‹ All episodes

SheBrews, HeBrews: A Jewish Fermentation Podcast

Episode 20: Cocktails

March 02, 2022 Evan Harris Season 1 Episode 20
Apple Podcasts Spotify Amazon Music Podcast Index Overcast Stitcher +
Show Notes Transcript

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iBpgqRbEFVg 

https://youtu.be/IN7_qyWeYLI?t=506 

Resources:  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_IBA_official_cocktails 

https://vinepair.com/articles/6-important-cocktails-recipe-guide/ 

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCioZY1p0bZ4Xt-yodw8_cBQ 


Books:

The Cocktail Codex

The 12 Bottle Bar

The Aviary

Smuggler’s Cove



Find us on Instagram: 

https://www.instagram.com/jewishfermentationpodcast/ 

Our Website:

https://www.buzzsprout.com/1789715

Evan:

Welcome to episode 20. If Shibaz Hebrews is Jewish fermenting podcasts, where we hope to discuss all things, home brewing incrementing today, we're talking about cocktails and midst drinks. I'm your host. Evan Harrison with me today is my toast. Alison Shea.

Alison:

Hey there. How you doing

Evan:

I'm doing, oh,

Alison:

well?

Evan:

I don't want to say well, I mean relatively well, but the state of the world. Um, yeah,

Alison:

You know, world war three might be starting,

Evan:

uh, yeah,

Alison:

but uh,

Evan:

to Tom layers, uh, sawn for world war three at good number of times already.

Alison:

oh, I've been, listening to the mountain goats. I'm gonna make it through this year. If it kills me.

Evan:

That's a good one. I need to add that. Like, I don't normally actually listen to a ton of music, though it's effort sometimes as background while I sleep, normally I'll use audio books for that, but so my music right now has I've been listening to more music than normal right now. It has either been. Apocalyptic comedy, like so long mom, tumblers sawn for world war three, or we will all go together when we go or has been things with titles, like 12 hours of relaxing studio, Ghibli, sleep music

Alison:

that's a, that's certainly a vibe I'm going to, I think my big one recently is I have a playlist called the late night dance party, which is, I am somewhat notorious for having very late night dance parties just by myself when my roommate and cat roommates are asleep. and it's, it's just like the most aggressive, lovely Bobby songs I've got.

Evan:

Oh, that's fine.

Alison:

It's a, it's a real mood lifter

Evan:

That sounds like a good, a good playlist for the state of the world.

Alison:

and it was a good one. So what are you drinking today?

Evan:

So, of course with today's theme, I'm drinking a Negroni, a relatively simple, mixed drink, but delicious made with, two thirds NATO and NATO Alliance ingredients. The remaining third is Israeli. So I'm not exactly complaining about that.

Alison:

Nice. I have, what I am now calling an old plumbing juice, also known as a rum sour is two parts rum. I used a, I'm not sure if this is what I was supposed to use for it, but I used dark rum. Um, so three parts rum, uh, two parts, lemon juice, And one part I didn't have simple syrup, so I like mixed up what it should be in sugar and water. Uh, Lacey version

Evan:

is it good?

Alison:

it is adult lemon juice, lemonade. This is

Evan:

it's a success.

Alison:

Yeah. This is, this is like, if your kid tastes this, they will think you are drinking lemonade. Keep it away from them.

Evan:

I mean you

Alison:

very good.

Evan:

you use the standard recipe for a sour. Of course frequently you'll see included, uh, add whites in the shape. That gives a really nice foam, but that is a sour. It's a dark rum sour. If you like, what ends up in your glass? It was a success. That is the, that is the general thing with anything you're drinking, especially cocktails. It doesn't have to be exactly the recipe. I have plenty. I have a giant stack if you didn't hear that thud of books behind me on how to make cocktails. So going from just straight recipes to very scientific thought, between the, but if we ends up in your class, you like, it was a success.

Alison:

Yeah. I'm more commenting that like, if we have any listeners who have. They should, uh, keep this away from them. If they decide to make a rum sour, it's very good. Your children will think it is lemonade,

Evan:

Yeah. If you're going to make it, you, everyone who just heard Allison's recipe for a sour, if you think, oh, I'll do a buy some sour mix don't sour mints. Disgusting. Just get some lemons or lemon juice and sugar sour.

Alison:

literally lemonade guys, I'm drinking lemonade.

Evan:

absolutely Is

Alison:

And, before we started the recording of it and I were talking, this is. probably also made from entirely NATO places.

Evan:

Yeah.

Alison:

It's I mean

Evan:

it's all

Alison:

from lemon juice and sugar.

Evan:

probably all American.

Alison:

Yeah. but very tasty would recommend. and we did actually have, an outline here, but Evan, what would you call these in terms of like the number of notes. you would, you would refer to them as each of our cocktails?

Evan:

Um, so the number of notes or the,

Alison:

Isn't it called? Like a two-in-one or three note.

Evan:

oh, so yes, that, that, that is one methodology, which is very popular in one of the books I have, liquid intelligence, yours would be effectively a OneNote or two note. Mine would be a three, which is my, for an a groany the recipe is one part, vermouth, one part gin, and one part compari, compari that a lot of flavor in it.

Alison:

Yeah. So, when I'm referring to is, one of the ways that cock. Cocktails will be classified is by the number of different flavor profiles that are mixed together to produce the drink. So you can have a really basic drink that will be, you can have like a two note cocktail or a three note cocktail, or you can have more than that. but a lot of really classic ones will just be like a two or three note cocktail. very straightforward, very just classic, basic tasty flavors.

Evan:

Yeah, there are the world of cocktails is absurdly huge. And sometimes people get overly specific. I say with a book that is very scientific and decoding, everything sending right behind me, that is one of my favorite books in this genre.

Alison:

Yeah. I think as a general rule, especially if, if you're like me and you like having, different cordials around to mix west. Mixing flavors that you like and, like have eaten things that mixed together well with them. But that, that is not proper English. If you have flavors that you like and, you know, go together well, and you have, you have ingredients that contain them or contain those flavors, it's usually pretty straight forward to make something that's going to be tasty. Like my, one of my favorite cocktails is a chocolate martini. You've got chocolate and vanilla vodka and creamy base. It's very straightforward. It's flavors, you know, that are going to go well together today, you've got a cocktail you can do all sorts of fancier things you can make, as you can, have say. Like a whole assortment of different things and have a, a complex flavor profile. But If you want to go, just come up with something on your own, anything you do that you like is good.

