10. Body image conversation with Michelle & Amanda

We are thrilled to invite both Michelle Wilding and Amanda Nelson, founders of The Sophrenic Collective to our conversation.
 
Amanda and Jessica attended a two day retreat they hosted, A Heroine's Journey.  This retreat takes a unique approach to conscious spiritual principles and applying it to everyday living.

These women teach from their own deep and vulnerable experiences of personal love and transformation.  Make no mistake, they practice what they preach! 

Most women have struggled with body image at some point in their life. Jessica shares how body positivity is the one area of her life that has held her back in her life's journey.  Amanda expressed how her experience of jumping into their three month program has already began to open her up in ways she didn't expect  in understanding body image.

Do you have a goal? Michelle shares how important it is that we put a goal into the GPS of  our mind so you can get where you want to go.  Michelle specializes in hypnotherapy and NLP. Our brains work like computers and when you understand that you can uninstall and reinstall a new program that better serves you, then it will do something new for you. New programs can create new behaviors.

Are you finding peace in your body? Amanda specializes in leaning into your emotions, and letting them work with you, and the power of not allowing them to dictate your choices. There is so much judgment about emotions and labeling them as good or bad. Let's educate and bring awareness to ourselves because our mind and stories get in the way of our emotional feeling experiences.

One of their greatest teachings is learning that your behaviors create protection around your physical body.  So much is felt and stored in your body; through emotional, mental,  spiritual and physical experiences. Their programs specialize in helping you release these old programs and so much more.  Listen in... this conversation has so many juicy nuggets you're going to love it.

Resource:
The Body Keeps Score by Bessel Van Der Kolk M.D.

Connecting with Michelle and Amanda:
Instagram
@amanda.monroy.nelson
@michelle.wilding

Find them on Facebook
A Heroine's Journey- The Sophrenic Collective 

www.thesophrenicollective.com
Podcast: A Heroine's Journey; For the Driven Woman

Transcript

Unknown: 0:02

This is gonna be fun. Fun. So fun. We're gonna be good. Did you record that other one for your other podcast? Cuz you know, that would be nice. Oh right. Little outtakes, outtakes, probably inappropriate outtakes. But oh my goodness thinks inappropriate with. Everything is sacred and nothing is sacred all at the same time. Yeah. Well, Jessica and I are so excited to welcome both Michelle and Amanda to our podcast today. And we just Can I actually were able to go and attend your workshop. Yeah. It's called a workshop, right? Like the mini retreat kind of thing. Yeah. Yeah. And that was one of those at was the second day that we were both like, we need to have mom talk about body stuff. Well, cuz you and I had said, we need to do a whole podcast on body image. Yeah. Cuz that's one of the things that I've always struggled with. Yeah. So that'd be a whole podcast conversation. And then I think it was the next day. She's like, you need to follow my friend Michelle, and she's always quoting your stuff. Yeah. And then I already knew Amanda, briefly. And then you sent me the retreat information. I was like, of course. And of course, this is showing up. And it's a Yes, let's go. Yeah, one of the most challenging pieces for me, and I wasn't actually planning on sharing this. Um, but I feel like we talked about it when you and I were when you were, she's going to get me the other and the other Amanda squared, but was standing in front of the mirror. And having that conversation, and we'll maybe we'll dive into that here in a little bit. But I'm curious to know how you two decided to knit your business into this because I've, I've known you both for a few years now. And you both have a massive wealth of knowledge and what you both offer and how you help facilitate healing and in many different avenues. But you guys decided to niche your business into the body. I'm curious to know why. Oh, that's a that's a story in and of itself. Man. We struggled in our business. We really did. And if I were to like nutshell, the reason why it's because everything that I do in this life, I experience it through my body. Like the body is the house of my soul. It is I get to experience these thoughts, I get to experience these emotions. And I get to experience like, this is my home. And so when I look at it, the core of like, everything comes back to what's going on inside of here, because this is what's experiencing everything. So yeah, like, I mean, there's a million different avenues that Michelle and I could have gone on with our with what she and I do co like co creatively together in our business. But at the end of the day, like this is home. And if we don't feel good in this, it's really hard to feel good and other place in any romantically you can only go so far. Right? And Parenthood, you can only go so far. Financially, business wise, you can only go so far, because of whatever culture because this is this is like a total culture that I've got going on inside of me. And is a culture that takes me more towards what I want or less. So for me that's like kind of a nutshell reason why I was like, Yeah, this one I think is also to like with the body like pieces of it. It's like, when you're going through healing so much is this so like kind of ethereal, it's kind of like out there. And a lot of times it's like, well is this working? Is this not working. But when it comes down into the physical space, like your body is a physical tangible thing. And so if you are working with energetics, or if it is like a mental thing, it's like it's gonna run through the energy of your body. And most because meaning primarily in our business work with women, like most women are so uncomfortable their body like I literally don't think I've ever talked to anybody truly any woman truly who's ever been like, Oh, yeah, no, this has been a great place. But this is the place that you literally from the time that you were born, your first breath, your last breath, you are here. And most time people are trying to escape it, if it's through food or other types of addictions, or, you know, even sometimes in the healing worlds, like when we go to a session like I can't feel this, I can't do this. It's like we're trying to escape this place that you're never going to get out of. And so if you can't be okay, here, then it is it's it's an effect every single aspect of your life. And specifically as women I do feel like just because of our culture and kind of the way that things are. For sure. I know for me, body positivity has been the one thing that has held me back from stepping into my voice stepping into doing the things speaking and writing books, and all those things. body positivity has been like, that's been my hurdle. Oh, well, for sure. It was I know like, it was interesting too, because I never go happy But well, you just need to love your body just love it. And to me, loving my body met I just do the same. I'm like, No, absolutely not. I'm still not okay with this. And I'm telling my body I love that. I'm saying that I like this. I do not like it. And I think sometimes too, it's like absolutely like learning how to be okay with where you're at and loving it. And also wanting more. I mean, isn't that what we're here to do is like grow and progress and be able to take it not because even nowadays, you see it kind of swings one way or the other right? It's They're like grind, hustle, like, kill like, yeah, workout and do this or it's like, just love it as you are, it's like, be unhealthy, you just do whatever. And that's just you loving yourself. It's like, like a happy little meaning ground is there a place where I can love it and still want to take care of it in the right way. And so like learning how to kind of combat that, but if you think about it, if you can get people to hate the thing that they are in all the time, their vibration, and the way that they feel themselves, literally is in the create more of like a lower vibration, shame, guilt, fear, and that place like, yeah, have you attacked the body in your image, that's the thing you literally can't escape is with you at all the time. So it definitely for us, yeah, back into this, it least for us kinda was the fact that I don't have enough that we've talked about this is the thing where I feel like it takes the two sides together where you're in like this sense of flow and healing and then there's the structure and this is taking it in to alignment and actually making it you can have physical tangible results in the world. So I recently decided to jump into the three month program in a private way what cuz you guys offer like a group three month program? Yeah. And I'm just one that I like things a little bit more. What's the word? VIP status? Maybe VIP? I mean, let's just call it what it is. Nothing wrong with that. And the idea of it really pinged because I, I think every person has had some sort of body