Jerry born visually impaired in 1950 difficulties traveling at night especially winter conditions

Today I’m sharing the interview with Jerry, conducted March 11, 2001. He is visually impaired, but not mobility visually impaired, except at night. His experiences at night in winter snow demonstrate the resilience of mankind in the face of daunting odds, but also how alone people with visual impairments feel – never once had he considered bringing up his difficulties to a trained professional to seek out additional training and support or new tools to try and make his travel easier. 

Jerry grew up with a visual impairment that he felt he was able to move about without a long cane and also benefited from the long cane, once he got one. He neve indicated his acuity  - it was worse than 20/400 – or legally blind, and he had more difficulty at night. That he learned to use his long cane wearing a blindfold, did not ultimately seem to prepare him for night travel. 

 A preferred alternative is to actually teach someone with low vision at night, that way they experience the benefits of their vision and the challenges of having less information. Night blindness is much more pronounced in people with a visual impairment than people who are sighted – so under the same conditions of night time, sighted people are able to see more with less light than someone with a visual impairment.

 Jerry is rightly proud of himself and what he is able to do- but in my estimation, he was never given the permission to consider returning to get more O&M to get additional support for these very challenging situations he finds himself in – nighttime, streets covered in snow banks, and perhaps implementing the latest technology (not an option when he was interviewed) but certainly in 2023.

 The field of O&M is essential, but there are very few instructors, limited budgets and even less time and money spent developing new instructional strategies. So, Jerry breaks his cane in frustration, rather than pick up the phone and call for a refresher course. Why is that?

 He continued to take public transport in his 50s and this puts him in places with unsavory characters – never thinking perhaps he should just find a way to get a car and driver – he has a good job– likely he could afford it…

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Transcript

 Today I’m sharing the interview with Jerry, conducted March 11, 2001. He is visually impaired, but not mobility visually impaired, except at night. His experiences at night in winter snow demonstrate the resilience of mankind in the face of daunting odds, but also how alone people with visual impairments feel – never once had he considered bringing up his difficulties to a trained professional to seek out additional training and support or new tools to try and make his travel easier. Let’s listen to the adventures of Jerry in Detroit

Jerry, 3/11/01

[side A]

Q. State spell your full name.

A. OK. Jerry H.

Q. And your date of birth.

A. 1950.

Q. OK. Where were you born?

A. In Pontiac, Michigan,

Q. And where do you live now?

A. Royal Oak, Michigan, just outside of Detroit.

Q. Uh, what do you do for a living?

A. I work with Internal Revenue Service. I’m a, what am I, these days? A contact representative with their automated collection branch. I used to work with taxpayer service, but we’re in collection now. I’ve been there 25 years this year.

Q. Neat.

A. Yeah, it’s a living. ________________

Q. It’s good to call you friend. [laugh]

A. What?

Q. It’s good to call you friend. [laugh] Anybody who works for the IRS… [laugh]

A. People just back away.

Q. [laugh]

A. [laugh]

Q. I'm sure. Where did you go to college?

A. I, uh, got an associate degree at, uh, Michigan Christian Junior College, it’s called Rochester College now. It’s in Rochester, Michigan.

Q. OK. How long have you had a vision impairment?

A. All my life. I’m a… I had ROP.

Q. OK.

A. So, yep, all my life.

Q. Could you describe your current functional vision?

A. Uh, it’s very low. I can see maybe, maybe very large objects. I can see well enough to well enough to, like, walk on a sidewalk, that sort of thing, but it’s not much more than that anymore.

Q. So, growing up, uh, you had fairly good vision…

A. Well, that’s, that’s relative. I don’t think I ever got up to 20/200.

Q. Uh huh.

A. Maybe it was about 20/400, or something. It was a lot better than it is now, but nothing anywhere near approaching, you know, the margin of legal blindness, really.

Q. And you always had trouble with any kind of glare or lighting conditions or darkness or…

A. Oh, I always had trouble in the dark. The lighter it was, the better it was for me. I always liked outside, you know, ‘cause I could… Whatever vision I had was really a lot better the more light you could get, the better off I was.

Q. When did you first realize you were visually impaired?

A. Uh, good question. Maybe, maybe three or four.

Q. Uh huh.

A. Three or four…something like that. I’m not sure if my parents told me or I just… I think it was just seeing what other…you know telling what other people could tell as opposed to what I was able to tell.

Q. Yeah.

A. That kind of thing. I don’t remember one particular point where I said, hey, there’s something different about me, or anything like that.

Q. When did you first learn to travel independent of another person?

A. Uh, my actual first mobility lesson was in sixth grade. Um, they had a mobility instructor come out from Detroit to Pontiac where I grew up and, uh, and, and, give me lessons. As far as traveling independently, I went to Michigan School for the Blind in Lansing for the first six years and, you know, we traveled around campus. Back then, they didn’t give you mobility.

Q. No.

A. Till you were fifth or sixth grade, you know, so you just, kind of, went at it…  We had to go from one building to the other. I guess it depends on what you mean by, like, independently. Uh, you know, I could go to… When I was in sixth grade, I went to, uh, uh… I started going to school in Pontiac at a, you know, a regular elementary school and I could go from, from home to that school, um, you know… I didn’t use a cane or anything so I had enough vision where I could, you know, walk around. There’s a lot of things I couldn’t tell, but I could walk down the street. I used to be able to ride a bike…terribly slowly, but I could ride the bike.

Q. Neat. So, um, were you restricted in any way by anyone?

A. Uh, well, my parents were always concerned about me, um, and they weren’t the type to just let the kids run crazy…

Q. Yeah.

A. …or any place they wanted. I mean, this was back in the early ‘60s when the parents actually felt like they had to control kids, you know?

Q. Yeah.

A. Uh, but it… So, they didn’t let me get very far but I don’t remember thinking, boy, they’re treating me different than my sisters because I’m blind or restricting me any more.

Q. So, you didn’t desire more independence.

A. No, I was always a big chicken, you know…

Q. [laugh]

A. …I’m not one of these go-get-‘em kind of guys. So, it… Um, my life was pretty tame.

Q. Well, I’m sure at the school for the blind you had friends who used canes.

A. Uh, actually, no.

Q. No.

A. ‘Cause you know they didn’t get into that until older and, um, I, I think they were probably going to get into that in the next year and in the sixth grade is when I started public school.

Q. Right.

A. So, I think in sixth grade, they could start going across the street to this little store we had and in the seventh grade, they, we could even branched out more. So, I… remember I heard later from my friends, you know, that’s when things…the neat things really started happening.