Evan:

If you want to do a crazy with flavors and flavor profiles, look at Tiki, Tiki drinks have insane number of, of, ingredients sometimes and syrups that are mitzvahs of other syrups. It's crazy. A lot of them are delicious though.

Alison:

Yeah. But I wouldn't include with that, like, strawberry daiquiri,

Evan:

Yeah. so actually martini. And so one of the things that's a little later in the show notes, but we can talk about now and I'll talk some of the history later. One of my favorite cocktail books that I don't have here, but I have in Utah is one called the cocktail Kodak. Which I think this takes, it takes a really neat look at cocktails. I think one, Alison you'd really like, and basically what it says is that all cartels can be broken down into one of six categories and everything is effectively just a take on one of these or one of these original tactiles. And so you'll notice a lot of cocktails have really similar recipes just with one or two ingredients, swapped out. That's basically taking that and analyzing it to the mat to its final conclusion.

Alison:

So what are the six categories or do we want to get to that

Evan:

No, I'll get to them now know that the, and you've mentioned two of them. That's why I brought it up now. The city categories, according to the cocktail, cadets are the old fashioned, the martini, the daiquiri, the sidecar, the high ball that they specify whiskey highball, just that is historically the oldest, but the high ball as a category. And then the flip, which is a really interesting mix of things that you have to analyze historic. Like

Alison:

side note. There is also a type of glass called the highball glass. so if you hear it referred to as, as like an actual item of, of drink drinkware in addition to a drink itself, it's because

Evan:

yeah. I mean,

Alison:

there are terms for both, but it's just not. I'm not saying to you

Evan:

Yeah, no. What I was going to say is there's also daiquiri glasses and martini glasses, and sidecar glasses tend to doing the same ones as martinis. And though most, most martini glasses are. The hard to spit, like they're easy to spill, right? I've seen you very carefully taking it to take a step.

Alison:

I'm currently using one and a yes, I am terrified this at all times.

Evan:

so at some point when I have like, actually, no I'm living someplace, you won't have to move it again. I want to get Nick and Nora glasses, which are what martinis and sidecars would have originally been served in their smaller, a smaller form of a coupe glass. Another thing with the glassware, don't go crazy about finding them.

Alison:

Nick and Nora, um, a movie about a playlist.

Evan:

That is a more modern run. Yes. But nitro north lasses are named after two characters in a novel from the 1920s that the two characters were infamously drunks.

Alison:

Oh, here we go. Nick and Nora, Charles are fiction. Fictional characters could buy Dashiell Hammett in his novel. The thin man later adapted for, Um, characters were later adapted for a film in a series of films between 1934 and 1947 for radio. Yes, for radio television, a Broadway musical and the stage plays. So they have been in many things apparently, and I have somehow only heard of the infinite platelet. so,

Evan:

I mean,

Alison:

feeling very cultured here right now.

Evan:

well in a lot of both actual episodes and tangents, now that we've released two tangents episodes, there's a lot of history that I like reading and talking about. So that's how I know a lot of this cocktail history is its own weird subject. A lot of it is very kind of, oh, I heard that or kind of retro. I want to S I don't want to say rat counting, but it sounds a lot like rec counting sometimes.

Alison:

I think that's a thing with a lot of food history. I mean, you do have some concrete stories, of, of origins. The first thing that comes to mind is peach, Melbourne, Melba toast. But you also have a lot of hearsay, a lot of, oh, this person commented on trying this at this fair once upon a time, but unless you've gotten an actual menu or a recipe tracing back to somebody in particular saying that they came up with it, it's hard to trace food history, like a specific recipe. And there's a lot about food history that we can talk about in terms of like, Oh this is the way the trade was going. And, and these foods spread to these areas and you can trace so much of world history, by what foods are in the region, like generally, or, what spices get to what place, what, what particular items are in a place, but actually a recipe in particular, I feel like that's, that's a whole other can of worms.

Evan:

Yeah. like what, with drinks specifically? One of the ones that a lot of people bring up is that the margarita has some mythical history to it, about serving a woman with the name or something like that. And coming, coming out of the drink without a thin air, it's a sidecar with tequila. I'm not a huge fan of tequila. So I'd prefer a sidecar to a margarita, but it's a sidecar where instead of lemon, you use lime and you use the Tila instead of Brandy.

Alison:

side note about side cars. my roommate and I came up with a variation on the sidecar, which is her family, his drink of choice for every holiday. we replaced the triple sec with blue Curacao and it is a beautiful shade of blue that very much matches, the logo for an organization that we belong to. And we call it a side pod, which is like also a reference to the whole tide pod thing because of the color, in addition to a reference to the organization. So it's our apartment's signature cocktail. It is very obnoxious and very delicious. And you basically do, it's one part brand. Wait,

Evan:

Yeah, friend. Dave would be a sidecar.

Alison:

all right. One part Brandy, one part lemon, one part blue Curacao and the whole load of ice in a blend. We do, we do I'm frozen. I have made them on frozen before, but I've found if you make them unfrozen, you usually have to add a fair amount of simple syrup just because the flavors don't come out quite the same way.

Evan:

So we get to, you want us some of the actual history of the cocktail.

Alison:

Yes.

Evan:

So I mean, mid strengths and P realistically originate with punches, which we've discussed in a previous episode. So go listen to that one. Punchy punches. I believe that was episode. what 14?

Alison:

Yes. punch exclamation point is what it says in our notes.

Evan:

Yes. I think, I think we renamed this no punchy punches to the good eats episode in which we say many times.

Alison:

goodness has, by the way, some very good episodes on cocktails. we're on brown walks through, All sorts of different information. I think it's, I think the original is a two parter.

Evan:

I think so it definitely has a sort of bond, bond, bartender serving bond setup to it.

