Episode 132 - Elmer T. Lee

The bourbon world loves a loud debate, and Elmer T. Lee seems built to start one: is it a smooth classic that earned its reputation, or is it an “allocated” name that rides on scarcity and Buffalo Trace hype? We pour a 90 proof single barrel sour mash and give you the honest read, including why some drinkers call it too simple while others will happily pay double or triple retail just to keep it on the shelf.

Along the way, we share some real-life updates from the Whiskey Brothers universe. Our group is growing, the bottle count is growing, and we’re moving from a residential setup into a larger commercial space north of Chicago. There’s a rehab plan, new windows and floors, fresh paint, and a big new bar build so we can host tastings the way they should be: comfortable, social, and focused on sharing good whiskey with good people.

Then it’s all tasting and context. We talk Buffalo Trace mash bill #2 and the high rye angle, what “single barrel” really means in practice, and why distribution and allocation can make a $40 to $50 bourbon feel like a unicorn. We also touch the legacy piece: Elmer T. Lee is often credited with bringing single barrel bourbon to the mainstream, plus the fun detail that he liked his pour over ice with a splash of 7 Up.

Expect classic notes like vanilla, brown sugar, light oak, a hint of cinnamon, and a finish that fades faster than you might want, which leads straight into the real question: what price makes this a “buy” versus a hard pass? If you like bourbon reviews, Buffalo Trace comparisons, and practical buying advice for allocated whiskey, hit play, subscribe, share it with a friend, and leave us a quick review. What’s the most you’d pay for Elmer T. Lee?

Transcript

Informer And Pop Culture Opener

SPEAKER_02 0:27

If you're just a human being that was born between I don't know in the 70s, 80s, 90s. If you know anything about this song, you know how popular it was for a real hot minute there. Maybe a summer or something like that, but no. Informer.

SPEAKER_01 0:46

Yeah. It was 1992. Seven weeks at number one. What that dude's doing now.

SPEAKER_02 0:56

I mean, last time we asked that about someone, they were dead. Oh, I hope that's not true. I think we looked someone up and they were dead. Shiny Burton Brothers, Mike and Tony. Uh, in a real good mood here. Oh, he's a Canadian. He's a Canadian. Purely based on that story.

SPEAKER_01 1:10

Extensive snow. Canadian. I think you're stretching there, but uh Canadian rapper born in Toronto.

SPEAKER_02 1:21

Alright, so uh since we last talked to you, um Tony. First of the things you know about Tony, which may be limited outside of uh whiskey, baseball, sports altogether, and family activities. Did I cover it all? Friends of Tony? Um that's probably everything. You might not know that Tony uh in the last week has moved his office because they're gonna tear down the building. He sold his house and he moved into his new house. And he's looking at me like I'm gonna expect him to talk about any of that, but no, boring. What's more important that we're about to do is we're gonna move our whiskey apart. Oh, yes. We Tony came up with this.

SPEAKER_01 2:02

I thought you were gonna talk about opening the chocolate store, too.

SPEAKER_02 2:06

Well, that's your that's your job. That's just you doing your job. The other stuff is like you adding on to the plate, which is the Tony plate, the family plate, the Myers plate. So it's been a busy two weeks. Tony had this real, uh, I would say kind of originally hairbranded idea that we need more space. Uh, we have we're growing in membership, we're growing in bottles, we're growing in podcasts, we're growing in all things. And uh a few of us fought it. Like, why, Tony?

SPEAKER_01 2:34

Like, yeah, it's I thought I thought it was gonna be over overwhelming, like easy slam dunk. Instead, I had to, instead, I had to give like I don't know, it's hilarious. Mike's in this car one day, and he calls me. He's like, Hey, you gotta sell this to me. You got 30 seconds. What are you how you gonna sell it? I'm like, what?

SPEAKER_02 2:51

What do you mean? When you said I thought it was over, uh what I was gonna say is I thought it was gonna be over before it started. I it was like we were like, why not have our cool, like five-year cozy place? And why move? Because moving, as you know, now too well sucks, but we're getting a new spot, yes, uh, in town, uh still north of Chicago, and it's bigger. And Tony's actually gonna move his office space there, and it's a commercial space. We're in a residential space now, which is a little weird for a bunch of uh guys and couples uh just drinking in a residential apartment. Uh so super excited. We will uh be coming to you from there probably in another month and a half. We're gonna do some rehab of the unit. Yeah, uh, landlord's giving us some new windows, uh floor, paint. We're building a huge new bar. So if you're in the Chicagoland area and you're a listener and you're like, I gotta, I just I gotta be more than a listener. I gotta meet these knuckleheads.

