Episode 22: Gluten Free Brewing

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Evan 0:00

Welcome to episode 22 brews Hebrews the Jewish fermenting podcast, where we hope to discuss all things home brewing and fermenting. Today, we are talking about gluten free brewing. I'm your host, Evan Harris. And with me today is my co-host Allison Shea.

Alison 0:13

Hey there, how you doing?

Evan 0:16

I'm doing your J uh, nothing to get into most of it on the podcast bender and okay. How about you?

Alison 0:23

I'm good. got a glass or something interesting here today. it is an old vine Zin, an old vines Zinfandel, which is, well, it's exactly what it sounds like pretty much as, as Zinfandel vines get older, they end up with smaller and smaller clusters of grapes, on the vines and those grapes get more flavorful, more intense. And I think did I say smaller, they get a lot smaller. So you end up with that. you? end up with a much smaller yield, but a much more flavorful yield as, as a Zinfandel gets, this is old Zinfandel. Vine gets older. So, they're not super easy to find, but I didn't happen to come across this one and grabbed a couple of bottles and it is really lovely. it's currently, and it's got the, it's got current notes and, in black cherry notes and very spicy undertones and it's really, it's really a lovely, complex wine. And I got it for a great deal.

Evan 1:35

Oh, nice.

Alison 1:36

I love a good deal

Evan 1:37

yeah, no, I, I love, I really like a good old vines in a similarly, a really strong bodied Cabernet, like a, a cab Sauvignon. Uh, I re

Alison 1:50

another bottle that's not open, but I have sitting right here is a fun. Yes, it is trader Joe's. this is trader Joe's diamond reserve. there were a lot of news articles about this earlier in, like October, November. I think it was November mostly. this is Kevin May seven young stags leap district, Napa valley, 2020, which, shouldn't stand out because stags leap valley is one very famous, for making red ones, specifically cabs, very famous for the grapes themselves and also for their techniques. but the other thing let's note about, Oh, about them from the year 2020 is that they were really badly hit by the California wildfire. So, for this bottle, which I, have two of them, then I managed to have, uh,

Evan 2:45

Oh, nice.

Alison 2:45

have not opened either one yet.

Evan 2:47

I haven't looked for that at my local trader Joe's, but there is one walking distance away.

Alison 2:53

it anymore. It's long gone. Unfortunately, really it disappears, but here's the thing. because of the wildfires, these Stag's leap, wineries and vineyards were rushing together of all of their grapes. and a lot of vineyards sold them as just so that they could get them out. They thought everything was going to be stored. They weren't going to be able to make anyone that year and they'd rather just sell off their yields quickly then. And then have everything get destroyed and not get anything. So, a trader Joe's distributor, or winemaker got their hands on this big crop of stags leap cab grapes, and made wine out of them. And, because it was through trader Joe's trader Joe's ended up with a somewhat small quantity of, of wines that would normally sell for upwards of $200 and sold them for 1999.

Evan 3:59

oh, that's a very good deal. Now.

Alison 4:01

So when you,

Evan 4:02

I love trader Joe's and their wine. One, one thing I was never able to do, but I wanted to do an undergrad. Never did. I still should just do it. I've always wanted to do a trader Joe's tasting menu.

Alison 4:12

oh, what would that entail?

Evan 4:16

Entailed buying one bottle of every variety of two buck. Chuck probably do reds one time and whites and other, covering the bottles and tasting them and ranking them. Blindly.

Alison 4:27

I would do that. I would be now.

Evan 4:29

We just need to find it just need to be in the same place to do it.

Alison 4:32

Yeah. Or

Evan 4:33

more fun.

Alison 4:34

it's to back check, but I it would be interesting if, if anybody is interested in doing this with us, maybe, it would be kind of,

Evan 4:42

it's about, 50 bucks plus tax.

Alison 4:45

Yeah. but we could, we could maybe pick also, like we could pick a small selection of they're like $7 and under peanut ratios for three buck, Chuck, and maybe a couple of other things. And

Evan 5:02

like one sub 10 and one $20 bottle or something like that.

Alison 5:07

Yeah. I think, I think because it's trader Joe's. Probably be like the three bucks check that they have like four or $5 lines, something that low, something that is at $10 on something. So that's maybe 1520.

Evan 5:21

So I'm wine, of course, this all relates to gluten gluten-free ruined by the way. Cause it's all wine wine is gluten-free. but, that reminds me of a story from my dad. so as I may have mentioned on the podcast, he's an orthopedic surgeon

Alison 5:34

I don't know if you've ever specifically mentioned that. I know you've said he was a doctor, but I don't remember knowing that he was an orthopedic surgeon.

Evan 5:42

I guess I've not mentioned that on the podcast, that is not exactly a proprietary information, but uh, he's an orthopedic surgeon

Alison 5:49

I Jewish doctor

Evan 5:55

Yes. Adopter surprise, surprise.

Alison 6:00

must be so proud.

Evan 6:03

Well, I, my grandmother was a psychoanalyst, so she was also a doctor., and when I drive

Alison 6:08

So many nice Jewish doc does.

Evan 6:14

Sir doctors will give gifts around the winter holidays frequently for their referring physicians. Basically, you, you you've sent us pate, your general practitioner. You've sent us patients and for my dad, he'll get them from people he sends to PT and the such, et cetera. It's a business gift, not, not uncommon in many businesses, and surgeons frequently, or, well, I shouldn't say just surgeons, but doctors frequently sent wine and gift like a gift basket includes a bottle of wine, so they need to buy a good number of bottles. So they don't want to spend too much. So what my dad and his, the partners in his surgery and his group did, was they went out and all of them picked the bottle from Costco because they knew they could get a good number under $20. And their wives will pick the bottle without them knowing the price. And all the wives picked under $10 looking to find the cheap, effectively the cheapest wine they thought would be decent. And then they taste, tested them without looking at the prices until they were done. The winner was a $7 bottle of wine

Alison 7:25

Oh,

Evan 7:26

for one year w called Razor's edge. Another. It was a $10 bottle called educated guests.

