Ready to debunk the myth of human potential? Join us, Dr. Taylor Hartman and Kat Larsen, as we venture into the world of potential versus reality. We scrutinize the perils of attaching oneself to someone's potential instead of their present, a risky and often disappointing game of chance. By extending grace and compassion to those in the process of growth, we learn to focus on the here and now, and the tangible progress being made.
In the latter part of our discussion, we delve into the fluid dynamics of work-life balance. We shed light on the modern shift towards seeking fulfillment beyond the office walls and how this could actually boost productivity. Furthermore, we expound on how the right milieu can cultivate teamwork and elevate performance. Addressing the elephant in the room, we broach the subject of loneliness in today’s world, providing insights and solutions to combat this pervasive issue. Join us for this insightful exploration of human potential, work-life balance, and the loneliness epidemic.
Take the Personality and Character Profiles at TaylorHartman.com.
Send questions and comments to Taylor@TaylorHartman.com Or Cathy@TaylorHartman.com with “Podcast” in the subject line.
Ready to debunk the myth of human potential? Join us, Dr. Taylor Hartman and Kat Larsen, as we venture into the world of potential versus reality. We scrutinize the perils of attaching oneself to someone's potential instead of their present, a risky and often disappointing game of chance. By extending grace and compassion to those in the process of growth, we learn to focus on the here and now, and the tangible progress being made.
In the latter part of our discussion, we delve into the fluid dynamics of work-life balance. We shed light on the modern shift towards seeking fulfillment beyond the office walls and how this could actually boost productivity. Furthermore, we expound on how the right milieu can cultivate teamwork and elevate performance. Addressing the elephant in the room, we broach the subject of loneliness in today’s world, providing insights and solutions to combat this pervasive issue. Join us for this insightful exploration of human potential, work-life balance, and the loneliness epidemic.
Take the Personality and Character Profiles at TaylorHartman.com.
Send questions and comments to Taylor@TaylorHartman.com Or Cathy@TaylorHartman.com with “Podcast” in the subject line.
Hello listeners. this is Dr Taylor Hartman, with Very Best of Living. I'm with my good friend Kat Larsen. Hello Kat. Good morning, afternoon and evening wherever you are, wherever you are and whenever you're listening, that's right.
Taylor Hartman:Welcome you and we're glad you're with us on this journey. It's fun to share with you and thank you for your letters that you write in and share with us about your life and how you're doing Very insightful and you know it's interesting. I was hearing someone say always know that everybody is dealing with something and whatever you can do to lessen the burden, the better off you are. That's probably the best way to take it. You know what I mean. So today we're going to have questions and answers for the doctor and Kat.
Cathy Larsen:You are going to be Go ahead. You can start asking Taylor. I was like I live in this fantasy world. You're a duck.
Taylor Hartman:Well, you get to ask the questions today.
Cathy Larsen:I do get to ask the questions today. That's kind of good In the driver's seat, okay. So I have been working with and looking at one of my clients that I'm coaching keeps talking about seeing this potential in this person and getting disappointed that she's notthis other person is not stepping into the potential that she sees. So my question for you is what should that look like in terms of our investment? Because you can hang out a long time when you see somebody's potential in something And I just want to know. It's like how long does it take people? Is it wrong to go? you know what That's it. I'm done moving on. Or what are the questions around? how long do I stay? What should I do? Can I enhance it? Should I draw it out of them? So I'd like you to just talk about that. Is that clear? that question clear?
Taylor Hartman:Very, very clear. Okay, actually, it's had people dealing with that question, that very question, and I think potential is a fantasy. I think it's. For example, there are people that are more talented in sports, and they are not typically the ones who are the best, because what makes you best in a sport is your discipline and your commitment to learning and understanding the sport and being in shape to be able to play it.
