Coming Out Fighting (with LGBTQ Youth)

Lately, the news has been pretty bleak: losing our reproductive rights, seeing just how close we came to losing our democracy on January 6… there haven’t been a lot of reasons for hope. But this episode we’re changing that, because we're talking to four incredible young LGBTQ activists. As our panel moderator Jess McIntosh says, advocacy is a relay race - and these young people are already running with the baton. And if teenagers can put together marches or speak at school board meetings, how much more could we all be doing?

But before we get to our youth panel, hosts Rachel Vindman, Jasmine Clark, and Amanda Weinstein discuss how they’re feeling about the Roe news a few days later. They chat about how the Republican Party seems to be backpedaling because they’re realizing that overturning Roe is widely unpopular. But they aren’t going to stop trying to take away our rights, from abortion to gay marriage, so we need to keep having these conversations and organizing.

Finally, our hosts raise a glass to their kids, to a little alone time, and to being in the right place at the right time in this week’s “Toast to Joy.”

You can visit go.redwine.blue/roepod to get more information about how to stand up for reproductive rights. There, you can find answers to frequently asked questions and learn more about how to get involved. The court has spoken and we want to know how many suburban women are willing to join us to fight extremism.

For a transcript of this episode, please email theswppod@redwine.blue.

For a transcript of this episode, please email theswppod@redwine.blue.

You can learn more about us at www.redwine.blue or follow us on social media!

Twitter: @TheSWPpod and @RedWineBlueUSA

Instagram: @RedWineBlueUSA

Facebook: @RedWineBlueUSA

YouTube: @RedWineBlueUSA

Transcript

The Suburban Women Problem - Season 2, Episode 27

Amanda Weinstein: Hi everyone. Thanks for joining us. I'm Amanda Weinstein. 

Jasmine Clark: I'm Jasmine Clark. 

Rachel Vindman: I'm Rachel Vindman.

Amanda: And you're listening to The Suburban Women Problem. This week, we have a special round table panel to share with you all. We brought together four LGBTQ young people who are doing amazing work. I don't know about you guys, but I sure wasn't organizing rallies or attending school board meetings when I was 17.  

Jasmine: Yeah, I think when I look at how kids organize now, I'm like… man. I wonder how much different this world would be if I was one of those kids that was like, “I gotta do something now.” Instead I was just kinda like, “oh, this is bad,” or “this is good,” but I didn't really feel empowered. 

Rachel: I've been thinking a lot about that lately actually. Yeah. 

Amanda: So we asked Jess McIntosh to moderate the panel after her great conversation with you a few episodes ago, Rachel. And after her explanation of what being non-binary means to her, we knew she'd be the perfect person to moderate. So most of today's episode is going to be that round table discussion. And I can't wait for you all to hear it. 

But before we get to that, we have to do our weekly check-in. So how are you guys? What's been blowing up our group chat?

Jasmine: Oh man. I just feel like lately you know, the hoods are off. Or on? I don't, I really actually know how to describe it anymore.

Amanda: When that chick was talking about Roe V. Wade as “protecting white life,” I was like, what? 

Jasmine: Not a gaffe.

Amanda: Not a gaffe, not a gaffe. Shut up. 

Jasmine: Yeah. So for context, Representative Mary Miller of Illinois at a rally with her buddy Trump basically thanked the Supreme Court for this historic, and I quote, “victory for white life.”

Rachel: White. Life. 

Jasmine: She was met with cheers and a big old smile from Trump. And she did not, she did not correct herself. It wasn't like, she was like, “oh, I mean life” or, oh, “I meant right for life.” Like, she just kept it going, big old smile, and went through the rest of her speech. And then of course later on, people were like, “oh, she just misspoke.” And I'm like, this is the same chick that like earlier when she first got elected was like, yeah, “Hitler got one thing, right?” Like this woman loves Hitler, she praises white supremacy, and it was not a gaff. Like she said what she said, and she meant what she said. And that's what I mean when I say the hoods are off or on, or I don't even know. There's hoods though. There's definitely hoods. I just don't know what we're doing with them now. 

Amanda: I mean, apparently we're electing them to offices apparently. 

Rachel: Yeah. And I think Senator Cornyn posted something on Twitter and he was equating Dobbs reversing Roe as the same as Brown V Board of Education reversing Plessy. And it's just not the same. 

Jasmine: It's not, it is not the same. 

Rachel: I'm not a constitutional scholar. I know that probably comes as a great shock to many of you, but I am not. But if you were taking the SAT and you know, made that analogy, it would be a false analogy. They are not the same thing. 

Amanda: No. I think when we hear Republicans say, “this is the same as,” I don't know what's gonna come next, but whatever comes next, you can guarantee it's not the same as whatever they're about to say. There's so much about the analogies that are so bad.