Alison 7:33

that's funny.

Evan 7:33

So for a group of surgeons, Razor's edge is a wonderful name for a bottle for a mine gift.

Alison 7:40

yeah.

Evan 7:41

so you can get good wine cheap.

Alison 7:42

Yeah. And also a lot of bottles of wine. like, there will be a ton of variation from year to year, just based off of climate and based off of soil conditions that you're based off of all sorts of things, where they might be in like a fertilization and crop rotation cycle, there's all sorts of different things. So one year a vineyard might produce something that, that would be like taste tested in valued at $11. And the next year they might produce something that might be valued at $450 or a hundred dollars. It really depends a lot on what, what they get from year to year. like I said, soil conditions,

Evan 8:24

all conditions, whether

Alison 8:25

a big one, whether

Evan 8:27

wet weather and water, one of the ones that's really common is, or not necessarily common, but some years you can let them effectively ice on the vine and then harvest them. You get ice wine, but that's something you need the right conditions for. If it doesn't have. No wine.

Alison 8:41

So I've actually had one lovely Icewine, that it's a kosher Icewine and I got it off of online kosher wines.com, not an ed, but also a great place to get kosher wines for a good deal if you're looking. but I found this kosher ice wine, it was a, 3 75 mil bottle, which seems to be pretty standard, from Niagara.

Evan 9:06

Interesting.

Alison 9:07

the Niagara region, which is like Northwestern, New York and Southern Ontario. Niagara falls in case you're wondering that area, they do produce wines there and they produce kosher ice wines sometimes. And I had it. It's lovely. quite sweet. It reminded me of a saw turn. Yeah. I liked it a lot. I have only seen it pretty much. The once I got myself a bottle and my brother, a couple of bottles and I haven't, I, I actually think he still has it. but I opened mine when my dad came to visit me here and we both thought it was lovely, inter unusual. It was something that neither of us had ever had before. but very much reminded us of a Saturn.

Evan 9:56

That's really no. And another thing with kind of like quality of the year when it's a very good year, as far as quality, not necessarily yield in Portugal in the door. Oh, valley specifically where they make pork is the only time you'll see a vintage port. So you not a port with a number of years on it, but it's a specific harvest year. And those are one of the few products that improve with age in the bottle on an industrial scale. Most industrial wine you buy. Once it's in the bottle. It's stable ports will improve with age, especially vintage port. Unfortunately I've tried looking 1993. The year I was born was not a vintage year. I think 94 was. Um,

Alison 10:34

I am a 94 baby

Evan 10:36

I know. Um, yeah, the listeners.

Alison 10:40

in 90.

Evan 10:41

but so there, but they vary sometimes you'll have four or five years in a row, all vintage and then sometimes you'll have 10 without one. So I think the only vintage year in the eighties was 1980.

Alison 10:52

Does 1980 count. I've heard this debated before. This is a tangent. Oh my God. We have to give an update on my tangent from

Evan 11:01

oh yes, we do ours after we recorded

Alison 11:11

Okay.

Evan 11:12

hours after recording.

Alison 11:16

I am, uh, oh God, I cannot believe that happened literally hours after.

Evan 11:26

But that was a tangent I did keep in. So it's not a holding for tangents episode.

Alison 11:29

Okay. So pause on everything else we were talking about. We were talking about once we were talking about vintages gluten-free things, hold up. Last time I gave her a rant. Last episode, I gave her a rant about daylight savings time and the sunshine protection act. As, uh, originally passed by the state of Florida a couple of years ago. Oh hour is after we recorded the last episode hours after like the next morning, the us Senate voted on the sunshine protection act of 2022, which is basically them taking Florida's sunshine protection act from a couple of years ago, which passed and all of Florida state legislature, uh, the U S Senate voted on it for the entirety of the United States and it passed. So if it passes in the house of representatives, then. We will no longer be on standard time. The U S as a whole will switch to being permanently on what we currently call daylight savings time, but would probably be called something like sunshine time.

Evan 12:59

Yeah. So I've learned a few things about this, that, first of all, apparently a lot of, first of all, it's just incredible that it was. And I guess you're going to claim that you deserve all the muffins and bagels in the land you drink from the cadre of glory.

Alison 13:12

But this is very, very bi-partisan.

Evan 13:14

Um, but so apparently a lot of senators didn't know that it was being voted on. Didn't know what was being voted on. So like it kind of slipped through, so it may not be quite as bipartisan as we originally thought.

Alison 13:27

well. The thing is that states, or you got a couple of blue dogs in there. Um, Christians, cinema, cinema. I've never know how to say her last

Evan 13:38

I believe it's Triston cinema. I could be

Alison 13:40

Anyways, cinema, who is notoriously a blue dog. Also known as somebody who is nominally, a Democrat, but often votes, with the Republican block. well she's from Arizona And, Arizona does not like daylight savings time. So she was very for it. And then you have the Florida senators who are the ones, Marco Rubio, I believe, who actually sponsored the bill. yeah. brought it to Congress in the first place. and then everybody else is like, this is, this is reasonable.

Evan 14:17

So what

Alison 14:18

Arizona and Florida, the two states that are, kind of the most pro this happening Arizona does not currently do daylight savings. And Florida has been trying to stay on it for years. the we're the biggest advocates for.

Evan 14:33

but the Navajo nation does do daylight savings time, which is mostly in Arizona. So crossing Arizona, you may have to flip your clock back and forth significantly.

