Living With Fire Podcast
Living With Fire Podcast
August Isernhagen: A Perspective on Wildland Firefighting
We interviewed August Isernhagen, Division Chief of Wildland Fuels with Truckee Meadows Fire and Rescue, about his career as a wildland firefighter. Isernhagen shares some highlights and challenges he's experienced along the way, as well as some tips for residents, if they ever come in contact with wildland firefighters. "Approach them as a trained professional. This is what they chose to do as their trade and show them that respect, in their expertise, for what they know," said Isernhagen.
For more full episode details including the transcript, visit https://www.buzzsprout.com/1819551/episodes/9478617
Welcome to the Living with Fire Podcast, where we share stories and resources to help you live more safely with wildfire. I'm Megan Kay, your host and Outreach Coordinator for the Living with Fire program, and joined today by my boss, Jamie Royce-Gomes, Hi, Jamie.
Jamie Roice-Gomes:Hi Megan.
Megan Kay:And our student worker content creator Jordan Buxton.
Jordan Buxton:Hello.
Megan Kay:Jordan is joining us today. He was part of the interview and had some great questions, so I wanted to get his take on the interview as well. This episode, we sat down with August Isernhagen, who's a deputy chief of wildland fuels at the Truckee Meadows Fire and Rescue. It was a great interview. He talked all about wildland firefighting from his perspective, and gave us a lot to think about when it comes to the job of wildland firefighting and how we interact interact with wildland firefighters and what we as residents and homeowners can do to make their job a little easier and keep them safe. So let's, I kind of wanted to hear you guys thoughts and interview, and let's start with whoever wants to go first. Jamie?
Jamie Roice-Gomes:Okay, I thought it was a great interview. I like how he gave some inside perspectives to wildland firefighting. Most of the public doesn't realize some of this stuff so pretty fascinating.
Jordan Buxton:I agree with that wholeheartedly. I think that Augie did a really good or August.
Megan Kay:He goes by Augie.
Jordan Buxton:I think that he gave a really good perspective on not only the seasonal wildland firefighter perspective of, you know, he only fights fires, but the career wildland perspective as someone who worked through the ranks and, you know, has fought in fires for the almost the last two decades, I think that he had unique insights, especially as someone who, as he kind of put it, would rather still be, you know, in the pits, fighting with the guys.
Megan Kay:Well, I think that, yeah, that's definitely where the action is. But he's also private, like he also mentioned, it's nice for him to have spend time with his family, because that's one of the aspects of being wildland firefighter, is there's adventure, but you never really know where you're gonna go and for how long you're gonna be there. Yeah, I think that I was really excited I got to sit down with him. Hopefully we get to talk with more firefighters in the future. I just, I just think that their experience fighting fire in the wildland urban interface, like residents and homeowners and just people who live with fire on a daily basis, can learn a lot from it, and also their stories are just interesting and engaging. So I'm always down to here to hear them. You know.
Jamie Roice-Gomes:I think it's important that we thank wildland firefighters for what they do, it's a big job, and it's not easy, and they're doing a lot. So, thank you.
Jordan Buxton:I thought it was interesting, actually, how he brought that up, how he talked about how in other areas, you know, he does, he kind of brought up why it is like this, but how wildland firefighters are shown gratitude in a greater way or in a different way, I guess, than around Northern Nevada, right? How, like he was talking about fires in Southern California, and how, you know, residents drop off supplies and goodies, and, you know, food, and you know, loads of other things to fire stations when firefighters from other places are there. And I just thought that was kind of interesting, considering how much fire we deal with here, that we don't necessarily have a greater community response in showing gratitude.
Jamie Roice-Gomes:Me too, I wonder if it has to do with the fact that we always have wildfires here, and so we've kind of become immune to it.
Jordan Buxton:Kind of jaded.
Jamie Roice-Gomes:Yeah, I mean, whereas if in another area, if they don't experience wildland firefighters or certain wildland fires every year, maybe it's just it's new, and I don't know. I mean, it's sad, but interesting.
Jordan Buxton:Last night, I drove by a lot in downtown, and there's a bunch of Cal Fire rigs out there right now, and I was actually thinking about how I wonder if there's a way I should be showing them gratitude. I mean, these guys aren't even from here, and, you know, their rigs are parked here getting
Megan Kay:Yeah, if folks want to show gratitude, Augie said ready. that he mentioned in the interview. It's always is good for morale when they can see, you know, like signs saying, Thank you firefighters, maybe that will give them a little bit more motivation. You know, not that they need it. They're, they're very highly motivated individuals. But, you know, just kind of make them feel good, make their day a little bit.