But I think it points out that they kind of realize they did a bad thing and they're really trying really hard, grasping any freaking straw, they can to try to justify this. Like they know this is bad, so they're like, “oh, we gotta figure this out.” I think they know that this is not exactly gonna go in their favor. And a poll came out today that has the generic congressional race has D's leading right now, after the January 6th hearings that we've had, after what's happened with Roe V. Wade. Now Dems are ahead. I don't think it's gonna go the way they think. 

And I think we need to be paying more attention to these races, like Casey's race and like your race, Jasmine. And one thing that I love happened was that Julia Louis-Dreyfus tweeted how important our state legislatures are. And she said, “It is time. If you wanna do something, find the pivotal races that we need to keep women's rights in that state. And here's 11 races you need to pay attention to.” And one of them, of course, was Jasmine's race!

Jasmine: Yes, I'm so happy. And you know, the interesting thing about that is like, I hate that it takes celebrities sometimes to get people's attention, but it did get people's attention. 

Rachel: But you need to get attention outside of Georgia. 

Jasmine: Yeah, absolutely. 

Rachel: I mean, the reality is like you, I mean, you need to get people like right now. We need to draw attention to races that no one would ever know about outside of your, out of your state. And that's what we have to do. That's where we need to be, you know, really working hard.

Amanda: And it helps with getting attention inside your district. Right? So that money, that attention, when all of a sudden you're like, whoa, Julia Louis-Dreyfus is tweeting about Jasmine! Hey, that's my state rep! That's pretty awesome. 

Jasmine: Yeah! A few people did comment that, yeah. I'm like, “oh, I know her!”

Rachel: But you know, I, I say this all the time... Everyone has something to give. Everyone. People can give their time. They can give their money. Everyone has a talent, something to give, to save democracy. And dude, it's all hands on deck. Everyone needs to do what they can do. 

I mean, if you wanna use a military analogy of an actual ship, like, from the, the newest enlisted member on that ship to the person in charge, whether it be a Captain or Admiral, everyone has talents and something they can bring to make it function and carry out the mission. And that's where they are. That's what we have to do.

Amanda: But I feel like we need more leadership. Like we have a lot of people, we have a lot of soldiers, right, using your analogy. We have a lot of people ready to fight. But you need leaders, right? The military is based on a command structure for a reason. We need leadership. And one thing that I feel has been lacking for the Dems. One thing that I loved about Julia Louis-Dreyfus and what they did is like, “Here is a strategy. There are 11 pivotal races.” I was like, “Yes! Lead, girl, lead!” 

And I feel like we do need more of this. Like I feel right now, we're like, “Hey, I'm ready to fight, but what the hell do I do?” Cause as far as I can tell, we've lost a Supreme Court for a generation. So do I give up for the next generation and then maybe I'll fight in the next generation? 

Jasmine: Absolutely not. 

Amanda: No, I know, but I feel like we need more of this. Here are the things that we can do. I'm gonna vote. I'm gonna talk to people, but what can we do? So I love that we also have, I know Red Wine and Blue is doing a Troublemaker Training. And that I was like, “Yes, lead girls, lead!” And I feel like we do need more of this, right. Standing on the steps singing a song or giving these like half-assed speeches isn't gonna do it. I need it point by point. What's our, what's our game plan?

Jasmine: What is the plan? Yes!

Rachel: I couldn't agree with you more. So, this is what I think again, not a strategist, just a mom–

Amanda: The best kind of strategist.

Rachel: I think they're gonna get some polling in the next couple of weeks, and they're gonna try to walk back some of these things. Andy Kim had a great thread on Twitter and I was in the car, cuz I'm like Alex's professional driver, it's super fun. And Alex was talking to him and he was saying, yeah, he was on the floor of the House and they started clapping. I mean, he talks about it in this thread. They, they got excited. Then they said, let's keep going. You guys, it's like, they're just like on some game show and they're like grabbing all the stuff they can off the shelves and trying to like, take it outta the store with them or something.

They never thought this was possible. That's why they all said that Roe was settled law, because they never thought anything else would be possible. Now that it's possible now that they see, they just wanna take it all. And yeah, when I say all, a lot of that is taking away women's rights…

Amanda: Same sex marriage, there's a whole bunch they want. 

Jasmine: Yeah, no, this is what all they want. I mean, they're telegraphing this, but I do think they're gonna walk it back cuz they're gonna get the polling and they're gonna see that if they're gonna do this stuff, it's gonna need to be a little bit like, under the radar. Yeah. It took this long for a reason. 

So I've had a little bit of media training. And so I recognize when someone else has had media training or when they've been trained on what to say and what to do and when to pivot. And as they've been doing interviews, I've noticed that when they start talking about abortion, about, “well, what are, what are the next steps? If you start forcing women to have babies they don't want to have, or, you know, people start dying because of these laws, like what are your next steps?” 