Alison:

yeah. it's very good. It's one of the first good eats episodes that I ever saw. and I was not old enough to drink at that point. but it was fun and flashy and intriguing enough that that's what really got me introduced and hooked on the show. So with strongly recommend,

Evan:

I don't know if I will link to that in the show notes, but there are also some great YouTube channels that I will link. The kind of bring is a good eats, like energy.

Alison:

yeah, There's a certain level of chaos. It's just a vibe.

Evan:

There's one, all of a sudden you, some of the videos that, if I haven't already, called how to drink, it definitely has the chaos.

Alison:

It's important.

Evan:

and it's a guy who's never actually worked in the bar, but he, he knows this. He knows his way around the books and knows that her drink. And, recently did an episode. he started a series called the customer's never wrong, or is it the customer that's always wrong. and in the series, he takes his hat from a Instagram of bartenders who found drinks that are, who've had to make crazy drinks writing like the, the receipt, taking photos of the receipt, the order receipt, he's taking those and making those drinks and seeing was the customer right or wrong.

Alison:

So the original quote is actually the customer is always right in matters of taste.

Evan:

Yeah,

Alison:

So whenever you hear the customer is always right. No, the customer is not always right. Like the customer doesn't know your, I don't know.

Evan:

return policy because that's the only people argue over a lot.

Alison:

one. the customer is not always right. The point is the customer is always right in manners of taste, is that everybody has their own individual tastes and preferences

Evan:

Exactly.

Alison:

and that's totally valid. Just, you know, don't be an ass about it

Evan:

I mean, don't be an ass, don't be an ass is generally a good piece of advice.

Alison:

Yes. I can think of, some subreddits devoted to this

Evan:

there are a few with, mixed amounts of, We're storytelling.

Alison:

Yes.

Evan:

but so as I mentioned, Cahtos really started with punches, but the midst drink, as we know, it started in the early 18 hundreds and came to its first kind of height and golden age during the wild west, the 1860s and seventies, which is not something people normally think of that timeframe as you've got beer, you've got straight whiskey and that's it. Right.

Alison:

Well, I don't know. Cause I know they carried like packets of dried spices and, and different things so that, and chilies and stuff so that they can make like quick stews.

Evan:

But not only that.

Alison:

surprise me though, if you thinking about them doing that, but like, it would be easy for them to take a whole bunch of different drive things or a whole bunch of different whatevers to be able to mix something that. would be easy to carry and easy to have with you.

Evan:

Well, absolutely, but not only that, one of the largest industries from about 1870, till 1910 ish was ice companies, shipping ice from Northern climates and giant ice houses and iceboxes until the advent of, electric refrigeration.

Alison:

Man. Am I glad for that?

Evan:

same I live in Texas now

Alison:

Yeah. Oh yeah. Information for everybody previously. Yeah.

Evan:

um, yeah,

Alison:

as we talked about things, we were like, Evan is in Utah and Alison is in North Carolina. Alison is still in North Carolina. Evan is no longer in Utah.

Evan:

I'll be back there, hopefully as much as I can, but yeah, no for work. I now live in Texas. as I take another drink, but, no, it's very warm. A lot of the air. I need artificial air conditioning. but the,

Alison:

Meanwhile, last, two weeks ago for work. Part of the reason why you guys got a second, a second tangents of the sodas, because I was in Ohio for work briefly. there was an ice storm. I haven't diced a car in years guys, and I don't miss it.

Evan:

I had to do that here last week and everyone was freaking out and I'm like, this is nothing

Alison:

Yeah, it was. I mean, I don't mind having to dis the car. I do mind when you get a rental car in Ohio and they don't give you an ice,

Evan:

Mr. Draper. That is.

Alison:

that's, that's something they should do.

Evan:

Yeah, I've got my promise to that. But one of my coworkers is from Toronto originally.

Alison:

Oh

Evan:

and he had no problem with it either. But as I was saying, the ice was Brett. I'm not gonna say readily, but available around pretty much the entire country pretty much all year and bartenders were the people paying the most for it because they could use it and they wanted to show it off. So big, fancy drinks with all sorts of spices and herbs, and very, very cold where signature across the west. A lot of them were not. But just, they were showing off their ingredients more than showing off something worth drinking, but the cocktail really had a rent, had its first big heyday in that timeframe when they were showing, look at what I can get, look at what the railroad brought me.

Alison:

Man. That's like wild to think about it in terms of look at what the railroad brought me. Like you're in here in some small town somewhere. That like

Evan:

rock Ridge, California.

Alison:

Yeah. But anywhere,

Evan:

I mean, it's a fictional town from Mel Brooks movies, but

Alison:

Oh, I, I,

Evan:

rock Ridge, California from a blazing saddles. Um,

Alison:

okay. Where were We

Evan:

We were taught, we just talked about the wild west and cocktails after that long tangent that's getting caught and hopefully not another one, starting by me saying that there was a tangent got there.

Alison:

Okay. Let's just see what was back on the outline so that we can figure out what we were planning to tack that

Evan:

So in the era of the wild west cocktails, the first cocktail books get published and there are two, the soy hotel's cocktail box. And the other, which is potentially the more famous, the more influential though, both are very famous, influential and influential was Jerry. Tom was the bartender. Jerry Thomas of New York published how to mix drinks, which is a, by many to serve, to be the first cocktail mixing book. And Alison is fixing my spelling in the outline because I can't spell.

Alison:

Yes. Sorry. I'm not really sorry. It's like a personal, there are plenty of typos where I'm like, whatever, but for some reason, seeing the word cheap misspelled, like, like a, like a little chicken noise That just gets made

Evan:

No problem. But so Jerry Thomas, did go kind of coast to coast. He, was born in Sackets Harbor. New York eventually died back in New York city, but w learned bartending in new Haven and then went to California seeking this role and ended up just serving all the prospectors.

Alison:

side note for people who are familiar with Sackets Harbor, which I certainly was not, it is on lake Ontario at like the way, Eastern end. and it's like right near the border with Canada. So if you see the lake that Toronto is on and you go all the way to the, like the farthest side, that's where it is. had just

Evan:

Hello up there.

