LDS Podcast "Latter-Day Lights" - Inspirational LDS Stories

Preserving Hyrum’s Heirlooms & A Heaven-Sent Second Chance: Joe Skeen's Story - Latter-Day Lights

• Scott Brandley and Alisha Coakley

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When Heaven hands you another chance at life, what legacy will you protect for your bloodline?

This Sunday on Latter-Day Lights, hosts Scott and Alisha welcome Joseph Smith Skeen to the show. As a direct descendant of Hyrum Smith, Joe unveils how near-death and a second chance at life became the spark that led him to safeguard his ancestor’s relics—from Alvin’s toolbox that once cradled the gold plates, to Hyrum’s bullet-scarred pocket watch, and even Civil War rifles used at Carthage.

Now an author of devotional books drawn from decades of faith-driven experiences, Joe weaves God’s calling, family heirlooms, and profound revelations into a testimony that proves the Lord can preserve hearts and history all at once.

Tune in to Joe’s story to discover how tangible relics and personal miracles intertwine, leaving you with fresh resolve to trace, treasure, and testify to the sacred narratives in your own family for generations to come.

*** Please SHARE Joe's story and help us spread hope and light to others. ***

To WATCH this episode, visit: https://youtu.be/7QAIlCNLGNs

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To READ Joe's first book, "Testimony: How to Find Peace and Strength in a Troubled World," visit: https://a.co/d/eFVf4j9

To READ Joe's second book, "Today's Thought: For Missionaries and Families," visit: https://a.co/d/hIMCcoc

To READ Joe's third book, "Affirmation: Stories and Artifacts of Joseph, Hyrum, and The Smith Family" (use code AFFIRM20 for 20% off,) visit: https://www.ssstechnologies.net/store/AFFIRMATION-Stories-and-Artifacts-of-Joseph-Hyrum-and-the-Smith-Family-p670324639

To READ Scott’s book “Faith to Stay,” visit: https://www.faithtostay.com/

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Also, if you have a faith-promoting or inspiring story, or know someone who does, please let us know by going to https://www.latterdaylights.com and reaching out to us.

Scott Brandley:

Hey there as a Latter-day Lights listener, I want to give you a very special gift today my brand new book, faith to Stay. This book is filled with inspiring stories, powerful discoveries and even fresh insights to help strengthen your faith during the storms of life. So if you're looking to be inspired, uplifted and spiritually recharged, just visit faithtostaycom. Now let's get back to the show. Hey everyone, I'm Scott Brandley.

Alisha Coakley:

And I'm Alisha Coakley. Every member of the church has a story to share, one that can instill faith, invite growth and inspire others.

Scott Brandley:

On today's episode we're going to hear how one descendant of Hiram Smith has been able to grow and develop his testimony in the gospel. Welcome to Latter-day Lights. Hey everyone, welcome back to another episode of Latter-day Lights. We're so glad you're here with us today. We have a really special treat. We'd like to introduce our special guest today, joseph Smith Skeen. Welcome, joe.

Joe Skeen:

I'm glad to be here. Thanks for having me.

Alisha Coakley:

Yeah, of course I have to say I'm curious Is the Smith a middle name or is it a double last name? How do you? Like you've got some history there with that. Obviously, Tell me a little bit about the name.

Joe Skeen:

So my parents, my mother, is in the Smith family and she was the daughter of Elder G Smith. I don't know if you remember him, but a lot of people like to say his name and they don't know Other people go. Oh yeah, I remember him. He was the last church patriarch.

Alisha Coakley:

Oh, okay.

Joe Skeen:

Yeah, so she had a name of Smith as her maiden name, and when my mom and dad got married, all of the boys in the family got Smith as their middle name.

Alisha Coakley:

Oh, that's really cool, that's really cool. I like that and it's easy to remember. You can yell at all your kids and you're going to get at least part of their name, right, right.

Joe Skeen:

It depends on how you yell it, I guess.

Scott Brandley:

Oh, that's cool.

Alisha Coakley:

Well, Joe, tell us a little bit more about yourself.

Joe Skeen:

So for probably about the last 40 years I've been a software developer, have a wonderful wife and five boys. Each of them are married, and so now I've got five daughters-in-law.

Alisha Coakley:

Oh, that's cool. And now I've got five daughters-in-law oh that's cool, and currently I've got 10 grandchildren. So yeah, I love my family baby, and then you'll actually have more grandchildren than you have children in in-law children yeah the scales will tip to that side.

Joe Skeen:

But the grandchildren are the best. They're your reward for making sure you take care of the kids when they're young.

Scott Brandley:

Yeah.

Joe Skeen:

You can just spoil the grandkids and send them home.

Alisha Coakley:

Oh, that's fun Cool. And then where do you guys live right now?

Joe Skeen:

So we live in Dushane Utah.

Alisha Coakley:

Okay.

Joe Skeen:

We used to live in the Salt Lake Valley. We came out here a few years back. Beautiful area.

Alisha Coakley:

I feel like all of Utah is. It's just I mean I'm biased, but Utah is just so damn pretty everywhere you go, you know. So are you guys like, is that northern, southern central? Where in Utah is that?

Joe Skeen:

There's so many different things in Utah too, just a lot of variety of different types of landscapes.

Alisha Coakley:

Yeah.

Scott Brandley:

So where is Duchesne located, Joe?

Joe Skeen:

Oh, in Utah, no. So do you know where Vernal is? Uh-huh. So if you're going from Salt Lake to Vernal, you're going to go right through Duchesne to get there.