And every single time they pivot to, “well, I don't think voters care about that. I think what they really care about is inflation and gas prices.” And that lets me know that their polling has told them you're losing on reproductive rights. So you've gotta pivot to something that we're winning on right now, which is inflation. So if they back you into a corner with a tough question about abortion or access to the right to choose or what you're going to do to save mothers from literal death, just pivot, pivot to something else. Pivot to one of our issues. And so that lets me know they've pulled this and they are losing that battle.

Amanda: So that means we've got to continue to amplify. Don't let them change the subject because that's what they've been trained or told to do, “change the subject every time, cuz this is bad for us,” which means we need to keep talking about it and keep having all of these conversations. 

Rachel: Amen. 

Amanda: Because it works.

Rachel: Amen. I mean, I, I said this in the emergency podcast and I really mean it. Like we have to keep bringing it up. Because they're gonna try to change it. And also other things are gonna be coming up, but we have to keep talking about it and not just on the podcast, we gotta talk about it in real life. And we have to talk about, you know, the importance of keeping this front and center in order to not let people forget. I mean, I don't know what's gonna happen. 

Jasmine: Anything can happen. I mean, four months is a long time. 

Rachel: Yeah. But we have to commit to yeah, it is. And we have to commit to having these conversations and they are hard conversations to have, but you know, I do see women really sharing their stories. And it's so compelling. And we've said it so many times– that's what's gonna change minds, is people sharing their stories because when people share their stories, not only are they relatable, but other people have stories too. And when you share your story, they're thinking about their story. They're thinking about what they went through and where they would be.

And you know, gosh, I'm just gonna say this. I know it's hard. We've got to have grace in this space for people who are willing to come to our side and change their minds because of things that are happening. And I'm, I know it's hard. Believe me. I know it's hard. 

Amanda: That's why I'm really excited about today's panel because it's having those conversations, but it's not just having these conversations… So today about LGBTQ issues, which we know that is next up, number one on their next hit list would be same sex marriages. 

Rachel: A hundred percent. 

Jasmine: I mean, they've been targeting them. Yeah. So it's definitely there. They've been priming us. 

Amanda: Yeah. So we need to have these conversations, and then, then what do we do? Talking about organizing. And so this panel discussion, these are the perfect people to talk to today. 

Rachel: So excited. 

Amanda: Right? So I think sometimes maybe we look for leadership to the President, which, you know, yes, we should be looking to him for leadership, but we sometimes forget, I think, how much our kids can be leaders for this nation. And these kids can teach us a thing or two about rallying the troops. So that round table discussion is coming up after the break.

BREAK

Jess McIntosh: Hi everyone. I'm Jess McIntosh. I use she/they pronouns and I am very excited to be joining The Suburban Women Problem today to moderate a panel about youth activism in the LGBTQ community. I am joined today by four inspiring young people who have been standing up to fight for their rights. And this is the moment when we need that the most. We do a lot of discussion about whether or not movements are sprints or marathons. I like to think of them as relay races. We each have our time with the baton and then that time is done and we have passed the baton. This is a particularly weird time to be carrying the baton… it is also a particularly weird time to be thinking about taking on that baton.

So these are the people who will inherit all of the problems that we have created, and they will be responsible for all of the solutions. And for as long as we still have breath, they are going to need our support. So we're gonna hear directly from them about the work that they're doing this Pride month and about the work that they're doing every month, because it doesn't stop in July. And I am just very, very excited to have their voices added to the national movement as well as to the podcast today. 

So I am joined by Devin Green, a 19 year old very recent grad who studied political science. He is heading to the UNC School of Law in the fall and hopes to continue advocacy work by becoming an attorney specializing in civil and human rights litigation.

Jessica Brady is a 17 year old in Pennsylvania. She works for her school newspaper and started by wanting to write a story about Don't Say Gay, but that turned into a huge advocacy project organizing a We Say Gay rally. And she wants to run for office someday. 

Jayden Rodriguez is a youth activist and a member of the Youth Resource LGBTQ peer leadership program and Advocates for Youth, and he just graduated last week.

And Aimaloghi Eromosele is a community organizer, a speaker, a writer, and a student. She’s a 23 year old with a longer CV than I have. She works for a mental health advocacy, LGBTQ rights, she’s getting PhD in August and is a member of the Young Women of Color leadership council at Advocates for Youth. All four of you, thank you so much for being here. And, and also the work that you do every day.

I wanna start with Aimaloghi. You're the oldest of our panelists. You, you know, you're the veteran here at 23, you've seen it all, you've done it all. Talk about what brought you into activism. Like when did you think, “okay, this isn't like a side hustle, this isn't a hobby. This is gonna be my life.”

Aimaloghi: I guess what brought me to activism work was, I mean, there's a specific incident and that was the murder of Mike Brown by the police back in 2016. It was at that moment, or as I started to kind of watch all of these extra-judicial killings happening out in the world… it wasn’t in my hometown, I'm from Macallen Texas, which is about 30 minutes from the Mexico border. 

