ODD Is Not Just Bad Behavior And Here Is Why (part 2)

Defiance can look like disrespect, but what if it is really stress, shame, and a nervous system that cannot downshift? We pick up our series on oppositional defiant disorder (ODD) with a clear, parent-friendly breakdown of what ODD is, how common it is, and why it is most often diagnosed in kids and teens. We also talk through why the label gets missed or brushed off, even though it has been in the DSM for decades.

From there, we dig into the risk factors that show up again and again: ADHD and emotional dysregulation, trauma and adverse childhood experiences, high-conflict homes, and inconsistent discipline that turns rules into a moving target. We also cover how autism spectrum traits, learning disabilities, sensory processing challenges, and executive functioning deficits can lower frustration tolerance and make everyday demands feel impossible. If you have ever wondered why a child seems to argue everything, explode fast, or blame others, we connect those behaviors to what may be happening underneath without excusing harm.

We get practical about what helps: structure, predictability, fewer power struggles, and stronger positive reinforcement so the only attention is not tied to the worst moments. We talk therapy tools like cognitive behavioral therapy (CBT), why family therapy can change the whole household dynamic, and how repairing trust often starts with adults regulating themselves and owning mistakes. We also answer the medication question plainly: no medication is specifically approved for ODD, but treatment can include meds for co-occurring ADHD, depression, or severe mood instability under psychiatric guidance.

You will also hear our “winner of the week” rescue dog story plus a shelter spotlight on May, who needs a home. If this helped you, subscribe, share it with a parent or teacher, and leave us a review. What part of ODD feels the most familiar in your world right now?

Recorded May 11, 2026

FIND ME:
My Website: https://motorcityhypnotist.com/podcast
My social media links: 
Facebook:  https://www.facebook.com/motorcityhypnotist/
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCCjjLNcNvSYzfeX0uHqe3gA
Twitter: https://twitter.com/motorcityhypno
Instagram: motorcityhypno
FREE HYPNOSIS GUIDE
https://detroithypnotist.convertri.com/podcast-free-hypnosis-guide
Please also subscribe to the show and leave a review.
(Stay with me as later in the podcast, I’ll be giving away a free gift to all listeners!)

Change your thinking, change your life!
Laugh hard, run fast, be kind.  
David R. Wright MA, LPC, CHT
The Motor City Hypnotist

Transcript

Cold Open And Show Kickoff

SPEAKER_04 0:00

In this episode of the Motor City Hypnotist Podcast, we are back. We're talking about oppositional defiant disorder, commonly known as ODD. This is part two. If you've not listened to part one, you can jump back, listen to that, and be caught up. Or you can listen to it after we're done here. You'll still get all the information. It's all there. And also, we're giving away free stuff. Hang in there, folks. We'll be right back.

SPEAKER_00 0:22

This sounds like something for the authorities in Detroit. Well, joke's on you. I'm living to 102 and then at the city of Detroit.

SPEAKER_03 0:30

Guys like this ain't take over here out of Detroit.

SPEAKER_02 0:33

Spawn in the hellfire's a motel. Take him to Detroit.

SPEAKER_00 0:38

No! No, not Detroit! No!

SPEAKER_05 0:45

Stationed in Drambuing making things worse than Detroit. We did not have as a unit the confidence that we felt like we needed to beat Detroit. Let's go to Detroit. Now you're talking, brother. I don't think so. He plays for Detroit now. Do they have many farms in Detroit? Detroit to Michigan. I go to school, I know where Detroit is. Get ready for the motor city hypnotist David R. Wright, originating from the suburbs of Detroit, Michigan. He has hypnotized thousands of people from all over the United States. David R. Wright has been featured on news outlets all across the country and is the clinical director of an outpatient mental health and hypnosis clinic located just south of Detroit, where he helps people daily using the power of hypnosis. Welcome, the Motor City Hypnotist, David R. Wright.

