Colleen Jorgensen 0:02
There is no part of the human being that is not affected. When you live with chronic pain, there is nothing about your life that is not affected when you live with chronic pain.And that is an aspect that the people around you can't quite understand so it's difficult to share the experience. You know, one of the most challenging things I think for most people is their sense of identity their sense of self often the things that they did that they identified with as being them, are things that they are no longer able to do and then you have this whole identity crisis moment of figuring out well who am I, if I'm not able to do XYZ. You know, and some people are able to figure that out some people have a very hard time with it.
Ericka Thomas 0:43
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Hi there everyone and welcome back to The Work IN. I'm your host Ericka Thomas, and we are in our fourth and final chapter of our connection series with my guest, osteopath and chronic pain care specialist, Colleen Jorgensen. We pick up today's discussion where we left off last week, discussing how sometimes our diagnosis can be a limiting factor in how we move forward in the body, and how we reconnect to ourselves and become more comfortable in safety, and in our own skin. Today, we're going to move into a little deeper discussion on chasing that diagnosis, and the invisibility of chronic pain.
Let's get back to it with Colleen Jorgensen.
Let's get back to some chronic pain issues. I am curious about, when someone is in that chronic pain state, how the body starts to perceive the world around them. And what that may look like on a psycho emotional state.
Colleen Jorgensen 2:54
So I thank you for asking this. I think it's really important to be aware of this. So I think it's quite, quite similar to people that live with trauma, that people who live in chronic pain, not consciously don't consciously perceive the world as dangerous but their nervous system that their nervous system sees threat, where there isn't threat. So very much like that house analogy it's a little bit like that alarm is going off constantly but that alarm shows up in different ways for different people. So when you say, how does it affect a person psycho emotionally there is no part of the human being that is not affected when you live with chronic pain, there is nothing about your life that is not affected when you live with chronic pain and that is an aspect that the people around you can't quite understand so it's difficult to share the experience. You know, they're one of the most challenging things I think for most people is their sense of identity their sense of self often the things that they did that they identified with as being them, are things that they are no longer able to do and then you have this whole identity crisis moment of figuring out well who am I, if I'm not able to do XYZ, you know, and some people are able to figure that out some people have a very hard time with it.
Your digestive system is hugely affected in large part because of that vagal connection, in large part because of medications that you may or may not be taking in large part because of that sympathetic response that stress response. Your appetite is affected and either you have no appetite and don't want to eat, or you eat but you don't digest well.
That invisibility aspect that we talked about before where many people in chronic pain don't have a diagnosis, or, or even if they do have a diagnosis and it's not a diagnosis that's understood. I think the most common thing that I hear from people that come to see me is that they're not heard, they're not understood. And that, you know, as human beings that's part of our social engagement system. We want that connection. We want to know that someone is understanding us and hearing us, hearing our story.
Their ability to be social is effected because being social might mean sitting or standing which might be things that are challenging for them. Being social means being around noise and lights that if they have that noisy brain that sensitized system, those lights and sounds can feel like explosions going off. And yet you cannot hear the conversation of the one person you're trying to speak to. And that's part of that vagal system that's part of that social engagement system that's not working well.
Colleen Jorgensen 5:48
Part of that vagus system goes to the inner ear and modifies the amount of tension we have in the stapedius and tensor tympani. That helps us to decide what kind of sounds are coming in and what kinds of sounds are not. And again goes back to the animal kingdom that you want it to be able to hear if a lion was roaring. Right.
But what it means is that you then are tuned to certain sounds that are harsh on your system, but you cannot focus on a conversation, for example. So it makes it hard to socially engage. So even though you crave that connection to be with others, it's challenging for their system to go out and be with others.
Being sexual is tricky because when you're constantly in that stress response. Your blood supply is being diverted to the extremities so that you can either stand there and fight or run away and flee so that's why digestive issues are an issue. And that's why there's usually no sex drive because that's not where the priority is for your physiological system.
Sleep is usually elusive. Professionally, people are often not able to either do their job at all or perform the way they want to. Family dynamics change. Brain fog is a huge aspect that a lot of people in chronic pain are dealing with. And I'm always curious to see that most don't even realize that that's related to their pain.
You know, a lot of the symptoms people have are so widespread and seem strange if you don't understand the anatomy. A lot of people won't even tell me about things until we're way into treatment and then all of a sudden say oh actually now that you mentioned that I do also have this but it doesn't have anything to do with my pain right. I hear that all the time. But yes it always does have something because we are all one system there is nothing in the body that is not interconnected with absolutely everything else. So I don't know if that answers your question Erica. I think the best answer is, there is no aspect of your life that is not affected.
Ericka Thomas 7:54
Yeah, and I'd like to go a little deeper on that idea about how people kind of feel invisible. When we're talking about chronic pain, especially if there's no specific diagnosis, or if it's taking a long time to find a diagnosis. And that can be such a struggle because you just keep going to one doctor after another doctor after another doctor trying to figure it out. And because the medical world is so segmented and specialized that can take a long time before they can, you know, connect the dots.
