Recessions make business growth challenging – but not impossible. On this episode of The Catalyst by Softchoice, Jason Brommet, Head of Modern Work and Security at Microsoft, returns to the podcast to lay out 3 strategies to help businesses thrive during an economic downturn. From engaging people to closing skills gaps and making things simpler using new AI tools, learn what you need to succeed at doing more with less. Together Cheryl and Jason compare today's situation with the Great Recession of 2008, debate whether the pandemic gave technology leaders a head start, and look into the potential of AI tools, including Microsoft 365 Copilot.
Featuring:
Jason Brommet, Head of Modern Work and Security for Microsoft North America.
The Catalyst by Softchoice is the podcast shining a light on the human side of technology.
This episode of The Catalyst by Softchoice is sponsored by Microsoft 365. See how Softchoice and Microsoft, together, can help your business Do More With Less: https://www.softchoice.com/m365
Recessions make business growth challenging – but not impossible. On this episode of The Catalyst by Softchoice, Jason Brommet, Head of Modern Work and Security at Microsoft, returns to the podcast to lay out 3 strategies to help businesses thrive during an economic downturn. From engaging people to closing skills gaps and making things simpler using new AI tools, learn what you need to succeed at doing more with less. Together Cheryl and Jason compare today's situation with the Great Recession of 2008, debate whether the pandemic gave technology leaders a head start, and look into the potential of AI tools, including Microsoft 365 Copilot.
Featuring:
Jason Brommet, Head of Modern Work and Security for Microsoft North America.
The Catalyst by Softchoice is the podcast shining a light on the human side of technology.
This episode of The Catalyst by Softchoice is sponsored by Microsoft 365. See how Softchoice and Microsoft, together, can help your business Do More With Less: https://www.softchoice.com/m365
[00:00:00] Cheryl: This episode of The Catalyst is brought to you by Microsoft 365. In today's economic climate, we're all being asked to do more with less. See how Softchoice in Microsoft 365 can help you cut costs, simplify it, and improve security. Visit Softchoice.com/m 365 today. Welcome back to another episode of the Catalyst by Softchoice, the podcast dedicated to exploring the intersection of people and technology. I am your host Cheryl Stookes.
News clip plays in the background
Speaker 1: It was the worst day on Wall Street since the crash of 1987.
Speaker 2: Traders here working the phone say a lot of their customers are freaked out waiting to see how low or down it will go.
Speaker 3: Let's talk about the speed with which we are watching this market deteriorate.
Speaker 4: It's the heightened financial turmoil that we have experienced of late may well lengthen the period of week economic performance and further increase the risk to growth
Speaker 5: Life, as most Americans know, it is about to change in some cases dramatically.
[00:01:06] Cheryl: Some of us working in the technology industry may remember just how much life changed during the great recession of 2008, and let's just say those aren't the fondest memories. Waves of layoffs and intense tightening of IT budgets, major innovation projects all thrown on the chopping block.
[00:01:28] Cheryl: It's been nearly 15 years since the collapse and wow, have things changed? We've just emerged from the worst of a global pandemic, a crisis that prompted businesses to embark on the largest joint technological experiment of all time. And if that wasn't enough, groundbreaking advancements in artificial intelligence seem ready to radically transform everything about the way we live and work.
[00:01:56] Cheryl: But as much as things have changed, it feels like history might be repeating itself all over again.
News clip plays in the background
Speaker 1: Yet another alarm bell sounded off on global recession this time.
Speaker 2: The International Monetary Fund, is warning that up to one third of the global economy is in danger. We've got China, the EU, and the US all slowing down this year, and this is expected to produce a real ripple effect.
Speaker 3: The risks of recession are rising.
[00:02:23] Cheryl: With the ongoing talk of a looming recession, here's what I really want to know. Will we see a repeat of 2008 or this time will things be different? I can't think of a guest better suited to have this discussion with us today than Jason Brommet. Jason is the Chief Operating Officer for Microsoft's Modern Work and Surface Business for Microsoft North America.
[00:02:47] Cheryl: He leads the go-to-market strategy for all product lines, including the Microsoft 365 portfolio. The last time we met Jason on the show, he helped us define what the future of hybrid work looks like. Today we're going to ask him how business and technology leaders can learn from the past and get ready for a potential recession.
[00:03:08] Cheryl: Oh, and don't worry, we're going to spend a lot of time talking about all things OpenAI, ChatCPT and what this bold new world of automation means to both businesses and people in the months ahead. Jason Brommet, welcome to the show. Hi Jason. How are you?
