now we've got so many different players, so many different technologies, it's a great time to be a student at Clemson University, especially in the engineering disciplines, we're going to enjoy watching those programs roll out in the future Zoran, and so really exciting to be hearing about the great things that are happening at the School of Mechanical and automotive engineering. Clemson also has a unique approach to graduate studies, we talked quite a bit about undergraduate but Graduate Studies called Deep Orange tell us a little bit about Deep Orange.

Zoran Filipi: 10:37

exciting topic. So it's a real pleasure to talk about deep orange. And this is where the credibility comes from. When I talk about creating opportunities for undergraduates as well, you know, when we spoke about the experiential learning opportunities in the new program, or programs that we are working on now, it comes really for from what we have done with the bridge. So early on, you know, when the automotive engineering program started, it's less than 15 years ago, the curriculum was developed based on a lot of input from the industry. And this basically told us that, you know, the students need to have strengths in some of the fundamental disciplines. But on top of that, understanding of the vehicle is a complex system, system integration, and how to work in teams to coordinate eventually come up with a successful product in the marketplace. And guess what, there was no textbook for that. So it was invented, here at Clemson, Dr. Paul want to call and set the time was truly a pioneer, with the idea to create a simulated research and development environments laboratory on campus, and take students through a complete product development process in two years. Sure. So if you think about it, try to imagine yourself as students, I can imagine I die with all these ideas and desire, you know, to learn about the vehicle about vehicle dynamics, about electrification and propulsion, about software about the automation, right. And then we put you in the classroom. And you have to sit through the lectures and study and study. And you have to do that, okay, you have to do that. But imagine a chance to almost like in the second week, after studying, beginning with your team, a market study, to understand your future customers. And based on that right side, what should be these critical attributes, so your vehicle, so that you can, after that really begin working on a design ideation go through the stages of the concept design and layout, development, architecture, finally starting to design components, subsystems, right? Complete vehicle in the last six months, this program culminates in building a physical prototype.

Matt Kirchner: 13:10

Wow. That's gotta be I mean, that's just an amazing experience to have, as you're considering, you know, your career pathway. And just to draw another parallel, one of the things we hear so frequently from manufacturers, as they're hiring, you know, bachelor's degrees engineers, or even graduate engineers, we hear often, hey, you know, they're really good with the math, they're really good with the computer science. They understand physics, they understand calculus, but you know, it takes us a while to get them to the point where they actually understand system integration where they're comfortable in that case on the manufacturing floor. And it sounds like just to draw a parallel in the automotive industry, if I'm going to be developing designing automotive components, automotive features, you know, entire entire automobiles, having that two year experience of going start to finish from ideation to testing and trial and error in finishing with a prototype really mirrors exactly what those students are going to see, when they get to industry, I've got to believe the feedback you get from the employers is quite positive in terms of what they're able to do when they begin their careers.

Zoran Filipi: 14:11

feedback has been amazing from the employers, the students get snatched up immediately after they graduate or actually, before they graduate, you know, they get a chance to learn by doing, they also have a chance during the two years here in the program to interact directly with technical managers from the industry. So, what we have at this point, we have been discovered by all the major OEMs for each one of these projects. And we are now at number 15 already, right? So for most of them, we had the major OEM as a sponsor, right from BMW to General Motors to fall to Mazda to Honda for example. And we have been discovered by all of these companies, so we do have a healthy competition for lot of talent coming out of these, these programs between the likes of Honda or GM or Ford, BMW here in South Carolina, so they have a, you know, closest, I guess, insights, you know, through many of the collaborations that we have with them, Volvo or Raytheon and Tesla. So, you know, we have been updating and modernizing changing our curriculum. In fact, the latest is only two years old, right. And students are absolutely prepared, you know, for this new world of automated vehicles, you know, Software Defined vehicles, as well as the manufacturing that comes along with that. So the manufacturing has been transformed as well. And there is a significant significant, basically content that they get, you know, through the education here, related to artificial intelligence, to the robotics and automation.

