Inside the Bipartisan Push for America’s Skilled Workforce - U.S. Senator Tammy Baldwin

How do we build bipartisan momentum to support the future of CTE?

In this episode of The TechEd Podcast, host Matt Kirchner sits down with U.S. Senator Tammy Baldwin, a national leader and co-chair of the bipartisan Congressional Career and Technical Education Caucus. Drawing from her personal upbringing in a STEM-focused household and her decades of public service, Senator Baldwin shares why CTE is essential to our economic future.

Senator Baldwin offers a candid look at how federal policy is influencing the future of technical education. She discusses the uncertain outlook for funding, efforts to align apprenticeship laws with modern tech careers, and why short-term training is becoming a national priority. With clear ties to workforce needs and economic strategy, it’s a conversation grounded in both practicality and urgency.

Listen to learn:

• Why short-term training needs to be federally funded like degree programs
• What Congress is doing to modernize U.S. apprenticeship laws
• How Buy America provisions are creating new manufacturing jobs
• Why the technical college system is a key asset in attracting new industry

3 Big Takeaways from this Episode:

1. CTE is one of the rare policy areas with true bipartisan alignment: From Buy America provisions to workforce training, Baldwin sees common ground among lawmakers focused on economic development. She credits this unity to the shared recognition that technical education is vital to America’s industrial strength.

2. Short-term training needs to be recognized in federal financial aid policy: Senator Baldwin emphasized the importance of allowing Pell Grants and other aid to support short, job-focused programs—not just two- or four-year degrees. Without this flexibility, learners may be forced to take on unnecessary debt or misrepresent their intentions just to access support.

3. Apprenticeship programs must be updated to reflect today’s workforce: The National Apprenticeship Act hasn’t been reauthorized since 1937, leaving many modern industries and small businesses without a clear path to participate. Baldwin is pushing for a bipartisan update that would make it easier for employers of all sizes to offer earn-and-learn opportunities.

Resources in this Episode:

To learn more about Senator Tammy Baldwin, visit: www.baldwin.senate.gov

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Transcript

Matt Kirchner: 0:08

Matt securing the American Dream for the next generation of STEM and workforce talent. My name is Matt Kirchner. I am the host of The TechEd Podcast. We are talking this week all things Career, Technical Education with a guest that, quite honestly, I'm just really, really honored, took the time to join us this afternoon. I am joined today here on The TechEd Podcast by Senator Tammy Baldwin, the senator from my home state of Wisconsin, and Senator Baldwin, such a pleasure to have you with us. Thanks so much for coming on.

Tammy Baldwin: 0:39

Well, thank you, Matt. I'm so delighted to get a chance to join you today. So let's start out with

Matt Kirchner: 0:44

just an incredible background that your family has. I think some people in Wisconsin and maybe not the whole nation, know that David E Green was your grandfather, a renowned biochemist, and so you've got this amazing family history of STEM talk about a little bit about what it was like to grow up as a girl and a stem family and how that influenced the way that your career went? Yeah,

Tammy Baldwin: 1:04

so I will say, first of all, I was blessed to be raised by my grandparents, and my grandfather, indeed, was a biochemist at the University of Wisconsin, and my grandmother, who actually thought she was an empty nester, because both my aunt and my mother had left that I came along, but she had gone back to work, and she also worked at the University in a very different field, and I want to just share it, because you don't think of art necessarily as STEM related, but she was the head costume designer for the university theater. And if you're talking about crafting costumes and stuff, you're talking a lot about measurements and geometry and all that stuff. So there was very much both of them in fields where stem was important. But also my grandmother's early career, before she had children, was teaching at an art school, which at the time was very much like a technical college. She was teaching people to be the calligraphers who would do the diplomas at university. She was teaching people how to do landscape gardening design. She was teaching people how to do costume fabrication. And so between my grandfather and my grandmother, I felt like this focus on education first, but also education in my grandmother's realm that gets you right into a good, paying job that can support a family and allows people to pursue their dreams and their passions. And so I really felt like I was immersed in that as I was growing up,

