PURITY: How societal expectations impact our sexual & mental health

Chrissy opens today’s episode with a nature visualization meditation, then shares the definition of the word purity, and invites us to consider the question: how have societal expectations or the idea of purity impacted your mental health?

Erica Smith also joins the conversation to discuss her work as an award-winning sexuality educator and consultant with over 20 years of experience. Together, Chrissy and Erica discuss purity culture, Erica’s approach to working with people coming out of it, and how people can incorporate sex education more positively and inclusively.

Then Chrissy shares this week’s book recommendation, Pure: Inside the Evangelical Movement That Shamed a Generation of Young Women and How I Broke Free by Linda Kay Klein.

And in the end, Chrissy encourages you to ask yourself:

• How have societal expectations or the idea of purity impacted your mental health?
• Can purity be achieved or is it an unattainable ideal?
• How do you handle situations that challenge your sense of purity?

☀️ My memoir, Finding Sunlight, is here! Learn more & order your copy today

Transcript

[0:00] Music.

[0:10] Hi, welcome to Stirred by Words, a podcast that uses the power of words to unlock your writing and wellness practices. I'm your host, Chrissy Holm, writer, editor, and wellness advocate.
This show is about my love for words, writing, and wellness, and I'm passionate about learning from others. Grateful to have you join us.
Today's meditation is inspired by this week's word, purity.
Take a moment to find a comfortable seat, close your eyes, and take three deep breaths.

[0:46] Music.

[1:31] Next, imagine yourself walking next to a beautiful meadow or outdoor nature scene.

[1:37] Music.

[1:43] Imagine that you approach a river, stream, or body of water ahead of you.
When you look into the water, you notice some leaves or debris floating on the surface.
With each breath you take, imagine the water becoming clearer and clearer until you see.

[2:01] Music.

[2:11] Next, think about the word purity and visualize a bright light surrounding your body.

[2:17] Music.

[2:25] Picture a cleansing of your thoughts and emotions, the negativity leaving your body and the clarity entering in.

[2:33] Music.

[2:53] Now it's time for today's word, purity. Merriam-Webster has one definition for the noun purity, but I'll also break down the word pure.
Purity means the quality or state of being pure. And pure means unmixed with any other matter, free from dust, dirt, or taint, and then free from sin or guilt.
Here are a few fun facts about the word purity. The first known use of purity was in the 13th century.
The opposite of purity is impurity, meaning something that is or that makes impure, such as impurities in the water that make it cloudy, or the quality or state of being obscene.
There are a few idioms and sayings with the word pure. For example, pure and simple, meaning something straightforward or uncomplicated, or pure luck, meaning by chance without skill or effort.

[3:52] Other synonyms for purity include cleanliness, cleanness, innocence, goodness, virtue, and morality.
Today's question is, how has societal expectations or the idea of purity affected your mental health?
So I've been definitely impacted by what they call purity culture, And for those of you who might not know what that is, in my experience, specifically, the conservative Christianity movement that really promoted abstinence before marriage and that sexual activity outside of marriage was impure.
And it focused on modesty, traditional gender roles, and so on.
So that's what purity culture is.
But from my personal experience, the concept of purity has really impacted my mental health.
In addition to religion, Sometimes there's a pressure to conform or set unrealistic expectations, such as like body size, how I should act, sexual activity, et cetera.
And striving for this pure form can really take a toll on mental health by feeling that increased shame, not feeling good enough, and even anxiety, all of which I've experienced myself.
So shifting my attitude and mindset towards purity has been crucial to my healing, and I'm really excited for you all to hear more from our guest on this word as it relates to sexuality education.

[5:20] Music.

[5:31] Guest is Erica Smith. Erica is an award-winning sexuality educator and consultant with over 20 years of experience. Throughout her career, she has provided comprehensive sex education and advocacy to young women and LGBTQ youth in Philadelphia's juvenile justice system, worked in an abortion care, and supported HIV-positive and transgender adolescents and their families. In 2019, she developed the Purity Culture Dropout Program to help people learn all of the sex education that they missed growing up in purity culture.
Sex ed that is accurate, queer inclusive, trauma informed, compassionate, and comprehensive.
She has since worked with hundreds of people to help them learn about healthy sexuality after high control religion.
Erica lives in Philadelphia with her partner in a house full of rescue animals.
I'm super excited to have her join us today.
Welcome, Erica.

