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Secrets From a Coach - Debbie Green & Laura Thomson's Podcast
Secrets From a Coach - Debbie Green & Laura Thomson's Podcast
236: The Force Is In You – Keeping Self-Belief During Workplace Lows
As we continue our series taking lessons from the world of Star Wars this one is all about mindset and belief, and the impact self-belief has on our worklife and sense of self.
In this powerful episode, we’re joined by the inspirational Nigel Snowball as he shares his lived experience of navigating tough times at work. From setbacks to self-doubt, Nigel explores how to stay grounded, connected, and empowered—especially when things feel heavy.
He reminds us that it’s completely human to have low points, but what matters is how we respond. Together we explore how to take ownership of our mindset, stay connected with others, and focus on the choices we do have—even when it doesn’t feel like it.
A lightsaber of a listen for anyone facing challenges right now, and a hopeful nudge to just take that next step.
Secrets from a coach thrive and maximize your potential in the evolving workplace. Your weekly podcast with debbie green of wishfish and laura thompson, stavely of phenomenal training. Debs, laura, you alright? Yeah, I'm doing well. I'm really enjoying our Star Wars focus.
Speaker 2:What a fun oh my god, I love it. And every time I've sort of looked and done something, I find I'm quoting and looking for references to it. It's really like hit home on this one, I love it.
Speaker 1:I know, and what a wonderful excuse to be watching lots of footage of Harrison Ford.
Speaker 2:Yes, you're enjoying that bit, aren't you?
Speaker 1:So, just to recap, our first one was all around channeling your inner Yoda particularly if you've got a busy full on work life or life life, then being able to tap into that inner presence. That was with Carl, yeah, last week was all around and working well with the droids in our life, right up your street, right up my cantina. So what does that mean in terms of working well and delegating the stuff that's less important to the, to the machines in our life? And this one, debs oh, I know we've got an amazing guest, so I know your conversation. You'll introduce us to the wonderful master that is Nigel Snowball, but this one is all around the forces in you.
Speaker 1:So, keeping self-belief Interesting, debs, I've noticed a lot of the workshops that I've been running recently. You ask people at the end, what's it you've enjoyed or valued most from this day together, and pretty much everyone will say to know it's not just me, yeah, that actually what I'm going through, in whatever level of the organization I'm in, it's not just me that actually a lot of people are feeling or experiencing the same. And you see, this shift in self-belief from oh, these challenges aren't a me problem, it's a situational challenge, and then actually you can just see people's level of self-belief increase in that moment. I can do this because actually we're all experiencing it, it's not just me. What in your experience have you seen makes a difference when people actively focus on increasing their level of self-belief?
Speaker 2:As you just said, it is enlightening. And the penny drops. I think it's that penny drop moment for somebody where they realise, as you said're not alone, but also they have the capability to be able to change and adapt if they want to. And what I love about this is the choice is always theirs and if they want to continue down the road they're going, there's going to be consequences. If they choose to change and go down a better road, there will be consequences. And it's just that realization moment where they go oh, if I don't do something, this is nothing's going to change, so I'm going to do something. And giving them the belief that they can just expels them on another level sends them into the universe and off they go.
Speaker 1:It's amazing, yeah what's it when they go in in star wars, when they go full speed? Is it hyper speed speed? Yes, it is hyper speed.
Speaker 2:And then you, you watch all the stars go by.
Speaker 1:Yeah and then you're there, oh wonderful, and talking of stars. Even his voice alone is comforting, reassuring. So I'm devs looking forward to this one with nigel snowball.
Speaker 2:Nigel Snowball. Hi everyone. I am delighted to be joined by the amazing Nigel Snowball, who I've known for many years back in T1 days at Heathrow Airport, and he is an absolute avid Star Wars fan. So it was not going to not be a podcast series without having him as our guest. So it was not going to not be a podcast series without having him as our guest and, in particular, nigel is going to be talking to us about the forces in you keeping your self-belief during workplace lows, because we all have them, and I know Nigel has been doing what he's doing. I'll get him to introduce himself to us in a moment.