Q. Right. But you didn’t… Did you get to do any of that?

A. Not at the school. Uh, you know, when I went back home and went to school, I could, you know, go around the neighborhood and, you know, I had friends that I hung out with, and we did just whatever. I didn’t… I don’t even remember when I really started using a cane on a regular basis. It wasn’t until… I don’t think I even used one in high school…

Q. Is that right?

A. …on a regular basis. Yeah…

Q. Do you remember using any strategies to…

A. Um, well, let’s see… I’m having to bring up old memories here. Well, I would always, you know, because I could see very well, I had to use things like, uh, light areas, dark areas, you know, like the grass is dark, the sidewalks are light, so I, you know, and deal with that. Um, at night when I was walking around, I would use streetlights as landmarks and… ‘cause you could see lights better than you could see anything else.

Q. Yeah.

A. So, there was those… Um, there’s probably all kinds of others that I’m not thinking of right now. I know I had, yeah… I know I had them. ‘Cause you can… I have, what do they call it, facial vision, or whatever, so I can hear larger…[laugh] hear large objects so, you know, your openings and, you know, where the doors are, and you can hear if you’re walking by something. If I didn’t know some other way, I could tell by that, you know, the absence of sound. You know all that kind of thing.

Q. Neat. Um, so do you think not having a cane was a problem, or…

A. Uh, for me, it wasn’t, I don’t think. Once I learned mobility when I was in the sixth grade, if I went any place real big, like a real busy, like, across, uh…where you had to cross at light and things like that, from what I remember I would use the cane. For most of the time, I didn’t use it, but, um, once I learned the skills, I thought it was important to use the cane…mainly at that point for other people, so they’d know I was blind.

Q. Oh, yeah.

A. Now that I don’t have vision anymore, I’ve got to use it for me.

Q. Yeah. So, was that…that would make people more aware of you.

A. Right, and for the things that I couldn’t watch out for, they’d have to watch out for.

Q. Neat.

A. That kind of a thing, ‘cause they’d be…if I didn’t have a cane, of course, they’d be thinking I was watching out and…

Q. Right.

A. …I was doing what I could but not as much as they thought.

Q. So, what do you remember as a method that was used to teach you O&M?

A. Well, they, uh, uh, they blindfolded me, uh, and so I learned to use the cane basically with no vision at all.

Q. Hm.

A. And I don’t remember if, like, part of the way through this, oh, six- or eight-week course… I have no idea how long it actually was…it was, like, for two or three hours on Saturday morning over a number of weeks. And, uh, mostly, I was blindfolded. But, I’m thinking, maybe, toward the end, I didn’t use the blindfold, but I did a lot of the basic cane work with the blindfold which, which I think is actually good…

Q. Yeah.

A. …especially when you’ve got vision like I had and you tend to rely on it maybe more than you should, or maybe thinking you can see more than you can.

Q. Right. Um, so you did indoors, outdoors…?

A. Uh, mainly outdoors… We probably did indoors… I mean, this was in 1962, so, what is that 40 years ago?

Q. Yeah.

A. So, there are a few details I can’t remember.

Q. No, that’s fine. Whatever…I realize that [laugh] So, um, mostly outdoors and do you remember like going on, like, buses or doing anything like that?

A. No, we didn’t do that. We mainly went downtown Pontiac, which was a pretty thriving, uh, downtown area at that time. Now it’s dead, but that’s another subject entirely.

Q. Yeah.

A. But, uh, we’d drive downtown… He’d pick me up at the house and we’d drive downtown, just walk around, um… We must have gone in stores, but I can’t really remember doing it. Most of the stuff I remember is, is basically outside. I think we did some things at the very beginning… He came to the, he came to the school, and I think we probably worked a little bit there, but I don’t actually remember… I remember being in the school, but I don’t remember working in the school. But that would be logical to assume that we did, especially so he could determine where, you know, where I was at.

Q. Yeah. So, you worked with the blindfold, and you worked… Did you work on using your vision also?

A. Not that I can remember.

Q. And, was he your only mobility instructor?

A. At that point, yeah. I didn’t have mobility again until I went to college prep at Harbor Hospital in 1968 and I was 18 at that time.

Q. Um hm.

A. And then that’s when we really started mobility. Um, that’s almost downtown Detroit, so we did all kinds of stuff. We did, you know, buses, we did buildings, we did everything.

Q. What were some of the strategies that you found most helpful?

A. Most helpful… I can’t think of anything that, that they wanted me to do that I didn’t think was very helpful.

Q. Um hm.

A. I can’t think of anything.

Q. It was all helpful, or…

A. I believe so.

Q. Yeah.

A. Yeah. I do.

Q. Um, what are some of the things that you use today that you learned, you think, back then?

A. Um, things like, I guess, are pretty much standard, really like, uh, listening to traffic flow, um… We have a right on red law up here so…

Q. That’s nice.

A. [laugh]

Q. Very nice.

A. You’ve got to watch, you’ve got to watch them ‘cause they don’t seem to care about you.

Q. Right.

A. But it, it…

Q. Oh, you mean they can turn right on red.

A. Yeah.

Q. Oh, that’s too bad. [laugh]

A. Yeah, right.

Q. New York City, you’re not allowed to, that’s what I meant.

A. Oh, OK. Yeah…

Q. Your law’s the other way.

A. Yeah, I don’t remember when they did it up here, but…this was years ago…but, yeah, now, if, if, it’s free, you know, there are certain places that it has a certain kind of sign that you can’t, but, of course, I can’t tell where that sign is and where it’s not.

Q. Right.

A. Um, you always have to watch out for it. Um, so mainly, I guess the traffic pattern… I still have enough vision so I can see the white lines and that makes it, that makes it nice. Um…

Q. Sure.

A. And, uh… I don’t know. Um, that’s all that comes to mind right now. I…

Q. Yeah.

A. …I just do it, you know?

Q. Yeah.

A. We had a real good mobility, uh, program… I went to, uh, it used to be called Michigan Rehabilitation Center for the Blind in Kalamazoo in 1974… I was 24 at the time and they had an excellent mobility, uh, course there. I mean, they ran you through everything. They would, they would tell you to find so-and-so business and actually go there and… I mean, they didn’t even take you outside. I mean, it was just you, you had to go out, get on the bus, do the whole nine yards…

Q. [laugh]

A….and get there and go in the waiting room of whatever business this was. It was kind of interesting, uh, I don’t know that I liked it at the time ‘cause it was more… It was kind of trial under fire, really.

Q. Yeah.

A. But, man, that would, that would really, uh, that would really, that really taught you.

Q. Yeah.

A. It really did. And I’m glad I went through it. I mean, like I said, at the time I don’t really like it…

Q. [laugh]

A. …much, um… I was young and foolish then…it was more work than anything, but, uh, um, but now, it, it… I can look back on it at the ripe old age of 51 and think, man, that was really…it was good for me.

