The one with the two hour design sprint - Teresa Cain Author Solving Problems in 2 Hours E142

🎤🎞️Only 2 Hours?!  “The one with the two hour design sprint” with Teresa Cain Author Solving Problems in 2 Hours in CX Passport Episode 142🎧 What’s in the episode?...

CHAPTERS
0:00 Introduction
2:18 Why is 2 Hour Sprint necessary
4:30 Overcoming risks of 2 hour sprints
6:10 Scoping the right challenge for a sprint
8:00 Logistic tips for 2 hour sprints
9:40 From Liberal Arts to UX and Design
13:50 Product teams using contact center customer insights
17:19 1st Class Lounge
24:10 She was ChatGPT WAY before ChatGPT was cool
28:05 Converting this to action…to business results
30:23 Contact info and closing

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I'm Rick Denton and I believe the best meals are served outside and require a passport

Episode resources:

2 Hour Design Sprints: https://www.2hourdesignsprints.com/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cainteresa/
Twitter: @DesignwithTCain

#customerservice #customerexperience #design #sprint #designsprint #customer #improvecustomerexperience #customerserviceprocess #process #business #management #travel #bettercustomerservice

Transcript

Teresa Cain: 0:00

If you do not have a plan to execute your design, Sprint, roadmap, anything that you're really working on, it's going to fail.

Rick Denton: 0:13

You're listening to CX Passport, the show about creating great customer experiences with a dash of travel talk. Each episode we’ll talk with our guests about great CX, travel...and just like the best journeys, explore new directions we never anticipated. I'm your host Rick Denton. I believe the best meals are served outside and require a For those of you who have been at a design sprint, I want you passport. Let's get going. to think about the longest it's ever taken. Weeks, probably maybe months for some of you. Okay, now visualize how fast you think it could have been. You're probably thinking that you could get it down to a week, maybe a few days. Or if you're really bold a day perhaps. Two hours Yep. To t w o hours. That's the reality. Today's guest Teresa Cane, Director of Product Management user experience and design for Trevi Pay creates and her book solving problems in two hours, how to brainstorm and create solutions with two hour design sprints released back in April of 2023. That is a bold claim, and we will get into the how and why of that claim in today's show. In addition to being an author of guides to design delivery, Teresa leads a team at Trevi pay overseeing a staggering 7 billion billion dollars in payments and shaping the experience for over 100,000 daily users. I can say our innovation and particularly speedy innovation would be key to success here. Prior to this Teresa has an impressive track record with companies like SMG Service Management Group net smart technologies, Lexmark and h&r block where she's played pivotal roles in product strategy, mobile solutions and integrations as part of her origin story. I'll let you guessed what double major Theresa was. I also bet you'll get it wrong. Stay tuned to the show to find out the answer, Theresa, welcome to CX passport.

Teresa Cain: 2:16

Thanks for having me on the show, Rick.

Rick Denton: 2:18

Let's let's get into this. And we are not going to even use two hours to do this when we're gonna get all of your wisdom in a half hour. So we'll go even beyond that to our design sprint. Let's talk about that your book solving problems in two hours it came out earlier this year in April 23. Now I realize that speed is the obvious answer here. But go deeper than that. Why was a concept of a two hour Design Sprint necessary?

Teresa Cain: 2:45

Yeah, no, that's a really great question. And it's one I get asked a lot and if you can imagine. So really with the concept of design Sprint's and design thinking, so I'll kind of rewind a bit. So if you recall, the concept of design thinking is where you can take months to year solving a process or a problem. And the concept of the design sprint, which was created by Jake Knapp and the team at Google Ventures was meant to really problem solve in five days. And what a lot of organizations really struggled with back when this book came out in 2016, is not every organization really has the bandwidth like Google does to run multiple, five day design sprints over long periods of time. In addition to that, a lot of organizations really looked at this method as something they could schedule out a year from now. So perhaps they plan in their budget for the following year. And they set aside a certain amount of money to bring in a third party firm. So what was really missing for that process, and why I developed this process and why it was needed, was really to solve a need for organizations and entrepreneurs, to be able to use this method to solve problems quicker and more efficiently. So let's say you have a problem that you need to solve tomorrow, you're able to use this process and effectively bring a solution in with your engineering teams right away. Yeah,

Rick Denton: 4:06

you've, you've used the word effectively in there. And that's the one that I think I want to key off of, because there's a lot of things that can be done really, really quickly. And a lot of times really, really quickly, is also in hand in hand with really, really crappy if we talk about kind of the scrappy way of doing it and that sort of thing. And, and that that has value in and of itself. But there's risks with that speed. And I imagine there's skeptics around the to really Theresa two hours Come on. And so I see all those benefits of the faster design sprint. How about some of those risks? And both the perception of those risks and the reality of those, how are you overcoming both the perception and the reality of those risks?