image, most if not all their life, right? We're we're just conditioned we're in a society that this is what a perfect body looks like, this is how you should and to what your point is, is there's this interesting pendulum swing between the two. And I've tried on all the things, all the things, all the things, and especially with I don't know, just the last few years of my life I'm tired of not not feeling confident in in my body and in my skin. And when we did this weekend thing I had already been started to think okay, maybe I'm ready because when you guys niched your business into this it's like okay, maybe I want to dive dive into this and it brings up that like, Oh shit, oh shit, oh shit and then the weekend you know, we did that and it was beautiful and there's a lot of really great exercises to move through and really beautiful information that you guys shared. And as I told you, Michelle, my one of my biggest things was I can commit to this for a month but three months I don't know and what I've what I've been noticing and I'm not even two weeks in yet, it is an interesting and I hope I can put words to this accurately. This isn't just about the body and I can feel that and I can feel that one of the things that I love about the two of you is how much you always talk about goals I've always fucking hated goals. I don't know if I want to say the F word ob beat sent to repeat that again. goals I don't really i i've never loved goals because to me it's like setting myself up for disappointment never really been able to like Yep, I got that one then that was never me. Right so the idea of having goals but then you I believe what you and I that we're talking it's like well if you haven't you don't have a goal. Where are you going? Literally it's headed towards your job like you're there I always talk about like Alice in Wonderland thing right where Allison comes up to the Cheshire Cat she's like well what road I take is it or do you want to go to school? I don't care cuz it doesn't matter. Yeah, if you have no direction it's like literally being mad at your GPS system for not taking somewhere you put no destination I'm not where I want to be. Okay with that it's the idea that you to have really been talking about lately of honing of honing this energy and taming Oh, that Timmy word. Trigger. And, and I can feel it. I can feel like there's something about the bodies trying to get stronger and being dedicated, committed to something last night. I think I had my first like, Huh, what's happening here because I'm wanting to numb out. And it was an interesting moment of what needs to be felt instead of just I was tired. I was like, last night was one of those I just wanted to order doordash and I wanted to go climb into bed. And it was like, Huh, why am I wanting to do that? You know, and it was just taking a minute just to feel and there was nothing like really there other than just feeling some feelings that were coming up. And, and just some I don't know, uncomfortableness is, you know, when we shift through, and you guys especially know this because you guys, this is a lived experience for the two of you. Oh, yes. So it's not just like you You teach everybody that you're teaching this and you and we're living it at the same time? Yeah, right. And that's the thing. It's like, there's times that I will look at Michelle and I'll be like, Oh my gosh, I really hate when I have to practice what I preach. or text like hey, so you know that day we get to practice what I preach. ethic. Why do we teach this stuff oh, We know it works. But it is it's not it's not easy. Well, and you know, it is if we go back far enough in, you know, my journey and also on Michelle's, this is also a contributor as to why we chose niching into this place is because both of us have gotten to have the life experience of eating disorder. So Michelle had her flavor, and I had my flavor. So, anorexia was, you know, and of course, when we look at any of those types of disordered eating, I'm using air quotes here. It's normally linked back to a moment when you really didn't feel safe in your body, and you felt totally and completely out of control. And what both Michelle and I found is that disordered eating would flare as a great compelling distraction to avoid from having to actually lean into the healing that was asking to be felt. And I think that is such an important thing to talk about is the fact that like, because when people go through our program, what is it like, six weeks and like, this isn't a body program? I'm like, yeah, so remember how we, like we got to try to let you know is that I know you said the words, but I didn't get it. I'm like, I know. And you wouldn't have gotten it because we had like, one cute girl Gabby, because she's like talking about it. So username. And she's just like, Yeah, I just thought I was gonna come in, and like, you know, kind of master the body and like, lose some weight. This was not the body, this was so much more than that was like, yeah, cuz what happens is, the body is a really, really compelling distraction. And what usually happens because I have been the last name, I've been training for fitness competition. And during this time, I had six months of dark night of the soul. And it was the most intense one I had ever been through where I got to process some things. Because I gotten to the point where I no longer was going to use my body as a distraction. Because I did, I hadn't even sorted for 20 years, 20 plus years, mine was more bilinear. I didn't know how to deal with what I was feeling. And so I would like try to stuff it down with food. And then I tried to release it, like throwing it up. And that was the way that I wouldn't be able to, like try to handle my emotional state. Well, also, when I handle the body thing, it was kind of like, oh, we're ready to deal with this stuff. I went into hacking to look at deep, dark, painful, painful things about myself, but I no longer had the body to distract. I had to wake up, I had to keep exercising, and I had to eat what I was supposed to eat. Well, I chose to. And because I no longer had the distraction. My body was like, Oh, hey, because one thing, any behavior you have, just the way that your brain set up, it thinks that it's saving you from something is keeping you safe. Well, my eating disorder was keeping me safe from hacking to go in and look at some of these deep things of not feeling worthy, not being chosen, not being enough. And a lot of these catchphrase things, but when you really go down and fill it, it is like this deep, dark, painful thing. Like I remember as I was purging some of this, like feelings and emotion out I was at 1230 at night, I am laying on the bathroom floor, like faces against the ground. And I love God. So talking about about like, you got to stop this right now. I can't do this, I'm going to die. Like we have to stop it was like No, no, and being able to let this trauma and feelings move out of my body. Like, my I didn't know how to handle this emotion before. So as much as I wanted to say my eating disorder was like, Oh, that's so horrible. And I was doing it, it was showing up to save me because I had no clue how to deal with some of these deep beliefs I had about myself, it was actually one of the most compassionate ways to deal with the belief. And I know that that's probably like, a little taboo to say the eating disorder was actually the most compassionate way that I could, you know, mine came down to a safety piece, a lovable piece. And I when when, you know, anorexia brain would kick in. It was normally at a time where the intense emotions were so big, and I didn't have any control out of what was going on outside of me, or inside of me. And so I but what I could control was what I put in my body, or what I chose not to put in my body. And I was one of those people that would swing to the side of being a stress non eater right. We got stressed eaters, we got stressed 19 years and I would stress theater, and I would swing to the stress non eater because it gave me a subconscious sense of control. And that version of control allowed me to feel safe enough to navigate the, the literal show that was playing out in my life. Yep. And so and also on the inside, right, the the internal intensity as well as the external intensity. So it's like when it showed up in that way where Oh, like, I almost got to be mad at myself. Because before I mean, it was like literally might use or it was like the biggest thing ever. Like it kept me from dating certain guys going through my dreams, my job like it was like, the biggest thing that I felt like I could never handle. But when I went back and looked at it, and I realized what was happening, oh my gosh, like that was actually that was just my body trying to save me. And it was a super compassionate thing. And I'm grateful that it no longer has to be that way. But I also had to learn how to deal with my thoughts. I had to learn how to deal with my emotions, because I have people coming to me all the time. Because they'll see that like, I've had like a massive physical change, right? Like, oh my gosh, what are you doing? Well, they're asking like, what's the meal plan? What macros are you on? What's your