Speaker 2:For a long time and he's sort of found, looked at, been involved with, come out the other end of so many different things that, to tap into his wisdom and his experience a bit Yoda-like, we're going to explore a little bit more about Nigel and what he does and how he does it. So, nigel, welcome to our podcast. Thank you, delighted to have you. We've been waiting for this for a little while, and Laura and I went Star Wars theme this month. It's got to be you while. And Laura and I went Star Wars theme this month. It's got to be you. So we're so chuffed that you could come on and chat with us. So first things first, tell us a bit about who you are and what you do, hi so my name is Nigel Snowball.
Speaker 3:I've had a really lovely 20-year career at Heathrow as part of the operational team. I've had many leadership roles throughout that time and I currently design and deliver our engagement and people strategy for our security teams, which is probably one of the best jobs I've ever had. Prior to joining Heathrow, I had a background in food, retail and hospitality industry, so I had quite a long career and learned many things along the way.
Speaker 2:And I remember bumping into you because I remember being asked to start doing some work with Heathrow many years ago now I mean, how long ago was T1? And I always remember them going oh, just go and just shadow someone in the airport, we're going to send you over to T1. There was you and there was Frankie, and I just have watched and been in that world forever and it was the best experience I could have had and I know you've been such a big, massive supporter of everything we've done and personal development and learning and it's just incredible to see what you bring into the world of work and how you shape it and make things happen. So I say we're delighted to have you here. So I suppose the other question I suppose it would be remiss of me not to ask you what is it about? Star Wars?
Speaker 3:oh, that's a million dollar question that, if I'm truthful, it's all around childhood memories. So when I saw Star Wars, that was 1978 wow, years and years ago, long time, yeah, at a galaxy far, far away, and it depends. So it's my first recordable memory with my dad. So we were in, uh, the newcastle picture house, which was one of those all amazing converted theaters. Yeah, being there at such a young age with an ice cream in one hand, a carton of juice and the other my dad next to us, and then that opening scene where the spaceships come, come over the top of you, and I remember just sitting there like life doesn't get much better, I've peaked. It was all downhill from there. So it's just a real childhood memory. Star Wars is one of those old classic good against evil type of stories, but with some spaceships and blasters put in and, if I'm truthful, I'm sure Princess Leia has something to do with the enjoyment of watching the old films oh, the old ones.
Speaker 2:I think that's just brilliant and I know, um, we always sort of send a message every now and again and you put a message out when it's the may the fourth be with you and I just love that. But obviously we wanted to make it link with this whole notion of self-belief and how important it can be. And whilst it's a massive topic and we appreciate that, but when we think about self-belief for you, what does this mean to you personally? And have you always had that a sense of self-belief or not?
Speaker 3:No, I haven't and that's led to some slight problems that I've had to deal with. Not everybody's journey or path is a straight road. There's a couple of paving slabs that trip you up and there's a couple of dead ends that you that you go down, and I can remember being in my late 30s, early 40s, just prior to to meeting you. When they talk about people coming to your life at the right time, this is a prime example. So I had to do some so like re re-evaluation, I had to like draw some lines under the sand and and I had to do some plans, plans for some self-equivalence and self-reflection.
Speaker 3:But, to be honest with you, all of those are irrelevant if you don't have the self-belief in yourself to start to deliver, and that's something that's really hard. It's easy to talk about, but when your head goes into the pillow at night or when you first get up in the morning, to have those thoughts straight away is like the key to it. So, yeah, there's a lot of self-reflection, self-analysis to look at what, what you are, who you are, why you are leading into the purpose and values courses that we did. That was like fundamentally another game changer in how I reviewed myself and I don't think, without that self-evaluation, I would have like been able to to believe in myself and then start putting things right and ended up where I am now, yeah, and I think that that just shows, isn't it, that ability to just stop and think about who I am.