Matt Kirchner: 15:56

So 15 courts have gone through this program, each one of them partnering with a specific OEM toward a solution for commercial use to a lot of these a lot of these products, and a lot of these solutions find their way to commercialization and automobiles,

Zoran Filipi: 16:10

challenge for OEMs, to basically test out some of the ideas, some of the really out of the box thinking and ideas over only a two year period, for sure. So very, very fast pace, and honestly. Much, much, much cheaper, right, then it would be to do something like that to do something, because you know, but I think what's most valuable, is also for more years for our partners to interact with students, you know, many of these projects that basically, the task was basically to come up with a vehicle for Gen Z, right? So the vehicle that might be in the marketplace in 2028, or 2035. All right? And who would be better than the youngest people, right? This young people likely to try to imagine that future? You know, instead of us?

Matt Kirchner: 17:03

Absolutely, yeah, taking the future consumer and putting them in the position of doing the research and the development now for a vehicle that they may be driving in five or 10 years,

Zoran Filipi: 17:11

I can highlight a couple of stories, okay, no, in one case, it was a completely different architecture of the vehicle. This was basically compact vehicle, sure, compact size, but with different attributes compared to what was in the market at that time. Right? The entire architecture, architecture, and eventually, even the styling of the vehicle was something unusual. And about three, four years, years later, a product came out of that company, that particular OEM, and all of us here, you know, and we were getting emails and telephone calls from the students, they would like, I recognize this. Right? Wow, it's awesome. You know, it's a fantastic validation, you know, what the students have done the students together, to go to the faculty and other one, I can even be more concrete and tell you that couple of the projects here, the orange projects, basically anticipated this day, like were exactly where we are today. The anticipation was, we have to be prepared for this transformation, and transition from IC engines to electrification. So the whole vehicle was conceived the architecture of the vehicle is a very flexible platform. So that the management can make a decision, you know, 30% of the vehicles are going to have an IC engine and other 25 are going to have a hybrid electric propulsion, and the rest are going to be fully electric. And guess what, five years down the road? They're going to be autonomous as well. Right? Oh, so students were able to kind of imagine all this, clutter that and come up with real solutions that basically you can see in the marketplace today, because you know, the situation. And the manufacturing, especially, these strategies for manufacturing are very different for something like BMW compared to Tesla, right? Tesla can just focus on a single architecture for electric powertrain, while a large, large, you know, established OEMs such as BMW has to think about transition and how to do it gradually how to be how to be very, very flexible in this. And, you know, this is something that the students have been working on here, already anticipating the future.

Matt Kirchner: 19:27

And then getting to that future when they get into the workplace. And again, whether it's working for an OEM, whether it's working in a tier one or tier two supplier if it's working in an ancillary industry, relative to the automotive industry, huge, incredible opportunities taking place at the School of Mechanical and automotive engineering. It's going to be really fun to watch that rollout in the future. It's gonna be really fun to watch what's taking place at the graduate level at the research level as you get into to new technologies. I read an article not too long ago, Elon Musk, who of course we all we all hear about and almost on a day Really bases had said that by 2030, you won't be able to buy a car that doesn't have that isn't able to drive itself a new car because basically, by 2030, we won't be able to buy a new car that isn't self driving. He said, we really have all of the hardware, smart sensors and devices now on a vehicle. It's just a question of letting the software catch up with that, is that where you see it? I mean, it 10 years, will we be all at least have the option of a self driving vehicle and not have to operate our vehicles if we choose not too