Jordan Buxton:I saw a lot of those signs last at the end of last season, driving through North Cal, you'd pass through the little the little towns, the ones that, if the fire got there, they'd definitely be gone. And the high was, highway was just lined with thank you firefighters. And yeah.
Jamie Roice-Gomes:There you go, Jordan.
Jordan Buxton:Thanks for saving our homes. But it'd be cool. It would be cool to see that in Northern Nevada a little more.
Megan Kay:I will say if you're when I was firefighting, like, it didn't happen to me that, like, personally, but people did bring stuff down to fire camp sometimes, and it was nice, you know, like, if they brought, like, baked goods, or maybe they paid for if it was, like, a smaller fire, obviously, if it's a big fire, I don't think people have that much money, but there are a few times, yeah, where people would just, like, pay for us to have some treats. You know, which, which was really, and when I say folks, I mean is usually like a local business owner who was kind of.
Jordan Buxton:If one of the wealthy local business owners, wants to cater an entire fire camp, that would be much appreciated.
Megan Kay:Well, don't cater to camp, but get us some cookies, you know. But the I think that there are some cool organizations that if people want, I mean, I'm not an expert, but I do know there's one that I saw on Facebook called Ashley's Toy Closet. And they collect donations for families that have been affected by Wildfire, maybe lost properties, homes, and they collect toys to give to kids. So there definitely are these sort of more grassroots mutual aid efforts by just sort of regular people trying to help out. So they are there, if you find them. Anyway, I think that we all really enjoyed talking to Augie and get to getting to pick his brain about wildland firefighting. And I hope you guys enjoy the interview.
August Isernhagen:My name is August Isernhagen, and I'm a Division Chief with Truckee Meadows Fire Protection District. I oversee the Wildfire and Fuels Program there.
Jordan Buxton:Can you explain the radio in the background real quick?
August Isernhagen:Yep, I apologize.
Jordan Buxton:You keep going, I actually like it.
August Isernhagen:The radio is going in the background. We're in red flag today, so I'm just listening.
Megan Kay:And a red flag warning for our audience who doesn't already know, means that there's potential for extreme fire behavior today because of low temperatures, high winds and
August Isernhagen:High winds and low RHs. what else?
Megan Kay:So can you kind of give us an overview of what you do as a Division Chief at Truckee Meadows? there's that
August Isernhagen:Okay, so Truckee Meadows started. We've always had a wild land component. It's one of our main areas of emergency response, and we've dabbled in fuels management here and there throughout the years. About a year and a half ago, in partnership, primarily with NV Energy in the state of Nevada, Division of Forestry, there was funding to be more proactive about the fuels management. Truckee Meadows created my position to have a Division Chief. Division means you focus on a primary area. To have a Division Chief focused on Wildland Fire and Fuels management in Truckee Meadows jurisdiction other divisions within TM. There's an EMS division for emergency medical services. There's an Operations it oversees the line staff and
Megan Kay:And then for when we say Truckee Meadows, because I know you guys recently changed your name. Used to be trucking those Fire Protection District, but now it's Truckee Meadows just Fire and Rescue.
August Isernhagen:Correct yes.
Megan Kay:And it's just in Washoe County.
August Isernhagen:Yep. So Truckee Meadows is responsible for emergency response in unincorporated Washoe County. So Reno has their own fire department, Sparks has their own, North Lake Tahoe out of Incline has their own and then our jurisdiction goes up to township 22 which is pretty much Palomino Valley, like that Northern boundary. However, through agreements with the county, we also take on their fire suppression North of that so essentially goes to the Oregon border. To the North. They have a small department outside of Gerlach that is also run currently by Truckee Meadows. That's kind of changing. And then there's a department outside of Pyramid Lake.
Megan Kay:And so you're in charge of the fuels crews. But also those are the wildland firefighting crews.
August Isernhagen:Well so the the our newest addition in the Fuels program, their primary 9-5 job is, or 7-5 job is, fuels management, right? And that's what they're doing 52 weeks out of the year there, year round, when there is a fire, they're all their their trade that what they've come up through is wildland fire. So they're fully qualified on that. When they're on project, they're running out of a type five engine, which is an actual fire truck with water and hose and tools.
Megan Kay:But it's like, but it looks like a truck, right?
August Isernhagen:Exactly.
Megan Kay:So it's not, it doesn't look like a typical fire engine. It's like a.
August Isernhagen:It's like a big lifted pickup truck on juice. And so that's what they're on project. That's what they're in on project, doing fuels management. Then when there is a fire, then they respond to the fire. Also, all of Truckee Meadows stations that we already have are fully staffed with wildland apparatus, and all of the staff are cross cross-trained for wildland. So the new crews are that's their focus as wildland and fuels, but all of the Truckee Meadows crews are trained and capable in it.