[00:03:27] Jason: I'm great Cheryl. How are you?
[00:03:28] Cheryl: I'm good. So I did my homework this morning and I went back and listened to the interview that you did in September, 2022 with Erika. So I feel extra excited for our conversation today. Looking forward to the discussion.
[00:03:42] Jason: Yeah, me too.
[00:03:43] Cheryl: So speaking of history, our team dug up a quote of yours from 14 years ago with the Channel Daily News. So this was from 2008 and back when we were in the middle of the 2008 financial crisis. And here's what Jason Brommet had to say back then.
[00:04:04] Cheryl: “With strained IT budgets, everything is going to be under the microscope.” So my first question for you, Jason, is are you feeling any deja vu and how does the current economic climate remind you of what we were all facing all that many years ago?
[00:04:22] Jason: Thanks Cheryl, for starting, uh, and dating me. I wasn't expecting that right out of the gates.
[00:04:27] Jason: And so, uh, love it. Uh, geez, I guess I should make sure that I go back and remember exactly what I said all those many years ago. Maybe I'll start here, which is intrinsically, uh, the. The business environment, the economic environment is subject to cycles. There's no question about it. And so is it deja vu?
[00:04:44] Jason: Sure. Uh, in some ways it is, but I also think it's just sort of the natural occurrence that we see in business, uh, broadly and, and I'll call it in the economies. In many ways with that as sort of a frame of reference, it does have a lot of, I'll call it capability or likeness to what we saw back in 2008.
[00:05:02] Jason: It's an opportunity for organizations to sort of pause, reassess what it is that they're doing, where do they continue to invest. And I'd say more importantly is technology has come so far since 2008, and so its potential to drive value for organizations. Is infinitely more than it was back 14 years ago.
[00:05:22] Jason: But at the core, do some of those fundamentals remain the same? Without question, it's about how do we manage cost? How do we think about innovation? How do we think about driving efficiency in our organizations? And so this idea of do more with less is certainly not new. It is something that is frankly existed for decades and generation.
[00:05:40] Jason: It just looks different in terms of the, what is it that we can do more with. To be able to do less with at the same time. And so yes, a little bit of deja vu I think to be expected will continue to emerge over time. But again, I think it's a great opportunity for organizations to reflect on what they're doing and what the opportunities are that are in front of them.
[00:06:00] Cheryl: It’s interesting if we think about where we are today, sitting here in 2023 relative to the 2008 financial crash, one of the biggest obvious differences is the pandemic. Here we are three years in, that just prompted major technological investments into everything from remote work, to security. I mean, the list goes on.
[00:06:23] Cheryl: Mm-hmm. I'm curious, Jason, as you think about where we are here in 2023, do you think that COVID-19 has made businesses better prepared to take on a looming recession?
[00:06:34] Jason: It's such a good question. I don't know that it is equitably answered for every organization and perhaps every industry.
[00:06:42] Jason: Without question I think Covid and the Pandemic and its sort of ramifications were a much needed catalyst for organizations to innovate faster in many ways. None of us signed up to participate in what is frankly the largest work from home experiment. And with it itch on a bright light on all the things that we're working, things that weren't working, uh, and more importantly, the things that we need to think about moving forward.
[00:07:05] Jason: What I do think it absolutely did in enabling organizations to be better prepared is looking at some of those fundamentals, which is, do we have the tools and the technology wired into our organization that enables us to work through, no matter what comes at us and listen, obviously the pandemic was significant on so many dimensions, but it could be a natural disaster tomorrow.
[00:07:28] Jason: And not to be a doomsday or by any stretch of imagination, but it's got a lot of likeness to it. And so as organizations have thought about different technology to deploy, uh, different business processes, different business policies, I do think it creates a platform that that enables for that natural ebb and flow that says, as economies or industry shrink or expand, you're able to scale up and scale down.
[00:07:50] Jason: And so as organizations innovated frankly to navigate in, in many ways, survive through the pandemic, those same capabilities that they have infused inside their organization will now carry through in an economic environment that allows for that scale up and scale down with much more agility than we would've seen in the past.
[00:08:08] Cheryl: It's interesting, there's just so many layers to this and, and I'd love to just talk a little bit about probably what's on everybody's mind right now. And I feel like we've been a week away from a major recession now for about a year. Mm-hmm. Um, so it's certainly been ingrained in our, in our minds and we're all preparing, you know, internally, organizationally, but we're also certainly seeing it with interest rates and there's a lot of work to do.