Zoran Filipi: 20:30

bad to go too much in either direction? Right? Definitely. And even today, you know, we talk about software defined vehicles, because it's such an essential part of eventually what you get as a consumer. And the experience of using that experience of using that vehicle, would I observe at this point is actually a faster pace of electrification, then complete automation of vehicles? Sure, it's significant progress has been made and continues to be made. A lot of the OEMs Of course, you know, Tesla, in many ways, leads the way at level three, right? So vehicle autonomy, level three, where you have the significant significant driver eights, and basically, the vehicle can operate autonomously. In the relatively controlled environment, meaning or structured, let's put it that way, meaning an interstate or a freeway, but to go from that all the way to level five. Right? There is a big unknown there that we introduced, which is the human what what humans do other humans around, you know, totally, right. Absolutely, wildly if you look at electrification truly, you know, we are past the tipping point right now, we are past that. Okay, because the change underway now, he's not only in the realm of research and development, this is now industrial scale change that we observe is maybe maybe on comparable to the early years of industrialization, basically, in US and around the globe. Okay, because, you know, instead of some of those plants that were built, you know, 3040 50 years ago, where you go from steel to some mechanical systems, you know, for different applications now, especially with that new inflation Reduction Act, and, you know, the strong desire to provide some subsidies, if necessary, you need be for offshoring, to make sure that we have, you know, on this continent manufacturing capabilities, you know, for these technologies, and that we can build reliable rebuy, reliable supply chains. Now, almost every day, we hear about new investment in a battery plant, right? Like the guidelines and everything else that goes along that goes along with it, you know, so just here in the state of South Carolina with the past three months, there are announcements for a new battery plant that BMW plans to build its 1.7 billion investment. Next week is going to be envision plant providing battery cells, basically, for battery packs. So on the same location right next to the BMW vehicle production plant, there'll be complete production from raw materials all the way to electrified electrified powertrain. Just last week, you know, there was an announcement about scouts. I don't know whether you're a fan of off roading, you know? Sure, yeah. A bit. If you're a fan of off roading, then you know the name, you recognize the name. So Scout electric vehicles will be manufactured here in South Carolina. And they approached Clemson already basically telling us projections will call for about 4000 new jobs, you know, and jobs aren't going to be engineering jobs. So you know, right there, even more motivation, you know, kind of and more energy getting into the education system.

Matt Kirchner: 24:05

Absolutely. It's such an exciting time. And so as I'm hearing you the you know, autonomous vehicles may be fully autonomous level five, maybe a little bit further away electrification and electric vehicles, obviously already here, and it's just going to continue to proliferate is that the prediction is going

Zoran Filipi: 24:19

to continue to proliferate, commitments are made significant commitments, you know, and these projects underway, basically mean that we are going to have here domestically know, in US production of energy storage, as well as complete, you know, supply chains, you know, ecosystems growing, you know, around these plants. And that's the only way to get to the goal of if not by 2030. But you know, by 2035. In some of the states, all vehicles offered in the market will have to be electrified in some others. There'll be a large, large percentage of fully electrified vehicles right. So what now needs to happen in the meantime, And, you know, federal government recognizes that as well. That's my observation on investments in infrastructure. So charging is the next you know, sure. Until now it was okay batteries, raw materials, raw materials, there is an answer, by the way, the technology to recycle lithium, for example, and other metals, cobalt nickel, that has been just developed just recently, you know, until now, I was wondering myself, you know, where is this going? How are we going to come up? Yeah. But recycling is an obvious answer. And right now Jesus exists already. Right. Plant being built as we speak, you know, for recharging, though, right, so large scale charging infrastructure. That's our next challenge, I believe.

Matt Kirchner: 25:47

Absolutely. Well, you know, it raises a couple questions, one of which is just our reliance on, you know, offshore sources of precious metals. And, and certainly, you mentioned, you know, lithium and cobalt, and so on. And so much of that is produced in mind and in Asia, and in China, particularly, these days really does leave us a little bit at the whims of the kind of the geopolitical atmosphere, if we are able to recycle those metals domestically, and probably find new sources of them in the United States as well, that that really starts to change the equation a little bit, you've got such an amazing backgrounds are in so many different experiences, so many initiatives that you're you've led by, you know, I can't let the podcast and without asking you a couple more questions. The the second to last of which is if I'm a technical college dean, I'm a president, if I am a University Provost or I'm a program director, I'm I'm a professor, and I'm really thinking about how do I increase the teaching of hybrid and EV technology? In my automotive programs? What advice would you have for those educators in terms of how you got started, and how they can get started based in particular about all you've learned from, I'm sure plenty of trial and error and success and maybe a few headaches along the way,