Alison 14:42

Yeah. So we'll see what happens with that. But, basically it's very good for everybody's sleep cycles. I'm very excited about it. It is a nice big finger to Benjamin Franklin, who admittedly it did make sense when he, when he, when he tried to get it implemented back in the 17 hundreds, but it's no longer, very helpful for the rest of us. Thank you very

Evan 15:05

That's right. So I, I have a few other kinds of points. Apparently we tried this in the seventies during the height of the oil crisis. Uh, and we were going to do a two year test run and Americans hated it. What? I

Alison 15:20

it wants to do a two year test run.

Evan 15:22

I have no idea what that, that's what,

Alison 15:24

it makes more sense if this passes, by the way, it won't. Right now we're on daylight savings time. We won't. Right. Is that

Evan 15:32

yeah, we will, we will fall back in late October, early November, spring forward, next March. And that's

Alison 15:40

then never again,

Evan 15:41

If it. passes.

Alison 15:43

If it passes.

Evan 15:44

What I would expect to see though, is I would actually see a bit of a realignment in what states are and what time zone. And that is more than that is honestly a good thing. Michigan would move to central time. Minnesota might move to mountain time, which is misnamed, but, but the states that are on the far, the further west side of many of these times zones may move over one. And what I would also hope to see is business hours and school hours, et cetera, just get adjusted.

Alison 16:12

Yeah, It'll be interesting to see in areas where people live on the borders of states. Like you have, there are cities. But people live in. I live in one of them, for example, I live right near the border between north and South Carolina. we would not have an issue with this, but depending on where those move, people who live, who do live in a border zone, may see shifts. That would be like, oh, you're crossing a time zone on your daily commute. And I'm sure there's people who do it now, but it would be interesting to see how much bigger of an issue that becomes

Evan 16:48

that's correct.

Alison 16:50

that being said. This would also result in, Uh, like Evan mentioned the oil crisis and how this was first brought up during your oil crisis. But because we are shifting because of the way that, um, the clocks shift with this plan, there would be a lot of energy saved in terms of like basically powering lights and things like that.

Evan 17:13

yeah, be an energy saved, empowering lights though. Uh, estimates range, range, widely, and how much energy it actually would be, but it would be, it would be significantly better by just not changing, whatever, whatever choice we make not changing is the bigger issue is the.

Alison 17:32

Yeah,

Evan 17:33

Um, and so that's my, that is my stance on it. Um,

Alison 17:37

which I mean fair,

Evan 17:40

if someone, who does thoroughly enjoy neurology,

Alison 17:44

uh, neurology. I feel like I need, I'm obligated to ask you to explain

Evan 17:51

the study of, uh, clocks watches and time,

Alison 17:56

Uh, I saw a great meme that I may have sent to you of it. I'm not sure if I did

Evan 18:01

which one is it? Something yell Nasir.

Alison 18:04

know it was. Ian nastier joke, but it is always open season on an Aussie, as we've said many times before on this podcast. No, I saw a meme that was like difficulty of changing various items for daylight savings time. And it was like, uh, your phone. Does it automatically, uh, your clock in your car? Uh, or I don't remember exactly how it went, but sundial move one house to the left.

Evan 18:40

I don't think you sent that to me, but I have seen it. And it's wonderful.

Alison 18:43

It was very funny. I'll see if I can find it and send out. Cause I'm doing a horrifically bad job of describing it right now.

Evan 18:50

that sounds good to me. No,

Alison 18:52

What? It was very funny

Evan 18:53

I still can't believe like within hours of recording,

Alison 18:57

hours I want.

Evan 19:00

you have the gift of prophecy.

Alison 19:02

Oh, another meme. I'm going to send another name to your oven to, uh, to link in the show notes, which is, uh, basically it's a small child holding a Dodge ball at that to throw it at some other people. And the other small children are labeled random users on the internet trying to be funny. And the child's throwing the Dodge ball as Apollo and the dodgeball is the gift of prophecy.

Evan 19:31

That.

Alison 19:32

That is the second time it's come up today.

Evan 19:35

That is wonderful.

Alison 19:37

last time. Well, I guess both times I'm one of the children, was something work-related that came up with and my boss, That name, and it was painfully accurate, very amusingly accurate though.

Evan 19:51

That is hilarious. Oh no, I, I still can't believe it, but

Alison 19:58

anyways. brewing.

Evan 20:01

Yeah. So,

Alison 20:02

the reason why we were going to talk about it today, wines. Yes. But basically a Passover is about to happen. I mean, Passover starts in two weeks. the next episode that we do, will take place days before Passover.

Evan 20:19

That's right. So if you have any Passover questions, send them to us.

Alison 20:22

Yes. Happy to answer any Passover questions. Don't know if we will actually know the answers or a fall,

Evan 20:28

Yeah, we, neither of us are rabbis. We're we're not, we're not rabbinical sources. but we didn't.

Alison 20:34

my usual go-to for cash-rich questions, is ask my dad and he knows whenever I come to him with a question, it's going to be a weird one. I've asked him some very strange Kashmiri questions over there. And sometimes he sits on that. Yeah, I'm going to have to ask somebody else

Evan 20:53

No, I normally go to like the bod.org or my uncle who's a rabbi.

Alison 20:57

Yeah.

Evan 20:59

but what was the thing? You know what I mean? It's the rat the, in the off, there's a lot of debate over what, over specifics of cost fruit. So if you were asking the most random question, you can think up, somebody has come up with something at least tangential I'm. Sure. Which is part of why I love, because no matter what your argument there's going to be something related that they can, that the are a reasonable related argument. Something, I kind of love about coming up with where questions and asking you rabbis.

Alison 21:25

Yeah. If you throw a baby off a roof and it lands on a man walking on the sword of a man walking by who is liable for the death of the baby?