Q. So, would they go with you?

A. Um, yeah, they would but they were, they were mainly… They weren’t with you… They were with you, but not with you.

Q. Yeah.

A. I think sometimes they would even drive to these places…you take the bus, and they’d drive and they'd wait for you.

Q. Right.

A. And then you’d, um, you’d get off the bus and you’d find the place and… I remember this one place was in a warehouse. This was really weird, but anyway… It was…that was kind of an interesting, uh… I forgot the name but I should know it, I… But it was… This guy’s office was on, like the second floor of a warehouse and I’m going in there and I’m thinking… I don’t know…

Q. Right.

A. [laugh]

Q. [laugh]

A. Cause it certainly didn’t seem like a place a mobility instructor would want you to go. 

Q. Right.

A. But it was the place.

Q. [laugh] Did you ever go without the mobility instructor as part of a lesson?

A. Um, not that I can remember.

Q. Um hm.

A. Uh, ‘cause, you know, towards the end of it, they would, you'd kind of eventually meet each other. But I don’t remember actually ever going and then coming back and saying, well, this is where I went, and this is what I did.

Q. Yeah.

A. Um, but, um, most of the time they weren’t close enough to give you any real help.

Q. Right. [laugh]

A. If felt like, they were they weren't even there.

Q. Right.

A. I remember one time, it was really funny… It was, like, back, uh, when they had the, uh, elevator… Elevators where you just touched…you know, touch pad on the elevators and I’m walking up to this elevator and I’m pushing on this thing and nothing…absolutely nothing is happening. There’s no buttons and probably the guy took pity on me and came over and said, you know, these things don’t press. [laugh] And I’m going mash, mash, mash. [laugh] And, what the heck is going on here?

Q. [laugh]

A. He said, no these aren’t buttons, so… I’m thinking, how do I get this thing to go up… That was funny.

Q. [laugh] So, um, did you find yourself being, feeling more confident after that training than before?

A. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

Q. And how did that play out, then?

A. Well, um, after I went to MRCB, I started the, uh, training program in Little Rock at Arkansas Enterprises for the Blind…Lion’s World Services, they call it now. And, uh, for the, uh, we called it the TSR program, Taxpayer Services Representative program. And, uh, if nothing else, you know, I felt like I could go any place and do anything.

Q. Neat.

A. …at that point.

Q. How many, um, different types of mobility tools have you tried?

A. Uh, not too many. Just basically, straight canes and folding canes. I’ve never tried a laser device or anything like that.

Q. What travel tool do you use now?

A. Just a white cane. Oh, I don’t… I’ve never had a dog. I’m not a dog person.

Q. Yeah.

A. I tell people, if they come out with leader cats, let me know.

Q. [laugh] I don’t know about that. [laugh]

A. [laugh] me and a kitty cat we get along pretty well, but…

Q. [laugh]

A. [laugh …no, I’m not a dog person.

Q. But aren’t cats known for their independence? [laugh]

A. [laugh] Well, they probably wouldn’t make a good leader cat.

Q. [laugh] If they felt like it, maybe they would bring you… [laugh]

A. Well…

Q. …go with you. [laugh] Uh, how many canes do you own?

A. Uh, oh, I could give you the joke and say, about 150, but I won’t.

Q. ‘Cause you sell them…

A. ‘Cause we sell them, right.

Q. For your own personal use.

A. Yeah, I know that’s what you meant.

Q. [laugh]

A. Uh, let’s see, I have, uh, maybe four or five. I’m, I’m kind of getting the, um, the sense that it’s kind of nice to have different kinds to do different things with. Like, I have, uh, an NFB, uh, telescoping cane that I use in church. I really like it because it, you know, collapses down into one section.

Q. Yes.

A. But, yet, if you get the thing out on the streets, it’s not, it’s not very good. I really like the fact that… I use a Braille display all the time…I type all day ‘cause I work on a computer all day and once in a great while I have trouble with my wrists, so I was looking for something that was real light and I like those because they’re light and some of the other carbon fiber ones, but a lot of them just aren’t study, so, yeah I like the, uh, the telescoping one for church and for, like, indoor things but, uh, I like, uh, aluminum for outside. So, um, and then I have one the straight cane that I, that I use going downtown Royal Oak here…knocking around, uh, just kind of save the wear and tear on the collapsible one that I use for work, so, um… I’ve kind of broadened out a little bit in that respect.

Q. Neat. Um, so, let’s see, so, how do you get to and from work?

A. I, uh, take the bus.

Q. Do you have any strategies for bus riding?

A. Um, strategies…

Q. Or tips?

A. Make sure, get on the doggone right bus.

Q. Oh. How do you do that?

A. Well, I usually ask, you know, are you going downtown Detroit? A lot of them, of course, um, you know… You depend on the schedule, so you know what buses are coming along. Uh, but when you’re downtown and coming back this way, you have to, you know… Always ask because, I’ve noticed the public, they’ll tell you… They’ll think they know and they don’t know.

Q. Yeah.

A. That’s weird, you know. If you don’t know, don’t tell me. [laugh]

Q. Right. [laugh]

A. Geez you know? Uh, but I got… I almost got on the wrong bus, so I always ask. I’ll even as the driver now, you know ‘cause there’s like… But I don’t know exactly… I was thinking once about how…several years ago…about how do you, um… Like, I remember getting on a bus one time and I said, what bus is this? This is Pontiac. Well, Pontiac goes through our (local service) and I’m thinking, OK, so I’m going to get on this thing, and it wasn’t even the right bus. The person just thought it was. I mentioned to the driver something "oh, we don’t…" So, I’m thinking… I mean, I was gun shy then, I mean, how in the world do you do this?

Q. Right.

A. So, instead of, uh, instead of saying, well, do you go to…is this the Pontiac… After a person just told me it was, and I’m thinking, you ungrateful wretch, he didn’t even say, hey, can I help. I didn’t want to do that to the person, so I’ll get on and I’ll say things like, oh, OK, I’m going to Royal Oak…this is a Pontiac bus. And then if the bus driver says no, then, I’m talking more like, I’m not taking for granted what the person…  I’m going along with what the person said and I’m not trying to double check them. That was a little bit of a concern. Because one thing I don’t want to do is, is, is try to, uh… Some poor sighted person trying to help you out and then you act like you think they’re an idiot or something.

Q. Yeah.

A. Next time they’re not going to help.

Q. Right.

A. It gets a little tiring trying to be on your best behavior all the time but I’d rather…I’d much rather have people help and maybe do it wrong than not help if you need help.

