ChiTuckyBourbonBrothers
The “Chitucky Bourbon Brothers” podcast, hosted by Mike Nielsen and Tony Meyers, serves as a delightful exploration of bourbon and whiskey culture, offering insightful reviews and discussions about various bourbons and whiskeys. The hosts share their passion for sipping “brown water,” a colloquial term for bourbon and whiskey, and aim to blend music with their love for these beverages, creating an engaging auditory experience for listeners. The podcast not only provides detailed reviews of different bourbons and whiskeys but also promotes a relaxed atmosphere where enthusiasts can enjoy the nuances of their favorite drinks alongside music that complements the experience.
ChiTuckyBourbonBrothers
Episode 115 - Blanton's Gold with Congressman Andy Barr
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Imagine a time when a Kentucky statesman would haul barrels of bourbon over the Appalachian Mountains to Washington DC, using America's native spirit to broker political deals. According to Congressman Andy Barr, Henry Clay's famous ability as "The Great Compromiser" had a secret ingredient: Kentucky whiskey that "lubricates the wheels of government."
This fascinating historical tidbit sets the stage for our spirited conversation with Representative Barr, who brings a special treat – Blanton's Gold Edition at 103 proof, a Congressional White Oak Caucus barrel selection. As we savor this exceptional bourbon with its honey, dried fruit, and lingering spice notes, Barr reveals the surprising intersection of bourbon and modern politics.
You'll discover two congressional caucuses you probably didn't know existed: the bipartisan Bourbon Caucus that advocates for the industry, and the White Oak Caucus working to ensure sustainable forestry for those all-important aging barrels. Barr explains how his Aged Distilled Spirits Competitiveness Act changed tax law to level the playing field for bourbon producers, and shares insights into international trade dynamics affecting Kentucky's signature export.
The conversation flows as smoothly as the bourbon itself as we explore India's potential as a massive new market for American whiskey, the "rum cover over" tax provision, and how European retaliation against bourbon exports affects multinational spirits companies. Throughout it all, Barr demonstrates that bourbon transcends political divisions – bringing together legislators from both parties who might disagree on policy but find common ground over a well-crafted pour.
Whether you're passionate about whiskey, curious about politics, or simply enjoy listening to genuine conversation, this episode captures the essence of bourbon's unique ability to create connections. As Buffalo Trace ambassador Freddie Johnson wisely notes, bourbon's magic isn't in collecting bottles but in creating memories through sharing – a philosophy that might just be the secret to better governance.
Listen now, and raise a glass to the spirit that not only warms the soul but occasionally manages to warm the cold halls of Congress too.
Morgan Wallen and Kentucky Politics
Speaker 1I've been throwing down the whiskey. I ought to get my money back. Someone said it drowns the memory, but it ain't doing jack. I've been sipping, I've been Shai Tucky, bourbon Brothers, mike and Tony. Nothing to dislike about Morgan Wallen man. I would say one of my favorite artists in the last you know five years. I mean, he's just like putting out hit after hit after hit. I haven't seen him yet. Have you seen him? Yeah, I saw him in Milwaukee and it was. It was quite the spectacle, was it? There were some fights, there were some.
Speaker 2I don't know why that goes along with country music, but it got a little ugly but we had a great, great time you know, my next show I really want to see is I want to see kenny chesney at the spear. Should do that together. I want to kind of go out there and do it.
Speaker 1So, uh, we're gonna drink some good juice today, but I'm excited for it I wanted to ask you, kind of his little intro um, I don't really know if you're like a real political guy and and I guess I what I'll ask is uh, is kentucky like a real? You know people are real into their politics down there. I would say you, your family, friends is a big thing.
Speaker 2Well, Well, where I grew up, yeah, my mom is like crazy Catholic so she only votes on abortion rights. So, like where I grew up, it's really really Catholic and really red and it's yeah.
Speaker 1All right, so you just went right in for it. Didn't like, didn't go into guns or horses, or you know.
Speaker 2No, that's where I grew up, that's why yeah.
Speaker 1Anyway, I ask because we do have a guest today. We're going to drink some great whiskey with him and he just happens to be the US representative of Kentucky's 6th District, Mr Congressman, Andy Barr. Andy, how are you man?
Speaker 3Hey, it's great to be with you, Mike and Tony.
Speaker 1So good to have you.
Speaker 3Thanks for thanks for coming up. Nothing better than being on a podcast about bourbon exactly can we just talk about?
Speaker 1we got the politics out of the way that's what I was trying to do, don't you don't have anything to talk about here. We're just gonna talk about bourbon whiskey let me tell you something.
Speaker 3I represent the congressional district that was once represented by a guy named Henry Clay. You got to go back to your history classes from high school to remember Henry Clay. Henry Clay was the Speaker of the House and he famously would get on the stagecoach in the 1830s and 40s and bring barrels of Kentucky whiskey over the Appalachian Mountains over into Washington DC to the Willard Hotel no way, and all of the people would line up to talk to him and they'd have to drink bourbon with him.
Speaker 1While they talked to him?
Speaker 3Yeah, of course so he was known as the Great Compromiser, henry Clay, and he famously said that the secret to being the Great Compromiser was Kentucky whiskey. And he said that bourbon lubricates the wheels of government. I love that.
Speaker 1That's awesome.
Speaker 2I mean I knew there was Henry Clay. I'm just going to take that as a fact?
Speaker 1I think it is. I know I knew there was Henry Clay High School.
