EP96: The Culinary Compass: Navigating from Kitchens to Podcasts with Chef Steven Leung

Chef Steven Leung on Resilience, Entrepreneurship, and Redefining Success Beyond the Kitchen

Voice4Chefs welcomes chef Steven Leung, who began cooking in his family kitchen in Hong Kong at 12, trained at Le Cordon Bleu LA, and built his career in top Las Vegas kitchens including Mandarin Oriental and the Michelin-starred Guy Savoy, later serving as executive sous chef at the Cosmopolitan. He and host Michael recount meeting during the pandemic on the Clubhouse “Food Is Religion” community, where Steven gained confidence hosting conversations and drew a record crowd of over 600 with a simplified beef chow fun demo. Steven explains how the pandemic showed the risk of building a life on a platform you don’t own, prompting a shift from titles and technique to entrepreneurship, systems, ownership, and long-term thinking, with health as a key catalyst. He defines success as freedom, sustainability, and structure, and joins Voice4Chefs as co-host to deepen conversations on sustainability, business, and legacy.

00:00 Meet Chef Steven
01:02 New Year Welcome
01:47 How We Met
04:07 Clubhouse Nerves
05:59 Mimi Recruits Steven
09:18 Beef Chow Fun Goes Viral
09:56 Simplifying Home Cooking
15:15 From Passion to Business
16:22 Career Over Job
17:25 Pandemic Wake Up Call
18:22 Ownership And Leverage
19:09 Wild Vs Zoo
21:00 Health Forced Pivot
23:56 Savings Before The Leap
24:25 Redefining Success
25:41 Voice4Chefs Vision
28:09 Legacy And Freedom
29:45 Lightning Round
31:01 Final Takeaways

Season2

Welcome Chef Steven Leung as our new cohost.

IG: themindfulwok

Transcript

Michael Dugan: 0:52

Today on Voice4Chefs we're speaking with a very special guest, chef Steven Leung. He began his culinary career in his family kitchen in Hong Kong at age 12 from helping feed the family. He went on to train at Cordon Blue, LA Cordon Blue. Cook in top Las Vegas kitchens, including the Mandarin Oriental, Guy Savoy a Michelin star restaurant, and he was the executive sous chef at the Cosmopolitan Hotel. Now he has started a new and exciting chapter in his life in entrepreneurship. Chef Steven story is one of resilience, hard work, and mastering the fundamentals from flipping burgers. To leading high pressure stations in luxury hotels. He brings his experience, passion for food culture, and the love of mentoring others to  Voice4Chefs as our co-host. Please welcome Chef Steven.

Chef Steven: 1:48

Wow. Thank you so much, Michael. Hello everyone. Very pleased to be here. I'm very thankful as well. Today is the first day of Chinese New Year, so it was a bunch of celebrations, so. I mean the, the New year, new me mood and love it. Thank you so much, Michael, for the brief introduction. And fortunate, very lucky to be in the city of Las Vegas where we're exposed to a lot of celebrity chefs, a lot of good restaurants that just basically built my foundation of the culinary career.

Michael Dugan: 2:18

Oh my gosh. I love it. And your story is so unique and interesting, and I just love having you be part of Oyster for Chefs. And I, I'm really glad that you're back and. I know everyone's missed. You tell a little bit of your story and kind of help people understand a little bit about who you are, what you're doing now. But the thing I thought I would start out with is how, how we met,

Chef Steven: 2:43

of course.

Michael Dugan: 2:44

And so my perspective might be slightly different than yours, but I remember. Joining Food is Religion back in 2020. 2021. I think it was 20. Well Pandemic.

Chef Steven: 2:54

Yeah.

Michael Dugan: 2:54

Yeah. It was beginning or, or kind of in the middle of the pandemic a little bit. Yeah. And Chef Mimi Lan, who's a good friend of both of ours. I was new to Food is Religion and she was excited about the podcast. I was doing the ideas, but also connecting me to Food is Religion at the time. Yeah. There was about 5,000 people.

Chef Steven: 3:16

Yeah.