workout? And I'm like, pick on, like, What are you talking about? Like, I've tried to do this plan, like this kind of magic. I've literally tried to do this plan. 15 years ago, I tried to do it. 10 years ago, I just couldn't do it. I'm like, it's the mental and emotional shit. And they're like, No, no, no, no, I'm like, No, I'm serious. Your body right now, if you're wanting to lose weight is putting on weight as a protection. Your behaviors are a protection. And if you don't have a mental emotional plan to deal with what's going to come up, and you start doing it, your likelihood of success is less than 8%. Like it just is, because so much is stored in your body when you start to move and to change your body that stuff. It's another reason why we Hitchin, we don't have to go searching for anything. You they start changing their diet, they start being consistent, that goes right to the surface. Like we don't have to go search for nothing. It's like right there in the surface, but it's gonna come up. And what happens is, most people go back to Oh, let's step it back down. I can't deal with this. This isn't too intense. I can't feel it. I have no clue what to do. My mind's freaking out. It's too intense. Let's step back now. And then they'll gain weight and go back to their old way. And then they'll just tell a story of Oh, see, I'm just not motivated. I'm just lazy. This is too hard. This feels more loving. This is the more loving thing to do. And it's like, Is there a time where you get to sit in the bathroom and take a break? Absolutely. A lot of times self care looks like no, you get up and go work out or you eat the broccoli. That was one of the things I love when one of the ladies who just came through our program, she finished she actually worked with us years ago. When because we've had a journey to get to this point, because we were at one point where I was like, Yes, follow your bliss. Yes. Like, God, your honor yourself. And she was with us years ago. And we were kind of more in that base. And she's like, this is weird. You know what? Back in the old group, it was like, No, if something didn't feel right, you need to do something to make yourself feel better. And when I don't feel good, you tell me to eat my broccoli and sit in it. I'm like, Yeah, like how's your life? Like, it's amazing, it's pretty peaceful. Well, that's, that's what I was gonna ask you with, with this discipline that you start doing through the body and showing up for yourself in those ways and being brave enough to then sit in it and eat your broccoli, like you just said, How is that now rippling out into your, into your business, into your personal life into your romantic relationships. I'm still working on my romantic relationship status, but I can't talk about that. So So for me, I actually made a really, I made a, I made the commitment back in November of 2020. It was the week before Thanksgiving, and I was like, Okay, I'm ready to lean into this part. I really am like I've, I've worked a lot of the mental, the emotional and the spiritual and the energetic and I feel like it's all coming full circle right now in with my physical, I just had this inspired moment where it's like, this is your next step. And in just that time frame, like the I really value piece pieces, one of like, the things that I just doesn't matter what a piece in business, you know, peace in my bank account. Peace in my relationships, like I really that is one of my core values is peace. And my you know, my husband will even speak to this. When we feel safe in our relationship. It feels peaceful, it feels super easy. I I'm not using like when this emotion comes up, I'm not bringing it up and like making an excuse to pick a fight with him. Right? Because let's be honest, the self loving that we've got inside of us, we normally will project onto our partners. And so by me going in and handling this stuff, my relation, and my relationship with Jeff has been I mean, he's he's very committed to doing his work as well. So but we have noticed a palpable difference. Just in these last, what, nine months, I don't know, what the timeline has been. Business wise, also peaceful. But I will say that that comes because part of my process of getting, you know, healing the relationship with my body, I'm using air quotes again, it was coming into a place of peace and safety within myself. That was like the core of what was being asked for. Yes, in addition to being like feeling loved and valued, but I will say even under the loved and valued was being safe and peaceful. And really, when you handle it on the inside it like you can't not have it ripped out onto the outside. It's just what it is. I find it fascinating when I asked someone they don't know what to do and they're they have this contemplation in their mind and you say, what brings you peace? Vega blink, what is p What is that? I love that you share that because I find that as a profound question to lean into what brings you peace? Well sure as hell not what I'm doing was really, but just asking yourself that question is a really great way to like reground regroup, step back. Right when it's definitely very different cuz it's like, well, what do I want? Well, what do they want what they don't want. Exactly. Which is step one. Add to sometimes the quote you want, though, could be coming through a wounding, right? Well, I want to not go crazy and what's going to not go crazy is going back to toxic behavior is uncomfortable with it right? And so when you go to what's peaceful sometimes you get to do the uncomfortable thing right now. I know for me when I felt to go into this, like, the whole reason I even like step into the body thing. I was like, I actually got to a point with my body, I was actually really happy with it. Like, I didn't really want to change it. And after 20 years of hating my body, I was like, This is awesome. And I remember, I was like, God, cool. Like, I'm really ready to expand more into business like so what I do is they get really serious about your body. I was like, Hello, I don't think you're the question. Like I said, business. We're good here. Like, do you see how far we've come? And I'm happy like, I might change that. Not too crazy. He's like, Yeah, no, I heard you get really, really serious about your business outside. Okay, not to this phase of the journey where I'm like, I get really serious about your body. What did they say? You said business? Oh, yeah. No, I wanted to get Oh, yeah. Can you want to know? Yeah, God said, Hey, buddy. Thanks, girl. Yeah, so he said, really, really special about the body. And I was just like, Okay, I'm gonna listen, this makes no sense to me. Like, I'm not even asking about this. I have no clue how it's correlating. And so I did. I got really serious about it a time my cousin was training for fitness competition. I was like, Oh, well, let me get a trainer, because I've been a personal trainer back in the day. So I know just enough to make something. Well, I know a lot more now. But back then 910 months ago, I was like, I know enough to make a plan. But if it doesn't work, I'll question it. And I knew for myself if I were going to question the plan, I wouldn't do it. So I just needed somebody to tell me what to do. I was gonna show up and do it. Like I had to take the guesswork out. Because I knew enough to be able to do it. But not for myself. I'd freak out. So she was trading for fitness competition. I was like, Oh, cool. I'll just use her trainer just as the trainer but like, yeah. competition we did back in the day, but I was like a punishment thing, right? So I was like, I'm gonna punish myself to get on there. So I reached out to them, she connects us. And I messaged him, and I was like, hey, yeah, so I like really like, I'm interested in training. He's like, well, what's your goal? You guys literally making your site? I want to do a fitness competition said, I was like, What just happened? Like, what is this? But I'm grateful I did. Because there's a level of commitment that I had to have. I don't know if I would have had if it was just to do. And I was like, Okay, so we're doing this. What I've noticed, this is the thing that I realized I had terrible follow through. And I was the biggest liar to myself, I would say something and I would not keep my word. And if there's one thing that's gonna create the biggest sense of unsafety, like, how do you feel if people doesn't keep your word? You can't trust him. You don't know what you count on. But most of the time, most people don't keep their words to themselves. Oh, I'm going to do this. And they don't. Oh, I'm going to do this. I doubt. And so then they wonder why why do I have anxiety all the time? Why do I never feel comfortable? And again, what happens on the inside ripples out to the outside? Well, no one's showing up for me, girl, this showed up for you or you show up for yourself. Or you expect you're literally expecting someone else to do something for you, that you won't even do for yourself. You guys. These were really big, like hard truths. I had to look at my can it just be like, No, no, it's easier. It's easier, doesn't feel better. And so as I had to show up, I had to I had to learn to now is it I'm really careful what I