Evan 21:40

I believe it would be you throwing off the roof. Would it not, but I don't know. I'm pretty sure that one's in the tonight. Isn't

Alison 21:46

no, it's in the. Yeah, it? is, shortly afterwards followed by one of my all time. Favorite questions in the Talmud. If a man falls off a roof and lands in a woman, does it count as Leveritt marriage? And here is the real kicker, then follows that question.

Evan 22:10

Okay.

Alison 22:10

it a regular or an irregular wind that knocked him off the building and custom to land the woman? Is it Leverett marriage?

Evan 22:21

Oh, my job. Oh, anyone who says Jews, listen, follow blindly. And don't question anything clearly. He's never met Jews, which everything.

Alison 22:39

No idea why anybody is bothering to question it in the first place.

Evan 22:44

What was the head? I don't know. I was going to make the comments about drafts being kosher or not. They are kosher. It's just hard to slaughter it.

Alison 22:51

A Musar as well, also hard to slaughter.

Evan 22:55

Easier than a draft.

Alison 22:57

I actually don't think so. I do know that like every once in a while there used to be in New York, like every several years there, there would be like a very expensive dinner for tasting where kosher meats. And one of them was draft. I remember hearing about this when I was in high school.

Evan 23:19

Well, so th the reason that it would

Alison 23:21

and they do it.

Evan 23:22

to coastally slaughter a moose is that you can, is that the equipment exists for slaughtering like bison and bison and moose are relatively similar size.

Alison 23:33

I think the problem is not. Is it easy? To like actually do the chef thing. I think the question is, is it easier to get a moose

Evan 23:42

oh yeah, no, that's the pro that's the problem. I was talking to you about the chef, the chef thing, which for anyone who does know is the term for kosher slaughter. and there's a lot of ethical things about kosher meat consumption. Would you, if you're looking for ethical meat by kosher.

Alison 23:59

Yeah, It's it's the laws surrounding kosher meat, have a lot to do with making sure that, the animal is slaughtered without pain, that the animal is treated relatively well. obviously I'm not going to argue that that, you know, in humane animal practices don't happen with kosher meat, but you can't have a blemished animal. You can't injure the animal in any way. the animal has to be uninjured when it is shot. And they inspected. And if it's not like a healthy animal, if it's been injured in any way or damaged, then it's it kosher in youth you've wasted a bunch of money. So,

Evan 24:44

So like th there are baseline not gonna say it's perfect obviously, but there are baselines around the treatment of animals and the slaughter of animals for Kosh root that are, do not exist for the mass market.

Alison 25:00

yeah.

Evan 25:00

so if you are looking at that as something to consider, and also because of these basic requirements, the meat is frequently a higher.

Alison 25:07

Yeah, it also, I believe it's also soaked insulted, which, historically has meant that you get fewer diseases from it.

Evan 25:15

correct. There's a lot of stuff like that.

Alison 25:19

yeah.

Evan 25:21

And you would, and you shouldn't need that at least symbolically for Passover. but Passover for anyone who doesn't know, is the celebration still feels like their own term, but it's the remembrance of our, of the Jews, Exodus from Egypt.

Alison 25:38

Yeah, it is also, which I feel like it should be brought up, especially in reference to this being a podcast about brewing. there are three major harvest festivals in Judaism. Passover is the first one of the year. it takes place during the month of Nissan, which is the beginning of the Jewish year. sorry. It's the, it's the first month of the year,

Evan 26:02

No, but it's not the car. Nissan.

Alison 26:06

No, it's not the car It is the first month of the Jewish year. there are multiple like new year's in Judaism and this one is the new year for the month.

Evan 26:16

the third one we've talked about.

Alison 26:18

Yeah, we've talked about a lot of them. We're not, we're probably not going to talk about. the, the new year for the Kings. That's kind of a legislative thing.

Evan 26:26

Yeah.

Alison 26:26

but anyways, as I was saying, in that, in that sense, Passover is the first one. And I guess you can think about it as the first one in the cycle of, of the growing calendar, I guess. So, to be shot is pretty much the beginning, beginning of, the nine months of the year. That's devoted to agriculture, in the, in the Lavant, and Passover is the first of the three big harvest festivals. So in addition to celebrating Passover, Passover is also, celebrating, stage of the harvest and you get to a show out, which is seven weeks later in, you're the barley harvest. And then you come to the fall and you have to coat a, which is the one where we sit in the little grass huts and we leave and we wait for

Evan 27:21

We shake some leaves of God.

Alison 27:23

yes, we shake leaves God and sit in grass huts. and that is the big end of the harvest.

Evan 27:30

Yeah.

Alison 27:31

So.

Evan 27:32

But why gluten-free is important for this? And we'll talk more about what. That's time, is that for Passover, you are not supposed to have any of what is referred to as comments, or 11. So of course this is a brewing podcast, so we're like, you can't exactly make bread. but you, there are commandments around having to drink wine for Passover. of course, safe medical safety comes first. We've discussed that, I think several times,

Alison 28:01

Yes, please drink responsibly. Passover I think is we just celebrated Purim, which I think is a good time to say, please drink responsibly even though tradition dictates otherwise. but also Passover during the Seder. It is traditional should drink four cups of wine throughout the night. So, I mean, my recommendation would be, make sure they're small cups of your all lightweight and make sure to drink lots of water. Well, it's a water. Excuse me.

Evan 28:30

And plenty of Pharaoh center. Cause that's a lot tastier than a lot of the other things served at the Seder.

Alison 28:36

Yeah, but it is much wine. the Passover Seder does cap off was a bunch of drinking songs. they are like, they are drinking songs,

Evan 28:46

They're taught to children, but they're drinking

Alison 28:48

they're doing the science, and then in my household, We always end it with my brother singing, find God. Yeah. Shout out to my brother who listens to this podcast. but you hear it as a kid and you think, oh, it's, it's a weird little song about, dad buying his kid, baby goat and go getting eaten. And then whatever happens after that. But thinking about it, not as small child remembering sequence of events and thinking of it as like bunch of people sitting around a pub drinking beer, it very much fits into that scheme.