Q. Yeah.

A. Who knows what the next person coming along is going to need?

Q. That’s true.

A. So, I guess that’s one little technique that… I was concerned about that for a little bit ‘cause, man, that really, that really bothered me. It’s, like, I can’t get on and not ask especially after this guy just flat out told me it was the bus, and it nowhere even was.

Q. Yeah.

A. I don’t stand out by Oakland Mall and have to call my daughter and say, Erin…who’s at work… [laugh]

Q. Right.

A. But any way…

Q. So, what you do is you, sort of, say loudly, uh, something like, the stop that you are hoping…or that someone overhears and confirms it or…

A. Also, a lot of times, there are people, you know, people at the bus stop… I work flat downtown Detroit so it’s, I mean, there’s all kinds of people coming home, uh, so a lot of them know me and, so, they know the bus and they’ll tell me, you know, your bus is here. Or if there’s nobody there, which happens once in a while, all the other lucky people get the day off or something, I’ll, uh, I’ll… You know, a bus comes up and I’ll say, is this… Are you going to Royal Oak? And they’ll say, yeah. Um, it’s usually…at that time, it’s usually better to… You go so and so and, you know, instead of what bus is this. And they have to tell you and you’ve got to decide… I’ll just say, hey, are you going to Royal Oak?

Q. Yeah.

A. And I know what… You know, I’ve been doing this for 25 years, so I know what buses are going along and what aren’t, so…

Q. Right.

A. …so I have a pretty good idea. But usually, I find that the safest thing to do is just ask the driver 

Q. Yeah.

A. … when they open up the door.

Q. They should know. [laugh]

A. They should know without a doubt.

Q. Um, have you ever been let off at the wrong stop?

A. Uh, oh, yeah, gees… Um, last, last… Well, we had a big snowstorm up here in December. We had, like, two or three of them, right, in a row.

Q. Hm.

A. It was horrible. The, the, uh, the sidewalks were all covered by, like, two feet of snow and, uh, uh… I guess the worst that normally happens is I get let off a block or two, maybe, down further than where I want to be or something like that. Um, this, this last time, they, uh, they let me off, like, about a block too far down and, and which was really kind of bad, ‘cause, I mean, there’s two feet of snow on the sidewalk and there’s…there was no place to walk. There was really no place to walk. I had to end up having to walk in a, um, um, you know, on (Glend Isle) which, you know, is awful doggone busy. And, and plus, you get somewhat disoriented ‘cause there’s no real landmarks, just a bunch of snow piled all over the place.

Q. Right. So, you were walking in the street…

A. Yeah.

Q. …because that was the only real clear place…

A. It was the only place…

Q. …but it was a very major road.

A. Yup, it was.

Q. Yeah. Because, otherwise, I mean, you can’t walk across the snow.

A. No, you can’t. You just…you can’t climb on piles and…

Q. And get all wet and…

A. Right, and, uh… We had some big snowstorms the last year and the year before and, like that, and to the point where… I think that’s the first time in my life I ever got to the point where it was almost not doable. began to really wonder if it was even doable or not and if it’s not doable, what in the world are you going to do?

Q. Right.

A. But, fortunately, I was able to, uh…

Q. What was not doable?

A. Uh, able to go…if…go any place from where you were. In other words, with all the snow piles, I was almost boxed in.

Q. Yeah.

A. And, uh, the one, the one time I ended up, uh, going down into the street again, but there was another fellow who was walking along, and I had to jump down about a three-foot drop to the street…

Q. Hm.

A. …and normally there’s nothing but they, you know, they plowed the streets and piled all this snow up onto the sidewalk…

Q. Right.

A. …so we walked down and then I came to my cross street and came down… But, um, I remember… You know, you can, you can get off 50 fifty feet in one direction or another and you might as well be a mile and a half away. I remember, I think the last time I really got aggravated, it was in January… The snow was clearing off some and, so, I told him to let me off at the end of my street. Well, what he did was, he let me off in the driveway of the gas station… Well, it’s not a gas station anymore, but doesn’t matter. right next to that. So, I’m like 50 feet to the, you know, further on down than I thought I was. So, I’m getting off here and I’m starting to walk, and I look up and I see a street light. Well, I think it’s the light in the middle of the, uh, of the street. Well, it wasn’t. It was the light at the back of the parking lot by the street. So, I’m walking along and all of a sudden, I walk in a dip and I thought, no, there’s no dip in this street…what in the world is going on? So, I walked to the back and then there’s this running vehicle and I see this light and I realize what’s going on and I think, I’m not quite sure where I am I still didn't quite figure it out. And then, um, I had had it by that time. You know, going to work every day and all that. I had finally had it and I took the cane and I just slammed it down on the, uh, on the, on the ground.

Q. Hm.

A. Broke the tip off. It now it looks like a bow and arrow without the arrow.

Q. Hm.

A. And, uh, so, then I, you know… What you do, if you don’t know where you are, you go back to where you started. So, I retraced my steps. I’ll bet you I’m I the parking lot. There’s a telephone, uh… There’s a pole with a telephone on it that people can drive through and use it…use the pay phone. So, the pay phone was exactly where I expected it to be once I thought about it.

Q. Good.

A. And I walked over and walked down the street and walked home. But man, I was mad.

Q. Hm.

A. I was really mad.

Q. And, then, you know, you’re mad and then you break your cane. [laugh]

A. [laugh]

Q. Then you get madder.

A. Yeah, well, it was almost a brand new one. It’s like… I had just about a month before.

Q. How much did you break it? I mean, was it where you were still able to use it, or…

A. Not really. It was, it was… I don’t like to use wavy canes. I couldn’t straighten it… I tried to straighten it out to the point where it was…it looked halfway decent, but it doesn’t, it didn’t… The tip was broke off, I had a regular cylinder tip so that snapped off and then the whole thing was just, you know, bowed.

Q. Hm.

A. I really slammed it.

Q. Yeah.

A. I really did. And I just ended up having to get a new cane.

Q. And, for the walk home, what did you do?

A. It was fine. I mean. I could use it…

Q. Yeah.

A. …for that because it wasn’t… It was more of a, of a bow than it was… I didn’t snap it or anything.

Q. I see, a bow like in a turn or a…

A. A bow and arrow…

Q. A bow and arrow, oh, OK.

A. It was more of an arch than… But it wasn’t that big of an arch.

Q. So, this was an aluminum rigid…

A. Folding.

Q. Folding.

A. Yeah.

Q. Gotcha.

A. So the, you know, joints kind of bent.

Q. You must have really [laugh] you really hit that thing.

A. I did.

Q. [laugh]

A. This was this was after… This was after getting let off a block down…

Q. Yeah.

A. …and between two buildings.

Q. Yeah.

A. And I ended up in a parking lot behind a building and… It’s dusk and I know I don’t have much time, ‘cause, you know, like I said in the beginning, my travel… You know, my vision, at night, drops off a lot and, and I knew how the sidewalks were, it’s like, you just can’t travel on them, period. So, I had to figure out what I was going to do, and I was, kind of, pressed for time.

