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Secrets From a Coach - Debbie Green & Laura Thomson's Podcast
Secrets From a Coach - Debbie Green & Laura Thomson's Podcast
220. Reducing Negative Team Friction
In the third of our 4-part series exploring how to reduce drama in our work lives, we explore the difference between negative and positive team friction and the skills to address friction in a positive way. Using practical examples from the world of workplace mediation we highlight the language, tone and intent that can help shift friction from a negative (leaving a mark) to a positive (creating a spark).
It can be tempting to use 'battle' language to describe frictions between people, but this can lead to a sense of not wanting to 'back down' and so engaging a conversation may bring with it a sense of defeat or giving in. We explore the impact it can have reframing this as a chance to 'step up' and be an act of courage and strength to want to engage and resolve frictions and challenges.
A useful listen for anyone who is sensing that frictions are rumbling between people and wants to shift things on before it becomes irreparable. It is human to experience conflicts, and unpleasant as it can feel in the moment - can lead to the greatest working relationships through the bond that is created when its worked through.
secrets from a coach thrive and maximize your potential in the evolving workplace. Your weekly podcast with debbie green of wishfish and laura thompson staveley of phenomenal training Debs.
Speaker 2:Laura, you all right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, how's your week been? Yeah, it's been really good Lots of variety, meeting different people, as ever very interested in our topic that we're going to be covering on this podcast episode, and yeah, but before I bang on, how's your week been? How are you doing?
Speaker 2:A bit like you. It's been eventful already. It's been different, lots of different things that we're working on and just keeping this stupid cold thing at bay, oh how very human every human? I know it's not on. Is it lots of vitamin c that's?
Speaker 1:what it is.
Speaker 1:It's not on and this is the thing. You see us, we can't always operate at 110%, we can't Every day, all day and with every single person, which is why we wanted to cover in this current four-part focus looking at how do we reduce workplace drama, and we thought it might be quite a fun way to celebrate the new Chinese year, which is happening in the month of recording the year of the snake. So snakes and the characteristics have the positives. They also have the downsides. So you know, like any one of those kind of personality characteristics, and the focus we are going to have on this episode is around reducing negative team friction. So hopefully this is a nice mix of some concepts to think about, some opportunities to reflect actually, what have I learned? Where am I seeing this play out? And some practical takeaway tools as well.
Speaker 1:So, deb, I think what can be quite useful is sometimes almost just defining what does it mean to have friction with someone or within a team? And is it always bad? Because if you look at the sort of the mechanics of how do you spark a fire, you need a flint and you need something for that to sort of spark against. So if you've got person A, person B and they think the same and they act the same, then it might be a very comfortable working relationship, but you might not spark any newness. Yeah, actually, there might be some people that have joined a team or you've worked alongside each other for a while where there are just some fundamental differences of opinion, but actually play your cards right.
Speaker 1:That friction short term could lead to some great long-term innovations because you're seeing things differently, you're challenging each other and you're able to come up with new ideas because there is friction. Yeah, so what would be interesting to get your take on? What's the difference between positive friction, where we're able to work creatively with each other, and negative friction? That actually is something we would want to avoid, and if I could ask you to put your mediator hat on with this, Not my meditation hat, Not your meditation hat.
Speaker 1:No, that was a funny moment we had when Deb had asked one of the team can you go and do some meditation?
Speaker 2:training, mediation, training, oh it was meditation training. Yeah it was meditation and they read it as meditation and even now I have to now doubly think what it was.
Speaker 1:So it was. So it was a bit of a shock, yeah. So she'd prepared for some lovely calm meditation workshop and actually what people were wanting? How do we stop people fighting and how do we mediate, get rid of?
Speaker 2:that negativity. That was brilliant, and so I think we're always conscious of that now when we're talking about mediation, not meditation.
Speaker 1:Oh, hilarious, yeah, so with your mediator, hat on, because I think sometimes there's some really interesting learns we can take from when things have got so bad you've needed to call in a workplace mediator. Actually, what are some lessons that you can give us right from the sort of the Gale Force 10, that if there are a few little windy moments earlier on, we could sort of address them? So first question what would you say is the difference between a positive team friction that actually you might want to cultivate, versus a negative team friction?