Matt Kirchner: 2:41

you know, I'm so glad you brought it up that way. I'm fascinated, to be honest, with the convergence between art and manufacturing, art and stem and I think, you know, we had Laura Kohler from the Kohler company on a year or two ago. I'm sure you're familiar with, I know you're familiar with that family and that company and great Wisconsin employer and their arts program, sure. And we could probably do a whole podcast on that, because I'm really, really familiar with the John Michael Kohler Art Center and the great work that's happening there. Happy, you brought that up as well, but we had this whole conversation with Laura Kohler about the convergence between STEM manufacturing, art and so on. I think a lot of times that gets lost in the mix is that there's, you know, whether we're talking about STEM, we're talking about careers in manufacturing, which we have so much of here in Wisconsin, there's this whole element of creativity and this whole element of engineering that goes into the world of art. And it sounds like that's kind of what your grandmother was doing in so many ways. Am I getting that right? Yes,

Tammy Baldwin: 3:33

you are. And there's that expression, Steam, right? Steam adds the arts right into it because of that way in which they're interwoven Absolutely.

Matt Kirchner: 3:43

And there was a part of me be honest with you for a while that was a little bit like adding that a and to see into STEM was was a way for the art folks to maybe get their hands on some of the money that was coming into STEM. And I've really evolved that thinking over the course of the last five or 10 years, and seen how we can inspire young people, whether they're on the stem side into also adding art into that experience and into their journey, and then students that are on the art side, exposing them to cool careers in STEM and manufacturing. I know that's what you're doing as part of this bipartisan CTE caucus, which I'll be honest with you until reading about it maybe six months ago. I didn't even know was a thing I spend all my time in career and technical education. Tell us a little bit about the congressional work that's happening in the CTE caucus, and you're co chairing that caucus, by the way.

Tammy Baldwin: 4:27

Yeah. So the career and technical education caucus was founded just about the time I was first elected to the United States Senate. It's strictly bipartisan, and a lot of the folks who are involved in the leadership of that caucus represents states with a lot of manufacturing going on, and understand that four year path to a career in a four year college is not everybody's path, and we know that, especially in a state like Wisconsin with such an excellent technical college. System, there are shorter pathways to great jobs, throw in apprenticeships, which we'll hopefully talk about in a moment, and you have a way in which you can be earning a family supporting wage very quickly and doing something hopefully that you love. One of the things that we were tackling as a caucus were, what are the obstacles that people face to getting into those great paying jobs and getting into a career training path that they can afford and that gets them into those earning positions quickly. And so a number of areas of emphasis came out of that, including the way that people can finance a technical education to make it affordable, maybe when they don't even intend to go all the way through and get the associate's degree after two years there, but they really want the skills for a job opening one of the things that I brought with me to this role in the CTE caucus was watching some of our technical colleges in Wisconsin respond to factory closings, and you had a workforce that was displaced, and all of a sudden you had A mission for our Technical College to figure out, how can we retrain these people mid career for other good, paying jobs without having them, you know, have to take out student loans and really disrupt their lives. How can we make that as streamlined as possible to get people ahead in challenging times, and

Matt Kirchner: 6:41

I'm so glad you brought up our incredible technical college system here in Wisconsin. And there's other states that do amazing work. I've spent a lot of time in Indiana and Ohio and so on, but there's nobody who does it like Wisconsin. I co presented at an event A few weeks ago with Leila Merrifield, who, as you know, is the new president of the technical college system here in the state. And I think you're absolutely nailing it. Just the value that that college system brings, whether it's the work I get to do on the Gateway Foundation Board at Gateway Technical College, engaging in my own time when all 16 technical colleges across the state of Wisconsin, and if folks haven't been into a technical or community college in the last 10 years or so, I mean, it's worth taking another visit. It is just totally, totally changed and incredible work being done in support of the next generation of the workforce. So thanks so much for bringing that up. Yeah,

Tammy Baldwin: 7:28

and Matt, whenever I take a tour, I want to go back to school immediately what I think about and feel when I'm touring one of our technical colleges. And you know, I was talking about the role they play when there's displacements in our workforce. Big factory closes, but there's also the role that they play when new industry is coming to town, and so gateway in particular is preparing for, we hope, a whole bunch of new jobs in southeastern Wisconsin and those industries that are coming couldn't be successful without the contributions of our technical college system,