Mother’s Day Golf And Kitchen Burn

SPEAKER_04 1:52

What is going on, my friends? It is David Wright, the Motor City Hypnotist. We are back with another episode of the Motor City Hypnotist Podcast. We're here. That is Matt Fox, the other voice you hear. Oh, there you are. Hanging out here, having a drink or two and enjoying a podcast. We're here. Yes, we are in the palatial podcast Your Voice, Southfield Studios, hanging out, doing a podcast, just having fun. I have to ask you, how was your weekend for Mother's Day, David? It was good. I golfed on Sunday morning. Kendra and I went out, did our first round of the season. It was okay. It was okay. Yeah, a little bit. Sorry. Our mic is out. We have the table mic, not the boom mic. So I gotta I gotta stay a little bit back. So I'm my little being up on that microphone. Yeah, well, because I'm used to that one. You can stay right up on the mic, you know. So gotcha. So yeah, we went out golfing yesterday morning, had a great time. I mean, didn't golf great. It's first round of the season, though, so I'll I'll give it that. I will say though, not to brag, but I only sliced one out of play on a drive. I had four drives that were these perfect draws right in the middle of the fairway. And that's ooh, keep my fingers crossed. That continues. So those that are watching on the video, yeah, you've got a big oh, I do have a bandage on my hand, left hand. Those of you watching on Facebook Live. So was it a really tough golf shot? No, this did not happen from golf. So it's Mother's Day. So I take Hendra out golfing, we do our thing, we get back, and she goes, I'd like fillets for dinner. I'm like, perfect. I'll run out. Went to the go went to the market, got some fillets, got some stuff for dinner, some asparagus, some Hollanday sauce, baked potatoes, a paycheck on meat. 100 bucks. Okay, yeah. I believe it was it was just for the meat, $72 for four fillets. See, yeah, yeah, that's crazy. I know. So I'm I'm I'm making the fillets on my cast iron skillet, which I use all the time. I love cooking with it. Stupid me. I I just grab the handle to move it, not even just not even thinking. And of course, if you if you guys know what a cast iron skillet, the whole skillet is flaming hot. I mean, you crank that heat up to get it as hot as you can get it. Because it has to cook and I grabbed that handle and I pulled it away immediately, but it was it was too late. So, so anyway, I end up having a trip to the ER for Mother's Day last night. Luckily, knock on wood, it was mostly one degree. There was just an area where it was two degree, which will blister, and that's right down here in this in this palm area. So it's all uh second degree is okay, there's no scarring. Yep, no scarring. The blister will pop and drain and and hopefully heal. But but I have antibiotic cream that I'm putting on it, and they say keep it wrapped for a few days. And honestly, today I'm I'm having no pain today. Good. So so so that's a good sign. So thank you for for the concern and and I appreciate it. I saw that and I'm like, oh no, I know his golf game is fucked. Yeah, I I think I'll be okay for this weekend because I have a big outing this weekend with my buddy Scott, who I've been friends with for like 30 years. You better keep it wrapped. That's all I'm saying. And we do the we do an event four times a season. That's the first time I've been involved in this, but each event, there's eight guys. Each event you have a match play for the first nine and a skins game on the in the set on the back nine. Take your shirts off and everything. Yeah, I know I'm not doing that, it might not be warm enough. But anyway, I'm I'm I'm pretty sure I'll be okay for golf this weekend. Perfect.

Weekend Stories And BMW Joke

SPEAKER_02 5:29

So yeah, I wanted to share with you that uh not this past weekend, not Mother's Day weekend. We had a great weekend, you know, kids and there was junior prom involved. Oh, nice a couple of times out. We had a dinner at Holly's mother's, and it was it was a nice time. Yeah, then then the water main broke in the town. We spent the day boiling water, it was it was fine, yeah. And we're working through it, right? The weekend before we made a trip out to Washington. Yes, I remember that. Yeah, and we went to the botanical gardens out there, it's beautiful. We got I got a lot of great pictures of flowers, nice and plants, yes, and tequila plants.

SPEAKER_03 6:04

Oh, nice. I mean agave, agave, yes.

SPEAKER_02 6:07

I call them tequila plants. But the one of the things that we did, we had breakfast with my stepfather's brother on a Saturday morning, and he's a super nice guy. You know, he he's quiet, he's very reserved, and you know, he he he does pretty well. And you know, we're walking out after breakfast to the uh to our cars and to go to the botanical gardens, and he was going off in his own way, and he looked at us and he goes, Do you know what the difference is between porcupines and BMWs? I I don't know. The pricks are on the inside as he gets into his BMW. Oh da, like this is the best way. What the fuck is it with? It was the funniest funny, and he's such a good guy, and I and uh for you, and I and I look forward to possibly seeing him in Michigan in August. Oh, nice when he's out here for work.

SPEAKER_04 7:03

He might have another good joke, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 7:05

So maybe, but it was it was just really funny, and I just I had to get that off my chest because it has stuck with me because a BMW is one of those cars that people look for, and it's a status symbol. Yeah, it's like I'm rich. It's not rich, it's just a status symbol. But yeah, you know, it was just a really funny joke, and I had to share that with you. Yeah, oh, that's awesome! And um, but yeah, the whole weekend, you know, I saw my mother, you know, nice, you know, pre-Mother's Day. You know, just had a really good time. Got to put eyes on her and my stepfather. Nice. We just had a really good weekend. We saw a really interesting play in Baltimore, and it was just it was a weekend, nice. It was an adult weekend. We got out and we had a good time.