Teresa Cain: 4:49

Yeah, that's a really great question. So I will say no matter whether you're using a two hour Design Sprint or a five day you're gonna have failures. So 80% of design sprints. What Whether it's a five day method or two hour are going to fail. And in fact, with this two hour process, what it's really meant to focus on is small and medium problems that you're able to use during that two hour time period. So you're not going to go take this and you know, build out a brand new, multifaceted website and to our right, that would be a large problem that you probably need to do more than a five day design sprint, you should probably have a lot more planning involved. So where this process the sweet spot really is, with a two hour Design Sprint is to really take small or medium problems that your organization is looking to rapidly get feedback on and solve with a collective group of stakeholders to kind of move it to that next step.

Your CX Passport Captain: 5:43

This is your captain speaking. I want to thank you for listening to CX Passport today. We’ve now reached our cruising altitude so I’ll turn that seatbelt sign off. <ding> While you’re getting comfortable, hit that Follow or Subscribe button in your favorite podcast app so you never miss an episode. I’d love it if you’d tell a friend about CX Passport and leave a review so that others can discover the show as well. Now, sit back and enjoy the rest of the episode.

Rick Denton: 6:10

How Okay, so almost don't want to say tactically, because that's a perhaps a slightly overused word. But maybe more practically, I'm a company I've got a myriad of problems, some that feel big, some that feel small. But sometimes I don't necessarily know that sighs that scoping how are you how have you helped companies kind of winnow down to this is the one or the ones that fit this approach.

Teresa Cain: 6:35

So ultimately, it's really, really comes down to the types of customers that you're engaging with and solving with. So when an organization comes to me with a problem, or we have a problem at Trevi pay, you know, just to give you a little bit of idea here, so we actually have 27 engineering teams, we have a little over 200 in our product and technology org across the globe. So that really means we're not just problem solving, small, medium, large problems, we're problem solving with stakeholders all over. And Australia, we've got offices in the US, Australia, Costa Rica, and so forth. And so what makes a really great problem for a two hour Design Sprint is something you have a strong demand for that you need to get over the finish line because your customers are asking for it tomorrow, or you want to get a competitive edge. Or perhaps you already have a well faceted backlog that you're managing, and you want to grab something on there that you don't quite have a solution for yet. And you need to bring it over that finish line before you go into your next sprint spike cycle. So there's not really one right or wrong answer to what type of problem is best, it's really what's going to add the most value for your organization if you use this to our designs per method.

Rick Denton: 7:50

And that doesn't surprise me to hear you say there's no actual checkbox here. It's not this is the shape, this is the size is the color of it, this is what automatically fits that idea of being able to deliver that immediate impact. I imagine there's also a logistic element of this that, that when it's two hours, there's a gathering of those that understand the insights that are required, and the solutions or the I guess, the tactics, the skills, the technology, if you will, to solve those is gathering of all of those elements, a challenge in the two hour sprint or something that is actually kind of fits very well within that.

Teresa Cain: 8:29

That's actually an efficiency that was really created with this process. So with the number of five day design sprints I had, I had actually, you know, Whittle those down to a couple days over the years. Before I had created this process. And part of why this process was created is you can get a group of 20 people together for two hours a lot easier than you can for 10 hours or 24 hours. Right, especially on this international timezone difference when you are managing teams for products and solutions across the globe, you need to be able to have a window, you could get everyone. And if you're not getting all the right stakeholders, you're going to be missing out on the key components for that solutioning portion. So that really was the biggest driver is how can we really use a time period that gets everyone together collectively engaged and be able to problem solve for a particular feature or subset going on for your organization? I'm,

Rick Denton: 9:28

there's a smile of just the insights that you're sharing that everyone, but there's a personal smile because I have a current client situation that I think would benefit greatly from what you're describing there. And I've been trying to share exactly how can I help communicate what you're describing? You just did it there. So maybe extracting that segment and having that conversation with my client about it's a lot easier to bring people together for a short period than have this extended ongoing element to that. So thank you both for the listeners but also selfishly for me. Absolutely. I mentioned In the intro, that you've got, to me at least a career origin story that is unique. It's not one that I would have expected you to say. And yes, the answer to the trivia question is journalism and English double major. For those of you that got that, right, you're lying. And for the rest of you that are honest about it, be surprised by this. And it's amazing that Theresa, I'm really interested how that made those majors. And of course, aside from the fact that I guarantee those helped and authoring the book, but how do you go from those majors to a focus in design, UX, and overall customer experience? It's