Matt Kirchner: 8:05

and they all point to that as a reason that they're relocating here. You know, we had Mary snap, who's the Vice President of Strategy for Microsoft, on about a year ago, not too long after Microsoft made their huge announcement about their expansion in Mount Pleasant and the pleasant prairie area and just incredible opportunities for employees, but we do have to upskill that next generation of technical talent. All of that, of course, takes funding. And you know, I'd be interested in a couple thoughts, your viewpoints from your chair at the national level, Senator, when we think about where the funding has come from. The last several years, we had the care the Cares Act, we had ARPA, we had chips and science. I mean significant amounts of federal funding, in many cases, being funneled through the states and into our technical colleges, into our STEM programs, in our high schools, in our universities. What are your thoughts now on the state of funding and where funding is going to come from? Are we going to see more shift to the states? Is it going to stay federal, maybe in a new form? What are you expecting? Yeah,

Tammy Baldwin: 9:00

well, I do think this is going to be a rather chaotic time. There's an effort to, well, eliminate the US, Department of Education, that, in my opinion, cannot happen without congressional action, but we do see some dismantling and some defunding, and so fasten your seat belts. This can be a very challenging time. We're going to get through it, but it's not going to be easy. One of the areas that I just mentioned a few minutes ago, though, where I hope we can up our efforts, and we can do so by working together across party lines, etc, is to make sure that the financial aid that people can draw upon to attend technical colleges can extend to shorter term programs. Thank you. So we're talking about upskilling or re skilling, talking about preparing an area of the state for a new industry coming to town, needing to have a robust workforce. Sometimes you really only require a couple. Semester's worth of coursework, or even a shorter term program that could be put together in concert with industry in order to prepare the workforce for that to be able to make sure that our financial aid programs are nimble enough to help students afford a shorter term program without having to say, Oh, I'm going to pursue a two year degree and then renege on that. We don't want to put our students in the position of fibbing in order to get financial aid. So I think that's something that we can pursue at the national level that will bring some revenue into the technical college systems across this country and certainly in Wisconsin too. Yeah,

Matt Kirchner: 10:43

I couldn't agree with you more on the value of short term training you mentioned a little while ago. You go to a technical college and you want to go back to school. The truth is that opportunity is available for a lot of us as we think about lifelong learning and needing to change our skills over the course of careers. I have the honor of serving on the National Board for the smart automation certification Alliance. And I think just about every one of our colleges here in Wisconsin are issuing those certifications in one form or another, just one example of how we don't necessarily have to commit to two years or four years as we upskill ourselves and prepare ourselves for whatever comes next in our career. So really glad that you mentioned that aspect, because I agree with you. I think that making sure we've got funding for short term training is going to be really, really important. The other thing, I think, and you mentioned already, Senator, that's going to be really interesting to watch is this whole evolution of apprenticeships. And I know that there was some news that came out of the administration last week on focusing through labor, through commerce and education, those three departments, and not exactly sure what form that'll take about supporting registered apprenticeships, which typically haven't been necessarily a model that has been supported from the right more so the left. What are your thoughts on that? And what do apprenticeships look like? You mentioned that earlier, so tell us your thoughts there.

Tammy Baldwin: 11:53

Yeah. Well, Matt, I first want to take the bragging rights. Wisconsin was the first state in the country to pass an apprenticeship law back in 1911 That's right. I think many of our immigrants who came to Wisconsin settled our state, brought those traditions from Europe with them. So I'm not surprised that Wisconsin was the first state to have such a law. The US followed suit in 1937 by passing the National Apprenticeship act, and that act has not been reauthorized or modernized since then, and so I have been proud to lead a bipartisan effort to reauthorize our National Apprenticeship laws and modernize them, because, as we all know, industry nearly a century ago, is very different than industry is today, and we need to be better equipped to bring maybe new, novel apprenticeships into existence and also enable smaller and medium sized businesses to be able to participate In apprenticeship programs. I think often they self select out of that, saying, Oh, we're too small. Those are big factories, big manufacturing enterprises that have apprenticeships within their ranks, or it's the trade unions, but we can't do it because we're just a five person shop. Well, there are ways where we can get small businesses, medium sized businesses, to work together to be able to sponsor an apprenticeship program. There are apprenticeships that have been introduced in recent years that didn't exist several decades ago, and so I am really excited to create this opportunity to modernize these laws. And why does it matter? Again, it goes back to can you afford to get the skills you need to land that great paying job that gives you economic security and a place in the middle class? Well, when you can earn while you learn, the idea of an apprenticeship is so incredibly important. That's how you make it work. And the technical college system plays a big role in many of our apprenticeship programs, sometimes offering the coursework one day a week when the apprentices are all at school, and then the remaining four days a week they're back at their facility or out in the field. But that ability to earn while you learn is so important, and I have talked to so many people who have become journeymen. And what would you tell your high school self, or if you had a chance to go back to your high school and talk to some of the young people there, what would you tell them about the opportunities and the doors that an apprenticeship opened and to a one, they've all been very, very encouraging of that path. And it doesn't mean that higher education isn't still available to you later down the road. Should you choose? But you're not starting out your career in debt, and that's something. There's a lot to be said for that absolutely.