[00:08:32] Cheryl: If we do end up having a recession, to the extent that the media would suggest that we are, can you break down two or three areas that you think businesses will need to focus on in the year ahead to, to make it through what are certainly uncertain times?
[00:08:47] Jason: Absolutely. I'll start with maybe the most humane of it, which is us as humans.
[00:08:52] Jason: Again, the pandemic and any of these moments of uncertainty create a lot of angst for us As, as people, you ask any business leader and their people are their most valuable asset, and so as you try to navigate a path forward, I. You've gotta really be thinking about your people. That is about how do you empower them?
[00:09:07] Jason: Are you, uh, provisioning them with the right tools, the right technology, the clarity, the culture, all of those capabilities. Wellbeing is one of the ones that is certainly, I'll call it really emerged and, and frankly is much needed, a brighter spotlight on it, um, that we saw, obviously through the pandemic.
[00:09:23] Jason: But this idea of how do I inspire my people to work in sustainable ways? How are you empowering them? How are you connecting them to your purpose, your value, your organization, your mission, your. Goals, all of those things. The second big one is this opportunity to really be reflective to say, how do I reduce complexity and redundancy in our organization?
[00:09:43] Jason: And technology spend is one of those categories. There's no question about it. Regardless of what category of software or tech you wanna look at, many organizations have multitudes of vendors to solve for very specific, narrow use cases, but you've really got this opportunity to think more, I'll call it platform wide, which is as we invest in platforms, Are we taking advantage of all of the capability that exists in those platforms that would then enable us to turn off some of those redundant cost heavy, uh, capabilities that are existing in your organization?
[00:10:15] Jason: And anytime you end up with multiples of the same thing is you're also just creating complexity. And in many cases, especially with the rise in cybersecurity, you're often also increasing risk. The last one that certainly, I'll say a hot topic in the industry broadly, and frankly I'll call it the worldwide, is how do we use and take advantage of advances in things like artificial intelligence and automation?
[00:10:38] Jason: As I often talk about in in large group settings, small group settings. The one thing that is most infinite for us as humans, going back to my first comment is time. We never have enough of it and it's fixed in finite. We have this amazing opportunity to leverage advances in AI and automation to give us, as humans time back so that we shift from some of the monotonous, lower value work into the higher value sort of creative work.
[00:11:06] Jason: Uh, I often will joke with customers as I do presentations and sometimes I put a picture of the terminator as one of my opening slides. Cause I'm often asked the question which is, Hey, are robots going to take over? And deeply, I believe they are not. But is there certain work that we should take more advantage of computing power to enable us to participate in Without question.
[00:11:26] Jason: And then you go overlay that with the people strategy statement, which is we also are facing a skill shortage in the world, and certainly here in Canada, uh, particularly acute in certain industries and certain disciplines. And so AI and automation can help us actually fill some of those skill gaps that we have.
[00:11:43] Jason: And so as you think about security, the ability for computers to process all of the threats that may be coming into an organization. Machines can do that at a much more efficient rate and effective rates than we can as humans. And so it's no longer now about having to go fill all of those skills gaps.
[00:12:00] Jason: It's actually being able to take advantage of AI and automation to do a lot of that work for us, and again, giving us back the time, giving us the security perimeters that we would want. And so that would be the third big one. That particularly is really hot right now.
[00:12:13] Cheryl: What I would really like to do, is dig into one of the things that you said right out of the gate.
[00:12:18] Cheryl: You talked about reducing complexities and reducing overspending. From your perspective here, just how much are businesses overspending on unnecessary technologies, and how widespread do you think this problem is?
[00:12:33] Jason: Wow. It's such a hard question to answer in terms of how much, uh, but let me give you some sort of frames of reference in, in a number of the, the categories that I'm certainly a little more familiar with.
[00:12:44] Jason: Back to that sort of first area around people strategy. As we've done research as Microsoft, uh, as I've engaged with customers, and the data would generally say that most organizations have somewhere between five to 10 different tools in place that they believe are contributing to the employee experience.
[00:13:01] Jason: Now if I go and change my hat, I'll say and put myself as an employee in any organization or as a consumer. We know what it feels like to have, to context switch across 10 different apps. Most people with, you'll open up their browser and they've got a favorites list that's a mile long cuz they can't remember what tool they need to go to, to do what thing.
[00:13:20] Jason: Whether it's requesting vacation, booking travel, submitting expenses, approving invoices, communicating with your organization, your leaders. That's just not a great employee experience. And so when you anchor back on those three areas of opportunity, why would you go create that complexity? Why would you not want to just create a great unifying employee experience by simplifying the number of tools that you have?