Taylor Hartman:So I think people get confused when they think potential is reality. Reality is only what evidence you have. It is not about what capability you have, and so I think when somebody ties themselves to a person based on potential, they are living a fantasy. It's a dream that's not going to be fulfilled in reality, because when someone says he has potential, what you're typically saying is he's not there, he's not doing it, he's not showing it, he just has the potential to, and I'd be much more interested in what is he doing right now.
Taylor Hartman:What's the evidence of who he is right now? before I bet on him? Of all the colors, the one that's probably seen the most often that has potential is yellow. There are lots and lots of people that will say, oh my gosh, the talent and the potential, and I'm like, well, that'd be great if it happens, but it doesn't mean much to me until I see evidence of it Meaning today. What is that person doing that would lend me to believe that his potential will someday be realized. And I don't think the person you're talking about is seeing that evidence. All they're living is the fantasy And that's on them Like if they're choosing to stay connected to that. I think they're delusional because what they're not seeing is legitimate evidence of it happening.
Cathy Larsen:So what you're saying is that you got to move on, basically.
Taylor Hartman:Potential is irrelevant. It's irrelevant. What's relevant is what are you seeing? What's happening, not what could happen.
Cathy Larsen:Why do you think people talk about potential? then What is it for?
Taylor Hartman:Because they don't want to give it up. They don't want to. I mean, the reality is there is potential. It's not like someone doesn't have potential, but I hear that more and more The older I get in my work. It's a fantasy of what could be. It is not what is. So if I see someone, let's say someone in football who's really really good at catching the ball and running fast, but he's just caught up in very poor behaviors, he's doing drugs and he doesn't show up on time, so they're telling you, yeah, but he has such potential, i'm like, well, yeah, you're right, he has a natural gift at something, but his daily discipline and evidence he's showing is not trustworthy. And most often, kat, in relationships you'll be hurt by believing in potential. You'd be better off saying I'm not interested in what you could be, i'm interested in what you're doing today.
Cathy Larsen:Say that one more time. I'm not interested in what you could be.
Taylor Hartman:Right, i'm interested in what you're doing today.
Cathy Larsen:So where is the compassion or grace in people's growth in your mind?
Taylor Hartman:Well, you're always hopeful, people will grow, but if I'm tying my life to your potential, that's shame on me. For whatever reason, i'm choosing to believe that's good for me, and to me that's like a gamble. And do I live gambling? No, i don't think there's a reason. Lights are on in Las Vegas Right, like the house is going to weigh in its favor, and I think people that are potential are more like a gamble and a bet as opposed to people who are performing or doing And, by the way, if they're experienced and realized right, more than happy to see that be part of life, i'd be thrilled to see that come to fruition. We would all gain by that seeing someone very talented or whatever coming through. But until they're showing evidence of it, why would I tie myself to that?
Cathy Larsen:So I'm a coach and I'm seeing a kid that's got all this potential and he's on my team. What do I do?
Taylor Hartman:Here's what I expect. I want this and this and this. Now It doesn't matter to me what your potential is. What I care about is what I'm going to see And I know if you do those things, all those potential things could only enhance my experience. But if I don't see it, go give your potential to somebody else, because I'm not interested. And, by the way, what you're doing is disruptive to the team. You have been given greater gifts than even others.
Taylor Hartman:I see out there every day doing what they need to do and you refuse to do your part. Selfish, not acceptable, that's what I would say. And, by the way, i always say to people like if you're going to fire a client or an employee, i'm sorry. Or if you're going to fire an athlete, i always say So how would I like to face them in competition? And if they're that good, i don't want to lose them. But if I'm dealing with potential, i can lose them. I can beat potential with discipline and good evidence. So I always ask that question how would it be to face that person in competition? And if they're not legitimate or solid and demonstrating good choices and habits, now I would have no problem facing them.
Cathy Larsen:You know that's as you're talking about discipline and you're right now. I mean, the hardest hits I've ever taken I think we've talked about this on the podcast have been from you to me, my hits, and which you know.
