Ep 86: Tiny Abandonments

September 22, 2026
Here and Human Wellness
Ep 86: Tiny Abandonments

Episode summary:

In this first episode under the new name, Jen reflects on the evolution from Love You More to Here and Human Wellness and what it means to be more interested in being present for life than perfecting it. She shares an honest look at her recent silent retreat, from the beauty of stillness and intentionality to the surprising challenge of coming home to everyday life.

Jen also explores the idea of “tiny abandonments”, the small ways we sometimes set aside what we honestly want, feel, or need in order to please others, avoid discomfort, or meet our own expectations. Through stories from the retreat and everyday family life, she invites us to notice where we might be abandoning ourselves and consider what it could look like to respond more honestly, kindly, and intentionally.

Favorite Quotes:

“I am becoming far more interested in being present for life here right now in this moment than trying to figure it all out.”

“The retreat was beautiful. It was very restorative.”

“A thousand times a day, maybe that's a bigger number than it's necessary. Several times a day, there are likely things where I am not being honest with what I either actually want, feel, or need.”

“I am just looking at how I can be more honest with myself."

“It is okay for me to take care of my own needs, period.”

“It just felt weird, but it was really good practice.”

Resources:

Jen's Instagram
Jen's Substack
McDaniel Nutrition Therapy Instagram
McDaniel Nutrition Therapy Website
Past Podcast Episodes 