[00:13:43] Jason: So that's on one side. If we think about sort of the employee side of it, I'll flip that over and, and talk about security because again, incredibly hot topic in the industry right now as we look at just the rise of sort of cybersecurity risk. Again, the research that we've done generally says, and again this varies a little bit between size of organization of an SMB to a large enterprise on the low end.
[00:14:04] Jason: Many companies just don't have a security strategy, which is deeply, deeply alarming. But as you move up, it's not uncommon to see 30, 40 different security tools employed in a single organization and listen, while as an industry, we have a responsibility to think that our customers do not have a homogeneous environment.
[00:14:24] Jason: They have a heterogeneous environment. But when you try to wire 30 or 40 different tools together with different teams monitoring and managing it in different ways, you are also probably creating risk, which is the vectors that you are not protecting are exposed in between the cracks of those 30 or 40 different vendors.
[00:14:42] Jason: And so that's not necessarily it in, I'll say monetary terms of how much they're overspending, but it gives you a sense of just the number of tools that we often see in specific categories. To the comment that I made in there. It's widespread, it is applicable, I'll call it, in every industry, every size of organization.
[00:14:59] Jason: It just sort of becomes this multiple of, um, that really becomes the question. Uh, again, small businesses in many ways don't think about technology as the first thing that they invest in. And in many cases, we want to be able to alleviate some of that expectation of them, which is we want them to be inspired to be great.
[00:15:15] Jason: Service providers or bakeries or manufacturers, we don't want them to be technology providers. That's really what the cloud is there and, and really as a HyperCloud provider, we wanna focus on. Um, but no matter the industry or the size, I see it all day long. Every conversation I get into, it's like, well, I've got five different tools to do this.
[00:15:33] Jason: I've got three different tools to do this. I've got 20 to do this. Can you help simplify? And that's really, I think the responsibility and the opportunity that we have working with our customers across Canada that were us, and frankly, around the world.
[00:15:45] Cheryl: Now I absolutely cannot have this conversation with you today without asking you about what's on everybody's mind, and that is ChatGPT.
[00:15:55] Cheryl: It's interesting, earlier today I listened to an interview with Adam Grant. I'm a huge Adam Grant fan, and he recently on his podcast, did an interview with the AI version of himself through ChatGPT, which was, which was, I mean, I think my mind was just completely blown. So for those that have not been paying attention, to all of the news that's been going on ChatGPT, my understanding it's, it has the fastest adoption rate of any tech in history in reading all the different use cases which continue to evolve daily.
[00:16:31] Cheryl: I think what's, what's really exciting for me and and in the context of this conversation is Microsoft's roadmap with OpenAI and how that technology is going to be used to help organizations to your earlier point, do more with less. Can you tell me more about the Microsoft relationship with ChatGPT and OpenAI and where are you going with this?
[00:16:55] Jason: Yeah, so I'll say our partnership is very much with OpenAI. That being said, we want to obviously take advantage of the capabilities that artificial intelligence provisions and provides to us, but we want to do so in a way that honours customers data, uh, their privacy and their security. And so for us it's really about how do we.
[00:17:14] Jason: Partner with OpenAI and infuse that technology into our platforms. And again, there's a much longer, deeper conversation about data and privacy we won't get into today, but I, I'd simplify it in many ways as this. We think about, I'll say what we've shared as it relates to our partnership with Open AI into two categories.
[00:17:33] Jason: First is the capability in the OpenAI service is part of Azure. So customers that want to use those capabilities as a building block for a different solution or their own custom solution, we want to enable them to do that. And so you can think about, uh, customer service bots as a great example where customers may want to be able to use AI as some of that front door into their organization.
[00:17:54] Jason: Again, alleviating cost and overhead of humans answering those questions. Because again, when you think about customer service, and we can all relate as individuals and consumers, you get pattern matching, right? And that's where computers can learn, right? That's how they reason over data. And then they can be able to answer questions and alleviate so that your people, your expensive cost of humans are really only focused on the most complex of scenarios.
[00:18:18] Jason: So OpenAI as an Azure service is really intended to be a building block. That customers can take advantage of. The other side of the equation in sort of our overall portfolio is how do we actually infuse those capabilities is what I'll call finished services. And so how do we infuse them in the capabilities or the software that we already manufacture?
[00:18:37] Jason: And so a couple of great examples really under sort of this co-pilot brand that you will hear us talk about. We have talked about, we will continue to talk about. Uh, co-pilot in Viva Sales as an example. You think about most organizations have some form of a sales force. The value that we derive from our sales forces is spending time with customers.