Alison:

Buffalo is kind of like almost directly due south and it's, it's not actually really it's like, if you go. If you basically go hop across lake Ontario, you pass through Niagara and then you'd hit Buffalo. It's it's pretty much a straight line. like you go, it's like 30 degrees east downwards. I don't know if I'm saying that right

Evan:

That's more than fine, but,

Alison:

anyways.

Evan:

fo for their native son, Jerry Thomas, the father of bartending a lot of drinks, originate their first recorded uses in the, in his content bots, including, some of the more notable ones, which would UPD decided not to mention that I've keep hearing, attributed to him and the blue blazer, which is a scary drink to make, because it involves a lot of fire.

Alison:

That sounds like something that you should avoid making as, not your first cocktail.

Evan:

So blue

Alison:

You should also maybe avoid making it as the first cocktail too, but like definitely his cocktail, like

Evan:

one, you put you light on fire and then pour from glass to glass to, okay. So you pour this flaming cocktail from one picture to another.

Alison:

So what I'm hearing is that I'm right.

Evan:

Yes, you are very right. it is a stereotype. Tell them, make,

Alison:

Yes. I will not be making that. no matter how much I like fire, that seems like the kind of thing that the very fluffy cat that lives with me. Wouldn't be a little too curious about

Evan:

yeah. Don't please. Don't light a loo on fire.

Alison:

no, he lights himself on fire on occasion, not lights on fire. He D he, he is semi notorious for like cinching his tail and. It's so fluffy that he doesn't notice, like he's not hurt just to be clear. He is not hurt. We have made a point to always keep her candles covered. We keep like, like we keep our flames covered, but he is so fluffy. And so like uncaring of where his tail goes, like, it'll go right into the hole at the top and he will not notice. Cause he's so fluffy that like nothing ever reaches him. He's done it like two or three times recently, uh,

Evan:

That is hilarious and

Alison:

three times that I know of, period. Um, I tell him, yeah, he just, he hasn't noticed one bit and we go and he's like, what are you guys talking about? Why are you yelling at me? I'm doing nothing. I'm standing on this table. I'm not hurt. What are you talking about? I literally don't know what you're knocking on. He's, he's not the brightest boy, but we love him to pieces.

Evan:

He's adorable.

Alison:

He's so cute, but so dumb.

Evan:

Um,

Alison:

anyways, different areas of cocktails.

Evan:

of cuts. So as those trans transportation networks that we talked about earlier, the lab for ice and all those spices to be included as those improved, availability of beer and wine approved again. So cocktails fell a little bit about fell. A little out of popularity also is as the wine industry in America grew, and you didn't have to ship it from overseas, introduced ship it from California.

Alison:

also I think so the, the phases of cocktails that we have, written about. In the notes. Um, I'm looking at this list here and it says, Tiki in the fifties and sixties, cheap mixers in the seventies, a teeny, everything in show mixing in the nineties, Canon pre-mix today. And I think that's like something that is reflective of general trends at the time.

Evan:

Oh, absolutely. Um, there's, there's, there's one though, before the kind of quick summary that you gave to prohibition was huge for cocktails.

Alison:

Oh yeah.

Evan:

so,

Alison:

mean, prohibition, anything alcohol related

Evan:

Nope, but it's a lot, if you're smuggling a set volume of liquid, you're going to get a lot more drinks by making out of cocktails by doing gin cause lemon juice, your all your juice is fine for prohibition doesn't matter. so you should keep going with all your mixers. So you just need the gin or actually prohibition is why Git gin became significantly more popular in this. A lot of cocktails were originally made with Whisty and Jen replaced them in the PR during prohibition because Jen didn't have to be aged. It was so therefore significantly easier to make a secretly,

Alison:

Okay. But personal opinion, it doesn't taste very good.

Evan:

uh,

Alison:

Yeah. They just wanted the alcohol. And so they were going for the highest alcohol content that they could get the fastest, they could get it so that they can send it out there. Basically like, uh, the 1920s version of every company in 2020, who had the like ability to make hand sanitizer, figuring out how to make hand sanitizer as fast as they could.

Evan:

correct.

Alison:

the quality. It's about how high of an alcohol content you can get as fast as you possibly can so that you can pop it out to people

Evan:

Correct.

Alison:

that have returned.

Evan:

there, there are a lot of, um, a lot of cocktails that classic now, classic cocktails that have their origins in the 1920s. My favorite being the sidecar actually.

Alison:

And, I would say a high on my list

Evan:

Yeah.

Alison:

Well, I mean the side pod, it's good. It's

Evan:

no, it does sound

Alison:

bright blue and it's a wonderful,

Evan:

have any blue chorus out, but it does sound really good.

Alison:

to fix that. It's a level of obnoxious then I just really appreciate.

Evan:

And maybe I'll do it a stop at the liquor store. Next time I'm coming back from work.

Alison:

Yeah. I don't know how many times this has come up on this podcast or if it has at all. but I do really like it when things are an obnoxious colors. I really do. I just got a new laptop bag and it is, bright pink and green and yellow Stripe. It's like a forest green. but. Yellow and bright pink strikes.

Evan:

You'd probably like a lot of the drinks in this book. And this is the I'll mention all of the books I had in that sat behind me, but this is a drink I need to make. You might not like it as much. Just look at that color.

Alison:

Ooh, that's fun. I'm a fun cocktail

Evan:

So this drink is called the banana Curry for anyone listening and know, holding up a book to a camera's most

Alison:

bright yellow. The cocktail in question is bright yellow. Also, if you want to do something really fun, you can mix yourself, a fun cocktail, basically make yourself a screwdriver, make some vodka and orange juice and then drop by drop. Add a little bit of grenadine into your glass and do not mix. Just let it go. And. And it will sink to the bottom and settle and you'll end up with a really beautiful sunrise drink.

Evan:

That does sound

Alison:

It's just an easy way to add like lots of fun color. You need very little because, Grenadines is very concentrated. It's also pretty? sweet. and also because if you add too much of it too fast, your whole drink is now pink. but if you add it like very, very slowly, like a dash at a time and try not to agitate the glass, you come up with something really beautiful.