For some people, and may never connect the dots, right. So, there can be this, I mean, at some point, we're dealing with physical pain, and then there's the reaction in the mind for some that, like, maybe they're just, they start to feel crazy like maybe this isn't real. It's, I mean, and some people are told this.You know I've talked to clients myself who flat out said my doctor doesn't believe me, or I'm afraid my doctor doesn't believe me, because they can't figure out what this is. How do you help these people? Obviously it's real, in their body, they're feeling it. They are the expert.
Colleen Jorgensen 9:19
Yeah. So yeah, there's a lot to unpack here. These are great questions. So I said, Yes, exactly what you just said. Any and all pain is 100% real 100% of the time, regardless of whether we can put it in a box and give it a name. That does not take away from the fact that the pain that you might be feeling is 100% real, just because we as medical professionals may not be able to figure out the source of it does not make it any less real.
So I hope that everybody out there listening hears that. Regardless of what anyone may have made you feel or told you, if you are feeling pain, you are having pain, period. There's no nothing else to say about that.
How do I help people. I listen. I really listen to their full story. I do have a medical history form, but I don't even always bring that out right away. I first just want to hear you tell me your story. Without guidance, I just want to hear where you take it and how you want to deliver it. And I really try to pay attention not only to what you are sharing with me but what are you not saying, And how is your body reacting when you're sharing certain things. And how is your body reacting when I can tell you're avoiding sharing certain things.
And as we talked about there's so many times where people will at the very end, they'll say, Oh, and I have this thing. I know it's not related to that, and you probably can't do anything about it but I just thought I'd share it just in case. And that's often the thing that helps me to figure out where everything is stemming from.
It's amazing how often that happens. And I just like to bring in a little personal story if you don't mind.
When I first had my challenges with chronic pain when I was a teenager. So I live in Montreal and right now in Montreal, it's very difficult to find a specialist especially for spine, and you don't have the luxury of choosing who you want to see. You are sent to one person and then you wait for however long that's going to mean which could be up to a year. But back then it was different.
And I was shopping around for a surgeon. So I knew that I needed surgery and I was shopping around. I must have gone to six or seven different surgeons. And I could not allow any of the ones I had met to cut open my spine because none of them saw me.
Until I met Dr Ford who's no longer with us. He was a huge, huge man ex football player with bright orange hair super sarcastic which I love. And he was the first one that heard me and that saw me. And he understood that my only care about having this surgery was that I would still be able to dance on the other side of it. And that became his goal for me. And that was everything to me.
I had spent months and months and months talking to people who couldn't care less that dance was something that if I couldn't get back to dance then, why was I having this surgery in the first place. But he got it and it wasn't anything he said it was just in his demeanor. It was in the way that I could tell he got it.
You know, so I try very hard to offer that to my clients I hope that I do. Chasing the diagnosis. So this is really, it's a challenging thing as the person living it and I'm finding it a very challenging thing as a health practitioner. Because how, who am I to say, Stop chasing a diagnosis and be okay with what you know. You know what if I said that one time, and there was something medical that was somehow missed you know. So it's a delicate dance and I can't honestly say that I have found, I have not figured out how to perfectly live in this yet, but I definitely see how detrimental it can be.
When people are just chasing a diagnosis when they have so much value placed on getting a diagnosis that they're not living in the present moment. That it's like they can't start tackling what they're living with until they have a diagnosis. So that's where I think it's, It's not serving you. And I don't mean, of course you need to clear yourself medically always.
But once that has been done there is a certain point, and acceptance is a challenging word for people in pain, when we say, you need to accept where you are in the present moment. We never mean you need to accept that you're going to be in pain for the rest of your life. So I think that's how it's often heard by someone who's living in pain. That when you say, when you say to them, you need to accept, where you are right now it doesn't mean give up the fight. It doesn't mean don't try to find a solution. It doesn't mean that life is going to get better. It just means that if you're only focused on fighting. You're never going to be able to heal.
I think of it like, imagine a boxer who when they come out of the ring they're still fighting every single person they come into contact with because that's all they're going to be in is in that state of fight. That's what it's like if you're only ever thinking of pain as an enemy. Or as this foreign thing that's coming in to invade your system. It isn't.
Pain is your nervous system, trying to communicate with you, trying to let you know that something's going on that needs your attention. So if you're only fighting it, it would be like being married to someone and you only ever argue with them. There's no partnership there. You want to figure out how to be okay, my body's trying to talk to me so let me listen. It doesn't mean that I'm saying, I'm okay with having this pain. No, it means I'm going to learn how to work with this pain so that I can get to the other side of it.
Ericka Thomas 15:10
So is it possible for someone who is living with chronic pain and maybe has a diagnosis that is not necessarily something that can be cured. Is it possible for them to achieve some kind of balance? Some kind of peace and harmony with their nervous system?
Colleen Jorgensen 15:32
It is so possible Ericka. I hope that everybody out there who might be living in pain hears this. Our bodies are so fascinating. They are so incredibly powerful. And our body is built to strive towards a state of health. It doesn't feel like that when you're living with a chronic illness or chronic pain. But know that under the surface at a cellular level, at a physiological biological level, your body is constantly trying to figure out how to get you well.