Evan 29:28

Oh, yeah, it is the right type of song and the right cadence that, that reminds me of something, that I have in the show notes so that you at least would enjoy though. There's not as many hockey players on it. That should be the Canadian Jewish news via their podcast, mench warmers, which I'm pretty sure I've mentioned before. And it's wonderful. it ha has right now voting for the God. Yeah. So God, you means goat in Hebrew. and so this stands for the greatest all-time diaspora Yiddish athlete.

Alison 29:56

Okay. mark Spitz.

Evan 29:58

so he's on there, as a Subaru

Alison 30:01

Oh, okay. Yes.

Evan 30:02

super. So Sandy Kofax is another one on there. Allie Raisman and carry strong.

Alison 30:09

Yes, I did not realize the Kerry stern was Jewish.

Evan 30:13

I had forgotten, and I don't recognize any of the other names, but several of them are baseball players.

Alison 30:18

Okay. Yeah. I wouldn't want to, I know like three baseball players.

Evan 30:24

Yeah. But that was just something that reminded me in this tangent filled episode, which I need.

Alison 30:31

Yeah. what else was on the list here?

Evan 30:33

So we've talked a little bit,

Alison 30:35

notes here.

Evan 30:35

have show notes that are, a little bit, all over the place, but so we've talked about wine and then previous episodes we've talked about Alison making her own wine.

Alison 30:44

Not that hard, pretty tasty did not age well, do not age your homemade scupper. No longer say

Evan 30:51

Good to know.

Alison 30:53

it was, it was, Yeah. it didn't age.

Evan 30:56

I don't have any wine open naturally here. I should stop at my trader Joe's and pitch.

Alison 31:03

Yeah, this is not from trader Joe's. This is,

Evan 31:07

there are also good liquor stores around me.

Alison 31:09

yeah, This was like gnarly Oaks or something like that.

Evan 31:13

so this one was actually not bottled, not aged in a wine cast, but this is Israeli whiskey.

Alison 31:21

Nice. I feel, I think you might've showed those to me.

Evan 31:24

I probably have my dad. I was in San Antonio over the weekend and my dad and I opened up a different bottle from the same distillery milk and honey, for anyone who's interested in their whiskey though. It is technically gluten-free because gluten does not survive. The distillation process is not kosher for Passover because it is made from grain.

Alison 31:41

Yeah.

Evan 31:42

but so it's basically is grain. So any wheat rye. Oh, and depending on who you ask, there's another category called TT notes, which are things that you could confuse with comments.

Alison 31:55

So Kitney ode is, I'm an Ashkenazi Jew, as I have definitely met

Evan 32:00

SMI.

Alison 32:01

kidney out, refers to anything that like, kind of resembles a weed. So any beans are considered kidney out. Corn is getting you. It's not, it is tradition as opposed to Halakhah to not eat it. So if you're. If you're stuck and you absolutely cannot get anything except for grits.

Evan 32:27

Let's just say rice and beans.

Alison 32:29

Yeah. If you can't get anything except rice and beans, then, I mean, you're allowed to eat rice and beans on Passover. if you're Spartic you just like, that's totally allowed. If your Ashkenazi tradition dictates that you don't eat rice, any form of being or any form of corn, we do, we keenwah,

Evan 32:49

I was fine.

Alison 32:50

eat keenwah, but as far will not eat many

Evan 32:55

peanuts are not okay because they are a legitimate type of

Alison 32:57

yeah, that would fall under the rescue beans. I think

Evan 33:02

controversial one.

Alison 33:03

Sesame another one. that you'll, you'll not see, is mustard seed, which is considered kidney.

Evan 33:10

I forgot about that.

Alison 33:11

Yeah. So on Passover, you can get some real weird fake mustards. Some of which I believe I had a mild allergic reaction to last year, along with a chicken salad. So I'm allergic to some, like, not like allergic to super allergic, but like my tongue was like kind of swollen and it kept tingling and I was like, I should not be eating this. so there was something in some Passover alternatives that I believe I'm allergic to, and I don't know what it is, but it was in the mustard and it was in the check-in salad.

Evan 33:47

That is odd.

Alison 33:51

Yeah.

Evan 33:52

no. So, though,

Alison 33:53

was also in a soup.

Evan 33:54

yeah, though, I will say it seems at least amongst many people. I know many Ashkenazi Jews. I know that acceptance of key to note is growing.

Alison 34:07

yeah. the conservative movement a couple of years back voted to, I don't remember exactly who it was, but anyways,

Evan 34:15

it's been well

Alison 34:16

United congregation of conservative movement, whatever it's called,

Evan 34:22

yeah,

Alison 34:23

but they voted to no longer follow Kenya. So

Evan 34:27

I, for the most part, I still avoid them. The one I have the most mixed feelings about is Sesame, but your assessment grows natively in the region around Israel. So I feel like if it were and has been grown in that region for long enough that if it were banned, it should be called out explicit.

Alison 34:46

I make out totally wild statements that might not at all be true?

Evan 34:51

You can try.