Q. Yeah.

A. So, that was, like, about… That was the first time… And then there were a couple of other times I, I that they… These drivers just don’t understand English you know so…

Q. Yeah.

A. …I was in the same general area and, I think, one other time they left me off a block down and I’m still thinking I’m on my street and then I find out I’m not on my street. I was another block down… It was, I think this was after all of that, so it was, like, I’m just fed up…

Q. Yeah. I can understand that.

A. Well, fortunately the snow melted and now all the things are, you know, clear, so…

Q. Is it also just back to being itself again, you know it…

A. Right, back to normal…

Q. And it’s just got more, sort of, signatures that you can sort of…

A. Yeah.

Q. …see the patterns that are real, but when it’s all looking the same, of course, it’s very disorienting.

A. Yeah.

Q. Big mounds of snow…

A. And, you know, the drivers… They’re not trained for any of this. The thing that really got me was when I broke the cane was, uh, that whole place, the whole, the whole… It used to be a gas station…now it’s just a garage and they fix cars and… But the whole parking lot was all just filled up. So, I’m used to being and the, and the… the bus stop is right in front of there, so I can’t get on or off the bus there so I kept telling people, OK, let me off in the street. Well, then, like driver… You know, they’re not supposed to let you off in the street, but if that’s all they can do… So, instead of this guy saying, well, I can let you off in the driveway now because they’ve plowed it out, or he might not even know because he might have been a temporary or a substitute, I’m not sure… He just let me off in the driveway instead of the street and didn’t tell me any different.

Q. Right. So, he didn’t understand, maybe, how important it was for you…

A. Exactly.

Q. …to get what you were asking for.

A. Right.

Q. So…

A. And then [laugh] the next… A day or two after that I get off… Now I’m in the street I want to be, but I get up on the sidewalk and then I’m, I’m… I have to step over this mound of snow because they…there’s some snow at the end of this parking lot where they plowed it…and I lost track of the cane and I then can’t even find the cane ‘cause in all the snow, the cane kind of rolls away and the, the… This car came along, and I flagged this dude down, you know, he was coming down the alley…there’s an alley behind the house, here… I say, hey, do you see a cane? Oh, yeah. So, he found the cane…

Q. Oh, wow.

A. …and, you know, sighted folks do, they find the cane, they pick you up, they carry you… [laugh]

Q. [laugh]

A. …you give you a little more help than you really need.

Q. Right, right.

A. But, he was, he was nice guy. He got me, oriented and all this other stuff, which most of it I didn’t need but, he was, he was pretty good. So, but I was a little bit ticked off by that, too, but here I’m feeling around on the ground for the cane which shouldn’t have rolled very far, but it did. Um, maybe a foot farther than I was feeling, so I wasn’t too pleased when I got home on that day either. But, um, anyway, that’s, that’s the winter I’ve had.

Q. Hm.

A. But, I, I think the thing that really, really griped me about all this is, I very seldom get totally disoriented and I think I got totally disoriented and maybe once every two or three years… And I think it was about the third time that month…

Q. Yeah.

A. …and that really, that really scares you. That really scares you when that happens.

Q. Yeah. What strategies do you use? You retrace your steps…

A. Yeah, if you can. Um, this, this one time… Well, I worked overtime… I don’t know if I told Peg about this… I worked overtime last November, and I’m not used to walking around downtown after dark…

Q. hmm hm.

A. …’cause I do use my vision to whatever degree I can. Um, I’m right downtown at one of the major intersections which has it's a divided street and, um, it… So, I’m walking… I walked across one side and I start walking across the other and I angled slightly and got out into this cross street, and I turned around and saw a car stopped where no car should be and then I realized I am totally screwed up now. And then I wasn’t quite sure…you know, ’cause right then, when you’re in the middle of a major intersection like that, you know, you make the wrong… You can get into worse situations…

Q. Yeah.

A. …you know. But there was another fellow coming along right then and he said, he told me where to go. I’m not sure quite what I would have done at that point. Sometimes you just have to stop and say, I don’t care what happens, you’re going to have to wait for me till I figure out how not to get killed here.

Q. Yes.

A. So, uh, uh, I had not come up with a, with what I was going to do ‘cause I just turned around… A car should not have been there and then I realized, no, you are in deep snow here and, uh, and then the other guy came around ‘cause he was crossing, too. So that really shook me up.

Q. Huh.

A. That can happen so easily.

Q. Right.

A. Especially… If you’re on a familiar route, I mean, I’ve been doing this for 25 years. Uh, this particular place, they took away my bus stop and moved it down two blocks. Cause they're building they’re building and used to go to this bus stop ten years ago, but it’s still… I’ve only been doing it a few months and I haven’t done it at night like that and you know you go along. I think apathy, not apathy…what’s the word? You think you know…

Q. You’re, like, familiar…too familiar.

A. Exactly. You’re so familiar with it…

Q. Yep.

A. …you, you zone out…

Q. You get, sort of…

A. (inaudible)

Q. Yeah.

A. ..and then, just at the wrong time, you realize that you should not have been doing that.

Q. There is a word for that…I can’t think what it is. [laugh]

A. It could be apathy.

Q. [laugh] No. [laugh]

A. Well, uh… Complacency, maybe. I don’t know.

Q. It’ll come to us. [laugh] Um, other than the bus and walking, um, what other sorts of transportation do you use?

A. Uh, not a whole heck of a lot. I used to go on trips for IRS. I haven’t done that in quite a few years. That was interesting. It was kind of like a big adventure.

Q. Yeah.

A. I’ve gone to Cincinnati for training and went on down to Atlanta for… I was part of a group that kind of helped out kids and new technology going back when refreshable Braille displays were coming out…and all of that. It was quite interesting doing that. Cincinnati and Atlanta…

Q. How did you feel about traveling alone to unfamiliar places?

A. Uh, I don’t really like it. I’ve had, I’ve had, uh… I’ve gotten kind of lazy in the last few years ‘cause I don’t really… You know, since my kids got big enough, I would take my kids every place and then… They’re adults now and I don’t go out traveling alone anymore. I might be a little bit rusty.