Sometimes you just need to get out of the way and let it do what it knows how to do. And sometimes you need to jump on board and learn how to work with it. What I can tell you is fighting it constantly is not the thing that's going to get you through it. But, yes, 100%, our body we know now science has proven it we are not just neuro plastic which means that we can change the neuronal connections in our brain,we are bioplastic.
That means that absolutely everything that makes us human can be changed. So, whatever you feel right now, however long you've been feeling it. It can change. Does that mean that we can cure everybody who's living with chronic pain. No, I wish that it did. But it always has the potential to change.
And the interesting thing is, how many people have witnessed and how many people are documented in research, who their pain intensity didn't change, but by doing this kind of work they found a way to live and enjoy life again. And so even though their intensity of pain may still be the same. It doesn't bother them as much because they're also engaged with life again. So of course anyone who's living in pain you want the intensity to go down and for many, it does and it can. But it's very interesting to see that that doesn't seem to be the more important factor. A lot of people have the intensity go down, and they're not enjoying life. But it's the people who find a way to be in the present moment and engage with life again that even if their intensity doesn't go down, it doesn't bother them as much. I find that fascinating and hopeful.
Ericka Thomas 17:53
It is hopeful Yes,absolutely. It is helpful. I just want to thank you Colleen this has been an amazing conversation, and we have touched on so many, many things. But before we sign off today I did want to talk to you about your business Stillness in Motion. I'd love for you to let people know what you have going on. And if someone wanted to get in touch with you if they wanted to work with you, how can they do that,where can they find you?
Colleen Jorgensen 18:26
Perfect, thank you so much. First of all, thank you for inviting me because this has been great. I've enjoyed our conversation so much. I hope we have more. I've got a few things coming up actually. So during COVID, I created a six week online pain care program called Discover to Recover:Move from pain to potential, and that's in its second run right now we're in our fourth of six weeks so I will continue to relaunch that. And I'm also hopefully by the end of March going to launch a membership version of that because for some people six weeks is great. It's enough of a toolbox of strategies and practical tips that you can then go out on your own and manage things and for others that have more challenging ongoing issues, a membership program offers them the opportunity to keep getting more tools and to keep working together so hopefully that's coming at the end of March.
And then, on April 28, I'm giving a free webinar on Discover to Recover creative pain care for healthcare practitioners, and that will be on Embodia Academy's platform, and three weeks after that I will be giving a more in depth version, a course on that same topic but will go more in depth so that will be on May 19 so both of those are through in Embodia Academy.
I do have a free pain care ebook so if you're listening and you're in pain and honestly I wish that people who weren't in pain started to do this work because tackle it before it's a problem it's always easier to be proactive. So even if you're not in pain, grab the free pain care ebook that's at my website, which is Colleenjorgenson.org. And there's a page on their free pain care tools where you can grab that ebook.
And then I'm on social media so I'm on Facebook, under @stillnessinmotion, Instagram, _stillnessinmotion. I have a YouTube channel with tons of free content under my personal name Coleen Jorgensen. And next week myself and two other colleagues Jo Bregnard and Tawnia Converse that you know from Namastream. We are diving into the new social media platform clubhouse with a Wednesday wellness. So at 11am on 11am. Eastern Time for the next three Wednesdays, we're going to be offering just a wellness check in. So we're going to guide you through a practice. Two to 10 minutes long. And then we open it up to questions or if you just want to share about your experience or ask questions about the practice or we'll fill you in on why we chose this practice and that kind of thing. So quite a few things are going on. And the best way to reach me is either through messenger on one of the social media platforms, or you can email me at Coleen Jorgenson thirteen@gmail.com.
Ericka Thomas 21:15
I am so excited about all of those things. And I will have links to them all in the show notes, so if people want to just go to the show notes they'll be able to click on those links and find you a little bit easier there.
Colleen Jorgensen 21:32
That's fabulous thank you for doing that Ericka I appreciate it.
Ericka Thomas 21:35
I am so grateful to Colleen for sharing her story for sharing her expertise, and for sharing her time with us. That's it for this series of connections on the work in. If you like what you heard, and you want to learn a little bit more about how we can naturally shake off stress tension and trauma, head over to elemental kinetics, calm, and I'll see you next time on the work in.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai
Colleen’s Free pain care ebook:
FREE pain care tools | Mysite (colleenjorgensen.org)
Info on Discover to Recover 6 week online pain care program:
FREE pain care tools | Mysite (colleenjorgensen.org)
April 28th, 7pm EST I'm giving a free webinar on Embodia Academy:
Discover to Recover - Creative Pain Care for Health Care Practitioners
My social links are in my signature below.
I think that's it! Let me know if anything is missing.
Colleen
Grab your FREE pain care eBook here: FREE pain care tools | Mysite (colleenjorgensen.org)
Colleen Jorgensen, D.O., RYT®200, GSY-P1
Osteopath / Pain Care Specialist / Therapeutic Pilates, yoga & Somatics instructor
coljorgensen13@gmail.com
514.267.8817 (NB: Email is the best way to reach me)