Megan Kay:How did you get the job? And what is your career in wildland firefighter? As a wildland firefighter?
August Isernhagen:I took a kind of a wandering approach to get here. I've been doing fire and natural resource management for about 20 years. I started in high school as a seasonal park ranger. For a couple years, I knew I wanted to do something outside and and.
Megan Kay:I didn't even know they had seasonal park rangers.
August Isernhagen:Yeah, for Washoe County.
Megan Kay:Someday I'll be a seasonal park ranger.
August Isernhagen:So I did that for a couple years, and I do trainings with the Forest Service in the summer, just to kind of learn what was out there. I still didn't think I'd do fire, apologize for the radio. I still didn't think I wanted to do fire. I wanted to go more like wildlife, but started going to UNR and then to help pay for school. I got a job as a wildland a seasonal wildland guy with Nevada Division of Forestry, did a couple years of volunteering all risk in there also all risk means structure fires, emergency medical services, that type of stuff. I enjoyed it, but it wasn't really my.
Megan Kay:The all risk side you enjoyed but wasn't your?
August Isernhagen:It wasn't I didn't have the passion for it like the wildland. So I focused on the wildland. I was a seasonal, doing that for six or seven years. Then I had my wife and I had our first child, and I got laid off, and I was happy being a seasonal I thought I could do that forever, but then we had that first winter without health insurance and a brand new baby at home, and so it's time, time to grow up.
Megan Kay:Yeah, so that's, that's something that I want to come back to. So let's, because I want you to describe what that seasonality of a wildland firefighter but I didn't mean to interrupt you. So you got you guys had a baby?
August Isernhagen:Had a baby, it was time to grow up. So I got a job running inmate crews with the Nevada Division of Forestry, similar function. So 52 weeks out of the year, those crews are going out doing project work, fuels management, forest health, that type of stuff. And then during fire season, those those inmates, are cross-trained to respond to fires. So I did that for a few years when I was a seasonal bounced around a little bit. I did a few years on engines. I did a few years on Helitack, which is basically hand crew on the ground, firefighters that get inserted by helicopter into remote areas.
Megan Kay:Very cool by the way.
August Isernhagen:Yeah, then I went back to engines for a couple years, then I became the crew boss for a while. Then one year, Helitack was short staffed, and I was brought into the Chief's office, and he asked, you know, you've been running a good crew. How'd you like to go to Helitack? So a fair amount of folks wanted that experience. I said, No, thanks. I like running crew. And they pretty much said, too bad you're the only one with experience. You're going, so I ended up back at Helitack. Was there for a few years. So as a crew boss, I was year round, and I'd.
Megan Kay:So when you say crew boss, you mean with the inmate crews?
August Isernhagen:Both. I did just inmate crews for a little bit, a couple years. And then when I ended up back at Helitack, I'd go to Helitack for the spring, summer and fall, and then come back to running inmates in the winter. And did that for a few cycles. Eventually, they created a Battalion Chief position over Helitack, because that's why they were always having to borrow folks, as they didn't have any exclusive positions there. I got that position, and then my boss there pretty much required, he couldn't, but he required me to go back to school to finish my degree.
Megan Kay:Degree in what?
August Isernhagen:Forest management and ecology at UNR. So, went back to school, finished that, and then, after four or five years of being the battalion chief there, the Camp Program Manager position opened with Nevada Division of Forestry, and that oversees the whole inmate program, about 700 personnel across. What 10 or 11 facilities across the state? So I took that job. The degree was key for that. Obviously, moving into those upper management positions. Was there for about a year and a half. I was always interested in climbing into upper management with Nevada Division of Forestry. Thought that's where I would stay. But then Truckee Meadows created this position, and.
Megan Kay:You jumped ship?
August Isernhagen:Everything lined up, and here I am, happy as a clam.
Megan Kay:been with Truckee Meadows?
August Isernhagen:16 months.
Megan Kay:16 months?
August Isernhagen:Yeah, and with NDF for about 18 years before that.
Jamie Roice-Gomes:What's the best part of being a wildland firefighter, in your opinion?
