Motor City Hypnotist

Mental Health Trends That Matter - Part 2

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A mental health label can be a lifeline, or it can quietly become a cage. We get real about what mental health trends and statistics actually mean once they hit the therapy room, especially when someone walks in convinced a diagnosis from 20 years ago still defines them today. Matt Fox joins me as we talk about why diagnoses should be based on symptom patterns, duration, and daily functioning and why they can legitimately change as new details emerge.

We also pull back the curtain on the system itself: insurance billing often requires a diagnosis code tied to session codes, which can pressure clinicians to name something before the full story is clear. From there we zoom out to comorbidity, because mental health rarely arrives one symptom at a time. Anxiety and depression commonly overlap, PTSD and substance abuse often pair up, and ADHD can fuel anxiety when life feels unmanageable.

Then we dig into disparities that shape who gets help and who doesn’t: women seek treatment more often, men avoid it and face higher suicide rates, and stigma still blocks care. We talk income, disability, rural access, and the complicated promise of telehealth therapy and mental health apps, including what makes online sessions work and what can make them pointless.

If you want a grounded, practical take on diagnosis, therapy effectiveness, and how to advocate for yourself, hit play, share it with someone who needs it, and subscribe. After you listen, leave us a review and tell us what topic you want next.

Recorded 4-20-26

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Laugh hard, run fast, be kind.  
David R. Wright MA, LPC, CHT
The Motor City Hypnotist

Part Two Setup And Tease

SPEAKER_03

In this episode of the Motor City Hypnotist Podcast, we are back with part two. We're talking about mental health statistics. And I know that sounds kind of boring, but it's a lot of information about what's prevalent in today's mental health world as far as issues and problems. And as usual, we're giving away free stuff. Hang in there, folks. We'll be right back.

SPEAKER_05

This sounds like something for the authorities in Detroit. The joke's on you. I'm living to 102 and then at the city of Detroit.

SPEAKER_01

Guys like this ain't peek over here out of Detroit.

SPEAKER_04

Spawn and the hell fires of motion. Oh, take him to Detroit.

SPEAKER_01

Detroit!

SPEAKER_05

Stationed in Drambuy. It's worse than Detroit. We did not have as a unit the confidence that we felt like we needed to beat Detroit. Let's go to Detroit. Now you're talking, brother. I don't think so. He plays to Detroit now. Do they have many farms in Detroit? Detroit to Michigan. I go to school, I know where Detroit is. Get ready for the motor city hypnotist David R. Wright, originating from the suburbs of Detroit, Michigan. He has hypnotized thousands of people from all over the United States. David R. Wright has been featured on news outlets all across the country, and is the clinical director of an outpatient mental health and hypnosis clinic located just south of Detroit, where he helps people daily using the power of hypnosis. David O. Wright.

SPEAKER_03

You know, you've been here for a bit. Yeah, well, I've been here a bit because we're just doing we just finished up the Man Cave Happy Hour podcast. We just can jump over to there and listen to that one because that's very entertaining.

SPEAKER_04

But I'll tell you what, yeah, I really enjoy having you on the Man Cave Happy Hour. Oh, I love being here. Yeah. And and you just add an element. And it's another, it's another voice, it's another opinion. Sure. Well, and plus I get to drink. So you know I didn't say that. That's a bonus. That's all that's on.

SPEAKER_03

That's all you. Oh, yeah, absolutely. But yes, yes, stay and we get to try different types of bourbons in spirits, and it's uh it's good, yeah. So that is Matt Fox, the other voice you hear, by the way. Yes, you do. And we're here. Speaking of of podcasts and doing other podcasts, we're in the palatial podcast, voice outfield studios. Thank you. Hanging out on a Monday evening, doing a podcast and enjoying our beverage from the Man Cave Happy Hour. Yes, yes, I didn't which is which is fantastic, by the way. But the Clint, I'm still enjoying the Clint Eastwood.

SPEAKER_04

Oh, see, I did the uh I did the Clint Eastwood, and then August was gracious enough to make me an old-fashioned with the rum. That's right. The bamboo. Yeah, the bamboo rum. Right.

SPEAKER_03

And yes, and I have a little sidecar of chartreuse. There we go. I finished my chartreuse and and I still have the I still have a little sip of blackberry brandy sitting right next to me as well. So it's been a good time.

SPEAKER_04

It's been a great night. I say that.

Shows Social Links And Free Guide

SPEAKER_03

All right, folks. Let me tell you where you can find me. Busy, busy lately. My website is motorcityhypnotist.com. Go there. I just booked another show today. So we're in the midst of prom season. And I know here's the thing: those of you who are from the Detroit area, they don't do after proms in this area, they do grad night shows. But other parts of the country, they do prom night parties. Yep. And keep the kids safe and in line. You're in Iowa. I was in Iowa again for the second weekend in a row. And I go back again to Iowa this weekend for a third time. So would you say you're Iowa famous? I am probably Iowa famous. And and here's the thing because a lot of these Iowa shows, like their repeats. Like so, so the first weekend I was there was a repeat. Last week was a new venue. I had not done their school before. Okay. And then this coming weekend is a is a high school I've not done before. My goodness. So we'll we'll see. Yeah. Well, we'll see how it goes. You are Iowa famous. And then after the Iowa run is done, I get a week or two reprieve, and then grad nights start near the middle of May. So yeah, it's it's a it's a busy time. But if you if you're still in need of entertainment for your post prom or your post grad night party, go to my website, motorcityhypnotist.com/slash shows. You can have a quote within minutes, you can book within minutes, and it'll be locked in. My social media, Facebook and YouTube, both Motor City Hypnotist, and Snapchat, Instagram, and TikTok are all Motor City Hypno. And as usual, every as we've done going way back to episode number one, text the word hypnosis to 313-8008510 to receive your free hypnosis guide. Within a few moments, you'll get a text message with that guide attached, and also a link to my business page, my motor city hypnotist business page, where you can leave a review, which would be greatly appreciated. Leave a review, say what you mean. Yeah, if it's positive, great. Just speak your mind. Yeah, and and really, I and I I and I acknowledge, and I've said this on the podcast before, I'm terrible at leaving reviews. But here's the thing, and this is just psychology, it's human nature. People typically don't leave reviews unless it's a negative review, because that's you get more emotionally charged when something negative happens. And we're much less likely to promote good things because it's good. You don't feel that that that instinct to lash out and say how unhappy you were. Sure. But reviews help. So I would appreciate it. If you could please leave a review, that would be fantastic. And and not only with with if you text the and get your hypnosis guide, but also whatever podcast platform you're listening on. Like, subscribe, like, subscribe, connect, whatever that is, and leave a review there as well. Because let's podcast that there, there's a billion podcasts out there, and you know, to get noticed or to get more people, it's it's it's a it's a big space. Let's say that. So reviews help, and that gets more people attracted to us. Do it. All right, we're ready. Are we? Yes. All right, here we go.