Michael Dugan: 3:16

In the Food Is Religion Club, and we were hosting, or other people were hosting meetings all day every night, 24 7. Lots of topics on food and the culinary arts and mental health. And you were hosting a room. And she said, I want to partner you up with Chef Steven. I was nervous. Now I'm like four and a half years later after podcasting. I'm not nervous. I'm excited, but

Chef Steven: 3:42

yeah.

Michael Dugan: 3:42

But at the time. I knew nothing. I

Chef Steven: 3:45

remember that.

Michael Dugan: 3:46

Yeah. Walked into that room and you made me feel so good. You made me feel so confident. And I came up on stage with you on the virtual stage in Clubhouse. It's an audio only app for those that are curious, but, and we had such a great time. And I was listening to you talk about food and deep dive into food and food culture. Yeah, I remember that. Yeah. And I remember being in many rooms with you and loving that journey. And that's kind of what kicked it off for me. But maybe you have a different perspective. I'm kind of curious what your perspective was.

Chef Steven: 4:21

I think the perspective was pretty close with you because very new myself as well. Again, at the time, clubhouse was the thing, right? You have to get invited to, to actually join the app. I entered the app without expecting, I didn't know what to expect for, and I first impression was. Of course, I, I choose rooms that are related to my background, which is food. Mm-hmm. And I landed, I believe in one of Mimi's room.

Michael Dugan: 4:51

Yeah.

Chef Steven: 4:51

And then I think because the app lets you chip in, right? Mm-hmm. Once you're directed to, to say something. And I felt like it was, it was fun because like before the pandemic, well, when I just landed my first management job, it was at the Mandalay Bay.

Michael Dugan: 5:09

Yeah.

Chef Steven: 5:10

I was a sous chef. And I could cook, I could create recipes, I can manage, I can do everything in a kitchen wise kind of job. But every day I would be so nervous for one part of the job is to preshift the staff because Really?

Michael Dugan: 5:29

Oh my gosh.

Chef Steven: 5:30

Okay. I get it. I get it. Yeah, because I was not a. Nobody was a good public speaker before. Right. They actually trained for it, or they have a passion, but some people are extroverts as well. When you take the MBTI test, I'm like completely introvert. I,

Michael Dugan: 5:46

oh,

Chef Steven: 5:46

I like whenever I can be alone. I like to be alone. But wow. I would public speak for the purpose of the job or for socialized reasons or for whatever reasons I would be very social. Sure, but I do not gain energy from crowds. Wow. I gain energy from myself,

Michael Dugan: 6:07

and I'm the opposite. I gain energy from crowds. Well, actually the funny part for me is that I work in technology, right? Mm-hmm. So I work with a bunch of introverted people, and that has caused me to become more introverted. But at the same time, one of my strengths is being an extrovert. So I'm an ambivert, which I, kind of delve in both worlds.

Chef Steven: 6:27

Hmm.

Michael Dugan: 6:28

But it's very interesting to hear you say that 'cause you went the opposite in clubhouse. Yeah, and I went the opposite in Clubhouse and I started to become more of an introvert. But there's strengths in both to to recognize and I think it's really good. But so Clubhouse was a great experience for you?

Chef Steven: 6:45

So long story short, got into Food is religion. I got into the club and then at that time I felt like all the topics of each rooms are super interested and they're super valuable. To people that are in the industry or they're mostly, eye openers for people that are not in the industry. Mm-hmm. Which is also very valuable. You get the insights and whatnot, and then. Chef Mimi called me on the phone. I mean, she, she reached out on social media. I got my number. Mm-hmm. Called me on the phone, gave me the small talk and the, uh, vision mm-hmm. In the whole club, like where she's trying to go and what value that brings to people that are in the industry or not in the industry. And she felt like I could be part of posting some topics of some rooms. I was very hesitant at first because. I did not like to be the voice of the room. My whole life. Right. And, and she said, no, it's easy. Mm-hmm. It's, I mean, she's, she told me she was the same, right? Yep. She, she was the same. Mm-hmm. And she got a little hook into some of the other rooms and she thought, why don't we just kind of organize our own thing? And she wants me to be part of the ride. I gave her. A long list of disclaimers, right? Yep. Right. Don't expect anything and blah, blah, blah. I forgot because it's been five years now.