August Isernhagen:The best, the best parts, right? And since I've moved into that Program Manager position at NDF, and now here with Truckee Meadows, I'm less operational. And what operational means for those folks out there is less in the field, boots on the ground, swinging a tool, which kind of sucks, because that's where that's the fun. That's where the fun is, right? My favorite parts about it were, number one, the adventure, right? You never know what's going to happen today when you show up to work. There's a little bit of that adrenaline, and, like I said, sense of adventure. I like traveling. Another exciting piece about wildland fires. On top of not knowing what's going to happen today, you don't know where you're going to end up today, and so I've been on fires all over the Western United States, and that's an exciting piece. You see a lot of areas that most people wouldn't see, right? Because you're not going to the tourist attraction. You're going, well sometimes you end up there too, but you're that's not the point, right? You so you end up in the middle of nowhere and see some cool sights. And then the last piece, the most important piece to me through the years, has been the camaraderie. You know, I had, I had close friends in high school. I had close friends in college. But by far my closest friends in the world are, are those that that I fought fire with over the years.
Jordan Buxton:Why?
August Isernhagen:I think it's, I don't know that's a complicated question. I think it's, there's obviously a piece of it's not like, morbidly dangerous, right? But there's an elevated risk, and sometimes you can end up in some sketchy situations, and that creates a bond. Another piece is ties to what Megan was talking about, kind of the cyclical nature of it, and the difficulties that go along with that. And and a lot of people maybe don't relate to that, right? But when you when you are in a season focused job, and you're living with these people for six months out of the year, you just those bonds, I don't know, naturally come about, you know? And especially like on the helicopter, there's a heightened level of risk there, and that's like the true definition of adventure, right? You just launch and take off into the wild blue yonder and get dropped off on a mountaintop for four days with your buddies, you know? And think you'd be hard pressed not to have those relationships in those scenarios.
Megan Kay:Yeah, and there's no, there's no escape. Even if you wanted to. But the yeah I did, just for full disclosure, I have some wildland fire experience. I was on, actually, was on an I wasn't ever on an engine with you, but I did serve as I was a seasonal NDF for two seasons, and then on a type two hand crew in Incline called the Slide Mount hand crew, which is part of North Lake Tahoe Fire Protection District, for two seasons. And then I was there for almost three seasons, but I got injured at the beginning of my third season and decided not to come back. I had to go to college. But, yeah, so I can definitely relate to that seasonality, because I did that for five years, basically, of just and it was hard to break out of, like, when you transition out of it, like, it was really hard for me to stay at a job for longer than a year. Because I was just like, I I'm getting antsy. Like when is it gonna switch? I don't it's like, is it really just this? Forever?
August Isernhagen:That is difficult. It becomes cyclical, right? Yeah, your life is based on the seasons. And you start to expect, like, just get to November.
Megan Kay:Yeah, but definitely, like is, I didn't keep in touch with like, the guys in my crew, but it's I definitely know a lot about them, at least at that moment in time, and they know a lot about me, you know? So it's like, that will, that will never change. But, yeah, those bonds are definitely, pretty crazy.
Jamie Roice-Gomes:Conversely, what do you think is the toughest part of being a wildland firefighter?
August Isernhagen:There's several. I mean, some of it's kind of the stuff we're already talking about. The hardest part when you first start, there's a financial component, right? Because it's pretty much impossible to get your foot in the door without some kind of seasonal experience. So to do that, you have to willingly take a job sometimes for two, three, my case, six, seven, I know other guys that they go 10-15, years as a seasonal and that financially is difficult, right? It's feast or famine. You're getting you're working all summer long, and you're doing pretty well, and then in the winter, you're out of a job, right? And it depends which agency you work for, whether you get benefits during that laid off time period or not. But the financial, maintaining financial health, especially when you first start, is one another one is family life, right? I'm married, I have four kids, and that has always been a struggle, especially when they're little. Is we were talking about it earlier, right? You leave in the morning, you give everybody a kiss. You think you're coming back that night, but who knows? You end up in Wyoming or Idaho, or whatever that scenario is, and a significant other can, you know, they're usually aware of that possibility, but the little one, they can't, they can't process that the same way, so that one's hard. And then what else I would say, tying back to those close relationships is it's a small group, right? And people outside those relationships don't, can't relate, and don't have that perspective, like even my own parents barely understand anything, because it's just, it's a it's, it's alien to most people.
Megan Kay:Even my dad, who was a Reno firefighter, his whole career, retired as a Reno firefighter. He didn't really have much wildland fire experience. Like he did go on some wildland fires, obviously, but never for as long as I did. So he even trying to explain to him, like, like he did not relate. So the only people who were honestly related are the wildlife firefighters, which I do have a few friends who were like on Hotshot crews and Helitack crews that just are in my circle of friends, and we always end up talking about it like, whenever we're at a party or something, even though we're no longer doing it, we're always just, like, relate back to it, or are following the issues related to wildland firefighters in the news and kind of trying to educate people about it.