Alisha Coakley:

Oh, okay, Perfect yeah that's a pretty area. You're right.

Joe Skeen:

Yeah, we're about an hour before hitting Vernal.

Alisha Coakley:

Okay.

Joe Skeen:

I've got one that lives out in Vernal, so I've got one son that lives out in Vernal.

Alisha Coakley:

Well, I know, along with software developing, you have a talent for writing. Is that right?

Joe Skeen:

Yeah, I've actually written three books Wow, which, if you want to see which ones they are. My first book I ever wrote was this. It's called Testimony how to Find Peace and Strength in a Troubled World. There's a big story behind that one. I'll touch on that. The second book I wrote was Today's Thought.

Joe Skeen:

This one is a collection of emails and thoughts that I sent to my missionaries. I had at one point three of my boys in the mission field at the same time. My wife would handle the emails for the regular day-to-day stuff and I thought, gee, what can I do to really support my missionaries? And so today's thought. I would study the scriptures on the way to work when we were living in town, there on the train, and I'd ponder the things that I would read and try to come up with something to share with my boys. So then I'd share them a thought about that scripture and quote of it. And more often than not my boys came back to me and said you know that thought you just sent me it was exactly what our investigator needed. So yeah, so I tried to keep track of all those emails. One of my sons came to me after his mission and says whatever you do. Don't lose those things. Those are wonderful thoughts. So I went into a book.

Alisha Coakley:

That's so sweet. I love that.

Joe Skeen:

And then the third book that I wrote is this one. It's a bigger one. Oh yeah, it's called Affirmation Stories and Artifacts of Joseph and Hiram and the Smith Family. Hiram and the Smith family. So my grandfather had artifacts that he received, was handed down from Hiram to John Smith, to Hiram Fisher, to Hiram Gibbs, to my grandfather, elder G Smith, father to son, oldest son, and he would go around doing firesides about the artifacts, sharing his testimony of the restoration of the gospel. So when he passed away, these artifacts were donated to the church and they're on display in the Church History Museum.

Joe Skeen:

That's neat, but there's not much information on it there. You know they've got little placards with just a little blurb, Right. Some of them are not even on display because you know they don't display everything they have Right. So what I did is I first set out to write this book to especially honor my grandfather and these artifacts and I kind of grew into more than that. And I kind of grew into more than that.

Joe Skeen:

The first part of the book is it covers more of a historical dialogue of the restoration, and then I show where the artifacts played a part throughout the whole thing, like Alvin's toolbox and even Hiram's clothes when he was martyred. I've got all kinds of stuff in there. In the process I found other artifacts from some of my Smith cousins that they shared with me. That I included in here and then in the back of the book is just the artifacts. So it's like two pieces.

Joe Skeen:

And I'd seen some artifact books that show little teeny, tiny pictures and then they have some kind of dry blurb about it. But in my book I include, like here's, lots of like landscape pictures, just beautiful pictures, large pictures of the artifacts. I include a lot of little-known stories about the Smith family and some insights and things that very few people know, Like my grandfather he had. I don't know if you know what Alvin's toolbox is. I could go on and on and on kinds of things, so I won't do too much here, but Alvin's toolbox is the box that first held the gold plates when Joseph brought them home.

Scott Brandley:

Okay.

Joe Skeen:

And one day my grandfather was rubbing oil into this box and it wouldn't take in one corner of it because the plates gold and other especially soft metals. If you rub them on something, a little bit of that metal rubs off and metal will not oil. Wow, Little things like that, you know. Shortly after that I went to visit my grandfather and he said oh, come here, come here, you got to see this. It's really exciting. And I saw it and, sure enough, the description of Joseph's size of the plates was about the area that would not take oil. So really interesting. But that's, yeah, that's my third, third book and it's 220 pages long, full color. Wow, uh, hardback with the dust cover on there just a beautiful book. I'm really pleased with the way it turned out looks gorgeous yeah, it looks really nice.

Joe Skeen:

Well, thank you. It took a lot of work. My third son was the editor for that book and he did a marvelous job on it. He came up with the design for the layout and so forth, and it took us about six years to produce that book. Nice.

Alisha Coakley:

That's cool and it took us about six years to produce that book Nice. So that's cool. So let's talk a little bit about your story, like what you want to share today, on the podcast when does your story start?

Joe Skeen:

So actually, as far as I can remember back and I have very early memories, even when I was in diapers in my parents' house I've always known the church was true. I always knew Joseph was a prophet. Some of that may have stemmed from being so close to some of these artifacts and having my grandfather, who shared that often. I remember times he would come to our house and and do a fireside. He he'd do them all over the place but show facts. I used to sneak into his office and play with these artifacts which you cringe and touch those. But I actually told that to my mom and and she laughed and said she did it too. So I'm not too bad about it. That's cool. I'm sure my grandfather did it too.

Alisha Coakley:

Oh, probably.

Joe Skeen:

It runs in the family. So being a member of the Smith family is certainly a blessing to me, but it does not guarantee that you have a strong testimony or even a testimony at all, because, just like in any family, you've got some people who I mean they've got their free agency and they make their choices. And so I've seen many members I'm not saying majority, anything like that but anytime you have members of the family that stray or make choices to go away from the gospel, it's difficult, and it's hard especially when they're closer to you. My uncle, my grandfather's son, actually was an alcoholic sweetest guy, but he was never very close, and there are other examples. That's just one example. He passed away years ago, but so just being in the Smith family it was a great thing. It is a wonderful heritage and a lot of things I can fall back on that help strengthen my testimony. But along the way I've had other experiences and that's some of the things I do cover in my testimony book.