Speaker 2:As you said, you know what's important for me, what do I want my life to be about? And juggling, I suppose, that whole world that you're in and finding your way again, you know, and may the force be within you in order to ensure that you kept on that path and trajectory of where you were constantly evolving and developing. And I suppose during that time, as you said, you've had a few hiccups, a few pavements have tripped you over, but as a manager leader, because you've managed, a few hiccups, a few pavements have tripped you over, but as a manager leader, because you you've managed, led teams of all different shapes and sizes in your career, I'm sure you would have seen a couple of workplace lows through that. But what is it that you think normally causes those lows when you're in a workplace?
Speaker 3:Human nature is that we all fear the unknown. If we were cavemen and we were women and we were walking past dark caves that we didn't know what was inside there, you would fear that because it's the unknown the biggest driver for the uncertainty. And what's unknown is around change. They're some of the biggest problems that we have. When we're we're looking into change, where, if you look at the gate, the change curve, when we're, yeah, we're not accepting or embracing it or so like exploring it, that's. That's when the lows start to come and that's where our job as leader is to uh, to identify people who have have those problems, but then just yeah, not taking by the hand literally, but metaphorically just lead them. Lead them through, start exploring what that means to them, how it's going to work and what the other side's going to look like yeah, no, definitely, and you're right about that change piece and I know probably in your career you've picked people up from those lows.
Speaker 2:Is there any in particular, without naming them, that you've, you're super proud of that. You enabled and showed them the way, if you like, as to how to get over that and into a maybe a better headspace. Have you got a standout one?
Speaker 3:yes, I just received some feedback from somebody at work who I've been working with, and when we talked about the, the metaphorical paved stones that tripped me up, this gentleman had been tripped up by the same paving stones and I'd managed just to be linked in with him at the right time at the right moment and identified some of the problems that he was dealing with, and we created a real bond. Nice and I shared openly some of the challenges that I had and we really formed an element of our relationship of trust to the extent as we, as he, started to build himself back. Um, yeah, there was some avenues that I saw him going down and I could see so, like some of the pitfalls, and I tried to explain to him just to take things slowly. Sometimes we can get overexcited with our plans, our recovery, our direction, yeah, and you just need to do things slowly and steadily because, as you mentioned earlier that there are peaks and troughs and they're they're, they're the danger points.
Speaker 3:Even so, like the peaks, if you don't manage those properly, peaks don't always last. Yeah, that's right, you need to just try and select consistently, just manage things. To the extent where you offered to, uh, apply for some roles, um, and I told him that I didn't think at this moment in time that was the best uh choice for him and we talked through that and we explored like longer term views and he wasn't too very happy with selling the feedback, but it is this choice what he wants to do. He decided to go without the plan that we had and he's just gone from strength to strength to strength and, as I said before, he reached out last week and he's just been promoted within the company and I am so immensely proud of this gentleman who's just become a real asset to himself, to his family and to the business.
Speaker 2:Oh my God, that is just incredible to hear, and they're those pinch me moments, really, where you probably don't always recognize the impact that you do have on others. And I think, when you're thinking about what you said there the being able to show vulnerability, being able to build or rebuild trust are some key skills that we all need to have. I suppose you then, because of the work you've done yourself, have to have that level of self-belief to know that you can be vulnerable or you can have that honest conversation with somebody in the right way to enable them to, I suppose, learn and grow themselves. And your ability to keep on learning in various forms, whatever works for you, has just shown that with hard work and dedication and tenacity, it does pay off. And I suppose if we were to look at your own workplace loads and relate them back to Star Wars and some of the characters, I suppose who, for you, would represent having good self-belief and who would not have it and why would you say that? Okay, so prime example.
Speaker 3:Empire Strikes Back. Okay, I'll take you to the, the dagger bar system, okay, where luke skywalker is being identified as having midichlorines in his blood system. With the midichlorines in the blood system is what the uh depicts how strong of a jedi you are. Uh, that test I don't think is available on the NHS, is it not?
Speaker 2:No, we can't get that. We might get it on Pupa, but definitely not in the NHS.