SPEAKER_04

That's how win it is done. All right, so what are we looking at?

SPEAKER_03

Got a good story. This comes from Georgia. Okay. A Georgia preteen saved her older brothers from a potentially perishing in a fire that consumed the left side of the family's two-story home. Pre-teen, 11, 12 years old, saved family. Okay. She's been hailed by the family and the community as a hero who saved the most important things the family had while everything else was destroyed in the fire.

SPEAKER_01

Okay.

SPEAKER_03

The Johnson family of six had only moved into the house a few months before the fire started last Monday in their garage. Oh my god. As it raged across the ground floor, Macy arrived home on the school bus and saw the fire. Macy is the preteen. Macy is the preteen. Yeah. She's 12. Wow. I'm sorry, that's in the it's in the title of the article, which I didn't read. 12-year-old preteen. Okay. 12-year-old girl. WJCL News didn't say whether she knew her two older brothers were in the house, but in any case, she ran to the door and began screaming into the house that there was a fire. My oldest son was preparing to go to work. He was in the shower. Again, had no idea until she heard her screaming. Said Macy's mother, Lisa Johnson, who said their second oldest son was asleep in his room over the garage. Oh my goodness, where the fire was. Yes. She's an incredible girl, and I'm very proud of her. Firefighters from Richmond Hill and Bryan County arrived quickly and stopped the fire before it consumed the entire house. The cause of the fire is still under investigation. Okay. Hard as it is to know that we've lost almost everything, that we have a lot of memories, a lot of good things. We have each other and we have God, Mrs. Johnson said. Fair. And I have faith in him. Capital H. Yes. So that is, yeah, that's a story. That's where it ends. So so that goes back to fight or flight.

SPEAKER_04

Yep. A 12-year-old young lady, fight or flight, she fought. She did. She knew she had to do something. She had to do something. Her brother's in the shower. She didn't know where her brothers were in the house. She didn't know. She didn't even know if they were in the house. Yeah, well, yeah. One's in the shower. One is sleeping. Yep. And she went in and she did what she felt she needed to do. She fought for her brothers. She just didn't know, and it's the right thing to do. Yes. It was the right thing.

SPEAKER_03

So here's Macy. Here's a picture of Macy. Good for her. And also you can see a picture of the house, the fire on the house.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, on the garage. Yeah. And the and the brother was in the shower over said garage. If you see the picture, the entire garage is engulfed in flames. It is. That's crazy. That's amazing.

SPEAKER_03

And that she ran towards that. That that's crazy. I love it. So Macy, good job. Definitely winner of the week material. Thank you, Macy.

SPEAKER_01

That's how winning is done.

SPEAKER_04

So Dave, yeah. I am doing a speech. Yes. About fight or flight. And there are other responses. There's also freeze. Freeze and fawn. Yep.

unknown

Yep.

SPEAKER_04

But the speech is all about being a duck. You stay calm, cool, collected on top, and you paddle like hell underneath. Right. So that is the whole mantra of fight or flight is being a duck, right? And I and I hope that I will inspire a few folks in my audience that will that will look at that and be like, that makes a lot of sense. You know, well, yeah. And for this young lady, you know, that I might incorporate her into my speech. Sure. Because that's fight or flight.

SPEAKER_03

That's a great example of yes, it's fight or flight, freeze, or fawn. Yes.

SPEAKER_04

And she acted.

SPEAKER_05

Yep.

SPEAKER_04

And then and then it's the adaptability after the fact. You know, you have to be able to adapt to the fight or flight response, the freezer fawn response. You have to be able to adapt to it. Yep. In whatever situation that you're in. So I am so proud of this young lady. Yeah, it's fantastic. Thank you. Yes.

Why Diagnoses Get Complicated

SPEAKER_03

So back to it. Yes, back to it. So we're on part two today, folks, of mental health statistics. We're kind of kind of I kind of got into this because you know, sometimes there's an there's like an ebb and flow of specific issues that come up, and it's there's no there's no really rhyme or reason for it. Sure, it's just what I see as far as who I see in my office every day. So I thought it'd be interesting to kind of dig into this. So so there is a part one, and it's an hour episode. That was last week. Uh so you you could listen to that one after we're done here, or you can stay here and go back to that. You'll get all the information. But I wanted to do was follow up and and kind of going beyond the just this the numbers a little bit. So we're gonna go a little bit deeper, not just into statistics, but what they mean like across different populations, whether it be men, women, ethnicities, old, young. Because here's the thing numbers, numbers are fine, but they don't they don't tell the whole story of course not of who is affected, how diagnoses differ, you know, what trends it really trends is is the best way to describe it. What what's happening now that we need to be aware of? So I'm gonna start right now with just understanding what a diagnosis is. Okay. Now, in theory, we know diagnosis is we figure out what's going on, we figure out what's wrong, and then we that's your diagnosis. Here's the thing with mental health, and here's the challenge. And one of the things as a therapist I've always struggled with is having to give a diagnosis. Okay, because for me, and and I know I've probably shared this in so many words, if not exact words, before on the podcast, but sometimes when people hear something, they latch onto it, and it that they it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy at that point. You have said those words, so so I and I've and maybe it's not worded exactly like that, but I know I've conveyed that sentiment before because a lot of people will come to me and I'll see them and I'll say, Oh, I saw a therapist 20 years ago, I was diagnosed with bipolar disorder. And then after talking to somebody for a long time, or maybe a couple, three sessions, I don't really see that. Because that was 20 years ago. Well, yeah, and and plus two, again, we have to die. And here, and here's kind of the the sad truth of it. In order to get paid by insurance companies, you have to give a diagnosis. That's you that you you don't get paid unless you diagnose someone, and that to me has always been very bothersome.