Matt Kirchner: 15:00

Absolutely. I mean higher education of any kind, incredibly valuable. I think we all agree on that, but I love the way that you kind of wove that answer together, talking about the importance of the classroom aspect of an apprenticeship and and certainly the on the job training. And I think, as you know Senator, I spent 25 years in manufacturing companies, leading Wisconsin manufacturing companies, we did a ton of on the job training, but there's nothing like putting a student in a lab, putting them in a classroom, putting them into a technical college, a high school program where they're learning, and accelerating that learning in a lot of ways, so that they're workforce ready when they get to the workplace. Super, super important.

Tammy Baldwin: 15:33

And Matt, you just mentioned something that I failed to mention, and that is, many of our high schools in Wisconsin are already offering in high school classes that can give you technical college credit. Totally, there are some students who actually graduate high school with an associate's degree. That's not I do, not everywhere, but the way in which high schools are increasingly working with the technical colleges in their region to approve courses, or if the high school isn't equipped to offer those allowing the student to leave one afternoon to go to the technical college campus, take those courses. There all of these things are huge advancements that allow our young people to be job ready, Career Ready, much earlier on and again without debt. And

Matt Kirchner: 16:23

I think about the creativity that's gone into programs such as, there's a new automation leadership degree at UW Stout. It's had huge bipartisan support in the state of Wisconsin, where students are earning credit in high school, literally, are able to start a baccalaureate degree program with 88 credits into 120 credit baccalaureate degree when they about a year after they leave high school through doing things at their high school and their technical college. Just one more incredible example. Dr, Frank, the chancellor, they're doing incredible work on that particular degree program. It's so interesting. Senator, you know, you think about maybe what our audience listens to on the radio, or he sees on TV, or sees on social media, and like fair amount of vitriol, I think is probably maybe even understating it when we think about things going on in Washington. But yeah, when we talk about topics like this, and we say, you know, our mission is to secure the American Dream for the next generation of STEM and workforce talent. Doesn't matter who you voted for last time or you're going to vote for next time. If you agree with that mission, we're on the same team. Is that how you're seeing it when it comes to career and technical education in Washington, DC. Talk about that a little bit. Yeah. Well,

Tammy Baldwin: 17:24

as I mentioned earlier, our Career and Technical Education caucus that we formed just about the time I joined the United States Senate, it's very bipartisan, and we bring in speakers on topics regardless of their political leaning. I think, about some of the top manufacturing states, many of them are represented by Democrats, or many are represented by Republicans, but it's really a way for us to work together. And I do want to talk about or raise another issue that I think really blends across party lines, and that is the idea of Buy America rules and requirements, and the role that that plays in keeping manufacturing jobs here, from keeping them from going overseas, but also in some cases, reshoring them when they have left because of prior poor industrial policy, and now we're able to bring them back. And so I consider myself a huge champion of Buy America rules, and it's the simple idea that when we're spending taxpayer dollars, we want those taxpayer dollars supporting us workers and us small businesses. We don't want them going overseas to be able to acquire components and parts, etc. So when we pass these major pieces of legislation, and most of them bipartisan. If we attach these Buy America requirements, we see these jobs come home. We have a great example in southeastern Wisconsin and Kenosha County of a company that expanded and doubled its workforce to make components for our broadband build out. And why? Because we had Buy America rules in the bipartisan infrastructure law that said we are going to use our tax dollars as we build out high speed internet so that all can access it, but the components have to come from the US. And our prior Commerce Secretary was able to persuade a foreign company to start producing their components in the US so that they could be purchased here for that program. It's really, really exciting to see what those bipartisan efforts can achieve.