Michael Dugan: 8:07

I know. It's been a long time.

Chef Steven: 8:09

Yeah. And then, but it was fun. It was fun. Mm-hmm. I actually, because Michael, you always say, I gave you the comfort, the confidence. You really

Michael Dugan: 8:17

did.

Chef Steven: 8:17

Yeah. I think it, it was the same thing. It was just mm-hmm. Happened to be, because I think I, I wasn't, I was new in hosting rooms and I'm always a follower more than a, leader most of my life, I can. Cooperate. I can do co-hosting. Mm-hmm. I can be a co-pilot or whatever. Right. I was nervous and then I think mm-hmm. We were both nervous.

Michael Dugan: 8:39

Mm-hmm.

Chef Steven: 8:40

And then we were trying to be very professionals in our corner. Right. It's just kind of the charisma happened and then I gained confidence from that. Because your words, Michael, you really lift people up as well, because people

Michael Dugan: 8:52

tell me that.

Chef Steven: 8:53

Yeah. And then I think it worked and then we both got getting confident and I mean at the end of the day, we were really trying to bring out the value, the knowledge. I think I'm trying to help the listeners. Understand something or open their eye on something that I experienced or I fought the way of making things right. And if my conclusion can, the wisdom, if you call it can help some other people in the field, I think that would be good for the whole picture because.

Michael Dugan: 9:24

Sure

Chef Steven: 9:24

I worked in different hotels and then I see the same problems.

Michael Dugan: 9:28

Yeah.

Chef Steven: 9:28

Different settings.

Michael Dugan: 9:29

Yeah. So, and we talked about those problems too. There were a lot of amazing rooms in food as religion, and I remember Maria. Was hosting one that was really about the culture of hospitality and the struggle of hospitality. I can't remember the title of it, but that was incredible.

Chef Steven: 9:46

Yeah.

Michael Dugan: 9:46

That was another one, but there were so

Chef Steven: 9:49

many, a lot. There's so many, uh, incredible. There's a lot of them. Yeah.

Michael Dugan: 9:51

Mm-hmm. One specific time, and I was so angry that I missed this. Room. And that was your room, the cooking. And it was January 29th, 2022. Oh, you got the exact date. Remember? Do you remember? I looked it up. I thought it was so amazing and somebody I know was making beef chow fun noodles. And that was your room. Can you tell me what happened? What did that feel like? Because that blew up.

Chef Steven: 10:24

Yeah. Yeah. I was surprised as well because

Michael Dugan: 10:28

mm-hmm.

Chef Steven: 10:30

I, a little backstory, I, I have a, a little cooking demo, I would say club locally, so I started doing cooking demos on the weekends. I mean, my weekend when I was working in the kitchen locally. Like at somebody's house. Like the, the owner of that house really liked to host a lot of different parties. Cool. And we met and he asked if I can, do some, you know, cooking demos, it'll be Mm-hmm. It's people of all backgrounds and professions have a connection. They like food.

Michael Dugan: 11:04

That's awesome.

Chef Steven: 11:05

So I started teaching like Michelin caliber stuff. Wow. Which is amazing to the crowd, but it was not too valuable for them. I found out because they would be like, wow, just like, what? How, how you, that's

Michael Dugan: 11:18

great,

Chef Steven: 11:19

but I'm not

Michael Dugan: 11:19

gonna do that.

Chef Steven: 11:20

Right. Right. Like it adds not no value except for part that they Wow. The factor. Right. I kind of, my kind of recipes and. The way of cooking for people, because a lot of people that comes to the cooking demo is they're home cooks. Mm-hmm. Or they're not even a home cook, but I'm trying to get them to cook at home. Yeah. So I have to make everything simplified. Right, right. So, I think I went through the classical way of cooking, so I understand theory, in theory. What's the, what's the right, let's say order or right direction to approach an ingredient. Mm-hmm. But there's also a, I, I don't like to put the word shortcut because I don't like people taking shortcuts, but

Michael Dugan: 12:06

yeah,

Chef Steven: 12:07

a lot of people, they.