Speaker 3I'm just going to take that as fact. I think it is. I know there's a lot of things, henry. Clay High School in Lexington I did not realize he was from Lexington, my alma mater, henry Clay High School. I grew up right around Ashland, henry Clay's estate, yeah. But I always thought of all the great quotes from the great compromiser, henry Clayants, that bourbon, uh is the the lubricant that that, uh, greases the wheels of government well, let's get to the whiskey first and then we're going to get to.
Speaker 1You know, uh, some talking points for you and and and the politics of it, but I just I gotta jump right into the whiskey, which we always do. Everyone knows blanton's blanton, you know some say it's not too easy to find. You know, what's even harder to find is Blanton's Gold Edition. The Gold Edition is always 103 proof and Andy just happens to have a barrel select pick and we're going to get in. Who selected this, which was the House White Oak Caucus. Take a note there, tony, talk about the White oak caucus. And just for a little detail, uh, andy got to pick this from the barrel. Uh, barrel number 85, rick, uh, number 56, and this happens to be bottle number 205. So blanton's gold really supposed to be. I'm gonna be honest, I haven't had it before.
Speaker 2I have.
Speaker 1But people rave. People really rave about it. It's the highest end Blantons they make.
The White Oak Caucus and Conservation
Speaker 2It is Well it's the biggest difference Whenever you get into these high end Blantons there's a green and there's a red and there's all these different ones. The Gold started overseas. It was literally an international release that didn't get US debuted until 2020. Oh, and it's the biggest difference between gold and the regular Blantons is the proof this is 103, and the regular is 93. Same mash bill from the same warehouse H at Buffalo Trace, which is a metal-clad rickhouse, and it's the only metal-clad rickhouse at Buffalo Trace and it's for that metal connections connections, I guess, makes the temperature change more, so you get, you know, higher temperature change, which enhances the aging so why is this?
Speaker 1why a barrel pick andy from from of this, from these guys? Well, hundreds and hundreds of bourbon whiskeys in Kentucky. Why this one?
Speaker 3Well, one of the greatest privileges that I've had as co-chairman of the Congressional Bourbon Caucus is representing for 10 years, for a decade in Congress, the Buffalo Trace Distillery. I love taking guests there from around the country and showing them this distillery. For those of you who haven't been to the Bourbon Trail, haven't been to Frankfurt, haven't been to Buffalo Trace very historic distillery it's a Sazerac distillery.
Speaker 1We've been there. It's just so cool.
Speaker 3The history is just like you feel it right when you get on their little campus and one of the cool features of the history is it's the oldest continuously operating distillery in the United States had a medicinal license during Prohibition. So there are older distilleries but this distillery is the oldest continuously operating distillery. Blanton's is one of their great products. Of course People know Buffalo Trace from their signature Buffalo Trace bourbon, but also labels like Elmer T Lee, old Rip Van Winkle, pappy Van Winkle, eh Taylor. I mean just an unbelievable array of exquisite bourbon whiskeys. Blanton's is one of the best. Of course, this gold is something that is a very rare and popular one. But people know the bourbon caucus. What they don't know is the white oak caucus. I want to talk about both. I do. I do so.
Speaker 2the white oak caucus I did a't know is the white oak caucus. I want to talk about both. I do, I do. So. The white oak caucus I did a little bit just to look into it. So, it has to do with the white oak trees. That's right.
Speaker 3So, as you all know, in order to be classified as bourbon whiskey, one of the key criteria the fifth criteria is an oak barrel. A new a virgin.
Speaker 3A new a virgin new, new charred white oak barrel and the current consumption. White oak is used for a lot of things but of course our staves come from white oak. It has to be white oak, has to be new and because of that and because of other hardwood uses of this hardwood, at current consumption rates, we're seeing a decline in the North American white oak population. So the white oak, the bourbon industry came to me as a Kentuckian, as a congressman from Kentucky, as the co-chairman of the Congressional Bourbon Caucus, and said hey look, we want you to promote in Congress a white oak initiative. Can you recruit other members to this cause? And I thought you know, this is the perfect, this is the perfect bipartisan.
Speaker 1So it was like no brainer right away.
Speaker 3You were like boom thanks for asking.
Speaker 1I'm in. I'm in, I mean it's a perfect bipartisan.
Speaker 3Number one it's economic activity, economic growth. We need this for the future vitality of the bourbon industry, the prosperity, the jobs, the economic activity of bourbon multi-billion dollar industry. But the other aspect of the White Oak Initiative is reforestation. For sure. Let's go find Republican conservationists like Yale Forrester, bruce Westerman, who's the chairman of the Natural Resources Committee. Let's go find some environmentalists on the Democratic side of the aisle who might be interested in a reforestation initiative like this. So it's a win-win. And I signed up Ami Berra, congressman from California, as my Democrat co-chair. Ami told me several years ago that he loved bourbon and I didn't know it. But he took a bunch of Democrat lobbyists to my district to tour my distilleries and never told me.
Speaker 2Oh, no way, Quick little piece.
Speaker 1So when you're hanging out with guys like that because you're the Kentucky guy, do you feel like they're just kind of saying that because they know that that's like being in Northern California?
Speaker 2It's like, oh, I love wine.
Speaker 1That's the kind of thing, Are they saying that Some of them do. Did you have to dig into it a little bit? I did dig in this guy's the real deal he's the real deal.
Speaker 2Good good.