SPEAKER_04

I I I I hear you, and I understand where you're coming from because you you run a business, yeah, you are a therapist, you are a professional therapist, you do everything by the book. Are insurance company pushing that envelope to force folks, therapists to make a diagnosis?

SPEAKER_03

Here's the thing in order to bill an insurance company, you must have one what's called the the the the I'm drawing a total blank. That's okay. It's a session code, okay, and it says what type of session you're doing. So for example, and you guys, it doesn't matter what the numbers are, but a 908.37 is a full session, 53 minutes. Okay.

SPEAKER_04

Or more.

SPEAKER_03

A 908.32 would be a 16 minutes to 38 minutes. See, so so so they're different, they're different diagnosis, there, they're different codes for the length of the the treatment and also the location of the treatment, whether it's in person or telehealth. Okay, but in order to build the insurance, we must also have a diagnosis attached to these.

Insurance Billing Forces A Label

SPEAKER_04

And that's where I'm stuck. So you have someone that has had they believe they're stuck in I have bipolar disorder for the past 20 years. Yeah, they come to you seeking resources and services, right? And you have to re-diagnose. Yep. You you have to include a diagnosis code.

SPEAKER_03

So it could be the same, or you see somebody for two, three sessions, and you're like, Sometimes I and believe I am never how do I put this without sounding cocky or arrogant? You're good. I don't just accept somebody telling me I was diagnosed with this. I I want to figure it out myself. I'm gonna make my own judgment on that. That's what makes you the professional in the room, yes. But the problem is we do have to diagnose. Okay, so and and really diagnoses are really just based on symptom patterns, duration, and impact on daily functioning. So if somebody comes to me and says, Yeah, I'm I'm I feel really anxious all the time, I don't sleep well, I have panic attacks, you know, I can't focus because I'm always worried something bad is gonna happen. Okay, at that point, even just with those few statements, I can kind of know that you're probably in the anxiety area somewhere. There, there's probably something going on with that. So I would dig a little bit deeper. So the so and with diagnoses, again, there are a lot of categories. And I'm gonna be honest up front about this because as a therapist, and and I and I convey this to my staff as well, the staff who's working with me, other therapists, I say, Don't don't jump to the most severe diagnosis. Like if somebody comes in, let's say they said, Oh yeah, I was diagnosed with schizophrenia 20 years ago. The therapist might just say, Okay, schizophrenia is a diagnosis, and they'll go right to that. But for me, I'm like, I I wanna, I'm, I'm gonna, I'm gonna place a diagnosis of what I see. So I don't care if you were diagnosed with schizophrenia or bipolar, right? What I'm seeing is you know, mild depressive disorder, single episode.

SPEAKER_04

All right, so 25 years ago, it could have been schizophrenia.

SPEAKER_03

In a very well, it could the diagnosis.

SPEAKER_04

See, and here's the thing though, we don't know that the diagnosis was correct, and but okay, so 25 years ago, what was the mentality 25, 30 years ago? Yeah, and now we have so much more data at our fingertips where we can say, okay, it may not have been full-blown schiz, it could be something that is well and you're right because because a lot of times, and again, the the the general symptoms of schizophrenia are delusions, hallucinations, sure.

SPEAKER_03

And and here's the thing, though, you can exhibit those same symptoms with sleep deprivation. Sure, the the the symptoms are exactly the same.

SPEAKER_04

Have you not read Stephen King's insomnia?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, of course in years, Matt. Yeah, I was gonna say good night, guys.

SPEAKER_03

Good night, August. So so it could just hanging on to one diagnosis is is I I like to be flexible. Let I guess that's the best way to put it. Okay, and I always say start low. You can always do we can always diagnosis can change from session to session, sure, or over time. So I always tell therapists, let's start with the basics. If you talk to them the first session, you don't get a whole lot of info, and you realize, yeah, they have some anxiety symptoms. Let's start with generalized anxiety disorder, and maybe four sessions later, the client gives you more information and you realize, oh, they're having a stress reaction. This is probably more like PTSD. So then you can update it. So a diagnosis is in flux, it's not permanent.

SPEAKER_04

What I'm struggling with is that individuals that are coming to you, and I'm glad that people are seeking out resources and and therapy. Yeah, but they were diagnosed, they were saying you are X, Y, and Z 20 years ago. They are still seeking out resources, they're still still think seeking out therapy. Yep, and you come in with a new avenue, a new way of looking at it. It may not be new, but it's just a different way, yeah. Okay, right, different from what they had before. Because you are trying to run a business and you have to diagnose, yes, so it's making you dig deeper than what somebody did 20 plus years ago.

SPEAKER_03

Yep, very that that's feasible, yeah. Sure.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, to me, why if somebody was being treated properly for the symptoms they were having, why are they still seeking out Matt?