Joe Skeen:

So to start with, when I was very young I was in early elementary we had a very cold, hard winter one year and I wasn't able to go outside very often so I kind of had cabin fever, and I remembered the previous summer being out in our backyard. We had a nice big backyard and I would climb this willow tree and we had an apple tree. But I wanted to be outside again, just like I was past summer. So this one February there was kind of a little thaw, that a lot of the snow was melted away and so I invited a friend over to play in my backyard. Well, this is February, the ground is still frozen.

Joe Skeen:

So I'm out there in the backyard with my friend and I decided to climb this willow tree and I told my friend hey, you know, last summer I mean here I'm a little kid I wasn't thinking very well, but last summer I saw katydids up here. I'll show you where they were. Maybe they'll be there. You know, I didn't know they were gone. So I climbed this tree and he's playing around in the yard. I get up about 20 feet up roughly. I never measured it, but it was up relatively high and I was looking around trying to say, okay, where was that that? So I shift my weight and grab this branch and the branch gives way. So I fell down and landed on this frozen ground and broke about every bone on my body.

Alisha Coakley:

Now I don't know that I broke every bone.

Joe Skeen:

But I say about because I don't know that I broke every bone, but I say about because I don't know how many I broke. It was bad enough that I actually hit the ground and bounced over onto my other side. I hit hard enough that I had blood come out of my left ear. That was how bad it was. I couldn't hardly even breathe.

Joe Skeen:

My friend, who is kind of scared, he runs up what do I do? What do I do? He's frantic. I couldn't hardly even breathe so I just very hard tried to squeak out get my mom. He just goes running, doesn't knock on the door. Just right through the back door my mom comes, picks me up, throws me the uh, the van onto a seat, which you know these days, there again, you're not supposed to do that, right, yeah, but anyway. So she throws me, the van, takes me down to the clinic. Now the clinic. They try to patch me up a little bit. They tried to patch me up a little bit and I had a broken wrist, broken foot, broken and cracked ribs, multiple concussions. The doctors told my parents just be aware, he's not going to make it through the night.

Alisha Coakley:

Really.

Joe Skeen:

Yeah.

Alisha Coakley:

Wow it was bad.

Joe Skeen:

So that night I did pass away. I remember seeing myself on the other side of the hospital room and then going through the veil, but then I was sent back. So I knew when I was coming back that I'd make it, you know, and from there I was. I took a long time to recover, but I did survive. I never told anybody about this for years, in fact. I couldn't tell anybody. Every time I tried to write it down or even tell anybody, my mind would just go blank.

Alisha Coakley:

Really you just forget.

Joe Skeen:

Well, but I would kick myself because you know they're always saying you got to share your testimony. Well, here I'd had this experience where I know God lives. I've been onto the other side and came back, yet I could not tell anybody to the other side and came back.

Joe Skeen:

Yet I could not tell anybody. So even on my mission, I had a companion one time who said to me one day Elder, what if we woke up tomorrow and found out everything we have been teaching is not true? I couldn't even tell him why I knew that he can't say that.

Joe Skeen:

So I just had to assure him. Just trust me, elder, it is true, I actually told my wife before I told my mom. But I told them just very sketchy brief that something happened like that. When I told my mom she said that doesn't surprise me. The doctor said you wouldn't live. So it wasn't a big surprise to her. Oh, wow.

Joe Skeen:

Yeah, I even tried telling my or writing a letter to my brother-in-law, who was struggling at one point with alcohol and other things, and he was in the hospital and we weren't sure he was going to make it and I thought, oh here I've got to tell him, put down a couple of words in the letter and nothing, just went blank.

Joe Skeen:

So, however, one night years later, my mother-in-law who was just an amazing lady her, my mother-in-law, who was just an amazing lady, just a saint lived a wonderful life. But I think it was on a 4th of July. She was in her house and she just collapsed. They rushed her to the hospital. And so we go to the hospital and they tell us that she's not going to make it through the day. And a number of my wife's siblings had strayed from the church and they were sitting there in the waiting room and just really somber you could tell it was just tearing them apart and my wife and I, yes, we felt badly about what happened to my mother-in-law, but we knew she was going in a good place. She was a wonderful lady.

Joe Skeen:

So, it didn't affect us the same, but seeing their faces just really tore my heart apart, thinking, oh, how could I tell them? And all of a sudden it was like being hit over the head with a spiritual two-by-four Thunk it's time to write. And from that day on, things just flowed faster than I could write them down, which was totally different. It was weird. So I was writing things down and trying to organize things, but then one night I was awakened in the middle of the night and the Spirit said here's the topics that I want in your testimony book. Write them down. Oh man, I'm tired. I'll write them in the morning, lord. No, write them now. Tired. I'll write them in the morning, lord. No, write them now.

Alisha Coakley:

no, really I'll write it in the morning.

Joe Skeen:

I'm tired, I'll remember. No, write it. You know anything? He's just saying, no, do it now. So I scrounged around for paper and it's dark and, you know, scribbled out a bunch of topics. I don't didn't know if I could even read it in the morning, but amazingly enough, I could and I still have the paper. But so it kind of gave me a framework to work on on this, this first book, and the words just kept coming, just poured out. I got to where I had it organized and gave it to my brother and his wife to just kind of proofread it. See where I was at, and they kept saying, oh, you've got to do more experiences You've got to do. I said, no, these are the topics I was told. If I'm told that by the story, that's what I'm doing. If we do other experiences, I'll do them in other books. So, anyway, so that one, that's how that book came about and it has a number of other experiences in there that I've had throughout my life and they're all based on kind of testimony, building ideas. So, and that's how I came up with that subtitle how to Find Peace and Strength in a Troubled World.