I think it was in that moment that I guess my rose-colored lenses kind of got smashed off my face and I had to kind of come to reality and realize that regardless of where I am, I'm going to be perceived a certain kind of way because of who I am. And most obviously that is my blackness. As I started to come into my sexuality, and I guess into understanding what it means to be a person with a uterus, I realized that I stood at the intersections of a lot of different identities. And with those identities I was facing and battling a lot of different systems. I was realizing and coming to all of this knowledge that I couldn't separate my life from politics the way I wish I could. I couldn't separate my life from the movement the way I wish I could. And I didn't, I'm not a very passive person. 

So I felt like if my life is politicized anyway, I might as well be a part of the movement leaders who are actually trying to influence and shift people's consciousness. And understanding that liberation can be reached by all of us if we band together, if we use the right tactics. So I think that's kind of what brought me to the work. There's specific incidences, but overall it's kind of like, “oh, This is my reality. So I'm making the best of it by fighting back.”

Jess: Yeah, I think we're gonna hear– my guess is that other people have similar entry stories. It's one particular issue and then boom, intersectionality hits you and suddenly all of the issues hit you. I wanna go to Devin. Devin, what, what brought you to this work? Was there, was there a moment or was it more of a, more of a slow burn?

Devin: For me, I think I was always built to be an activist. I often say that activism feels… It's who I am. If you don't understand my activism, you don't understand me. And I like to tell the story that when I was like six or seven, I would call our city's non-emergency line to report malfunctioning street lights. And for whatever reason, that was the, that was the issue that I was really passionate about. For whatever reason.

Jess: It matters, traffic safety! 

Devin: Yeah, exactly. And as I got older, I just started, you know, watching the world around me and adding to the list of issues I was passionate about. And I think really what changed the game and I have a, sort of a similar story to Aimaloghi that for me, it was George Floyd that really kind of shifted the way that I thought about my activism and realized that this is a never ending journey for me. And being a trans person, being a black person, being the son of immigrants, you know, has really shaped my activism and made me more aware of the world around me. And it's just made me that much more passionate about stepping into that.

I think honestly the catalyst was actually the show Law & Order SVU! So they were tackling the issue of the backlog of rape kits. And I didn't know that was a real issue. And as I started learning more about the issue, I was like, we have to do something! So I just started emailing my legislators, emailing legislators across the country, trying to make a difference that way. And that sort of was the springboard for all of the activism that came to follow. 

Jess: We could have a whole other panel on how the content of your media matters so very much to how you perceive  the issues around the world. I mean, this is, it sounds silly to credit a, a, a TV show, but I've been working in politics for 20 years. And if The West Wing hadn't been on when I was in high school and college, I have no idea if I would have this career at all. 

Jessica Brady, you are just 17. When I was in high school, I would have done anything to not stand out in any way shape or form. That was the prime directive.  And that's not at all been what you've done. So talk a little bit about that experience and, you know, coming out and coming out as an activist in high school. 

Jessica: Yeah. I mean, it has been quite a journey and it's still a journey, you know, because I am, you know, I just finished up my junior year of high school. So, you know, I'm still a high school student. The way I like to look at my life is like, like I had like three separate journeys. There was my coming out journey, my journey with mental health, and my journey with activism. And I think up until very recently, I don't think it quite clicked in my head these journeys aren't necessarily all separate from each other. They're all just different parts of who I am. 

And, you know, I came out, I was in junior high school. I told my mom at an Olive Garden. When it comes to my coming out journey, my biggest struggle initially was the way the church perceives it. I was raised Greek Orthodox, which is very like, stricter than Catholic, you know, it's probably one of the most traditional, I guess, denominations of Christianity you could have. And that's what I was raised. So coming out meant that, you know, if my church found out, I would essentially be forced to leave. And that is exactly what happened. So that, for me, when I look at my own personal journey, like, I mean, I have lost friends, I've had issues with family members, but the thing that had the most impact on me was definitely my church and just kind of the different, wonderful ways of rejection they decided to throw my way. 

And so really, I didn't start my advocacy journey until, I mean, I'm gonna say until I was like 15, 16, which is still like, young. I live in Monroe County, Pennsylvania, and there was an Asian-American teenager who was shot to death by police on an overpass 10 minutes from my house. So I took it upon myself, I was a sophomore in high school and I organized a march for this kid. Because the police in my town were trying to sweep it under the rug. Like, “oh, it didn't happen.” They tried to frame this kid so he looked like he was a criminal, like he should have been killed, when he was really on this overpass cause he was suicidal. 

And then I know I also spoke about my mental health journey. I am someone who struggles with anxiety and depression, which has sometimes been a barrier for me with my organizing and my advocacy, because, you know, you can get really easily burnt out and it's just, it's, it's rough. And I actually, around the middle of last year, I ended up hospitalized because of it. So for me, that is something that's also super important and I am a big mental health advocate for just better treatment in general, more treatment, more accessible. 