say, Why? Cuz I know I'm going to do it. Like I joke a little on my room was super messy for like two months. I'm like, Yeah, no, I'm not ready to do it. Yeah, like, well, what are you talking about? You know, you should do it like, Yeah, but when I say I'm gonna do it, it's gonna stay clean. I'm not really committed to that. But you get really careful. And all of a sudden, when you know that you're going to do what you say. But also, you're going to do your say, regardless of how you feel, because that was the other thing I used to do. I don't really, no, no, no, I know, my body hurts. So I'm not going to go to the gym. And this there are you should rest. I'm not saying push yourself too hard. Or how often do you hear that? Well, I don't want to eat that. So you like it? So when did your feelings start dictating your goal? Right? Like, hey, there's ways to show up. And so I learned how to handle the crazy emotions I had running through me, my highly emotional person. Well, I got his claim it but before I used to let my my emotions got to dictate if I got my goal or not, if I were able to have results, and let's like go a little bit further on the backside of that part of you know, there is a level of like, okay, yeah, doing what I say I'm gonna do and like push, push, push, like there's, you see a lot of that in the world. But a lot of times people are actually pushing through and saying yes to things that actually were not a yes. And so part of this is also getting really clear on what like what is the actual authentic yeses? And what are the authentic knows and you're holding yourself to the authentic yeses? And that's the part that like Michelle is speaking to like, Hey, I know that this is what I call like a soul. Yes, my soul is saying yes to this. And I know that it is going to send me anytime. Just disclaimer. Anytime you say yes to a soul aligned thing. It's going to get you out of your comfort zone. It's going to be super uncomfortable. You're going to get to look at some things. You're going to have these limiting beliefs that are going to pop up guys. It's not going to be fun, going for something new is fun, and not fun. all at the same time, but when you are very clear on what your yeses are, and very clear on what your noes are, and you say yes to the soulful thing, and you are committed to showing up regardless of how you feel. That's where the magic starts to happen. If you're saying yes, and forcing yourself to follow through on things that are not an actual aligned, yes, that's where burnout, that's where adrenal fatigue and failure happens. That's where autoimmune disease kicks in. That's where you're kind of the breakdown. That's where the breakdown of the body starts to happen. So you've got it on, like both aspects. What are you pushing through on? are you pushing through on the things that take you that are in alignment or that are out of alignment? Because that's one of your coping mechanisms to people, please? Well, that's one of the things I had to realize for me, though, is like I, what were yeses and noes I didn't know before, because I stopped when it got hard. Now that I'm going to follow through, when it's not a soul, yes, I still follow through because I keep my work. And now I'm like, I'm not doing that again. But I the competence now. It's like, I so much with the body, like Amanda said, Everything happens in your body. Now that I can deal with my emotions. I know, it doesn't mean anything. I know how my brain works. And so I can rewire it to work for me instead of against me. I now feel like any goal I can get Why? Because I'm okay. If it takes time. I know I'm going to show up when it's hard, because it's going to be hard. There's things that are gonna have to move. And it gets to the point like oh my gosh, like, all of a sudden, I'm like, life really wasn't meant to be easy. I was just getting in my own way. And I had behaviors and habits that needed to change. But once those change, like, if I can change my inside and my outsides change, well, I have control over that. That's not now like oh my gosh, I'm not addicted to life. What's gonna happen? I'm like, cool. If my outside world is just reflecting back what's going on the inside, I can go do something. And yeah, is it uncomfortable? Absolutely. But to me, that's such a safer way of living. And being a point of like, I don't know, if God likes me today, maybe he's gonna torture me today. I don't know, maybe that person is like, yeah, it's like, it's so arbitrary. And like, you know, me, I have a very like, logical mind. And things need to make sense. And I was always a little kid that wanted to know why. And now I'm like, oh, if this is how things work, this is how energy works. This is how things get reflected back, I can do something about that. But if I didn't know how to read things, and I didn't know what was going on with my body, so everything felt so confusing. So for me going through this, it cleared out all of the muck. And it also got me really, really clear how I worked. How do my emotions work? How does my mind work, and then in turn, because I learned how to figure myself out, I could figure out how the world works. And so for me, I like open to like, literally opened everything business is taking off, I got to handle a lot of stuff with me around romantic relationships. And that's gonna be awesome. Like, unfold, but it's like, but you guys, I guess I want to say if you're looking at the body stuff, this has been the hardest thing I've ever done in my life. Literally, it has, I have had to look at things. Like when I say that I was on the bathroom floor at 1230 at night with my face on the towel crying, like literally like begging for to stop. It was hard. And so if you're going through it, and it feels hard, cuz I don't know if it was designed to be that way, but like clearing some of the deep, deep painful stuff out. It's painful, but it's way easier than living a life that you're going to regret and having 20 years cuz I had 20 years of prolonged pain, right? I just decided, oh, we're gonna go into six months of just getting hit. And it was intense. But my whole life is so much better now because I was willing to go through it. Well, I would like you, Michelle, to talk more about the NLP and the hypnotherapy the mental stuff was kind of your specialty. And then you kind of have Amanda your specialty with the emotional. So I think it would be great if you both kind of shared. Yeah, that part of your why like Michelle and I team up so well, right, because she's got she has got a gift with working with the mind. And you guys I am a friggin feeler. Like, I love emotions, I both love them and hate them. But learning how to like navigate and work with them. That is a liberating piece as well. So and that's why we team up so well is because she's got a niche there and I've got an itch over here and and you need both and you need both because your body is experiencing both of them. So I'm the NLP and hypnosis The thing that I love about it and kind of just explain how the brain works. Like I talked about it because I was like a little kid and Sunday school like faith can move mountains like how how exactly did that go? They're like, yeah, we're not gonna talk about like, no, is it the actual mountain does this happen? Or watch out? Like there'd be women? And I'm like, I missed that women have a husband that's nice to her. But that one has been that's mean like, what's the difference? Like, how did this work out? So my brain was always wanting to be like, why does this work? why this has worked. So that's why I really dove into the mindset. So with NLP is neuro linguistic programming. Your mind science is proven is literally designed just like a computer. It's actually more powerful than the biggest supercomputer there is. But let me ask you a question. How often are you wondering what programs are running? Have you updated the software? are you removing viruses? Are you kind of just letting things happen? Most people are just like, what? Like, oh, yeah, new concept, right? But we know that our brains work like computers. Well the cool thing about it is when you I understand that you can uninstall and reinstall new programming just as quickly as it can happen on a computer. And I also like looking at it that way, because then people can start to hear it that way. It's no longer like, oh, mental health, right? Because like, if you have a computer that has a virus on it, or you have a computer program that doesn't work, and you go to your friend and like, yeah, fundamentally, my computer just sucks, like, What are you talking about, like Lisp programmers aren't? Well, okay? It's no, no, no, like, No, I'm not a computer is not weak. It just sucks. You know, I'm saying like, all these things that we say about people, it's exactly the same way. So your brain has like three different things that it runs off of one, it wants to keep you safe. It wants to keep you safe, too. It's trying to give you what it thinks that you want. And then three, it's trying to give you what it thinks that you want. And it's also trying to move away from pain towards pleasure. And the last one is it will make whatever program or belief you have, it will make it come