Giovanna Lester on Marketing for Freelance Translators and Interpreters [Ep 49]

'Subject To Interpretation' is a weekly podcast that deep dives into the topics that matter to interpreters.🎙 Hosted by Maria Ceballos Wallis

This week we speak with Giovanna Lester on her marketing advice for freelance translators and interpreters. 

Giovanna (Gio) Lester has been a mentor for both the American Translators Association and Abrates, the Brazilian ATA counterpart. Those she had the honor and pleasure of guiding have gone on to make professional and career changes, strengthening their resolve and/or skills, helping them identify and seek extra training. Some of her mentees have gone on to become workshop leaders, create and implement career growth paths, change their specializations, discover new interests. 

While president of two Florida ATA Chapters, Gio was involved in providing training through workshops she led and bringing outside speakers. Gauging membership interest, market needs and desired subjects became a natural process that lead to identifying solutions and possible professional shifts. 

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:21

Welcome to subject to interpretation, a podcast, which takes us deep into the topics that matter to professional interpreters. I'm your host, Maria. Welcome in today's episode, we're going to talk about the importance of creating and maintaining a marketing strategy for your TNI business. Jovanna Lester also known to her friends and colleagues as geo Lester is going to talk to us about this subject. Geo is a conference interpreter in working in the languages of Portuguese, English, and Spanish. She's a translator and a writer with more than 40 years of experience in the TNI profession. Welcome geo.

Speaker 2: 1:02

Hello. Nice to be here. Thank you, Maria.

Speaker 1: 1:05

In addition to your professional experience, geo you are also the current president of ARA, which is the Brazilian association of translators and interpreters. And you have held many positions in different organizations, such as ATA, NA and C B M I Atif and others, right?

Speaker 2: 1:26

Yes, yes. I like helping people so

Speaker 1: 1:29

Well, in fact, that is actually one of the quotes that I have from you, which is that sharing your knowledge and professional experience is a passion that keeps you growing. And that's precisely what we're going to do today. We are going to sort of speak, pick your brain a little bit so that you get an opportunity to share many of those great ideas that you have about marketing in the TNI business.

Speaker 2: 1:56

Thank you for the opportunity.

Speaker 1: 1:58

Well, it's a pleasure to have you, first of all, what does marketing for translation and interpreting encompass? And why is it important in particular for freelancers or sole practitioners?

Speaker 2: 2:13

Well, the work we do goes beyond the sounds we make as interpreters and also those little colorful markings on the paper called letters, words, sentences, paragraphs, and we need to be able to convey that to our clients. I mean, if you are a staff interpreter, if you are working at a company, no problem. That's a different situation, but you, as a freelancer, you need to understand that every agency is a client of yours and you need to sell yourself rather than sit back and wait for them to come to you. No, and also you might have direct clients. So how are those direct clients going to create an image of you based on, I don't know, a website, a business card that says nothing about who you are. I mean, I'm referring to the professional directories. You go to the Naji directory. There is not an image. There is no sound there. Uh, the ATA changed that I think it was 2003 or 2005 that we introduced the sound files now, but it's very limited. Being able to portray yourself, your image, the way you want your client to see you is very important.

Speaker 1: 3:41

Now you started along this journey quite a while back. And when you began on this journey, were there any templates, was there any guidance available to you that you could follow?

Speaker 2: 3:54

Nope. Hello? Nope. Was trial and error, the scientific method, trial and error. That was it.

Speaker 1: 4:03

Now I remember you and I discussing in our pre-interview that you, uh, wanted to create your own website. And in fact, you went out and you learned HTML. Tell us about that whole experience, where you felt that it was easier for you to go and acquire a brand new skill than perhaps going out shopping for it.

Speaker 2: 4:24

Oh yeah. That was a bit of an ordeal. See, when in the eighties, when people thought of websites, they were these huge posters that were on the internet and they had no, uh, movement to them, nothing and their most geared to large companies for an individual to have a website was rare. And for a professional like translator and interpreters, you know, to have one was unheard of because, um, what were we supposed to do? We supposed to work with, uh, agencies, right? Or a publishing house. I wanted more than that. I had moved to the us not too long ago and I needed to get my face out there, sell myself. And I decided to go and create the mode. I had to do it a lot more people have come behind me and have done great work. So I'm not creating any modes recently.<laugh> and I retired that website. I have a few new ones.