Evan:

after prohibition there've been a lot of areas of cocktail says Alison mentioned. and a lot of it are. Indicative of bigger trends in the 50 since sixties? Well, well, how did the world was still only just recovering? So it really started in the forties going into the fifties and sixties. However, the Caribbean was relatively unharmed. The south Pacific people had access to, and a lot of the rest of Latin America, people thought was the Caribbean, basically. So, and it was some of the few places in the world that were, um, blown up. and so people want things that brought them, that sort of feeling. And so that was lots of Polynesian stuff in general culture as well. And that's why you saw a lot of Tiki drinks and honestly, there's some very good Tiki drinks.

Alison:

I also think there's a little bit of the like, it's, I mean, parts of that parts of that area were blown up in a, in a different, maybe not quite so literal way, but I think also there's a little bit of the like pre post crusades effect. Because there were people who were in the south Pacific who were stationed in the south Pacific and they did see a little bit of the area and they did see, maybe not much, but a very different environment. And they wanted a taste of something that they considered quite exotic. so I think that probably played into it to a certain degree. and also, I saw an article recently, that I have not read yet, but it was sent to me. and it was like, the title was something about how, how we haven't helped people. Our age don't know how to host dinner parties. We were never taught how to host dinner parties and that, that plays into it. Certain aspects. I don't know. I haven't read the article yet, so I still need to read the article. But, I think that like in the fifties and sixties, at least what I understand is that like hosting dinner parties was a thing and hoes and, you know, people were making aspects and people were making things that they wanted to look fancy and thrill a crowd. And it was very, it was very much about the show and I think something like a Tiki drink would fit in well with that kind of idea. And, you know, you have a lot of canned foods and jellied foods that, you know, you could make something easily with lots of canned pineapple and, things

Evan:

Yeah, access to the ingredients you'd never had before. W when you think a lot of these 1950s recipes, which do not sound good are a lot of them are your first access to this ingredient you've never seen before. So things are just thrown together and absurd combinations. It makes a lot more sense.

Alison:

Yeah.

Evan:

but that is a lot of TKI. Some of them do sound

Alison:

who I think, does an interesting job. I've definitely mentioned this before. I think on this show, but, B Dylan Hollis on, on Tik TOK has kind of become known as like the guy who makes old recipes, but also he has a couple of YouTube videos

Evan:

I know you, I know you've sent to me. I don't know if we've talked about it on the pod.

Alison:

anyways, he he's a character that reminds me too, anybody who has read the web comic check please, which is probably not many people here.

Evan:

I'm aware of it because I know I have plenty of friends. Who've read it, but I never have.

Alison:

basically it's a web comic about, this kid who. It's on a hockey team. He's also a very avid baker. and his name is, is Biddle Viddy. his hockey nickname is video, but anyways, it's the general idea is that like, he's, he, the guy in, on tech talk is making historical recipes and he does a longer form version of them on YouTube. Sometimes, sometimes a lot of the time he just posts his tech talks, but he does have some longer form videos where he talks about the history behind the recipes. and, and I think it's really fascinating to hear about these things. I mean, I've said it before, and I'll say it again, food histories, world history. And like we were saying earlier, like you can track. Through you can track the movement of different foods and the access to different foods, throughout history. And that's really indicative of it's how trade was going, how wars were going. we were trying trade routes were, who was living in this area. If people got moved, if people were all sorts of things, if people were trading,

Evan:

so th that reminded me of something that I'm sure I'll mentioned another pod in another pod. I was listening to a different Jewish history podcasts. Well, an actual Jewish history podcast, not one where we just have Jew tangents about Jewish history

Alison:

things show up on occasion here, we don't intend for them to, they Just do.

Evan:

and they found the luggage list of this trade of this this Jewish merchant who spent many years in India, they found his luggage list for returning to, the middle east. And so, and this is one of the few documents of it's timed from the 12 hundreds.

Alison:

Well, it's

Evan:

And there's a

Alison:

complaining about the quality of his copper. It's always open season on and nastier jokes.

Evan:

It always is. It always will be. but so is really interesting because there were a lot of food. I will not necessarily surprise them, but there were a lot of food items in his list. One of which we were raising significant number of raisins and people think that that actually was not for him. For just straight up easily eating raisins directly. But because at least at the time the rabbi's considered, if you made wine from the raisins like that ginger wine, we talked about before a few episodes ago, if you remember that, but if you made wine from the raisins, even if the raisins wine from the grapes were turned into raisins, even if that wine would not be considered kosher, the wine from the raisins would be, so it was a way to make wine for kiddish on the long sea voyage.

Alison:

Um, also just, for reference again, when we joke about Ian here, basically there is a guy, there was a guy who lived, roughly around 1750 BCE, who was a copper merchant who sold poor quality copper to people. And for some reason he kept all of the clay tablets with the complaints he received. So we have

Evan:

not complaints. He was sending his complaints, he received, and this is some of the oldest writing we have look like.

Alison:

It's Akkadian cuneiform writing from 1750 BC. He kept every complaint. It's like, if you picked out the bad Yelp reviews for your business and you kept them and they stayed around for food, archeologists could see people roasting you on Yelp years and years later, except instead of being on Yelp, they had to carve them into clay tablets and ship them to you. you

Evan:

I still love it. I still look every time it's story. I love it.

Alison:

open season on in us, your jokes, and we will continue to make them. And I'm sorry, I'm not really

Evan:

No, we're not sorry about

Alison:

mention this like four other times,

Evan:

We're not

Alison:

but I will always make jokes about poor quality copper.

Evan:

I don't think you have any copper let alone poor quality.

Alison:

Well, I have my, we call it a nerd box. I have my, my

Evan:

I should mean a reef. Penny.

Alison:

That's plated, I guess that counts, that counts. If I count my copper wires for my electrical box.

Evan:

Yeah.

Alison:

All right. engineer here formerly an engineering student. When I was an engineering students, I took a class called electronic design in which we were issued something that we called to nerd boxes, which is basically just a kit for wiring, wiring plug boards with circuits.

Evan:

I have somewhere in the space behind me, some copper sheets from an art class. In college.

Alison:

I think counts. You do have copper. It's probably not the highest quality copper

Evan:

I was a television. And you think I was paying for the highest quality copper.

Alison:

No, you're getting it.

Evan:

This air.

Alison:

Yeah. I mean, they probably weren't ripping you off on it openly though.