August Isernhagen:I think those are, those are kind of the hard parts. What a lot of people would envision is the difficult pieces. And some people think it is, I've never had an issue enjoyed that, so, yeah, different than what most people
Megan Kay:Yeah, if that's if those are the difficult parts of the job, then you probably shouldn't be in the job, because that's just the job. During a wildfire, firefighters have a lot to do. Make it easier for firefighters to defend your home, create defensible space now. Defensible space is an area between a house and an oncoming wildfire where the vegetation has been managed to reduce the wildfire threat. Proper with, you know, in terms of, like, the physical element, or defensible space doesn't mean removing all vegetation, though, by following the lean, clean and green rule, you can keep your property safe while preserving its natural beauty. Learn more about defensible space in our guide "Fire adapted communities, the next step in wildfire preparedness" you can find the guide in the resources section of our website at livingwithfire.com. would think, I would guess. We were talking about the pros and cons of wildland firefighting, the sort of effects that it can have on your your personal life. I wanted to circle back to a conversation we were having off mic earlier, about, like mental health. And you were talking, you were talking about how, well, first of all, just kind of unpack, sort of some of the maybe challenges that are common with wildland firefighters, like mental health wise. And then what you you mentioned that Truckee Meadows is actually being proactive in dealing with it. So I'd like to hear a little bit about that.
August Isernhagen:I think mental health in terms of the wildland community, think it obviously it's going to depend on the individual. Like, if you're like me, I eventually fell into a rhythm, like we were talking about, where life is just kind of seasonal, right? Summertime was fire focused. Fall was winter focused. Winter, or excuse me, fall was project focused. Winter was like hunting and relaxing time, spring was ramping bac yeah you just kind of get into that life cycle, and then it's the natural ebbs and flows, if you will. I could see how that could be a mental health piece for a lot of people that aren't able to kind of roll with with that dynamic. The unknown is also another mental health piece, I would say, probably the biggest one ties back to the family element that we were talking about right issue, like, if it can create marital issues, the job, right? That same thing being gone all summer long and not present, how your kids take it those types of things, as well as the stress from like we talked about the financial element when you first get started, all of those play into it. And we talked about it again. I've never felt wildland fire was anything extraordinarily dangerous or extraordinarily impactful in terms of what you see, but obviously same thing, every person takes that differently, and sometimes you see death and destruction and things that some people have a hard time coping with.
Megan Kay:Well, yeah. I mean, not everyone experiences an injury or them either themselves or maybe on their crew. But it does happen, and it can definitely be traumatic. You know, like, if you see your your buddy get injured, or, you know, someone in our crew had, like, a grand mal seizure, had been Helitacked out. That was a little intense. But the yeah, just the anxiety and just the constant sort of anxiety, I feel like could definitely contribute to some mental health issues.
August Isernhagen:And you do get exposed to some of those traumatic events, right? They're not as often as, say, an all risk firefighter who's going on medical calls and car accidents and those kind of things, or a police officer, you know, or somebody in the military, but it's still the the rate that those things happen is still elevated in the wildland world compared to everyday life I've been on, I've been around three or four, four aircraft accidents, right? And I think almost in the wildland community, those might be, again, I'm not a psychologist. I I would think those are have a more pronounced impact because they're not exposed to it all the time, and some of those coping mechanisms aren't there. Would be my guess again, yeah,
Megan Kay:But yeah, I can't even imagine being in the aviation like, all the stress that would go into just the daily operations of that, yeah, and that can take a toll on your nervous system, I'd imagine.
August Isernhagen:Again, I think it depends on the individual. Like, when you're first learning and you're first into it, it's a whole new world, and everything can kill you, but then eventually that you just you adapt, and that becomes the day to day way of things.
Megan Kay:Yeah, but so Truckee Meadows, you guys hired a psychologist?
August Isernhagen:So we have, I don't know his technical title, but yeah, he's a doctor, and we give him, he's basically on contract with the district, and in return, he's available if we need him for a CISM which is a critical incident stress management discussion. It doesn't have to be that formal. As he's cruising around town, he'll stop in a fire station and and touch base with with the folks. And if they want to engage or pull them aside, then they can do that, not just about work stuff, just in general, how they're doing. If we have near misses or injuries, we bring him into the fold to check everybody's mental health there. And then he's also really active nationally in the wildland fire community. So all spring, he's cruising around the Western US, touching base with hotshot crews, engine crews, federal government, state governments and and same thing, doing a lot of preventative maintenance. He likes to call it on the front end, giving tools on, how to deal with some of those stressors. So, yeah, that's one element that, or that's one aspect that, that Truckee Meadows has, we also have some of our internal folks. Battalion Chief Derek Reid, he was instrumental in starting the Nevada Peer Support Network, and that was in conjunction with Dr Steve also, and that was all focused on mental health. Of it started off fairly limited, right? The fire community, but that's expanded for to law enforcement, medical personnel, the military. And now it was the Northern Nevada Peer Support Network. Now it's the Nevada Peer Support Network. So I don't know how many different agencies are participating in that, but this spring, they put on a two day resiliency training at the convention center that was solely focused on mental health of emergency responders.