Alison 34:52

Yeah. I have no idea, but, I don't know if I've brought this up before on the podcast, but. Just as you may hear people, who are gluten-free for health reasons, there is also something that is very common, like much more common than you think. I think it's like one in four, Miserables hate Jews have, which is called fava ism. And people have various degrees of this. It's also known as the G six PD deficiency. It is, an inability, it's an inability to break down something that's in the light and it can have all sorts of nasty side effects over the course of your life. like do bad things to your organs, eventually causes blindness, like there's, there's various effects. And since it is so common among those, or if they choose, I wonder whether, like taking more note of kidney. Would not be a better thing, the same way that people making more notes about things being gluten free would is good thing. Even if it's, I mean, in this case, it is a rather large percentage of the population, but gluten-free is much what people who are medically gluten-free as a much smaller percentage of the population. And I feel like even though it's not whole off quickly required, noting those things would be a big medical benefit to a lot of people. And I do know that in Israel, my sister who lives in Israel has commented before that. she's seen, a lot of products that have kidney and they don't really label things as a kidney out or Kenya free.

Evan 36:32

Interesting.

Alison 36:33

And I think that would be something that like, like on kosher products at least would be a good thing for people to do it.

Evan 36:42

I would agree with you, for all the pull we have in the kosher labeling industry. but that, that is interesting. It did not know about the deficiency. one thing though that reminds me of. And not specifically Jewish, but Mediterranean. And I know you don't drink coffee, but in Italy it said you shouldn't order a cappuccino after noon. and especially not after dinner, you order a much smaller drink. And there are all sorts of reasons given, including that's an insult to the chef, but studies show a large percentage of the Italian population has at least mild lactose intolerance. So ordering a drink with a lot of melt later in the day means you're not going to sleep well. So it's kind of, so that, that reminded me of that. but for, are you looking so elaborate? Are you looking something up.

Alison 37:34

Yeah. you can find a lot of articles about this with G six PD deficiency. I'll send you some articles about this.

Evan 37:41

I will make sure to link them. I do have a friend who's farty and has a lot of food allergies have re related to kidney out. Now that I think about it, basically all very allergic to nuts. They're not peanuts, very allergic to Sesame, and the such.

Alison 38:00

Here we go. Here's a quick blurb. G six PD deficiency is the most common known human enzyme deficiency affecting 400 million people worldwide, most frequently in areas with a high incidence of malaria, such as Africa, Mediterranean and Southeast Asia, about 65% of male Kurdish Jews have the disease carriers are thought tests, some resistance to malaria because the genetic mutations are sex-linked. Most cases occur in males, females who carry one mutation are generally not affected because the normal copy of the gene on their second X chromosome compensates for the defect. This is not always true. I do know people who have woman who have a GC who have this, who are affected

Evan 38:43

So,

Alison 38:43

by.

Evan 38:44

mean, in general does not of course mean every time genetics is not as simple as they like to teach in elementary and middle school, but of course those are elementary, middle, and middle-schoolers you teach them, you don't teach them the fully advanced science.

Alison 38:56

But also think of it in this case, kind of like a, we can, even if it's recessive for women, that means if you have an active father

Evan 39:08

Yeah, it's a,

Alison 39:10

and a recessive mother, the daughter can still get,

Evan 39:14

yeah. So it can be both sets linked and recessive. So yeah, it is slightly more complex than basic men's delay in, genetics, but not much.

Alison 39:22

Yeah. Oh, here's the rest of this. This disease is caused by insufficient glucose, six phosphate dehydrogenase, or G six PD, an enzyme finding red blood cells, causing the cells to break down faster than they can be replenished this results in hemolytic anemia, which can vary in severity from lifelong anemia to rare. to know symptoms, anemia, and those who are G six PD deficiency can also be induced by certain oxidative drugs, infections, severe stress or ingestion of fava beans. it's not necessarily just fava beans. It's any type of lung GAM, but it's fun. The beans have like the highest amount of, of, I think the protein that can't be broken down in the most severe form of the disorder is called Tafolla ism after the legume. so Yeah. it's super, super common.

Evan 40:11

Yeah. If you're thinking, if you think you're having those problems, talk with your doctor.

Alison 40:15

Yes. If you are, Ms. Rafi, Jew,

Evan 40:18

Especially if you're a Ms.

Alison 40:19

you should get looked at it. It does show up in Ashkenazim too, but like if you're in Ms. Rocky day, you should probably get checked out

Evan 40:26

I mean, a lot of things show up in astronauts due to the fact that the Rheinland massacres and only about 350 families escaped into what was then the Polish Lithuanian Commonwealth. And so I've talked about some of that history otherwise here, and don't need to get into it. but yeah,

Alison 40:42

Another thing. That's good. This is really a tangent filled episode. I know this is supposed to be about gluten-free, but I mean, I guess this is vaguely related. also, if you are a child of parents who got tested for genetic diseases, like me, my parents got tested in the eighties and they pretty much got tested for Tay-Sachs and not much else. So if you're in a situation like that, where your parents tell you that they got tested, and this was 20, 30 years ago, you should get tested again because they test for a lot more things. I know I'm not a carrier for Tay-Sachs because neither of my parents are carriers for Tay-Sachs, but I don't know what else I might have.

Evan 41:22

Yeah, no,

Alison 41:24

I, mean, other than like heart disease and colon cancer.

Evan 41:28

I know, I know. I genetically have the mark, the markers for type one.

Alison 41:33

Well, I know that

Evan 41:36

Everyone, everyone on the podcast should know that at this point, cause I've mentioned it before, but a lot of there's a lot of testing around the families of people with type one for the markers. a lot of that goes on now. And interestingly, if your there is an increased risk for if either parent has type one, but statistically there's a slightly higher risk for children of fathers with type one, which is just odd.

Alison 42:06

yeah,

Evan 42:07

Um, but.

Alison 42:10

there are a bunch of different organizations. If you were Jewish. There are a bunch of organizations that will screen you for genetic diseases. J screen, it was one of the really big ones. there's lots of them, some of which will, disclose or not disclose your information. Some people don't want to know. there are organizations where you, and, your future co-parent, both submit DNA samples and they will tell you whether or not you should or should not have kids. and that's all the information you'll get. So there's really do your research. There are lots of organizations that will, that will give or not give you information depending on what you would like to know. but. I do highly recommend that you get checked out.