Speaker 3:And this was identified by another great leader, obi-wan Kenobi, who identified the strength or the opportunities in Luke and advised him to go and do some training with Master Yoda. Yes, and there's a scene in there where Yoda's trying to teach Luke to use his mind, to be the power. And he asked him to raise this X-Wing spaceship out of the water. And Luke's trying to do it, yeah, and he can't do it. He says that it's too, it's too big for me, it's too big for me. And Yoda comes out with a line of uh, judge me by my size, you must not got you. And and he then raises the, the spaceship, out of the, out of the water, yeah, and he says to Luke he says that the problem, um, I'll not, I'll not do any more. Yoda quotes in my voice he says the problem is not that you can't do it, it's. The problem is you don't believe, and that was always like a big turning point for me. To to believe is the battle. Once you believe, then you're away.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's so true, isn't it? Cause you have to believe you can rather than you can't, cause if you can't you won't Right. So, thinking about that, but I love that and I remember that now you've been talking about that and it is those, I think, they give you those little moments of belief, believing you, and I think you can carry that through into everyday work life as well. But who do you think has not got good self-belief? And why, would you say from those characters, because there was thousands of characters that you could probably pick on. Is there one that stands out for you? Probably not, because they wrote it in a way that was very get your thinking right.
Speaker 3:well, I mean, if you're talking about so like true self-belief, I mean it has to be darth vader, doesn't he? Because he yeah he was what one of the good guys, um, but he just didn't have self-belief in, in the force, in what was good and righteous. And he, yeah, and he turned to the the dark side. For, yeah, the path don't ever turn to the uh, the dark side, or the path will never, never end, so to speak, and that's why he, yeah.
Speaker 2:He then tried to bolster his own belief in his own ego with so like, uh, evil yeah, definitely, and I know we've talked about this before around ego and how it can really destroy you as an individual, and you can see that with people around you, right? But yeah, so I suppose, how does self-belief then have a part to play in maintaining that harmony between highs and lows for you, would you say so?
Speaker 3:if you don't have self-belief, you'll spend an awful lot of time thinking about what you're good at, what you're not good at, what you can do, what you can't do, why you can't do this, and you can spend the need of the whole day doing that. During that time you've spent looking at this like, then, the negative aspects of not believing in yourself is you've missed the opportunity to to reach out and build relations with people, to actually do the right thing, to set the set, the plan. So it's a, it's a self-perpetuating prophecy like, yeah, once you, just once you go down that path of disbelief, you, you never break the vicious circle to actually spend on that and the positiveness. So yeah, and and and, as I said, like it's an act and point is, once you break that you, you believe in yourself, then you can start building the relationships. And when you start building the relationships, they can start doing stuff for you and then you can start being more successful, and then it just rolls on.
Speaker 2:Just keeps going, which is fascinating. Do you think that this is a bit of a curveball question? Do you think there's any relation between and not to be ages but age? Does that have something to do with self-belief? Or, in your experience as a manager leader, you've worked with a huge range of ages, right, yeah, Would you say it was particular, or is it across all? What would you say it isn't?
Speaker 3:and it isn't. So I'll try and quantify that. For me, age is important only because time has given me the opportunities to to learn, but it's also given us the opportunities to to fail. Yeah, it's so. That might be sort of.
Speaker 3:Some younger people may unfortunately have had, like some, some challenges going along, but it's just just so, like data-driven percentages, you've got more chances of making mistakes, having problems as you get older, but learning from them, and I think one of the biggest things I learned and it was a real big thing when we talk about the harmonies of managing the highs and the lows is problems are only a moment in time. Once you understand that or you accept that, it makes life so much easier. And when you are in the lows, you think okay, this is where this is where I am at the minute. Yeah, I'll just stay true to my, my values, and my values will, as they always do, drive you through to the other side yeah, yeah, and that's a level of great level of self-awareness to catch it when you're in that low and know that it is.