SPEAKER_03

This is the question I ask clients every day. And that's where that's where I'm stuck. And and you're gonna stay stuck because there's no answer, there's no good answer for that. I'm sure there's here's the question I have, Matt. You're my client, you come in, we're meeting for the first session. Sure. You know, I'm gathering information. I'm like, what do you what are you dealing with? What are you feeling? Have you had treatment before? And somebody will say to me, Matt, you say to me, Oh, yeah, I had a therapist that I was seeing maybe 10-15 years ago. And I say, Oh, how long were you seeing that therapist? And you say, I don't know, five or six years. Okay. And I say, What changed? And they say, Nothing. That that is common. Unfortunately, that's common. I shake my head. I know, and and and that's and that that is because here's the thing, and I and and I know I've said this before to people, therapists is just like any other profession, it's just like quack doctors, you're gonna get bad therapists sometimes. And and I tell people, you need to you're in charge of your own mental health. Yes, and if you have a therapist who you feel is not helping you, you as the client have the right to ask for somebody else or go somewhere else. But do they know that? That's why I'm saying it because I want clients to know this, yeah, because a lot of times they'll go to a place, they'll just they'll go online and say, Oh, counseling, you know, whoever accepts counseling dollars out of the corner, whoever accepts my insurance and they accept my insurance, so I'm gonna call there and get an appointment. And you get an appointment with Joe Schmoe, who might just be a lazy therapist. It's a crapshoot, it is so so again, you are in charge of your own mental health. And if you feel like you're not getting the help you need, you have the right to say, I want to see a different therapist or go somewhere else. Yeah, and and I know it's a lot of work, just and I know people struggle because with mental health issues, there's also the challenge of just doing daily function, like making phone calls, going online, making an appointment, keeping that appointment with a schedule.

SPEAKER_04

It's challenging. Is that where folks feel it's a full-time job because they're trying to take care of themselves?

SPEAKER_03

And it's just so convoluted. Just think how busy life is, and now you have to find a medical professional, make an appointment that fits your schedule, attend it, and continue to attend it. It's tough. It's it's difficult sometimes. It's like trying to find a rheumatologist. No, it's like trying to find any specialist. No, really, it is. It's just like that. There's there is a shortage of rheumatologists in this country. I know, because I have clients who are specifically looking for rheumatologists. Yes. In fact, my wife, and I can I can share this because she's she knows. My wife suffers with psoriatic arthritis, so she's been seeing a rheumatologist for years. We we mentioned this in the past and unfortunately passed away.

SPEAKER_04

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. We did talk about that. But yeah, that that that's my point. You yeah, there's a shortage of people who specialize in certain areas of the brain, of Behaviors and what have you? There, there's a shortage, and we are looking towards our future. Yep. Dave, you are a man of a certain age. Yes, I am. And you want to retire comfortably. I would hope someday. Within the next 10 years. There you go. Yeah. There's a legacy that needs to be led. And who's gonna who's gonna pick up that torch?

Comorbidity And Overlapping Symptoms

SPEAKER_03

That's a good question. It's a great question. Who's gonna pick up the torch? So, as far as diagnoses go, a lot of times clients could have multiple diagnoses. They might have generalized anxiety, they might also have moderate depressive episodes, recurrent. It it so so here's the thing. You said it's called it's called you said recurrent. What does that mean? It means it it it it happens more than once, it's not a single isolated episode within months of each other, days of each other, years. Well that that's kind of subjective. I'm I'm just uh you said recurrent, so I'm just trying to understand. Typically, if somebody's in a depressive state, let's say for a few weeks, and then maybe they go a few months or more and they feel better, but then they then it just kind of rotates and again to another depressive episode that would be recurrent. What happened in their life to make it happen? Well, that's that's how that's how we ask, and how we get to how can we help you with that?

SPEAKER_04

And that's where your next diagnoses comes from.

SPEAKER_03

So you can build earlier, right? But but here's the whole thing com it's it's called comorbidity. That that's when you have multiple diagnoses for one person, and here's the thing in most cases, there are multiple diagnoses, that's just how mental health works. There are so many overlapping symptoms. Somebody can come to me, list their symptoms, and I can say you could have 10 different diagnoses, sure, because a lot of these symptoms overlap. So let me get into the let me get into the numbers on this.

SPEAKER_04

Is it like a a Scantron A, B, C, D?

SPEAKER_03

I know it's just symptomology. That's how it's how we determine it. Nearly 48% of individuals who have been diagnosed have more than one diagnosis, so almost half. I I I can understand that. Yes. So again, some common combinations. You might think, well, what how can you have more than one thing? How do they fit together? Yeah, but I'm gonna give you half I'm gonna give you some common some common combinations, commonalities, commonalities. All right, anxiety and depression almost always go together. Yeah, you're putting your finger yes, because if you're if you're anxious, you're typically depressed. If you're depressed, most of the time you're anxious. That though those kind of live together, so that's not unusual. PTSD and substance abuse, very common to have both of those together because people turn to substances to cope with trauma, whether that be alcohol, whether it be drugs, whether it be pot. What are the percentages of veterans in your practice? Oh, that's a good question. See, I don't know because I have you know eight other therapists working. So that's a fair answer, but the PTSD and veterans go hand in hand. Yes. Now I I will say, in general, though, because we haven't had an armed conflict until now, a major armed conflict until next week. Probably like until eight o'clock this evening. I mean, as far as like troops on the ground, probably Vietnam has been our last major conflict war. What desert storm? Uh yeah, but a lot, most of that was air raids.

SPEAKER_04

I I I beg to differ because you had because you had desert storm, you had desert shield, shield, and storm.

SPEAKER_03

And then we had Afghanistan, we were there for a while. But but here's the thing uh the troops are stationed everywhere, they're all over the world. Yeah, so and again, armed conflicts as far as boots on the ground, but but it doesn't matter. I don't care if you're flying a plane, that still can be it could it can still you can still have PTSD. It doesn't matter what your job is if you're put into a into a risky situation or a dangerous situation, that can cause trauma. Of course, yes, boots on the ground, boots in the water, doesn't matter. Yes, you're still gonna have that. Uh another common one is ADHD and anxiety. Yes, typically, people who have ADHD are anxious because they can't focus and they feel overwhelmed and they feel stressed out because they can't manage things.