New Space And Huge Bar Build

SPEAKER_01 3:54

Uh we're getting a new space. So I'm excited. It'll be fun. It's uh my goal is uh May one. We'll see. It'll be close. I'm hoping that everything is set up and done, May one.

SPEAKER_02 4:03

Contractor Tony making some date promises. We'll see if he delivers. No, no, no, no.

SPEAKER_01 4:09

Until I get access, I'm not giving it to you, but that's a good goal.

What Elmer T. Lee Is

SPEAKER_02 4:12

Around town that's my goal. You're known to be the contractor around town that meets his dates. So, anyway, yeah, here we go. It's time to drink some whiskey. Yes, it is a single barrel, it is a sour mash. It is a Kentucky straight bourbon whiskey at 90 proof. It is called Elmer T. Lee. Yes. Elmer T. Lee. I've always loved the little dimples on the bottle and how it's kind of square and just so easy to hold. But you know what? A lot of people really, really hate on this because they say it's just simple. Uh, they say it's really nothing special, and they say it's overrated, but some say it's nostalgic and it's got a and it's got a you know a solid choice for a and for an enthusiast. But there's kind of more hate than love for this one, but there's a lot of love because people pay double and triple what the retail is. What is the retail on this now? Uh, somewhere between 40 and 50 dollars. Okay. So a very reasonable bottle.

SPEAKER_01 5:12

Yes, but it only comes out I think once a year or maybe twice a year, and it's very scarce. It's definitely allocated. It's not, it's not something that's dropped like Weller, right? Buffalo Trace drops Weller all the time, you know, different colors, different times of years. This is like a once or twice. This is definitely, you know, if you're trying to get some of that what Rock Hill Farms or some of the um, you know, some of that Hancock's presidential reserve, those are all like similar but different, low-proof Buffalo Trace, single barrel type expressions that see Alma.

SPEAKER_02 5:45

Check really quick, and we we uh I'll talk while you check. How many, how many bottles do they put out of this every year? Because I I what what I think the hype about it is is that it is a Buffalo Trace product. Elmer T. Lee, great, great story, another kind of father or grandfather of bourbon, um, and worked uh at Buffalo Trace, uh retiring in 1985 for 36 years, and blah blah blah, all that other stuff. So it's like I kind of feel like this is one of those, it's got the the bones and the making of something great, and then they just really sell it out uh because it just doesn't go everywhere. And I and I'm I'm personally like that. If there's something that's kind of hard to find, but for some reason it hits our store or it hits Illinois, and I'm like, it's a once-a-year pickup, and especially if it's 40-50 bucks, so it probably just flies off the shelf, and then other people are like, wait a minute, I didn't get any.

SPEAKER_01 6:42

It's not even that it flies off the shelf. They're they don't release an official number, not a public number anyway. It's you know, obviously it's the mash bill number two, which is their high rye, but um, they're saying that Illinois and national distribution allocation behavior is that typical stores receive zero to six bottles a year, larger chains get one to two cases annually.

SPEAKER_02 7:02

Which still seems like a lot, but if a number's not out there, then a number's not out there.

SPEAKER_01 7:08

Yeah, I'm not gonna find it. But it's a single barrel, it's it's one of the, you know, they uh uh experts estimate it between two thousand and four, two thousand and four thousand barrel uh barrels per year.

SPEAKER_02 7:17

Okay. So also I asked you to pull up uh before we started. We we did we had a podcast on Elmer Telee.

SPEAKER_01 7:26

Here it is. They say it's about eighteen thousand to forty-five thousand a year based on Oh, great number.

SPEAKER_02 7:32

Eighteen to forty five. That's kind of like we're gonna be a good one.

SPEAKER_01 7:35

National wide, nationwide. So it's gonna be all over. I'm eight uh to put it into perspective, Blanton's is ten to twenty times larger than Elmer Tele a year. Ten to twenty X? Yes. That's a that's probably a better way to put it.

SPEAKER_02 7:48

It's for sure a small one, especially at 18. 18 is like one of the antique collections, if that.

SPEAKER_01 7:55

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 7:55

Um and those go really fast because you know they create uh a lot of demand there.