Speaker 2:You know, no feeling is fine, all right, it's not going to last forever. But that ability to um recognize that in the first place and put measures into place to help you navigate your way through it, um is it's fascinating, isn't? When you start to break us down as humans. Um, and thinking about it was so, how do you keep your own self-belief topped up? You said you had feedback earlier which reminded you that you're obviously doing something right.
Speaker 3:I'd say self-belief is very much, uh, an active muscle in in you, in who you are. So it's like going to the gym, is you might be able to?
Speaker 3:I can't think of weights because I don't live with you might be able to lift a lot of weight a lot of weight, a lot, but then if you stop going to the gym, then your ability to lift that is diminished over time. And it's very much the same with self-belief. You have to be disciplined and you have to keep on with it. So I have two golden rules. In the morning I wake up and I do my gratitude for what I'm happy, for what I'm happy with and what am I going to achieve. And then, just as equally important is I unfortunately have quite a long drive home and I use that for myself self-reflection you have to reflect on what's gone well, what hasn't gone well, why hasn't it gone well? What can you do better? How are you going to settle? What have you learned? So gratitude in the morning and self-reflection in the evenings.
Speaker 2:That's really nice and I suppose you can see it for what it it is what's in front of you and be able to know what you can do differently next time and what you will try different or not, as the case may be. From there, how do you help somebody in your team explore it for themselves? You that you know you were supporting someone, they right time, right place, you could watch them and you were able to help them. But how else do you encourage your teams over the years to have had that self-belief? What do you do as a great manager, leader, for them?
Speaker 3:so my current team's motto is to to engage, enable and empower. Yeah, I live by those three phrases, and anybody in my team who doesn't have those tattooed on a part of their body is a disappointment to me I'll better get that one sorted out then, no so.
Speaker 3:So what it is, it's around engagement. So that's open up the lines of communication and that's where the trust elements come in. Yes, uh, the real, real crux of a relationship, relationship, the enabling, is then the skill sets. So I need to, uh, train them, they need to upskill themselves, we need to understand what, what it is that they need, and then the most powerful and empowering bit is the empowerment to go out and to do, the empowerment to go out and make the mistakes. Making mistakes is the empowerment to go out and to do, the empowerment to go out and make the mistakes. Making mistakes is the biggest teaching that you can have. And I know you also say, unless you're challenging yourself, you're not learning.
Speaker 2:No, you're definitely not, and you become a bit stale and complacent and rot away if we're not careful, isn't it? Go from that or go somewhere else. So I suppose, when you're thinking about those top three tips, I suppose for other managers, leaders around the empower and engage and enable, engage, enable empower people to do that. What impact, if you are consciously doing that with you and your teams, does that have on your own mind, health and sense of well-being? If you know that that's how you're living your life, how does that make you feel? When you know that you are doing that for your team, other managers should be doing it for their team. If they're not, then they get on the bus and make it happen, yeah, and then it's thinking how does that? By doing that, being able to know that you're doing that, how does that impact on your mind, health and well-being generally?
Speaker 3:massively. I mean, that's why I do do this job. I have a team of like 4,000 plus people and, as you can imagine, with that size of team, there's wow, there's problems come and there's challenges come and there's disappointments come. Yeah, um. But but I know that by by doing what I do, I make a difference to people and that's why I do what I do. That's why I was so, um pleased when, when we got to do the purpose and values courses together. That's why it was such a big thing to me, because, yeah, that gives me some form of my purpose and what I need what I'd like to do best yeah and have your.
Speaker 2:I remember those workshop. They were super powerful and you know just, and to be able to facilitate, I say with you and some of the others that did facilitate, it was just that moment in time that I think is just groundbreaking and I have to big, big shout out to Heathrow for enabling me to be a facilitator of those as well, for them, on their behalf. But I think, when we look back at that and think about our purpose and what our values are, has your purpose evolved since then or is it the same as it was?
