Dev Interrupted

Dev Interrupted is the go-to podcast for software engineering leadership. Each week, hosts Andrew Zigler, Ben Lloyd Pearson, and Dan Lines sit down with industry experts to explore the strategies, struggles, and stories behind high-performing software teams. Paired with weekly industry news coverage, the conversations dive deep into the real challenges that define excellence in modern tech.

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Dev Interrupted

The people-pleaser in the machine | Wayfound’s Dr. Tatyana Mamut

July 29, 2025 • LinearB • Season 5 • Episode 30

Your AI is learning to lie to you. It's not malicious—it's just trying to be a people-pleaser. This dangerous phenomenon, known as AI sycophancy, is what happens when we train models with outdated incentives.

Dr. Tatyana Mamut, an anthropologist, economist, and the CEO of Wayfound, joins us to explain why treating AI like traditional software is a critical mistake. She provides a revolutionary playbook for building AI you can actually trust, starting with how to manage AI agents like employees with clear roles, goals, and performance reviews. She then introduces the radical solution of an "AI supervisor"—an AI that manages other agents to ensure accountability. This all builds toward her vision for the "multi-sapiens workforce," where humans and AI collaborate to build the companies of tomorrow.

This is an essential guide for any leader aiming to build the culture and systems necessary to manage AI effectively.

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