[00:18:57] Jason: It's not administering, I'll call it paperwork and CRM systems. It's not always about authoring mails in responses to customers. And so OpenAI and the co-pilot really sort of enables users to shift from this world of AI on autopilot where it's sort of predictive text to actually AI as a co-pilot, which is actually now learning from you and enabling you to be more productive.
[00:19:19] Jason: And so being able to draft sort of initial responses back to customers. And part of this is allowing the flexibility for organizations and for users to rewrite it. Right, which is you can have AI sort of formulate the first generation of it and then be able to sort of correct it as you go to put it into your vernacular or your language.
[00:19:37] Jason: Similarly, as about 10 days ago, we announced Microsoft 365 co-pilot, which is being able to be more effective and efficient as it relates to the applications inside Microsoft 365. And so things like Word and PowerPoint, you can think about all of the content creation that we do inside those apps. Being able to use that capability to actually get us through sort of the first draft, right?
[00:19:57] Jason: Get us through some of the more mundane sort of elements so that our time is then really focused on the value add, the creative thought, and the more constructive thought around all of those capabilities. But it's also being able to thread together and connect your business data. And so part of that announcement was business chat.
[00:20:14] Jason: And so the ability to now actually use AI reasoning over your enterprise data protected, again, under those security and privacy policies, to be able to stitch pieces together to be able to say, Hey, I want to actually go and understand within the context of a specific meeting, what were all the action items that were referenced.
[00:20:30] Jason: What was a specific quote or comment that was made? Again, in many cases, I'll call it redundant, not high value work for us as humans to be able to do, where we can take advantage of computers to be able to do that work. And so those are some of the early advancements and integrations that we're building alongside our partnership with OpenAI.
[00:20:48] Jason: But there's also lots to come.
[00:20:51] Cheryl: As someone who is a writer and who has struggled through their first published book. I am, my biggest question to you was, where was this three years ago? In 2020 when I was looking to publish my first book. But no, this is, this is fantastic and, and I know you talked about some of the integration with 365, which is really exciting.
[00:21:10] Cheryl: I know there's other uses around automating code and better search.Can you. Can you maybe tell me, Jason, you know, from your perspective, you know, what are the ChatGPT cases that you're most excited about?
[00:21:23] Jason: So there's the most, I'll call it basic, uh, and none of this AI stuff is basic, just to be clear.
[00:21:29] Jason: But if I think about some of the most basic use cases, It is that knowledge work. It is that ability to go and create PowerPoint presentations or Word documents or author emails. We can use AI to get some of that work started for us, where we then think about sort of adding the, the human element to it, the creativity, et cetera.
[00:21:49] Jason: The other big piece of it is aggregating sources, right? Which is usually an AI agent to go out and pull data from various systems. So again, as humans, we aren't having to go and do this context switch and having to go search multiple places. The time spent searching for information has just been one of those productivity things that has plagued us for decades.
[00:22:08] Jason: And this is really an opportunity I think for us to start to get at that, to get some of that time back that is spent just searching for information. So that's what I'll call some of the more basic use cases, which is around how do we think about end user productivity, to be able to inspire them to do more and really have us as humans be able to add the value on the things that we are exceptionally good at.
[00:22:28] Jason: And frankly, computers just haven't learned. So that's on one side. The second is what I'll call those routine sort of capabilities or those routine tasks. And I'll use customer service as a great example. And again, we can all relate to this as consumers having to call or, or log in and open a ticket. In many cases, getting to a human is heart because there's finite capacity of human staff in customer service environments, organizations want to be able to take advantage of the humans being applied to the most critical cases or the most complex cases.
[00:22:58] Jason: You can then take all of the other stuff and have AI models learn and reason over that data to recognize the patterns and be able to surface information. I can only begin to imagine, as you think about shopping malls or restaurants, the number of phone calls that they get on, Hey, what are your hours?
[00:23:13] Jason: Where's your location? As humans, that's not something that we're going to add a ton of value to. Why not get an AI bot, I'll call it, or an AI agent to be able to answer those questions for you dramatically reduces the time spent, reduces the cost inside organizations. And so those are probably two extremes.
[00:23:30] Jason: Obviously, AI can be stretched so much further as you think about. Cognitive services and the ability to create new experiences that are more diverse and inclusive for individuals. You think about manufacturing environments where you can use image recognition to identify items coming off of a manufacturing line that are not meeting specific standards, and so you can look for anomalies using image recognition.