Speaker 2:I think the word you used there was cultivate. So if there is a positive team friction, it's that ability to spark new ideas, new ways of working, to bounce ideas around, to not take it personally because you're wanting to disrupt the current mode or the current way of thinking. So you have to step into that creativity mode if you like to be able to get those ideas out. And whilst everybody might not like all of the ideas nobody ever does it's that ability, from an emotional, intelligent point of view, to then take that and talk about it and discuss it, because it's not about you, it's about what do we need to do to create a new way of being thinking, working together, and that disrupting thinking is something that is really positive. Sometimes Otherwise, as you said, we just sail along on non-choppy waters and we can get complacent and we can just think we're all right and then suddenly boom, everything goes a bit carnage. So, from a positive way of doing it, that friction is a good thing as long as it's set up well and so, bringing in some of the mediation techniques around, setting the scene around what it is we're going to do, because everybody has different ideas and opinions, and I think if you've got that culture within your team or your organization where you want to hear people's opinions and you want to hear ideas, that's an amazing place to be. So people will bring their ideas.
Speaker 2:So it does create that optimistic mindset to want to try something different. And let's give it a go and I'll put my idea in. They want to hear from me, so people therefore belong and feel they matter. So on that side, it's a good thing. When it goes wrong, really wrong, oh my God, it can be toxic. Nobody wants to work with everybody. The eyes roll when you say could you go and work with? And that one person just sets the tone. Is this feedback, debra?
Speaker 1:No Lord, my phone's been quiet the last couple of weeks. Have I had one no one wants to work with?
Speaker 2:you? Yeah, no, not at all. Bloody hell. And that is where it is toxic. You can feel it. And people are just fighting each other, not literally. Well, I have seen it where people do fight each other because they just disagree fundamentally on every level. And when you unpick what's going on for them, because sometimes you do have to get them both in the room and start to find out what is the problem, but have that complete mediation space, because if they're not going to resolve it themselves, most humans will resolve it themselves in one way or another. But some people just don't and don't want to. So that negativity stops ideas. Just everybody doesn't want to come to work.
Speaker 2:It's a horrendous place to work in and it's just not a nice culture to be in. It's toxic and it's. And then you find that that vibe then like spreads and it, it just permeates the whole feeling, the vibe, the environment that you're. And then people wonder why, if they don't address it? So if you see that going on and as a manager, leader, you don't call it or address it, then you're condoning that behavior first of all, but also it means that people won't want to work there. They might stay for maybe a couple of months, but as soon as they go, oh my God, this is like a poison chalice. What am I doing here? They will then look for other jobs. So yeah, it's a real interesting one. It's just horrible. It's horrible, negative, toxic place.
Speaker 1:So thank you, and I know a little bit later we're going to pick up so what might be some practical things. If you're there in a scenario you can sort of see it's sort of going towards this path and we were sort of just chatting beforehand just in preparation for this. I guess the positive team friction is where you create that spark and it creates an energy to progress and move things forward. The negative team friction is where all it does is leave a mark and actually people don't want to engage and move things on, they just want to kind of have the quickest conversation possible to sort of get out of there. You've reminded me actually, do you remember? There was that brilliant work. We'll have to reference it in the overview, but it was about relationships in terms of what are the couples that are predicted to make it and have a long-term relationship.
Speaker 1:And what psychologists had arrived at is there is one micro expression that if they see the presence of that on that couple's facial expression, they know that that relationship is going to have a higher likelihood of ending rather than being able to be sort of brought back.
Speaker 1:And that one facial expression isn't anger, it's not irritation or annoyance. In fact that indicates you still care enough to feel anger, irritation and annoyance. The one facial expression that is the one that is kind of the indicator of this all needs to be put down is contempt. So contempt is the absence of interest or respect.
Speaker 1:It might show itself as cynicism or sarcasm, or just not wanting to engage so that contemptuous protective mechanism we might put on, which is ugh, I find this person so distasteful. I'm not going to give any emotion to the person, I'm just going to shut up shop because that's the best thing I can do to protect myself in this moment and I just don't want to engage. So I think that kind of, is it a spark or is it leaving a mark? And the other thing, that's, whether it's relationships in our personal life or our professional life that contempt, when there is the absence of any emotion to want to do things, then that's where you know it might be an opportunity to bring in the mediators to then see if there's a way around it.