SPEAKER_01 8:01

So I don't get these very often. I the bottle that we're drinking is the is may have been the same bottle we've had in the past. I have just a little bit left, and I keep a little list of these barrel, these bottles that I have that have under a quarter, and I pull it out when I go to Benny's and say, Hey, these are the ones I'm looking for. And every once in a while I get lucky and they say, Yeah, I got one of them. So they also know I got two more questions for you. All right, go for it. One, do you have a mash bill on this? Just mash bill number two, which is the 12 to 14% high rye, uh typical Buffalo trade smash bill.

Allocation, Mash Bill, And Hype

SPEAKER_02 8:35

Okay. Number two. Uh, and why we're gonna keep this podcast quick is because we already did this before a few years ago. We did tell listeners if they're scrolling through and listening to other episodes, because maybe they like keep us honest. Let's see what Mike and Tony said back in 2021 episode.

SPEAKER_01 8:54

Uh it was the 18th episode of our second year doing this, our episode number 32 total.

unknown 9:01

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 9:01

We were we were we were young. A hundred years ago, a hundred episodes ago almost. I don't know what number we're on right now, but almost a hundred episodes ago.

SPEAKER_02 9:08

This one will be quick. See what we say, and then you can go back to that one if you're not scroll control. Did you listen to it? I don't even know what we did. I uh I I just know that we're that we're uh that we're honest guys.

Tasting Notes From Nose To Finish

SPEAKER_01 9:20

I didn't I didn't even well let's see how much better our taste has gotten, see how much better we can pick things out now. Cheers, dude. Cheers, yeah. What do you got here on the nose? Classic.

SPEAKER_02 9:32

Classic vanilla.

SPEAKER_01 9:33

I mean for sure, tons of vanilla.

SPEAKER_02 9:38

I mean, kinda nothing to dislike at all. I mean, it is just super classic. It's well rounded. It almost has like a I almost want to say it has a start and a finish. Like it's it just it doesn't just like, oh, if you sniff it too hard, all of a sudden you're getting it's like a it's like a that fresh flavor.

SPEAKER_01 9:57

It's like that that you know, that fresh uh baked bread smell that a lot of people put with uh vanilla. They they kind of go hand in hand. It's kind of like that that you know, that's I don't know. There's a little bit of oak, a little bit of oak, yeah, not too oak.

SPEAKER_02 10:12

If there's any if there's too much anyway, uh anything, I would say um yeah, kind of a vanilla vanilla and like a and like a bready. Little zing of like uh cinnamon, but maybe that's that that's that high ride. Cheers. Yeah, maybe it's cinnamon.

SPEAKER_01 10:30

Yeah, I I I wouldn't get get rid of that cinnamon.

SPEAKER_02 10:34

I like how you said baked bread though.

SPEAKER_01 10:37

Okay. Light. The proof is definitely in the sip. 90 proof, I don't know if we said that. Definitely in the sip.

SPEAKER_02 10:44

Some of the haters online have a video of Elmer T. Lee himself, it's probably like 15, 20 years ago, uh saying, you know, I pour a little bit of this over a cube and then uh add a splash of seven up. And it's like, really? But I mean, it is so balanced and great. Like if you added like that jolt of sugary seven up or even like a ginger ale or something, it would be fucking amazing.

SPEAKER_01 11:12

Yeah. It's the brown sugar comes out. Do you get a little bit? I get a lot of little brown sugar in this, actually. Light fruity, a little bit of oak. I like the brown sugar.

SPEAKER_02 11:26

A perfect little fruity, like a um it's like a like an in-your-face fruit, but not like a cherry, like a um it's like a red fruit almost. Like um, maybe even like a cranberry or like a raspberry, strawberry, something, something.

SPEAKER_01 11:43

It's good. It's very, it's just a old school, it's not a it's not a powerhouse. It's not gonna burn you up. It's 90 proof. You're either gonna like this or you're not. There's not gonna be a middle of this. For some people that they're gonna say this is a mixer and it's too light. For others, they're gonna say this is fantastic, and how can I get how can I get these anywhere near retail?

SPEAKER_02 12:04

I mean, I put this like right in the really great daily drinker category. Long day, tough day, get home. Assuming you only paid 40-50 bucks for the bottle. You want to pour yourself like maybe two fingers of it really nice. It's not spice glass for a high rise. Some of those high rise power through that. Like you're you're doing, you know, two fingers before dinner. That's what she said. And it's just you wish, man. You wish. That's a great response.

SPEAKER_01 12:36

All right. Um, finish. Um, I mean, it's not for for being a high rye, it's not a long one. It's it's there, but it's not like a super, it's a very mild to medium in my mind.