Q. so, how would you prepare for travel to unfamiliar places?

A. Uh, you mean, like, go to cities and that sort of thing?

Q. Sure yeah.

A. Well, usually, IRS would tell you where you’re going to stay, so, I wouldn’t do a whole heck of a lot mainly just, just find a way to the airport. A lot of times… We have, like, transportation services around here or where you pay, uh, um, you know, some of them will come to your door, pick you up, and take you to the airport and then you just let the airlines know that, you know, I’m blind and they…you… Up here I imagine in most every city they have people at the airport that can, you know, take you to the gates and that sort of thing.

Q. Yep.

A. So, it, it… They usually pretty much know what they’re doing and then, um, when you get to the destination, you tell the person that meets you there well, OK, I'm gonna, I need to go to so and so hotel and they'll, they know how to do that. Then, at the hotel, um, whoever would help you with the bags, I’d get them to tell me a little bit about the hotel. Uh, you know, that kind of thing.

Q. What do you want to know?

A. Um, a lot of things that… Like, where the restaurant is, uh, the layout of the lobby… Some of those hotel lobbies are harder to get around in than the cities I tell ya…

Q. Yeah that's true.

A. …and the a, I’d ask them things like, you know, how do you make out calls on the phone. Uh, things are getting more complicated now with the, uh, uh… I haven’t had to travel in so long by myself, but since I did, they’ve come out with, you know, everybody’s got remotes now. Back when I was doing it, it wasn’t too difficult to figure out how to use the television or whatever. But now they’re all practically as complicated as the space shuttle.

Q. [laugh]

A. You have to have somebody… I remember the last time… The last trip I took, I had to go down to the lobby and ask them if I’d pressed any Pay Per View channels…I didn’t want any of that.

Q. Right.

A. So, I, I, uh… That was I the late ‘80s, but, uh, I would ask them, you know, things like that and, uh, have them help me get oriented to, you know, where the room was maybe, um, where… I like ice machines. You know, I kind of have a ritual you go down to the pop machine, and you get a Coke and…

Q. Yup.

A. …you get ice you go back, show me where that sort of stuff is. Uh, nothing real complicated.

Q. Right.

A. But, they were always pretty good about it, especially if you give them a pretty good size tip at the end.

Q. Yes.

A. I mean, money talks.

Q. Right.

A. Um, I always found them to be extremely helpful. And most of the cities I went to, uh, I had been to before. Uh, I think the first time I ever traveled to Cincinnati, they did it up right because there were several of us blind people. They had somebody come up to the airport and pick us all up and everything. Somebody from the IRS did and then they even helped us, you know, learn a little bit about the, uh, um, the hotel. That was very nice. That was a very nice…

Q. So, when, do you usually have someone from the IRS come pick you up for the airport, or…?

A. Uh, they did the first time, but, uh, usually, uh, you would just, like… The airport… The hotel would have buses, uh, you know… There was one hotel that we stayed at quite a bit in Cincinnati where they actually… We stayed at kinda because they were so nice about that. They had, like, a bus that would come pick people up at the airport. They’d pick anybody up.

Q. Yeah.

A. And they would take you around and they would take us across the river to the IRS office and that sort of thing. So, it was a kind of standard thing they did for everybody. And we found it real convenient, so, uh… And sometimes I would… One time when we done that, that, uh, we’d take the bus to downtown Cincinnati and, uh, the people would… One nice thing about working for IRS is, you’ve got all these blind people working Taxpayer Service, so they would… You know, the IRS is used to working with blind people, so…

Q. Oh.

A. …they could do things that would, you know, they might not think of normally. Like the people in Cincinnati would say, well, I’ll tell you what, they’re going to stay at the Holiday Inn at Sixth and Lynn there, so, uh, why don’t you take them… tell them to take this and this bus, uh, come down here and this is how you get back, and all that so, um, it’s, it’s really nice, you know, working for an organization like that that have a lot of blind people.

Q. Oh, I bet. It’s just… They do things to, you know, make it the easier way or whatever…just make is right. Um, how do you establish your position in the environment?

A. Um, I’m not quite sure of the question?

Q. Um, what sorts of things do you use to know where you are?

A. OK. Um, well, usually, when I get off the bus I the morning, you know, I’ve got enough vision to, to… There’s one building I look for. There’s one slender, very tall building that I’ll look to see if that’s where it should be. If it’s moved, then I’ll know something’s wrong.

Q. Um hm.

A. Um [laugh] yeah, really. My wife says…

Q. [laugh]

A. Yeah, so, it’s, um… I usually start with the bigger things and go down to the smaller things ‘cause as far as I go every day, you know, it’s not very… It’s not really varied, so it’s, uh… I’ll look at the bigger things. OK, are these the buildings I recognize? Uh, if they are, then, OK, you know, I’ve got to walk around the planters. They’ve got these big cement planters just the right height…

Q. Right.

A. …so they get your kneecap.

Q. Hm.

A. And then I get off their corners so, I guess I go from large things to small things.

Q. So, the building is the shape and the size…

A. Right. It, it… This building is kind of neat because it’s made of marble and it’s… The foundation of the building, like, angles out and meets the ground at an angle. So, I’ll, I’ll, uh, walk straight across and hit that…the cane will slide up onto the marble uh base and I’ll go, you know, in one direction or another.

Q. Neat. Have you used; do you use maps of any kind?

A. No. I’ve got, um… I don’t go a lot of new places, like I was saying, I kind of got lazy in the last several years. I’m not one of these real adventuresome people, so… I’m a creature of habit so I haven’t gone that many new places and I’ve, I’ve got a, if I do say so myself, an excellent spatial knowledge…

Q. Um hm.

A. …so I’ll talk to people and have them tell me, you know, how to get from here to here and here and it pretty much sticks. So, I don’t need to… Like, if I… I always know what direction it’s in…unless I get really turned around… Uh, I’ve always got, kind of, you know, an internal compass…

Q. Neat.

A. …I don’t, I don’t need maps. A lot of people really need them ‘cause they just don’t have a spatial…a very good spatial relationship. I know a lot of people with ROP tell me they don’t. But I lucked out and do have one, so I don’t do maps.

Q. Well, I imagine talking to people you’ve had people who give good and people who don’t give good directions. [laugh]

A. [laugh] Yeah.

Q. What is… What would be examples of good directions that people give you to places?

A. Uh, good directions… Uh, I’m not a direction… I can’t really think of anything. If that were really good, um… People out on the street are normally pretty good…

Q. OK.

A. …about, you know, telling me… A lot of the times what I’ll do is I’ll, I’ll have already have a good idea and I’ll tell them, you know, I’m looking for so and so and if they’re unclear, I’ll, I’ll point in whatever direction I think they’re talking about, you know. OK, you go down one block this way and I’ll point and turn left and go one more block and they’ll say, uh, yeah… ‘Cause working with taxes all these years…

Q. Um hm.

A. …now that’s how people just don’t understand. So, I’ve gotten into the habit of, you know, you don’t talk so you can be understood, you talk so you can’t be misunderstood.