true. And so programs, how do you get them right? Most of your programming is happens between the ages of zero to eight tonight. So that means most people are running off very childlike programs, right? Like, it's kind of like we have these adults that are looking at life, like they're still believing in Santa Claus. No, it doesn't work that way. Because you'll see it, there's some people out there that make money. It's like breathing, right? Everything they touch the Midas touch to scope, and there's other people no matter what they touch, even if they touch the same thing, the other person touch, cannot for their life, do it. They just have different programs that are running. So you have your conscious mind and your subconscious mind. Your subconscious mind is the one that runs all the programs and it's 90% of all the function that happens. And if you don't go in and look at the programming it when you're not thinking about it, you're literally gonna have to fight against it if you want something different. Because most the time when people figure out what their beliefs are, they're conscious that well, I don't believe that like, Yeah, but subconsciously you do. And it's very much a child like programming. It's running the show. But once I understood that, the reason why I love it so much is one, okay, I can change this, to it makes sense why I'm behaving this way, even though I don't like it. But then you can start to work it back. That's how I was able to work back what was going on with my eating disorder. Because I will have people that I used to think that No, I just want to sabotage myself. Yeah, no, that's not how it works. Yeah, no, like, really, your brain just hates you. Like what happened? Like your brain just is just trying to make sure that your life is going crazy, like Does that even make any sense? But when I got that my brain was trying to keep me safe. Then you start asking, Well, why? What's it trying to keep me safe from? Hmm, well, if this behavior showing up in a way, where it's trying to give me something, or trying to keep me safe, I can work with that. Because all of a sudden, I can start working it back. And that's what I realized is, oh, I had deep beliefs of being unworthy beliefs of not being wanted, not being chosen, not being enough. And those were so painful to me that I needed a distraction. And so my brain came up with one, you know, and yeah, I did have some experiences, like, yeah, I grew up in a culture where it was very much looked on. My mom, I used to ride horses. And we had a group of people that we rode with when I was eight years old. And they kind of went away for a few years. And they came back on this club, because I was five, nine at 12. Like, I was a tall girl, right? And so when they came back, my mom was like, Oh, you know, Mary, you know, so and so. And I remember that was her name that says you've gotten really big, you guys, I grew like eight inches. But in my mind, what did I hear the culture that Oh, my gosh, I was going to close. So that's when my dieting started. So because I had some of these deep feelings of disbelief that I had an experience, which compounded on top of it, like, oh, cool, we're gonna focus on this. And so she doesn't have to feel this. And so that's why and so with hypnosis that just helps you get down into, it's just a really, really meditative state and helps you get down to access those programs. So you can get down into that state to be able to rewire them to change them. But once your mind understands why it where it started, and why it started, and what it wants to believe, instead, it will let go and it will do something new. Because then you're also using like your ego. Because a lot of times people say I need to get rid of my ego mind. Oh my gosh, it was like, such a good helper, like protector. And yeah, it thinks it's like, the sheers. Right. But when I'm like, Hey, isn't this smarter? Oh, yeah, yeah, we're gonna do this new thing, cuz that's way smarter, and then all of a sudden, the new behaviors really easy. And so that's why I really love working with the mind. Because as the emotions come through, the body will come up. And then they're going to hit something in your mind, and you start having thoughts about it. And that's where all of a sudden we create suffering. Because you guys pain is a part of life. Like, it's literally something people are gonna feel pain. But the suffering happens as to what you make the pain. And most of the time, when you start to feel pain, your mind starts to go, it starts freaking out, right? Oh, because one of the prime directors of the brain is trying to move you away from pain. So it's like, oh, my gosh, we have to not feel pain, we have to not feel pain, because this is my job. This is my job. So then it's like, oh, because this is going to happen. And it will take painful experiences in the past, it will throw them into your present. And then you'll imagine that this is going to happen. And most of the time what happens in your brain is a million times worse than any other experience. And so that's kind of like when you understand how the brain works, then you can also do something different. And when you change the programming, your behavior naturally changes and becomes easy. So that's it. Thank you. Yeah, lots of people ask, what is hypnotherapy? What does it What does it look like? And okay, so thank you for Yeah, hypnotherapy said people are thinking like, Oh my gosh, am I gonna go in and do weird things that make you guys if therapists could mind control, we'd be billionaires, we run the world. Like, literally, I promise you, this is not what would happen here. It's literally like when it comes in, you're fully conscious. It's just a deep meditative state where your body's in the state of just being super super relaxed so you can access those secrets. Well, my daughter, Courtney, she had suffered through some, you know, suicide ideation and attempt and NLP and hypnotherapy is the thing. She did a lot of talk therapy, she did some EMDR therapy, but the hypnotherapy in the end of the NLP was what shifted her. I love. So for me, in my experience, like is, I am a fan. Yeah, it's been my honor. What do you do? And I know Amanda's training to do NLP, I think it's such a beautiful, Michelle's the person I go to when I need to break my brain, and she pisses me off every time. Yeah, why did you ask that question? So on the emotional aspect of it, most of us one, we're never taught what our emotions are. We're never taught what to do with them. And we walk through life, letting them run the show, right, based on we talked about this, like, based off of how we feel is what we we make our choices whether or not we're going to do something. And the other thing too, is that just because of social conditioning, there's a lot of judgment that's placed on the different emotions, right? How many of you guys grew up? experiencing anger not being okay? How many of you, so we have five core emotions, right? Every every other emotion is kind of just a derivative of these five. So there's, there's anger, there's sadness, there's fear, there's sexual, and there's joy. You guys, if you are in a human body, you're going to feel these things. And how cute that we in society are going around judging all of these emotions, and making them mean whether you're good or bad. Right? When I really it's literally it's emotions happening is literally the equivalent of you breathing. It's what it is. and emotions A lot of people think are felt in like the mind, because they trigger the thoughts, like Michelle was talking about your emotions are actually felt in the physical body. They're felt they're felt there, and they're stored there. And for those of us that never were taught how to process them, be with them, understand them, we spent most of our life shoving them down so that we personally would be socially acceptable, and we'd be welcome in our family, we'd be welcome in society, and we would conform so that we could belong. And there comes normally a point in people's life, especially right now on the planet where I'm seeing it happen like late 20s 30s 40s, I'll be honest, even like, I'm like cheering my mom, because my mom is, you know, she's lean into this stuff, too. So I don't want to just say it's like a certain, but there comes a point where it's like, I can't keep living feeling this way. Like this, I can't keep doing this. And for people that have enough self awareness, they can shift into like the healing or getting help. And if we look at it on like the lowest, I say, last, like the densest, heaviest, most traumatic aspect of it, people are taking themselves out because of how they feel. People are taking themselves off the planet, because of the emotions that are running through their body and what they are making that mean about who they are and what their life gets to be. So that's why I'm kind of like, yeah, emotions, like, let's, let's educate people, let's bring some awareness around these things. And let's learn how to actually work with them. So that they're going to be intense emotions are going to be intense. And they also don't have to be hard. They also don't have to be, you know, create suffering, like Michelle