SPEAKER_02 12:47

Probably it's probably its worst points.

SPEAKER_01 12:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 12:50

Kind of flattens out a little bit of leg leaves you wanting another sip because you're like, oh, that went away so fast. That's why I think it's like a long hard day. Pour a nice big one, maybe even over a cube to give it a little, a little uh a little chill, and power this baby back. And know that you can do so, that it's it's not 127 proof, it's 90. Right. Like huge, huge difference. Um sit method. Shareable? Yes.

SPEAKER_01 13:21

Um, or you want to do it?

SPEAKER_02 13:24

Yeah, I do want to share this. I do want uh it's got the Buffalo Trace influence, which uh they're not Heaven Hill for me. I think there's a little too much hype with Buffalo Trace, and a little be, a little bit rightfully so. Um so I'll give them a meh. But they're a great, great, great, great, great brand. Uh, but and then price can't beat it. So I give this uh two and a half out of three. Not not my rating, not my rating, two and a half of the SIP.

SPEAKER_01 13:53

Nice. I uh I wish, you know what I wish we would have done? I wish we would have grabbed a Blanton's. Maybe we should and have a sip of Blantons with it because that's also a single barrel release. It's a hair younger. Elmer T Lee's known to be eight to nine years, Blanton's six to eight years, Blanton's 93 proof, Eli, you know, Elmer Tilly's 90 proof, both of the same number two mash bill. Both are single barrels. I I look that's something we should have probably done. But since I don't have that in front of me, um shareable, absolutely. Influence, it's Buffalo Trace. The story, I I mean Almer Tilly's the he is uh credited with being the founder of single barrels. I mean, that's what he he's like the first one to put single barrels to the market. Uh price, if you get it for 40 bucks to a hundred bucks, it's it's a good price. Uh, it's not something you're gonna get all the time. You're gonna be able to get blantons and wellers and think well wellers is a is a weeder, but I don't know if I want to pay a hundred bucks for this.

SPEAKER_02 14:46

I want to pay like if it's hey, the shop got it for 40 or 50 and they're kind of like jabbing me at like 85-ish, cool, but like a hundred plus tax plus everything, and I'm like, uh, I don't want to pay more than more than double its retail, but um a delicious, very simple, uh awesome, awesome taste.

SPEAKER_01 15:11

Yeah. I mean, uh, I'll you want me to give it a give it a number first? I'm gonna three and a half. Yeah, I was gonna say same thing. Exactly. Exactly the same thing. Three and a half. I guess I mean that's exactly what I was gonna say.

Sign Off And Nostalgic Outro

SPEAKER_02 15:25

This is good. Uh we'll have to check uh what we were last time. Oh, I have no idea. I don't keep track of that all the time. I bet we're pretty close. Uh at least uh at least relatively close. All right, let's go out. Uh I promised that would be a fast one. Go back to episode give or take 36 and listen to Elmer T. Lee. That was probably actually not that long of an episode either. So if you have time, pull over your car. If you're driving, don't scroll through and uh have an accident. But Elmer T. Lee, uh Mike and Tony, Shai Take Bourbon Brothers, we take care of the whiskey so you could focus on with whom you share it. Mr. Inventor of the single barrel, Elmer T. Lee. Oh man.

SPEAKER_03 16:08

Yo, VIP. Let's kick it.

SPEAKER_01 16:12

Same, same genre, same, same genre, same type of.

SPEAKER_02 16:15

Yo, VIP, let's kick it. If you're not like one hand on if you are driving one hand on the wheel and like the other one like just throwing the finger out, like not the middle finger, but like just your oh, like let's kick it. Because you know you, depending on your age, if you were like 10, 20, 30, 40 years old whenever this came out, depending on how old you are then, were that uh 10 and 20. Those are the ones. You know you danced to this at a party. You know you dance to this at a wedding. You know you dance. You know the words in someone's basement. You know the words. You know the words in someone's basement. Like, come on.

unknown 16:48

Don't wait.

SPEAKER_02 16:49

So fucking great. Uh good one, Tony. Uh, Elmer T. Lee, Mike and Tony. Good to hang with you. Good luck on your quick one.

SPEAKER_01 16:57

Good luck on your move. And we're all on arm. Now it's I'm unpacking and packing bourbon now. Thanks, guys.

SPEAKER_03 17:10

Now that the body is jumping, with the base kicked in and the fegus off. Quick to the point, to the point, no fresh.

unknown 17:20

I go crazy when I hear the floor.