Teresa Cain: 10:35

really those sneaky minors. Rick, so you know, while I was a journalism and English major, my emphasis was actually technical writing and editing. So that means I was editing HTML. And that's actually how I got my first job out of college at h&r block, which was editing tax cut.com articles in HTML. And so, so that's actually really how I got my start in the tech world and then moved on to sequel in, you know, right into product management and dabbled in some Python and other languages over the years. But really, a really unique experience where I've actually had the opportunity to be in the proc and technology space for 16 plus years. So I really got my start. Right in there, right out of the get go.

Rick Denton: 11:22

So that is okay, you actually are catching me off guard there because I thought it might be no one teaches me how to think and I didn't think about the sneaky majors actually in with two children at college right now they've got some sneaky majors that I know are going to help them in a similar way going forward. I have to imagine that, you know, in one class when you're studying Proust and Shakespeare, and then you're also then understanding HTML, there had to be some sort of some mental disconnects there. How about taking those worlds together? So you started there, and you evolved into where you are today? I'm curious how you see the worlds of design and customer experience weaving together, it seems obvious, and yet there seems to be a tribalism that exists there. How are those two worlds really at their best when they're weaving together?

Teresa Cain: 12:13

Yeah, so, you know, just kind of circling back to, you know, one of my first roles, you know, my first I, when I started h&r block, before I got offered a role there, I was actually interning in my very first internship, I was actually asked to do my taxes and all kinds of different softwares that you know, at the time, TurboTax was kind of coming in the market for h&r block, and several others. And so when you think about customer experience, think about all the different tools that you could have a different experience in and doing your own taxes, aside from the fact of working with an accountant or work going to an h&r block store, or another mechanism, those are all different experiences targeting different generations and different types of audiences. And so one of the recommendations I had developed at the time, was that they should be partnering with universities, you know, for that model. And that was in part because of the experience of how do you really bring a customer along for the journey, not one, that they're just starting when they go to college, but one, you know, as they further their career, as they perhaps get married, perhaps have children. And so that's really part of that customer journey, when you think about the experiences we have across different products and solutions of how do we really keep that customer interested in coming back for more.

Rick Denton: 13:34

And that really kind of hits me as I think about some of those products, I will not name them. But the ones that I've used, how some of them I did start using right as I came out of school, and my gosh, you know, through marriage through kids through empty nesting, all of that the evolution and how those tools have evolved with me. And Kevin, well, you want to talk about lifetime value of staying with a customer journey. I don't know that we often think in decades, and yet you're describing that thought of financial software, being a decade oriented element of that I imagined to do that requires Well, understanding the customer, right, that's a key element of customer experience. And I talk a lot longtime listeners know this, they know that I talk a lot about how I love that the contact center. And all of that inbound customer knowledge is just such a source of rich, rich customer insights. And I talk a lot to the contact center folks about how do you leverage that? How do you then communicate that outward? Well, you're on the other side, you're the the consumer of this information. And so I get the chance to actually ask a consumer of that information. How are you tapping in to those consumer insights through the contact center and others? What are what are how are you succeeding at that? And then what are some of the challenges in unlocking those insights? So I

Teresa Cain: 14:52

might have a little bit of a biased answer. So while I am a consumer of that info, I actually got Net Promoter certified I'd 15 years ago, okay, got metrics. So I have actually been along for the NPS and CX journey throughout my entire career. And really, that actually, what you just described is the fundamental of what we should be tapping in, in the product and technology and user experience teams. And so with that, in every organization, I've actually been at, I've had the opportunity to roll out a net promoter survey, partnering with support and other teams, really for that product feedback. So that's really critical. And I've used a number of tools. Over the years, you obviously saw I worked at service management group, but also Medallia Qualtrics, cleverbridge, sales forces NPS. So I have rolled out quite a few programs and how I'm really using that data today at trovi. Pay and how I have in the past, is collectively being able to look and evaluate not just the NPS scores, but what I'm looking at is the verbatims. So what are the customers saying? And one of the questions that I put on the NPS survey intentionally is, Would you be open to participating in a usability study or a design study with our product and UX team? And around 30% of our customers that take the NPS survey? And fill that out? Say yes, to that. So that's how, yeah,

Rick Denton: 16:23

30 seems really high to me. Now, I guess it's 30% of those that have already opted into a survey is still what great engagement. Yep.