Michael Dugan: 12:09

More efficient. More efficient. Way

Chef Steven: 12:11

more efficient way. Because you have to understand like the chemistry of that Yes. Particular ingredient.

Michael Dugan: 12:17

Yes.

Chef Steven: 12:17

Because there's not always one way to do one thing. There's different ways when you understand the chemistry and understand the recipe. So my point is, I, I took those like part recipes.

Michael Dugan: 12:31

Mm-hmm.

Chef Steven: 12:31

And I simplified them.

Michael Dugan: 12:32

Okay,

Chef Steven: 12:33

I would, I would give an example, French braised beef dish. Mm-hmm. It takes a long time, right? You have to make the stock, you have to, reduce the stock, right? You have to caramelize your onions, you have to

Michael Dugan: 12:42

mm-hmm.

Chef Steven: 12:43

Cook the meal product, cook everything down, wine and everything until you get. The perfect dish. Right,

Michael Dugan: 12:49

right.

Chef Steven: 12:50

But for home coke, yeah, they, they like the recipe and they like how it tastes, but they will never do it because it, it's so many steps. It's

Michael Dugan: 12:57

too complex.

Chef Steven: 12:57

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. So I'm not promoting any brands, but if you find some organic canned soups where there's not a lot of, weird stuff on it, just the most natural, can soup, you could find some french onion soup that is more natural and then you can go to Organic supermarkets to get vegetable juice, just like the V eight vegetable juice, but without the, all the additives and all the chemicals and stuff, but like the more natural ones. So what you do is you get a can of French and soup, some vegetable juice and some wine, buy 'em together and make that same sauce. Nice.

Michael Dugan: 13:36

Oh,

Chef Steven: 13:36

I get that right for the beef. And that saved you maybe two hours. Right? My point is, I, the backstory is I started the cooking demo. Mm-hmm. And I added the value because I simplify someone's everyday test and I felt good about it. Right. So in that channel, in, in the beef ch and episode, yes. I, yeah, I went into the same technique.

Michael Dugan: 14:00

Okay.

Chef Steven: 14:01

Yeah. So I, I. Because I don't just simplify for the task purposes. Mm-hmm. You have, it also has to taste good. So I kind of started speaking about the foundation of beef sheen, like what aspect that you have to have in there. Mm-hmm. But how you, how you can do that at home, like very, in a simple way.

Michael Dugan: 14:25

That's really cool.

Chef Steven: 14:26

And so I think. Like a quarter towards the, the session.

Michael Dugan: 14:32

Mm-hmm.

Chef Steven: 14:33

One of the, more influential person in Clubhouse. Yeah. I think she heard the value that's in the recipe. Mm-hmm. And she pulled a lot of people in.

Michael Dugan: 14:43

So how many people? Because in general we might have maybe 20, 30 people in a room. Sometimes a little bit more than that. Right. How many people showed up?

Chef Steven: 14:53

I don't remember the numbers correctly.

Michael Dugan: 14:55

Big,

Chef Steven: 14:55

maybe. Yeah. It was like 600, right?

Michael Dugan: 14:58

Yeah. That's biggest room food is religion ever had, so congratulations for that. That was pretty cool.

Chef Steven: 15:06

That was cool. Yeah. Mm-hmm.

Michael Dugan: 15:08

And so the FI think one of the founders showed up and they brought a bunch of people and that was pretty powerful and I missed it. Yeah. Oh God, I would've loved to be there with you and celebrate, man. Yeah. I really wish I had been there.

Chef Steven: 15:21

It's just a good, great like validation of

Michael Dugan: 15:23

mm-hmm.

Chef Steven: 15:24

Not just my skill because I want to add value in a way of simplifying people's life.

Michael Dugan: 15:31

Right?

Chef Steven: 15:31

I think with that thought, it validates it and

Michael Dugan: 15:34

yeah.

Chef Steven: 15:34

That's awesome. Yeah. Drive me to keep doing more.

Michael Dugan: 15:38

What we wanna talk about is right now, what you're doing now, so how did your journey into food and entrepreneurship truly begin, and when did it become more than just job?