Speaker 1:So I know in a moment you'll share some practical bits, but I guess what's the benefit of reducing team friction and putting in some work to make things better? So what have been some scenarios you've seen Debs of where either a manager or someone within the team has not been pretty. It's felt really toxic. They've done the work to move things on. What's the vision of success that we can look forward to, to sort of roll up our sleeves and do something about it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's such a good question, laura, and I think contempt is a fascinating thing because it's really hard and if you're in a team inside work, outside work sometimes one of you has to it gets called backing down. I know certainly my experience of working in couples and also with teams where it's gone a bit wrong. Somebody feels like they have to. Well, I've got to back down, because why should I? They should back down, we should back down. And it's just like, oh my goodness, come on, people, eventually somebody has to recognize and they do they actually not back down but step up. Because if they can bring themselves up and out of and see it for what it is and look at themselves first and say, do I really want to be feeling like this every time I'm in a conversation with this individual? Or hate it and hate is a strong word, as they said, there's a fine line between love and hate, right, but that hatred is a feeling the contempt has. No, it's just whatever. So if we can get someone who will go, what's for the greater good, how does it impact you? If you were to do something different, what impact would that have on you as the individual? And then you leave them to contemplate it and think about it, and then you might see someone will step up and go I don't want to be like this any longer and they make the choice to try and make it work again. When it's broken down irretrievably, it just is never going to come back. It might come back but it might be different. And again you have to then, if you like, renegotiate how you work around here now based on what's gone before. But it's really fascinating.
Speaker 2:I remember working in a sales team eight years and years ago and there was just friction with the highest earner earned loads of commission, did loads of sales, and there was this friction by some that weren't maybe as good, and you could feel it, that negativity, and there was every time this person stood up to say I've hit I don't know how many sales it was that day. You could feel the contempt in the room and it's a lonely place sometimes. But one person who was a very big influence I always remember said this is ridiculous, isn't it, deb? And I went yeah, what do you want to do about it? And they go. We can't continue like this, can we? I said well, what do you think? Yes, I was in coaching mode and they went no, we can't.
Speaker 2:I said, okay, what do you want to do about it? He goes I'm just going to back this person because they're doing really, really well, but they got themselves out of it. They stepped up, not back down, if that makes sense. They faced it and if we can face it, we can, nine times out of 10, move it somewhere, be it finishing it completely, it's still a move. It's not this me or we find a way to work together again. You're never living with them or loving them, but you might have to work really hard with them.
Speaker 1:Debs, I love that bit about it's not backing down. I'm not backing down. I'm not backing down.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you can hear it, can't you?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm stepping up, I'm stepping up and I know we've done lots of stuff around sort of dynamics, but I guess is that the bit where the child turns into the adult?
Speaker 2:Yeah, in that moment I'm not backing down. There he is.
Speaker 1:It's my life. It's my life, yeah, it's my choice. So what can I sort of do about that? And that might take, you know, I guess that might take years for someone to go. Actually, I think I think one of us needs to do something about it and it you know, this is this position isn't tenable in my head to have this amount of power sort of going to someone else. I think I think that's absolutely fascinating.
Speaker 2:Because if we are, if the person who is a neutral, obviously that's where mediation comes in, because if we can't solve it together, we may need a third person who acts as that facilitator of the conversation, who is just there to sit and listen. And obviously, you know, it can get bigger and bigger where they do bring professional mediators in and they, you know they can be in any conflict really, and you see them, you know, in governments they bring mediators in to talk to countries, which I think is wow, that's on another scale. But sometimes we may act as the mediator and it's a very different role, because you are there as the mediator, you're not there in your job role per se. And that's why you have to be really clear on what your role is, if you are going to be the mediator of that conversation or the facilitator of that conversation to consciously move it forward for them. And there's some skills that you have to consider prior to stepping into that conversation, during it and then after.
Speaker 1:Oh well, let's definitely focus on those in a moment. So I guess, to sort of sum up so far so negative team friction versus positive team friction is the positive stuff creates a spark. That might actually be. You want to actively look for points of conflict, because things have got a bit samey. There needs to be some innovation. And imagining that spark on the flint, on the flintstone I like that image, you can see it, can't you?
Speaker 1:Yeah, you can see it, and so actually, if there's a difference of opinion, as long as there is the willingness to sort of listen to each other I know you're going to talk about skills in a moment then actually that team conflict, rather than it creating a funny feeling in your tummy things are kicking off is, oh, things are getting interesting, let's lean into this and then to be able to spark, whereas the negative team friction is where it just leaves a mark. Everyone leaves that interaction just feeling not quite right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, as our colleague Lynne talks about it.