Cathy Larsen:I want to say thank you, for with all my heart I do really want to say that And for my children those are the two places where I've taken the biggest hits from my kids and from you, and I have to tell you I don't think I would have ever found discipline if I hadn't been hit that hard, like on the ground, bleeding, feeling like I know, that sounds dramatic, but it's not. It's like you like roll up in a ball for a day. I did anyway on numerous occasions and like who am I? Who am I?
Cathy Larsen:You know, and so I think, as you're looking at that, that discipline and the potential and the truth that you have to bring to somebody's life is what you're saying.
Taylor Hartman:Right.
Cathy Larsen:I don't want you if this is what it's going to be Right, Or we don't need you.
Taylor Hartman:If you're going to choose this, well and in all fairness, like let's take you for an example, kat The potential was limitless, honestly so gifted in so many ways, but what's the point? I'm just going to become more discouraged, right, if I'm playing to something that isn't happening.
Cathy Larsen:Right.
Taylor Hartman:And, by the way, i'm not doing you any favors either, because people that buy into potential and keep playing to that, all they're doing is extending the time. They're not holding them accountable. today They're saying, oh, in time, because your gifts, you could really be something. Well, that means nothing right now. If you really believe they have that, why not discipline them right now and or cut them free? You know, either one of those, right, but if you're looking with potential, you're living with fantasy.
Cathy Larsen:Great answers.
Taylor Hartman:Great answers that question for the document And I do want people to. I want our listeners to know that if you're tying to potential, then you have the ownership of your own Like what is it your? why is it you're choosing to buy into something like potential versus evidence of what is. Why are you doing that? And you did mention the issue of compassion and grace. That's not gone. I mean, no one's saying I hate the person, i don't want them in my life, none of that. I just don't trust them because they're not doing anything. Give me reason to trust them right now.
Cathy Larsen:Gosh, i love how you tie trust to potential and to building relationship. So let me just stack a question on here then on top of that. So so in your model, when you live in your limitation or the limitation of another color we've gone through this That's when people kind of have sick behavior, right?
Taylor Hartman:Right.
Cathy Larsen:How do you help that person when they don't see it as sick behavior? What do you do?
Taylor Hartman:Well, i like to tie it to congruence, like I like to say to them here's what you do and here's the consequence. So if that's not what you intended it to be, that's what you're doing, that's what's actually happening. So, if that's, if you're unaware of that, i'm now educating you that that's what's happening. And if you can't see that, then you're not caring enough to even look at it, because I'm not making it up. And if, in fact, you do see it and you don't care, that tells me even more about who you are, and that's your role, that's your work. But the difference is I'm not going to let you do that to me. Like I understand, you may choose to stay in a sick behavior. Obviously, i believe in agency, but not at my expense. Does that make sense?
Cathy Larsen:Yes.
Taylor Hartman:So I would want them to get better by showing them how what they're doing creates ill effect. But if they don't choose to act on it and repair it and get congruent, then that's fine, but not at my expense. I never want to lie to a client. I always want to say to them what I see and how I believe that will impact their life, so that perhaps down the road, if they don't embrace it now, later they will say he was right, he didn't lie to me. That's true at the time.
Cathy Larsen:That makes sense, that makes a lot of sense. So, as you're looking at the world, so I want to ask you a question, as we're looking at this and you work in corporate America quite a bit right.
Taylor Hartman:Right.
Cathy Larsen:Tell me, as we look at the world of business today, what's happened through COVID with generational stuff? what's going on? what do you think are the biggest things happening in corporate America that are making people not want to buy in to work, because here's what I hear. I want flexibility, i don't. They kind of beat the crap out of you. What are companies doing bad and what are companies doing good in the world today?