Chef Steven: 15:53

Food. I think I mentioned it before, it was never a job for me because I, I remember I start out at the Mandarin Oriental as a cook and a lot of my peers, they, I would say, I wouldn't say a lot, but there was, there were a few peers mm-hmm. That went from back of the house to front of the house because they saw how many, how much tips or, you know, oh yeah. Money. These, uh, servers, runners, or, busers can make mm-hmm. Compared to a cook. Mm-hmm. Because we're all, I think at the time, we're making $18 an hour.

Michael Dugan: 16:31

Yeah.

Chef Steven: 16:32

And it was nothing after tax. It's like. Two grand.

Michael Dugan: 16:35

I know

Chef Steven: 16:36

a server easily at a five star hotel, they would make five, $600 in tips per night.

Michael Dugan: 16:43

Oh, that's insane.

Chef Steven: 16:44

You have to go through that mentality. Right? I keep on saying to myself, Hey Steven, you're not just looking for a job. You're kind of building a foundation for a career.

Michael Dugan: 16:54

Yes,

Chef Steven: 16:54

yes. Because to I say to myself, A job can always be replaced. Technology can replace a career is it's more sustainable, right? Mm-hmm. I fought through that time to not thinking about just making money at the moment. Sorry, the question. Food was never just a job. It was more of a career, more of, I would say it, it was more of a identity.

Michael Dugan: 17:17

okay.

Chef Steven: 17:17

Because I, I trained seriously, right? I put in the sweat and then I became an executive chef. I. Push through, high pressure kitchens. And for a long time I thought, success meant me mastering techniques. Of course, earning titles, that's, I mean, that's normal for a lot of people, right? Mastering techniques, something people don't know you can do, something people cannot do. And then earning the title right? But over time, especially, we were talking about the pandemics, I realized something that. The thing is you can build your entire life on a platform that you do not own.

Michael Dugan: 17:58

Mm.

Chef Steven: 17:58

That's what I realized.

Michael Dugan: 18:00

Okay.

Chef Steven: 18:01

Because in the old Chinese saying, there's saying that as long as you work hard, you won't starve. But when the pandemic happened, every hotel on the strip closed.

Michael Dugan: 18:13

That's right.

Chef Steven: 18:14

So what about working hard because mm-hmm. When there's no platform for you to work hard, didn't

Michael Dugan: 18:19

matter. Didn't matter.

Chef Steven: 18:21

You can build your entire life on a platform. You do not own that. That's what I learned. Okay. Because restaurant, they close contracts will end and system changes the time.

Michael Dugan: 18:30

Mm-hmm.

Chef Steven: 18:31

So the pandemic was a wake up call because that was time that I realized it's scary not to have control over something.

Michael Dugan: 18:38

Yep.

Chef Steven: 18:39

That was a wake up call. So my journey shifted from being just excelling in the kitchen. I turned into building systems and relationship outside of the kitchen.

Michael Dugan: 18:51

Hmm.

Chef Steven: 18:51

So entrepreneurship, community building, and then for me to understand money a little bit more, and sustainability

Michael Dugan: 19:03

mm-hmm.

Chef Steven: 19:03

Of career or my life in general. I started to ask, myself bigger questions because now. I mean, food is still my foundation, but ownership. Oh

Michael Dugan: 19:14

yeah. Leverage. It's in your soul. Yeah. It's in, well, you can't get rid of that,

Chef Steven: 19:18

but ownership, leverage, and long-term thinking. Mm-hmm. I mean, that's kind of the evolution.

Michael Dugan: 19:23

Okay. Fantastic.

Chef Steven: 19:25

Yeah.

Michael Dugan: 19:25

What did entrepreneurship expose about you that you weren't prepared for?

Chef Steven: 19:31

Like I said, I had to learn more about money. Right. Okay. And I think exposure was,

Michael Dugan: 19:38

did you feel vulnerable about anything?

Chef Steven: 19:41

I actually had a talk with. One of my friend that I haven't seen for a long time, I, I just met him at the restaurant and we were like, Hey, long time no see, blah, blah, blah. And then I told him I left the job, I'm doing something on my own.

Michael Dugan: 19:54

Mm-hmm.

