Do you ever feel like life's transitions can be both beautiful and daunting? Join me and my good friend Cat Larsen on this week's episode of Very Best of Living as we candidly discuss navigating through life's ups and downs, from our grandchildren's graduations to saying goodbye to loved ones or leaving a job. Along the way, we delve into the importance of recognizing and celebrating personal achievements without falling into the comparison trap.
Traveling can be an amazing adventure, but it can also bring its share of challenges. Cat and I share some of our most memorable travel experiences, as well as the life lessons we've learned from visiting different cultures and places. We also touch on the importance of being present in the moment and truly engaged when interacting with others, especially when providing emotional support to someone who is a Blue personality type.
Finally, we tackle the topic of mental resilience and its crucial role in today's society. From discussing society's false notion that anxiety is a badge of honor to the significance of setting our own standards in life, Cat and I explore how individuals can build mental endurance and cultivate personal growth. Tune in as we reveal how forgiveness plays a pivotal role in mental health, and why we should all feel challenged to improve. You won't want to miss this insightful conversation!
Remember to follow the HartmanPersonality IG account. There you can participate in “Ask Taylor Tuesdays.”
Take the Personality and Character Profiles at TaylorHartman.com.
Send questions and comments to Taylor@TaylorHartman.com Or Cathy@TaylorHartman.com with “Podcast” in the subject line.
Do you ever feel like life's transitions can be both beautiful and daunting? Join me and my good friend Cat Larsen on this week's episode of Very Best of Living as we candidly discuss navigating through life's ups and downs, from our grandchildren's graduations to saying goodbye to loved ones or leaving a job. Along the way, we delve into the importance of recognizing and celebrating personal achievements without falling into the comparison trap.
Traveling can be an amazing adventure, but it can also bring its share of challenges. Cat and I share some of our most memorable travel experiences, as well as the life lessons we've learned from visiting different cultures and places. We also touch on the importance of being present in the moment and truly engaged when interacting with others, especially when providing emotional support to someone who is a Blue personality type.
Finally, we tackle the topic of mental resilience and its crucial role in today's society. From discussing society's false notion that anxiety is a badge of honor to the significance of setting our own standards in life, Cat and I explore how individuals can build mental endurance and cultivate personal growth. Tune in as we reveal how forgiveness plays a pivotal role in mental health, and why we should all feel challenged to improve. You won't want to miss this insightful conversation!
Remember to follow the HartmanPersonality IG account. There you can participate in “Ask Taylor Tuesdays.”
Take the Personality and Character Profiles at TaylorHartman.com.
Send questions and comments to Taylor@TaylorHartman.com Or Cathy@TaylorHartman.com with “Podcast” in the subject line.
Taylor Hartman:
Hello listeners. this is Dr Taylor Hartman, with Very Best of Living. It's so good to have you with us. this week I'm with my good friend, kat Larson. Kat, hello.
Cat Larsen:
Hello, what's been happening?
Taylor Hartman:
Well, what's so fun is so we're at, so my granddaughter was graduating.
Taylor Hartman:
My grandson was great. He goes. Don't come to my graduation, it's boring, it doesn't mean a thing And he's so yellow, literally. I mean he is. I don't know how he graduated, i don't know. So they're sitting in the audience and his name is Easton Gunn, with an asterisk, and of course, his mom and I had the exact same question. Oh my gosh, he has to see the principal before he can graduate. Like there's no way he's graduating, right? No, no, she reads further and it says graduating with honors.
Cat Larsen:
Oh my gosh.
Taylor Hartman:
I said. I said that is not, is that is not his life. I don't know what is I mean? there's just no way on earth. It's honors. I said how on earth did you pull that off? He goes. I'm smart, bubba.
Cat Larsen:
Bubba, i'm smart, bubba, no exception being you're smart. Taylor, it is not a silver spoon, It's a yellow spoon. I'm just telling you, it's not a silver spoon in somebody's mouth, it is the yellow spoon. What a great way to look at it. It is. And then I had my other granddaughter.