Taylor Hartman:Well, it's interesting. One of the things that I've really liked is there is a better balance of life. We've probably aired on the not being as strong a team player as we could be. That's the negative. What's in it for me is more important typically today than it was 50 years ago. But I do like the fact that people are saying I want more from life than just work, which I like. So some of them are saying just quality of life. I want to be able to do things in my life outside of work that are meaningful.
Taylor Hartman:But the negative of that is that I do think some people take advantage. But I also believe that it doesn't really matter where you're working at home or you're working at the office You are who you are in your own character, and you will make it successful. People are legitimate. Wherever they work, they're getting more effective. Some people are actually more effective working at home because they're not bothered by the daily drama of what's happening in the office, and other people need the structure to be effective in the office And, depending on the job, all of that makes a difference. So I think if people get honest with themselves, they find that it actually has enhanced the opportunities and possibilities of being more effective with your work. On the other hand, it's also loosened some of the requirements for that and been less productive and less effective. They always go back to motive, always Like the boss that wants to control you and micromanage you is going to be less effective and get less work out of somebody than the boss who has confidence and trust but also holds you accountable to performance. So today I think it's better to say here's the outcome I need to see how you get theirs on you. If you can't get there, though, that also tells me you're not the right person for the job. But if you can get there in your own way and it makes sense and it's supportive of our principles and values as a company, i'm all for it. And then I talked to the team building connection.
Taylor Hartman:I do find that the companies that enhance the quality of life of their people tend to have better success. There's more of a desire to work as a team or support the company, as opposed to just themselves. 50 years ago, kat, there were so many, many employees that they gave up themselves for the company, and then there was a betrayal. That happened 2008, 2009. A lot of employees were told sorry you're out, and I don't totally fault the company. They can all fair in this You can't pay the bills. You can't pay the bills. You have to let people go. But there were people who said I gave you my life and you just cut me out.
Taylor Hartman:So then things shifted to where people are more like what about me? as opposed to the company, i prefer the blend, like you really do commit to the company and the team and you want to grow other people, but you also are finding time for your own life. It's funny you say this because we just had a conversation with a company president the other day and he was saying that what he found is that if people are liking where they're working, then they will actually work harder between seven and five and go home and have a better, healthy homelow. We kind of meander through the day seven to eight, but they're messing up their whole life and they're really not that efficient and effective at work when they could be. So they're creating an atmosphere that says let's be efficient and effective and let's also have our own healthy home life, which I like.
Cathy Larsen:That's good, i'm taking a note. Okay, so I have a question that I deal with. When I'm working with coaching clients, it seems to be that there's this loneliness, alone feeling in the world today. Have you noticed that?
Taylor Hartman:Yes, very much so.
Cathy Larsen:And can you just speak to why and maybe some steps to look at it differently or maybe frame it differently?
Taylor Hartman:You know, covid really did a mind shift for a lot of people, being cut off from other people. I think we realized how much more social humanity is by nature than not, and I do think that, because of people's ability to choose not to be with someone, it makes them much more vulnerable to being alone. And, as you know, there's loneliness and there's a loan, and a loan can be a wonderful experience and loneliness can be not so wonderful. I think that in order to not feel lonely, you've got to commit to something bigger than you. There's got to be a reason to get up in the morning to go, connect or be with or help out with. That makes loneliness less pronounced than when people are guarded, uncomfortable, risking, unwilling to reach out, to participate in something They seem to be more vulnerable to being lonely in their lives. And people that are more willing to risk, be vulnerable, ask connect. They seem to find places to connect with other people. And it's also personality wise. There are some personalities that just really need connection more than others.
Taylor Hartman:And it's interesting to me this young man I'm working with who is blue. He wants a relationship very much, but he's also very critical, and so he makes it almost impossible to get the thing he wants the most, because once he gets close to someone he starts criticizing things they do. And the last comment he made to me was I'm not even sure if she flosses, and that's a problem for me. And I said well, you know, here's the problem I have with you. You want a relationship but you are so critical of specific things that are going on that, rather than pursue that to resolve it, you may end up alone again And at the end of the day, is that really more important to you than being connected? So I do think that people don't realize again how they get in the way And I have to tell you our audience will love this, because remember the man who couldn't stand, the dog that was coming over Other the rest of the story.