Speaker 1: 5:37

Now, speaking of phase, you know, you were new to the industry, at least in this country. And you wanted people to remember you, what did you do to your business card to try and make an impact?

Speaker 2: 5:51

Ah, I remember going to the ATA conference and people giving me their cards and then I could not remember who they were afterwards. So I thought, Hey, real estate people put their faces on their cards. Why don't we do the same? And I started to do that. I would put my, um, my face on the card, not huge, just, you know, tasteful and put the, uh, logos of the associations I belonged to. And at least I felt more comfortable that when you picked up my card at home, after all the, uh, heat of the event, you could go and say, oh, I remember that lady. That's what I wanted. And I started to do that and I still do it.

Speaker 1: 6:40

And now it seems to me that probably over that period of time, you started developing little techniques to help you stand out in the TNI industry and conferences. And also as you met clients and as you were trying to either retain them or get new clients, talk to me a little bit about maybe the things that you started to put together for yourself and why you decided even early on to start sharing them with other interpreters.

Speaker 2: 7:10

Well, besides my website and besides the business card, uh, I felt that it was important to communicate with my clients between jobs. Sometimes you get a job from a client in January and only in October, you hear from them again, because I don't know an article you published, uh, was on published online, something like that. Not because they remembered you as that translator, they like to work with, you know, you're just a name. So one of the things I do is about three times a year, I write to my clients, it's small little notes, um, telling them that I finished that project. I had mentioned last year, or I finished the course. I have a new certificate. Um, anything that is related to our work that is positive. Okay. Even if you're going to talk about COVID, please make it a positive thing.<laugh>, you know, and, uh, that's how you do it. I did that because as I said, I wanted to stay top of mind with them. And that was the best way I encountered to do that.

Speaker 1: 8:29

Now, um, you're alluding to probably how you communicate with your clients right now, which is email, but in your 40 plus year trajectory, as an interpreter and translator, there have been many changes in technology. In fact, probably, you know, interpreting, not interpreting, but, um, translating and delivering a document, you might have delivered it by fax received it, it by fax and then rendered it into the opposite language and then sent the facts. Things have changed a lot. Can you walk us through the transformation that you yourself have had to make in terms of your comfort level and your knowledge of technology? So now geo is a, you know, totally tech savvy person<laugh> but maybe once upon a time, you weren't,

Speaker 2: 9:18

Oh man, I started working on an Aved letter. You know what that is?

Speaker 1: 9:24

Sounds like a typewriter.

Speaker 2: 9:26

Yes. One of the first, uh, Daisy wheels, you know, oh, no memory, no memory whatsoever. I still went to the, uh, library for, uh, research. When I had to do research, no internet. Then I had my first, um, word processor. It was a Panasonic. I could, uh, save up to 3000 wor uh, characters. That was it. Ha my gosh. So yeah, it has been a big, uh, thing. And when the internet hit, that was a total shocker. I had clients who were getting jobs done out of the country, brought over here for review because it was cheaper than paying somebody here to do it. So all of these things have shaped the way I do. My marketing have shaped the way I do my work. What differentiates me from you is not how much I charge, but the extras I add to the job I do, you know, and that is different. My flavor is different from your flavor, has nothing to do with quality, has to do with what the client needs and what I need. Um, so besides that, the getting from typewriter to word processor, to computer, to storage on the cloud and collaboration on the cloud, uh, there is also, um, uh, it was at the tip of my tongue and then went running away from me.<laugh> you've been there. So, um, there is also the, uh, cat tools. For example, we didn't have cat tools. Was that, uh, process of, oh yeah, I did a translation on the same subject three years ago. So let me bring that material to the screen. So if I need to do a search, I can do that. Go dictionaries. Now we have them online and the cat tools are so advanced. Now that you can add machine translation to your cat tool, you can add electronic dictionaries to your cat tool. So many different things that can be done nowadays. When I look back, wow, the internet needs to be canonized<laugh> so much has changed because of it. It is great.

Speaker 1: 11:56

Now you, um, very early on you decided that you had to share your new found, I guess, knowledge with folks. And I believe you mentioned to me that you did your first presentation to members of what was then flat, the Florida, um, association of translators, is that right?

