Mary Shores is a second-generation collection agency owner, a bestselling author, and an international speaker. Her current passion in life is promoting collector training and development through The Collection Advantage online training program, which features Mary’s extensive studies into neuroscience and compassion to teach collectors how to execute high-converting, empathetic scripting.
What you’ll learn about in this episode: There’s a shift in brand awareness and transparency, especially with the pandemic. Learn about how companies can get the right message out there to be on the right side of change.
How changing your mindset will position your company for growth
Learn what differentiates successful debt collection companies from the rest
Learn how to cultivate the right culture, find and hire rockstars
Learn about the psychological burden of debt and how can we move forward to make sure we’re evolving our practices to meet the new normal that revolves around emotions and why we should invest in human capital.
Resources:
Additional Resources:
Mary Shores is a second-generation collection agency owner, a bestselling author, and an international speaker. Her current passion in life is promoting collector training and development through The Collection Advantage online training program, which features Mary’s extensive studies into neuroscience and compassion to teach collectors how to execute high-converting, empathetic scripting.
What you’ll learn about in this episode: There’s a shift in brand awareness and transparency, especially with the pandemic. Learn about how companies can get the right message out there to be on the right side of change.
How changing your mindset will position your company for growth
Learn what differentiates successful debt collection companies from the rest
Learn how to cultivate the right culture, find and hire rockstars
Learn about the psychological burden of debt and how can we move forward to make sure we’re evolving our practices to meet the new normal that revolves around emotions and why we should invest in human capital.
Resources:
Additional Resources:
Lex Patterson 0:03
This is an attempt to collect a debt and any information obtained. information obtained will be used for that purpose. My name is Lex Patterson, you're listening to Fair Debt, my podcast about things misunderstood and overlooked in the debt collection space. Today's guest Mary shores is a multi generational collection agency owner has authored a book conscious communications, and has been helping transform many businesses around better communication. And her concept, that connection is currency. Welcome, Mary.
Mary Shores 0:50
Hi, thank you. And connection is currency is actually connection in general is one of my very favorite things to talk about. So, yeah, it's gonna be a good one, let's, let's get fired up for it. Right.
Lex Patterson 1:02
So I've been reading your book. And it's interesting to dive into communication and understand how communication touches really all facets of our lives, including even the way we talk to ourselves, which is something we can all be more aware of, especially during these times when we're more isolated and the pandemics going on. I know I'm doing a lot of talking to myself lately. But I've sent the book to my two daughters as well. And so the whole family's reading it. And so we're really enjoying that and diving into it. Um, and speaking of the pandemic, there's been this shift in what people expect from companies they do business with, have you seen this shift happening?
Mary Shores 1:44
I feel like it's been leading up to to this sort of moment in time, where things just snapped. So what I mean by that is as we've gone through a revolution of how business was done in the 80s. And oftentimes I'll use this analogy of like playing Monopoly. Because when people like when I was a kid, I loved to play the game of Monopoly. And I, most of the people I meet tell me the same thing. But there was this, you know, everyone had like their own strategies with monopoly, but there's really, truly only one way to win the game of Monopoly. And that is that you have to bankrupt all your friends. And so the thing is, like, to me, that's such a great analogy of how business was done, like in the 80s. And in the 90s. And one time, I even watched a documentary series on the History Channel, called the men who built America. And these guys were eating each other alive. You know, like, they all want it to be the Titans and so they were all fighting for that spot. And so at some point, things have began to calibrate themselves in a different way. And you know, when oftentimes, I'm like talking about how a lot of times, especially in the collection industry, that we came up in a time, or our strategies were built during a time when it was the baby boomer generation, and the baby boomer generation is so much about pride, and responsibility, and doing the right thing. And those are beautiful sentiments. As our paradigm shift has changed, you know, we've we've grown into, or we've evolved into a society that is now the millennial era. And it doesn't matter if you're a millennial or not a millennial, but people are way more likely to make their decisions based on how they feel. And if you kind of think about these concepts, and bring it to like modern day business, okay, so like companies, companies that are doing very well are really focused on that consumer or that customer experience. You know, I think that we're sort of done with broken brand promises, you know, don't say, fly the friendly skies, if every other Twitter tweet is showing that you're, you know, racist, or that you're giving bad service or, you know, whatever you're arguing with a customer over something very trivial. And so we see these things all the time. And I think that it's a great opportunity to understand that the more digital we become, the more important it is to make sure we're very clear on what that customer experiences, what their journey is, and what their expectations are, and that you become that brand that you promise that you are in the collection world. I see this all the time because if I'm at a healthcare conference, I see booth after booth after booth that says we provide kind and compassionate collection services. And I would just really like to see that being backed up with actual policy and procedure and training. methods and investment into collectors to make sure that you can deliver on that brand promise. It's very important. And I think especially if you're working in any kind of health care, you know, it's going to just become empathy is going to just become more important than it even is right now in this present moment,
Lex Patterson 5:21
right? Yeah, yeah, we're at this place in time where we all have the ability to quickly publish content across multiple platforms so easily. And this is why it's so important to get your messaging right along with your why. And true you who and who you truly are. I mean, do I have that right?