was talking about, we can just our body naturally knows how to process these things, but our mind and our stories about what we make these emotions mean get in the way and it kind of just like stuffs it all back in. And we're recycling it most people are just recycling the same emotions. And so being able to one identify, okay, cool. Like I'm, I'm not my body, I'm not my physical body. I'm also not the thoughts that are going on in my head. I'm also not these emotions that are pinging, like, emotions are nothing more than energy in motion. And your body's experiencing it. And you're the one like you're that you're that spark of consciousness, or you're that soul or that light or whatever, what however you want to identify with it, but you're that that spark of consciousness that's getting to have this experience in a physical body. And one of the things that I find super fascinating, is that, you know, if you think about each of the emotions, we feel them in different parts of the body. Okay, so if you think of something sad, or you're watching a sad movie, if you were to tune into where your body was feeling it, most people feel it in their chest. Notice like if you if you've lost a pet, okay, that's a sad one. Let's just say that. You feel in the chest right? The throat starts to burn when you're feeling sadness, the nose behind the eyes, we have receptors like physiological receptors for sadness that hang out in the chest, the front of the throat, in the nose behind the eyes, okay? Anger, anger is felt, typically in the jaw, anybody clench your jaw, who grinds their teeth at night, probably got some things you're pissed off about subconsciously, and you don't even realize it. Right? So in the jaw in the head, migraines, headaches, totally connected to anger. And you feel it down the back of the neck and across the shoulders. That's typically where anger hangs out. What were the other ones fear, think of a time that you had to get up and speak publicly? Where did you feel it? The Pit of your gut, right? We have receptors for fear their sexual guys, where's that right? pelvic region, the pelvic region and chest right? Typically, that's where the receptors are. This is the thing that I find so fascinating. Joy is the one emotion that you can feel everywhere in your body. That's so cool. We have more receptors for joy and our physical body. physiologically, we were made with more receptors for joy than any other emotion combined. And how many of us are living in anger and fear and sadness, when there's actually so much joy that's available to us, but nobody taught us how to work with our emotions in a way that helps activate and gets us experiencing that part of what's available. So I love helping people in that area. I love helping people start to access more joy and peace. Like I said that like I really do value peace. That's just a derivative of joy for me. And also a lot of people when the body starts to break down when you have stuffed down too much heavy emotion, whether you want to call it heavy emotion, you want to call it dense energy. Like there's lots of names for it. Basically, it's just suppressed, suppressed, suppressed. And the body can only handle so much suppression before it starts to break down. And what most people think is like, Oh, my gosh, my body's betraying me, when really all your body. So this is the thing, my body is my biggest ally. That is a belief that I carry now like my body is my best friend and my biggest ally. It's been here since I before it has been here since before I took my first breath. And it is the thing that's going to walk me out of this life. Like my best friend, she's not going anywhere. And when something's out of alignment, she speaks up. Right. So when we suppress it way too far, for too long. hip pain, man, I used to have severe hip pain, lower back pain. Of course, I couldn't let I can't let myself be supported, right? Like every single ailment, injury, there's a possible emotional and mental contributing factor to it. And there's actually a really great book, if you want to dive more into this, I want to give like, are you guys cool, if I just give a quick resource, there's a book it's called the body keeps score. It is fascinating. And it helps build a new framework in your mind that like your body really is your ally, not your enemy. And I think most of us, you know, I say women because one it's for women here in the room, Michelle and I mostly work with women. But it is it's collective. It's men, women, children, like it's, it's all of us. But most of us spend a good chunk of our life feeling like our body is our enemy. And our greatest obstacle, when there is the possibility to be experiencing your body as your greatest blessing your biggest ally and your best receptor for experiencing joy. And if you're going to want to have a happy life, you're going to have to get in alignment with your body because that joy you're wanting to experience comes through your body. If you hate your body. Make sense? You're not experiencing anything your life like the receptor that's going to be able to even feel that joy that you're wanting to feel is going to come through your body. So it's one of the things like yeah, has to be something you're coming into alignment with, or else you're literally walking around in a constant state of war. And that's what hunter anybody. So yeah, we niched our business into body but it's not like, Hey, here's a meal plan, and hey, let's go work out and like people, I think they would love it if it was just that, right. That's so kids, were just using this as a tool. And that's exactly what it is. We found that using. So going back to the word goal, right, setting a bar setting a goal within your physical body, you can move towards it. And it's measurable, there's things you can look at, you can collect the data points, and it's all in your own little sphere. I really do believe that this physical body like in this energy bubble that is my own sphere that is a three and a half feet, that's typically three and a half feet that like hangs out around me. This is my first world. This is the world that I get to create. And I get to decide what the culture of this world gets to be. And and so so yeah, it's, it's about the body and it's not about the body. Yeah, it just makes it a lot easier. Because when you Get this in alignment that all of a sudden, it's like, people that we work with are like, Oh my gosh, like they're getting married or being better parents. And I'm like, I'm getting everything else I want like, Well, of course you are. Because you learn how to manage this world. And it has to reflect right outside of what you're getting. And so I find that it's, I've maybe I should say this, like, it's, it's probably the most intense in the beginning way of doing it. But it's the easiest way to create the world, the life and the experience that you are. It's you get this handled. It's like everything else is just easy. Outside worlds a reflection of our inner state. you master the inner state, the new master, the outer outer state, which I think is awesome. And I that I love all of that all that is, I love that you touched on things that yeah, that it's not talked about. We're not taught, you know, and how amazing I wish we were teaching this in elementary school, how can we preschool? Well, this is what your body does. As a mom, which I want to go back and change. Oh, right. I hear you that. I hear you. Yeah, for sure. There's something that I keeps popping. So I'm gonna touch on this for a minute, which was something that you and I had talked about the other day, Amanda, where there's no compassion for skinny people. Oh, hey, this was an interesting thing. Because when Amanda was sharing that she was going ever since I met Amanda, Amanda is beautiful, she's thin. She's all the things that a lot of us really strive to being. And when she was sharing that she was doing this, I'm like, Are you kidding me? Like you're already like, what is it that you're missing that you don't already have? And so we had an interesting conversation, especially with the anorexia piece that there's not a whole lot of compassion for skinny people, we can look at someone that's heavy and go, Oh, yeah, they, they don't look healthy, they should probably lose some weight, which is a judgment too. But there's more compassion there. So I don't know. Why wasn't present, the mandate was skinny. It's exactly why Michelle and I weren't friends for the first 12 years that we knew each other. She didn't like me, because I was skinny is that it's true. Right, we don't talk about this. And, and a lot of like, what I found, and part of it probably is just because, you know, we attract a lot of what we are in what we've experienced. So I do work with a lot of women that are on more of the petite side. Who I have one woman that just tried to kill herself three months ago. And she's got a bangin body. You look at her from like the outside. And that woman is like, Oh my gosh, I would love to have what you have. And her internal culture. I mean, even doctors say there's no reason that she should be alive scientifically, medically. They can't make sense out of out of why she's still breathing. And so, like, self