Joe Skeen:

And this is back in 2017, I think, when I published that first and I thought, okay, great Lord, I did exactly what you wanted. I'm going to start looking at ways to promote this book, get it out there so it can help people. And I started doing the research and kind of planning things. And here again, another prompt it's not time yet. What do you mean? It's not time? I put all my time into this. I've been waiting to do this for so long. No, it's not time. Okay, well, if the Lord says it's not time, it's not time.

Joe Skeen:

So I set it aside and it was not very long after that I started writing the artifacts book. So I think the Lord had that in mind, saying, okay, it's about time. And in the meantime, my grandfather passed away and the artifacts I mean certain events just said it's time to do that one now. I mean certain events just said it's time to do that one now, anyway, so that's how the second, that first book, came in, and then that third one. The second one was actually in the middle of all of this stuff, so that's when my boys were out on their missions. So, anyway, there are a lot of lessons to be learned about experience, about being you know, my passing away and coming back, but the biggest thing is that God does live. There is absolutely no question about that, and some people have bigger experiences, some people have lower ones, some of them are just are probably a lot better than me, because the spirit just tells them they know, you know instead of that experience?

Joe Skeen:

I guess I don't know, but um, I know that he lives and it gave me strength to be able to overcome a lot of challenges that came after that. Um, just kind of give you an idea when I became a deacon we had 14 deacons in our quorum, the quorum's 12. We had 14. So we had a lot of kids. There were a lot of young men in similar age, especially in my stake throughout. So by the time I became a priest I was the only one on the table. Time I became a priest I was the only one on the table. The rest were gone out of the church or there were one or two of them that would come occasionally but sit in the back, would never go to the table and say, no, we're not worthy, we can't do that. One of those guys did come. I found out later he turned his life around and went on a mission. So I was glad to hear about that. But that was. I didn't hear that till later, after I'd moved away from that ward.

Joe Skeen:

In our stake the whole stake, three young men graduated from seminary the year I graduated from seminary and you know there was a lot of us.

Joe Skeen:

So there were some challenges. A lot of my peers at the time when I was a child were kind of enticed to go the route into like drugs and other kinds of things, and it kind of just took them away. There were times that I was chased down and even beaten. One time they chased me down and tried to force drugs in my mouth, and I wouldn't do it, of course, because of what I knew. I knew what the truth was and in that case, when they chased me down and tried to get drugs in my mouth, all of a sudden all at once all jumped up and ran away, as though somebody had come to chase them away. I was on my way to school actually at that point, so my books and things were just all over the lawn where they tackled me, and so I got up, looked around. I was going to thank the person who. So I got up, looked around, I was going to thank the person who chased the kids off. There's no one in sight anywhere.

Joe Skeen:

So I still, to this day, don't know unless the Lord intervened somehow and just got them off my back. Anyway, there were things like that that were difficult, but that was about the time I was in middle school and that was a very difficult time for me. Middle school was really hard. So, needless to say, as a young boy in middle school, walking to school without any friends and walking home alone was very difficult. So I started trying to say, well, gee, how can I get people to like me, how can I find a friend? And of course at that point most of my peers would go around swearing. Unfortunately, I learned a few colorful words and thought, oh, maybe it will help me be accepted by some of them. So I picked up some colorful words and of course I was careful not to say it around my mom or dad.

Joe Skeen:

But I knew it was wrong, but just trying to fit in. But I knew it was wrong but just trying to fit in. After that went on for a little while I was out in my backyard and our backyard kind of bordered a gully. So we had our big backyard and then this fence and this big gully, which was kind of cool because I'd just go down there and I was in nature down there. Like I said, Right, yeah.

Joe Skeen:

It was fun, it was great. So we'd often go back there and I remember one time I had been down there and I'd come back into our backyard and I was walking up towards our house and I heard this voice call my name, my full name, and at first I thought, oh, my older brothers are playing a trick on me. So I look all over the place, there is nobody around anywhere and I hear my name again and I go oh my, I know what this is. So I answer, I said yay, Lord. And then I hear the Lord tell me your conduct is not in line with someone of your calling. And yeah, it's like okay, I better change.

Joe Skeen:

During that time I felt that there's just some interesting things, especially as I pondered over the years, that I reflect back and I go man. It wasn't just that experience, but there's so many things I learned from this, even over time. During that time I felt such tremendous feeling of love that is entirely incomprehensible, greater than any worldly thing I've ever felt. If you were to try to compare the most love that you've ever felt from anybody here on this earth and compare it with God's love, it's almost like trying to compare a splash of water in your face to the Pacific Ocean. It is just infinite. In fact, the Pacific Ocean isn't even enough. It's infinite and it's eternal. God loves you so much.