SPEAKER_04 7:44

Nice, awesome. That's fantastic. Nice, nice Mother's Day.

Free Hypnosis Guide And Reviews

SPEAKER_02 7:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 7:48

So let me tell you folks first where you can find me. My website, motorcityhypnotist.com. Grad season is upon us. First shows is coming Saturday in Grand Blanc, Michigan. Uh, if you're still in need of entertainment for your grad night, now's the time. Motorcity hypnotist.com slash shows. You can have a quote within minutes and book within minutes as well. My social media links, Facebook, YouTube, are Motor City Hypnotist, and Snapchat, Instagram, and TikTok are all motorcity hypno, H Y P N O. Yes. And as we've done every episode going back to number one, text the word hypnosis to 313 800-8510. Within a few moments, you will get a text with a PDF written by me. It's a hypnosis guide. It's download, downloadable, yours to keep for free. It will also give you a link to my Google business page. And I would appreciate it very much if you could just leave a review there as far as the podcast, or if you've seen a show, or if you've seen me individually for hypnosis or therapy sessions.

SPEAKER_03 8:44

Leave a review.

SPEAKER_04 8:45

Yes, review is fantastic. And again, as far as reviews go, whatever platform you're on, whatever, wherever you're getting the podcast, leave a review there as well because it just helps us get out to more people and grow the show. All righty. It is time, Matt. Here we go.

Winner Of The Week Rescue Dog

SPEAKER_00 9:09

That's how win it is done.

SPEAKER_03 9:11

All righty.

SPEAKER_04 9:13

Who is it? Okay. We you know we uh uh it we do this, and I've said it a probably a thousand times, but I I always gravitate to animal stories just because I love animals. So this is one of those stories. Some rescue dog transformations are so profound that they restore your faith in second chances. Rescue dog transformations, Dobby's journey from squalor to a new family home is one of these stories.

SPEAKER_02 9:40

My hand is all the way up.

SPEAKER_04 9:41

Yep, I I we're gonna get to it because it's Dobby. Yes, I know your question. Why is his name Dobby? Because that's what he looks like. Yes, okay, yes, we're gonna get there. Don't worry.

SPEAKER_03 9:53

All right.

SPEAKER_04 9:55

When Humane World for Animals and the Runnies, or I'm sorry, the Runnels County Sheriff's Office arrived at a property in Ballinger, Texas. They found a heartbreaking scene. The air was thick with nonstop barking and the smell of feces and urine. So it's one of these situations, hoarders these animal hoarders, unfortunately. Among the many dogs inside, rescuers discovered a young pup that was completely hairless and crouched inside of a kitchen cabinet. Oh my god. And they gave her a fitting nickname Dobby for the Harry Potter house elf that was not allowed clothes. And I'll I'll I'll just show you the picture of Dobby and you can see why they called him Dobby. Oh man.

SPEAKER_02 10:44

Masters had given me a suck. Master has given me clothes. Yeah, Dobby is free.

SPEAKER_04 10:53

There's Dobby. Sorry. No, I that that it's it's it's so fitting. In total, the team rescued over 70 animals from the property. Holy shit, I know, including chickens, ducks, geese, and a cat. What the actual F, man? Each being given a chance at a better life. Okay. Dobby woke up the next morning in a clean and safe environment. Good. Her healing journey already underway. Perfect. Friendly with responders, she wagged her tail as she accepted gentle affection along with treatment for her mange, which most of the animals also required. Yeah. Haley, a graphic designer for Humane World, soon heard Dobby's story. The little hairless pup tugged at her heartstrings and she drove two hours to meet her. Good. I often joke that at some point while working at Humane World, I would likely fall in love with a pup and want to rescue one, Haley said. The connection was immediate, and Haley knew they were meant to be best friends. After bringing her home, Haley renamed her Misty to give her a fresh start and leave her painful past behind. That first night, Misty surprised everyone by prancing with joy around the house and quickly bonding with Haley's other dog, Oswald. Sweet. The two have now become inseparable friends. I love this. She began eating like a normal puppy, gaining weight, and where there had been only bare, irritated skin was now soft fur as her coat began growing in. Do we have an updated picture of Dobby? We do. I'll show you that in just a second. Okay, good. It takes a village to help animals like Dobby. Misty's transformation was incredible. The trembling, hairless dog from the kitchen cabinet became a confident, playful pup who knew she was loved. Shelters always need families willing to provide homes for animals who have been experienced neglect or abandonment, with each adoption creating space for another animal in need. Volunteering at local shelters, for instance, walking dogs or assisting with events or helping with administrative tasks all support rescue efforts. Even a few hours a month can have a meaningful impact. Okay. So there is a picture of Dobby a little bit later. You can see in that picture on the on the left with her his her new owner holding her. All right. She's got a lot of hair. Yep, the hair's coming back.