Taylor Hartman:
She graduated and you know it was so great, she was so excited and she's red with blue, she's strong, bold, she's fun, she's happy. And at the end they were announcing the names as they went up there And this one guy that would do half of them was so like like he was so great. He said, almost like a movie star, and it was just fun the way he was so, this deep, booming voice And the way he would say it was that here they are, kind of thing. So it was very, very cool, very fun to see it happen. I was thinking about that as graduation, like for them. It's such a major event in their life, so happy for them, right. And then you're also like going to a wedding and thinking they don't have a clue what it's going to be, and that's kind of true with high school graduation, right.
Cat Larsen:
I know They have no clue. They're going to experience, no clue, and you know endings and beginning my daughter's, her last day in Amsterdam is today. And. I've gotten as of what time is it here, 1205. I've probably gotten five calls of her, just can't even talk like mom. Oh, she goes. I just fell in love, i go. what did you fall in love with? She goes, just everything. I just fell in love with everything And I'm like, well, i'm so glad you're crying that you're leaving. I really am.
Taylor Hartman:
You know so, so good, and I think the best part about that is really that's true of life. Like, the more passionate you are, the more effective. The more you love a child, the harder it is to see them go, the harder it is to leave Yes, like the country, the harder it is to give up a job. Yes And yes, you wouldn't want any other way, so that's very, very exciting.
Cat Larsen:
Oh yeah, i mean just the, just the fact that and we talked about this morning. I said, you know, she's like what is it going to feel like? Well, here's the, here's the thing. You don't compare, you don't go back to Seattle and compare.
Taylor Hartman:
Amsterdam to Seattle. You know you don't do that You just go.
Cat Larsen:
that is a like, a special thing. It's like it's just its own thing and don't try to hold it up to anything else.
Taylor Hartman:
So healthy, because if you do that, comparison is the end of joy. right, that's right. Then you lose the magic of Amsterdam. That's right, and that's true of all of us. Like everything we do in life, right Like, don't try and compare to the next thing you're doing. Like that's even true of like children. Don't make the comparison. Enjoy them for who they are. Yes yes that's not feel that they'll feel it right.
Cat Larsen:
Oh yeah, oh yeah. Yeah, we've all felt it. I mean, did you feel it in your family?
Taylor Hartman:
It's so funny. I was oblivious, like, honestly, i. I just thought the sun shined with me, so I didn't notice that I was not a favorite of my day And you didn't even know. I didn't even know. Like that's how it ignores is bliss, i guess was that in his will at the end?
Cat Larsen:
Oh, by the way, taylor, you were the worst.
Taylor Hartman:
You're the one that was hardest for me. You still felt loved very much so, and I thought about that many, many times how fortunate I was to have that. Like at the graduation. People are yelling for the person that when the name came up. And I thought isn't that cool that these people are all celebrating this person and caring about them. And then, what does it feel like to have somebody who is alone?
Taylor Hartman:
Mm-hmm doesn't have that, who came over on their own, for example, or whatever's going on. We're very fortunate. Those of us that has support in our younger years. I think it's very cool. Yes, Yes today we're gonna do something very different. I love gonna have question answered, right.
Cat Larsen:
Yes, yes, we are. so I've just pulled some off of our Hartman personality Instagram account because I think and please, listeners, if you're not following, get on and follow Hartman personality and you can ask. We have asked Taylor Tuesday and Taylor gets on and responds, not just with, i mean like some really like Really heavy-duty questions come in and you do a great job in that little space that you can type in Taylor of really getting to.
Cat Larsen:
That directness that you talk about, right, you just get right to it. So I love that. So the first thing, though, i just want to ask you know, i like the throwing questions about you. So You are at a place where you I think you told us you were going on a trip to Peru, right?
Cat Larsen:
Yep right correct and you like travel and love travel, you love travel, and so when you say you love travel, tell me the number two, like one and two, of what it is when you go someplace, that the data that you take in, that you love What, what makes you love it?