Teresa Cain: 16:30

Yep. And for b2b, you know, engagement survey scores for b2b, you know, tend to run a little lower, you see, somewhere around the seven to 12% range. But again, of that seven to 12%, range 30% of those taking the survey, say yes, we'd love to do that. And that's exactly how I'm using the data is, how do I look at the experiences they have with net promoter, along with other click metric tools, like amplitude and Google analytics to see what they're actually clicking on what they're using? And then what is their experience while using that, you know, on that Net Promoter scale. And from there, I'm able to really help make decisions strategically for our roadmaps and kind of next steps for what we're trying to solve each quarter.

Rick Denton: 17:19

Oh, that's fantastic, Teresa. I love that. That willingness and that appetite and that interest in gaining that customer insights and I love taking it to that next level of great you fill out the survey. By the way, you want to join us in a user experience panel. And that's a brilliant next step of taking that insight a little bit further later I may want to talk to you about how you convert that to action we may get to there but for now, I want to invite you into the first class lounge you mentioned some destinations and Costa Rica sat in my head but you mentioned some others around the globe as well. And while you may be doing these design sessions remotely there may be some business travel that you've had or even personal travel and you know when you go those long distances it is nice to stop down in the lounge especially when you get access to the first class lounge which you get today. Congratulations. So join me here we will move quickly here and have a little bit of fun what is a dream travel location from your past?

Teresa Cain: 18:12

Yeah, so I actually just got back from Ireland which was amazing. But I did some some coastal hikes along there so that is a dream location and I will say most of Europe is a dream location Italy I try to make back to Italy every couple years since I've got family there so Oh,

Rick Denton: 18:33

oh even better. Okay, which part of Italy? Verona

Teresa Cain: 18:37

Italy,

Rick Denton: 18:37

so very nice. Very nice. Indeed. You said hi. So I want to actually double down a little bit on the the Ireland part you said hikes because I'm very interested in hiking and lived in that in the Southwest US. What does that look like in Ireland you talk about these coastal hikes What is that like?

Teresa Cain: 18:52

So So here's a fun fact for you. So I was told it was a walk but I learned that walk over there means hike apparently so I came prepared with tennis shoes but no really it's like a several mile there's just several miles of these like coastal views. We are kind of walking uphill there's a particular town I went to it's called HOath it's right outside of Dublin and it's about 45 minutes from Dublin and you get there and it's this like really quaint fishing town it's beautiful and you really climb up this hill and what is actually like seven miles of coastal hike around we're looking at beautiful views of the ocean and so forth. You know the group I had went with about half of us kind of took a detour and went to the bar so make it the full height but I think we made it about four miles and the others were wish they would have done the route we did so

Rick Denton: 19:49

Okay, so I kind of like as much as I love my Arizona desert hikes the your hike there sounds kind of intrigued especially with the you know what I've done here, I'm gonna stop off in the pub. You have give send me mail a dream travel vacation. I haven't been to yet. But I want to ask you what is a dream travel vacation you've not been to yet.

Teresa Cain: 20:07

So I think really on my list, especially after just coming back from Europe, which I love, I actually would really love to go over to Australia and New Zealand, which, for me pay actually has offices in Australia. So I with COVID, I think I probably would have gotten gone there by now. But COVID disrupted that a little bit. But for me, I think that's probably one of the journeys I'd love to take over to either Australia or New Zealand.

Rick Denton: 20:34

That would be great. And the idea of doing it kind of in conjunction with work where you're working, but if you could do sort of the slow travel mode where you're over there was so far for those of us that live here in the US that I'd want to dive into there yet either. It's definitely on the list to spend time there. I don't want to spend two weeks there. If I'm going to travel that far. I want to really immerse That sounds awesome.

Teresa Cain: 20:53

I will say I have a coworker that has been with Treasury pay for over 20 years. He's been there over 40 times.

Rick Denton: 21:01

Oh, okay. So this is now just catch up. Yeah, this also has now become a recruiting podcast for tribute pay buddy that wants to get into some of the some global travel is gonna now start popping in their applications unintentionally here, but that's a nice little, little recruiting video. What one of the things I do love about traveling, even when I'm not traveling is eating of course, and what is a favorite thing of yours to eat

Teresa Cain: 21:28

while traveling or just in general?