Evan 42:55

Especially in the Jewish community. and I mean, honestly, I'm not necessarily the biggest fan of all of the 23 and me sort of random by like home DNA, family testing. but yes, if you are considering having biological children and especially if you're in the Jewish community, I would recommend that you get tested for various things at risk, especially something like Tay-Sachs.

Alison 43:21

That's not to say that only Jews should get checked out. Everybody should get checked out for these things. a friend of mine, for example, who's, adopted, and it turns out her brother passed away of a genetic disease. She has the much lesser female version of the disease, but, if she has children, which I mean she and her husband are lovely people, but I'm not asking them about their family planning. I do know that. If, if she has a boy, they have a 50% chance of dying within a, I think before the age of 10 from any very, very painful that into gender disease. So it's not exclusive to Jews. you do have the option and I think this has become more common, especially among Kohanim, which I've heard where like for various reasons, if the preferences for one gender, or, for company, and sometimes it's just easier to just have a, a girl and not deal with some of the issues surrounding co hunting. I've heard that before. Again, this is all, this all raises a lot of ethical questions, but it is stuff that's done and it is stuff that, is something that's often discussed. I. Recommend you talk to a genetic counselor and also get yourself screened

Evan 44:47

Yeah.

Alison 44:47

as you're saying.

Evan 44:49

Yes. So aside from neither, neither of us are genetic counselors. We're both engineers.

Alison 44:58

yes. All I know is, I like having data.

Evan 45:02

Yeah, me too.

Alison 45:03

data is good. Having more data is often good, but some people find having too much data hard makes it hard to

Evan 45:13

But if you analyze it, that'll only make more data.

Alison 45:16

Yes. But for everybody find what works for you, but do research

Evan 45:24

Yeah. Be responsible is J is generally the point of that tangent. That's almost certainly staying in.

Alison 45:30

drink responsibly, and do everything else responsibly, I guess Nick children responsibly.

Evan 45:39

yeah, especially that, and don't drink if you're doing that. Well, you can drink for the act, but not the, you know what I

Alison 45:46

Not the afterwards. Yeah. if anybody listening to this podcast is currently pregnant. we are not experts on things like safe, alcohol consumption during pregnancy, but we know that fetal alcohol syndrome is bad. So do your research.

Evan 46:05

Yeah. I know at least one person, I have a friend who is currently expecting,

Alison 46:09

Well,

Evan 46:10

don't know if, she or her husband listen,

Alison 46:12

I wish her,

Evan 46:13

Hi.

Alison 46:15

so. I wish her a safe and healthy pregnancy instead of think as well

Evan 46:24

so

Alison 46:24

as I do for anybody else who might be listening to this and pregnant?

Evan 46:27

Yes. we're very on track today.

Alison 46:32

Oh yeah. Gluten-free.

Evan 46:34

with the day I've had. I need I'm on track is not easy.

Alison 46:41

yeah, I mean, it's one of those sometimes it's just one of those days.

Evan 46:47

it feels like I've had a lot of those days recently, but gluten-free,, so wines, as we've talked about are naturally gluten-free and you can make them yourself though, wrong season to get fresh grapes.

Alison 47:00

But I've mentioned it before I keep my equipment strictly gluten free. Right. So my yeast is gluten free. if you want to purchase gluten-free yeast, it's usually labeled on the package directly. Levin yeasts are all gluten free And that one weird cider used that really tasted like a yeast that I used at the beginning. That stuff was also labeled gluten free, but it has to do with what they're feeding the yeast.

Evan 47:29

And how they harvest

Alison 47:30

And how they harvest east. Yes. So, what you put into your equipment when you're talking about Passover, everything is pretty much strictly no contact with anything that's considered helmets. So if you get a little bit in there, it doesn't matter. It's highlights. even if it's like Evan's whiskey, if it started out as containing gluten and it's all gone, it doesn't matter. It's still summits. So for those purposes, I mean, if you want to be able to consume anything that. you make on Passover, I would recommend just go strictly gluten-free for all your equipment or make sure that you have separate everything. so gluten-free is easier, easier.

Evan 48:11

correct.

Alison 48:13

And, there's lots, there's so many different ingredients that I think this was, this was the next thing you were going to

Evan 48:19

so that's a little bit, I was going to say Mo to my knowledge, most dry yeasts are gluten-free. It is the liquid yeasts where you run into more of a problem, but of course, check the ingredients itself. If that is something that is important to you,

Alison 48:34

Yeah. Oh, so if you're going to use something like a sourdough starter, which some people do use for, for reeling, that would be, like summates.

Evan 48:44

that's just strapped for comments unless

Alison 48:46

the extreme,

Evan 48:47

that's right. So Mead also, of course,

Alison 48:51

yeah, honey, sugar, tap yoga. I, don't know what you would do with tea. I've never tried to brew with tapioca,

Evan 48:59

I looked into a little bit of gluten-free brewing for beer style, drinks, because that's something I was curious about and, and supposed to just telling you, as opposed to just ending the episode, minus the tangent, the tangents, saying, well, make cider, make me to make wine. We should do think you should do those. Just, those are all enjoyable things to make and drink. as long as you don't develop a carpal tunnel while making wine

Alison 49:22

I already had carpal tunnel. It just got worse from the one

Evan 49:26

well, don't, don't hurt yourself

Alison 49:28

by yourself.

Evan 49:29

That is correct.

Alison 49:30

Learn from my mistakes and buy yourself a dang geezer.

Evan 49:34

so there is a lot of interesting things I found. of course, one of my favorite resources is Northern brewer both for information and products, and they had several, things they suggested as potential items you should brew with that are gluten-free as well as I found a whole website dedicated to gluten-free brewing, including a, a don't go, which is a style, a Dunkel Weisen as a style. I like to completely gluten-free German style beer made with amaranth and millet.