Joe Skeen:

However, at the exact same time, I felt a huge, very strong disappointment, just enough to kind of crush you. I knew what I'd done had been wrong, you know. So you know, I had a short little conversation in which I promised the Lord I would never use those words again, ever. That's a tall order, you know. If anybody's gotten you swearing boy, they just roll off your tongue, you know. But I never, ever have done that again. I've never relapsed, and I think that's due to the fact that I remembered a lot of things that and I think President Monson used to tell us maybe even President Kimball too, way back then. You know, if you have a bad thought, come to your mind, sing a hymn from church or something like that, and so I used some of those things and often prayed for strength. So I had to rely on the Lord a lot, and if somebody like me, average Joe, can do it, anyone can do it. You know, the fact that he had said someone of your calling, instead someone of your calling. My conduct was not in line with someone of your calling didn't mean, you know, for a time it kind of bothered me thinking you know, wow, what am I supposed to be doing? But really what it is. All of us have that same calling. We're all children of God. We've come down here to learn and to grow and to choose the pathway back to our Heavenly Father. It really applies to everybody, and so over the years I've realized that this experience was not just for me. It was to help other people and to help them know they can do it, they can overcome things, they can follow the savior. It doesn't matter what you've been into or or how easy it is, you just slide back into it, step you know, stand up and do it again. You know, try again, don't give up. So it, try again, don't give up.

Joe Skeen:

So as I reflect over that experience, I see it as almost a preview of what we're all going to go through at the end of the world. We're all going to stand before the judgment bar of Christ. And you know, when I was younger I thought, you know, I'd read the thing where every knee will bow and every tongue confess. The Lord is going to force you to confess or say that it's going to come freely, because you will remember who you are, you'll remember your past, living with our Heavenly Father, and you'll feel his love. I mean, there's no gee, I'm smooth, talking my way out of this. He knows, and you know, he knows and you know that's the kind of experience we're going to be in. And so if somebody thinks they're going to be able to, you know, talk smooth, get their way out of it or put the blame on someone else or whatever, they've got kind of a sad reality that's coming. It's not right, it's just not going to work. But on the other hand, if you're following the gospel and you're doing what you're supposed to do, trying, even if you're not perfect. It's going to be a wonderful experience and I'd rather be on that end of it. That's what it has to be.

Joe Skeen:

I've also kind of from that experience I've heard over the years it comes and goes people try to twist other people by saying, well, if you don't accept my behavior, you don't love me. Right Now, from this experience, there's no way that God can be anything else than loving. But it doesn't mean that he loves everything you do, right, you know, yeah. So the love that he has for us, he's always got his hand out there saying, hey, I'm not pleased with what you're doing, but here's my hand, come on, let's go, come this way. He's always there beckoning us to come. So that's another thing I kind of got out of that experience. The other thing I got out of it is often we think, you know, we're supposed to love the Lord with all our might, and what's the love of Christ? Charity is the true love of Christ, but what it really is is we need to love like Christ loves. So just like the Savior says, hey, your conduct, it isn't right, but I still love you. We need to be that way with our fellow men. We need to love them, even if they're doing something that we think is terrible, they shouldn't do and I've seen that with some of my peers. I still love them. You know, we need to be um.

Joe Skeen:

One little story I put into my testimony book too is one day um. It may have actually come from a dream, cause I remember coming up with this. I had this dream that I was. I saw this man traveling on a mountain trail. He was traveling alone and he gets around this curve and finds the trail suddenly drops off to a cliff and fortunately he sees it before going over and decides okay, I've got to turn around and go back. Turns around and goes back and after a little while encounters another company headed the same trail, same direction, and this man says look, don't go that way, it's trouble, you are going to be in trouble, it's going to be painful, you may die, I don't know, but it's really bad. And this everybody in that company just scoffs and scorns this man and says no, you're just trying to control me. You know, I want to do what I want to do. This is an easier trail. I'm gonna take this. It was heartbreaking for this man. But what could he do? He had to let them go and hope that they can fare better.

Joe Skeen:

But that kind of a, that little parable or story is really what I have done, cause I've I've had to be kind of the lone guy and I tell my peers, hey, don't go that way. And that's exactly what they did to me. So I kind of tell that parable or story to other people now to hope that they can see that. Okay, going down there, I've seen that drop off. I had that experience. I don't want you to have to go through it.

Joe Skeen:

And the sons of Mosiah man I understand how they feel they went through the same kind of thing, elma the Younger, and they said the thought of any other humans going through that kind of an experience just made them shake and treble. They didn't want anybody else to have to run into that kind of an experience, just made them shake and treble. You know they just they didn't want anybody else to have to hand, you know, run into that kind of thing. So that's that's what I've, that little story I I got and I put into that book I it's similar to my experience and to my experience and it does. I see people make these choices, to go down a path that's going to lead to trouble later on, and it really breaks my heart and I know that our Savior it's the same thing. You know Jesus wept. He does have those emotions. He does care for us and it does hurt to see somebody take a pathway that's going to hurt them in the long run. Anyway, so those are some of the things that I learned from that experience.

Scott Brandley:

I like that story.

Joe Skeen:

Yeah. So and you'd ask me you know what stories am I going to put in here? And these play together and they're kind of big things. There are other stories I've had lots of experiences over this time but those kind of play together and they kind of hit the core of what the leaders of the church have been telling us.

Joe Skeen:

Especially when you're trying to share the gospel with somebody else, first thing, you do you love them, right, and you serve them too. But before you even do that you have to have a testimony. I mean, you love them anyway. But those two things go together. And if you love them, how do we love them? Is it conditional? Shouldn't be. You should be like our Savior's love for us. And that is unconditional, infinite, doesn't mean we love everything they do. But they are children of God and they are here to learn and grow and sometimes they do make mistakes and you know, we can kind of be the Savior's hand, have our hand out there to help them along, if they'll take it Anyway. So those are some of the stories.