Speaker 3He could be on this podcast. He could talk bourbon. Love it Very, very. He's next In an educated way. Despite what your listeners may think about politics, there are bipartisan friendships in Congress and he's one of them. He's a good guy, Great. Mainly because he loves bourbon.
Speaker 2Well, hopefully we get more of those. We need more of those bipartisan things. It's the lubricating, it's the lubricating.
Bourbon Trade Politics and India
Speaker 3There's a funny story about AMI. Ami brought some Democratic lobbyists to my district and they were touring Woodford Reserve and in Woodford Reserve there's a barrel celebrating the 20th anniversary 2006. Of course it was. I come to think of it, it was 2016. It was the 20th anniversary of Woodford Reserve and I had signed the barrel of the 20th anniversary barrel and these Democrats had come to my district during a pretty contentious re-election cycle for me and they pointed to it and they said, oh, we're going to beat that guy, we're going to beat that guy, not knowing this was my district. They were in my district.
Speaker 2Oh no.
Speaker 3And they were with Congressman Barrow. Well, the tour guide, who was there? Who was my constituent? He called you, no, he called them out. And he said listen listen, we love you, we're glad you're here. I don't care about your politics, but one thing you cannot say on this tour is anything negative about our congressman Andy Barr. He is a friend of this distillery and there will be no more conversations about him. Whoa, that's ballsy.
Speaker 1You should either hire that guy or at least throw in that he should get a raise. He got promoted.
Speaker 3Back to the point. We formed the White Oak Caucus and as part of the fund of the caucus we're promoting legislation to gradually reforest and provide future feedstock for our bourbon barrels. We use a lot of white oak and hardwood floors upstock for our bourbon barrels Right.
Speaker 2Well, we use a lot of white, oak and hardwood floors up here.
Speaker 3Oh, I bet you do A ton. Save it for the barrels, bro, it's even more up east.
Speaker 2It's because the trends now are changing the colors of hardwood floor lighter and you can't use red oak because it makes it orange and pink in certain sunlight. You have to use white oak. Well, don't use too much of it Well.
Speaker 1I'm just saying this podcast is about bourbon whiskey. I'm telling you that it's one of the other uses, and today we're going to bring in politics, we're not going to talk home building and all that special.
Speaker 2Just another example of where it all fits together.
Speaker 3Point is, congressman Barrett, myself, the other members bipartisan of the White Oak Caucus, we got together. We supported this legislation. We got a pass through the Savior of Force Act, a bipartisan forestry bill, and then we got together and we tasted a lot of these different blantons and we picked this was our hand-selected barrel that we picked for the-.
Speaker 2How many of the congressmen got to be part of these tastings?
Speaker 3I think there were that evening there were eight of us four Republicans and four Democrats, maybe six, it might have been three and three.
Speaker 1Okay, so did you split them up Quite a few of these bottles, because you know a barrel's got 200 bottles coming out of this glass.
Speaker 2Well, these are only six to eight-year juice, so you probably got 220.
Speaker 3Yeah, let me tell you something you got a basement full of the secret? The secret of negotiating deals in washington is you invite your colleagues back to your office. They know when they come to my office I've got a blanton's gold blanton's gold right.
Speaker 2That's awesome. That's awesome, so great all right, so the other guys have tasted. Did you get them a six pack at least?
Speaker 3um, oh yeah, we all. We all all right, and they all have some too. I, by the way, I'll have to say it is a bipartisan exercise. Mike, the co-chair of the Bourbon Caucus is, of course, morgan.
Speaker 2McCartney yeah, he's a Louisville guy. He's a Louisville guy.
Speaker 3A Democrat also a good guy, a good friend of mine, and he has a very impressive collection in his office as well.
Speaker 2Well. I, I mean yeah, I mean, is his district? Does his district hit Bardstown too?
Speaker 3I don't know, no, okay.
Speaker 2It's kind of a weird how it's split up.
Speaker 3He is Louisville, so all of the urban distilleries in Louisville are part of his. I'm Lexington, central Kentucky, so I have the distilleries I have in my district. I have the distillery district.
Speaker 2Right.
Speaker 3The revitalized Old Pepper distillery the revitalized old pepper distillery. Yes, Down like downtown, right West of downtown town branch, which is the all tech, but the more famous distilleries in my district, of course, uh uh um Buffalo trace was in my district for 10 years. Woodford reserve, uh castle and key.
Speaker 2Yeah.
Speaker 3Do you have four roses at yours Four.
Speaker 2You've got to be close county, so I have four roses and I have wild turkey oh nice, we love two of the two, of the best two right up there the big favorites.
Speaker 1Okay, so let's get to the bourbon caucus. It's you and you said his name is morgan uh the democrat from louisville.
Speaker 3Okay, the republican, he's the democrat, but it's a big caucus, it started with the two of you though. Right right, but you know you'd be surprised how many members of congress are big bourbon drinkers. You've got Tom Cole who's a congressman from Oklahoma Huge bourbon guy. He loves bourbon drinks, woodford Reserve some. Thompson Acres Mark, but he is a very strong bourbon.
Speaker 2Whiskey. I mean it's. You know they say about whiskey, right, whiskey is. Everybody has a palate for a whiskey. You just don't know what it's going to be Because, like all, bourbon is a whiskey, but not all whiskeys are bourbon, so there's a lot of flavors for a lot of people to pick from from all over the world.