Q. Yeah.

A. So, uh, they take care of a lot of that. There’s this one lady at work… It was so funny. Her name is Fayette. She, she says she can’t give good directions she said. I was standing right in front of her, she was facing me, and I was facing her and I was asking where to go… And she said, go straight ahead. And I was standing there, like, no, Fayette. She said, straight ahead. So, I said, if I go straight ahead, I’m going to go smack into you. And she said, “I told you I can’t give good directions”.

Q. [laugh] She meant for you to turn around?

A. I don’t know what she meant. I still don’t know quite what she meant.

Q. [laugh]

A. Figure… We were standing face to face about a foot and a half away or about two feet away. She said, straight ahead. She kept saying, straight ahead. So, she might have meant straight ahead for her turn around and go backwards, I don’t know.

Q. [laugh]

A. I, I, I teased her about that. But, uh, some people just don’t know their left from their right.

Q. Yeah.

A. But [laugh] you know. One funny thing about, um, like, if I, I’ll be standing at a light and, of course, people can tell when the light changes a lot faster than I can ‘cause I go by traffic flow and they’ll be coming across and they’ll say, the light’s green. Well, I’m thinking, is it green for the cross traffic or is it green for the people, the cars that are going to run me over.

Q. Right.

A. And you’re still standing there and they’re thinking, I just told him he could go, what is he doing? You know…

Q. Right.

A. But, uh, I guess it would be a good example of bad directions. Uh, and then I’ll say the same thing. Is it green? They’ll say, yeah, and then I’ll think, well, I don’t know what I’m talking about. [laugh]

Q. [laugh]

A. Or, do they understand what I’m trying… I know what I mean but do they know what I mean?

Q. [laugh] Well, and unfortunately, sometimes, it’s been green for a while, and they say it’s green but really, it’s about to turn.

A. That’s, that’s…

Q. I’ve seen that on more than one occasion.

A. Yeah.

Q. It’s, like, yeah, well, you’re not being very helpful right now. [laugh] go away.

A. Yeah.

Q. Um, what one thing that happens frequently when you’re traveling do you like the least?

A. Um, the bus drivers’ not remembering to let you off.

Q. Yeah.

A. You’ve got to really remind them.

Q. Yeah.

A. Really remind them. And I wish they’d pay attention a little bit more and then… Usually, well downtown Detroit, uh, I know it’s about time to get off the bus because the road gets kind of rough and I’ll ask them and sometimes I’m thinking of something else and they’ll let me off a block or two down further. Then the whole route to get to the building is different. It’s no big deal but I can’t sleep on the way to it. You know, you go back to the complacency… I actually have to pay attention to where I’m going [laugh] a little bit more.

Q. Right.

A. So, it just drives me nuts, especially if it’s like the dead of winter and it’s not light outside and I can’t use the vision I’ve got very effectively.

Q. Yeah.

A. Uh, and I really have to be careful. But I think it's the bus drivers not…

[side B]

Q …when they want to help.

A. Ask me if I need help.

Q. Yeah.

A. People will come up and say, where are you going?

Q. [laugh]

A. It’s none of your business where I’m going. Gee, I… We have a lot of, a lot of street people down there.

Q. Yeah.

A. I could tell you stories about that, but you don’t have the time for all that. But it’s [laugh]…

Q. Actually, I do. [laugh]

A. [laugh] The, uh… But people will come up to me and they’ll say, well, where are you going? And it could be one of these bums. And it drives me nuts. It’s, like, one of these bums will come up and help you and then they want money for doing it and I’m, like, well shoot…

Q. Right.

A. …I didn’t realize we were getting into an employer/employee relationship here.

Q. [laugh]

A. So, uh, but I would, normally, I would rather sighted people come up and you know tell you, ask you if you need help…

Q. Yeah.

A. Um, kind of act like you’re going in the same direction, whatever, whatever, you know, but instead of assume that you don’t know what the heck you’re doing. [laugh] The thing that drives me crazy, too, is people… [laugh] I’ll be doing perfectly fine, walking down the street perfectly fine, don’t need any help at all, and they’ll say…someone will be coming toward me and go, you’re doing good.

Q. [laugh]

A. [laugh]

Q. That’s very nice of them. [laugh]

A. Thank you, thank you. [laugh] I thought I was, too.

Q. And the funny thing is, you could, actually, you know, be not going in the right direction and they wouldn’t know.

A. They wouldn’t know, yeah, true.

Q. [laugh] How do you locate someone to get assistance from?

A. Um, it depends, uh, if I think I’m going in the right direction, I’ll just keep going in that direction and when somebody comes up or comes along going in the opposite direction, I’ll, uh, flag them down.

Q. Neat.

A. If, if, I haven’t a clue as to where I’m going and I know there’s a store around some place, I’ll, sometimes I’ll even go into a place and say, well, I’m looking for so and so.

Q. Yeah.

A. But, most of the time, the places I go, there are enough people around that I can, you know, wait for a minute or keep walking and somebody’s going to come along pretty soon.

Q. Neat. What kinds of things do you use as landmarks?

A. Um, oh, buildings, uh, benches, poles, uh… It’s kind of funny… There’s this one pole down [laugh] My favorite pole…

Q. [laugh]

A. Downtown Detroit. Um, you cross the street… I’m into, kind of, rituals…you know, you do these little rituals… You cross this one place, and this is a big ornate pole, it must have been left over from the ‘20s and ‘30s when they built these things and made fancy everything… And you cross the street and it’s almost, like, on the crosswalk… You have to, you have to really watch out for it. And, and so I go around the pole and wait to go across the street. And I’ll even whack the pole with the cane just for fun. Uh, but I use poles…

Q. Are you using your vision with…at the point, or…

A. Usually.

Q. Uh huh.

A. But sometimes I don’t. When I work late, I really couldn’t, so, I would, uh, hit it to get a pretty good idea that… Cause it's pretty--I mean It’s awful big… I mean, it’s a foot and a half through, maybe… Uh, maybe a foot through. It’s awful… It’s not like a… It’s not like one of these two- or three-inch think ones…

Q. Right.

A. It’s a big old thing.

Q. Yeah.

A. Um, you know, and I’ll, I’ll…I would whack that and, um, uh, things like, likw planters, uh, sometimes sounds. Um, you know, it just depends on where I’m going. You know, every environment has its own cues. If it’s stable enough to use, uh, sometimes I’ll use, uh, like a store will have, you know, lighting out front and I’ll use that. Sometimes the buildings around it are quite dark and… I remember when I was, uh, oh, uh, when I was going…when I worked late, right outside the bus shelter there’s a liquor store. The bus shelter is something else, too, because the bums and winos hang out there…and, um, it’s actually kind of dangerous, um… But, but it’s a little bit difficult to find the stupid bus stop because, uh, there’s no real landmarks there. The bus shelter is there…uh, I kind of have to look for that…but after dark, it was really nice because the liquor store was lit up like a Christmas tree…

Q. Yeah.

A. …and everything else was dark, so I knew when that was, when I got near there, you know, I knew where I was. Um, so, um, you know, anything that you can get a hold of you use for landmarks.