Evan:

No, no. It was cheap,

Alison:

Probably straightforward about the quality of

Evan:

um,

Alison:

now that we're done making ENS, your jokes.

Evan:

for today.

Alison:

for tonight. We're done making in ACIAR jokes. what were we up to?

Evan:

So we were talking about the multiple phases of cocktails, how the plan, they went through a lot of things that were visible in the general culture.

Alison:

Tiki in the fifties and sixties. So we covered that cheap mixers in the seventies. You're talking, you know, there's, there's colors, there's disco, there's, there's all sorts of fun things going on. I'm not surprised. This is when, like, it makes sense that this is when more and more, you know, You're brightly colored mixers. You're easy access. You've got the rise, like early rise of a lot of plastics.

Evan:

Okay. I was just going to say, this book was from the 1970s. I'm wrong.

Alison:

when it's from

Evan:

1939,

Alison:

that seems slightly older.

Evan:

given the prohibition and in 33, this book belonged to my grandfather, my mother's father. So I'm the, one of the grandkids who's the most into, drinks. So my, when my grandmother found it, she gave it to me. but so it has recipes for Manhattan, Manhattan too. it has recipes for the president Cuban. That's a new one,

Alison:

Yup.

Evan:

the ditzy with STI. That was going to hold this up and say, is the seventies strict. No, it's not. It's thinking, wow.

Alison:

Not surprised that they'd be making something with a name like that. And the thirties.

Evan:

I do not endorse the name. I'm just stating it as a historical

Alison:

I know you're just stating statement, but, you know, anyways, back to where we are, Um, teeny everything in show mixing in the nineties,

Evan:

yeah, there was a Tom cruise movie where he was a flair bartender, a thing. That's the one where he's like sliding in his socks. Um, but, uh, Dan, I've not actually seen the movie. I'm also not the best movie watcher.

Alison:

Yeah. And then today this, yeah, Canon premixed a lot about Convenience, Being able to get it all in one.

Evan:

easy standardization as well.

Alison:

Yeah.

Evan:

Do you see white claw, everything, and now everyone makes the sell, sir. And they are

Alison:

Okay, please. Don't destroy the SNL guys. Have a great sketch. It is hilarious.

Evan:

wonderful. I love that. Those are some of the writers on the show that, have you seen their, sketch from last night?

Alison:

No, I haven't seen it yet.

Evan:

Oh, it was good. I wa earlier today I watched, last night's episode. it was

Alison:

saw the cold open, which, shouldn't bring us into another topic that we have, for the cold open may had, the Ukrainian choir Dunka

Evan:

Yeah.

Alison:

Um, performing a prayer for Ukraine.

Evan:

yeah. Instead of, I know SNL, most of the time they called open search jokes. This was not

Alison:

Yeah, but it was.

Evan:

because

Alison:

it's not something to joke about. It's something that's very real and very scary for a lot for the world. And, you know, putting a lot of people in immediate fear in immediate danger.

Evan:

a lot of innocent people in a democracy, in immediate fear and danger and a lot of people conscripted to fight for the whims of an autocrat.

Alison:

Yeah,

Evan:

but so yeah, don't buy Russian vodka right now. if it is American vodka, if it is vodka made in America, Canada free world by right people who fled Russia, very different issue,

Alison:

yeah,

Evan:

don't go around harassing Russians in America. Or most of our listeners are America because they are Russian odds. Are they fled a different oppressive regime in. The vast majority of Jews in America, flood oppressive regimes in Russia.

Alison:

Also, someone then I would like to direct you guys to, I know my siblings listened to this sometimes and they're probably, you know, expecting me say this, but, before I was born, my parents went on dates and eventually brought my older brother, to, anti-Soviet pro Soviet Julie injury rallies. and there was a band that was very big in those circles and very iconic in those circles, called and they have some fantastic music, and. A lot of it is about, about being a refugee about, about Jewish Jewish experiences. They have a song that's currently playing in my head right now. we are leaving mother Russia, and it just comes to mind at the moment. It's, it's, it's very iconic anti-Soviet and, and pro you know, pro refugee music.

Evan:

if I can, I will link that in the show notes.

Alison:

Yeah.

Evan:

Because, yeah, do not. I mean, the, how, how of the Russian economy functions is it is for the oligarchs and for platinum or Putin, who, as I mentioned is an autocrat. If you're siding with him over Ukraine or America, you're wrong, I have no problem saying that you are flat out wrong. Our country is not perfect. Ukraine's democracy. Isn't perfect. But if you're siting in favor of the autocratic, Flatiron, Putin over an actual democracy, yes, there there's been plenty of antisemitism in Ukraine throughout history. A lot of it has honestly been at the hands of the Russian regimes that have controlled the area. I've talked a lot about the pale of settlement here. The pale of settlement included Ukraine Ukraine at the time. Most of what is now Ukraine at the time was part of the Polish Lithuanian Commonwealth, before it was taken over by the Russian. There are plenty of video, plenty of places. You can go to learn more about that, but the antisemitism the Jews have experienced in Ukraine has been at its worst under Russian regimes.

Alison:

And there is currently a pretty large Jewish population in Ukraine.

Evan:

Yes. Many of them were fleeing. Many of whom are staying flat, floated mirrors. The Lensky for anyone who doesn't know is Jewish.

Alison:

Yeah.

Evan:

So it, so if, if you're saying, oh, he's trying, if you will have heard Putin's propaganda, trying to Dean not SIFY Ukraine, they democratically elected someone Jewish to be precedent.

Alison:

Yeah. Worlds is a scary place.

Evan:

before we were talking, before we started recording, I mentioned that of the music I've been listening to recently, a lot of it has been Tom layer's songs that are very apocalyptic. They're comedic, but apocalyptic, the world is. Scary right now that one could also draw on the

Alison:

And, and it,

Evan:

Oh, I bet.

Alison:

and I am scared out of my mind. That's not how the song

Evan:

That is

Alison:

how I feel

Evan:

absolutely. I need, I need to send you a video about that song.

Alison:

I don't. Did I say this before or after the podcast started? I think, I don't know. I'm gonna make it through this year. If it kills me the mountain

Evan:

Yeah. That, that one also should be on that playlist

Alison:

I am going to make it through this year if it kills me.