Speaker 2: 12:15

Yeah. The first, uh, ath chapter in the state of Florida. And, uh, that was a trip. Nobody knew what, uh, cursor was. And I'm talking about, you know, that was a presentation on the internet on how to use the internet, how to send emails, to communicate with your clients, the very basics. They didn't even know what a curser was. What is a U L uh, address, address bar? Where is it? So I had to go through the very, very, very basics. And nowadays I have to talk about, uh, video streaming, which is completely different. And, uh, wow. It's just what, I don't know, 20, 30 years.<laugh>

Speaker 1: 13:07

Right. It's I, I find it really interesting cuz we started talking about marketing and then we deviated a little bit more into the trajectory of technology, but it really isn't such a stretch because by becoming familiar and being able to use technology to your advantage, then we come full circle because this is the technology now that not only do you have to be able to use to do your work, but you also have to be able to use it to support your business. Right?

Speaker 2: 13:41

Totally, totally. Um, Instagram, I have a colleague, who's an interpreter and she does such a great job on her Instagram account. She has, um, recorded herself interpreting like for two, three minutes, people who are well known, um, their own material that they put out on the web. So it's public knowledge, no problems with, um, um, what do you call it?

Speaker 1: 14:13

Confidentiality.

Speaker 2: 14:15

Yes. Okay. Yeah, no problem with confidentiality or copyrights. So she has created a studio in her house. Like I have done here in mine and she and her husband record her while she does the interpretation. And she has managed to also create promotions based on that. And it's so exciting. I'm really looking forward to being able to do it myself. And there's so much more, so much more, um, with a Facebook, with LinkedIn being able to promote yourself on different levels. The important thing, however, is to make sure you don't leave ghosts behind those accounts. You don't use anymore. Go and kill them please. And also separate your business persona from your person. There are two different things there, your business persona and your individual person, your being, those are two different things that need to be kept apart. You don't want your clients, you know, bumping into a picture of you, uh, drunk with a glass of beer in your hands or, you know, in a cany bikini. Mm. Certain things are supposed to be kept private.

Speaker 1: 15:33

So how do you put yourself in the driver's seat in this age of technology, you've mentioned many of the tools that are available, social media in particular, as far as controlling, um, your, your social media presence. But there is just so much to do. There is so much information out there and there's just so many options that you so many ways you could go. How, how do you personally control, uh, your environment, your, your, um, electronic environment<laugh> for marketing purposes,

Speaker 2: 16:12

You just made me think of shoes right now.<laugh> you have many different pairs of shoes for different purposes. You don't wear them all at the same time. Basically. That's what you gotta do.<laugh> so focus, focus, pick one or two. I have a presence on Twitter. I have a presence on Instagram, but that was something I don't worry too much about. It's for fun. So I can, uh, follow my family. Facebook is also family and LinkedIn is business. So Twitter and LinkedIn are the ones I use for business. Those are the two I focus on. The others are fun for me and I don't, uh, re invite anybody to it. That is not related to my family can be my work family or my blood family, but it's my family. You know, there's a difference. So you do that. First of all, you have to separate which ones you can dominate. Start with. One of them learn as much as you can learn, how you can, uh, take advantage of the options, follow one or two people. So you get used to how they do their business on that same platform. And you emulate the things you like. And if you keep doing that, you know, try one first and then you try the other. Maybe you can drive both together<laugh> but even so you're gonna focus in the morning on one in the, and another, not necessarily at the same time on both of them though, some of them have a, um, a thing called, um, management. So you have social media management, uh, tools right now, like tweet, deck, Hootsuite, buffer. Those tools allow you to create, um, the graphics you want to share, and you can share them all at once on, on the different platforms, you can actually stagger how they are deployed. So you create the same graphic, the same message. That's gonna go on your Instagram, gonna go on your LinkedIn. It's gonna be out on your Twitter, but on Instagram, it's gonna go at six in the morning on LinkedIn at 20 afternoon. And on Twitter, it's gonna be at 8:00 PM. Whatever, depending on the market, you're trying to reach. If you're gonna go for Europe, 8:00 PM is good because it's a good time over there. You know, things of that nature. So you kind of, I kind of contradicted myself here, but it has to do with how you are doing the job. If you are fully engaged in technology and you are using a platform, a management platform, you can do all otherwise. If you're doing it by yourself, focus on two of them, one at a time, and then you can grow into others. Otherwise it can become a disaster. You burn yourself.