Speaker 1:And then building on that then. So, rather than feeling like someone's got to back down, actually the let me sort of step up. So it's an act of maturity to do that.
Speaker 1:And I was just musing as you were talking, because in the old days, when people stayed in jobs for years and years and years, your reputation would have been within the organisation in which you worked in. Yes, that's true. If average length of tenure now is what? Two to three years, yeah, on average and even within that same organisation, you might work in different places. Actually, what we're also talking about here is what's the reputation? I want to precede or follow me with reference to how I like to work, and if, actually, the last 10 people you work with found you really difficult and there was lots of negativity, and this is now the 10th mediation session you've had. Well, at some point that's going to have an impact on your reputation.
Speaker 1:So, I think, from a career point of view, we have to be much more well. There's an opportunity to be more self-managed in terms of the reputation you want to have, because maybe, unlike in the eighties and nineties where you were sort of staying within a smaller pool of people, now, with you know, a billion plus users on LinkedIn, we are all out there potentially in our careers. Creating a story, creating a reputation, yeah, and that ability to convert negative into positive, yeah. Team friction, where you can spark new ideas, is probably going to be quite useful for the next five years because I reckon there's going to be lots of things to argue about debs yes I think there will be.
Speaker 2:Yeah, even though, whose turn is it to go and make the cup of tea? Yeah, that's why they brought vending machines in, so it got rid of that conflict. But it's, yeah, you're right. Actually, that's a really good point, because if you're not considering, consciously, considering how do I show up? We always say, don't we? What impact do you want to have? Do you want to light up the room as you walk in or as you walk out? And we always laugh at that.
Speaker 1:I loved it when I first heard you say that.
Speaker 2:And they go. Oh, because you're right and we've. You know, we have seen in larger organizations that we work that that person's reputation will precede them. So when they apply for another job in another part of the organization, somebody knows somebody. That knows somebody and it's based on perception of how they were then. It's not necessarily how they are now.
Speaker 2:Now, if they are smart and they realize first job didn't know the rules and working had an etiquette of respect and all that stuff. They can learn that if they have a great leader and a mentor and training and development. So people can shift because they may not know what they don't know and I think the person that invests that time. But however, they will still be marked. Like you said, there is still a mark that's left and they have to work really hard to overcome that reputation. And I've seen some people leave an organization, go somewhere else and then come back because they're coming back in a different position. That works. However, if you've got somebody that has worked with you when you were back then 15 years ago, they will still remember you from 15 years ago. So you then have to prove yourself even more sometimes to show them that you have shifted and changed. So that's an interesting little dynamic that goes on as well in teams.
Speaker 1:Oh you're, it is, and I won't derail us sort of too much. Did we have a conversation, but you've just uh, we are getting to the skills bit in a moment.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we will Hang on people, because we've got three. We've got three, three, three, three, three, three.
Speaker 1:But you've reminded me of how sometimes, how long these stories work. For I went to a bit of reunion one year ago, two years ago, so there were some people who hadn't sort of seen each other for 20 years, and I overheard a conversation, once the wine had got flowing, where I heard someone then saying actually it's always been a regret of mine how you and I left that team because I know we'd had some things that we disagreed about. So I just wanted to say I did really enjoy working with you. It's just at the time, I know, we found each other a bit sort of full on and I remember eavesdropping over that, thinking that is a magic moment that is happening right there.
Speaker 1:20 years long that story has been, and actually they might not have been actively thinking about it. But there I am, face to face with that person that I'd sort of go oh God, I've got to work with them. But actually, 20 years on, you see things differently because no feeling is final. You've grown up now 20 years, you've had 20 years of working with different types of people under your belt and you might now see it differently. So that ability to sort of repair what might have been left a bit ruptured, I think can feel really motivating.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think so, and that yeah, that is true, actually isn't it Law, but that person stepped up to own it and they took personal responsibility for their part in it and they were, you know, had the kahunas to say it out loud, and what that person chose to do with that. I suppose it's up to them after that. But that regulation of self and that emotional intelligence and awareness enough to recognize it in the first place is incredible, and that's what we ask people to do is just look at it. What is going on, what's the perception that it's creating? Asking great questions as the person facilitating it is your gift in those moments, because you are privy to getting information from people so the other person can hear it.