Speaker 1You know what I was just thinking as you started going through. We prepared for a lot of things. We just thinking as he started going through we. We prepared for a lot of things we didn't prepare for. What other congressman drank bourbon? Oh, he's like starting to rattle. I know I wish I would have. Like he's like california oklahoma, it's great.
Speaker 2Yeah, there's got to be some texas guys, garrison brothers that's a big place down there.
Speaker 3They're good that's good stuff I've had. I had a texas congressman tell me oh we, we make bourbon too. I said yeah, it's counterfeit.
Speaker 2It's true.
Speaker 1It's pretty.
Speaker 3It's pretty. You're like moving on. It's not good. We call it whiskey, it's not.
Speaker 2It's just a whiskey. It's not good. That's when you go backwards?
Inside the Congressional Bourbon Caucus
Speaker 3No, you make good whiskey, but, by the way, you kind of remind me of the trade implications of this. And not all whiskey is bourbon. Bourbon is whiskey, but not all whiskey is bourbon. That's true. And that brings me to kind of a trade-related point.
Speaker 2There's a lot of policies, yeah, a lot of craziness going on, but India is where this trade policy actually could really benefit bourbon.
Speaker 3There's a lot of hand-wringing and concern about tariffs and retaliatory tariffs. We saw retaliation from the EU during the first Trump administration, but the power, the potential power of the Trump trade policy is to potentially open up export markets.
Speaker 1A lot of people think they're closing them. The initiative is actually to put more Kentucky juice in a place like India.
Speaker 3Exactly so. India, 1.4 billion people, the largest market and, by the way, I thought, the largest consumers. Aren't they by volume Largest consumers? And they are a whiskey drinking culture.
Speaker 2Yeah, I've heard that. I've heard that.
Speaker 3But what do they drink? It's legacy scotch, it's legacy imperial scotch and it's typically blended down. It's not very good.
Speaker 1I've heard that yeah.
Speaker 3So we've done taste tests in India of the sweet corn-based bourbon whiskey and it matches perfectly with the spicy Indian palate and so it's wildly popular when introduced into India. And we've already seen I've worked with Howard Lutnick, the Commerce Secretary, on this working with the ambassador from India. I've had dinner with him at the Indian Embassy, and only a few weeks into the tariff policy from the new administration, they reduced the tariffs against our Kentucky bourbon exports from 150%, which is extremely protectionist, down to 100%, and that's big, because the more those tariffs come down, the more market access we have. There's enormous potential for bourbon production in Kentucky. There's a lot of stories that you'll read about right now about how there's a glut of bourbon and there's a decline in demand for bourbon after this renaissance that we've experienced.
Speaker 1We hear it a lot yeah, a lot of haters.
Speaker 3That problem will go away overnight, if we can open up India or Asia in general. We couldn't produce. I mean we could have three times the number of barrels aging, three times the number of brick houses, three times the number of distilleries, and we would not be able to satisfy the demand if we can get these tariffs down?
Speaker 2Do you think they'll? I mean, are they going to send the same juice we're drinking over, or are they going to water it down? Because a lot of the Indian stuff is pretty watered down. You don't get a ton of crazy high proof stuff.
Speaker 1He's asking are they going to keep the good stuff here? Well, I think he's asking are they going to keep the good stuff here? No, no. Are they going to water it down?
Speaker 2to have more, so you can make more with the same number of barrels.
Speaker 3I think our competitive advantage is we don't water it down Right. Look the.
Speaker 2Indians. Well, it's part of your five rules, right? It can't be less than 80%.
Speaker 3No, exactly 80 proof. Sorry, yeah, and I mean make their own cocktails and do what they want with water and with mixers, but we're not going to water it down.
Speaker 2Right, so we send it over. We actually have a bottle of.
Speaker 1Indian whiskey here, rampur is what it's called. Yeah, and I thought it was actually not too bad. It wasn't the worst, a little scotchy, obviously not a bourbon, but it was pretty good it wasn't as bad as I was anticipating it.
Speaker 2To tell you the truth, I was expecting it to be just not anything that you know like a different flavor, almost like drinking like a malted barley right, like if you're drinking one of those high barley things you're like. Well, that's not what I was looking for at all.
Speaker 1So do you want to pop through the Bourbon Caucus initiatives real quick so we can close that out?
Speaker 3Sure, yeah, I mean I don't speak for all members of the Bourbon Caucus, but what I would say is the top kind of policy issues that really matters. We did permanently reduce the excise tax on bourbon and also pass my bill the Aged Distilled Spirits Competitiveness Act back in 2017 in the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act. Before that bill was passed, the interest expenses that distilleries would incur in aging bourbon were not deductible until the juice went into the bottle. Well, of course, that could be 8, 10, 12, even longer time period. Think of it in terms of a mortgage interest deduction If you couldn't deduct the interest on your mortgage until you sold your house after 20 years.
Speaker 1I would hate that. The housing market would be just slightly crippled, Exactly, and aging barrels and paying the interest on that. You think it's like pennies. I mean it's millions and millions. There's that many barrels.
Speaker 3And, if you think about it, this was a huge competitive disadvantage for aged distilled spirits, non-aged distilled spirits vodka, gin they can deduct the interest immediately, right when the bottle. So we changed the law so that distilleries could deduct the interest on an annual basis over time.
Speaker 1That's awesome.
Speaker 3The tax laws really, I think think are in pretty good shape. The the rum cover over is something we're still, I read a little bit about that.