loathing across the board, people doesn't matter what shape comes in all shapes and sizes. And just because my favorite flavor of self punishment, because that was part of it, too. Yes, it was control, but part of it was self punishment, because I wasn't worthy. Because of you know, a lot of these things that I experienced as a little kid I grew up like feeling and believing that I was complete, totally, completely not worthy and unlovable. And there was a part of me, it's like, Okay, well, if we're unworthy, and we're unlovable then, like, what happens to those people? Will they get punished? Okay, I guess that means I got punished myself. So, like, the levels of abuse that I, you know, everybody would look at me and be like, She's fine. And those were the Those were the years of my deepest self abuse. And that was also I was 97 pounds when I had my failed suicide attempt. So but looking at me, it was like, Okay, yeah, she's a little thin. Let's take her some food. Right? Is that was the problem, because that was the problem. But but it is where, again, it's a societal thing, where, like, I'm not even mad about it. I'm mad about it, but I'm not mad about it. Like I can understand it doesn't mean it's okay. Right. Right. And I think that's why I wanted to kind of bring that up for a minute, because it's not something that is talked about, and when you and I chatted about it, and I shared that with you, it's like yeah, there's no compassion for skinny people. And, and I've been thinking about that ever since. And you're right. There's not. There's not a thing students like, I mean, again, is like, there's no compassion because it's like, oh, well, that's the standard, right? I didn't like Amanda cuz she had what I didn't have, right. So then my mind has to be, like, whatever it has to society has climatized that are 50 you're not having to say 50 pounds. That's, that's 97 pounds at five eight. Yeah, right. Right. That's the body standard. Oh, my gosh, no, that's, that's not healthy. That's suffering. But we have been conditioned and marketing that that's, well, I think that's one of the things that you have to realize too, is like, okay, so there's a culture that's happening, right. And there's some people you think, just because the culture is happy, doesn't mean that you have to buy into it. But then if you have an experience your brains like, oh, like for me when my mom told me that I was big. Oh my gosh. Like, completely wrong context I bought really tall, there's a lot of big, like big can mean a lot of different things, right? It could be fat, it could be tall, it could be like, whatever what you heard, but what I heard because of what the culture was made a whole new story. So it's like, I can't say like, oh my god. Like, I wanted to play my mom for a long time for Cosmic History. Okay, like, like, I'm sure like, whatever. Like, sometimes when you can't handle it, you want to make it someone else's fault. Oh, my gosh, my mom should never said that you guys, how's my mom supposed to know? Like, really, that work could have so many different contexts. Obviously, she didn't mean to say that. And so I can look back now and I can change the story. But because of the culture, my brain is like, that means that everybody else talks about being fat, you were just told that you were fat, like it means something. So you can turn it in an experience. That now was traumatizing experiences to my child. I think, what I wanted to be big that it was a compliment, right? Well, and we do better when we know better even as parents, right? Yeah. So one of the things was studying NLP that I loved that, as I'm going through these things, talking about memories, we only remember we remember the fractured, unhealthy, traumatized memory, not actually what happened. Like you can be sharing this with your mom and be like, and she'd be like, What? What No, she's like, that's how I found out what it was. Michelle, when you were eight, you were like 534 years later, at 12 years old. You're five, nine, that's big. And I was like, yep, that makes sense. Yeah, but it is a fascinating thing that we do that we it's a cute thing that we do that when we were six year old this happened and for the rest of our lives. Now we're acting out in that way because of that trauma, when really, it wasn't even that story that we've been telling ourselves for however long was not it's not accurate, which I think is a really important thing. Because I think a lot of times people are afraid to go do their work because like, well, if I have trauma, I don't wanna remember it. You guys, most of the trauma that people have when they find it, like that's stupid. People say but are you serious? I literally have been having a problem for 20 years. And it's because of that. And it's you know, and they want to start laughing and it's usually pretty simple. Cuz I think sometimes it's like, because I've heard like, No, no, there's stuff down there. That's painful as dark because it does feel that way. Because there was a little like, Girl inside who literally thinks that she's unworthy because she's big, right? When you actually go down and look at it, you're like, wait, that's been keeping me hostage storytelling, but you were losing your mind creates this whole story around it being in it. Yeah. And my daughter learned that through NLP, yo. And so I asked her I'm like, are we storytelling? Like, Did that really happen? Well, no. Okay. And did it mean that that? Yeah, yep. And how much of that? Are we storytelling? How much are we creating? Because when you can actually see it that way, then your gosh, you can set yourself free. So it's like, I think sometimes, like, if you're out there, oh my gosh, I'd like to do personal work. But everyone says it's so hard. It's so scary, you guys, you don't have to have been sexually abused. You don't have to have had like been beaten by your parent or living on the streets or having like some horrific thing happened to you for you to have malfunction or dysfunctional behavior. It literally could be a month that was big. Why? Because I get I grew seven inches, for my mind made it think something different. And but because of that I was acting out in a way that created something. And I also don't want to downplay Yeah, there are some times to that there are really big traumas, there are really big things that happen. And you can still heal those in the same way, it doesn't have to be scary, you don't have to relive it in the same way. And it doesn't have to be this crazy, painful, horrific experience to be able to let it go. Like I'd love to put out there that there is something different than just talk therapy, right? Because we do in our, in our world that's kind of like I go see a counselor, I go see a therapist, or I go with and I'm not like I'm not a gay because that's actually really important sometimes to get the ball rolling, and you do not have to go and talk through every single detail of whatever happened to you. And you don't have to relive you. You don't have to relive the trauma there are ways of working with this that are way more gentle way more compassionate and way more streamlined. And and that's part of what I love about like, you know, I work outside of the box. Michelle works outside of the box, Amanda like, Jessica, like we're people that do work outside of the box. And and sometimes a lot of your answers for what you're asking for are going to come in the flavor of being outside of the box. Again, re dime almost pretty much every time. So I do tell people like hey, okay, so when you're asking for something, whether you're the praying type, or you're the calling in a vision type, like whatever language you use, when you're placing that order up to God and the universe. Just know that when the that that order is served, it's probably not going to be served in the way that you thought almost always. And, and it is because really if you if you knew how to do it already, you would have already done it right. And so a new resources coming in. And it's having the bravery to say yes, because it will be outside of your comfort zone, but it It can be much more gentle, much more easy. And you don't have to relive it. Yeah, it's really important. Yeah, I agree. I do want to put out there because he's popping my head. If you're someone out there thinking like, Oh, well, they're talking this way now, because they have the body like, one of the big things is that I wish I could go back into my 18 year old self, hey, when you have the body that you think that you need in order to be happy, it's not going to feel the way that you think. Like, it really has nothing to do with the body. Like I'll have people say like, Oh my gosh, like, do you feel amazing? Do you just like love having this body? I'm like, kind of neutral? What are you talking about? Like, like, I literally wish that I could go back and tell each emotion, it has nothing to do with your size. It literally has nothing to do with your size, the person that you're going to become? That is what you're going to like love. And yes, this is just a side benefit of it. But like, I just used to think, Oh, no, it had to be a size, I had to look a certain way. When I did, I would arrive and I feel