Mary Shores 5:40
I completely agree with that. I feel like, you know, we may have talked about this before, but I feel like that, especially sort of in the new normal, like, whatever the new normal is going to be that I consider myself as an agency owner, to have that visionary voice. And what I need to do with that voice is be the megaphone that is going to translate into all of the core areas of what we do in business. So that if a consumer is speaking to one of my account reps, or collectors on the phone, that that conversation is on autopilot from my direction about how I want that that call handled. Because you know, my Why has always been that I really want people to feel good about the fact that they're paying their debt, instead of feeling shame, and unworthiness, for having a debt. Because it's such a huge opportunity for people to understand that there's a lot of fear, that comes with having a debt. There's a lot of shame and anxiety that comes with having a debt, there's a lot of judgment, there's a lot of self judgment, there's a lot of cultural judgment, you know, it's such an important milestone, to be able to have control over your finances and control over your day to day finances. And I think that sometimes, you know, we can really tap into understanding what that consumer experience is like, because when we really understand their day to day, then we can really begin to understand what kind and compassionate collections truly looks like.
Lex Patterson 7:11
Right? Yeah. and transparency is the key, I think, you know, and, you know, I'm sure this can have side effects on many aspects of the business to not only attracting new business, but new talent growth opportunities. And we'll dive into that further here in a minute. But I'm hearing the key takeaway is to make sure you know who you are, who and what you truly are, what you value, and being emotionally intelligent, and then socially responsible enough to basically walk the talk.
Mary Shores 7:42
That's so true. I have something I wrote a few years ago, it's my core four. And the core four is really like the four values that that we live by at our collection agency and at our communication company. And what's interesting is that when you figure out like who you are at your core, and you figure out what those core values are in that core mission, and you start to run all your Intel, your decisions intentionally through that filter. For us, it's through that filter of the core for you know, and that really is the sort of beginning seeds of creating cultural, you know, cultural change, and how you can begin to pivot a company is just pay those little small details.
Lex Patterson 8:27
Yeah, yeah, that's powerful. And maybe we can share some of that in some of the content that we include in our show notes, too. If you've got a core for example, for people, that'd be awesome. Yeah. So you were married, you were on one of my favorite business podcasts on word nation, it's Episode 994. For our listeners who want to check it out. I'll provide a link in the show notes on our website, kindred force calm. And you spoke about a lightbulb moment you had while listening to a podcast and this aha moment was about a business hitting a plateau or a ceiling. And the role mindset plays in going to the next level. Can you tell us more about that?