SPEAKER_02 13:17

Oh, and the dog too.

SPEAKER_04 13:19

Yeah. So that's that's kind of a well, it's an after and before.

SPEAKER_02 13:24

It's not in the right order, but it's see, see Dobby on the left-hand side of that picture. Those that are watching on the Facebook Live, yeah. You know, she she's she she's engaged, she's looking at the camera.

SPEAKER_04 13:38

And in and the in the Dobby in the cabinet is just broken. Yeah. Yes, you can see it. You just look at the difference in the eyes. Yes. Yes. Absolutely. Yeah. So anyway, great story. Again. Definitely winner of the week material. Thank you for that.

SPEAKER_03 13:53

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 14:01

That's how wit it is, Dobbs.

SPEAKER_04 14:03

Oh, I have one more picture of Dobby. Hold on. Oh, look, see. C. There it is. There's the there's an after picture. Misty, as she's now called. Love this. Yeah. Just loving life. You shall not hoot patty potato. Do you know? I it's funny, Matt. You you bring up. I I I I'm not like a huge Harry Potter nutter a fan, but I've but I've watched the movies. I don't know why. When Dobby died, that really broke me up. Did it really? Yes. For for some weird reason. I'm like, I don't even I haven't read these books. I I don't I don't love I mean I don't love it.

SPEAKER_02 14:41

It's it's entertaining, but they the the books got more into the story of the house elves and what have you and what they did for you know Gryffindor for the castle itself with the preparations of food and what have you, but the movie portrayed uh one house or a couple of different house elves, yeah. Okay, okay, but uh other than that, Dobby was the main feature of the stories.

SPEAKER_03 15:04

Yes, yes, Dolby! So we're here, folks. Oh, wait, what are we doing? Did we do no not that one? No, sorry, turn your computer down. Hold on, I got it. There you go. I got it. Wrong button. Wait, we'll just do it.

SPEAKER_04 15:17

So back to it.

ODD Basics Plus Prevalence

SPEAKER_04 15:19

Back to it. So we're talking about ODD. This is part two. And the first one we talked about really what ODD is and really the populations it affects the most, which which in general are children and adolescents. Sure. So we're gonna talk a little bit more as far as percentages, like like what what's what are the percentages of this diagnosis?

SPEAKER_02 15:41

And I had given you my prediction, it would have been the ages from four to the ages of 25 for the diagnoses of ages.

SPEAKER_04 15:50

Right now, ODD, you it can be diagnosed at any age, but honestly, but but the most you see it mostly with with children from like seven to twelve, and then adolescents up through up through age 20. Okay, yeah, right. So the question now, like who who's who tends to develop ODD and why? Like, like how does it happen? So research research has shown that ODD affects approximately three to ten percent of children. Think about that. One in ten children are affected with ODD. No, no, you said three to three three to ten percent. So on the high side, that's one in ten kids. That is that's three in ten, isn't it? Three to ten percent. Three to ten. I'm sorry, my my apologies. Yeah, three to ten percent. So on the high side, it's one out of every ten. Got it. The do the disorder is typically diagnosed in preschool, in elementary or early adolescence. And there's a severity to that, isn't there? Yes, with ODD, for sure. Yeah, like a severity of symptoms, yeah. Yes, for sure. So gender differences and younger children by boys are diagnosed more frequently than girls. By adolescence, the rates become more equal. We mentioned that last time. So, what what are the risk factors of ODD? Like, like what is is there something that that causes this? Is there something that that that kind of kind of sets this off?

ODD Risk Factors And Root Causes

SPEAKER_04 17:19

So here's the several risk factors that that can contribute to ODD. Okay. One is uh ADHD. This is one of the strongest correlations uh uh with ODD diagnosis, that that a majority are also diagnosed with ADHD.

SPEAKER_02 17:36

Is that because they have a certain routine that they have to stick to and if that gets broken? A lot of that happens, yes.

SPEAKER_04 17:43

Okay, so uh impulsivity and emotional dysregulation often overlap if somebody has ADHD and ODD. And you're right, Matt. With ADHD, it's an it's it's an inability to focus. You feel like you're always behind, you can't pay attention to things, and that may lead to these emotional reactions that that I I I can't do life, I can't function, I I'm I'm I'm you know, I can't, I can't I can't stay focused on things.