Transcript

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SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome to the Here and Human Wellness Podcast. I'm Jennifer McDaniel, a registered dietitian, writer, mother, and someone who's far more interested in being present for life than perfecting it. This is a place for honest conversation about nourishment, midlife, family, and all the beautiful, difficult, and ordinary parts of being human. I'm so glad you're here. Welcome to the Here and Human Wellness Podcast. Yes, it is a different name. I'll talk a little bit more about that in a minute. But um I don't know. Uh Love You More was a beautiful name because it was the name that um reflected how my dad always and still does um hang up when we say goodbye. Love you more. And um, so that is still a really important, and I love the fact that that's how this podcast started, but it is evolving, and this is the first episode of um a very similar podcast, but I am now calling it Here and Human Wellness. And um, my introduction for Here and Human Wellness is hello. This is what I've written anyway. You'll see if I keep it. Um, I'm Jennifer McDaniel, registered dietitian and writer and mother of three boys, and someone who is becoming far more interested in being present for life here right now, in this moment, than trying to like figure it all out. This is a place and a podcast for honest conversations where I'm gonna talk about nourishment, both physical nourishment, but also just all kinds of nourishment, um, what it's like to be in midlife. Um, there's gonna be family conversations here and definitely continuing conversations around the beautiful, difficult, and ordinary parts of just being human. So we're here and now, and we're talking about what it's like to be human. So um, for all of those of you who have been following the Love You More podcast, this is probably not gonna feel a whole lot different. Probably just mostly a branding, um, a branding thing, but you tell me, maybe you'll notice that things do feel different. Um, I am in my home right now, um, and there is construction going on in my home. We are we're redoing our kitchen, which is super fun. Um, but it has also been super disruptive. I've been cooking down in my basement with a one-pot burner, um, an Instapot, and an air fryer, and a tiny, tiny little sink which we hand wash all of our dishes. Um, so yeah, that has not been a whole lot of fun, but I know on the other side of it it will be good. But anyway, I say that in case there's some loud construction. Um I'm hoping that doesn't happen, obviously. And also, my dog is in my room right now. And sometimes when people come in, she barks. So talk about being human, right? Um, so in today's podcast um about um not only the evolution of the Love You More podcast to hear in human wellness, um, I also wanted to talk a little bit about the silent retreat because I just returned and um I'm gonna be so honest about all of it. Um I had been dreaming up hosting a silent retreat ever since I went on my own um back two years ago. And I just I absolutely loved the opportunity to be in stillness, to not have any obligations, even the tiniest obligation of when someone walks past you and there's an obligation to look at them a right way, right? Like, I mean, haven't hasn't that happened before? Like you walked past somebody and you're like, oh, I don't I don't know if I actually even smiled at them or oh, I hope they didn't take that the wrong way. You know what I mean? Like there is energy that is expended even in subtle greetings. And um this isn't just for introverts, you know, introverts might like naturally gravitate towards a silent retreat, but this is also an interesting place for even extroverted people to see what it's like to have time and space in which they are just kind of with their own being. And um I just really enjoyed that. I also enjoyed, of course, not having to take care of anyone. I mean, it's like going on a solo trip, you know. Um, but even on a solo trip, you know, you engage with people and you, you know, you um go to a restaurant or you have to go to the grocery store or whatever. And to be in a retreat space in which everything is taken care of for you, and literally all you have to do is abide by the schedule to some degree, it there's something so unique and freeing about that. Um, so yes, so I had been planning a silent retreat for probably it took me eight months to plan it. Um I had the perfect location. If I do another silent retreat, which I do plan on doing, um, the Kindred Forest in Brit in um not Branson, um Bourbon, Missouri, is you know, hour and 15 minutes outside of St. Louis, but yet it feels nothing like St. Louis. You're in the Ozarks, you're in some hills, you're in woods, you're in beautiful lodging and spaces, comfortable, cozy. Everything there is so intentional, like all the artwork and the little signs in the bathroom that remind us how precious water is. It's just it's really a it's ideal for a retreat center. So how great to have access to that. Um, so the space was awesome. We had um, I had planned experiences for us each evening or afternoon. So the first afternoon, we had Joe Peng, the owner of the Kindred Forest, do a forest bathing experience for us, which is really just like being playful and curious outside in the woods. And he would have us just do simple things like go and observe, like being aware of movement, you know, walking through the woods and just noticing what was moving and what was in your awareness around that. And um I was I was so intrigued. There were hummingbirds everywhere because it was like the period of time right before hummingbirds go to South America. I believe it's where they migrate. And so they have to like get all the food that they need. I heard that they almost double in body weight right now before they head off. And so there was like four or five hummingbirds that I just sat there and watched, which was so cool. Um, so that was my lovely movement um of the forest bathing experience. And then we drank some tea that was local and native to the area. Um yeah, that was