Mary Shores 9:08
It was such an aha moment. And so what it boils down to is talking about that entrepreneurial ceiling, and this really, you know, whether you're in the collection business or you know, whether you're a vendor in the collection industry, or whatever industry you're in, it's, it's kind of seems to be the same phenomenon, you know, like a small business person will get up to a certain level of revenue or a certain level of profit, and then just kind of stop getting that double digit growth numbers, you know, so instead of like 11% growth or 28% growth, they might start to stay the same. Or even as they start to lose a client here and there, you know, their revenue might begin to dwindle. And so I was I was actually going through this myself, and it had been a couple of years and I just sort of settled in and thought well, maybe this is going to be how it is you know, like unless I make I knew instinctively that I can only run the company to like my own personal level of management capabilities. So I was aware of that as a strength and both a weakness. And what was said on this podcast that was my that made my brain just come alive was that small business owners entrepreneurs get into this rut, because they are running their business with a six figure mindset. So they might be a seven figures they might be at, like 1.5, they might be at 3 million, you know, whatever. They're, they're at seven figures, but they're still using the same habits to control their decisions as they did when they were six figure. And so the trick is, you have to get yourself into an eight figure mindset, you have to start to think and feel what an eight figure, you know, being intentional about those decisions. If I'm an eight figure business owner, what does my day to day look like? What are the decisions I'm making? How are those things differently? So let me just kind of break down what I mean by a six figure mindset. So to me, and like, This all comes from me. So like, I'm this is all real stuff from my own life. Okay. I think some other people might resonate with this, because, you know, I find them a lot like other entrepreneurs. So the first thing was, I'm a bootstrap. Okay, so like, raise your hand out there if you are a bootstrap, agency owner or a bootstrap entrepreneur, because Hello, that's, you know, that's part of that pride and responsibility. You figure out how to do things. Okay. And so bootstrapping, so I bootstrapped everything. The last thing I wanted, when I started my business when I was only 24 years old, was to have debt and then fail at the business. Because I thought, well, if I fail, then I won't have a business, but I'll have all this debt. Right? Well, yeah, you know, but that created a mindset. And that mindset was, I can only invest in my company with my own profits. Also, it also it created this mindset of everybody wears many hats. So the bootstrap entrepreneur tends to hire people with a lot of diverse awareness, meaning that they're doing the data entry, they're putting the payments in, they're resolving client disputes. They're, you know, they're managing the collectors. They're training people there. It's like, there's this one, Susie. And Susie knows how to do everything. Yeah, right. The army of one I call it army. I love it, right? army of one. And I had a wonderful team of Susie's around me, right? Like, my team. They're so amazing. They know everything about the collection industry. They've been with me for years and years and years. But what I didn't have was like focused management level, I didn't have a structure, I had an amazing structure, by the way. So what I want to really give credit to is just take a moment for ACA, they have that wonderful program. I think they call it blueprint now. But when I bought into it, it was a PPMS, professional practical management system. You know, when I was a young lady, starting my agency, and for any of you who are just kind of getting on your feet, having that Management Protocol in, it was really a life changer for me, because it taught me the importance of having structure and work instructions. And that might have set me a little bit apart from the six figure mindset, because that's the thing I did, right. And so I just want to tell you, if you're still hanging in there, if your your sign is still up on your wall, and you're still opening your mail every day, which is why Christmas, by the way, if you're like in the collection industry, you open the mail, it's kind of like Christmas. Oh, yeah, I needed a little silly break for a second.
Okay, but seriously, like back to this, you know, think about how are you bootstrapping your business, you know, how are you holding yourself back, because you're thinking the way that a six figure person thinks. And for me, it's been like, really interesting. So I've hired a CEO. I've started to hire middle management people, I've started to create goals differently. I've started to think in terms of what I call billion dollar Mary. And, you know, Lex is reading the book at conscious communications, but so he knows a little bit of my backstory. But sometimes I say, like, I've got this trailer park marry inside of me, versus this billion dollar Mary. And you know, trailer park, Mary, she's come a long way, right? She's come a long way from that first home she bought they call it tiny houses now, but we didn't call it that back then. But my point is, it's that it's the way you think it's becoming intentional about how you make your choices, and how those choices are going to affect other choices. And I've known some very brilliant, brilliant business people in my life. And I can tell you that there is a quantitative difference between how they think about situations. versus how the bootstrap entrepreneur thinks. Okay,
Lex Patterson 15:03
right. Right. Great. Yeah. And in your book, back to your book, you know, you stayed in there. Are you saying there that it all started with the desire to have the next person you spoke to on the phone be happier at the end of the call than when they started? And that that really changed the way that you did. You do business, and it really changed your life. And I feel it's it's an important story. And I'd like you to share that with the listeners.