Speaker 2:I know we've come on to some practical ways of prepping for that, but I always remember having one particularly difficult because it was a sexual harassment claim and they couldn't work together, and some practical ways of prepping for that. But I always remember having one particularly difficult because it was a sexual harassment claim and they couldn't work together and allegations were being chucked around. They didn't want to raise a grievance, they wanted to mediate and have a conversation as to how they can overcome this, because they had to continue to work and it was fascinating what came out of it and the feedback that we got was it was just nice to be in a room. It and the feedback that we got was it was just nice to be in a room. Somebody asked me some questions you made. They told me I made the other person listen. I said, well, I didn't make them, we just agreed how we would do it and therefore they could hear it for the first time. And it was, and they said what.
Speaker 2:What they heard was they had no idea that that's the environment they were creating and to hear it was quite hard, but they understood it. And that is what we're looking for. We look for empathy and understanding, creating some clarity around what is true, what's not true, what's made up, what's history, what's the story, what's the perception, to have no judgment in that moment and to focus on what we're going to do about it. You know, and that I always forget, yeah, I always remember that. Yeah, I felt I've never heard it, because we summarise as a mediator, you summarise back, so what I'm hearing you say is and just to hear it as a third person in the room, that person said I've never even heard it that way, cause I don't cause. We were too much crashing against each other, so no one was listening.
Speaker 1:Wow. So let's now have a look at, let's say, things aren't at the stage where you've got to bring in a full-on mediator to come in but you're sort of spotting some low-level things that you think if this gets left it could potentially sort of fester.
Speaker 1:And because sometimes these wrinkles don't iron themselves out kind of automatically, no, particularly working hybrid. I know we often sort of bring that back in. But the 21st century thing of this is you might not have a chance waiting for the kettle to boil in the kitchen to chat something over. That's true. You don't have to book in a scheduled call to have a chat. So it requires even more intentionality from a language point of view, because you might not stumble into each other and have a convenient time to have it. So what would be if there were like a toolkit of top tips? That in terms of reducing negative team friction, then what would that toolkit list be? And then we'll look at call to action and share the secrets. So what would be? Some top tips?
Speaker 2:Top tips. So there's loads. My top tips would be to have, if you can foster that open communication, that to have, if you can foster that open communication, that transparency where you can create that environment where people feel safe to share concerns or ideas or challenges without fear of judgment, being judged or retaliation. So I think, encouraging transparency, fostering that open communication, listening that is the key, key thing. Listen, don't interrupt and check in more. I think that's you know. So how do you feel you know conducting those one-on-one meetings? How's that been going for you? What's working? Well, all those things you know you talk about in a one-to-one um can really help, I think. Collaboration as a team, encouraging that collaboration, I think important. How do you get people working on cross-functional projects or working together cross-functionally? That can help take away any preconceived ideas or see somebody in a different light. I think so. How do we respect diversity as well and embrace and be open to hear diverse views about what people think? We all think differently but if, rather than close it down, it might create a curious mind to go oh, I've never really thought about it from that perspective. Okay, I may not still agree with it, but I'm going to explore it first before making a decision. So I think that I think, definitely, if you can feel stuff's not quite right, check on it, do it, address it quickly, don't let it fester, because it will just grow arms and legs and it will and people go. Well, that person's not doing anything about it. You know you don't want that, so see it. I think that's one um, we talked about ei, building your emotional intelligence. I think it's really really key knowing when you're under stress, so when you may not be at your best. Let people maybe you need to let people know that. I think feedback is a gift, as we always say, not the crap sandwich, but regular feedback. Observe what have I seen? Yeah, I thought it was amazing. So, the more we can foster that positive environment, invest in people, create that sense of psychologically safe to be able to do that and of course, mine is always empathy.
Speaker 2:Recognize individual needs. What does you know? What do people want? Recognize what they have done, show appreciation for the piece of work they've done, so that you can foster that positive team environment. But you have to role model that as well. I think you need to have someone who role models that. You don't have to be the leader to do that either. You can be one of the. You know the team that can do that as well. Yeah, I think that's it Communication listening. Just hear what that person's saying before you jump in and go. That's wrong. Go, that's different. That's interesting. We owe it to ourselves, right? That's interesting. I've never thought about it from that perspective. Can you tell me more? So you're being curious, you're bringing that curious mind into it. Well, yeah, I do see where you're coming from. I don't necessarily agree with that, but I do like this. So it becomes a two-way communication without going. That's rubbish. What made you think that? So yeah, that's for me would be some of the top tips. I'm sure there's more.