But it ultimately came to a head with the Don't Say Gay bill that was passed in Florida. That for me, like the first place I came out was in school, to my friends, cuz I wasn't sure how safe I'd be at home. I wasn't comfortable yet. You know? So the first place I felt safe enough to be myself was at school. So seeing just the way, you know, so many legislators are trying to strip that away from kids like myself, it, it really pissed me off, I'm gonna be honest. So I decided to organize a march– or actually, no, it wasn't a march. I had a rally in my town and it was a little hard cuz my dad was not behind me. My dad is a Trump supporter.  And it came to the point where I was hysterical, I was like in tears, cuz he just like, could not understand why I was doing this. Couldn't understand why I didn't support the bill. I'm like, “Dad, I'm gay. Like why would I…. What??” Like, it just, it was really rough, but despite it all just kind of tried to keep pushing forward and fighting for what I believe in.

Jess: I'm so sorry for what you had to go through with your church and your dad. And I thank you for taking that energy and turning it into something positive. Jayden, I, I know that you are, you are the newest of the panelists on, on the activism road. You are a recent graduate, congratulations. But talk to me about, about what made you decide that this was gonna be a part of your life going forward?

Jaydon: I just like meeting people like me. And my mom, she's very accepting. My mom is all out, like every Pride month, getting all this Pride stuff for me around the house. She just makes it a lot easier to be myself. And she's always telling me to be the best authentic self that I can be and like, not care about what anyone else has to say. And me personally, I like making other people feel the same way. I feel like everyone should be themselves 110%. Like, no matter what.

Jess: I love that as an impulse also. It doesn't have to come out of adversity. It can come out of recognizing what you have and realizing that that needs to be the norm. And not just the exception for you. I, I wanna ask you to tell the story about your graduation and the gowns, because you told it to me a little bit earlier, and I think everyone should know it. 

Jaydon: At my graduation, we have two trans students at my school, and my school has color-coded gowns for boys and girls. So the two trans students swapped colors to make themselves feel more comfortable to walk. I was walking to go see the girls because the boys were being boring and no one wants to be the boys all day. So, I went with the girls and the one trans student who’s trans male had the blue gown on, but the school was not gonna let them walk until they put their gold gown on, which was for girls. Like they were, they weren't letting anybody walk. And it was like, they were making such a big exception for him because he had on blue and not gold. 

So I blew up on the principal– or whoever, I forget who it was, it was someone in charge– and I was just yelling the entire time. And I was basically explaining like, I'm not gonna walk until you guys let them walk. Cuz if they're not walking, I'm not walking either. Cuz I won't stand for a school that doesn't accept everyone. And they were talking about how some like, “oh it messes up the way our school looks.” And I said “if anything, it makes your school look even better cause you're including everyone, no matter what.” And I said, “I will not be walking until you let our students walk no matter what.”

Jess: That's beautiful. Yep. But let me ask a sort of general question to everybody. And that is how important, I don't wanna assume that all of your schools are supportive. So my question is how, how important is support or would support be based on each of your high school experiences? Just feel free to jump in if you have thoughts.

Devin: For me, I actually like, came out and started socially transitioning in high school. And I was lucky enough to be at an art school and it was very accepting. We called it the gayest school in the district. The teachers were amazing. I actually had a few queer teachers, which was nice. And so just having that environment where I could be myself and where I could go by Devin and use my correct pronouns was pivotal for me. And I think as I've gotten older, I just realized how lucky I was to have that support because so many people don't have that. But yeah, that school support is really pivotal because at the time I didn't have family support. And so being at a high school that was affirming and that was so amazing was sort of my safe place, you know, when I didn't have that family support.

Jessica: So my district with everything that had gone on, you know, throughout 2020, 2021, my school made the decision to implement a diversity equity and inclusion committee on the school board level. And there were a lot of angry parents, angry teachers that were like, “oh, like what about the white kids?” Like, you know, it was like a whole big thing. And they thought their kids were being discriminated against for being white and straight. But it ended up being disbanded only a few months after it was put in place. 

So a group of my friends and I, we went down to this school board meeting and basically called them on their BS. Because their whole, the school board's big claim was, “well, we don't need this committee because there's no discrimination here at our school.” I was like, “are you kidding me? You're–that's a joke, right?” So I kind of led the effort, but there were like four or five of us, we basically just went down. I said, “I'm a lesbian.” You know, my friends were like, “I'm trans, I'm gay. And the amount of crap we see and deal with should be more than enough for you to keep this committee.” But what ended up happening in November a new school board was elected. And pretty shortly after that, the committee was reinstated and is still there today. 

Jess: I love that you've already been to school board meetings. Have other folks on this call also spoken, like, have you also Googled, “when is my school board meeting? I'm gonna go and make some noise.”? Like, is that something that you all do regularly? Is that just like a thing kids do now?