Chef Steven: 19:54

And then he's also a chef as well. And then he, he told me, oh, how the hell, I'm so proud of you, I envy you, because now you don't have a set schedule. Mm-hmm. We would say normal nine to five, but we're not nine to five. But you don't have a set schedule. You're, you have freedom, blah, blah, blah. And I told him, like, me and you. Or both. Imagine that we're both lions, right? With a job, you're kind of in a zoo, right? You get fed every day. Mm-hmm. No matter what as a lion, right? In a zoo.

Michael Dugan: 21:18

Sure.

Chef Steven: 21:19

And compared to entrepreneurship, you're a lion in the wild, you're free, but nothing's guaranteed. You have to hunt for it. So that sense of vulnerability, I think comes from the un unstable. Right? Mm-hmm. And before you reach the light, it's like before you reach the light, you're, you feel lost, right? Am I doing this correctly? Am I setting myself up correctly for, the success that I wanted? And then so forth. Yeah.

Michael Dugan: 21:49

Was there anything, was there any kind of catalyst that. Made you pivot from being a chef to truly being an entrepreneur. Was there something like a defining moment, anything that happened? To you that you said, that's it, I'm making this move and I'm, I'm leaving and I'm gonna, I'm gonna make this move full-time.

Chef Steven: 22:10

Yep. It's health.

Michael Dugan: 22:11

That's what I thought. Yeah.

Chef Steven: 22:13

Yes. Mental health and also, physical health because mm-hmm. When I was working at my last job, I filled in the spot for executive chefs of the restaurants mm-hmm. That are inside the hotel. Right. No matter if it's the turnover rate, if it's the applications. So I pop in, different restaurants,

Michael Dugan: 22:33

so you're like floating from different restaurants, so you have to pivot right on the fly. Wow.

Chef Steven: 22:38

Yeah.

Michael Dugan: 22:39

That's even more intense than just being a chef. That's, oh my God.

Chef Steven: 22:42

So when you put it on fires kind of here and there, right? Sure. So, little backstory. During New Year's Eve morning, we had an in Italian restaurant that never serves brunch because finite restaurants mostly just operate, nighttime. So that, morning they decided, oh, this year we're gonna do brunch. But the Italian chefs, European chefs, they're very hands-on.

Michael Dugan: 23:07

Mm-hmm.

Chef Steven: 23:07

They're not the expo that you see in most, American style restaurants. They like to touch the food, taste the food, which I think I agree with. But Vegas is such a high volume.

Michael Dugan: 23:17

Mm-hmm.

Chef Steven: 23:18

That you have to be quarterbacking a lot of stuff. You have to be the general of the ship. So at. On, on New Year's Eve morning, we, we had I think, three chefs that are scheduled to do the brunch. Two sous chef and the main executive chef. And I thought everything would be handled right because you have three chefs there, but they're still not used to the brunch kind of. Flow.

Michael Dugan: 23:47

Oh wow.

Chef Steven: 23:48

So I walked by trying to say hi to everyone. I thinking everything would be okay. Right? And then the runners was like, chef, can you stay here where it's going down? I was like, what? So I was pulled in and then I had to, organize everything. So my point is I was putting out fire and. I would say I'm a very responsible person. I don't just work and then, oh, it's time to go home. Mm-hmm. I still think about my job when I'm off work and stuff like that. So I would say every time I really get a day off, I would feel like my whole body like. When I wake up the morning of my day off, right, I, I felt like my whole body is like oxidating. I'm about to get, the pre fever kind of feeling. Your throat kind of feels slimy and

Michael Dugan: 24:35

mm-hmm.

Chef Steven: 24:36

Your whole body feels like sore and

Michael Dugan: 24:39

Oh yeah.

Chef Steven: 24:40

Your, every part of your cell is attacked by different free radicals and then oxidizing,

Michael Dugan: 24:47

and you're not, you're not motivated to do much.

Chef Steven: 24:50

Yeah.

Michael Dugan: 24:50

Because you gotta go back to work.

Chef Steven: 24:52

Yeah. Yeah.

Michael Dugan: 24:53

And, and so you, you just wanna lay down and you don't really get time to relax.