Speaker 1:That's a beautiful list. So, fer, can you just do that in your nine o'clock briefing meeting that you've got today? Lovely job done. Just link in on that bit. You said about the O, the O it to yourself If I had to do a quick explanation on that. So I learned this from you and there have been a few times where I've thought on any tricky conversation sessions I've been running oh actually is this a bit obvious? Do I use this slide or not? You know, I'll tell you what on those checkout post-it notes quite a few people will put the O tool.
Speaker 1:So if you imagine the word O-W-E O is, let's say, you know there's a likelihood you might pop in that conversation. What this does is just work on that impulse control. So if Dev has just said something that I'm thinking how dare you? And just observe. So just let her finish. Observe where it's going, because actually I might be about to interrupt you before. You were about to say but now I see it differently. But if I interrupt at that point, actually your message might have then had going to be taking a different turn.
Speaker 1:The W is wait. So just wait and just hold yourself for a moment and then engage with some of those beautiful questions. That's interesting. I wasn't expecting you to say that or that's different from what I'd picked up. Yeah, let's discuss. And it's having those little. It's like when I remember practicing for my French oral GCSE, you know, can I ask where? Can I ask for a ham sandwich? Can I ask where the police station is? So you learn these few little phrases just to be able to sort of make do and communicate in there. And that's, I think, where some of these little phrases can be quite useful.
Speaker 1:You know, phrases like I noticed that, or I may be wrong, but I wanted to have the conversation or help me to understand, or I wasn't expecting you to say that, or I'm disappointed to hear you say that, or I'm curious about that, and sometimes those little sentence openers can just then help have those conversations where it's you know it's seen as a knock on the door rather than a kick through the door Just to sort of create the negative.
Speaker 2:And it's that ability to ask probing questions, right, yeah, sort of supposed to facilitate the conversation around the questions you're asking. And I know one of the things that I always like, you know I there's one example. I have written this down because it's like what do you think may have contributed to this, this misunderstanding? Then your tone has to reflect it from a genuine place of curiosity, not a telling dictatorial. So what do you think, might you know, may have, may have contributed to this misunderstanding?
Speaker 1:You're not saying it did, is the advice not to say, well, what do you think, what do you think, and then put inverted commas, misunderstand. Yes, exactly so the body language and the tone is important with this, the tone and the flow of the words.
Speaker 2:Because, we're very good, as you said, of pausing. Maybe in opposite, do you really believe in that, the way you go up or down that? You know subluminal messaging, and sometimes I've had, I've had people say um to people when they're asking them to do something to undercover what what they need is to say, well, I want, I want this done my way, you know, and but how can we explore what's important about that for you? So you would say what you want. So it is asking what you, what you want, or what you need. I need this. You know I want this done my way, but you would also. So what's important about that for you? So again, you're getting that two-way communication going, rather than go, we just bloody do it, you know, it's my way or the highway, it's like, open it up for exploration.
Speaker 2:I think, and I think that's the skill that not I have seen some people use brilliantly and others struggle at times, and that's when they go oh, I should have really asked that and they haven't. But again asking, you know, so I'm, I'm seeing it this way, but I may be completely wrong, maybe completely wrong. What are you seeing? Yeah, what do you think? What's your, what do you see it from your side. So again you're opening it, an invitation up to explore it with them. So again, it's very much your mindset. You've got an open mind to it and curiosity mind curious mind, not that dictatorial. It's very collaborative working around it.
Speaker 1:Devs, I think there's been some smashing skills on this and always what we've sort of said in any of these things is these are skills for life. We just happen to be paid to deploy them in our work persona. But I'm thinking you know so, just as a sort of a call to actually me thinking from a parenting point of view, if children can see the adults in their world having these conversations of, ah, I see it differently.
Speaker 1:Let's chat that through rather than no, no, rather than no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, and just sort of blocking that conversation, because surely what we need to be able to thrive over the next five years is people being able to communicate, work with difference.
Speaker 1:Understand that sometimes it's not a personal attack, there's just a different style in what someone might have. So, rather than kind of it leaving a mark, that means people shut up shop, it's creating spark. That means there's that willingness to work, disrupting your thinking and that idea then of being able to, not that sense of backing down which feels like you are the loser in it, but stepping up to actually enable some good stuff. And then those skills that you were talking about, which are life skills. We just happen to be talking about it from a team point of view. So what would your coaching call to action be and particularly this goes out for anyone with who maybe has got a bit of beef going on around them in whatever part of the sphere of life and what would be your call to action that you think might really help someone feel a sense of progression in this area?