something. And that's why I think sometimes too, when people don't do the inner work along with what they're doing. Maybe if they're able to get the body get to the size or the shape that they want their way, I still don't feel I don't feel the way that I did. But if you work with it in a way where you're getting in alignment, and you're loving your body, your body will naturally change into whatever its perfect, healthiest place is, and you'll feel awesome in your body. And you won't even care what people think about it. You won't even care if it's like up to society's standards. Or if you have to do it this way. It's like it's a comfortable place to be. regardless what sizes. Yeah. So before we finish up and show people or you guys tell people how to get a hold of you. Yeah. Do you think we should share maybe like our top three takeaways from the retreat without giving away too many like? Yeah, I want to hear this without giving away like, one of the retreat was Yeah, yeah. Another one coming up on wall. Yeah. Yeah, sure that in just a minute. Um, yeah, you go. I'm like, Well, now I gotta, you gotta think, Well, for me, I will share this at the end of the second day. Amanda and I were going back and we will said, I can't imagine what more there could be because we I really fell after the hike. The hike was a beautiful experience for me. So that was like a really big takeaway for me. Touching in on going by myself for two hours, and leaning in. So that was one big takeaway. The second was when we're on our way back after that, we only have a half a day left maybe like three hours. And we're all like, I think I'm, I think, I think I'm complete. Like there can't be any more. I think we're done here. Like, we were really both like, and wow, was I not? So the second takeaway was that mere work and I've done mere work. Honestly, my mere work has consisted of from my neck up, looking myself in the eye and having that conversation, and ignoring the the lower part of my body. So that was the second takeaway that mirror work was Holy shit. Amanda, and Amanda was there. You weren't there for my mirror? Well, it was it was raw. And it was real. And what was the other third one was when we were talking about what our because at the beginning of your treat, you have each of us set our own personal goals that's personal to us. So then going and asking our body's permission, if if your body is ready to release it, and I got a hard note. Mm hmm. So that was a an answer I got was, you know, unlike why the answer I got was just tenderness and grace. Yep. Which I haven't done with my body, or myself, because I'm a doer. I'm a goal setter. And I checked those boxes, and I get it done. And so the grace and the tenderness piece that came back to me, and of course, I was like, What do you mean? No. What do you mean? No, my body's not ready to release this Wait, you know, that I'm holding on to. And that was, so those are kind of the three takeaways for me that going in because I mean, we're teachers, but I love being a student to being that, you know, then we go back, and we teach it to ourselves and to others. And in that process, we grow. Yep. So those were my three, like, takeaways, but yeah, that last, and and I like I think, complete and then you push us. You're welcome. And I'm sorry. And you're welcome. My three takeaways were one that showed up that I didn't expect, which was I got to be up in front of everybody and process, which, you know, we always make the stories that I had so much worse than what they are, but to what you were just saying we all you know, we teach we also do retreats. So then to be the student in front of the whole group and be really vulnerable. I can't remember what the piece was that I was working. I love that you but went up there though, and did that. That was hard for me. I've been really trying to practice the vulnerability piece and being seen and so it was like when you said who wants to be the volunteer? I'm like, Oh, shit. It's me, buddy. Yes. No, it was a full body. And sometimes that's what the yes feels like, right? Yeah. The scary Yes. Yeah. And the second thing for me was the moment part that you just touched on with the idea of the receptor cells because I hadn't actually heard that before. And, and that was really fascinating to me to sit through and, and, and recognizing and have more compassion really for the emotional center, and how those pieces show up for us. And and I would say in conjunction with that the hike was just awesome. I mean, while on the rocks and the writing down the things and sitting with it and moving it and I think what I loved the most about that is when you start doing more and more work like this, how quickly things move once the recognized Yes, this is the piece I'm holding on to this is how heavy it is how long do I really want to hike around with these freaking rocks, probably not that long, or this one actually maybe a little bit longer and, and honoring yourself in the process of healing. And what that looks like that was that was powerful for me. And the mere work I actually I really hated I really hate it. But Damn straight. I don't know that I would, I would never do that again, I I'm just gonna put that out there right now. But what I loved about the mirror work was actually seeing everyone else that showed up in front of that mirror. Because everyone else had a different story. Everyone else had their trauma and the and the wounding that they're holding, and being able to look at themselves and say these things like it to even what we were talking about with the judgment piece of not having compassion for the skinny girl. And it's like, I don't care what shape or size you are, like the inner turmoil and the inner hatred or the inner whatever it is that's going on inside most people is heart wrenching. And so that ability to have compassion and God watching Jessica, she's first she was the one I hope you are okay that I share that she stepped up to it first. And she did it like a boss. And she like the integrity and the fierceness that you had. And you looked in your yourself in the eyes. I was like, holy shit. I could not do it as well as you did. But it was just that was that was powerful. I mean, the weekend itself was was powerful. And for me, it was absolutely perfect timing. And that self judgment piece. It doesn't discriminate, no matter what side No. evident, like you said, Yeah, because there were all sizes and shapes. And everyone really had like the same. That self judgment piece. It's almost like the same story. But oh, you you're like how do you nuances, but the same, the same thing? I don't know her name, but she was just like, how can you think that about yourself? You're just when you're beautiful. And it was just it was just like this beautiful, emotional experience. So thank you. Yeah, and I know we're not supposed to share anything outside of that space. I'm hoping that I think I know I tried to share without sharing all that. But yeah, I think it was worth so if people want to learn more about you guys. Where do they find you? Okay, so first one website. So the website for us is the soco? soco.org. It's longer, but we had to shorten it. We had to shorten it. We'll put it in the Yeah, um, you know, and you can also follow us we're on social media. We're pretty active in the Facebook world. And also on the Instagram world. So for me, it's just my name Amanda Monroy, Mo n r. o y. Nelson. Michelle dot Wilding. Yep, I think that's, and we'll again, we'll put this in the show, to find. But then yeah, I mean, we work with people, we have programs that we run, we have a 12 week program that we work with women, where we're literally walking you through the body experience, learning how to work with the mind, learning how to work with the emotions, learning how to show up learning how to take care of yourself, it does come with like the workout and the eating part. Because that does bring stuff right up to the surface. But it's having you be able to be supported as you're doing your work. A lot of times they go to the work, but it's like, oh, how do I do and this emotional stuff, and I know what do I do with that? Normally, that's not that's not what you find. So yeah, you guys touch on all the bodies, which I love that mental, emotional, physical, spiritual, and make sure that every single one's connected. And so yeah, that's a 12 week program. We have a group one offering, or we have one more it's group and then also want to once you get a session every single week, we each have our own personal practices that we do. And then we do have a the workshop that you guys were talking about. We're doing that the end of August, August 27 28th, in Highland, Utah, right, correct. Yeah. And so those are kind of the ways that you can find this work with us or experienced the workshop. Yeah, you guys are absolutely amazing. I know. I'm so honored to get to spend time with you one on one and to share our experience with others because I think that it's what you guys are doing is beautiful and powerful and so needed. Yeah. So thank you for bringing your light to the space. Thank you for having us. Here. Awesome. And everyone. Always and without a struggle, struggle without an end.