Megan Kay:Yeah. I mean, it's such an important issue. And I mean just the what the wildland firefighter, just with wildland firefighters in particular, you know, our wildland seasons in air quotes. You can't see that, but I said air quotes are longer and longer, and yeah, and so folks are out on the line, like, actively fighting fire for prolonged periods of time and getting exhausted. And so I just think it's anything, any sort of innovations in and being proactive and giving folks tools, but also just checking in. You know, I definitely was, I was feeling I was pretty lucky. I had really good leadership, that I was always really touching base and checking in with stuff like that. I mean, there's, I feel like, you know, cultural fire crews, like, there's also things that contribute to anxiety.
August Isernhagen:For sure, there's a stoic macho mentality.
Megan Kay:Maybe unnecessary, but for the most part, there was genuine, like concern for everybody. So that was pretty nice. I wanted to kind of switch gears a little bit and talk about just things that you think, that residents, homeowners, people in general should know about wildland firefighters. Like, what do you think that people should know about wildland firefighters, whether that would it's in context of, like, during a wildland fire event, or maybe just in general, so that people kind of understand who these folks are that are fighting these fires, you know, I mean, obviously everyone's different. Like, there's no, there's no stereotype. But the, you know, I just think, I think that people would like, I think it's an interesting job that people want to know about. And especially, like, if people, if, if people are living in the urban interface, and they, wildland urban interface, and they're experiencing wildfire like, they're gonna come in contact with with firefighters. So it'd be kind of interesting. It'd be kind of nice to know, like, maybe we'll start with this. Like, what's like, some etiquette?
August Isernhagen:Some etiquette? Well, several times I've experienced it through my whole career, especially. I don't know that it's centered, obviously, around fire, but just working for in the public sector in general, right? You interact with a lot of opinions out there based, you know, regarding what you're doing, right? A lot of opinions and good ideas. I've interacted with tons of public when I'm out on project or out on fires where you're getting that, you're getting those inputs on something that maybe they don't understand as well, right? But they still have the opinions. And obviously, in this line of work, emotions are high, right? Whether it's a project and you're cutting out somebody's favorite tree, right, or it's prescribed fire and somebody's worried about it escaping, or you're in the actual fire environment, right, and they're worried about their house. And so I think the main piece of etiquette is, would be to approach, approach them as you know, a trained professional, this is what they chose to do as their trade, and show them that respect and in their in their expertise, for what they know.
Megan Kay:Is there anything that maybe homeowners could know, could do to maybe make wildland firefighters jobs easier?
August Isernhagen:It ties to the first question, and you know, living with fire talking about fuels management, defensible space, those those pieces, specifically, is a piece of honoring or respecting what those guys do would be to take some ownership in your own, your own position in life, with your property, your home, that type of thing. They are, fathers, husbands, wives, mothers that are coming into these situations to try to help and having that ownership to do what you can before that scenario happens, I think isn't stressed enough, right? Because there is a bunch of work. This is the stuff you guys talk about, all the time that can be done ahead of time to both make it safer and more productive while the wildland folks are in there. As we treat, as we train, we always beat it into everybody's heads that there's no bush worth dying for. There's no house worth dying for, right? That's true to a degree, but if that were completely true, we'd just stop fighting fire all the way to get all together, right? Because that's the only way to guarantee it doesn't happen. So there is a piece of that we also try to train folks not to get emotionally involved when there's homes and structures threatened and private property. We can say that all day long, but that is not accurate.
Megan Kay:Yeah, you don't. No one wants someone's house burned.
August Isernhagen:You instantly become more invested in. What you're doing when it's somebody's private property, and so having that ownership and making a difference to help before it's needed.