Taylor Hartman:
That's good. I first of all it's it's the culture. I'm so intrigued by how people live different cultures, how they experience life, and Unless I'm there, i don't really get a chance to just see it, like, like you can tell me about it, but I want to actually feel it, and so being in these places for me is such a different ambiance than reading about it or hearing about it or actually seeing it, even on a videotape. I mean, i'd much rather feel it. And so being there, that's number one. Probably number two is learning. Like I feel, like I am. When I'm traveling, i am like on high alert, i'm always. I'm not just Vaging, i'm actually experiencing new, new ways of thinking, new understanding of how people can navigate life and each other differently, appreciating What they bring to me by seeing them interact with me, Mm-hmm, different places they go. So probably those two things are the most important Yeah, the culture and the people with together, and then the learning opportunity.
Cat Larsen:
What place sticks out in your mind as a thing that hit you the hardest or you Experience the most? in those two things like, what place do you just go? Oh, this was man. I really felt it, i really learned a lot, i was surprised, oh.
Taylor Hartman:
Well, okay, and so I really can't live in it that well, but I'm in Africa was, honestly, it was the most surprising, like I was like, so stunned to see the magical beauty. I mean I I.
Taylor Hartman:
You know, i just can't even explain to you that the beauty. And then the simplicity of the people, like they have nothing, zero, and And they are happy and they, they care, and they, they dance and they engage and and and They're not I don't know. I that whole Africa was a very unique experience. And then to see people Who are so trapped, like they really don't have the freedom to challenge and speak up about things, they're not really educated as much, so I was very contrasting.
Taylor Hartman:
I think Venice was probably the most surprising in terms of the city To me. To see a place, it's a, it's all waterway, it's thinking, very just, artistic in my mind, the artistic nature of it. And then Italy it's hysterical to me, like they're so yellow, like they're, they're literally Falling apart and they're all having a great time. Like it's unbelievable to me, just the sense of living in the moment, right, having a great time. I still remember driving out of Switzerland, all pristine, all orderly, into Italy and all of a sudden, and there's literally no, any lane. You go anywhere you want to go, and I'm like I think I've come home, like this feels like oh, and Jean is like covering her face. So, so I, you know all of yeah, all of those, i mean all. Anywhere I have been, i have been surprised and intrigued, and never disappointed, by the way I've never said I'm. I wish I hadn't come here.
Cat Larsen:
So never, not one place. You say I wouldn't, know, nope, nope, interesting never well, good, that's good to know, because, i mean you know, because, well, i think that's a choice too. I mean you know your expectations have to be. You know, if your expectation is like learning, and you know learning in the culture and the feel of it, i mean you're gonna feel different any every time you walk out of Utah. Right, you know, you're right about that.
Taylor Hartman:
You know, that's a good insight, because I did think of a couple of women who have plenty of money and they went, hated Rome. I said it's the eternal city, how can you hate? And they said I was dirty and they didn't treat it. I wanted to be treated and so you're right. I was stunned. I remember thinking well, that tells me more about you than about Rome, actually.
Cat Larsen:
Yeah, yeah, I can't imagine that either. I mean just having having gone to Europe for the first time. It's like you know, now I'm like I want to go everywhere. I would write everywhere.
Taylor Hartman:
Yes, you know.
Cat Larsen:
So okay, so we're gonna jump into some questions. Thank you for answering those you bet. So the first one is and I think we can never get enough Help in a healthy way with this which is how can you help a blue with emotional support?
Taylor Hartman:
So you're saying they need emotional support. How do you give it?
Cat Larsen:
Yeah, how do you?
Taylor Hartman:
have a blue.
Cat Larsen:
How can you emotionally support a blue? Okay, so I'm not sure support them the way they would feel it, not just like okay. Yeah, I understand what well?
Taylor Hartman:
number one is you have to be sincere. You have to genuinely care about what they're sharing with you. For those of us that are not blue, we often will kind of say could just get the end of the story, like I really want to hear the whole deal. They know that the minute you say it and they do not feel supported, they feel dismissed, and they're because they're pleasers, they try and hurry and so they really kind of trip over themselves. They trip over themselves because we're not giving them a chance, have the full experience. Yes, number two, you have to understand them.