Rick Denton: 21:31

In general.

Teresa Cain: 21:33

So I will say so I am Italian. So I can home make my own pasta, cookies, all all the above. So I will say like I do make a healthier version, you know, then many places you'll find but I do think for me really just like going back to pastas and parmesan are kind of like what's home for me and what I think of my Nona cooking over the years and my mother. So

Rick Denton: 22:02

we got to start doing these podcasts in the afternoon evenings because now I'm hungry Teresa thinking about that good homemade pasta and the cookies. Let's go the other way and stem my hunger. What is something growing up? You were forced to eat as a kid but you hated as a kid?

Teresa Cain: 22:16

Oh, that's a tough one. I mean, it has to be vegetables, right? I've been surprised. No, I mean, this is actually this is kind of a funny story. So we're talking we're talking about Italy and Italian foods. So I actually went over to Italy when I was a teenager like young teenager. And I remember there actually are several restaurants there that have like 10 Plus course Mills over there. Because in a lot of times, you're kind of eating there and you're meant to stay there and enjoy the experience not just dine in dine out. And so I remember there was some sort of caviar variety that I was eating over there. And I would say that I wasn't ever forced to eat it but I learned when I was over there that I would put the food I didn't like in the roles until one of my cousin's figured it out and went to grab a roll and there was a lot that he found in there so never caviar. The

Rick Denton: 23:11

inventive. What boy there's an interesting I can assure you no one has answered caviar to that question before plenty of vegetables but caviar has never made the list. And I love the inventive ways that we as kids found ways to hide or dispose of food we didn't want it. What is going back to travel clothes, not the lounge. What is one travel item not including your phone not including your passport, that you will not leave home without

Teresa Cain: 23:36

hand sanitizer. I will say especially especially after after my my last my last travel trip I got I got sneezed on at the airport. So like right full on sneeze and sanitizer couldn't save me from that.

Rick Denton: 23:57

Oh, Teresa, I would want to go shower in hand sanitizer after being sneezed on in a global airport. So yes, I can understand why that would be the one travel item not including your phone that you will not leave home without. Now. I've got these goofy feelings thinking about that. So I'm glad that that is a memory from the past for you. You said something interesting to me when we were talking before the episode. And you mentioned that you've been doing chat GPT for years now, given that most people and myself included really first started hearing about chat GPT as a concept in late 2022. Perhaps I'm really intrigued by someone who says that they've been doing it for years. Tell me more about you and chat. GBT

Teresa Cain: 24:38

sure and it's specifically not open AI chat GPT but what I mean by that is I actually have worked on a number of text analytics engines and AI models. And so NLP or natural language processing really is a way to decipher large amounts of data and provide an output. And that's something I've worked on At a number of places over the years, you know, especially while I was at Service Management Group, we had built several homegrown text analytics solutions and had some partnerships with others as well. And service management group, if you're not too familiar with, they are a really large CX platform. So in addition to net promoter, they process digital surveys, really in an omni channel, last state state of mind. And so some of those large clients, you know, we were processing billions of pieces of data that were kind of coming in, and we were creating output. And a lot of the output we were creating was action. So when you think of the concept of chat, GPT, in a similar fashion, you are able to input, whatever you want into there, you know, we're talking about pizza and pasta, let's say you, you know, are typing in, you know, tell me more about pasta, and you're able to kind of have this summary of data kind of come out of that. Similarly, that tried to pay, you know, we've looked at a couple of different, you know, predictive models of how can we really predict what's going on in the industry with payments and invoices, and so forth. And so what I find really fun about chat GPT is, while this is a interface available now to the public, a lot of organizations were already utilizing these methods internally, you know, and I haven't even touched on the government, the government has had their own, you know, systems internally that they've used in partner with a couple organizations in the past that I've worked for. And so, really, I think it's great, I think there is a lot of use, that is being made out of chat GPT. But one of the things about chat GPT is it is a model that has both supervised and unsupervised learning, which means that right now it's getting fed a lot of different data, and there is probably someone there manually having to go through and decide whether that data is true or false. So that would be one of the complications that I see about chat TPT is we have to be careful about what we're using from it, what we're claiming that we're using that data for how we're using it, and how we're really claiming it, especially with, you know, some executive orders about to be in play, stadia, whether or not you use AI, for your picture for your writing anything, you know, that's a really big piece of a change, it's kind of come to this big phenomenon of AI. And