Speaker 1: 19:35

It, it can be exhausting. We all, we all have, um, encountered, uh, the, the difficulties of living 24 7 in a zoom world. And especially since, since this pandemic, but I wanna make sure that we make a distinction between these types of passive. Maybe not, not directly passive, but more passive social media, such as Instagram and Facebook, where maybe there's some comments exchanged or some likes. And for example, using the direct contact that something like LinkedIn provides for you, you have, you have access to your context, as well as the context of your context, depending on whether or not you're willing to invest in a paid account, for example, in LinkedIn. And that requires a completely different approach, right?

Speaker 2: 20:32

Uh, in my mind, yes, it does. Um, you cannot just go in and contact people and say, you know, I wanna be working with you. Number one, you're doing dealing with professionals, not friends. You want a friend, it's a different thing. It's a business connection. You need to focus. Why are you contacting that person? What is your goal? Do you have something to give that individual also because there's got to be a give and take it's a business business immediately implies a give and take. So that's number one. Number two. How are you going to approach that person? You cannot simply say, Hey, I saw you online and I liked your name. Shall we connect? No, there's got to be something deeper. Um, I have written to people I don't know on LinkedIn because I'm a paid member. I can access their contact information, but I have to be respectful. And that's what I did. I was very respectful. I approached the gentleman. Who's a lawyer who works in an area I'm interested in and I introduced myself. I'm Jill Laster. I'm a translator. And the interpreter working in this area. And I see that you also, uh, you are also active in the same field. I think we might be able to assist each other. And I invited him for a conversation. That's very different from saying, Hey, you work in the same area I do. Shall we link? No, be professional.

Speaker 1: 22:11

Now, how do you, how do you approach the, the fact that let's say maybe you have a, a few minutes here and there and you reach out to some people. And on next day you get really busy because a new job came in for you and everything. Just kind of, you know, takes the back, goes into the back burner. How, how do you personally handle the consistency that really is required and the follow through to successfully manage these new relationships and new contexts? Cuz you also have to work. Of course

Speaker 2: 22:52

At work time<laugh> oh, they live with vacation, right? Oh, I, I think I sing them someplace<laugh> oh no. Oh, kidding aside. Yes. It requires discipline. When you have discipline, you find time to do what is important for you. I have gone to sleep at 9:00 PM so I can wake up at 3:00 AM to do work. It was important for me. I needed to do that. I did. So you just need to do, uh, programming. You need to schedule yourself. And there are many tools online to assist you with that. And that's basically what I do. And nowadays, for example, I get up at six in the morning so I can do work related to Abras when I'm done with Abras work. Then I do work related to my social media when I'm done with my social media work. And by then it's around, I don't know, nine 30, 10:00 AM. Then I start with my business. Now it is not every day. It's two, three days a week. And sometimes I will work on a branches business on a Saturday because there, there is stuff that needs me and I can't do much about it. Thank goodness for the pandemic. I told you there was a good, you know, a silver lining to the pandemic. I can't go out. So I stay home and I work, but yeah, you need to schedule yourself. And again, you can make uses of those platforms that allow for you to schedule your posts. So you can program your posts for the whole week, all in one day. So this afternoon you have no translation work to do all your invoices are out, sit down, have fun and do all your social media in one sitting. Everybody's gonna think that, oh my gosh, you're so efficient. How can you do that? Every day I did that on one sitting three hours and that's done. I was, uh, curating, um, Twitter account, many of the followers of that account or in Europe, six hours apart. So I programmed my first tweets of the morning, the night before and somebody questioned me, you know, what are you doing? Why are you doing this? And I said, look, I'm sleeping. But the people who follow the account are awake and they expect to see something. So they will comment on what I wrote by the time I wake up, there'll be three or four comments and I'm inter um, excuse me, I'm interacting live with you. I didn't just throw it there and ignore it. No, but it's my way of respecting your schedule. Maybe by the time I answer it, you are having lunch or you're taking a nap, but I was there. I answered it. We are still communicating, interacting real time.