[00:23:53] Jason: That's, I'll say on the very far end of the extreme, uh, healthcare, another great example. The ability to have computers actually start to look at imaging, uh, x-rays, MRIs, CAT scans, and again, having learned over millions of sort of data points, being able to then have AI recognize those things that may be wrong or anomalous in any of those images.
[00:24:13] Jason: So those are the more complex, and I'll say more custom applications, but I obviously started with what I'll call some of the more basic use cases that we think, again are, are big drivers of productivity. And so I'm not under, I don't intend to undermine, I'll call it the term basic, but it's more out of the box finished goods versus creating custom experiences.
[00:24:31] Cheryl: I, I love that and I love the leveraging AI to answer frequently asked questions. I was so happy that Jason brought up OpenAI and ChatGPT topic. I admit I've gotten a bit obsessed about over the last few weeks. I see so much potential in how these technologies can help businesses stay competitive during economic challenges.
[00:24:55] Cheryl: But that had me thinking, how does Jason think automation and AI will help businesses survive economic uncertainty? And beyond all the bots, what role do humans play in it all? But before we get there, a quick word from our sponsor.
[00:25:17] Cheryl: In today's economic climate, technology leaders are under a lot of pressure. Not only do they need to accelerate innovation, they need to do it all while cutting costs and maintaining security. That might sound like an impossible feat, but you'd be surprised just how much you can get done with the tools and technologies that you already own. That's why here at Softchoice, we're making it a priority to speak with our customers about Microsoft 365 and how they can use it to do more with less.
[00:25:44] Cheryl: With Microsoft 365, your business can start to cut costs immediately by getting rid of redundant solutions you don't even need, and all the licensing headaches that come with them. You'll also be able to simplify it Management. Automating processes such as device management, onboarding and provisioning with world-class familiar tools.
[00:26:07] Cheryl: Microsoft 365 also enables you to let your people work more flexibly and securely so you can rest easy. Knowing that you're reducing your risk with a proven zero trust model. Think you can be doing more with less. We agree, and with 34 years’ experience, we can show you how. Visit us today at softchoice.com/m365 to learn more.
[00:26:34] Cheryl: That's softchoice.com/m365 to start doing more with less today.
[00:26:40] Cheryl: So if you were to, just to take a step back and look at all the uses of automation and AI in general, what would be your advice to businesses to help them figure out how do we integrate these technologies into our operations and, and where do they look to get started?
[00:26:59] Jason: There's so many good directions we can go on this. So today, AI is not new. If I think about some of the basic capabilities that we see on our phone as an example, uh, predictive text and being able to help finish sentences for us, that is AI running in the background. So that's more the autopilot versus the co-pilot side of it.
[00:27:19] Jason: We've often all had probably those experiences where autocorrect doesn't quite capture what we're trying to go do, and it sends out a mail that. It doesn't really quite make a whole lot of sense, but that's really AI infused, uh, for organizations in many cases. As I think about our, I'll say our cloud services, it requires intentionality of the organization to turn some of those capabilities on or enable them.
[00:27:40] Jason: We often refer to them as cognitive services, and so things like closed captioning inside a teams meeting, the ability to do transcripts inside a teams meeting, that is AI running in the background. But we empower customers to make the choices to whether or not to turn that on or turn it off. So that's the first piece, which is use the AI that is already available in the tools that you have at your fingertips as a way to go and make your people more productive.
[00:28:04] Jason: Automation, uh, slightly sort of different nuance on it. Where I often will challenge customers, and I'll give you a really simple example, is think about those business processes or those workflows that exist inside your organization today that are not running effectively or efficiently. One that I often love to share with customers is approvals.
[00:28:24] Jason: If you think about just approvals in its most sort of broad, generic frame of reference, whether that's uh, time sheets, whether that's vacation requests, whether that's purchase orders, whether that's invoices, whether it's contracts. You can use workflow tools. To automate that whole experience. One of the things I love being able to show customers, and I often will do this in, in larger environments using Microsoft approvals.
[00:28:50] Jason: I get notifications directly in the flow of work. And what I mean by in the flow of work is inside teams. So it's that canvas that I get all of my work done because I have access to all of the apps and data and tools that I need inside teams, but Microsoft approvals brings those into teams experience.
[00:29:05] Jason: So I'm not having to go in context, switch and navigate to a bunch of different apps. I get one notification for every type of approval that I may have as a leader. So that's purchase orders, that's vacation requests, that's invoices, that's contracts to sign, and I get it all in one. I don't have to worry about the complexity of what is the line of business system that sits in behind that somebody does.