Megan Kay:Communities located in wildfire prone areas need to take extra measures to live safely. There are many ways to prepare communities and properties for wildfire, including creating and maintaining adequate defensible space and hardening homes to withstand wildfire. This could mean altering or replacing certain components of the home. Our wildfire home retrofit guide will help you better prepare your home and communities for wildfire. You can find the guide in the resources section of our website at livingwithfire.com. Something that I think is interesting that exists now, and feel free to comment on it that didn't exist when I was wildland firefighting, which is also that's a whole thing to unpack there too is just the term wildland firefighter, like often, that's not actually the designation. It's usually like Forestry Technician or just seasonal but as it's understood, that's the job as you're a wildland firefighter. But when I was working on hand crew and on an engine. There wasn't a whole lot of social media. You know, Instagram wasn't around. Facebook was there, but it wasn't that big. And, you know, there's always been this sort of impulse to share stories and to connect with other people who are doing the job. So, you know, my crew always did, like a video right at the end of at the end of the year, which was, like, usually, like really intense music and just like highlights of all the stuff.
Jordan Buxton:Of the plane dumping over the forest.
Megan Kay:Which is awesome, and then the uploaded to YouTube. And that was your way of kind of like putting it out there. Like, this is what we did this season. But now there are lots of like, Facebook groups and Instagram accounts and YouTube influencers around wildland fire, so people can really kind of educate themselves and dig into the culture. There's one podcast that I listen to. It's called Anchor Point. It's Brandon is an ex-wildland firefighter, former wildland firefighter, and he, he actually lives in Reno, has a big audience, but, yeah, his podcast is huge, and it's, I just love that there's this culture now where people can talk about it, and there's an outlet to where they can like, find like minded individual or people not like minded, but, you know, people with the same experience. That didn't really exist when I was firefighting. So it was like, the only way you can meet other wildland firefighters. Was like, in camp. You know? So I thought that was, I just think that's pretty cool. So feel free to comment, but I still want that anecdote and that heartwarming story.
August Isernhagen:I don't know if I have heartwarming.
Megan Kay:I have kind of an interesting story about helicopters. So just sorry, this isn't, this podcast isn't about me. But I'm always, I've always, I never got to ride on a
August Isernhagen:No, you're good. helicopter, and it's one of the things that I regret, or I can't regret it, because there's nothing. It's not, it wasn't my choice. It's just one of the things that I'm kind of bummed that never happened. But the because, part of the reason I wanted to be on the crew that I applied for was when I was an NDF. I got assigned to the water tender one time, which is the it's an interesting gig, if you guys, if people listening, have ever been on a water tender? I was on the water tender that day, which usually is no big deal. It's like you drive the water tender to project work or wherever. You just have to be on it in case it gets dispatched to a fire. Well, I got dispatched to a fire out in, like Winnemucca, with the other guy I was in the water tender with, and we ended up being on this fire for like two weeks, or however long, a long time, and we were stuck, just like at the airport, and our whole job was to just like, fill up the various, yeah the pumpkins. So it's like, we would just be going back and forth from a hydrant all day. Yep, that's all we did. And it was really boring, in my opinion. It's a very important, it's a very important job. But, and then this crew, the crews kept getting. They were being flown in and out every day because they weren't like, spiking out on the fire. They're just like, we're getting a ride every day in the helicopter to and from the fire. And I was just like, who this is? I'm so jealous of this crew. And I found out who it was. It was a slide mount hand crew. And I was like, cool, I'm applying for that crew next year. And because in my mind, I didn't know anything, I was just like, wow, that crew flies on helicopter. And I never got to fly in a helicopter the two, the two and a half seasons I was on there, but got close. I one time we, like, taped up all our tools, had our manifest, every everything ready, because you have to weigh everything, because it's very you know, it's a it's an aircraft, in case you guys didn't know helicopter are an aircraft, but we got very close, and we just never did it. So they decided that they would, they were fine with letting us hike the 13 miles. So we did. But anyway.
Jamie Roice-Gomes:I got a question for Augie. Like, do you Augie? Do you have any stories of how like, like, the community has, like, rallied around, like firefighters after a fire and like made like baked goods or something like that?
August Isernhagen:Yeah, I think it has a lot to do with culture and demographics of the community, right? I've been on tons of fires in Southern California, and down there, emergency responders are kind of viewed in a different light than up here. I don't know if that's political leanings or what that is, but down there, there's so many donations and baked goods and snacks and socks and baby powder that gets dropped off at the stations like it can't ever even be used by the firefighters. Just comes out of the woodwork. Up here, that's not as common. Again, it's, I think it's just a demographic difference, but all of those big WUI fires, right? Wildland Urban Interface fires. It's a heartwarming piece. Right? Is all the signs that you see, especially when it's kids painting and those kind of things, saying, Thank you.
Jamie Roice-Gomes:That's really interesting. Sorry.