Evan:

it's only February.

Alison:

Yeah.

Evan:

Yeah.

Alison:

Anyways, so is wonderful. It's a bunch of like cantors and I think they're like lawyers and doctors and like miscellaneous professions. it's just a bunch of friends who started this band and they have some really great music. They have some beautiful harmonies. They're just a bunch of guys who started to band together, and saying it at Soviet Jewry rallies or, and stuff. they have music about finding somebody who's a Morano, somebody who's a crypto Jew who never knew it. and this guy is dating a girl and he learns that she always candles Shabbat candles in a secret room in the back house. so they have a lot of great music. they also have like a great version of with some nice harmonies, but anyways, if you want some, nice, interesting Jewish music for today, that's my recommendation for today. I've got, I've got lots of unusual. Jewish music racks That we can get to another time, which I think actually might be a fun episode

Evan:

That would be,

Alison:

Jewish musics or like,

Evan:

if you ever heard ain't Kelo Hanno and Ladino. I know we've talked about, probably talked about it before and it's definitely been in tangents Latino.

Alison:

know if I've heard that one. I mean, is probably the most famous LeadDyno song

Evan:

I'll send.

Alison:

most AASCU is like us.

Evan:

but Rosa Lazarus, Shauna services, I've been to the Charlotte bend to several times. They had someone sing it in the Callahan in Ladino. and it's very beautiful. I mean, it's a beautiful song in Hebrew anyway, but,

Alison:

Yeah.

Evan:

um,

Alison:

Hm, Hm. Hm. Hm. I feel like, like a solid 60% of that time, you hear that song sung by like a bunch of third graders or younger.

Evan:

Uh, yeah.

Alison:

yeah, which is very cute, but does not like make it the easiest song for you to get some really pretty, pretty renditions of,

Evan:

that is

Alison:

and I'm not surprised that there are really pretty renditions of it.

Evan:

I'll send you a link later, but back to'em unless you, I mean, they're also popular drinks. I've been having the last word a lot, which feels like a very apocalyptically named drink.

Alison:

to me. So fire up that funnel mine. Give me one last drink. When the sun comes up, I will leave with that. Sorry, this, uh, another thing that's been on my playlist a lot, um,

Evan:

um,

Alison:

Anyway, who's next, on it. We have non-con through our list.

Evan:

no, but the, the, the rest of the list looks bigger than it is.

Alison:

Oh, uh, we've definitely talked about, okay. Anyways, uh, on the list, by the way, it says don't buy Russian vodka. So I guess we're going to assume That was. the last thing that,

Evan:

Yes.

Alison:

international bartenders association has an 150 drink list. Every bartender should know unforgettable.

Evan:

And it's broken. It's broken into three categories, which are the unforgettable, the con the contemporary class that's and the new age drinks

Alison:

Seems reasonable.

Evan:

is. And there's a lot of fun stuff in there. Most strengths you've probably heard of are most kind of traditional drinks you've heard of are on this list. At one point, I had it memorized and I've forgotten it because it wasn't useful. And I had more important things to learn.

Alison:

Yup.

Evan:

but a lot of those drinks are in one of the books I reached back to the pile that has fallen over well away from the microphone. The 12 bottle bar.

Alison:

Anyways, where we were before?

Evan:

Yes.

Alison:

not on the list. We've definitely mentioned it before. I don't know if much. Yeah. We've definitely talked about this before. I think we, I think it came up in punches. but snippet of Jewish history, I don't know how to pronounce his last name. It's Shalom. It's

Evan:

It is, it is every time I've heard someone pronounce that it's Shalom.

Alison:

Okay. Well, anyways, Joe Shalom and Egyptian to created the Tiki drinks suffering bastard during the war. So, uh,

Evan:

Yeah.

Alison:

presumably world war two.

Evan:

That is correct. Uh, the suffering bastard to help fuel a lot of the fight against Rommel.

Alison:

So.

Evan:

However, after the war, wasn't so great to be a Jew in Egypt. So he left.

Alison:

So anyways, we've brought him up before and I think I've said the same thing about his last name every time, probably. but there are videos you can watch on him. I believe we've linked a video to him before. I'm pretty sure we would link like a, a mini documentary

Evan:

yeah, we, we link to video on from distinguished spirits if I recall, which is another great YouTube channel for cocktails. Oh, not very active.

Alison:

Evan mentioned earlier six types of cocktails, codex old-fashioned, martini daiquiri, sidecar, high bell flip that that is seven

Evan:

yup.

Alison:

anyways.

Evan:

No cadets is there should be a coal in there instead of a comma it's sets

Alison:

Okay. Anyways, six times. Of of classic

Evan:

classic cocktails. They use different ratios. Some like the Manhattan use a pretty standard ratio of two parts, one part half part, which I know parts should be pull numbers. So theoretically you could call it four to one, but they, everyone I know calls it

Alison:

cocktails. Aren't like, I never see cocktails written that way. I see it a lot of the time them with halfs. And I think it just makes it easier because like, you can have, like, if you've got a, a jigger, you've got a half there, so it's, it's easy to do with house and have a two, one half. It makes a lot of sense.

Evan:

Yeah. no, I mean, so your drink effectively followed that ratio,

Alison:

My

Evan:

the sour, but I mean,

Alison:

yeah, it's not no, I was

Evan:

not Manhattan, but it,

Alison:

sour ratio is two parts. Spirit is three parts, spirit,

Evan:

yeah. Sorry. Yes.

Alison:

part sugar,

Evan:

Yeah. So

Alison:

then you can add an egg white, if you want to clarify it, mine was perfectly cloudy, perfectly delicious. honestly, if you're making yourself a sour, I would recommend you, have some Tums on the side. They're very tasty. They are, this was absolutely delicious. And I'm glad I made it keep it away from children because it tastes like lemonade. it is very acidic. And if you like me or Jewish and have a bad stomach rigid are things that tend to go together.

Evan:

As we've taught

Alison:

Yes, I recommend it.