Speaker 3:No, I don't think it's evolved or changed, but it took us a while to under understand it, to play around with it. The purpose and values course was like massively, massively powerful. When we talk about self-belief, I don't think you can really have self-belief unless you understand what you're about and that comes down to your values and your purpose. I may have changed the words a bit, but the crux of it is is about just making sure that I'm happy and just trying to make other people happy, and that is as simple as it is yeah, a bit like yoda's quotes.
Speaker 2:Right, they're very, very profound but super simple. They're not super complicated, are they? And I and I think that was going back to our star wars theme that was something that I always resonated with me when you saw, put the quotes in and they come up and go oh my god, that makes so much sense. And I suppose you know he lived on purpose, didn't he? I believe. So good old.
Speaker 3:Yoda, you would or not, there is no try.
Speaker 2:Hey, that's my best one, yeah, and I still get people challenging me on that and go yeah, but if you don't try, you'll never know. I said you've got one to try in the first place, you know, so you've got to just do it and give it a go. As you said, learn, learn from those mistakes and not be afraid of them, I suppose, and find a different way of mind talk, which is obviously what he does and it's just a mindset and the terminology of the words, and I know it's really small, just like pick, pick up on words.
Speaker 3:But I remember when we used to do the, the leadership courses, yeah, uh, with some of the the teams that we had, and yeah, and you said what are you, what are you going to do? And I said I'm going to try and do this. Are you going to try to do it or are you going to do it? And I was like oh, yeah, yeah, and I still do that today, do you?
Speaker 2:I love that. I love that I was working with somebody else who is now no longer at Heathrow and I was running a workshop with his team that I hadn't met the whole of his team before at all, and one of the questions I asked them at some point was what are you thinking, how are you feeling? And they all looked at him and went is this where you got it from? He's always asking us that question. I'll go, yeah, probably.
Speaker 2:It's so funny, but it's things that stick with you, isn't it? And then you can instill that and pass it on to others as well, which I think is so, so important from there. So I suppose thinking about what it is that I mean, you've already given us some quotes out of the Star Wars film. Is there one in particular that always resonates with you and reminds you to keep on believing in yourself? And also so that's the first bit, but also, secondly, does it, how does it get you out of that low into that high? Is there some particular mantras, if you like, that always come through your head?
Speaker 3:so some, some context to the dead jedi structure. So you have okay, thank you, you have. You have the jedi. It's just like an organization. They have structures of select importance. So they have, yeah, the jedi council, followed by the jedi masters, and then the, the jedis, and then the padawans who were the trainers, and there was a jedi master who trained under yoda, called qui-gon jinn.
Speaker 3:Okay, his phrase that I pick up and I use constantly is around your focus determines your reality. Ooh, that's nice. So it doesn't matter how much of a low that you're in if you want to get out of there, the power's in you to do that. So, whatever you focus to do, you can't do. And people who say, oh, we can't do that, then it's quite simple, then your focus isn't enough. Yeah, I mean Arnold Schwarzenegger used to say, I mean it's quite simple, then your focus isn't isn't enough. Yeah, I mean arnott swartzenegger used to say, I mean it's been a bit extreme, but arnott swartzenegger used to say, like, if you, if you, if you need to refer to black pan b, plan a wasn't good enough, you should never have a plan. I mean, I wouldn't go as far as that.
Speaker 2:But yeah, he was on it.
Speaker 2:He was on a mission yeah and if you, to get you out, you know, move you from the lows to the highs again. Apart from that, I think that's an amazing quote and you could use that in editing. Is there another that you would go into and think about that? You know, sometimes teams pick up on that right. So if you're using that and whilst people go, oh, here we go again, it it just to stop and think about what those words mean and the impact that it has. We interpret it in our way, right, depending on what we need. So is there another one that you always refer back to as well, like a go-to?
Speaker 3:as a quote, not to answer that one gets us out of jail most times, but I think the self, the self reflection and and self-resilience and self-awareness is around when, when you get like, that is just the strength to just stop. Yeah, that's nice, stop what you're doing and just start reflecting and and think yeah I love that and thinking about your.