so nice. And then um, then we had a sound bath experience by this incredible practitioner who's been doing it for many years. And she just is magical. So an hour of this beautiful sound waves and instruments all around us while we just closed our eyes and soaked that all in. And then the final experience of the weekend because the weekend was um Thursday through Sunday. So Saturday night we had um my dear good friend Sandy Weiss, who's a physical therapist and a Feldenkrais teacher. Um, I won't get into what Feldenkrais is here now. I have several episodes on Feldenkrais, but anyway, it's basically somatic education. You know, it's letting your body teach you what it needs and how to move. And I use it so much whenever I have some pain in my body to be able to try to help myself uh move out of that. So um the week, the weekend was beautiful. It it was very restorative. Um, I had two women who came. Um, and that was absolutely what was perfect at the time. I mean, yes, it was so awesome, and I wish that there were more people who would have been able to sign up. Um, so yeah, there was a little grieving around just having it be so small, but um I kind of have I kind of feel like this will be the smallest and that most likely this is only only gonna grow with some time. But um, it was sweet. I had the whole lodge to myself, which is pretty nice. And I ended up doing the cooking too. Um, my very dear friend, who was gonna come along with us and be um the the the individual who was gonna prepare meals for us was not able to come due to some illness. And so um I also led um the food part. And that was actually like the first meal was a little stressful because I had it was like the shortest turnaround time for me to get like kind of be leading some things and then turnaround and make the food. But um, and it was also the most like awkward meal because the three of us were at the table and the two women who came are like pretty close and good friends. So um to not talk uh while we were eating, I think felt like super strange. And um I also like I was like, oh my gosh, these green beans were not exactly how I wanted them to be. I wonder if they think that they're gross and I can't even ask them. So much um, so much of what come came out, and then and I'll talk about this in a minute too, because um each day we would also have an hour where we would circle up and just share like what was feeling alive for them, what were they noticing? It was a time to talk if they wanted to talk, but you don't have to talk. And in those conversations, people pleasing came up quite a bit. Um so I'll share more of that here in a minute. But um, so yeah, so the cooking, it was actually super fun because as I just mentioned, my kitchen is under construction here in my house. So to have access to a full working kitchen and everything is like again, like so intentional. Everything I needed was there, immersion blenders, beautiful mixing bowls. Um, it was great. I was like really actually happy to cook. And I was also happy to see it was really fun to create recipes with so many things that I don't really do at home because I'm cooking for three young boys who don't want hemp heart seeds in their salad or pickled onions on their tofu Buddha bowls. You know, they're like, what's that? Eventually, maybe they'll be like that. But right now, that's not how they eat. So it was also really fun just to go wild with um the vegetables and ingredients and really make it um delicious, at least personally speaking. And I did get a lot of positive feedback from the food that they were like, man, is this how you eat all the time? And I was like, I wish. But um, yeah, and like how they were saying I haven't eaten this many plants and this many whole grains and nuts and seeds ever, and it feels really good. So I think that was that was fun for the participants too, just as a dietitian, that was fun for me to be like, if if I was able to feed people and help them, you know, get the amount of plants that we are learning from research that is good for the body, good for most bodies, this is kind of what this would look like. And how does that feel in your body? And I think they felt really great, you know. So the food experience was also awesome. And I got into my groove and then they were so generous to always help clean up. So we all did dishes and we we figured out how to do it without even talking. I would have to leave little notes here and there, like one morning, you know, I would still get up early in the morning and go for a walk. Um, and it was usually dark out. And so I walked out of the lodge door and I felt this big cobweb hit my head on the way out. And when I came back from my walk, I saw this massive spider and a massive spider web. So I didn't want to disturb it. So I just made a little note, you know, please duck when you come in the lodge door. There is a spider. Um, so I had to let people know little things like that. So we would every once in a while just communicate via notes if we needed to um tell something important of importance. Um, I have gotten feedback from the participants about the silent retreat. And, you know, they were nervous before they came. They didn't know what silence was going to be like, they didn't think they could do it. They just they felt pretty like unassured of how this is gonna go and understandably. Um, and then they were like, I didn't want to go home. Um, it was actually shorter. Like I had some people tell me reasons why they couldn't come was that it was too long. And I understand that, especially if there's logistical things that you can't get around. But from the standpoint of letting silence and the nervous system settle, it takes time. And to just do that in a very short weekend is not enough time. So, really, Thursday through Sunday is even cutting it close with that. And um, you know, both participants were like, I actually wish it would have been longer. So that was really good feedback um to hear. And so I think the thing that shocked me the most about the silent retreat um was coming home. And it was really interesting. Like once the retreat was over, I