Evan:

a good recommendation. yeah. Another common ratio is equal parts. So 1, 1, 1, or one, one on one. so mine and groany was it that, the last word, which I mentioned earlier is gin chartreuse, lime juice, and Lazzarato Christino

Alison:

I have always made side cars using that ratio to,

Evan:

yeah. I mean, aside card normally is closer to a two to one. but it can vary.

Alison:

Yeah. but

Evan:

Yeah.

Alison:

if you make yourself a tide pod, it's 1, 1, 1.

Evan:

Yeah. Especially if you're, if you're doing a frozen one, I would bring it close to that 1, 1, 1, and the thing for a lot of these. Figure out why figure out a basic recipe and mess around with the flavors. Enjoy it. There's a lot of, a lot of ways to change it. Get good quality ingredients. They don't have to be crazy, but good quality ingredients and have fun.

Alison:

Yeah. That's, that's really the whole thing.

Evan:

Yeah. All right. We'll link in the show notes, there will be linked to both articles and videos you can read as well as the link of some of the books that were in the pile behind me that has since fallen down, including the 12 bottle bar. It talks about the drunken botanist before got Smuggler's Cove, which is all about Tiki.

Alison:

I really can't recommend the drunk And mountain the off it's really such a good book.

Evan:

this book,

Alison:

I've mentioned it so many times on this podcast and it continues to be an excellent reference for me.

Evan:

I now have a copy

Alison:

Great.

Evan:

and I just got this book, the aviary, which is a Chicago bar in Chicago. This is kind of. Haute cuisine cocktails.

Alison:

I think it's just whole cuisine. I think the T is silent. I'm not

Evan:

It would be, but, the term I'm more looking for molecular gastronomy would be a better term. Is these Silicon molecular gastronomy cocktails. and oh my God, they looked

Alison:

It's a beautiful book.

Evan:

Let me pull up. I mean, that's not a very interesting photo, but like the art is also well done.

Alison:

Oh yeah,

Evan:

That's what I need to make.

Alison:

yeah. Anyways, I am looking at Evan flip through this, the, the pictures of this book. It does look like a beautiful book. Even the cover is really beautiful,

Evan:

Yeah. It's it is very well done, but it's also gigantic. So it is very awkward for me to,

Alison:

very nice.

Evan:

Oh, but it is a beautiful book. there are a lot of books. I will list them in the show notes. I don't have much else.

Alison:

Yeah. I mean either. I actually, one other thing I have not proved in a while because I was moving and things came in the way, but what is that next step on your list of things to.

Evan:

So I think next on my list is probably a, probably I'm going to do another Mead, which is, will be relatively fast. I need to get yeast. I also haven't brewed in a while because I was moving to Texas and I need to get, I need to get Bernice then despite the fact that I live in one of the largest Metro areas in the country, there's one local home brewing store and it is a 40 minute drive minimum away from me.

Alison:

Not so convenient.

Evan:

And they're closed on Sundays.

Alison:

Yeah. My local Homebrew store is also closed on Sundays. It's very inconvenient. I used to be able to go during my lunchtime, but now that I have moved about 15 minutes away from my work where I was living before, the amount of time it would take me to get to the Humphrey store is significantly longer.

Evan:

Yeah, no. So

Alison:

bit of Oprah.

Evan:

I need to get a little bit more, honey, and I need to get some yeast and I plan on probably doing that again, and then hopefully I will be getting the equipment to do beer itself.

Alison:

Very nice.

Evan:

So that's some interesting beer ideas. I want to try.

Alison:

Nice. I, I told my roommate she could pick what was next. and her, the first thing she, she said either she wants lemon and something floral or herbal, or vanilla and something. she has this vanilla lime candle that she likes one. so I stopped by a local spice shop. It's called savory spice. they are nationwide. They have a great website, but also if you're lucky enough like me to be, to live near one of their stores, really great place to just like go and talk to people about flavors. they've been super helpful with that. I bought a whole bunch of lavender and I'm going to do that. I have also been, tasting, flowers from local Magnolia trees because apparently if you catch them in exactly the right time, they taste like ginger, I have so far not caught them at the right time. so I've just been tasting, which is, I mean, I'm, I'm, it's like very obvious just walking around neighborhood, at least that I'm not the only one doing this. It's like a, my friend makes tea from them or they're like, it's a thing people do around here apparently where you make things from Magnolia

Evan:

Yeah,

Alison:

I did not know that, but anyways, I,

Evan:

but I, I don't know. I haven't seen much local edible produce in my walks around here

Alison:

if I do.

Evan:

unless I want to eat bamboo.

Alison:

some, Yeah. If I do manage to find some, I'll try and do something with it. If not, then I'll skip it. It's kind of a weird thing for me to be doing anyways. But like you see other people walking around, tasting the flowers, being like, oh, can I make tea about tea from this yet? Not yet. So local foraging is cool.

Evan:

We've talked about that with the, Mulberry, me wanting to broom over right before I moved,

Alison:

Yeah.

Evan:

not having a chance. I haven't seen any Mulberry tree.

Alison:

Yeah. It is no longer purple beauty Berry season. But I have seen in some of my homebrewing Facebook groups that people use this Berry, it just like grows wild here in the Carolinas.

Evan:

Oh, that's

Alison:

It's very bright. Purple it's I've tasted them. They're not like you can just pick one right off of Bush and give it all, all rents. it has very little flavor, so I haven't, I don't actually have any intention to do anything with it, but people you can do it. You know what, if you are a forger, give us a shout. We would love to hear from you. I think it would be really cool if we could do a, an episode on forging.

Evan:

I would love to talk more about foraging on learn more, especially, cause I don't know what I can forward around here and it doesn't look like much.

Alison:

that would be super cool.

Evan:

Yeah.

Alison:

Anyone else got anything else?

Evan:

have nothing else today. I mean, we can always talk. I'm sure we can tell with more if we don't need to record at all.

Alison:

This has been a little bit of a long episode. Just a tiny bit. I think we had a couple of opinions here and there

Evan:

Just a few.

Alison:

just one or two

Evan:

Yup.

Alison:

anyways.

Evan:

Anyway,

Alison:

Well, I haven't really brewed recently, but she brewed Hebrew. And now it's time for you to brew happy fermenting folks.