Speaker 2:I suppose if you were to speak to your younger self when you first got into your role as a manager, first way back when, what would you say to that nigel that you learned over the years, the wisdom you would now have given to that young Nigel starting again, what would you have said to him Start trying to be somebody else, be yourself.
Speaker 3:Really simple. It's easier said than done without having somebody to mentor you through to what that actually means, which, then, is about learning what your values are and your purpose. But, honestly, when you understand what your values are, what your purpose is in life, it's just so easy. It doesn't matter what problem you you've gotten, you don't know what the answer is. You just reflect back to your values, yeah, um, and that'll give you some guidance on what, what, what you really know to be the the right course of action yeah, and it gives steers you in that right direction.
Speaker 2:Right, and doesn't get you off course or anything from there. Yeah, so I suppose thinking about managers, if you were to pass on some advice to them, you know, thinking about other managers, leaders around that maybe haven't explored as much about themselves as you have and understand what it means for you. What would your advice be to them?
Speaker 3:That's a really good question that I would probably just try and sell it. Engage and coach with them to understand what, what's, what's important to, yeah, to to them, to to make sure that everybody knows that we're all different, never to look at other people, what they've got to be so like. It again comes down to gratitude just be grateful for what you are, who you are, yeah, and and I think some of this the lack of belief sometimes I'm trying to think of the phrase imposter syndrome.
Speaker 3:Oh, yeah when people say, like, have an imposter syndrome. And I have people, when I've promoted people and they say, oh, I'm not, I'm not too sure you, I can do this. I don't know why and it's around you. Do you have an element and trust in me? Because you've come to work for me? So i'd'd like to think that you do. And they would say, yep, I trust you emphatically and I say, well, trust me, I know I've made the right decision and they just have to believe and then you just have to take them on that journey. There's a lot of engagement that has to be done throughout those stages of development, but there just needs to be that tipping point where they start to self-believe and you can see that with the responses and the emails and when they start pushing back and the challenging and you think, yep, my work here is done.
Speaker 2:Exactly. I can carry on my journey now into the next person, into another galaxy, somewhere else from around it, and I just think this has been really cool. I'm so delighted to have you to be able to talk to you about it, because I think you know, sometimes you underestimate the impact that you've had on people, and certainly in my time of working with people that have come across you and worked, your name always comes up as somebody that people look up to, and you've inspired others to do stuff that they may never have done before, and I think when you have that ability to empower others through yourself, without even realising it, I think it's such a great quality to have, and I suppose it's you know what would keep you going, doing what you do, what would keep you doing and doing it.
Speaker 3:Just making a difference, genuinely, when people say, say oh, what makes you happy? And it's literally just making a difference, and the young gentleman who sent us the yeah, the feed feedback, just just for those those moments, uh, just giving that feedback. It's just so powerful. It's just a reminder because sometimes you can get lost in the problem solving or the solution problems. If anybody does feel like they have been affected or supported, just remember that that individual does need a little bit of feedback. It's just to make sure that they know that they're going in the right direction. Yeah, definitely.
Speaker 2:So, Nige, you're obviously you know. As I said, you've inspired others, probably without even realizing it, and shown them the way. How do people maybe reach out to you if they wanted to sort of tap into your knowledge or your wisdom so you can guide them in the right way? How can people find you?
Speaker 3:I'm I'm a little bit of a luddite when it comes to social media, so I have an instagram page that I shared with my dog, which I don't think is really useful, but probably LinkedIn, yeah cool. Linkedin would be the easiest way to reach out and then hopefully build up some relations or answer some questions, if anybody has.
Speaker 2:And I don't think there's any other Nigel Snowballs on there.
Speaker 3:Are there Uniquely only me in this world.
Speaker 2:There is only you. That's what I remembered from before. I think there was a conversation we had about that. There is only one of you and that, well, I suppose that sums up the whole thing about having the forces within you right and keeping your self-belief is super cool, so you can continue to do what you do. But, nigel, I just want to say a massive thank you for your time and taking that time out of your massive role and engaging with others, and I think that whole piece of you know that enablement, that engagement and that empowerment is such a good message to carry forward and applying it in every avenue. So I just want to say a massive thank you for your time and, yeah, we look forward to chatting to you again at some point. Thank you very much.