Aimaloghi: When I was in high school, I was definitely like a shit starter. So that was like, maybe not always at the school board meetings, but I stayed in the front office, not necessarily in trouble, but definitely like, mm, arguing. And like, I'm so grateful that there are folks like Devin who have been able to look to school as like a safe space. Ad even Jaydon, being the kind of person to create that kind of safe space in their own school. And you too, Jessica. But I think when I was in high school, like, I didn't really feel encouraged to come out. I went to a really small medical professional high school. And remember at the time my biggest fear was this, like, I don't know, I just didn't want people to judge me or think I had a crush on them when I wasn't even checking for them. You know what I'm saying? 

But like I just felt I had fear and I know that just living in Texas, fear is the way that they basically control us. And it's basically like their primary tactic, like intimidation is their primary tactic of keeping things very silent and hush-hush. Like I, I know friends who work within the Texas school, public school system, and even to like create Gay Student Alliances or things like that, like it's constantly getting disbanded or constantly under a lot of surveillance to the point where teachers get so tired, the students get so tired, that they just kind of give up. 

But I think that having like people in high school like Jessica who are going to school board meetings, like really means a lot because there's a lot of other, probably like quiet queer kids, like I was, who were afraid to come out, who are like looking at like actions like Jessica and Jayden's. I'm super grateful for it. And maybe even if they don't have the language for it, like there's something in there that resonates and makes them, you know, probably more confident to be who they are just by watching you all too. 

Jess: Well, I think that's one of the most important parts of organizing is that there are people who are not even your intended audience who will hear your message and it might have absolutely enormous impact on them in, in ways, in ways that you don't even know.

I wanted to get into this conversation a little bit because when I, cuz I'm sort of like straddling generations here, like I am the oldest of millennials, which means I'm not your generation and I'm not the generation of the people who are passing the Don't Say Gay bills either. So, so one of the things that I hear the most is they don't understand the gender expansive conversation at all. It's just, this is so wildly new to them. We got the L, we got the G, the B came along sometime in the late nineties and I had to do a lot of explaining to a lot of adults when I came out as bisexual, like what that meant. Now we're talking about gender expansive identities. People are non-binary. People use she or they pronouns. There are more trans people in the country who are comfortable being their authentic selves than ever before, which is amazing and needs to be celebrated. So in the interest of helping to educate people for whom this conversation is simply new, can I ask, let me start with Devin… what does gender expansiveness mean to you? Like what, how did, how does that conversation make you able to live the kind of life that everybody ought to be able to live? Like what would you explain to somebody who was like, “this is a phase”? 

Devin: So I think that for a long time, we have subscribed to this gender binary of like “girls wear pink and girls paint their nails and have long hair and boys play with trucks and play outside in the dirt.” And I think we're starting to realize that that doesn't work for a lot of people. And even people who don't identify within the LGBTQ+ community, there was a time when cis girls wearing, you know, pants was a big deal. 

And I think for me, especially like, I like to paint my nails and I identify as male. And that's just one way that I kind of tell the binary that it doesn't have a grip on me. And I know for a lot of my friends and a lot of the members of the LGBTQ+ community, it's just a way to be authentic to who we are. And I think for me, for a long time, I felt a lot of pressure to conform to what I thought it meant to be male. And especially what I thought it meant to be a Black male. That I didn't allow myself to do things that I really enjoyed doing. And once I started allowing myself to be more flexible and to do things like paint my nails and to let my friends do my makeup and to do things that actually felt authentically me, I was a lot happier and I was a lot more authentic to who I am as an individual. And so I really think this is a conversation about authenticity, about allowing people to be who they really are without feeling the need to conform to societal expectations about who they should be. 

Jess: Doesn't sound scary at all when you put it that way. Does anybody else have thoughts?  

Aimaloghi: Understand that you can continue to learn. There are certain things that are changing that… just because it doesn't apply to you, doesn't mean that it's necessarily bad or that it is, you know, a phase. And even if it is a phase, then why can't I live fluidly? Like how often humans are constantly changing and growing? Why wouldn't I feel like I can express myself in one way one day and then do something different the other? And it doesn't make it any less valid. It just means that I'm living in my fluidity. I'm living in my authenticity. 

Jess: Jayden, I wanna go back to you because I, I know we have a lot of parents who are listening and who would really want their kid to say about their homes what you said about yours. So can I ask you a little bit more about parental support? What kinds of conversations did you have growing up? What were the ways that your caregivers made you feel like you were in a safe space at home and you were able to be whoever you wanted to be, whatever that person was that day?

Jaydon: I only grew up in a house with females. It was my mom and my sister for 11 years of my life until my mom got with my stepdad. So I only had women in the house. So we would watch like Mean Girls and Clueless and all these different things. And she, every time there was like a gay character, she wouldn't make it seem like it was something negative or there was nothing negative about being feminine. So I was scared at first to come out. It did take me, like, I wanna say like a few months, but when I did, she had such an open embrace and like, there were a lot of things she didn't understand about the LGBTQ community, but she didn’t make it seem like a bad thing. She always asks questions. Like, she's always curious to know, like, “oh, what does this mean? What is this term? So I don't be disrespectful.” 