Taylor Hartman:
Like it's so interesting as woman who's an alcoholic, she says to her daughter who's getting married I Just want to sit down with you and I want to understand how we can make your life better and And and how we can support you. And then she said the. So the daughter, who's shot very healthy, says you could be home, like you could actually be here, because I don't think you understand why I can't be there. Like I'm trying to build a business and I'm. And I said, oh my gosh, the minute she's asking how can I support you? the person tells them and she took, she denies it by saying you don't understand me. I Can't possibly do that for you because I have this. So when a blue person tells you, you can't just dismiss them and say, well, you're too moody all the time or you expect too much, or you have to listen to understand them. That's the other part.
Cat Larsen:
I Very good And that is yeah, that is a truly get over yourself in the Hartman path. Get yourself, get truth, capital T truth, not personal truth, and then get over yourself, you know is that getting over yourself is a lifelong. Are you over yourself? Do you think you're pretty over yourself in all of these More?
Taylor Hartman:
so than I ever was? Yeah, by a long, long shot. I just realized it doesn't work Like you're so limited. When you do it is almost when I do it today I'm embarrassed, i'm like oh please, that was so petty, that's so inappropriate, because you just feel it. It doesn't feel right, whereas before, when I was younger, i was like oh no, you justify it, you defend it. Right.
Taylor Hartman:
And today, when I see people who are about themselves at the expense of me or about others, i'm really just more sad. I kind of look at it and go you know what? your life's limited? You don't even know it, you're doing it. No one's making it. Your life's limited. If I'm in a professional capacity, i challenge them. I definitely will do that. If I'm in a personal capacity, i don't always say something. There's no point.
Cat Larsen:
Right, yeah, no, that's so good, because that leads into this next question, which is what are some tips for making? I love the way people write. They're so good. I love our people.
Taylor Hartman:
I love their degree.
Cat Larsen:
Yeah, Oh. what are some tips for making a crappy situation better? Trying to change my attitude, but it's hard.
Taylor Hartman:
Well, attitude is always tied to expectation. So the reality is that if you set an expectation that's unrealistic, you're going to have a hard time making a good thing out of a bad thing, right? I guess another thing I recommend to people is accept that life is sometimes crappy, like it isn't always wonderful. I've never known somebody raising kids who's always happy Like your house is always a mess. It's never really done So.
Taylor Hartman:
Rather than saying I'll be happy if I could clean this up, you might say you know what? I'd much rather have these little humans in my life than have a clean house. And you shift the perspective you have on what's crappy and give it kind of a license to be okay, kind of a good thing. Or you also might use a crappy situation to say all right, so what can I learn in this? So that's what they're doing, but what can I learn about how I can engage this experience differently? So if somebody's negative, you can say I can ignore it, not pay attention to it. I can actually be kind to them. You know, understanding how much harder it must be for them to live in that negative kind of mindset. I can ask if there's something I can do different that would make their life easier. I can allow it to be. I mean, i've really come to that one.
Taylor Hartman:
I realize that a lot of people I'm with don't really care to be happy. Okay then, let them not be happy. It's not the end of the world. So I think, a lot of suggesting your attitude and your expectation of what you should be doing to improve it. I even say to the parents with kids sometimes you need to let the kid just be the kid Like. They will not be what you maybe want them to be. I know I have driven parents that are so good about making life happen. They have a kid who's like a sloth and it's really hard for them because they think they want their kid to live abundantly. And I have said to several of them maybe you need to read up on sloths and start understanding what their way of life is and how it works for them and let it be okay.
Cat Larsen:
It's so good. There's a little animated. It's called. I can't remember the name of it, but the sloth is the worker in the DMV.
Taylor Hartman:
Oh, yes, i saw that. And the woman the sloth, the glasses.
Cat Larsen:
And then she's like the DMV and she's like going to stamp something and it takes three minutes. It's like it's so great, It's so great.