[00:29:26] Jason: But I, as the end user, as the leader in the organization, no longer need to concern myself with that. It's that simple notification. It brings all of the data that I need to give me context on what it is that I'm reviewing, and then ultimately what it is that I'm approving. And then it manages the workflow.
[00:29:40] Jason: For me, it's about automation. It's how do we actually digitize a lot of the things that we've historically done to make them more effective and more efficient? Because we as humans are also prone to making mistakes. And so wouldn't it be cool that just says, Hey, when I need to go and initiate a work, Flow for a new purchase of something, it's all mapped out for me.
[00:29:57] Jason: So that would be a second really easy place for organizations to go start. Um, because it, it's, every organization has workflows or approvals that bog us down as humans. Then obviously as you start to get it, I'll say further along in the AI continuum in, again, similar to where I started, is add the capabilities as they become available.
[00:30:17] Jason: And then you can start as you get more mature as then start to think about sort of this building block idea, which is how do I actually go use some of these component capabilities to go solve more complex AI oriented capabilities that I may need? Uh, image recognition, any of those cognitive services, speech to text.
[00:30:33] Jason: Uh, you can kind of run the list a mile long, but that would probably be the last place because it's the more complex, but it's also the area where in many cases, some of the greatest gains can be made at the same time.
[00:30:44] Cheryl: Jason, you had me at simplifying expenses, so I'm all in. Exactly. Exactly. I mean, anything that we can do to make the things that, that are really mundane and take our time and energy, but are not a good return on time invested. It kind of leads me to my next question. You know, this is a podcast about the intersection of people in technology and every time we talk about. Technology, particularly technology is cutting edge as some of the things that we're talking about today.
[00:31:10] Cheryl: We have to keep in mind our people and people in general. Can you give our listeners a few practical ways in which they can leverage their people and the places that they work to stay ahead? Of what might be a looming recession or all the challenges we're having with remote work. I guess asked differently, Jason, what goes into a people winning strategy when it comes to all these technologies?
[00:31:34] Jason: Where I'll start maybe is I, think about three things for almost every organization to kind of go challenge. The first is mindset, which is, listen, there's lots of coverage in the press. And there, there has been, and I anticipate that there will be, which is. What does this new world of work look like? Is it return to office?
[00:31:52] Jason: Is it stay at home? Is it somewhere in between? What does that look like? But for organizations, it's really this moment in time to really challenge your mindset. And the analogy that I often give, which is for so long, we've defined work by where we go, not by what we do. And it's really this opportunity to think about sort of the workplace that has historically been this sort of primary destination to actually now shifting our mindset to say, Hey, what if we now start to make people and our employees.
[00:32:18] Jason: A mobile destination. And what does that need to sort of in inspire us in our thinking tools, technology policy process? You can kind of run the list a mile long. So that's the first piece. Mindset and what does that look like and how do you start to pull that apart and sort of challenge historical frames of reference to say, what does that need to look like moving forward.
[00:32:38] Jason: The second is around culture, and that is as much about understanding what your culture is today and how that sort of transitions to the future. It's about understanding what your historical culture is and how that influences the decisions you make, but it's also about understanding what the decisions are that you make and how that influences culture.
[00:32:55] Jason: Because in many cases, again, uh, often get pulled into great dialogues where organizations are wrestling with this while return to the workplace equals my culture. It's like, then you've got a real problem because if that's what you think is defining as your culture, I bet you your people have a different point of view.
[00:33:11] Jason: And then the third piece is technology. Uh, and yes, it, it's kind of funny that the Microsoft guy sitting here going, yeah, technology, but it's number three on the list. It is. Because if you think about technology as being the singular solution to all of this, it's not going to work. Technology is a great enabler, it's a great connector.
[00:33:28] Jason: It's what's enabled all of us to continue working through the pandemic is we had to sort of go home. But it can't be the end all and be all. So those would be sort of three big areas that I often will challenge customers to sort of be reflective around to say, hey, are you really thinking about this?
[00:33:42] Jason: Holistically in behind that, obviously one of the big ones right now is wellbeing. And how do you think about sort of a holistic approach to what does wellbeing mean for your organization and how do you inspire your people to work in, in sustainable ways, and how do we want them all to participate?
[00:33:58] Jason: We spend a lot of time thinking about knowledge workers, those people that are in the office every single day. I'll say more traditionally sort of bound to a computer, but the reality of it is, is there's an entire workforce that we generally refer to as frontline workers that exist across every, almost every industry, but they have so little of the tools and technology at their fingertips.