Speaker 1: 26:09

Gee, this whole concept of marketing yourself can be a very overt type of concept or it can be a very subtle concept. You mentioned your work with Abbra and I imagine that over the years, your participation in different organizations has contributed to, um, the expansion of your business. Is, is that so

Speaker 2: 26:36

Yes, most definitely my, my life would not be the same. Were it not for professional association directories? That's where most of my clients is still find me. So Naji, Abra, uh, the ATA, uh, I a P T I, my name is out there thanks to them. And why do I like to be a member of those associations? Why do I pay money for that? I mean, because it's important. One of the things I also do is advocacy. And I do that because I believe in the work they do, I'm getting goosebumps here and that's how truthful it is for me. Really these associations are there to do what, um, the syndicate that the unions do for other workers, you know, as closely as possible. I had to do a presentation for the I Mia on nonprofit associations and I learned something very important. They move a lot of money, number one, and they basically do the work the government can't afford to do for specific segments of the population. And that's what we are as specialized professionals. We are a special segment of the population. So these associations service us with newsletters, with, uh, publications. They do, uh, lobbying for us, for example, I mean, not the way politicians do, but they write in our defense to the government, like, uh, the associations did now with regards to COVID asking for medical interpreters to be vaccinated also to be part of the first group to receive vaccines, uh, when they wrote about the interpreters who were abandoned in, uh, Iraq and Iran after the wars, um, Naji opinion papers that tells the court and lawyers how to use our services and why it's done this way or that. So I love the work they do. That's why I pay to have my name in their rosters. And people respect me for that. And there is one more thing. Have you all heard of is O I imagine, right. One of their requirements. Can you define ISO for us first is the international standards organization, sorry. Yes. And, uh, they are the global organization that determines the standards. There are ally standards. There are the European standards, the north American standards, even, uh, Brazilian standards. Okay. So is O requires for you to be, uh, compliant with one of their requirements. Unfortunately, I do not remember the number, but for you to be compliant with one of their requirements, that you be a member of a professional association, who is a member of the fed international Federation of interpreters fit from France. And that allows you to very nicely put on your resume or your business card. I O whatever the number is compliant. You know, again, you are promoting yourself and why, because you're a member of an organization that's there fighting for your rights. So yes, I do. I belong to them and I love it.

Speaker 1: 30:32

And that, of course, you know, is the, the absolute definition of work smarter and not harder.

Speaker 2: 30:41

Yes. Ma'am you said it

Speaker 1: 30:43

<laugh>,<laugh> now, as far as all of the information that you've gathered over the years, you have obviously done presentations and you've shared it with colleagues and, and, and I believe that, um, you're one of the, the most generous in spirit, um, colleagues that, that I know, because you share your knowledge freely, um, in any way that you can, but sometimes you actually have to put it down in a very organized manner so that people can actually, uh, work it out from a to Z, so to speak. So you've put together a course, um, for authorship program in the LAMODA Institute of interpretation, in which you actually not just go over the things that we've talked about today, but you actually walk translators and interpreters through all the things that they need to do to establish their social media presence, et cetera. Tell me more,

Speaker 2: 31:45

Ah, one of the issues that we have is when we go to work and nobody knows how to handle life, and we really hate that. Yeah. Like being called a translator<laugh>

Speaker 1: 31:58

And when you're an interpreter, of course.

Speaker 2: 32:00

Yes. So, um, I started by helping, um, those who are going to take the course to understand the parts of a website, the mechanics of it, how it works, how it gets together, how it gets put together, the need for having a professional, do the work. Okay. You are learning the language that this individual is going to be used. When talking with you, it's not for you to learn. I'm not teaching you to do a website. No, I'm teaching you to understand what is required. So you understand the price you're being charged. And you also can prepare yourself. You select your pictures, the text you want on your website, identifying the clients you're gonna be writing for and attracting with your material. All that is very important. So, so that is the one part about websites. I also talk about communicating with your clients in a positive way. Just as I mentioned before, I do three or four times a year. It's not all the time. It's not every time something happens, but it's important for you to stay top of mind. So there are companies that do mass email distribution, however they do. So in a way that each one of those emails come up to the individual in the two area, it's directly to that individual and you feel respected, represented. It's not like when we receive emails from agencies, dear linguist, I have a name. I want you to use my name. I like it.<laugh> so that's another thing I do talk about. And I go, we actually get to create one of those messages. So it's very interesting. And I also talk about a program that actually, it's what they call SAS. It's a service as software, as a service SAS software, as a service that is online, uh, it's free. You can pay if you want, you can have a paid account, but it's also free. And the features allowed for you to create nice graphics. They have already templates. All you do is go there, change the picture, change the text, but you leave the lettering, you leave the colors. So you make it your own.