SPEAKER_02 18:11

ADHD and OCD is um is a big proponent of ODD right and those symptoms, if you will.

SPEAKER_04 18:18

Yes. Okay. The other big risk factor is trauma and and adverse childhood experiences. So abuse, neglect, domestic violence, uh parental substance abuse, or family instability, divorce, parents moving in and out, those kind of things have a big effect. Because, and the reason being is that defiance becomes a coping mechanism or a survival strategy if you're growing up in a in a in a volatile household.

SPEAKER_02 18:50

Yeah, yes, right. They they need to find their space or find their spot within that household. Yep, and if they're being ignored, or if mom and dad are arguing and they're doing their own things and blah blah blah, and they have like, okay, I need to have a voice, and this is the only way I know how to do it.

SPEAKER_04 19:11

And and let's let's delve a little bit deeper into family stress, high conflict households, inconsistent discipline, chronic stress. These are all contributors to having an ODD diagnosis.

SPEAKER_02 19:23

Inconsistent discipline kind of intrigues me because you do something wrong, you get discipline. A week later, you do the same thing, and there's no repercussion.

SPEAKER_04 19:33

Yes, and and many parents are probably guilty of inconsistent discipline. I I now that doesn't mean just because that's happening, you're gonna have an ODD kid. No, but it can't, but it, but it can be a contributing factor, and that's the big thing that we have to look at is that okay, uh as a parent, once your kid has ODD as a parent, it's best to get professional help. But but as as small children, you need to have a consistent structure as far as what the expectations are, what are what are the dis what discipline happens when you do something?

SPEAKER_01 20:11

Sure.

SPEAKER_04 20:12

And here's the thing that that that's often, and I see it a lot, and and I and again, all of us, all of us parents are probably guilty of this. We we become a reactionary. So one day your kid might break a vase and you're like, oh, it's an accident, it's okay. The next day, the kid breaks a vase and it's like you're grounded for a week. That it's and it's not within a day. That's that that I'm just kind of throwing out a random example, but I mean it could be a week, it could be a month. It depends on where the vase came from.

SPEAKER_02 20:46

Mom always said, Don't play ball in the house, right? You know what? Dad got her that vase last year for Mother's Day with flowers, no big deal. That vase came from grandma, and she'd been gone for a while, and that was an airloom.

SPEAKER_04 21:01

Yeah, it's it's more value. Yes, yes, there's some more emotional connection to that. The other thing, again, and this this plays in big is anybody who's on the autism spectrum is more likely to have ODD. Agreed. Learning disabilities, sensory processing difficulties, executive functioning deficits, these all are prime issues with ODD, as it is with autism. And and again, uh people who who are diagnosed with autism typically struggle with frustration tolerance and emotional control. And that just kind of just feeds into that ODD. So again, we've talked about it, we've answered questions

Why Punishment Backfires With ODD

SPEAKER_04 21:43

about it. Let me make it let me give you some examples of what it looks like in real life. Okay. What does ODD look like if you have a kid or a teenager? Imagine a child who refuses every request, argues constantly, explodes. Emotionally, blames everyone else, and turns everyday routines into battles.

SPEAKER_00 22:07

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 22:08

That's a list of symptoms. Parents become exhausted. That happens. Dad becomes bald. Teachers may interpret it as just rebellion or or manipulative or intentional disruption. But underneath this behavior, we have to look at what's causing this frustration, shame, emotional overwhelm, anxiety, or feeling chronically misunderstood.

SPEAKER_02 22:36

You know, the chronically misunderstood is probably the most part of all of that.

SPEAKER_04 22:42

I well, I think the emotional overwhelm is is I I mean and I'm not weighing these, but but that's a big one. It's it's just you don't know how to process emotion.

SPEAKER_02 22:53

You don't know how to express yourself. Yes. You know, right in in the English language. You you might be very you you might be a genius, but you can't verbalize what you're feeling. Exactly. And that's the most frustrating part for a teenager is that they have these feelings, these emotions, but they don't have the vernacular to say, I'm feeling X, Y, Z. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_04 23:16

Yep. And because there's no emotional regulation, there's typically no emotional intelligence. Yes, they're feeling something, but they don't know how to even express it, and they don't even know how to say it.

SPEAKER_01 23:27

Right.

SPEAKER_04 23:28

So here's the thing: I listed all of these things, and it doesn't excuse behavior. And and that's not the point of this. Behavior should never just be excused, but understanding the root causes changes how you approach this person.