Jess: Yeah. I think, I think a lot of times people are scared to talk because they don't want to say the wrong thing and they don't want to offend somebody. There are a lot of older people with very good intentions who might have something to contribute to this kind of conversation that don't ever wade into it cause they're worried they're gonna screw up a pronoun. And it's so much more important to just ask the questions and listen to the responses. So just sort of creating that sort of environment where we can, where we can have conversations and you can, you can say your truth to your mom and she can hear it and then maybe, maybe share a little of hers with you too.

So I wanna make sure that we get a chance to talk about what's next for all of you. Because this is where I wanna give you the opportunity to ask all of us for help. Like, what would be the most important thing that people listening to this could do to help you achieve the goals that you have for the next year? That might be donate to this cause, that might be listen to the young people in your life more. I'm gonna start with Aimaloghi, cause you've probably thought about it cause I know you're going for your doctorate, so you have a really clear idea of what you wanna do with your life. But like what, what does your career look like and how can we help you be as spectacular as we know you can? 

Aimaloghi: Oh, wow. What a great question. I don't think I have all the answers. I think I'm still figuring it out as I'm going along, but honestly, the conversation that we've been having today is a part of the work, giving queer young people a platform to speak their truth and be able to talk about what's important to us and share our stories and being open and willing to learn, being open and willing to be wrong. 

Devin: I guess for me, I will say, so the organization that I currently work for is a local nonprofit that is primarily made up of allies and parents and families of the LGBTQ+ community. And one of the biggest things that I have seen them do is really just showing up whenever our community is under attack. And so that can look a lot of ways. Not everyone is a marcher, not everyone is a protestor. But maybe that means calling your local representative. Maybe that looks like writing an op-ed. Or any number of things. And so I think as I look to the future, so I am heading to law school, I will probably be the youngest one in my class, I'm 19. And I will be in a field where not a lot of people look like me and even less identify like me. And so I think that I really got here by allies just stepping up and showing me that I can do things that other people aren't doing. So I think that is really like the big thing. I think mentorship is really powerful and the power that people who are older than me have had on my life, the influence that they've had has been tremendous. And I really could not have done it without them. So I would just say like, show up, however that looks for you. It doesn't have to be marching. It can be being a mentor to somebody. It can be writing an op-ed or calling your legislator. But just show up.  

Jess: Jessica, what about you? 

Jessica: So I think first and foremost, just let all of the queer people in your life know that you love them. You, you care about them. You're there to support them. An organization I think would be really, really important–and, you know, if you can't donate to, at least promote and support– would be the Trevor project. When it comes to queer mental health, we are seeing, you know, horrendous statistics, especially when it comes to trans and non-binary youth. That's definitely a cause, an organization I support a ton. You know, I donate what I can I'm 17. But I would say just definitely support it. And if there's anybody who you may know in your life that would need that as a resource, make sure they know it's there. 

I think the last thing I'm gonna say too, kind of echoing what Devin said, just contact your legislators, cuz at the end of the day, they're the ones making the decisions that could either be extremely beneficial or detrimental to our community. The voters have a lot of power. So make sure you vote for people that align with what you believe and vote for people that are gonna support everybody you love in your life, including those that you love that are part of the LGBTQ community. 

Jess: Jayden, do you have any, any thoughts on what folks can be doing to support or, or what people your age can be doing if they want to be more involved? Like if the parents listening to this podcast sit down and talk to their kids about what's going on in their lives, is there advice that you would love them to give them? 

Jaydon: Yeah. I'd say for parents to just listen to your kids because their voices are very strong and like, kids leave an impact on other children. So what goes on in the household, it travels to school or whatever area that they're in. Their energy spreads. So, if you have good energy and you're accepting at home, imagine how your kid is gonna go to school and make everyone else feel. Me personally, what I was like starting to work on was getting inclusive sexual education for everyone and not just heterosexual sex. For schools to start teaching all inclusive sex ed.

Jess: It’s such an important issue. We know that students do better– all students, regardless of how they identify, do better in environments where we teach that everybody is deserving of respect. Every student does better. They are less likely to be bullied, they are less likely to be harassed, if you have that comprehensive sexual health education, that includes conversations like the ones we just had. 

I wanna thank you all so much for joining me today. Devin Green, Jessica Brady, Aimaloghi Eromosele, Jaydon Rodriguez. Thank you so much. I can't wait to see where you all go. 

Jessica: Thank you so much. 

Aimaloghi: Thank you. 

Devin: Thank you for having us.