Taylor Hartman:
That is an excellent. I love that one. And also Kat, you know I really have come to appreciate maybe with age I would not want to be that person Like, really that is not a fun place to be, whether they're a sloth or they're uneducated or they're mean spirited. In all fairness would you like to live inside of that body. And so it gives me a little bit more empathy for not having to fix them, but understanding it can't be fun for them either.
Cat Larsen:
Right, right, right, all right. So that builds to this next one, which I think it's like a one, two punches What can I do to build mental resilience? That's from what I'm wondering.
Taylor Hartman:
You know what I like about that. I feel we're entering a culture that is not resilient mentally.
Taylor Hartman:
Everybody is depressed, everybody is anxious. There's even the promotion of a little anxiousness. It's a good thing. So if you don't have it, then you're probably not as strong. I'm like, oh please, that's such nonsense. The reality is, if you need it, fine. Like when we talked with Cade, he goes.
Taylor Hartman:
I was being negative because it maybe motivated me. I said that makes no sense to me at all, but that's your call. Don't take a negative, like people do in the world today, and promote poor mental health as a positive. That is insane to me.
Taylor Hartman:
So I think resilience is standing up to things. Like I'm dealing with a young man right now who said I stopped being effective when I became an adult. I don't know how to adult, i don't know how to deal with things happening and adjusting, and so once I got out of high school and I had to make it on my own, i didn't have any resilience, no mental strength to do that, and I said, boy, that made a lot of sense because he was suicidal also, and I can see that when he was taking a look for an easy out, let me just go, because I really don't have the gifts to deal with adultery in life. So I think it's important that you look at the resilience by saying, ok, can I do hard things? Have I done hard things? My biggest complaint for young people today is they don't do hard things Like they stay around classes. They don't read the extra book, they read the cliff notes.
Taylor Hartman:
They don't put the effort into being physically fit. They crap bad food and gas stations or whatever. They're not doing anything that takes effort. They would then be able to kind of build a consciousness that I am a committed, disciplined person, and so I feel like the way you get mental resilience is you go through hard things and you find a way through it, and that tells you you can do it again And you do it again. You do it over and over again. People that can't do that, they give up too quickly And they actually lose the essence of what I think life's about, which is learning how to do difficult things.
Cat Larsen:
Yeah, there is a sense to me in our world of, like you said is like going back in depression. And I think social media is great. You can learn so much, we're on it, we're on the platforms to teach and help, and that's one thing. But you have to be resilient with social media too, which is you can't just go oh, depression is up 43% And it's because of this, this and this, and not do that work that you're talking about. Like, because it can affect you. Like, see, we are depressed, see, oh, yes, i'm just, i'm You're right Everybody else is here too, right.
Taylor Hartman:
That's so good, because the truth of the matter is you've got to have an identity inside yourself. Yes, it's different than what society wants you to be like Like. You have to be willing to set your own standard as to what life is supposed to be about. So when society imposes a falsehood, you're able to go. That doesn't fit my identity. That's not who I am. It's very important people get that sense of what am I committed to And I can remember Kat literally deciding to push through something just so I could believe in myself. Like you said, you would do it, do it And that paid off Even my PhD.
Taylor Hartman:
I've always said to people it doesn't mean you're smarter and brighter, it means you are persistent. That is exactly what it means. You will stay with something long term And that's you know. I look for those markers in other people, people that really have markers that show me they actually stayed with difficult things right And we're resilient in life's challenges. So it's really it's actually more important today almost than in a hundred years ago Like they need more physical endurance. Also, we need more mental endurance and resiliency. You're being hit all the time by social media, always challenged on thought patterns and thought processes, and I think in the field we're in, mental health, it's probably one of the most damaged areas, where people are promoting ideas that are so fallacious and they espouse them as truths.
Cat Larsen:
Well, you know it is. That's the next question I was going to ask you, which is what are some things? one of our people asked what are some things modern therapy teaches that you don't agree with?