SPEAKER_04

There, there's a lot to be said for folks that have ADHD and anxiety. There's a lot to be said because the ADHD side could be because they're an absolute genius, but they get put into a situation or an environment where it there's just too much going around, too much stimuli, too much stimulus, and they they don't know what to do. Right. There are a lot of people that have educated themselves, teenagers at that that have educated themselves, folks that they have been they've been diagnosed with. You have X, Y, and Z. And they are provided tools, resources to deal with their ADHD. What do I do if I am starting to feel anxious? I am I've been privy to that, yeah. And I am sure I'm astounded by the reaction of individuals that have recognized their shortcomings, sure, but it's not a shortcoming, it is genius level people.

SPEAKER_03

I mean, it can be sure. I I mean we could say the same thing with autism that that there are so many more people on the spectrum than we even would know or guess.

SPEAKER_04

But now we're still trying to understand the brain because autism, ADHD, anxiety, it all relates. And is would that be a diagnosis? Autism is autism a diagnosis, yes.

SPEAKER_03

Absolutely, yes, yep. Autism is a diagnosis, and and here's the difficulty with autism, not to get off on a tran. We're gonna do an episode just on that, please, just as I say that, because we could get off on that. But I will say with autism, it's much more difficult. It's not how do I put this? It's not difficult to diagnose, it's just there's no there's no straightforward way to diagnose. No, there's not because there's a blood test, there's no written test, it's all based on on information that you collect. I I agree. So so that that one is is difficult.

SPEAKER_01

I'm listening.

Gender Gaps Stigma And Suicide

SPEAKER_03

So we think about mental health challenges, and you know that men that that there's a big difference between men and women as far as the data and the statistics go. In fact, that there's huge gender disparities when it comes to mental health. So here's the thing women have higher rates of anxiety and depression in general. That's because of men. Men now, now here's the thing with men men have much lower treatment rates, men are less likely to seek treatment because they're men, but that's that Neanderthal brain thinking that is, you're right, and men have higher suicide rates, so women have higher rates of anxiety and depression, they seek treatment more often. Uh-huh. Men don't seek treatment and they have higher suicide rates. So for men, I would just say this treatment is not a weakness, it's not a sign that you're you are any less of a man. It's being, in fact, it makes you more of a man because you're going to address something in yourself that is going to benefit your family, your your marriage, your kids, your work. Can I ask whatever? Can I ask you a personal question? Absolutely. Have you ever sought out a therapist? I I have a therapist now. Okay. I've I've I've had a therapist on and off since I was a teenager.

SPEAKER_04

I I I've seen therapists in my life, I've seen a therapist through my divorce. Yep. There's nothing wrong with talking to somebody about what you're feeling.

SPEAKER_03

And there's not. And I and I really want to hammer that home because because again, there's just this it's that that thing in men's thinking that it's oh, I'm tough. I don't need to do that. This you know, it's a stigma. Yeah, it is a stigma, and the stigma still exists, even though we've come a long way. And I will say, here's here's I I hate to say this even, but here's where social media can be a good thing because it's brought to light a lot of mental health issues that has enabled men to be like, yeah, maybe I should talk to somebody. If you look up to Michael Phelps and what happened, exactly, yeah, like figures like that who have who have who have acknowledged they have mental health issues. Yes, they went and sought help, they feel better. And and for a man to do that 40 years ago was probably unheard of to speak out about it.

SPEAKER_04

If you follow Joe Rogan and he's like, hey, I'm gonna push psychedelics here, try this and you won't get penalized.

Access Barriers Income Disability Rural

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, well, on a side note, I just saw today, and this that this could be a good thing that Trump signed an executive order that uh is going to approve research into uh microdosing psychedelics. Yes, that's what I'm referring to. Yes, so and Rogan was sitting right behind him in the Oval Office. But see, that that that is a great thing because I mean I think more research needs to be done into a lot of these unconventional treatment types, but the way it was I I guess the way it was portrayed was hey, you could do mushrooms for and you're not gonna get no, it's it's it's very nuanced. And I'll clarify it here. Microdosing, you won't even know you're taking it. No, that's the whole point of it. You won't see rainbow or not, you're not gonna go on some crazy trip for 10 hours. That's not how it works. So just just to put that out there. The the executive order was to approve the research, the research of psychedelics to help mental disorders. Any research into mental disorders, I'm all for. Yes, yes, let's do it. There's a lot of socioeconomic factors that come into play. Please do tell lower income people are more prone to stress and reduced access to care.

SPEAKER_04

Well, because they don't have the income to support what they need.

SPEAKER_03

Well, and and here's the thing because because again, initially, if I were just a lay person, I would say, well, they have access to healthcare, they have Medicare or Medicaid, we can use that. I'm I'm a layman. Well, I'm asking, do they? No, well, see, but here's the thing: some do, a lot of people do not, they have nothing, they have no coverage because they haven't done the research or no, I I think just because they don't qualify for whatever reason, you know. I have clients, so so let me let me just in general, because again, this this could be a whole other tangent, too. I have a lot of clients who, technically speaking, because of their mental health challenges, are disabled, they cannot work, and they've applied for disability and they've been denied. They're they're they're stuck, they have no resources, they have no access to care because they have no money. There's there's a gray area. There is, and and and it's never black and white, it's never one or the other. There's all there's always an area, but but that's that that's anecdotal information that that there are a lot of clients who just don't have access to care. There, and that's still an issue. Yeah, that's a problem. That that that's where everybody should get some type of coverage. Another pop another population that has much higher mental health challenges are people with disabilities. Okay, so do you have a disability, David? I do not. That I not not not that would not not the traditional definition of a disability. No. Do I have a disability, David? Not that I know of. Yeah, I I might, yeah, but I but when I'm talking about disabilities, you're probably talking about paraplegis. Okay, or okay, T traumatic brain injury. So thank you for like thank you for putting a definition. It's not just saying I'm disabled. Right. That that doesn't qualify. Right. Right. The problem though with disabilities, especially developmentally disabilities, like people who might be again on the spectrum. Let's go back to that. Okay, or maybe people who have some developmental delays, maybe they're just like maybe they're dyslexic, maybe they had dyslexia is not the dyslexia is nothing to joke about. No, it's not, and and and it's considered a disability for sure. Yeah, so the the the issue though is these these these populations experience a much higher rate of anxiety and depression. Where you live makes a difference. Rural versus urban.