Rick Denton: 27:21

the answer that you provided there shows some of that has been working with it. And, and even I have found myself casually using phrase and I think most many folks do, right? It's the Xerox of copiers, we say chat GPT. But then we mean AI, but actually, we don't mean AI, we mean, large language models, or what all this specific things that those of us that are relatively new to this area, are still getting our lexicon wrapped around it. And so to hear you describe that, and then I'm kind of curious, maybe off camera, we'll talk about some of those government things that that you seem to know about, that has us both intrigued and perhaps fearful, but no, actually, that there's a ton that we are gaining out of this, even in the customer experience, space and other things and how we are able to leverage those tools to improve experience. And that's a theme that you said, in there, I heard convert to action. And I'd like to close this out today with everything that we sort of talked about even a design sprint, if you've done it for two hours, but it doesn't manifest an action, if you understand the customer insight from the context center, and it doesn't manifest them to action. Or if you have the user experience, whatever that looks like, if it doesn't manifest to action, well, then it's worthless. Great, you got a nice dashboard you have to do. So how are you taking all those customer insights, whether it's a design sprint, whether it's the contact center, whatever the input is, how are you converting that into action?

Teresa Cain: 28:48

Yeah, so I agree. 100%. So I think if you do not have a plan to execute your design, Sprint, roadmap, anything that you're really working on, it's going to fail. And, you know, I think that's something that a lot of organizations struggle with, and kind of why, you know, the concept for to our designs, brands also came to fruition, you know, considering that one in five businesses, you know, closes every year, you know, in the US alone. And so really how I go about executing, you know, any of those plans, you know, whether that's a two hour Design Sprint or roadmap or different x or putting something into chat GPT I'm getting, you know, how I really go about that is the biggest way is to really delegate and make sure you who has ownership of the action and that's really the biggest failure point that I see with organizations is lack of ownership of who will execute on the items coming out of any meeting, not just meetings, design sprints or roadmap executions, driving and features. And so really good delegation is important, I think, you know, putting a plan of how you will follow through with that and then really putting in stringent deadlines. and follow up is important as well. So that's really the success to making sure you execute that. And another key item is why I wanted to say is making sure that you have stakeholder buy in stakeholder buy in is what really allows you to bring your projects over the finish line for when you execute it and to continue to have that buy in that pays dividends from there on as your champions.

Rick Denton: 30:23

There's a lot woven into there, I hear I heard two big themes. And that is a plan, right, actually intend to do something not just have a pretty scorecard, but a plan and a process and the like, and who's going to do it in the delegation associated with it. And the stakeholders, those two themes heard loud and clear, along with some minor, the minor themes in there as well. And I think that's incredibly valuable. Because if we haven't created tangible business value out of all of this customer work, whichever flavor of customer work we're describing, then what's the point? And creating that tangible business value is so important? Well, Teresa, that it's been a real delight. And I imagine others might want to know a little bit more about you a little bit more about your approach to design, to app to our design, how can folks get in touch to learn more? And where can they get the book, all of those sorts of things, and I'll get that in the show notes. Sure.

Teresa Cain: 31:11

The book is on amazon.com, paperback. There's also an e book special going on right now as well. Also learn more info, go to 2hourdesignsprints.com or follow me on Twitter at@DesignwithTCain or connecting with me on LinkedIn.

Rick Denton: 31:30

Awesome, and all of that is in the show notes scroll down. You don't have to write anything down just click the links, and you will go right there to either get the book or connect with Theresa Theresa, I really did learn a ton today enjoyed it all the way from exploring what even the concept of a two hour design sprint, the idea of weaving into how that converts into action and translating that and also learning that at some point, I want to find a way to come where you are and enjoy some of that homemade pasta because that just sounds absolutely spectacular Theresa, it has been an absolute joy for me to have you on the episode today. I've enjoyed it thoroughly. Theresa, thank you for being on CX passport.

Teresa Cain: 32:09

Thanks for having me, Rick. I've enjoyed it as well.

Rick Denton: 32:16

Thanks for joining us this week on CX Passport. If you liked today’s episode I have 3 quick next steps for you Click subscribe on the CX Passport youtube channel or your favorite podcast app Next leave a comment below the video or a review in your favorite podcast app so others can find and and enjoy CX Passport too Then, head over to cxpassport.com website for show notes and resources that can help you create tangible business results by delivering great customer experience. Until next time, I’m Rick Denton and I believe the best meals are served outside and require a passport.