Mary Shores 15:29
Sure, yeah. I, it was such an important moment. You know, we go back in sometimes when you're in your life, wherever you're at now, you can kind of like, hit on these moments where there was a moment that after that nothing was ever the same. So it really was around 2005. And I had been kind of sick of the rising real estate bubble, because I knew instinctively that this was not good. In fact, I remember in 1999, when FHA started changing their standards for who could get approved for an FHA loan. And I thought, This is dangerous, okay. And so eventually, that evolved into what became the subprime mortgage. And I was having consumers call me up, remember, I'm wearing every hat. So I was answering the phone in those days. And these consumers would seriously like laugh. And they would say, haha, I didn't have to pay this $500 veterinary bill, but I still got my mortgage. And I was so frustrated, because I realized that these consumers when they were getting these mortgages, the only question they would ask is, how much is this going to cost me per month, and I was trying to educate them on like, you know, look, you're getting your mortgage, but you're paying 12% interest when you could be paying, you know, in those days, 6.3 was an amazing interest rate. Anyway, the point is, I was getting so frustrated with the daily stressful phone calls, that one day, I just looked at the phone, and I said out loud, I just want the next person who calls to be happier at the end of the call than they were at the beginning. And that was the moment when happiness became my new North Star, I had no idea how I was going to get there, I had, in fact, I was actually kind of feeling a bit ridiculous, you know, kind of like when you're in that desperate energy of like throwing your hands up and just saying, like, I give up, you know, I, I give up, and I just kind of surrendered. And then I had no idea what my next move was going to be. But I just decided we were eliminating any negative words from our call flow. So we were not. So here I am, you know, still young, like maybe 30 in my early 30s, telling my entire staff, you can't say no, not, can't won't, however, an or unfortunately, you know, it seemed kind of weird at the time, but like it paid off, because our revenue went up 34%. And then it got me studying the power and the science behind communication. So when I say connection is currency, I just want to tell you, like I've done the neuroscience, I've taken the classes, I have actually studied the neuroscience of compassion. And that is not just a tagline. I mean, it connection is the new currency.
Lex Patterson 18:25
Yeah, and I've seen it actually, since I've been reading your book, you know, is you make the comment in there, I believe that your the statements that you're making, will lead you closer to either connection, or conflict. Right. And, and I can see that, you know, with that word, for instance, unfortunately, when you say that, instantly the barrier starts to come up. Okay. This is unfortunate. Why? You know, whereas if you change that around, you're going to create that connection path that's going to totally changed result, which is what we're all after. So yeah, true. Yeah. So
Mary Shores 19:00
because the brain and body have a visceral reaction to the word, unfortunately, because because we all know that no good news is coming after that word. And so the moment we hear the unfortunately, or even since it because I don't know about you, but I can predict three seconds before someone tells me that word. And you can feel it because what the feeling is, is I'm not going to get my needs met, whatever it is that I need from this person or this company, I'm not going to get that need met. And if we can just switch up the story, switch up the script, flip the script and say, You know what, I completely understand where you're at right now. So many people feel exactly the same way you do, and you are not alone. And I am telling you that those words will do more to affect your business than to say to somebody, no, I'm sorry, we can't do that. Our policy is yada yada, yada. Nobody cares. nobody's listening to you. You're just making their cortisol and adrenaline levels. Increase an increase in increase until they freak out on you.
Lex Patterson 20:04
Yeah. Yeah. And you know, we're talking a lot about mindset, we're talking about growth, changing the mindset changing the communication. And I mean, do you see in the industry, you know, with all the agencies and the companies you're working with, do you see finding and hiring click collectors to be an industry wide challenge?