Speaker 2So that obviously became because of rum and the islands and things like that, and I I did a little just enough reading on that. That. I was wondering how is that something that they're going to help whiskey with, or is it purely an Island type thing?
Speaker 3It's interesting because the bourbon industry used to lobby against this provision of the tax code because they believed it gave rum a competitive advantage over bourbon when they couldn't get the law changed. Guess what they?
Speaker 2jumped into it.
Speaker 3They bought the rum to take advantage of it. So you see a lot of Kentucky, bourbon and us other holding companies that bought rum.
Speaker 3And so now the bourbon industry is also lobbying for rum cover over. Basically, what this is is the excise tax on rum is $13.50 per proof gallon Under permanent law. $10.50 of that $13.50 that's imported into the United States is covered over to the treasuries of Puerto Rico and the US Virgin Islands. Yeah, and so the revenue that would otherwise come to the Treasury Department in Washington stays in the islands and helps support those islands.
Speaker 2And doesn't it have something where they actually helps them improve? Those territories, it improves their. In addition to that, they improve their facilities. They do Right, they do. Part of that is on top of that. They also get, like, their facilities improved or something.
Speaker 3They do, and if you look at the total revenue amount, the cover over is estimated to be about $700 million a year in excise tax revenue to Puerto Rico and the US Virgin Islands, our territories there. Well, the bourbon industry is now taking advantage of that cover over and it helps promote those industries.
Speaker 3Another big hot-button topic is what's called the duty drawback clarification. So duty drawback permits refund of duties, taxes and fees paid in connection with imports if that merchandise or substituted merchandise is exported. Right now these schedules it's called the harmonized tariff schedule codes.
Tasting Blanton's Gold Edition
Speaker 1There's a mismatch between our bourbon and Scotch and Irish whiskeys and so if you have a same company that's both exporting bourbon to europe and importing scotch and irish whiskey over here, um, we want the uh duty drawback so that you don't have the the impact of those duties so a lot of these are just like leveling playing fields that are that otherwise, uh, kentucky is, you know, ireland or scotland or Japan or whatever they just have you know, kind of like a lot of the tariffs that we're talking about or they kind of have a leg up and they shouldn't.
Speaker 3Yeah, it's a way to make sure it's zero for zero.
Speaker 3And by the way, let me just say this you know we had a pause in the tariffs on the EU and we're still in that 90 day period right now. You know the last Trump administration the EU put big retaliatory tariffs against our bourbon and we took a big hit Our exports plunged by about 20% when those 25% tariffs, those retaliatory tariffs against our bourbon, were in place. So this time around they were not going to reimpose those retaliatory tariffs because President Trump threatened 200% of a further retaliation against their French wine and their spirits. When I was over in Europe in October, I reminded the EU that this is a dumb policy to retaliate against Kentucky bourbon because you're basically tariffing yourself. Look at Campari. Campari owns Wild Turkey. That's an Italian company. You're basically putting a tariff on yourself. Same thing with the Pinot Ricard.
Speaker 1That's great. I would never put those two things together, but that's so stupid.
Speaker 3And same thing with Jefferson's. Jefferson's is owned by a French company.
Speaker 3So we were reminding them. Look, if you put these retaliatory tariffs on us, you're tariffing yourself. Interestingly, the reason why we're in much better shape this time around Ireland the Irish ag minister visited with me. They're doing a great job. Of course they're members of the EU. They're doing a great job. Of course they're members of the EU. They're in Brussels. They are reminding their European member states at the EU that if they retaliate against Kentucky bourbon, guess who's going to get hit? Irish whiskey, scotch whiskey. Of course Scotland is part of the UK.
Speaker 1You always trust the Irish. I mean I'm married.
Speaker 2I'm married to an.
Speaker 3Irish girl, an Irish lad, but the point is that the Irish, once again, are helping us.
Speaker 2Here we are, they're helping us in Brussels. I love it. Why do?
Speaker 3they come to Kentucky, they come for the horses.
Speaker 2The horses and the whiskey. Didn't you do the they come for the horses, the horses and the whiskey? Didn't you do the same type of for the horses? Did the same type of tax incentives that you were just talking about with the bourbon, to be able to incentivize horse races, right? Or the horses, the racing horses themselves, right, where you can start depreciating them? And things like that. That's a different. I know this is more about bourbon, but Kentucky and their horses is almost as important as Kentucky and the bourbon.
Speaker 3Bonus depreciation is going to help the sale of Thoroughbred yearlings, but we want the default to be three-year depreciation. That's a story for a different podcast.
Speaker 2We like it.
Speaker 1It's the time of year, tony just gets excited Whenever I can use the Unbelievably excited.
Speaker 2We just finished the Triple Crown, I mean come on.
Speaker 3Hey, listen, On the first Saturday May of Churchill Downs, those mint juleps, they got your juice in it.
Speaker 2They got you going. That's a fun place. I was there last year. I didn't see you, we weren't able to catch up, but I was there last year for the 150th and it was a fun one.
Speaker 1I year for the 150th, and it was. It was a fun one. I wish the weather would be nicer. I feel like it keeps raining lately. Rain, rain in the spring in kentucky. That's how it works. All right, let's get into the blanton's gold edition. Um, a few little stats on it. We already said it's 103 proof. Uh, it's not in age stated. But uh, what's eight?
Speaker 1I see six to eight is what you've seen Retails for in the ballpark of $85. I don't think you'll typically ever find it for less than about double or triple that aftermarket.