Speaker 3:I appreciate being offered the opportunity to have this chat.
Speaker 2:Oh, I love it. Thanks, night, you will look after yourself. Thank you bye. So, law, what did you think?
Speaker 1:oh, what, what? I mean that that is the, the snowball effect. There's an actual thing.
Speaker 2:Isn't it the snowball effect? It's the snowball effect.
Speaker 1:Yeah and just like the snowball effect, gathering momentum, you know it's just can be incredibly reassuring sometimes to listen to someone else talk about their workplace lows and what their work that they've done, from a self-belief point of view. I think my main takeaways and I'll link to my secret is just Nigel's humility, his honesty, but also his hopefulness, for actually you can turn things around and you can make a positive change, but it doesn't have to be anything enormous, just one step at a time. And it's the snowball effect, that compound effect. So, yeah, what did you value? What did you enjoy?
Speaker 2:I, yeah, I just enjoyed talking to him, especially around how important purpose is for him and values, and how he makes decisions consciously, makes decisions that fit what's right for him and what I also love. He's never shied away from. Now he understands who he is and has the belief in himself to do difficult conversations, challenging things, feeding up, feeding down. It just becomes part of who he is and I suppose, to use the Mandalorian quote, this is the way. That's it. I think this is the way and the minute we understand ourselves and know what we can do, yeah, well, this is the way. So it was just brilliant to chat with him and Purpose and Values he spoke so passionately about that and you probably underestimate that ability to look at self first, to understand self well, enables you to live a greater, better life as well. So it was amazing. Yeah, it was really good.
Speaker 1:So my share the secret would be twofold, actually, Number one if there is someone with whom has had a positive impact on you, share that secret with them. Don't keep it secret.
Speaker 1:Let them know, as Nigel said, you know it's that feedback is often, you know, that real sort of motivational fuel and if you've got a wobbly friend or teammate, get them to listen to this, have their own snowball effect. Listen to Nigel, and just to know that, you know workplace lows well. You don't get the highs without the lows, otherwise it would just be a plateau. So you know this too shall pass, Debs. What's your call to action? So we turn this from chit, chat and conversation into tangible. Practical action To tangible.
Speaker 2:I think I'm going to pick up. What Nigel actually did was to look at what's important really important for him and start to identify the values that enable him to make the right decisions in the right way with the right people. So I would do some work around your value set and really explore and I know we actually have a handout and a document that we use where people start to shape their values. So if anybody is interested in starting to explore themselves and look at who they are in their own self-belief, then just drop us an email and we can send you that document so you can get working on your own values and live on purpose.
Speaker 1:Love it, debs. So you know, you have that moment where someone says it's time to book your performance appraisal. Who's walking down the corridor to you? Is it Darth Vader or Princess Leia? And if it feels like it's a bit more Darth Vader, then tune into our next week's episode, which is going to be about a Rebel Alliance approach to performance appraisals, and we're going to turn it on its head. So this doesn't have to be a Darth Vader inspired performance appraisal.
Speaker 1:When you find yourself getting hot under the collar and then getting burnt, we're going to look at what does it actually mean to have a really healthy approach to performance management, and that's going to be with one of our wonderful HR friends who's going to be our guest of that, so can't wait for that one, debs.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it'd be good, me neither. So, yeah, looking forward to seeing you on the other side, lauren, talking about that Seeing you on the other side.
Speaker 1:Love you lots. Have a fab week. Love you. Bye. We hope you've enjoyed this podcast. We'd love to hear from you. Email us at contact at secretsfromacoachcom, or follow us on Insta or Facebook. If you're a Spotify listener, give us a rating, as it's easier for people to find us, and if you want to know more, visit our website wwwsecretsfromacoachcom and sign up for our newsletter here to cheer you on and help you thrive in the ever-changing world of work. Bye.