Taylor Hartman:He comes back and says I went outside when the dog was there with his owner and I asked his name and I waved to the man who I couldn't stand And he said I realized you all helped me. See, i was the problem, not him and certainly not the dog. And he goes. You know it's so fun about this. Now I honestly don't look for that time when I expect him to be out there going on my property. I care less. It's irrelevant to me anymore. I have freed myself so dramatically by owning that I was the problem and not him. It was so mesmerizing I got to tell you saw somebody get over himself and free himself at the same time.
Cathy Larsen:So I want to go to the dog poop incident. I love it. I need a blog on that one.
Taylor Hartman:Yes, it's just such a great comment. Oh, my God.
Taylor Hartman:He was so sure it was the dog and the other guy. And yet his wife didn't trust him because he was so angry. He was obsessed with this, looked for it all the time on the ring camera, so he'd go out there and get irritated by it And he said it's funny, i don't even pay attention to anymore. It's like I don't know what I was thinking. I look at it now and go that's crazy. So for our listeners, i want you to know that is the golden moment in your life when you can actually say I'm free. I'm free. I no longer hold myself hostage or, even worse, allow other people to hold me hostage. That's the freedom that we're talking about.
Cathy Larsen:So good, i'm so glad that guy. What a beautiful story.
Taylor Hartman:It's a great story.
Cathy Larsen:Okay, time for one more? Yep, okay, this isn't a question. I want you to tell me about your beliefs around this and then to support or unsupported How you do. One thing is how you do all things.
Taylor Hartman:I like that. I would agree with that. Actually I would agree with that. My gut says I would agree with that. I think that if somebody is flaky, they tend to be flaky in many things, not just one. I think if someone is sincere, they tend to be sincere in all things, not just one thing. I think if they are giving, they tend to be giving in all things, not just one thing. I would agree with that concept. If they are judgmental, they tend to be judgmental wherever they go.
Taylor Hartman:If they're thorough, like it's interesting, my wife is so good at follow through and depth, it is going to get done well. And I mean our Christmas is done. All the gifts for the friends and family are done. Now she makes these cookies that are so remarkable. She comes up with a way to package it. Like Martha Stewart, you'd look at this gift and say, oh my gosh. And then all she has to do is, when it's Christmas time, to bake the cookies, to actually do it, and she's got the ingredient package for everybody and the things that go with that. You know the turner, the flipper. There's so many thank you. She's just so thorough. So when I mentioned her the thing I was trying to do. She spent four hours literally that night coming up with ideas that would make it work, like ideas to make it happen. She's that thorough And I think in all things she's that way, she loves that way, she commits that way. It's thorough. So, yeah, i would go with that. What are your thoughts?
Cathy Larsen:Yeah, i do. I think you can not live in truth on it very, very easily, and I think it's like how you approach anything. It is a truth that I don't like.
Taylor Hartman:Well, that's a fair point. You know it's interesting. The company I would work with and these are all blue collar guys, like they're just great guys And they would literally go out to the applicant's car and look at how they kept the car before they would hire them, because they wanted order and cleanliness and self respect. And so people that would come to the interview they have no ideas what's happening, but the way they were as a team just orderly, disciplined, self respecting If your car was kept messy they would not hire you. So that kind of goes to your point of how you are across the board, right.
Cathy Larsen:Yeah, you think you can compartmentalize and you can't.
Taylor Hartman:I mean, I don't my, my experience, you don't. Yeah, yeah So ultimately, you are who you are across the board. Okay, that's it for today, listeners, thank you so much. We enjoy you always and love having you part of our journey together. So keep your questions coming, kat. Always a pleasure. Always Talk to you all soon. Love you Bye.