Speaker 1: 34:41

Well,

Speaker 2: 34:41

One of the things that, those pieces,

Speaker 1: 34:43

Okay. I'm sorry. Go ahead.

Speaker 2: 34:45

Yeah. So those are the three pieces that I cover to, to, to give you the basics from there, you can, you know, extrapolate and grow more and do more things.

Speaker 1: 34:57

And you, one of the great things about that course is that you have really done all the legwork for everybody. It would've probably taken me tens of hours to go through the internet and try and find the best apps or the best programs to create a template for this. You know, that communication advertising, et cetera, but you really nailed it. You just went right in there and you give the students an, an opportunity to create their own vision. What characteristics do you feel that an interpreter or a translator needs to be successful in marketing? Of course, this is a part from the knowledge skill, the knowledge sets that they have to have knowledge, skills, and abilities that they have to have for their interpreting or their translation service.

Speaker 2: 35:55

Um, curiosity is number one, it might kill cat kill cats. However it makes for great professionals. You need to be thirsty for knowledge. I attended a seminar today. That was absolutely incredible. I I'm taking courses right now. I'm taking a course on interpreting. I am an interpreter, but I'm refreshing myself. You know, my knowledge, my vocabulary language is alive. People don't forget that. Um, I'm taking a course on comparative law. So study learn, be thirsty. That helps you a lot. And not only on specific subjects, EDMS learn jokes, even, uh, swear words.<laugh> so all of this becomes part of our lives. When we are behind the microphone, we don't know what's coming out of that person's mouth. So it's very important for you to be prepared, even if you do, as I do, which is pick your client, you know, knowing who you want to serve, identify that niche that you belong to and going after the individuals that operate within that niche for you even. So sometimes you get surprises. I remember it was a position and somebody brings a dog in. I had to interpret something that the opponent come made a comment. The opponent made about that, that had nothing to do with what was going on or legal. Yes. Surprise. Guess what?<laugh>. So

Speaker 1: 37:42

Now I, I, I have heard you say this before, and, and I think it's important that we reemphasize it, which is that you believe in picking your clients.

Speaker 2: 37:55

Yep, definitely.

Speaker 1: 37:57

<laugh>. What advice do you have for newbies in the field? Maybe it's somebody who has just gotten a certification has just graduated from a two or four year program. Somebody that's new to the industry. What advice do you have for them in terms of picking their clients?

Speaker 2: 38:18

Okay. There are a few parts to this advice. So<laugh>, I'll try to be succinct. Number one, understand what your passion is, what really moves you, discover that. And then go after people who work in that field, who work with that subject matter, that attracts you and make sure to prepare yourself for that job. Once you do that, you need to, in your marketing, identify yourself as somebody who does that, who is good in that aspect. However, you're not gonna go and say, Hey, I'm Jill. I know how to paint walls. Eh, uh, uh, oh, you need to think in terms of what your client wants. You want to attract them. You cannot be chasing each one of them. You want them to come to you. So, um, if we are dealing with somebody who just became, um, a court interpreter or a legal interpreter for that matter, let's forget the court because those are regional, but you are a legal interpreter. What type of legal area attracts you? Is it family? And in family, is it juvenile court that has to do with succession or something related to divorce, or, you know, there are different, uh, sub segments identify that go to the bar association website, identify the lawyers that work in that area, in that field that just interests you. And then you write to them again, when you write to them, you are not talking about who you are, but you identifying possible problems. They have, can you understand what your client is saying? No. Well, let me help you. And my website, I say, um, whether it is a change in lifestyle or a professional endeavor, let me be your voice. And that has to do with what my clients are looking for. There are websites that can help you identify exactly the language you can use to help with your marketing. They are there, but the most important thing is one, know what you wanna do? What, what areas you wanna work with? Two, understand the needs of your customer and cater to that, uh, three pick your language correctly. And I do not mean the language you speak, but how you address your client. It is very important for you to do it the proper way. And, uh, it is also important for you to understand that you need a professional to assist you and putting these things together. Somebody who has the proper training, otherwise you can burn yourself with a website that's not properly. Um, designed has difficulties is always breaking and creating problems for you. And as far as getting that first job, make sure you understand the cost of your work. How much does it cost you to get the job done more easily think in terms of how much you wanna make at the end of the year, break it by the number of weeks you want to work. And there is a formula for that, and you're gonna find it in many different places. Once you do go through the formula, you find who you want to work with. Bring those two pieces of information together and take a leap of faith, a well-formed leap of faith.