found myself like rushing, like rushing to get out, rushing to put away the groceries um that I had brought to bring back home. And just I was like, I kind of asked myself, like, why am I why am I rushing right now? You know, it was like this is over and now it's time to return to life. I'm still not even sure what that's about. I don't necessarily need to figure it out, but I I did notice that. So when I got home, um, I came home to the same home, you know, a home under construction, a home with a dog that sheds and no one had vacuumed, and it was very hairy all around the house. Um, I came home to um just messes, you know, not my husband had done a beautiful job taking care of the kids, you know, things just were different uh than how the retreat was. The retreat lodge space, everything had a place. Everything was so intentional. And here in my home, things are shoved in drawers and things are just put away as quickly as we can. And I'm staring right now and looking at my dog's like dog cage, and there's stuff piled on top of it. And you know, that's not like this is a complete pig sty, but it's not it was nothing like what felt like the retreat lodge space was like. So I already was feeling a lot of resistance around that. And um, and then my son had my oldest son who had just gotten back from playing golf, came home and threw himself into the chair and turned on the TV to watch sports and was like, Mom, I'm hungry. Can you make me something? You know? And to his credit, he did ask me, How was the silent retreat? And I just didn't even feel like I was like, it was good. I didn't even feel like talking about it. Like I was just so thrown back into life and um and that felt pretty hard, you know. It felt and and then, so I don't know if you all have heard of sort of the the Buddhist um expression, the second arrow. I think I've probably talked about it in this podcast before, but the first arrow is whatever is this pain, right? Whatever kind of is a source of the pain. So the source of that pain was I've just been in this beautiful silent retreat, and I had all this space and time and tidiness and intentionalness, and I'm coming home to what feels like chaos. Um, so first arrow. Second arrow is the one that we sort of put on top of it from a resistance standpoint. So thoughts like, well, I shouldn't even be feeling like this. Should I just got back from a silent retreat? Like, shouldn't I be this content, peaceful, um, I don't know, like better person? I feel none of that right now. Um, so that that should. I think the second arrow is really like the any of the shoulds that we put up put on ourselves. Um and so I was just even feeling some guilt, some guilt about that. And my husband was very kind. I, you know, he just gave me space, which was great. And then the next day I thanked him for that. I was like, thank you for allowing me to just be how I was. Um, you know, because I think if he would have come home from some kind of restorative retreat, I would have expected him to be felt look feel and look more restored. So um, and on the way home um from the silent retreat in the car, I listened to a conversation from um a coach that I I listened to quite a bit. And he brought to my attention something that I think actually became quite obvious when we come home, which is really when I came home, which is really sort of the crux of what I wanted this podcast to be about. And I wrote about this in my my most recent um wellness Wednesday Substack post. Um, and I entitled it Tiny Abandonments. Um and what I mean by tiny abandonments was any time that we aren't honest with ourselves, and maybe we we bend for someone um because we feel badly, or we feel guilt, or we feel like it's what we should do, um, or we feel like that's the responsible thing to do. But basically it's when we do something that really isn't the honest response of what we want to do. And the example he gave in his opening of this um article that I was listening to was maybe you have something that you've got you've got plans with someone and um you receive a text message from them that they can't do it anymore, and you're like, oh my goodness, I wasn't really in the mood to do that tonight anyway, you know. Um, and the question becomes, why were you doing it then? Why were you doing something that you didn't really want to do? Um and I'm I'm kind of thinking it works really well with commitments, right? Things that we're committed to do that we don't want to do. Um, but I think it's also how we how we even act with other people, how we identify with ourselves with others. So even with my children, when often my boys might ask me to do something and maybe I'm in the middle of something else, there might be a little voice that says, Oh, be a good mother and just do that thing for them and do it with kindness, you know? Um, and that's not all, that's not all the way. That's not how it goes all the time. There are times in which I'm like, I'm in the middle of something. Can you handle that yourself? But that's the honest answer, right? An honest answer isn't a right answer because an honest answer could very well be, I want to do that right now. Sure, hon, yeah, I'd love to do that for you. That could be the honest answer. But I think if we look a little bit more carefully at things, so much of how we handle our responses, how we do things is either automated because that's how we've always done it. And and and if we constantly put ourselves out there because and and we're not being honest to actually what we really need or what we really want, um, we are kind of abandoning ourselves. And um it can be it can be so hard because we have been conditioned, and I think he talked about this in his article, from a very early age. And I think about this this morning. Like I had a I had a child this morning who had a bad haircut yesterday and he did not. Want to go to school today. And um he was just having a hard time. And I think there were times in which I was there from him and I I totally understood that. And then there were looks that I probably gave him, like, come on, just get your shit together. Let's just