Mary Shores 20:24
Yes, I think that as of the recording of this episode, and I've had, so I have some rental properties that I'm preparing to be sold right now. And I've had to reach out to a number of different, you know, yard cleanup, people, painters, you know, just different contractors. And they've all said to me, the same thing that the guys who are refinishing the floor are booked out for a year, and they're like, we can't find anyone to work for us, the lawn mower guy, he's like, I can't take any more contracts, because I can't find anyone to work work for me. So I just want to say like in the collection industry, this is not specific to us. companies all over are going through this, okay. And we don't we don't have to go into the politics of why that's happening. But it's here. So what does this do? This gives us something to look at, let's get curious about it and say, don't say we can't hire somebody, okay? Because that's just gonna continue to keep you in the frame of mind that you're not going to find anybody. I did an experiment years ago. And this is actually in the last chapter of my book, where I say, you know, what is my goal? Okay, let's say I want to hire six new collectors. And then I need to say, what are what are six things that need to be true to make that goal, and you know, what, you kind of got to start thinking out of the box. So some of the things that that people might be doing differently are, you know, creating different hiring incentives, you know, really talking about what are the benefits of getting into the collection world. And then, and then putting that information into the job ads. So for example, my assistant, Michelle and I were working on a blog, it's like five reasons to work in the collection industry. Well, let's think about that for a minute, you get a great financial education, my staff who's been with me for many years, I get letters of gratitude for them, I have not only just my staff, but because I am coaching other collection agencies and working with their collectors. And through the collection Advantage program, I get letters from them, because they're like you have opened me, you have opened up my eyes to financial well being in a way that I have not thought of before. So think about this as like, if I am a college student, and I'm thinking, what kind of job do I want, that's gonna set me up for the future? Well, having a great financial background is so helpful, then it's like, how are you going to invest in your people. So for us, at the collection agency, we have a business boot camp. So everyone that gets hired goes through this business boot camp, and in that they get to learn so many different aspects of the business. And what I found, especially for young people, is they don't always know what their total skill set is. So as we're kind of watching them move through the boot camp, we can evaluate what's the best place to put them in. And that has worked out really, really well. Another thing is, people really get into the idea of like, personality testing, I just had an agency owner, reach out to me the other day and asked me about this. And I think those things are great, especially as selling points to get the job. You know, because if you're a young person, and you're, you're looking for work, and this company is going to like put you through this personality test, I'm telling you young people are really, really into this. Let's talk about young people for a second. Because young people are looking for work, that is humanitarian Plus, they do not want to work and humanitarian minus environment. And what I mean by that is that they are only wanting to work for companies that are moving human evolution forward. Okay, so that puts the collection industry in a very interesting pickle.
Lex Patterson 24:14
Well, yeah, yeah. And I've heard too, as I've talked to people too Mary that, you know, they're they're running into like, the the anxiety aspect of this, you know, where, where you got new people coming in the door, there's all these regulations, they're afraid of making a mistake. Maybe talk to that a little bit, you know, the difference in the generational aspects of it.
Mary Shores 24:38
So yeah, I mean, I've had this come up recently, too. And I think I remember one time, years ago, I was even in a different building. And I had this Canadian guy. He started working at my office and he was a collector, and he had been a collector in Canada, and I was putting him through the FDCPA training and when he got done, he resigned because he was was worried about getting $1,000? Fine, because it's kind of like the collectors could be held responsible and personally have a violation. Right? Well, I've actually never heard of this happening. So I realize it's part of the FDCPA. And I think that one of the things that I did when this recently got brought up was just looked at an indemnification policy through, you know, we use Alex Wagner through ACA and just said, Well, you know, can I get some people protected, and that was enough to show like, that was enough to sort of bridge that gap, the anxiety that I'm running into a lot is anxiety about talking to people over a phone type of a situation. So it's like, there's the anxiety of all the rules and regulations and, and how we can take that so far that it paralyzes us, because it sometimes seems like no matter which way you make your policy, you're going to violate something, right? So then you just need to have the protection, business protection layers in process. And no, make sure you're controlling the aspects of what you can troll can control, which is how your agents are speaking to your clients. And so we put a lot of investment in training of new people and, and also through the collection advantage, you know, we're training other collectors and other agencies, because this helps bring back the anxiety of actually talking to people, there's actually a huge fear to ask for money. So if you think about it, how scary it is for someone to take a job when they're going to have to force themselves out of their comfort zone, and ask another human being for money.
Lex Patterson 26:40
And that leads us into the whole psychology of debt. Right, you know, which is fascinating. And you and I had talked about that before. Sure, that concept with us to?