SPEAKER_00 23:43

Right.

SPEAKER_04 23:43

Punishment alone rarely it doesn't work, is is is positive. In fact, excessive punishment often escalates ODD behaviors because the person then feels even more unheard and more misunderstood.

SPEAKER_02 23:58

And and we've been saying ODD for a while. What and what does ODD stand for? Oppositional defiant disorder. Defiant disorder. Yeah, it escalates, it takes it to the next level up. They become more defiant if you continue to punish inappropriately.

SPEAKER_04 24:14

Is that an inappropriate? No, no. In fact, in fact, we're gonna get into that, Matt. That was a that was a perfect thing because as a parent with with a kid who has ODD, oftentimes you're you're at a loss. What do I do? I don't I don't know how to manage this, I don't know what's going on.

Practical Parenting And Therapy Tools

SPEAKER_04 24:29

All right. So here's here's some of the things that that parents should learn to manage their child who has ODD, or even a family member, because they could be adults in in certain sit situations.

SPEAKER_02 24:41

We talked about ages from you said eight to 20. Yeah, right. But there is a part of oh, and it can't exist outside of those age, right?

SPEAKER_04 24:50

That that's just the common times that it's diagnosed, right? Right. So parents need to learn these are the things that our parents can do. Consistent discipline. Now that doesn't mean going off the deep end as far as you're growing. It just has to be consistent. They and in fact, I tell parents if your child does something wrong, they need to know what the consequence is. You can't just react and say, and I and I brought up this example last episode, I think. Or maybe this episode, we're talking about the vase. Kid breaks a vase, one day it's fine, the next day you you beat the kid into oblivion. So so there has to be consistent discipline. And and in the that not just discipline, consequences. Correct. Consistent discipline and consequence. That's better. Talking to parents about emotional regulation strategies, how to help your child feel and talk about these emotions in a safer environment. Positive reinforcement. When the kid does something good, and and here's the problem with ODD kids, parents, they often don't react unless there's a unless there's a behavior, unless there's a negative behavior. That's what gets your attention because a kid is screaming and punching himself. You're gonna react. When the kid does something good, that reaction is sometimes not there. Yeah, you don't reinforce the good stuff. And as parents, also how to reduce this power struggle. Because here's the thing you're you're never gonna win the power struggle with an ODD person. Really? It's not you're you're not going to because in their head, they're just they're just expressing emotion, right? There's no right or wrong to that. You just have to be a Jedi and take the high ground. Well, not necessarily, but instead of constant punishment, here here are the things that you can do. Okay, structure, which we talked about, consistent discipline, predictability, again, setting up situations where the kid or the or the the adolescent knows what to expect. And again, strengthening positive behaviors. So there are programs that and there there are a lot of different programs out there online. And and I I I'm gonna list these.

SPEAKER_02 27:48

Do you remember when you do you remember that time when you you almost become Chris Farley in SNL and you're talking to your kid about something that happened a couple of days ago because now they're in that lucid state, and you have to have that calm conversation about how their behavior affected an environment that was happening at the time. Absolutely. Yep.

SPEAKER_04 28:14

You remember that time when so again, the approaches as far as a child or or adolescent or even an adult, the things that we want to address is in therapy, if if and again, I if if your child or your adolescent or an adult has ODD, they should probably be seeking therapy. Yeah. But cognitive behavioral therapy helps with identifying emotions, managing anger, improving or increasing a frustration tolerance, and developing problem-solving skills. Sure. Now, you would think these are things that just children learn, but with ODD, it does it it doesn't always happen that way.

SPEAKER_02 28:55

And that actually helps to when you have those, when you when you call it out, when you have those calm conversations after the fact, that actually helps their emotional intelligence in the future.

SPEAKER_04 29:05

The big thing that that need you need to compare, and and here's kind of the the the side effect that comes along with ODD, that that a lot of these clients, whether they're kids or adolescents, probably more into adolescence because they have they have their brains a little bit more developed, it ends up being this vicious cycle of blow up, feel guilty, hate yourself, blow up, feel guilty, hate yourself. And it's the cycle. And and believe me, these people suffering from ODD, they don't want, they don't want to exhibit these behaviors. You gotta break that cycle. It's not it's it's not their intent. They they it feels as it feels worse for them than for anyone else. So just approaching it that quit being an a-hole, that that you're you're not addressing the emotional need that's there.

SPEAKER_02 29:55

It's more of I hear you, I understand where you're coming from. Let's take a second. Let's let's figure out how you can manage when you feel this. Let's take a second, let's go our own ways, let's have some quiet time, no matter what the age there are.