Q. Have you ever been injured when traveling?

A. Uh, no, uh… Back when I was a kid, my nephew and I went, uh…  We were riding bikes and, uh, uh, it got late enough, I couldn’t ride the bike, so I was walking the bike in this… We were in a park and I got hit by a car.

Q. Hm

A. I guess I would be traveling. But it was, I was very lucky because it hit the bike first and then hit me and just knocked me down.

Q. Oh, gosh.

A. It, it didn’t seriously hurt me… It was a dirt road so he couldn’t go that fast. But, uh, that’s the only time. I’ve been, you know, pretty blessed.

Q. Whose fault do you think it was?

A. Um, it was his.

Q. Yeah.

A. Because, it was in a park, and it was a dirt road going through the park back on the main highway. We were way maybe a quarter of a mile from the main highway. And, uh, he should have been watching what he was doing.

Q. Sure. Do you belong to any professional or consumer organizations?

A. No, uh, I sure don’t.

Q. OK. What do you attribute to your present level of mobility?

A. What do I attribute it to?

Q. Uh huh.

A. The instruction I got from the mobility instructors. Um, I’m not sure if I’m answering that…

Q. Yeah, no, that’s great.

A. I… We had the opportunity recently to, uh, um… They had a conference for mobility instructors and teachers of visually impaired over here near us and they asked us to come and be one of the vendors. So, we did that, and they had all in the same room and, so we got to hear the speeches and stuff and they were mainly talking about teaching kids and I haven’t dealt with mobility instructors since I was, oh, 25 or something like that, and, even back then, it was more of a chore. You know I’m, I've got to go to these lessons and do things, and now I’m 51 and have got grown children and I’ve got a new grandchild, so it's like I see the whole thing from a different perspective. I looked at these, these kids that were learning these things and I, I’m sitting there thinking, you know, this is why I can do the stuff that I can do.

Q. Hm.

A. This is how come I can go to work every day and go on these trips and, uh, do all these things. And I came away with a real sense of appreciation for all of you people who do these things and, uh, a whole new, a whole new outlook on, um… It is vitally important, I think, for kids… I don’t know what I would have done without it…

Q. Yeah.

A. …Cause I got it at such a young age. You know, I didn’t have to deal with it. I was just taught how to do it and… And I was, you know, since we went to that thing, I’m walking around downtown and thinking about all the things that I do with the traffic patterns and the cane techniques and asking people and just on and on and on. And I learned these things so long ago, they’re second nature to me. It’s not like I learned… I almost forgot I learned them from somebody else in a sense.

Q. Yeah.

A. And, I, I don’t think I could have done any of it without the mobility instructors.

Q. Hm. Quite a testament.

A. Thank you. Glad I can talk to one and tell them.

Q. Would you get more mobility instruction?

A. Uh, I think I would if I needed it. As a matter of fact, I’ve even thought about it with, uh, uh, with the… Now, you know, that I don’t have the vision I used to. And, um, like I was saying earlier, I don’t do a lot of traveling in unfamiliar areas. So, I’ve tossed around the idea that I don’t… I don’t do a lot of different things. I just never, uh, you’ve pretty… pretty, what do I want to say I do a lot of the ordinary, same old, same old stuff. I’m not one of (inaudible) that's not me. So, uh, I’ve actually thought, like, I was saying before you got your door that I’ve got kind of gotten a little lazy in my older age here with, what with my kids being around and Peg and I go places…Peg’s visually impaired, too, but she’s got a lot more vision than I do, so when we go places, she kind of helps out so I’ve kind of gotten rusty to go new places…by myself. So, I’ve actually thought, do I really want to do this and would I have an occasion to do it. I suppose if I really thought I wanted to launch out and go do new things, I would have to see… I’d try it and see.  ‘Cause I have had an awful lot of mobility instruction over the years. It’s a long time ago, but I think just brushing up on my own skills…

Q. Yeah.

A. …uh, is probably what I need to do.

Q. Where would you find an instructor?

A. Um, I know some in the area. Um, there’s a receiving hospital down here. We’ve got an order of canes with them right now, as a matter of fact. They teach mobility. Peg’s gone there. I think I could call [person’s name ??]…

Q. Neat.

A. …and say, hey, what do you think? Where do I go from here?

Q. Neat.

A. Um, so, you know, growing up in the Detroit area here, I know people at the Commission and that sort of thing, so I can go talk to the Commission, or talk to Mike Plus I know, I work with other blind people from IRS, so, uh, I… that is a very important thing. I think they have a network of, of your peers, in that sense you can really trade a lot of tips and bounce ideas off them and that sort of thing.

Q. Yeah.

A. I know a lot of people, especially newly blinded, they don’t know where in the world to go for anything and, uh, fortunately, I’m not in that boat.

Q. Yeah. Well, that’s the interview.

A. Oh, I’ve enjoyed it. I hope I’ve helped.

Q. You have. 

Jerry grew up with a visual impairment that he felt he was able to move about without a long cane and also benefited from the long cane, once he got one. He neve indicated his acuity  - it was worse than 20/400 – or legally blind, and he had more difficulty at night. That he learned to use his long cane wearing a blindfold, did not ultimately seem to prepare him for night travel. 

A preferred alternative is to actually teach someone with low vision at night, that way they experience the benefits of their vision and the challenges of having less information. Night blindness is much more pronounced in people with a visual impairment than people who are sighted – so under the same conditions of night time, sighted people are able to see more with less light than someone with a visual impairment.

Jerry is rightly proud of himself and what he is able to do- but in my estimation, he was never given the permission to consider returning to get more O&M to get additional support for these very challenging situations he finds himself in – nighttime, streets covered in snow banks, and perhaps implementing the latest technology (not an option when he was interviewed) but certainly in 2023.

The field of O&M is essential, but there are very few instructors, limited budgets and even less time and money spent developing new instructional strategies. So, Jerry breaks his cane in frustration, rather than pick up the phone and call for a refresher course. Why is that?

He continued to take public transport in his 50s and this puts him in places with unsavory characters – never thinking perhaps he should just find a way to get a car and driver – he has a good job– likely he could afford it…