Mary Shores 26:50
Well, if we think about if we think about the psychology behind having a debt, so I've spoken about how you know, it's a lot of shame and unworthiness, okay. And if we break that down, we can look at what the consumer, what the consumer experiences, like, you know, many of them do not have control over their day to day or month to month finances. So you have to think about, okay, what does it feel like to have this debt? And also not have any control over your day to day and month to month finances? Okay, because think about how that is going to make it difficult for them to make a commitment? How can they make a commitment to pay you $200 a month? If they have no control over their weekly and monthly finances? Like, do you see that that creates a disconnect, okay. And so sometimes, like, when we're thinking about how to work this out, we need to teach the skills to get over that kind of hump. And so instinctively, because we're humans, we understand this, and it causes us a little bit of fear of the freakout. Because we don't want to push that person too much, you know, and have them have a reaction about what we're asking for. And yet, we still want to find a way to work it out with them. So the other part of this is like just understanding that weight on the shoulders of the person who owes the money. Now, on the editor side, I think this is something we don't talk about enough. Because if anyone think about it for just a moment, like Lex Has anyone ever owed you money, you know, in like a sizable amount. I don't mean like $20, but like 500 or $1,000? Maybe you lent it to a family member. And there's this moment that comes where you start to sort of sense that they're not going to pay you back. Yeah. And you know, maybe you know that they just lost their job. But we really feel so put upon that, that this debt is not going to be paid off. And then what happens is it creates a rift in the relationship, right? So if connection is currency, then conflict disconnects. It's like the opposite of courtesy. Right? Okay. So that disconnect starts to happen between you and this person, and it grows and grows and grows, and now that person will avoid you, and they won't take your calls. And this once friendship or relationship has now dissolved because of this debt. So what my point is, is that whether you're on the original creditor, creditor side of debt, or whether you're on this other side, that you owe the debt, it is a psychological burden. There is a weight, there is an emotional weight. And sometimes it can be like mental gymnastics, if you are the person who is the original creditor. And so you know, that's a big concept. But as collectors we're sort of in the middle of these two sides, right? And so it's created a lot of mixed messages in our industry. So I feel like we're really at the precipice of breaking through all of that, where we can understand these concepts that I like to talk about. With the compassionate collections framework, and how do we put together a new industry built on compassion, and in a way that is going to increase performance, because the one thing everyone always thinks is that doing it this way, is going to have a cost to performance. And actually, the science shows and the results also now show that the opposite is true, that the more you can actually bring these sort of underbelly emotions and feelings to the surface, that people actually feel better about it and are more motivated to pay.
Lex Patterson 30:41
Yeah, I love that concept. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. So great. So you've worked with a number of companies in the debt collection space, and in this new environment that we found ourselves in over the past year? What do you think differentiates successful companies from the rest?
Mary Shores 31:00
Well, that's a really great question. I think that in the collection industry, what I have seen is a lot of ingenuity. I've seen a lot of companies helping each other out. And I've seen, I loved what happened with like the ACA daily huddles, and so many people such as yourself starting podcast this year, and I feel like and I'm not sure about you, or anyone else, but I feel like this 2020 that was supposed to be the year of vision, you know, and instead turned out to be the year of hindsight, it's like it had this way of turning up the volume on my personal internal issues, you know, and helped bring to light even more of those bootstrapping habits that I had. And in a lot of ways, it's like, it gave me some things to look at, and then make real decisions with my company. So you know, I can't speak to what everyone else did. But I can tell you that early on, we got into the communication mode quickly. So one of our core values is conscious communications, just like the title of my book. So I sent weekly emails to clients, letting them know, like, whatever temporary policies we had put in place, like pausing credit reporting, allowing no questions asked missed payments, you know, we showed them everything we were willing to do to work with people in the situation of the pandemic, you know, in thinking about, like, what can I control as an agency owner, you know, and then the next thing was, how important it was to communicate 100% transparency with my team members, you know, if you go back to that first month or two, like February, March, April, I had staff that were terrified, because they didn't know whether they were going to get laid off fired, put out of business have to go on unemployment, like it was a mess, right? So we got ahead of the game. And we communicated like, we want to make you safe. Like we have three goals. Number one goal, stay in business. Number two goal, nobody loses their job. I don't even remember the third goal, to be honest with you. I think it was like a while ago, and it was a very traumatic situation. But we, we didn't want anyone getting laid off, we wanted to apply for the PPP. And we wanted to pay our people. And that's exactly what we did. And we like, communicated even when my people got sent home, you know, we communicated like your home, you're not working, we're still going to pay you, then you have like the added extra Terrifying moment when you've got big clients contacting you asking you to pause accounts. Right. So we're there was some of that, and I feel like we didn't have that much because we were communicating forward with our clients and that I feel like doing things like that being intentional about how you're moving through the situation really affects your reputation for years to come. You know, I did see some agencies kind of like, well, if the governor had asked them not to call sort of fighting against that, and it's like, you know, what, the debts gonna still be sitting there next weeks, you know, and so making decisions within the parameters of what your government has asked you to do, instead of fighting against those parameters, I feel like is also important. Yeah.