Matt Kirchner: 19:30

And I think regardless of political persuasion, what we're seeing here in the United States is this, we are seeing reshoring of manufacturing. We are recognizing that that needs to be an absolute fabric, and has been for generations, if not since this inception of our country, such an important part of what makes America America, that jobs are great, paying jobs, that money reverberates over and over in the economy. And so it's it's music to my ears to hear you say that Senator, that there's this, this bipartisan effort and interest in reshoring manufacturing. Here to America as someone that loves manufacturing, that spent my entire career there, totally, totally appreciate where you're coming from. And in as much as we've got a lot of educators that listen to this podcast every single week, particularly stem and technical educators, if do you have a message to them, and is there something maybe, as you went through your educational pathway that might surprise some people in terms of your views on education. Oh,

Tammy Baldwin: 20:24

my goodness. Well, aside from our parents or grandparents, in my case, educators that we're exposed to have probably the biggest impact on our lives and our development, I think about so many of the teachers that I had throughout the years who inspired me in very different ways, to realize skills that I didn't know, that I had to involve me sometimes in extracurricular activities that allowed me to be able to apply those skills. A quick anecdote, I had a high school math teacher who also was the cross country coach, and asked if I'd volunteer at Cross Country meets to do the statistics afterwards to, you know, calculate which team it involved math, right? Yeah, make sure you were getting those scores accurate, etc. And, you know, I think of so many who really pushed me to understand that I had a capacity to do things that maybe I didn't know that I could. And to the educators out there, you open worlds for people, you open doors, and you create pathways for independence and opportunities and keep it up.

Matt Kirchner: 21:37

Absolutely. That's great. That's a great message, Senator, and we talk a lot about on The TechEd Podcast, about the fact that a lot of times the teacher that does the amazing work they do isn't necessarily the one with the perfect curriculum or the perfect way to teach something. It's that individual that inspires in us something we didn't know we had. That's the perfect example the story you just told about being the status test and at the track meet, absolutely beautiful. I do want to ask you one final question. It's a question Senator that we ask every guest here on The TechEd Podcast, and that is, if you could go back in time, I believe, 15 years old, maybe Madison West High School, if our homework is correct, go back to that sophomore year of high school. And if you could give one piece of advice to your younger self, what would that be, I

Tammy Baldwin: 22:21

think that balancing your academic pursuits with involvement in the community, involvement with your fellow students, that was really what gave me the whole deal was not, you know, I was a serious student, but I also had great fun with a lot of extracurricular activities, some of it athletic, but most of it yearbook and student government and all sorts of components that really filled everything out and allowed me to apply some of the things I was learning out of my textbooks in the real world. And I will say I'm one of the ones who has several dear friends who I met back then that are still to this very day, people that I am so close to, and so, yeah, it's the teachers, it's the academics, but it's also really being a part of your community,

Matt Kirchner: 23:17

absolutely, being a part of that community, having a well rounded experience as you're going through your high school experience. I, too, have tons of friends that I was tight with growing up in wauwa, Tulsa, Wisconsin. I know what that's like to be to stay in touch with people like that. Maybe it's something in the water here in the state of Wisconsin, not sure, but one way or the other, Senator, so glad you took the time to join us here on The TechEd Podcast. You're welcome back anytime. Thank you for your service to our state and to our state and to the United States of America, and really appreciate you taking some time for us today. Thank you for having me a terrific conversation with United States senator the honorable Tammy Baldwin here on The TechEd Podcast. Thank you so much for being with us. Lots of interesting references. We'll link those up in the show notes. We do have the best show notes in the business. You will find them at TechEd podcast.com/baldwin that is TechEd podcast.com/b. A, l, D, W, I n, when you're done there, check us out on social media. We are all over Facebook, tick tock, Instagram, LinkedIn, wherever you consume your social media, you will find The TechEd Podcast. Thank you so much for being with us this week. We had a wonderful conversation with us. Senator Tammy Baldwin, my name is Matt Kirkner, this is The TechEd Podcast, and we will see you next week. You.