Joe Skeen:

I don't think I'll get into any of the others but over the years, many of which I've shared with some people, but I wish I could reach more people in the hopes that I could help them turn their hearts to the Savior. That's where I started writing some of these books. I've got many more books I think will be coming, because I've already been thinking about some of the other things that I've done, like when I had that experience with the colorful words to overcome that man. That's one of the hardest things to do because Satan likes to just throw it into your mind and it just comes out of your mouth before you even think about it.

Joe Skeen:

And I've talked to some people, and some are very good LDS people. They're wonderful people and yet every other word they're throwing out some kind of language. And you know some of the brethren have been saying language matters and you know some of the brethren have been saying language matters and the thing is is if you can learn to control your tongue it even talks about that in the old testament, clear back then curb your tongue. But if you can learn to control that, it's actually teaching you how to overcome other things too. I don't know if you you've ever heard about the book Atomic Habits. You read that one or heard of it?

Alisha Coakley:

Yeah, it's really good.

Joe Skeen:

It's awesome Many times.

Joe Skeen:

The only thing about it that I did not like.

Joe Skeen:

I mean it was a great book, but I just wish it had a gospel perspective, because I started reading that book and I go, man, this guy was following me around.

Joe Skeen:

As a kid I did a lot of these things because to overcome it, you start with little pieces and you start building on them, little at a time that's what atomic habits are Start one and another one, and then pretty soon you've got so many of them that it becomes strong and you never go back to what you're doing. So, yeah, that's the idea behind it. So I I even thought of maybe doing in one of my books some of those concepts, but from a gospel perspective and with with the gospel story. So so, yeah, I did some artifact videos. You know, touching back on that one, a good friend of mine, robert Hatch he's a video kind of a guy and he produced some videos for Living Scriptures on the restoration artifacts. Me and my mom were both in portions of those videos telling about the story of the restoration, these artifacts and the Smith family. I have those links to those videos on my website for the book, the artifact book.

Alisha Coakley:

That's neat.

Joe Skeen:

Do you?

Alisha Coakley:

have a favorite artifact, like one that, just like man, you wish you had kept it in your family, or one you really love to talk about or show off.

Joe Skeen:

Yeah, all of them.

Alisha Coakley:

Oh.

Joe Skeen:

Yeah, it's hard to see them go, but there's some good and bad about that. The good thing about it is they are now on display, that more people that are able to go to the museum there can see them there. The bad part is they don't have all of the stories and background there.

Joe Skeen:

But you say, okay, the artifacts, which one do? I wish I had, yeah, all of them, but I know they're not available. However, one of the reasons I did the book is because I don't want people to forget about the artifacts. I don't want them to miss the the um tie that it has between us and the past. In fact, in the very start of this I kind of in the introduction, I put a shameless plug on family history. Everybody has a story. Now, they've got the story, and your ancestors have stories. It's not just Smith's, it's not just the Skeens, it's not just anybody else. Everybody has it in their ancestry. And if they dig back and find some of those stories, they're not just for you either. They can help other people. So that's why, when I saw your website or your podcast, I thought that fits in with exactly what I was thinking is man, everybody's got stories. We've got to share them. Yeah, help other people out.

Joe Skeen:

So of the artifacts that are still there, I got to thinking you know, I'd love to share this with people. I could do firesides. I've got really good professional pictures of all the artifacts. I could do it remotely. I did my first one and didn't have much to show anyone. I was afraid everybody was falling asleep. You know, I took a slide. Okay, it was still okay. I was able to share my testimony and the things with it. There's something about having the physical artifacts. So what I started doing is I started collecting different artifacts from those period time periods. I actually have a rifle from a very similar time period to the one that Hiram had and in fact it even has an octagonal bore in the middle of the barrel barrel, just like Hiram's did. So I've got that, I've. I actually made a replica of Alvin's toolbox because I had the exact dimensions of the inside and I wanted people to be able to see what those plates fit into.

Scott Brandley:

Oh yeah.

Joe Skeen:

I've seen people make replicas of plates and they're huge. And there are some historians who say, oh, joseph was wrong, it couldn't have been that size. Well, I would take Joseph's word over anybody else. He's the one that handled them, yeah, but you see replicas that people make and these plates are just gigantic. Because they say, oh, there's no way they could have written all of this on those plates for the Book of Mormon. And yet Joseph's description only a third of the book was even there and the rest was sealed. Third of the book was even there and the rest was sealed.

Joe Skeen:

But the description of the plates from Joseph was about six inches wide, six inches tall and six inches deep. So six, eight and eight. And that fits perfectly into that box and, like I said, the oil wouldn't go into that one corner where the plates were. So I know that had to be the size. I've even gotten some of the plates that I put together and we're trying to make a replica of the plates. They won't be gold, they're actually just silver sheet metal, but to give people an idea of what the size really was and how heavy they were. And let me tell you, any that much's heavy even the 68.

Joe Skeen:

Um, I did had some of this stuff at a fireside. They did for my son out in vernal and we handed the plates to one of the teenagers there, who is bishop's son, eager to. Oh yeah, I can hold that. And unfortunately we did not warn him. We hadn't put the rings around him yet. We just just said we're still working on the rings. We hand it to him and he grabs it and, oh, he drops In the process. He scratched himself too. Dang it, not kind of bad.