August Isernhagen:Oftentimes, No, you're good. Oftentimes, as those requests come in, the incident management teams, the teams on these bigger fires, they try to redirect those people to the Red Cross or nonprofits, right? Because when we're on these big fires, the big fires, not necessarily all the little initial attacks, but you're pretty well logistically taken care of, right? So there's a there's an incident command post or and a camp that gets set up, and it's essentially, it's like Burning Man. It's a city that just gets built in a parking lot, right? And there they feed you, and there's a medical tent to get ibuprofen, and there's supply tent to to go get new gloves, right? And so you're pretty well taken care of, and so oftentimes on those big, catastrophic ones like we have right now, right Dixie, those donations are much better served to go to those nonprofit it's like Red Cross and help with the people that are evacuated and may have lost everything.
Jordan Buxton:A couple of years ago, I can't, I can't remember the year. One of those camps was actually set up in the schools sports field down the street from where I grew up, down the street from my parents house. It was there were their engines from Colorado, New Mexico. A couple from New York. And it was the entire block that my I grew up on was just lined with engine
August Isernhagen:One of my more memorable fires. There's crews. hundreds, but one of the more fun ones, in retrospect, and this is a unique piece about the firefighting community, right? Is oftentimes when you're the most miserable and broken afterward. You look look back, and those are the the times that you laugh, and it's and it's funny. I was, I was on Helitack, and we got flown into a fire up by Pyramid. I don't remember the name of it, and we spent we flew up first thing in the morning, and it was off doing its thing in the cheatgrass, and we spent the entire day just hot lining, right? And so hot lining is a term when you're like, at the active part of the fire. You're not mopping up, you're not controlling the edge, but you're like, actively suppressing, trying to fight fire, and it's oftentimes the most physically arduous, but it's also the fun, right? You're in, you're in the excitement. Aircraft are dropping all around you, and there's flames, and you're sweating. And we so we did that all day, from probably 8:00,
8:30 in the morning, till, I guess, 5:00 or 6:00 at night, and we got picked up off the line. Most of us were pretty close to running out of water, because on the helicopter you you travel light, right, because your our program's main focus was initial, initial attack, moving fast on those scenarios. And so we're flying back to to the heli base. Our support vehicles are instead to resupply on water and MREs and stuff. But on the way there, we found we we spotted another smoke over in Story County, somewhere. And so we turned to go there. Obviously it needed to. It needed some attention. It was starting to crown through the Pinyon-Juniper, right? And so we landed. We offload there. The helicopter takes off to give us bucket work. He's, he goes, actually, he went back for fuel. And then we call in Smokejumpers. They're going to come in and help us, because they're sitting instead smokejumper plane comes over, they drop their guys in part of their gear, and then a thunder cell moves over. And so when a cell moves over, two things happen, right? One, oftentimes your fire blows out because of the wind events right the downdrafts that come out of it. And two, you lose your aircraft because they can't fly for the same reason. And so our helicopter couldn't come back. The jumper plane got sent back and landed. And we're still out of water. We're still out of MREs. We get drenched. There's lightning crashing all around us, probably two or three strikes within a quarter mile of us, the jumpers got blown around in the wind, so they're scattered out trying to figure out where everybody is. And that was our night. We went to bed with no food, no water, soaking wet, and in the middle of nowhere, in the rocks, and you go to bed thinking, like, what am I doing with my life? But then, you know, after a week or two, you look at your buddy and you just chuckle about it, because that's part of the adventure.
Megan Kay:Dang.
Jamie Roice-Gomes:I would imagine that it was a really like bonding moment with your your colleagues, right?
August Isernhagen:Afterward, not in the moment, right because people are thirsty, they're hungry, they're cold, they're wet. Yeah, tempers start to get testy. I remember having to call one of them out, like, because he was complaining about, I don't remember what the water I think I had to tell them, like, complaining about it isn't helping anybody. Shut up. We'll get water in the morning.
Megan Kay:Yeah, they'll drop you some water when they can, yeah.
August Isernhagen:But after the fact, yes, then it's bonding. But in the moment, it can be testy.
Megan Kay:And that's why those relationships are so strong. You go through more with these people than you go with like, your freaking spouse sometimes.
August Isernhagen:No, there's been numerous times myself and the crew, especially on the helicopter, just flown into the middle of nowhere, like I said, for three, four days. Here's, you know, 10 cases of MRE and a bunch of cubies. Cubies are five gallon boxes of water and some batteries, and we'll see you in a few days.
Megan Kay:Go stop the fire. Thank you for listening to the Living with Fire Podcast. You can find more stories about wildfire and other resources at livingwithfire.com. The Living with Fire Program is funded by the University of Nevada, Reno Extension, Nevada Division of Forestry, Bureau of Land Management and the United States Forest Service.