Alison 50:03

I've never worked with them.

Evan 50:04

Nor have I, no, they call it first state Dunkle and it's supposed to come out to a pretty heavy percentage if I recall. and so some of the ingredients they used were millet, amaranth, tapioca syrup, and brown rice syrup and molasses.

Alison 50:21

Oh, I mean, I've had brown rice syrup and I mean, molasses is delicious. So it sounds the things that I have tasted before. Sounds lovely.

Evan 50:30

I mean, I personally probably cut the hops out a little bit on it, but this honestly sounds like a recipe I might try anyway, just because it's going to be interesting and I'm curious to see how it tastes,

Alison 50:40

Yeah. I mean,

Evan 50:42

and that will be

Alison 50:42

why do we Homebrew except to be able to do all sorts of weird experiments that we find

Evan 50:47

Yeah. But so from a few of these different resources, a few of the other things that are fermentable that we may not have thought about before white sorghum rice rice is actually used in a lot of different loggers.

Alison 51:00

Rice. I did know. I've wanted to make soccer for a while, but I haven't gotten around to it because I like needs. And also we've brought this up before Saki uses a very different brewing process than a lot of other things.

Evan 51:14

Yeah. I'll yeah. I also really want to make sock day. I also want to try making me so, but I might try some.

Alison 51:20

buy it.

Evan 51:21

Yeah, me too, but there's an H Mart not far from my office, which is like an amazing Asian grocery store. Not like it is an amazing

Alison 51:28

mine. Me. So from

Evan 51:29

and so I might be able to get the ingredients to make SATA effort, let the, the con the con, the Koji starter from there, I might be able to get,

Alison 51:36

cool. yeah, the one thing, I mean, I check ingredients and stuff because for Kashi purposes and for not eating things that aren't vegetarian

Evan 51:46

yeah,

Alison 51:47

and kosher, I have found that like some fermentable products. in Asian supermarkets are made with shrimp or some form of fermented sesh. So if you are interested in doing it and you keep kosher or otherwise concerned about something like that in your food, check your ingredients.

Evan 52:10

oh, let me be blunt. one of the more common, ingredients is. Some people would be okay with, and it is a form of fermented and dried tuna.

Alison 52:19

I don't know. I don't eat fish in general, so

Evan 52:22

I know that, but that's a bougie, and frequently on like some, Japanese dishes. You'll see these flakes that kind of dance in the smallest of wind that is cuts of bougie, which is a, which is a dried and fermented, Bonetto tuna. So it w so that is one item, but frequently they use, shrimp so that the shrimp not going to be kosher got sushi. Can theoretically be, of course you don't eat fish. So it doesn't matter. the cuts of Boucher is frequently included in me. So, or not frequently, but sometimes included in miso paste to make it the. To help make the soup easier because the soup is traditionally, the fish stock and miso stock MITs together. but rice of course, is a teaching note. So some people may or may not be willing to drink that on Passover. of course, easily fermentable sugar and Belgian candy sugar, which is used to give a lot of Belgium nails, a little bit of, molassey flavor. It's just, another form of sugar. We mentioned amaranth and tapioca as two ones we hadn't thought about. but we're really curious about, I think the real instruction is go out and try things, figure out what's ferment, technically fermentable, that would be interesting for Passover might be a little late to start it for this Passover, but get ready for next. and then there's one. One more product. That's not for Passover, but I just thought it was interesting if you do have a gluten sensitivity medically, but you would like a traditional style beer made with glutinous material, white labs, which makes a lot of really good yeasts has a product called clarity from WL li 4,000, which is an enzyme that breaks down gluten and reduces it, reduces it as well as clarify the beer itself.

Alison 54:11

That's pretty cool.

Evan 54:12

and it says, treat a beers, usually tests below 20 parts per million gluten, which is currently the gluten-free standard. Of course, I know for many celiacs that is nowhere near an acceptable limits, but as I said, if you have a gluten sensitivity, if you're celiac, it's a different issue. But if you have a non-celiac gluten sensitivity, this may be an interesting product for you to try. and I have nothing else aside from Morton. Do you have

Alison 54:42

Lots of things. No, I'm trying to remember what means I, I told you about

Evan 54:47

if I remember if I

Alison 54:48

the prophecy. Oh, was the other one, there was another one.

Evan 54:51

it's always open CSUN on Nasir,

Alison 54:55

Yeah, no, there was another

Evan 54:56

but that's just a running joke with this podcast as well. Please

Alison 54:59

Oh yeah.

Evan 55:00

please send us your questions for Passover. I hope to before the Passover episodes start my next brew, hopefully.

Alison 55:10

I've been so busy. I thought it was going to go on a work trip. And then today I'm not, or a trip

Evan 55:15

well, where were you going to go?

Alison 55:17

Akron, Ohio where I always go for work.

Evan 55:20

I didn't know if you had another place to go.

Alison 55:23

Nope. We got Akron, Ohio,

Evan 55:25

I'm sorry.

Alison 55:26

a suburb of Akron, Ohio,

Evan 55:28

Aspirins. Large enough to have suburbs.

Alison 55:31

sort of,

Evan 55:33

I thought.

Alison 55:34

I haven't actually found downtime and Akron yet. So

Evan 55:37

Good luck

Alison 55:38

all I know.

Evan 55:38

this.

Alison 55:42

But I found, I found the suburb.

Evan 55:45

That's what matters.

Alison 55:46

Yeah. Before, uh, before we find them copper in the slipping anywhere

Evan 55:59

That's right.

Alison 56:02

I'm Allison, uh, she brewed Hebrew and now it is time for you to borough. I got that one wrong.