SPEAKER_04

I saw a I saw an article in regards to the zip code you live in, huh?

SPEAKER_03

Species yes, that that has a lot to do with it. So here's the challenge: a lot of people in rural communities, there's a lack of providers, there's greater stigma, yeah, and and the rates uh the symptomology rates are are much higher in rural populations. Why so let me ask a general question.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, because it's it's a dumb question at that.

SPEAKER_03

It might not be.

SPEAKER_04

No, it is the the rural community, yeah, farmers, yeah, it is a generational industry, typically, yep. Do you see a lot of rural farmers with in your practice? I don't because we're located in a suburban area. Correct. So if you were to be in a rural area, do what do you what do you think that diagnoses would be? Because they're in a rural community, they waited three months to see you. They've been dealing with things for 10 years. Sure.

SPEAKER_03

The resources aren't there, right? Yeah. Well, I mean, I'll give you a great example, Matt. We just talked about I've I've I've been driving to Iowa the last two weekends and I'm going again. These are rural populations. Like I get off the freeway and I have to drive another hour on back roads to get to the location I'm going to. You're going through cornfields. Yes, absolutely. Cornfields and farms and silos everywhere. And then I get to this, then I get to the the the hotel and the school, and it's like two stop light towns. Sure. You know, so there's some isolation going on there. Very much and and if and here's the thing. I I'm in a suburban area. I I work in the suburbs south of Detroit in Taylor. There's people everywhere. When you go to rural communities, you might have to drive for an hour to see a doctor or to see a therapist. So here's my and that hinders treatment because the access is less convenient.

SPEAKER_04

So here's my stupid question for you, David. If they had more resources, if they had somebody that was available within five, 10 miles, do you think it would be better? Sure.

unknown

Of course.

SPEAKER_03

Yes, yes, but that's my access is better. That's a stupid question. So why do we have a shortage? I I think I think it's just based on any rural area. Like when you go into towns like that, like I was just in, there was no McDonald's, there was no grocery store, there's no it's it's it's a general access to services in general when you're in in an isolated area.

SPEAKER_04

It doesn't matter where you are, rural, industrial, suburbanite. Why do we have a shortage of professionals?

SPEAKER_03

There's no answer to that.

SPEAKER_04

There isn't. No, it's a resort. No, it is.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, no, I get it. I I I know.

SPEAKER_04

I I told uh a few uh I told a few teams this this past week. I said, be prepared over the next 10-15 years because our baby boomers are going to be passing away. Uh we've had a lot of scenarios come at us with you know beneficiaries, death certificates, this, that, and the next thing. Yeah, it's going to ex it's going to explode over the next 15-20 years. Yes. I told my team, be prepared, study up and make sure that you understand the steps that you need to take to take care of the person who has passed away. Right. Not the person in front of you, not the relative, not the beneficiary, the person who was passed, because there are a lot of assets that are floating around out there. Absolutely. I know I'm getting on a tangent myself, but you have to pay attention to what these folks have built. And when it comes to folks in that rural area, they they're they're trying to build a legacy. Yeah, that needs to be protected.

SPEAKER_03

Well, I will also say typically, and and again, that this I don't have any data on this, it's just my thought. But if you live in a rural area, especially very isolated and really rural, yeah, a lot of times there's not a lot of times those people I should say those people, that doesn't those that population typically doesn't seek higher education. So there would be a lack of professionals as far as medical or mental health. But that shit in our country. Oh, I've been there. Yes, I know. It it it's there's not a lot there.

SPEAKER_04

No, I have relatives that live in that rural area and I I want them to thrive, I want them to have what they need. I I am a resource for them to help them to find those resources. Yes, they might have to drive three hours away, but they have to make the conscious decision to do it.

Telehealth Apps Pros And Cons

SPEAKER_03

Again, it just becomes more difficult, and that that's the key to it. So, so to speaking of again, the the other thing in many rural areas, they tend to be more conservative. That's not a judgment, but that's a fact with that becomes a lot of that carries some stigma as far as mental health goes. You're right. Many people avoid treatment because they don't want to be judged. The big thing though is is that that again, and I go back to people in rural areas now have access to information they never had before.

SPEAKER_04

You're right, because of the internet, and and I'm not the inner the internet can be a be a very dark place, but Dave, does does the does the session that you're gonna have to help your mental health have to be in person?

SPEAKER_03

It doesn't know, it doesn't have to be okay. That's so so for example, I'm licensed in Michigan, I can see anybody in Michigan. Sure, it doesn't matter if they're in in in Sault Ste. Marie, sure, if they're in Michigan, I'm licensed to treat them. And we have telehealth services, which most practices do now.

SPEAKER_04

There are services, apps that you could go on to and you can see a license. What what are some of those apps that are called that someone can log in and be like, I I'm having issues. They can see a a professional therapist on their phone within within Yeah, one of them is called Better Help.

SPEAKER_03

Thank you. Another one called uh there's a there's a bunch of them. Now, I I I would caution people. Yes. Many of those pull-in therapists who are just starting in their career and they're just looking to make some money. That's fair. The other thing with those is is they're they're they they they promote it as being accessible, which means you can therap you can email or text your therapist anytime, anywhere. It's not an ideal arrangement to have effective therapy.

SPEAKER_04

Okay, it's not like going onto your DoorDash app because you're you're a DoorDasher, you have an issue, you it's it's not chatting with somebody, you know.

SPEAKER_03

It's it's just here's the thing. If you're looking to get therapy, do it right. Okay. And and again, I I'm not being critical of anyone because I I don't know anybody who's who's worked on these with these services. But I do know just from a lot of the the groups I'm in, a lot of the professional development I do, that there's a lot of there's just a lot of question, that there's a lot of there's there's not enough people like you, David. Yes, I know well, no, I I agree. So, and I'm not saying you shouldn't use those, but just know that it ends up being crisis intervention mostly more than anything. And very, very seldom does real therapy occur. You're just resolving the the the the issue that's on their mind at that moment, and then because again, with these with these better help and these other online services, you you might you might only talk for five minutes, you might talk for two hours. There, there's no set structure.