Taylor Hartman:
Yeah, that's really good. I don't believe living together with someone before you marry them is the answer. I think the statistics even prove that. The reality is that if you're committed, you're more likely to succeed than if you're not. One foot in, one foot out is hard. It's convenient, but it's hard to be commitment, i think, another thing that teaches not to forget Like they're out to get you and you have a right to hold your banner and protect yourself. Like we talked about at a podcast about armoring up. Yes.
Taylor Hartman:
Mental health teaches. A lot of professionals teach armoring up and I'm saying no, you need to get firmer within The, stronger with who you are, so you can not let them own you as you go through life with challenges. So forgiveness is another big piece I think mental health is. We allow, we've lowered the bar on what we think mental health should be, so people don't feel challenged to actually increase their mental health and improve. It's more like just surviving. You're lucky to survive. I'm like that is not thriving, that's not healthy, it's just surviving and it'll wear you out. I've always believed life is like the ab, that flow of the tide. It's gonna come in. If you don't build a beach that fights it back, it's gonna consume you at some point. So you've gotta be constantly challenging life, the abs and flows, in order to find purpose in your life.
Cat Larsen:
I've been thinking about this. It's funny when you watch something I started watching. It's called The Last Kingdom and it's really good. It's about how England, back when the Vikings were in and trying to take over England and the first king is Alfred. And it's this church versus pagan right. So, the Danes versus the Saxons and the way they view God. And I guess, just thinking about it, pogradar, talking about it last night, i said, i said we're just so lucky We don't have to wake up every morning and defend our land.
Taylor Hartman:
I mean, we don't have to wake up and say somebody's coming to take this over.
Cat Larsen:
So what do we spend our time thinking about These things that? so going out and finding that resiliency thing is really important because it's not built in to not like that. We don't have to defend ourselves. It's not built in like that. I mean, there's a lot of hard things that people go through, but we don't have it. I think that's more critical.
Taylor Hartman:
I think that's more critical. Yes, today it's more mental.
Cat Larsen:
Exactly, and just an interesting thing. But the mental piece of it is you do still have to go out and build the resiliency right. You have to say I am going to.
Taylor Hartman:
It's actually internal. Yes. The work is all internal, like you are refeeding an internal resiliency. So what externally happens doesn't then own you or critique you or hold you back. That's what I'm trying to say. In the old, we were talking about the last kingdom. Yes, the reality was they were defending themselves physically or they would die right. Well, that's not necessarily happening today, but people are dying all the time emotionally.
Cat Larsen:
That's what I'm saying, yes, and. I think And so like suicide and all of the things, that how we're dying and what we can't, you know, I mean, it was pretty clear back then. Yeah, they weren't. you know, it was very unhealthy, of course, because they're like killing people for a piece of land.
Taylor Hartman:
But also part of the problem I have with mental health is everyone gets a trophy. That is not life. That is not reality. I am really good at certain things. I am not good at other things. I don't need a trophy across the board. All that tells me is I'm average and everything. It does not tell me that I'm genuinely good at certain things or I can be respectful of others who are better at things. It doesn't tell me that. It tells me it's just about playing the game. So it doesn't really challenge you to get really really good at what you can bring to the table and appreciating people who have those gifts where you don't. So I think that's also numbing it down. Making it average does not work for me.
Cat Larsen:
Yeah, making it average. And why do you think we got there? What made that happen? in our world?
Taylor Hartman:
we were afraid of, or trying to, well, you can look politically, if you look at that, from communism and socialism. That's the essence of it is everybody is the same right. There's no drive to improve or get better. And you can go the other extreme on capitalism, which can be very egocentric and finances are everything and they define whether you're good or bad. But in my mind the desire to improve and to grow and be rewarded for it, for legitimate effort and success, is more effective than saying I'll just give you a certain amount and you can show up and just do average work and we're fine. There's no real growth or energy in that. In my mind It's like surviving versus surviving in mental health. Same. Thing.
Taylor Hartman:
I don't consider that legitimate. So, those are my answers to your question.
Cat Larsen:
Good, Yes, I guess I feel that you're getting ready to wrap up, which is my worst time of the day, so go ahead. Bye-bye.