Chef Steven: 24:57

Yeah.

Michael Dugan: 24:58

Yep.

Chef Steven: 24:59

I can

Michael Dugan: 24:59

relate

Chef Steven: 24:59

that one day I was like, yeah. So I would, I would recommend, side income or not. Because if you don't have savings or, financially support. Supportive, sources. It's hard to pivot.

Michael Dugan: 25:12

Yeah, that makes sense,

Chef Steven: 25:14

right? Because entrepreneurship, you do not make any money until you make money, right?

Michael Dugan: 25:18

Mm-hmm. It takes time. Yeah. Yeah, it takes time. So you've built businesses beyond the kitchen. What is your definition of success in what you're doing now? What makes you feel successful?

Chef Steven: 25:32

I think, uh, like I said earlier in my career, success was titles. Right? Right. Titles are, are validation because, and recognition, right?

Michael Dugan: 25:42

Mm-hmm.

Chef Steven: 25:42

And, and being the, the best, the most knowledgeable, the best cook in the room. I think now, as you can tell, success is freedom, right? Mm-hmm. Freedom of time, freedom of decision, freedom to choose who I work with and. So honestly, success also means building something that doesn't collapse if I step away for a week, right?

Michael Dugan: 26:07

Okay.

Chef Steven: 26:07

I, I think because chefs are trained to grind, right? We're trained to be proud of the, uh, exhaustion, right?

Michael Dugan: 26:15

Mm-hmm.

Chef Steven: 26:16

But long term, that's not sustainable,

Michael Dugan: 26:18

right?

Chef Steven: 26:19

So my definition of success matured. From hustle to structure. Right. From talent to systems.

Michael Dugan: 26:29

Mm.

Chef Steven: 26:30

Okay. So from survival to strategies?

Michael Dugan: 26:32

Mm.

Chef Steven: 26:33

Yeah.

Michael Dugan: 26:34

That's brilliant.

Chef Steven: 26:35

Yeah.

Michael Dugan: 26:35

Okay,

Chef Steven: 26:36

great. Yeah.

Michael Dugan: 26:37

As you step into this next chapter with entrepreneurship. You're also coming on as a cohost with  Voice4Chefs again. Yes. I'm so excited about seeing

Chef Steven: 26:48

Excited. Yes,

Michael Dugan: 26:49

very excited. So what excites you most about that and what kind of impact do you wanna make through these conversations that we have with chefs?

Chef Steven: 26:57

I think what excites me would be these conversations, creating more depth. Because we do not want to surface level chef interviews that everyone will know the answer of. We wanna talk to chefs that are working on sustainability.

Michael Dugan: 27:17

Mm-hmm.

Chef Steven: 27:18

Because sustainability is be beyond a trendy buzzword because it's really being responsible. Like in in your heart, you want to. Make a change, right? Mm-hmm. So these conversations would be very exciting and valuable.

Michael Dugan: 27:35

Cool. Very cool.

Chef Steven: 27:37

We interview with some chefs that are also entrepreneurs, so get an insight of what ownership really looks like because a lot of chefs, unfortunately, a lot of chefs, they open restaurants and fail because True. They just want to put showcase what they, their talent is, they don't think about the numbers. They don't

Michael Dugan: 27:55

mm-hmm.

Chef Steven: 27:56

Do the data analysts. And then it's a business, right? Having conversations with chefs that are entrepreneurs can really give insights of what ownership really looks like, right? And I think also chefs can, you know, kind of learn, or they can hear how they can protect themselves financially, right? Mm-hmm. And maybe how food connects to the community and eventually leaves a legacy for it. Them as a in individual, right? So there are so many talented chefs who never learn business structure like say mm-hmm. And then there's entrepreneurs who don't understand craft. So if the podcast can bridge the gap, I love it. It's powerful. It's powerful.

Michael Dugan: 28:43

With you being our co-host, you're gonna hold me accountable to that, which I absolutely love because I can learn a lot from you, just like you can learn a lot from me. Same.

Chef Steven: 28:53

Yes.

Michael Dugan: 28:54

Yeah. It's so we're

Chef Steven: 28:54

bridging the gap already.