Joe Skeen:

Anyway, I've been collecting a lot of things like that, like a replica Book of Mormon, even some stuff. My grandfather didn't have A sword from the time period similar to the sword that Hiram had. It's actually a Civil War period. It's not quite as defined, but it's a replica. That one's not an actual old one. The rifle is it's well over a hundred years old A watch similar to what Hiram had when he was martyred. So I can show them. You know, okay, this is where he had it. I even got a vest so I can show them where it was. And and the you know the events inside Carthage jail and the events inside.

Joe Skeen:

Carthage GL. You can understand that and, incidentally, there are lots of theories about the Carthage GL, too, that are floating around, and some are very opinionated. But whether you believe that Hiram was shot immediately, as he was hit in the front and from the back at the same time, or he spun around, or does it really matter you?

Joe Skeen:

know he died, so it doesn't matter. However, my uncle did a lot of and here he is an attorney, so he dig digs into very solid evidence to kind of show what actually happened that day, even though nobody was actually standing there taking notes. They were asked later and everybody's fighting for their lives. So they really can't tell you really good details. But from the things that my uncle had found and I include that in the book too the events had to be in such a way that saved John Taylor's life and Willard Richards' life, Because if Hiram had been shot both in the front and the back and the mob ran downstairs when Joseph jumped out, john Taylor and Willard Richards never would have escaped the jail.

Joe Skeen:

They came back up to finish the job. They saw Hiram on the floor, shot him multiple times after that, which there's evidence because there's no blood on any of those other bullet holes they didn't know he was dead yet, right, but by that time Willard and John Taylor were no longer in that room. He'd taken them around into the jail room, the cell room, and so the people went in and they were primarily after Joseph and Hiram, but they wanted to kill everybody in the cell. I covered that. There's eyewitnesses who heard them say that even but, um.

Joe Skeen:

So john taylor is over in that cell room. He's covered in basically a straw mattress over there not very good. Willard richards is standing there. He's a big man, he's a sitting duck. He did not expect to live through that. But they went up and, knowing they wanted to kill Hiram, they walk over, kick him over just like Joseph. They prop him up against the well and shoot him several more times. They roll him over onto his front and shoot them through the back. The bullet hole went straight through all of his clothing and hit the watch. So I know it was actually straight. You couldn't have done it from the outside, because that's an angle from the they're on a second story, okay, and there was only one hole in the door so he couldn't have had two shots come through and hit him in the back. So we know he was over there when they shot him before they looked for Willard Richards and John Taylor.

Joe Skeen:

Now, about this time earlier in the day, I have to kind of go back a little bit. Samuel Smith before Joseph and Hiram were martyred, he had been injured in Nauvoo or near Nauvoo and he was resting up. That's why he didn't even go to Carthage to support his brothers. So he was bedridden and he heard because people were coming back who'd been kicked out of the jail, kind of making some warnings. He heard that, oh, joseph and Hiram need my help. So he arranges for a young man to load them into a wagon and take them to Carthage. So they get onto the road to Carthage, which I actually have a picture of the road to Carthage in here, and so you kind of get an idea of what this looks like, because here's this road and there's some farmland, but there was dense trees all along the edge of it. So they're going along with the wagon and the mob was there to stop them because they were afraid of the Nauvoo Legion. They didn't want anybody from Nauvoo getting back to Carthage because they knew they were going to do the martyrs. So they stopped them and they recognize Samuel oh, you're a Smith boy, we're going to get you. He hops out even though he's injured, runs into that forest, makes his way back to Nauvoo, gets away from the mob, hops off to a horse, goes back and runs really fast around the mob.

Joe Skeen:

Well, the timing that he's coming into Carthage is about the time they're shooting Hiram again up in the room and a lot of people heard this. Somebody yells out the Mormons are coming. They were scared to death. A lot of people heard this. Somebody yells out Mormons are coming. Okay, they were scared to death of the Nauvoo Legion. It was the biggest, most trained military group in the state, so they they were fully expecting the Nauvoo Legion to come and level the place. So when they heard that it was actually the mob following Samuel and Samuel comes in, you know, trotting in Mormons are coming.

Joe Skeen:

Well, at this point they're more afraid of the Nauvoo Legion than taking the time to go find Willard Richards and John Taylor. Wow, they exit the whole town, they just go. And that allowed Samuel to help Willard Richards, get the bodies ready to go back to Nauvoo and to help John Taylor and a few others who had come to help too. But what a lot of people don't realize as well is, within three weeks, samuel passed away directly due to the increased injuries that he got from getting to Carthage to save his brothers and, in fact, saving Richard and John Taylor's life.

Joe Skeen:

So, and you know, just looking at all the events, I even covered several theories in my book and said you know what? The only thing I think is plausible is that one. So yeah, there's just some amazing miracles that happened. Joseph actually had a dream and I think he told it to was it WW Phelps, I think he told it to he had a dream that he and Hiram were one day walking along water and then saw the city with a Savior in it and they were headed there and Samuel came and joined them and went there with them and that was exactly what happened essentially. So yeah, some neat, neat stuff.

Scott Brandley:

That's really interesting.

Joe Skeen:

I got a lot of stories like that in this other book and that's why it took me six years to compile it, because I poured through every book. I've got the books that my grandfather had. I didn't just take the stuff that my grandfather had at face value, I dug in to get to the most primary source on all of them and obviously I ended up mostly on Joe Smith papers. Tons of stuff out there. I also found things in old news reports from way back there, like when Joseph and Hiram were martyred. There was a newspaper that said thus ends Mormonism.

Scott Brandley:

Oh yeah.

Joe Skeen:

Yeah, nope, didn't happen.

Alisha Coakley:

They're a little bit wrong.