SPEAKER_04 30:13

The other thing that I would recommend very strongly is family therapy with the client who suffers from ODD, the parents, even siblings, because it's a household, it's it's an ecosystem. So, so everybody has to be on the same page. Family therapy can help reduce conflict, improve communication, establish boundaries, and and the most important thing is rebuilding trust, yeah. So that this person can come to you when they need to.

SPEAKER_02 30:43

Yep. So they're comfortable enough to know that you you're there for them and you're not gonna react, you're not gonna be so reactionary because you're just gonna be in an a-hole, yeah. That that you're being reactionary. You need to get to uh as an individual that has someone in that household that has ODD, you have to learn to regulate yourself first. Oh, sure.

SPEAKER_04 31:04

And and as a parent, that's really difficult. Now, and I'm and I'm talking personal experience here, yeah. Because I I I and again, I'm I want to be transparent and honest with you. My son, who has ODD, many times when he's had these behaviors, I've lost my shit because I'm frustrated, I'm overwhelmed, I'm emotionally drained.

SPEAKER_02 31:26

You're a parent, right? And and and you're not no one's perfect, right? Right, yeah, but we all have to but the fact that you're an individual that recognizes yes, I overreacted. There's a lot of people out there that won't even accept that they overreacted.

SPEAKER_04 31:41

Well, and the big thing, and I say this to parents all the time parents make mistakes. We're nobody's perfect, we're gonna make mistakes. The best thing you can do is acknowledge it to the person you made the mistake with. Dear Theodosia, I I anytime I've lost my shit with my wife or with my son, every time after the fact I've said I was out of line, I apologize, I'll try to understand better. Yeah, you you you have to have that debrief because that shows one to them that okay, yeah, that wasn't pleasant, but he's owning up to it.

SPEAKER_02 32:16

So, you know, at least he's acknowledging it. And it's a start of you're you're not gonna get their trust right away. That's a start of rebuilding whatever what trust you did lose.

SPEAKER_04 32:27

Well, and the other thing it sets an example for them. It does because when you when you make a mistake and you apologize, then they see, oh, I can I can apologize if I do something wrong. And and it reinforces that approach.

SPEAKER_02 32:42

It it as in no one's perfect, right? We all make mistakes, we all act out. It's how we handle ourselves after the fact. When it comes to the ODD side, it's almost as if they don't the person doesn't have the the gumption to think first before. Right. Yes, that there's no critical thinking. You're right, right, yes, and that's where we want to help them get to is to understand before you explode, I want you to just take a deep breath and think about where you are and what's going on. And it's really tough to do with kids that are eight years old. No, no, absolutely. It's so tough.

SPEAKER_04 33:24

No, it it is difficult. And as again, as a parent with a child who has ODD, it is difficult.

SPEAKER_02 33:29

It's a challenge. It is. And and if I may ask, and I and I'm I kind of want to pry at no you can at what age was he diagnosed?

SPEAKER_04 33:37

I uh see, I okay, so technically speaking, he's been seeing a therapist since he was probably six, seven. So even even as a as a small child, there were behaviors that were concerning, but not super concerning. Sure. So I'll give you an example. Pinewood Derby. He was in Cub Scouts. Okay. We did Pinewood Derby every year. I I'm I'm I'm not some some great carpenter with all these skills. So but you know, we made his car. We're we're we're on the day of Pinewood Derby, his car comes in last place, last place, last place. And and he just he just he just disappeared emotionally. And when I say that, it's just like you could see it in his eyes. He wasn't even there. He was he he was upset. He he was upset and he was angry, but the way it looked, it just like it just like like he wouldn't answer anybody, he wouldn't talk to anybody. He just just was blank, he was just blank.

unknown 34:44

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 34:45

And then later is when the emotional thing came, when he was out of you know, out of public view, that's when the emotion came.

unknown 34:54

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 34:54

So so but but again, as a parent, these are things that happen. Yeah, you you you you can't guarantee everything's gonna work out. Yeah, and and that's the difficulty, and that's kind of thing. So the question becomes okay, so I I have a child or an adolescent or even an adult who ha who I think has ODD.

Medication Limits Plus Next Steps

SPEAKER_02 35:14

What what medication can they take? See, and med as you've stated so many times on the on this show, medication is the last resort. It is a last resort, it's not an answer, it can be a tool. It's a tool, it can be a tool, it can be a tool for this type of diagnosis. I I I can't think of any medication off the top of my head that would be useful unless you are diagnosed with ADHD and what have you.