BREAK

Jasmine: Welcome back everyone. So the panel was… inspiring. I think that is the way I feel when I watch young people, you know, teenagers, like hey, I got kids that are like in that age range, you know, but they're just like, “We're not sitting down. And we are not going to just be silent. We are going to use our voices and we're going to speak up and speak out.”

Rachel: And they’re not limited by, you know, what, like if they're anxious, you know, like a 16 year old suffering from anxiety, she's not afraid to get out there and just make it happen. And if she can do it, I can do it. 

And, and I have said repeatedly on this podcast, I am so inspired by young people who are doing so much more than I did at their age. And that's what it's gonna take. And it just makes me wanna do more and more.

Amanda: Same. I think we should not discount these kids. And I think so sometimes, especially Republicans like to point out, “Well, these kids aren't gonna vote.”

And I think one, we don't know. That's true. And if you look at… so we've had Nse Ufot on the podcast to talk about how she's reaching especially to young people in very different ways than we have done voter engagement. And this is where you see big changes in places like Georgia and in Jasmine's district that flipped, because you're seeing more young people voting and these demographic shifts. I think we are also learning how to reach out to young people better than we did in the past. So I am very hopeful about all of that. 

Jasmine: Love it. 

Amanda: Well, I think the young people of America could be anyone's Toast to Joy today, but what else has been bringing us joy this week? Rachel, what's your Toast to Joy? 

Rachel: My Toast to Joy, and I know you guys are all gonna be super jealous, this week... I am home alone. With only the dogs.

Jasmine: I love it. 

Amanda: Oh my gosh. That's so relaxing. 

Rachel: It's pretty amazing. I'm not gonna lie. Like last night I had carrots and hummus for dinner. And as long as I feed the dogs and they don't even, like, I can feed them the same thing every day and no one complains. So it's amazing. And that is my Toast to Joy. 

Amanda: Oh my gosh. Are you binging anything? 

Rachel: I'm watching the Lula Rich documentary. I haven't watched that, like a lot of people told me about it and I have so many other things on my list, I've been keeping a list for forever, but I'm just gonna tell you guys… just full disclosure, I'm a big nerd. And I like to watch Britbox. I have a subscription to Britbox and I watch old episodes of Midsummer Murders. Yes, I am 48 going on 88 and I own that. So that's that. So that's where I am. And now you guys all know that I am not a constitutional law specialist and also that I am an old woman. So there you go. 

Jasmine: Hey, I love it. I love it.

Rachel: Jasmine, what is your Toast to Joy? 

Jasmine: So I had the opportunity to go to Virginia this weekend. It was like a meeting of the minds, but the interesting thing about it is when I got there, there was this huge storm right before we got there. So my flight was delayed. I didn't get there, to the actual place, until 4:00 AM. And when I got there, trees were down. Power was out, there was no water. There was no one at the front desk. So imagine pulling up into a completely dark, no street lights, no nothing place, 4:00 AM, and there's no one there.

Amanda: It's like The Shining!

Jasmine: Yeah. It was very much something out of a scary movie. However, through all of that peril, I ended up getting into my room, you know, going to sleep, waking up the next morning, seeing the devastation that I couldn't even see the night before, cuz it was pitch black dark. And then the Roe decision happens. And it was almost like a whole other storm happened all over again.

But because we persevered through the first storm and gotten through it, we were there to really lean on each other and do what we needed to do to get through the Roe thing. And it started out like mourning and grief and shock, and it went straight into strategizing. And I feel like I couldn't have been anywhere else in the world and it wouldn’t not have been the perfect place to be at the moment that that happened. And so my Toast to Joy is just being in the right place at the right time, even if it seems perilous. Sometimes, you know, you gotta get through some storms to get to the action. And so that's my Toast to Joy. So, so glad I was there. 

Amanda: I love it. Oh, I love hearing that. I love hearing that there's like this, these little strategy meetings, which I know there are plenty of strategy meetings that I'm not a part of! I don't know why, haha. But I love that.

Jasmine: We did have an economist there, so that was nice! I can't remember her name, cuz I'm really bad with names, but she was like an economy policy person. So maybe not an economist, but econ policy. And she was very smart. I was like, “oh, you sound like my friend Amanda!” 

All right, Amanda, what's yours?

Amanda: So speaking of camp, my Toast to Joy today is to my daughter, Nora, who we picked up from camp after two weeks. And I am just so impressed by her.  That to me, she is like this little girl and this little girl was off on her own for two weeks and I am proud of her independence and her confidence. And so her bunkmates actually voted her most likely to be president–

Jasmine/Rachel: Awww!

Amanda: I know! So she was super excited about that. I was like, oh my gosh. So Casey and I were like, “yes, get it girl!” So my Toast to Joy is to Nora, who I adore and I am so glad she's home. And I'm also just so proud of all of these kids. So I'll bring it back to the youth there. 

Jasmine: Love it. 

Amanda: All right. So thanks so much to everyone for joining us today and we'll see you again next week on another episode of The Suburban Women Problem.