Speaker 2I think it's up to almost 105 or 120 now for the retail. It's tough to find them secondary under 200 bucks. 250 is where they're usually sitting. It's made. It's made. It's buffalo trace mash bill number two, which is their extra rye mash bill and one of the cool things like it yeah it's gonna remind you a little bit of the of the um, uh, what's it called? The four roses barrel select stuff with that high rye. I think I have this feeling because they're all about that same age bracket um, so you know how.
Speaker 1I just told you that tony gets a little excited when there's another kentuckian in the room. Look at his glass it's empty he got so excited that he just kind of slurped it back little by little, while he was talking about talking about.
Speaker 2What's cool, though, is blantons came out in 1984, and you know robert e t robert uh, robert t lee was the actual distiller of it. It's one of his last things that he did. Well.
Speaker 3Well, can I tell you, I met Elmer T.
Speaker 2Did you really?
Speaker 3I did. I was running for Congress in 2010. It was my first race for Congress and a nice group of people offered to host a fundraiser for me at their home in Frankfort, kentucky. And so I show up and they said we have a big surprise and a special guest. And they told me, as the guest of honor, so to speak, to go to the basement door. I was supposed to go to the basement door.
Speaker 2Kentucky.
Speaker 3And open the basement door and in would come our special guest Right. So I did. First time I'd been in this home, but they told me where the basement door was. There you go I opened the basement door and there was Mr Elmer T Lee. What the hell is he doing in the basement? Elmer T Lee emerges from the basement of this Frankfurt home to surprise us all.
Speaker 1I love it. Were you freaked out? Or all of a sudden you open a door and some guy's coming at you, or did you know who it was?
Speaker 3Oh, he was a legend. He was a legend. Everybody was like oh my goodness, this is crazy. It's the legend Elmer T Lee.
Speaker 2Why couldn't they just let him walk in the front door and ring the bell? You had to go to the basement.
Speaker 3It was supposed to be a surprise and they told him to get in the basement.
Speaker 1Love it All, love it All. Right, let's give this a little nose.
Speaker 2Let's do it. Cheers, guys.
Speaker 3Cheers.
Speaker 2I had to refill my glass because I may or may not have had a couple ounces of it.
Speaker 1Someone's a little excited. It's good stuff. Excitable, tony. What do you got Honey? I got some honey on this, I think, kind of citrusy, citrusy, it's like a dried fruit honey. Come on, kind of citrusy, citrusy, it's like a dried fruit honey. I mean, come on, the citrus isn't there for you. Yeah, but not. I don't want to say it's like lemony, but there's, there's like an orange there there's a nice spice on the back end oh yeah, all right, let's taste it.
Speaker 2Let's do it. Oh yeah, cheers, this is good stuff, of which tony already has. I've already tasted it. I could just talk while you guys are tasting it. I don't remember the exact things. I remember the finish. It's a nice long finish from my earlier sips on out that you guys sent me Mouthfeel.
Speaker 1It's big, it is big.
Speaker 2A lot of vanilla Apricot Apricot's not citrusy apricots on citrusy is it kind of? Uh, no, it's like judges I don't know fruit to dried fruit, not citrusy at all uh peppery yeah yeah, yeah, definitely like more than it is like a, like a spice, it's more like a. Spicy, I mean, the finish is long spicy.
Speaker 3It's got like a little bit of a Remind me guys. What is the rye in this?
Speaker 2So they won't give us the mash bill. So that's the one thing that Buffalo Trace does is they just tell you what mash bill it is. So we know there's no wheat, we know it's obviously more than 51% corn. If I was guessing, I'm going to guess that you're probably sitting at about 70% corn.
Speaker 2You're probably sitting at 20% rye and 10% barley would be my absolute guess. Just because there's enough fruitiness and enough lightness at the beginning, and then you can get that big spice boom and it's a good flavor. I mean the flavoring at the end, beginning, and then you can get that big spice boom and it's and it's a good flavor. I mean the flavoring at the end. I think this, at 100, at 103, proof is is fantastic. I mean nothing against the regular blends, but I always I don't really chase the regular blends and I think a lot of it is, just because it's like it's hard to get and it's kind of a pain. They ask to chase after.
Speaker 1Um, we do chase whiskeys yes, and you're being in kentucky, you probably don't have to do as much chasing as we do, and we hunt, I hunt for.
Speaker 3Yeah, you know, I was in washington, I was at a pretty, pretty nice, uh upscale hotel for an event and there was a group at the bar and and I ordered a what I thought was a pretty standard pour of uh a blantons, yeah, and I got the bill and it was like 45 bucks yeah, yeah, yeah, they kill you.
Speaker 2Yeah, especially in dc. Yeah, I was like been to jack roses I have many times that's that's. I've had events, my favorite. I think it's the best bourbon bar pub in the country it is. It's a good one now I'm sure there's some new ones in louisville that I haven't been to because they. Louisville has really revitalized itself, as you know. I really hope completely switching. I'm really hoping that lexington brings some taste tasting rooms in.
Speaker 1I would love to see that down I know it's nothing to do with you. Louisville's just main street's blown up.
Speaker 2Yeah, it was there but I think they could do some. I mean because they already redid that whole west, that whole west of rup, you know where peppers and town and branch and all that stuff, the distillery district yeah, if I think they could get a few of these guys to come over there, it could bring some. I mean, I know it's not really your stuff, it's more on the local politics, but I could just open up in versailles.