Michael Dugan: 28:56

I love it. Oh my gosh, I love it. And the energy and the positivity that we can put out to the world. Yes, yes. Inspire people. Agreed. Is powerful. So 10 years from now, what do you hope people say about Chef Steven? Not just professionally but personally?

Chef Steven: 29:13

Honestly, I want 10 years from now, I think even one year from now. I just want to build structures and systems where people can be successful and they don't need to mention about me. I can be the ghost because I, I think, uh. Expectation and repetition comes with responsibility. It's not saying I don't like responsibility, but being free Uhhuh life. I think it's more, I wouldn't say internal life as in going to Hawaii or The Bahamas every day, but like I mentioned before, the freedom to choose. You can say no to a lot of people. You don't have that responsibility to obligate. I think true everyone's life is, at the end of the day, it is short-lived when, when you get there, right? Mm-hmm. And then you just, you don't want to, you know, sacrifice time with family and, and your loved ones and maybe new interests that freedom can bring. Mm-hmm. I think, uh, I hope 10 years from now. Not to care about what they say about me as a person, but if I left a legacy for other chefs to also really realize life is more important, I think that would be a major milestone. Right.

Michael Dugan: 30:32

Maybe we can do some of that on the podcast together.

Chef Steven: 30:34

Yeah.

Michael Dugan: 30:35

That would be powerful. Yes. And pur and purposeful, right?

Chef Steven: 30:39

Yeah, I think so. Yeah.

Michael Dugan: 30:40

Cool. So as we move on, we're gonna do a lightning round. We haven't done that before, but I thought this would be fun.

Chef Steven: 30:46

Yes.

Michael Dugan: 30:47

Are you ready? Take a drink and get ready.

Chef Steven: 30:49

Yep.

Michael Dugan: 30:50

Alright. One word that describes your leadership style.

Chef Steven: 30:54

Sympathy.

Michael Dugan: 30:57

Okay. The biggest risk you've ever taken.

Chef Steven: 31:01

Entrepreneurship,

Michael Dugan: 31:03

I can tell. Proud. Proud of you. Very proud of you. A mistake that made you better?

Chef Steven: 31:09

A mistake that made me better. That I moved out here to Vegas from, from the Bay Area. Away from my family. Yeah.

Michael Dugan: 31:19

Ah, okay. Something that's non-negotiable. Non-negotiable. In your kitchen or in entrepreneurship,

Chef Steven: 31:28

in honesty.

Michael Dugan: 31:30

Love it. Love it. One habit. In your life that keeps you sharp,

Chef Steven: 31:37

just being on top of the trend.

Michael Dugan: 31:40

Something chefs don't talk about enough

Chef Steven: 31:42

mental health.

Michael Dugan: 31:43

Love it. If you weren't in food, what would you be doing?

Chef Steven: 31:47

I would probably be a singer.

Michael Dugan: 31:49

Oh wow. Awesome. Okay, and then finish this sentence,

Chef Steven: 31:53

legacy means to guide.

Michael Dugan: 31:56

Okay. Fantastic. Any last words about this episode? Any last words you wanna say out to the world of Voice4chefs?'cause we're now global

Chef Steven: 32:04

understanding Kitchen, right? The intensity, the ego.

Michael Dugan: 32:07

Yep.

Chef Steven: 32:08

The craft. But I also understand. Business models now ownership and long-term positioning. I would be very excited if in the future we can interview more chefs. That brings conversation for listeners to actually learn in the kitchen. What leverages, what is the possible risk when you own a restaurant?

Michael Dugan: 32:31

Mm-hmm.

Chef Steven: 32:32

And are they building something scalable or just sustainable? Are they building income or just equity? I care a lot about, when we bring up the word legacy, it's not just what dishes are we known for, but what are we building that actually would last and brings us freedom to actually live our life? I think that kind of lens. It's something I naturally would bring into every conversation.

Michael Dugan: 33:02

Well, chef Steven, thanks for being our guest, but also thanks for being my cohost Yes. Partner in crime and I'm so excited about moving forward with this.

Chef Steven: 33:11

Very excited.