[00:34:16] Jason: But they are also the closest to our processes. Our core customers, our customer care, our products. They will see problems months, if not weeks, before the boardroom will. And so it's really about how do you think about every employee and how do we bring everybody along because at the end of the day, it's our employees that drive our culture.
[00:34:34] Jason: And if we don't create environments that are inclusive for everybody to fully participate, we're going to cut ourselves off. The last one that I'll just touch on very quickly, because I'd be remiss not to. And this may be a little provocative. Everyone needs to be thinking with this sort of term of flexibility front and center because it is sort of the new currency in the workplace.
[00:34:56] Jason: It is being sort of embedded into the rewriting of the contract between employee and employer. And again, you don't have to look very far in the news to say, Hey, these organizations that are mandating return to workplaces in many cases are triggering what I'll call the great resentment, which is employees pushing back against leaders going, no, I am not going to.
[00:35:16] Jason: In an environment where we are tapped for skills we can't afford to, organizations that are embracing flexibility and sort of hybrid policies and strategies are using it as a differentiator for how they recruit and retain talent. And so back to my earlier point of our people are our most valuable and important and expensive asset.
[00:35:36] Jason: It's true. And so we should be doing everything to design an environment that enables them to be their best and bring their best every single day.
[00:35:43] Cheryl: I love that, Jason. And it, it's in line with everything that I'm hearing from potential candidates that are looking at new opportunities to those that are working for organizations that are mandating.
[00:35:57] Cheryl: I would say nonsensical return to office mandates like thou Shep be in the office Tuesdays and Thursdays without any consideration to whether that is purposeful collaboration, whether or not someone's sitting to commute into an office to sit on teams meetings for the whole day. I, I'm all for purposeful collaboration and collaborating in person because I think there are just some things that are better done that way.
[00:36:20] Cheryl: But I'm also. A huge advocate of flexibility and the whole concept of work your way. So I want to go back to our September interview that we had with you on the podcast, and you mentioned that you really dislike going into the office, and so I would just love an update from you as we sit here in, in 2023.
[00:36:39] Cheryl: Has that changed? How are your feelings about going into the office these days, Jason?
[00:36:45] Jason: Oh, these things that I say that come back to haunt me. Um, listen. Not much changed. Uh, I'll be honest, I will absolutely maybe build off your last comment, Cheryl, which is, I love spending time with my people and my team and my co-workers and my friends.
[00:36:59] Jason: There's no, no debate nor question on that, but the simple realities are still true, which is the commute needs to be worth it. And if I think about the personal practices that I've developed both for myself, for my team, and for my organization. I am now at a point where they enabled me to be more productive than I ever was.
[00:37:20] Jason: Being a full-time office person, and listen, I think I've shared this with you in the past, is I defined myself as an office person and I didn't need to, but I did. But what I've learned is I can be incredibly productive. I can be incredibly connected to the organization. That doesn't necessitate me being in the office all the time.
[00:37:40] Jason: But that intentionality of when I do go into the office is so powerful. Whether it's about reconnecting with my team, whether it's reconnecting with friends, whether it's reconnecting to the leadership team, or just finding moments for those serendipitous water cooler chats, right? That intentionality on when I do make those plans, I make sure that they're super valuable.
[00:38:00] Jason: Because then the exchange is worth it, right? Again, I, I kind of think about a two-hour productivity kill of being my sort of commute to the office. That's two extra hours. I can get my own stuff done on my own time and on my own schedule, but I deeply value the time where I am in person. But I am still very much a proponent of staying at home and having the flexibility to choose when and where and how I want to work and that's the environment that I do my best. It's also an environment that I try to inspire inside my team.
[00:38:29] Cheryl: I love that, Jason, and just to end off today, first of all, thank you so much for your time. We love having you back. You're just going to have to become a regular segment for us. I appreciate you taking the time to re-join us here on the Catalyst.
[00:38:42] Cheryl: With all this talk of looming economic recession, I can't help but feel a bit of deja vu. Just like in 2008, businesses need to start reducing their spend and cutting down on waste. That's a given. But they also have an opportunity to do things differently and keep innovating. Whether it's getting ready for new AI powered capabilities or creating a fresh approach to the way that you engage and elevate your people, the potential really does feel unlimited.
[00:39:13] Cheryl: That's it for this week. If you enjoyed this episode, please tell a friend or colleague. I'm your host, Cheryl Stookes, and you've been listening to The Catalyst by Softchoice.
[00:39:27] Cheryl: This episode was brought to you by Microsoft 365. Visit softchoice.com/m365 to see how you can cut costs, simplify it, and drive security with Microsoft 365. The time is now to do more with less.