Zoran Filipi: 26:59

through through everything you've said, you know, so much learned along the way, in different ways. But I feel that we in academia, universities, technical, technical colleges, as well, to be entrepreneurial. Right, we have to be responsive to the market, as well, you know, and the market is basically the employment opportunities,

Matt Kirchner: 27:26

refreshing to hear you say that, by the way, continue,

Zoran Filipi: 27:28

Oh, I feel that responsibility, you know, the students come to us with high expectations, you know, with dreams, with dreams and ideas, and we have to fulfill those expectations, you know, we need to provide high quality education for them, and experiences that so that's one part of my answer, I think, experiential learning as well, that will prepare them for this brave new world that will prepare them, you know, and help them develop that mindset that, you know, whatever we do, say, as engineers, has impact on the society, and I guess, to answer some of those key questions, right, has to address either challenges that we have, or maybe create something new, that will enhance our lives, you know, provide something better for all of us. So from ability, you know, to discoveries related to the medical side of things, you know, by engineering and things, things like that. We want to work on things that matter, right, we want on things that will make a very positive impact impact on the society. So the answer to you is, we have to basically recognize the expectations the responsibility we have, and work hard to understand the market, quote, unquote, which is, you know, talking to these young people as well, for sure, for sure. But also keeping the pulse on the economy, the industry, whatever might be the area where we are active. You know, we talked a lot about vehicles and propulsion, but this applies to all this applies to other areas as well. Different ways to do that, you know, you do that through partnerships, collaborations, you organize workshops, some of the data, obviously, is available from the government as well. All of that needs to drive our agenda. And you know, when we recognize there is a change in the way, we have to get ahead of that we have to get ahead of that. No, because we are producing that talent, you know, for the next 10 years, or 20 years or three years. And, you know, if new courses are required, let's go ahead and do it. Let's just route what exactly is needed. And let's work on that. That was

Matt Kirchner: 29:44

a very, very refreshing answer. And I think that's going to resonate well with all of our educators. As you know, at the Tech Ed podcast, we're all about people who are disrupting technical education, which in my mind includes certainly the world of engineering education and you're a true disrupter Just listening to the way that you think about the work that you do. Zoran, I have one final question for you before we end our time with you, which has just been a great conversation. It's a question we asked in one form or another of a number of our guests, probably all of our guests at one point in time. So if you could travel back in time, and you could meet yourself when you were 15 years old, and you could give yourself one piece of advice to that 15 year old Zoran Filipi, what would that advice be madly if

Zoran Filipi: 30:27

I think about a 15 year old Zoran Filipi with dreams and ideas, and a desire and impatience, Okay, to start working on that, to start working on those dreams, you know, to make them a reality. My advice would be to think about what will be critical in your education. So the education of 16 year old to bring you to that point, and look for opportunities to talk to the professionals from that field. To understand what does it take to get there. So really, there is no substitute for first kind of building that background in the academic disciplines. making the right choices in school, learning about what are the careers that take you to where you want to be that will allow you to work on these exciting new topics. And then after that, I think once you get to the college level. After that, follow your passion for your heart.

Matt Kirchner: 31:31

I love it. Zoran Filipi has been our guest here on the tech ed podcast. He is the founding director of the School of Mechanical and Automotive Engineering, reflecting on that 15 year old version of you, as somebody who dreams has desires and is impatient. Something's telling me that not much has changed in that regard in terms of who you are today, which is really refreshing. I love your views and your philosophies and higher education on interdisciplinary programs on following technology. It's just been a really fascinating and enjoyable conversations are in with you and we thank you so much for joining us.

Zoran Filipi: 32:03

Likewise. Thank you. I enjoyed it too.

Matt Kirchner: 32:10

Thanks for joining us for this episode of The Tech Ed podcast. If you haven't already, subscribe, leave a review and if you liked this episode, share it with a friend. New episodes launch every Tuesday. So listen in next week.