SPEAKER_04

I'm gonna bring this all the way around. That person you just talked to online through that app. Guess how they get paid? They have to provide a diagnosis. I don't know for sure on that.

SPEAKER_03

Neither do I, but I'm just I I'm just kibbitzing. Right. How do you think they get paid? I don't know what their pay structure is, but they get paid somehow. They they do get paid somehow, and and that's interesting. I'll look into that. I I I have to plead ignorance on that. I have not I've not looked that that much into the the the the structure of it. I just know that while it seems convenient and it seems great. And again, Michael Phelps promoted this. He did. Now, and again, I'm not going to criticize him. He got help. It worked for him. I would just say be careful because it it's it's not the traditional way. And I'm not and I'm not saying we can't be open to change and advancements. Because we're talking about trends. Yes. And that that is a trend. And I would and I will be honest to you, even though we provide telehealth services and many of my clients opt for that. I don't believe that's an ideal scenario for therapy. Not for everybody. No. I don't honestly, I think I I I much rather have clients in person. It's to me, it's so much more effective. I can see you, I can see your body language, I can get reactions in real time. And talking to somebody over a screen, I think it just there's this disconnect. And I can't describe it, I can't define it, but it's it's we're so used to watching things on on our screens that are imaginary. It's not human. And when you talk to somebody over the phone or FaceTime or whatever, or or or Doxie, which is our HIPAA compliant telehealth program, sure, you're still talking screen to screen. And it just it just to me, I feel like it's just a little less personal.

SPEAKER_04

Can I can can I share with you that I I've heard when someone's doing telehealth, yeah, and the therapist, the the clinician, they're they're they're they're in a chair, they're sitting down, they're taking trying to take care of somebody on the screen. And that person on the screen is walking around their house, they're being distracted by kids or dogs or neighbors, or they're in their freaking car and they're driving, yep, and they're trying to manage traffic and have a therapy session at the same time.

SPEAKER_03

Let me add to that, Matt. They're in their car and then the signal keeps going out and they keep dropping the call, and then you got to reconnect. It's it's just it's just it's the mentality of how you take care of yourself, yes. And and I would say, and again, for people, for some people, this is a good option. I and I'm not saying get rid of telehealth totally. That's not what I'm saying. No, for some people, definitely people who have like major agoraphobia, they can't go out in public. Yes, that's a good option for you, but for most people, I would say therapy is going to be so much more effective in person. It's just uh my professional opinion, and somebody can argue with me and I'll defend it. That's my feeling on it.

SPEAKER_04

But if you are seeking telehealth, yes, put yourself in a situation where you will not have the distractions, put yourself in a position where you know that you can give a hundred percent to the person that is trying to help you on the other side of the screen. Yes. I just it it it breaks my heart just to hear those stories about people that are trying to help. Yes, and they have someone on the other on the other side of that screen that are going anywhere else except taking but part of that too, Matt, though, is and and and I and again let me counter that a little bit.

SPEAKER_03

If I'm talking to somebody and they're walking around or they're talking to their kids, yes, I will say to them, it doesn't seem like you have privacy right now. And I for this to be effective, I need you to be in a private environment where we can be totally open 100%. But that probably doesn't happen with a lot of therapists and clients, it probably doesn't, and and you're right, if you're distracted and you're focused on other things, that that's why this will open up a whole nother cancer. That's why I think working from home is not an ideal situation, it's convenient, but uh but I know it's human nature, you're not going to be as productive at home as you are at work.

SPEAKER_04

Telehealth became very, very prevalent in 2019 before COVID. It was already on the rise. Telehealth was right. 2020 happened, yep, and then it became the thing, yes, and now it's just something that is there, yes, it's and it is treated like shit.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, it it is it it opens up access to a lot of people who might not be able to get service. So again, I'm not I'm not dismissing it totally. I'm just saying the population who would benefit more from telehealth is probably very small rather than being in person. Being in person is the best for most people.

SPEAKER_04

There are exceptions to that, yes, on the agoraphobia side, but in order to get treated for a therapist like yourself or whoever in the world is doing that what they have to do to take care of the person, not on the other side of the screen in front of them. That is the best medicine. Yes, that I I that that is my opinion, yes, for sure. And I agree with your opinion. Yes, telehealth is not going away, David.

SPEAKER_03

No, no, it's gonna be here. It's it's it's a convenience, and I get it.

SPEAKER_04

And we could fine.

SPEAKER_03

We could do a full episode on the what's the what what what are I I will look into that because I want to I want to know if there's data because it because it's been a few years since COVID.

SPEAKER_00

Sure.

How To Choose A Better Therapist

SPEAKER_03

I want to see if there's data that evaluates telehealth versus in-person results, whether that be medical, mental health. There has to be standards set for telehealth. And I say that there are standards met for therapists, but you still have therapists abusing clients. You know what I mean? There are rules. There's rules when you're skiing on a mountain, there's rules when you're walking down the street. And if people don't follow the rules, that's on them. But but but I mean, we can have all kinds of rules. I mean, uh I've Matt, I've met therapists who've slept with clients. I I that's a whole nother episode that's just gonna say we're just gonna start starting a list, but uh, but I'm saying that that it's like any other profession. Don't go. There are bad ones out there, yeah. But that's all I that that's just what I can say. So the important thing, and the reason we're focusing on the these these these differences and in these these this data, these data points, is that mental health is becoming more accessible, be telehealth being one of the reasons. So even if you're in a rural area or you have a condition that prevents you from leaving your home, you can still get help. Yes, the big thing here is awareness is rising, and that's due again. I have to give credit somewhat to internet and to social media, that awareness is rising, but the need is also rising as well, because as awareness rises, more people need help. And right now, for me to take a new client, it's probably a month out, and that month from now, you'll need things could be totally different, and you'll still need to provide a diagnosis. Yes, absolutely. So the big thing is I don't I don't care what system you use or what if it's in person, if it's telehealth, or if you drive an hour, whatever. The important thing is if you're having mental health issues, is to reach out because there are good there are there. I I know this sounded very kind of negative, and and I didn't mean it to sound like that. There's a lot of great therapists out there. There really are. You it's just that you need you need to do your research. Look at referrals. That that's one of the biggest ways that you can kind of evaluate if people are saying good things, they're probably getting results.