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's such a good question. That could be a whole episode on its own, laura, I think for me there's a couple of things. It's getting yourself ready for that conversation. So how are you going to be in that conversation? What do you want as a good outcome? And not being afraid to set the tone, set the scene contract, as we call it. And not being afraid to set the tone, set the scene contract, as we call it around the reason I'm having this conversation with you, or we're having this conversation, and what I'd like to understand is how are we going to get the best out of it?
Speaker 2:So, I think, setting the scene, doing your prep work, knowing what you want as an outcome and then, yeah, just opening it, well, with some clear expectations and boundaries about what we want to talk about, and listen, yeah, ask how have you seen this? Can you talk me through or tell me more about how you see it from your side of the world, because it could be different to mine, but I'm really interested. So it is taking that adult space, not that parent. So, again, the tone of your question and the way you ask it are super important, because you can hold that space of completely impartiality and that's why mediators come in or facilitators of conversations come in to facilitate the conversation between two people. They are completely impartial to it and will listen and will ask and they will manage the space, if you like. If anybody's been to couples counseling, they manage the environment. Um, so people get feel like they're being heard on both sides beautiful loads there law probably way too beautiful.
Speaker 1:While thinking, call to action preparedness yeah, oh, I like that.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, not preparedness, preparedness no preparedness.
Speaker 1:I don't know if that's right or not.
Speaker 2:I like it, though it feels like it does.
Speaker 1:And my share of the secret would be right listen out. If you've got a friend or a colleague in your sphere of influence who is saying things like, well, I'm not backing down, I'm not backing down Even in that moment, what if you were to step up and sometimes that can completely flip in on its head? Yeah, get them to then listen to this so they realize there is an act of courageous strength leaning into that. Yeah, rather than kind of backing down and the other person kind of winning, because the win is we're able to rest in, rest peacefully with our work persona, because no salary is worth it ruining your leisure time, preventing you from falling asleep, or it just, you know, creating a lot of kind of impact, negative impact and upset. No, no salary is worth that.
Speaker 1:So, this is all in the pursuit of working well and how we can then reduce workplace drama, with a particular focus, this episode, on reducing negative team friction. And so our final one next week, debs, is going to be how do I work well with my opposite? Oh yes, this is a good one, the yin to the yan. Because you see, debs, when I've got an idea, I just need to pick up the phone and tell you immediately. But maybe you'd prefer a little bit of thinking time, because you were right, slap bang in the middle of a quiet task. Yeah, so I didn't mean to irritate you, but actually I've been the irritant in your working day, and if we were to only understand each other's yin versus yang, then we can sort of play on those. So I'm really looking forward to that, because I think there's a lot of stuff we do with teams around understanding that kind of and embracing that sort of difference. So I hope you have a wonderful week, you too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's definitely a lot. I have that image in my head now and I'm going to take that. Are you going to leave a mark which is like a burn, or are you going? To spark, you know, and create light. I think that's what it is.
Speaker 1:I love that image.
Speaker 2:I've got that in my head now, so thank you for that, laura.
Speaker 1:It's like a little earworm. Now, yeah, and you know what I'm going to manifest up. I bet between now and next week we're going to meet someone that has the surname Flint.
Speaker 2:I bet we do.
Speaker 1:Let's put it out there, let's put it out there, put it out there I bet we will.
Speaker 2:We're doing some good work next week.
Speaker 1:So let's see, I love this Lord, thank you. They'll tell us whether it's good or not. Yeah, they will oh my God, I love it. Thank you so much Lord.
Speaker 2:It's been really good.
Speaker 1:I've really enjoyed this topic this is a good one. Yeah, me too I loved it.
Speaker 2:But have a good week too.
Speaker 1:Oh, you too, darling. Love you, love you Bye. We hope you've enjoyed this podcast. We'd love to hear from you. Email us at contact at secretsfromacoachcom, or follow us on Insta or Facebook. If you're a Spotify listener, give us a rating, as it's easier for people to find us, and if you want to know more, visit our website, wwwsecretsfromacoachcom, and sign up for our newsletter here to cheer you on and help you thrive in the ever-changing world of work.