Speaker 1: 42:26

Is that gonna be any different for someone an established professional who wants to venture out into a new niche?

Speaker 2: 42:35

I don't think so. I don't think so. Those individuals are also, you know, uh, trying something new. They're also growing out of their, uh, they're moting out of their old selves.<laugh> sorry. I just saw that image. You know, the butterfly coming out of the cocoon. So it is important for you to understand it's a change. Change can be good or bad. It's your attitude. Always, always, always your attitude. That's going to determine the outcome. It may not be what you want, but you can simply say, oh, well win some, lose some, I'm fine. And you go on your Merry way or you can stand there and cry your heart out. It's your attitude. That's going to determine how you are going to go forward.

Speaker 1: 43:27

And that attitude also extends to your relationship with your colleagues and other colleagues, willingness to refer you if they are unavailable, or if they know that you have specialized, let's say, like you said earlier in juvenile dependency or some other, um, some other kind of legal aspect. If you've ex specialized in that they might call you or recommend you instead of saying, oh, I don't really know anyone.

Speaker 2: 44:00

Mm-hmm<affirmative> exactly. Um, your colleague is a tool in your arsenal. You are a professional arsenal. Always whether they work in the same language, or if they don't work in the same language, they are always a tool for you. You get sick. I mean, you a freelanclancer you work alone, you get sick. Your client calls you for a job. What are you gonna do? Lose your client. Say, oh, I'm sorry, I'm sick. I can't do it. Uhuh. Don't worry, John. I am sick, but Maria can help me. I know two or three people, I'm gonna go check to see if they are available and I'll put them in contact with you. Don't worry about it. I had a huge 500 fortune 500 company, client of mine, direct client. And I had to leave. I had to go to Brazil and spend six weeks over there. I wrote to them and I gave them the names or five colleagues of mine, whom I had contacted and made sure they were available to assist. Should anything happen? Fine. I send information to my client. I leave for Brazil. Get there. The phone rings. Can you do this for us? Uh, I'm not in the country. I sent you the name of five people. I know, but we like working with you. I can't try one of them. How long you gonna be gone? Six weeks. Oh, we'll wait.<laugh> no, you don't be afraid of losing your customers. Your customers are your customers, your friends or your friends. Your colleagues are always gonna be there. Have your back help you. So trust them. And I've had, uh, clients, I'm doing a job for one now, a hundred thousand words. But I believe in September, I recommended a colleague to them. They went and they did their job because I was busy doing something else. They came back to me when they're done. They're my clients. They may go back to my colleague when they are in the same, uh, pickle again. But that is helping your client. We are in this business. Not necessarily because we want to become billionaires. No, we like helping people. Don't we, you need to be ready. Your job goes beyond the project. You receive a project, you deliver the project. You wanna know your customer is happy. And if you cannot deliver that project, you still wanna know your customer is happy. I have received jobs for Portuguese, for Italian. Doesn't matter. I have referrals. I send it to my clients. They get in touch. They do their jobs. And when it's my language, they come back to me again. So yeah, they are a tool learn to use them.

Speaker 1: 47:15

So your best marketing tool, it seems to me is your professional reputation and your word.

Speaker 2: 47:23

Exactly. Nothing will take the place of that. Nothing.

Speaker 1: 47:30

Lester, thank you so much for joining us here on subject to interpretation. Thank you for having me over. It's always a pleasure. Thank you for joining us here on subject to interpretation. We hope that this podcast has enriched your journey along this fascinating field of interpretation and translation. If you're watching us on YouTube, please share your comments with us below. And if you're listening to us, don't forget to subscribe. So you don't miss our weekly episodes. Take care.