get out the door, you know. Even as little kids, we have sensed when when we're not going along with someone's agenda of what they need, that makes life harder, maybe for yourself, and it makes it harder for them. So we learn with time to acquiesce to other people to make life easier from a very early age. And some of us might have stronger conditioning around that than others. Um and so this kind of returns back to the conversation that we were having at the silent retreat of people pleasing. And, you know, what was interesting is we would be having a conversation about how we would see ourselves people pleasing, therefore tiny abandoning some of the things that we actually need. And but then, like one of us, one of the three of us would kind of come to some some conclusion, like, well, but I mean, that's what that's what you have to do sometimes in a relationship. You have to you have to have their sacrifices, right? Or um, well, if I didn't do that, they would think I was a total, like selfish a whole, you know. Um and so that is the next part that this article really encouraged me to look at is what is what is on the other side of the fear around someone thinking I'm a total a-hole. Um, because that is a really hard feeling for someone to think that you're selfish. And and maybe maybe they do. Maybe you say I can't do that commitment. End of story, like nothing else to say. I'm sorry I can't do that commitment. Um, because I will find myself saying, I'm sorry I can't do that commitment. I have da-da-da-da-da. Let me explain myself. Let me show you why you should understand why I can't do this commitment, right? Um I just had a text message exchange the other day with someone who was gonna take my kid to a practice, and she mentioned something about like a tiny little difficulty in there that might be a bit tricky for for her to get the kids to a practice. So I initially wanted to come in there and be like, oh, don't worry about it. Let me see if I can rearrange things, or or another thing I might say was, you know what, I'm gonna get them next time. Because it is so hard to sit here at least, I'll speak for myself, with um letting that just be what that is. They said that it might be hard for them to do that, but they did not say, I can't do that, or they did not say, I need help with that. If they said that, to me, that's when I could come in and think, okay, how she's asking for help. Let me see how I can respond, you know. So it a thousand times a day, maybe that's a bigger number than it's necessary. Several times a day, there are likely things where I am not being honest with what I either actually want, feel, or need. Because I am afraid of what sits on the other side of that if I own that or I am honest with that. And so the stark difference of not having to think so much about that in the silent retreat, giving full permission that if someone walks in the door of the lodge and I was sitting there on the couch, I didn't have to look up and be like, I didn't do that. I was just giving them space to have what they needed, and I was having the space of what was needed here. And it did feel weird, but it was really good practice, you know, it was really good practice. And um, and that doesn't mean that all of a sudden we're gonna be cold and we're not gonna say hi if we don't want to say, you know, it doesn't need to be that complicated. I think it just we just I'm I am just looking at how I can be more honest with myself. Um, another example I gave in my article was I was tired. I am tired a lot. I think perimenopausal number one freaking symptom is fatigue, right? And that is so real. I could go to bed at eight o'clock and still feel tired the next day. But anyway, I I digress. Um, so I like to get in bed early, and um, my husband takes care of putting my youngest to bed, which is kind of that agreement. Um, but every once in a while, guilt will creep in. Oh, I should go put him to bed tonight. I haven't read to him in a long time or whatever. And um, but that's not the truth how I actually feel. What I actually feel in need is tired and I want to go to sleep. And um, and a lot of times that hits me right before I go to bed. You know, all doesn't it seem like things always wash over you right before you go to bed, but um, but I'm like, no, the honest, what I honestly want to do is be here in my bed right now. He is well taken care of. I don't even need to say that, right? That is trying to land somewhere. Um, I can just sit with, it is okay for me to take care of my own needs, period. And kind of going back to um the the circle of the three of us talking about people pleasing, it was just so hard for us just to be like, yeah, it is gonna feel scary or weird to not want to come around and make it okay, um, or not try to clean it up so it feels good for both people. Um so that's what I'm playing around with. And that's actually probably what some of the beautiful insights that came after the silent retreat. I think that's all I want to say about that. Um this Substack, or not the Substack, this uh Here and Human podcast. We are doing video now. So I am gonna have video for that, which will be kind of cool for you to see the guests that come on the podcast. That is gonna be one update. Um, I also have the podcast not only on McDaniel Nutrition's website now, but also we have that on my Here and Human Wellness website. I created a website where I have archived all of my articles and I've categorized them into like nourish, so things around nutrition-related articles, midlife-related articles, family-related articles, and then what I call being human articles. Most of those being human articles are my Wednesday posts, which are for paid subscribers, which I'm super grateful for, paid subscribers. Thank you so much for supporting my work. Um, and then the Friday posts are always remaining free. And those are also where those five recipes will be included at the end of every uh submission. So, anyway, I am still gonna sign off Love You More. And thank you for being here. And thank you for being here for the first episode of our new podcast here and Human Wellness.