SPEAKER_04 35:40

Well, let me answer that that statement, Matt. I can make it very clear. There is no medication specifically approved for ODD. Thank you. That's why I don't think of anything. However, medications may help when co-occurring conditions are present, which is often the case. Right. So, for example, ADHD. There, there is Adderall for children, there's Ritalin. There's there's other non-traditional, non-habit forming medications for ADHD. So that's something you'd have to talk to a psychiatrist about. Right. Antidepressants, SSRIs in particular. And we did a and we did an episode on antidepressants just a few episodes back. So if that if SSRIs are selective uptake, reuptake inhibitors. So not to get we did a whole episode on that. Go back and find it.

SPEAKER_02 36:29

Go back and listen, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 36:30

But SSRIs help emotional regulation, so that could help. Mood stabilizers or antipsychotics also can be very helpful. Something like RISPRD and Lamicdal is a is a is a brand name of a common mood stabilizer. Got it. And these are typically reserved for behavioral dysregulation. I'm almost thinking there's an episode three on this. There could be, yes, because we could be getting into more stuff.

SPEAKER_01 36:59

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_04 37:00

Yes. And and I think we are going to do an episode three because I'm just looking ahead. Yeah. And there's still stuff I want to share as far as treatment goes and some approaches. Yes. So what we're going to do is we're going to say this is the end of this episode number two, but we are going to have oppositional defiant disorder episode three coming up next Monday. Yes. So just know that. We'll get you all the information you need. But but I think this is important because I think this is a, in my personal opinion, this is this is a very overlooked or ignored diagnosis for many people.

SPEAKER_02 37:35

And I'm especially for parents. And I'm glad that you've brought this into your show because I've I honestly I've never heard of ODD. Yep. And it's it's it's kind of eye-opening for me as a as a parent of six children. Yep. You know, I I've raised amazing kids and I am and I'm helping to raise amazing kids. And ODD is just something I've never heard of. And I kind of going back into my past and going, I should have done more research. Right. Because it has been in the DSM since 1980. Right.

SPEAKER_04 38:13

So but again, unless you unless you have to face it, unless you have to deal with it, you wouldn't even think of it. But I think it doesn't even come down.

SPEAKER_02 38:20

It was probably there, and I had no clue. Maybe, maybe so. You're right. And and I look at my I go on. Yeah, sorry.

SPEAKER_04 38:26

Yeah. So no, you're right. Because again, as parents, if you don't have the knowledge, you just think as I said earlier, that the kids just be in an a-hole, knock it off. But but but you don't there could be something much deeper going on there. And you're right about that.

SPEAKER_00 38:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 38:41

So we are going to come back next week with ODD part three. Love it. And we'll get you some specifics as far as what what you know what treatments are recommended, what types of treatments. And we're going to get into the medication part more in depth also.

SPEAKER_02 38:57

Oh, we're going to talk shock therapy? I'm kidding.

SPEAKER_04 39:00

I mean, I mean, maybe. All right. Before we go, all right.

Adoptable Dog May And Signoff

SPEAKER_04 39:06

Taylor Animal Shelter. Okay. I know our typical sponsor, well, not really a sponsor, I just make them our sponsor. Detroit Dog Rescue. For some reason, their site's been down. I don't know what's up, but we'll figure it out. But anyway, May needs a home. And this is at Taylor. Taylor Animal Rescue. Yes. This one is a terrier lab mix. Female will be about 60 pounds. Okay. But May needs a home.

SPEAKER_02 39:32

Oh, look at that face. I know. They're laying down in a straitjacket. That's so cute. I'm I'm kidding. She's laying down. Yeah. And she's just got her harness on. Yeah. She's got a harness on, a walking harness. She's adorable. Yeah, it's not a good one. I love the black and white knot. Yeah, it's just the face is so striking. Yeah. She's got very uh kind and wise eyes. Yeah. I gotta say. Facebook, you know, Facebook Live folks, they need to stick around for these because you do.

SPEAKER_04 39:59

I'm and those those of you listening to audio, I mean, we do one of these every week, and you never get to see them. So jump onto Facebook Live, Motor City Hypnotist Facebook page. It goes live every week, Mondays, around right around eight Eastern Standard Time, give or take.

SPEAKER_02 40:15

I'm I'm a sucker for dogs with dogs with kind and wise eyes. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 40:20

So anyway, May needs a home. That would be Taylor Animal Rescue. No, I'm sorry. Taylor, I forgot the name of it already. Taylor Animal Rescue. Taylor Animal Shelter.com. Yep. All right. That is our show, folks. We'll see you next time. Change your thinking, change your life, laugh hard, run fast, be kind. We'll see you next time.