Speaker 3Oh really, there's one that opened up in versailles the old castle but, well, yeah, there's the castle, you know um whatever happened with angels, the owner of Angels, envy Henderson. He bought the castle.
Speaker 2Oh, did he really? Did he ever turn it into like a he's? Got some co-investors and some partners, but yeah, it is a Like a bed and breakfast type thing. It's a bed and breakfast.
Speaker 3I've heard that and you know good bar with a lot of bourbon in there.
Speaker 2That's cool. I was in school there, yeah. No, I mean, that thing was empty for years and years and years it's. It's kind of it's literally you drive like just west of lexington I don't know if you've ever gone down was the paris pike or whatever that is for sales road, for sales. Yeah, it's like you get down that way and right there's a kingland, there's a castle, like a full walled castle. That's been like there for and it was like 100 years kind of thing.
Speaker 3It was no, no it was built in like the 60s.
Speaker 2Oh, okay.
Speaker 3And Lee Majors and Farrah Fawcett owned it at one time when they were dating.
Speaker 2That's hilarious, but the place never got finished or something. It was a crazy. You drive down this road and all of a sudden you're like what is that? There's literally a castle in Kentucky In.
Speaker 3Kentucky. There was a mysterious fire in the 2000s and the insurance proceeds were used to refurbish it and built it into a really nice bed and breakfast.
Speaker 1Is that what it was?
Speaker 2I like, when that happens A mysterious fire we have some of those happen in these old school. Hot dog stands around here.
Speaker 1So you don't have to totally partake in it. But we usually do what's called a SIP method, which SIP is shareable influence and price. So I'll go first so you can kind of get an idea of what that means for this pour. I love that we're sharing it with each other and I'm so glad that you brought it to us. So I think shareable for that reason is kind of a no-brainer. Blantons and Buffalo Trace they're up there at pretty much the highest level for me. I think they usually put out stuff that's still very reasonably priced. So I would say three for three on the sip method for Blanton's Gold.
Speaker 2Yeah, I have had this before because I was lucky enough to have somebody that had a bottle of this and brought it and shared it with me. So I would share this with someone that that would. If they would see it, I don't think I would bring this out and be like, hey, try this, because I know what I have. But if somebody would see it like on our wall and be like, how'd you get that? I want to taste that, I would absolutely give it, give them a sip. Influence to me, I mean buffalo trace. To me it's, you know, heaven hill, buffalo trace. You can flip a coin. They're the two big dogs of the industry and they're just fantastic and I, I love so much of their juices. I mean, one thing we didn't even talk about buffalo trace is their weller line, which is probably the best. It's the best weeded bourbon line there is.
Speaker 1I mean besides maker's mark. You know I love that. You couldn't even like bullshit in front of andy that you would share it. You became like this little squirrel with his nut. I'm not sharing this. Thanks for the bottle, Andy See you later?
Speaker 3No, you know that's a great point about Weller. I often tell people who ask me about Pappy Van Winkle do you have Pappy? What's your favorite Pappy? By the way, my favorite Pappy is 2923. And wing going. Do you have Pappy, and what's your favorite Pappy? By the way, my favorite Pappy is 20, not 23. Yeah, I just think that 23 is not quite as good as the 15.
Speaker 2I think the 15. I like the 15 the most.
Speaker 3Well, whatever it is, yeah, we've always said 15 and 20. You know, if you're a big weeded bourbon guy, what I think great about Buffalo Trace and I like them all. I'm a politician, so of course Depends who you're with, but I will say about Buffalo Trace is the versatility, Because you've got this great Blantons, but then you've got this weeded line as well, Wellers and Pappy. But the real secret, which is so interesting, the secondary market of Pappy is so crazy. But Weller is accessible, it's priced reasonably and it's young pappy.
Speaker 2It is.
Speaker 3It's the same thing.
Speaker 2Absolutely, it is.
Speaker 3It just comes out of the barrel a little earlier.
Speaker 2Probably not in the same honey hole in the Rick house, but it's the same stuff, it's the same and I think we get that question a lot.
Speaker 1Oh, pappy, pappy, what's your favorite? It probably is like daily.
Speaker 3It is, it is, it is, have to. It probably is like daily it is, whether you're you know it is, it is, and I'll tell you it's hard. The amount of people that ask us like what's your?
Sharing Bourbon and Political Future
Speaker 2favorite bourbon and my answer, my question always back is I'm like, well, that you can get or that you can't get. Right, because what my favorite bourbon is is is what I think is some of the best bourbon I've ever had is, unfortunately, stuff you just can't get. Like we're lucky enough to either have a bottle or we tasted it at somebody else's place or at a distillery and we're like that might be, and sometimes you don't want to pay two thousand dollars for a bottle of a bottle of booze.
Speaker 1It's like. It's like going back to the price and every answer price at 120 bucks.
Speaker 2It's hard to buy a bottle of bourbon at 120 bucks.
Speaker 3If you don't know, it's okay but going back to um, what's really special about the Buffalo Trace Distillery is Freddie Johnson. Freddie is an ambassador for bourbon. He is an institution, third generation at the distillery. He's in the Bourbon Hall of Fame. Freddie says something very, very important. I don't know if you all know Freddie.
Speaker 2I don't know him.
Speaker 3Freddie needs to be on this podcast. Freddie said something very, very important about to your question. Would you share this? Would you bring this out?