SPEAKER_04

The due diligence is needed. If you don't like who you're connected with, it's okay to ask for something.

SPEAKER_03

Absolutely, or to go to a different place totally, correct. And and I know here's the challenge because clients will come to me and they'll be like, You're the fifth therapist I've seen in the last year. I hope you're not, you know. And I'm like, I get it. Let's let's start fresh. Let me tell you what my approach is, and you can see if this is a good fit for you. That's what they said three times ago. Yeah, but that's that's what happens because unfortunately. Because every practice has the same practice. Well, we're doing the same things, it's just done differently. Some some some therapists are not how do I put this? You're not there to just bullshit. No, you're not there to just have a coffee talk for an hour. We're there to we're there to deal with issues. The intake and here's the thing, a lot of times, and and and this is I I'm just guessing, this is what happens with a lot of therapists. They just get lazy, they kick back in their chair, they're just like, Oh, how's your how was your week? Well, what happened? Well, that's cool. Oh, you like sports? What do you think the tiger's gonna do this year? Like it, it's it it can be that that inane, that banal. It it it and there are therapists like that.

SPEAKER_04

And if you're talking to somebody like that, uh-huh, you you need to switch. I really love the fact that you actually sat back in your chair and you had that that what that one-sided conversation just now, right? Because that is real.

SPEAKER_03

Yes, that's that does happen. Now, I now and don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you can't you can't talk about sports or something that they're interested in. Sure. I talk to I I talk a lot of to a lot of my clients about self-care activities. What what do you do for self-care? How do you take care of yourself? So we might talk about movies or video game, but it's related to them addressing their mental health issues without them knowing it's not just to kill time without them knowing it. Well, that too. That's that that's the whole point. But it but again, and here's the thing with therapists too: you you have to create a connection that there's there's this impetus on the therapist to connect with the client so that they trust you. A lot of this is relation building.

SPEAKER_04

What I what I what what I really got just my my brain just went in a different direction, but I'm like, you have a gamer, they're into Final Fantasy and all those fantasy games. You know, Final Fantasy VII was the best PC game to be released, it's got the best story ever, yeah. And you have a therapist that has no idea what a PlayStation 2 is.

SPEAKER_03

Well, see, see, here's the thing, Matt, and here and here's where connections can be made and why therapists matter. If you have a therapist who's it doesn't matter what age they are, okay, I'm just gonna say say you have a therapist who's never been married, doesn't have kids. Uh-huh. They can still help you, sure, but they don't have a lot of life experience that's gonna connect with you. Uh-huh. Now, I I have a I have a wife, I have a 23-year-old son who's a gamer. I have so so I I've been exposed to a lot of different environments, environments, let's say or or subjects that would that would connect with adolescents right now. You are a diamond in the rough. Well, maybe okay. I mean, I I would hope I'm not the only one out there. Um I'm sure there are there are other ones. I have great therapists in my office right now. Sure. I I mean, not always. Sometimes I I've believe me, over the last 15 years, I've let go of a lot of people because they were just terrible. Okay.

SPEAKER_04

And I appreciate you for that because you recognize that you want to have people on your staff that are going to be able to connect with whoever they're speaking with.

SPEAKER_03

Therapy is all about result, it's not just about talking. Talking is great, but but there has to be some it's there has to be some goal behind it.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, we could go on for hours. We're just gonna talk in circles.

Adopt Cash And Final Signoff

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, we are. But anyway, that brings us to the end of the mental health trends. We're gonna call it trends because statistics sounds very clinical and unpersonal, but but we we did talk about trends and things that are happening. We did. So so that is is that's that. We'll wrap that up. Oh, before we go, somebody needs a home. Okay, who is it? Cash. How much you got? Cash needs a home. How much you got? He was born in 2020. Okay, so he's probably five, six years old. He's six dollars old. He's a lab mix, 50 pounds, dog friendly. Yes, kid friendly, yes, cat friendly, unknown.

SPEAKER_04

Okay, so you said lab mix, lab mix, lab labrador retrievers are one of my favorite breeds in the world. You're gonna love this, you're gonna love this face, map. Okay, here's cash. Oh, come on! Look at okay. Cash is I always say the word adorable. Cash is handsome, yes. He is that is a handsome looking puppy for six years old. He's got that he he's got a little bit of humor in him. Yeah, he's got that that that little quirk in him that's gonna say, I'm going to make you laugh. Uh, he's got humor in him. Oh my goodness, yeah. I want to take cash home.

SPEAKER_03

There you go. Call him Detroit Dog Rescue.com slash adopt. Cash needs a home. Yes. I you know, and and whenever I see these, especially like date of birth is really the big thing because he's like five or six years old. So I'm like, what happened? Where'd he come from? What you know, what's his story? I always want to know that.

SPEAKER_04

He uh just wasn't with a family that was smarter than him. I'm or I just it's hard to say. But he he is a handsome looking dude.

SPEAKER_03

He's a handsome dog, he's a handsome dude. Yeah, I gotta say, yeah. Put it back up Detroit Dogrescue.com slash adopt. Cash needs a home.

SPEAKER_04

Yes, guys. He is a adorable, smart dog. Yeah, I'll just put that out there.

SPEAKER_03

Yep. Alrighty, folks, that is our episode. Join us next Monday. Same bat time, same bat channel, 8 p.m. Eastern Standard Time. Join us on Facebook Live on my Motor City Hypnotist Facebook page or the podcast Your Voice Facebook page. Yes, please. In the meantime, change your thinking, change your life, laugh hard, run fast, be kind. We'll see you next time.