Joe Skeen:

Yep, you cannot stop the work that God is doing. It doesn't matter what man does or what they say. Yeah, anyway. So that's all. Part of my testimony is god loves you, he lives, and he does love you enough that he restored the gospels to bless the lives of not only us but even our ancestors, all earth.

Alisha Coakley:

So wow, yeah, love it thanks so much All earth.

Scott Brandley:

So Wow, yeah, love it. Thanks so much.

Alisha Coakley:

I'm just smiling. This was just a smiley, just a smiley episode. I love it. That was really really neat. I, you know I'm always a little bit jealous of people who have such rich history in in the church, and especially when they know about it right. Like I, just I think it's so neat that you have taken this interest in this love and your ancestry and this like pride in your family line and that you're you're not just like holding onto it all, but you're actually sharing it with the world. Um, so I'm curious and we'll share links for anyone who's interested in purchasing any of your books but where normally are they at? Are they on?

Joe Skeen:

amazon or yeah, um, especially with this last book, it's a big book.

Joe Skeen:

Yeah, it cost a fortune to put together yeah, professional photos and stuff I can imagine but this book was so dear to me my testimony of the prophet and of the restoration and the artifacts that bear witness of it I did not want to do a cheap thing, yeah, but I wanted this to be case binding on really high quality paper, full color throughout so that nothing is missed. Hard back dust cover. It's a beautiful book. It's a great coffee table book. My brother-in-law he actually teaches, I think, the deacon's quorum. Now he's got this book and he would take it and show it to them and the kids are, oh wow, that is cool Because it kind of brings things to life. That was the kind of thing I wanted to do with this, but still made it kind of tight because I wanted it to be more affordable, to hit a certain mark where people could actually buy it.

Joe Skeen:

Every year there's a Joseph Smith Senior Family Reunion. I thought I've got to be able to introduce it there. That's what I did last August and it was a good thing because I sold out the books. They recognized all this stuff because they know this, these things too. So I sold a lot of them and a lot of people still came back later and bought more books.

Joe Skeen:

But so now I'm selling it on my own site. I was going to try to have someone like Amazon handle it, but it costs too much. Yeah, Huge percentage, Right, I wanted it to be available. I've thought about seeing if desert book would carry it, which would be great. So I'd be happy to work with them and I could do that. I could sell it through that, but it takes. They get thousands of submissions for different things to carry every single year, so I'll try pursuing that too, but right now I'm doing it on my website. I've got my own website, the book itself. The retail price on it is $49.95, and I'm doing a 20% off on it. The code to get the 25% off is AFFIRM all caps with 20 after it.

Alisha Coakley:

We'll make sure to put that in the description link too.

Joe Skeen:

We ship it. I actually have tons of books on hand Because I had to get them in volume to get them reasonable. The shipping of the main shipment from China was crazy. It just took months.

Scott Brandley:

I have business books I bought from China, so I can completely relate to what you're saying. It's so expensive here in the US, but there you can get a really good quality book for a lot less.

Joe Skeen:

And so I'm very pleased with the way it turned out. But if there are other people that needed help, I could even give them pointers or I could help them too.

Scott Brandley:

Yeah, hey, if we break even people that needed help.

Joe Skeen:

I could even give them pointers, or I could help them too. Yeah, hey, if we break even, that's great, but my goal is to reach as many people as I can with with my testimony, and that's really what it boils down to.

Alisha Coakley:

Yeah, okay.

Scott Brandley:

Cool, awesome. Well, joe, before we wrap things up, is there any last thoughts you'd like to share?

Joe Skeen:

I kind of covered them, but I think I'm going to reaffirm that if anybody ever has any doubt or question, does god live? Does he love us? Does he care? It's a resounding yes. It doesn't matter what you've done, where you are in your life right now, what you've said or who you think you are. By the way, if you think you're something less than a child of God, you're absolutely wrong, because God loves you. He really does, and he's there to help you. And there are people around to loves you. He really does and he's there to help you, and there are people around to help you, and sometimes the angels that help you are actually, when the Lord touches somebody else's heart, to reach out to you and help you. Sometimes it's more miraculous, like what happened to my backyard. I did not expect that.

Alisha Coakley:

Well, like I said, it got me smiling the whole time. It's always nice to hear just some just really sweet, you know, special experiences in history and all that kind of stuff that just makes you feel the spirit in a very calm and happy way. So thank you for sharing all that with us today.

Joe Skeen:

Well, you're welcome, glad to be of help and I can help with other stories and experiences in the future if you need.

Alisha Coakley:

We love that.

Scott Brandley:

Awesome. Well, thanks, joe for being on the show again and thanks everyone for tuning in to another episode of Latter-day Lights. If you like Joe's story and you want to help us spread the word and and help get his story out, go and hit that share button and let's do our five second missionary work and share some light into the world today.

Alisha Coakley:

Yeah, and don't forget, guys, we're always looking for new guests too. So if you have a story that you want to share, or if you know someone who has a great story to share who would be perfect for this episode or for this for this podcast, um, be sure, like Scott said, reach out to us. We would. We would love to hear from you. So, all right, I all right. Well, I think that's all we have for this week. Um, until next time, we will see you, guys later.

Scott Brandley:

Thanks so much. Take care, bye. On today's episode we're going to hear how one descendant of Hiram Smith has been able to grow and develop his testimony. Welcome to the church.

Alisha Coakley:

That's just making stuff up.

Scott Brandley:

Okay.

People on this episode

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Scott Brandley

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Alisha Coakley

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