Lex Patterson 34:27
I mean, I see that and the connection area that you're talking about the communication part, I think we're, you're absolutely right. It's the pandemic really has dropped some of those barriers. I feel personally, I've connected to more people than I did ever before, which is so great, you know, and, yeah, it's a little bit different. We're sitting here looking at each other on a zoom meeting, you know, instead of talking face to face or whatever, but the connection is still felt there, you know, so it's really important. I think another part to it is the intro spec. That's happened with with agencies as well and you You had actually sent me a while ago, a blog article that you've done on ways to maybe look at your agency's unique value proposition. And, and, you know, I think that that's a really key part that people can do as well, just to really understand getting back to that, why, and the what? You know, and maybe asking yourself some of those questions. Yeah,
Mary Shores 35:26
I think so I had a, I wrote this blog, it's on my website, Mary shores calm. And I think it's called, like three keys to establish credibility in the new normal. And, as part of that, you know, it's like, waking up to what we will need to do to establish services to keep our current contracts with our clients safe. Because this is a ripe opportunity for other agencies to come, come in, and like, take some of your clients, right? Yeah, because relationships that were there in the past, they may not be as strong, you know, people are number one, they're gonna be looking at their safety and security. So what is your agency doing, especially if you're in the healthcare market to keep their their consumers feeling safe and secure? Okay, so that's the first thing. And then the thing about that I feel like you're tuning into is this part about becoming transparent about your internal strategies? So what do I mean by this? Obviously, my agency is all about communication, and all about compassionate collections. So if that's my spit sticks, so to speak, or that's my spiel, or that's my brand promise that I need to shout that out to the world. Because all of the clients who need that type of soft touch white guy call it the white glove collection service, those caught those companies are going to gravitate towards me, because I am providing what they're looking for. Okay, so maybe you're more of a cutthroat get to the point direct agency, you're going to move right to a lawsuit, that if that's your strategy, no judgment. But be clear about it. Like don't say your one thing, and then be another thing, because I just saw a headline a couple months ago, that said collection agency sued for lack of compassion. Now, of course, that article got my attention. And when I read the details, it was said this, that they're the company's website, claim to provide kind and compassionate collection service. And the phone call that was recorded, did not reflect kindness and compassion. So they were basically sued for a broken brand promise. Wow. So good lawyers out there can make all kinds of arguments for that, right? Yeah. But my point is, like, when you start using your internal strategy as your marketing plan, you're going to magnetize to you the right types of clients that you're looking for. And also, it helps you get ahead of establishing yourself as the known company for that thing. Like I would love it if Mary shores is known for compassionate collections.
Lex Patterson 38:09
Yeah. Awesome. Yeah. So great. Well, Mary, thank you. It's been great. having this conversation with you. Um, I want to end with there's a story in your book about you meeting Chaz at a film festival, and how he turned to you. And he said, it's not a coincidence we met. You're going to help people with what you're doing. I know it. And I want to echo those words. Back to you, Mary. Keep doing what you're doing. It's important work. Oh,
Mary Shores 38:41
thank you so much. Thank you so much, Lex. I'll send you a picture of Chaz and I and for anyone who's wondering it said this is named Chazz Palminteri and the movie that we were watching at the film festival was called a Bronx tale. So if you have not seen a Bronx tale, I highly recommend watching it. And my favorite quote from the movie is, the saddest thing in life is wasted talent.
Lex Patterson 39:07
Awesome. Yeah. Great. Well, thank you again. Look forward to talking with you again soon to you as well. Thank you for joining us on another episode of fair debt. Remember, you can access additional information about this and all episodes on our website at Kindred force.com. Please join us next time for Episode Three. The secret weapon with guest Pat Hutchins.