Speaker 1and share this.
Speaker 3He said you know, the magic of bourbon whiskey is not that you hoard it for yourself, that you take out a very special bottle pour it for yourself and have it alone.
Speaker 2Right, it's to share.
Speaker 3The magic of bourbon whiskey is when you have someone special in your life, a friend, a family member, your dad, your brother, maybe even it's your girlfriend or your wife, and maybe it's a neighbor, yeah anybody Maybe it's someone that you just met, but you invite them into your home. So true, but you invite them into your home.
Speaker 1So true.
Speaker 3You sit down on the glass, you pour that beautiful juice into the, into the glass, however you want it, there's no wrong way, and you'd sip that and you have an experience and you have a conversation. Yeah, and when the next time you look at that bottle on your shelf, you'll see that that liquid is just a little lower than what it was before. And you know what that is. That's a memory, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1Good times with others. And you don't even know this, but and we'll say it at the end but our tagline is uh, we, we, we take care of the whiskey you focus on with whom you share it, which is like that's, that's everything to us. Yeah, like you're at our whiskey apartment, cause we're here to and we're ready to share it with you.
Speaker 2You look around this place and there's there's, there's a plenty of stuff. There's some stuff that you've, you can get. There's some stuff you can't get. And and if you come in here and you see something where we're probably sharing it with you, cause if, if you're invited in here, then if we don't already know you, then you're a friend of somebody that we obviously like or somebody that we obviously know and think highly of, or you're not going to get up into this place, right, Like this isn't like a storefront. You're not just going to walk by and knock on the door. You got into this place. It's kind of a crazy hallway. I feel very lucky that I'm here Very fortunate.
Speaker 2We're fortunate to have you, I to have you. I'm glad you were able to squeeze this in.
Speaker 1Thank you so much for coming, but I want to say we haven't touched on probably the most important thing. We'll get off the whiskey for a second and we'll go back. I've seen certain things and websites of Andy Barr for Senate. Yeah, that's right. What's that?
Speaker 3all about Well. So I've served in Congress now for 13 years, that's long enough. I feel like we've accomplished a lot for the bourbon industry and for the Commonwealth of Kentucky, but you know I only represent one-sixth of the state, right 750,000 Kentuckians. There's four and a half million Kentuckians, by the way over two and a half times barrels of bourbon than people in Kentucky but I'd like to represent all of those barrels and all of those people.
Speaker 2Right, right. I love that.
Speaker 3And that means I have to run statewide, and Mitch McConnell has announced his retirement. There's an open seat in the United States Senate, and I'd love to represent the entire Commonwealth. What a privilege that would be.
Speaker 2That would be awesome.
Speaker 1That's awesome, we'll be rooting for you.
Speaker 3You know I only represent some of the bourbon trail.
Speaker 1You're just in the middle, you've got to do it all I want to represent it all. Yeah, and all those Kentuckians know that you got their back.
Speaker 3I got their back, oh for sure.
Speaker 2I got their back, all of them.
Speaker 3I got their back. I've got the back of the bourbon industry and the horse industry and you guys.
Speaker 2You got a lot going on. I was able to do some searching. You got your hands full. You're financial, you're on all kinds of stuff, foreign affairs you're all over the place. You're not just focused on one little thing.
Speaker 3You've got your hands around a lot. Well, I really do believe bourbon is the solution to so many of the world's problems.
Speaker 2Well, it's answered a lot of stuff. That's why we do this. That's what they say. It works for us.
Speaker 1We get to the end of the day and we can't answer the questions. And we answer them right here.
King of Pain and Final Thoughts
Speaker 3Bourbon makes you happy. If everybody could sit down and just have a drink of bourbon with one another, we could hash out our differences.
Speaker 2I think that there's a lot to be said about that. There's a lot to be said if people would just come to the table and not have a whole lot of stuff that they're bringing with them. It's nice to just have this little Glencairn glass in front of you.
Speaker 1Have a little glass. Have a little glass. All right, you told us some of your favorite kind of let's call it old school music. What are we going out to here, tony?
Speaker 2Well, you know, you told me you came to Chicago twice to see the police at Wrigley. So I feel like we got to do. I think that was 2007.
Speaker 3So I'm starting this with a little July 2007, man.
Speaker 2It's the police, but what's up, it's the police. This is King of Pain. So it starts a little slow this way we can keep talking and kind of finish up what we're doing. But it's one of their classics. I mean, it was one of the ones that was remastered on their I think, their greatest hits, their second greatest hits that came out in the early 2000s. So if they're remastering a song, it's one of their best.
Speaker 1Well, thanks for bringing this bottle. Delicious, delicious pour, and so good to have you here. And, as I said before, we take care of the whiskey. You actually took care of it for us today by bringing it, but you focus on with whom you share it.
Speaker 2So, Andy, awesome awesome, awesome, having you here Nice. It was such a fun time.
Speaker 3Mike, Tony, thanks so much. Appreciate it. Enjoy this with others.
Speaker 2We will, we will. This one won't be sitting in the back room. It's going to be sitting right up there on top, so we can tell the story every time somebody asks about it.
Speaker 1Congressman Andy Barr for Senate. Thanks, andy. Yeah, check out his website barrforsenatecom. Right? Why don't you let him say it?
Speaker 3Is that correct, barrforsenatecom, there we go See.
Speaker 2Thanks Andy, Peace out Tony, Bye guys, Bye guys, Thank you.