[6:27] Hello, Erica, happy to have you here. Thank you so much, it's so nice to see you, Chrissy. You too.
Well, we can just dive right in, but first I wanted to say, I'm beyond thrilled to be interviewing you for this podcast in your class.
So you think that your LGBTQ was a game changer for me. And I just, I really have been following your work for a couple of years and I was nervous to join it, but then it was so healing.
So I really appreciate that you have put out such helpful work.
Thank you.

[6:58] It's so rewarding to hear that every single time. Cause when you do create content on social media, sometimes it's like, is anyone listening? Am I yelling into the ether?
But knowing that what I do and the things that I share have like a tangible impact on people never gets old.
So thank you for saying that.
Absolutely. Yeah. And then kind of relating to that too, like you have your Purity Culture Queer Support Groups, which I joined as well. So shout out to my group.
Of course I could go on and on just even like you said the shouting out to the ether type things but I know you know a lot about um even though you didn't grow up in it you know a lot about purity culture and since our word of this episode is purity I'd love to hear what does purity mean to you? I mean the word purity to me in my personal life it never had any relation to sexuality so I would think you know hear the word purity and I'd be like yeah it's about like the quality of water or air, you know? The quality of an element perhaps, but I don't believe it should have any relation to humans. Yeah. How do you think that concept of purity, like whether it's just a water type thing or like how it relates to humans, how people have interpreted it, at least. How do you think that concept affects society as a whole?

[8:19] It constantly, if we're talking about purity as it relates to humans and human behavior, it is a constant goalpost that you can't meet because it's going to keep moving.

[8:31] There's no way to achieve, quote unquote, purity in your words and your actions and your behaviors and your thoughts because nothing is ever going to be good enough. Humans are messy and imperfect, and it's just not a word that I think should be addressing humans at all. I don't know when or how we decided that that was something that people should strive for, but it's never going to be something that humans can perfectly achieve. Right. It kind of plays into that perfectionism. You're trying to reach that. This is perfect kind of thing. Yeah. And I don't know.

[9:11] Know if this is a tangent or this is going to be very related to our topic, but, you know, we, we think about sexual purity, people trying not to engage in sexual behavior or people even trying not to have sexual thoughts. But I also see in particular women, like young women online striving for different types of purity, such as I'm going to drink so much water that my pee will be clear. Or I don't have any discharge on my underwear because I am a clean woman, which is not a thing. Anyone who has a vulva and a vagina is going to have discharge on their underwear, but just the attempt to position ourselves as these like superior beings over others by how, like how clear our pee is. Like, it's just like, that's not healthy. It's not good. You're never going to, what are you trying to prove. It's just, yeah, things like that.
Yeah, it's more, it's even beyond, like you said, just sex or whatever. It's what our bodies are doing or like how much we're drinking, you know, but.

[10:16] And like I would tie that also into the idea of like clean eating and having a clean diet.
It's not something like there's no standard definition of what that means. And there's also no achieving an ultimate way to eat clean, quote unquote. It's just like, your food is processed, it's manufactured. There's going to be, even organic produce is going to involve the use of certain pesticides or maybe poor labor practices. Like just eating clean is another example of like trying to achieve a standard that is so vague and that you can't ever actually reach.
Yeah, absolutely. That makes sense. It gets me thinking a lot about just like.

[10:59] How we try to set an impossible standard. And by we, it's just like, well, society, it's just, we're trying to reach these things that you can't, you know? Yeah.
Yeah. And it's a waste of our energy and time, and it's a massive distraction when we're in that zone of trying to achieve perfection or cleanliness or purity or, you know, all of those things that just can't be achieved.
Definitely. So when we think about like the history of it, how would you say that our attitudes or understanding towards like purity or impure have evolved over time. It's hard for me to feel confident answering that question because I feel like it requires sort of a historian perspective and you.

[11:43] Know maybe even someone who studies the entomology of the word but I didn't really see the concept of purity applying to sexuality until I I mean me personally until I started hearing about Christian purity culture. And in other, even before, like, evangelical Christian purity culture, there's like a bit of, you know, not a bit, but in Catholicism, you know, there's the idea of virginity and purity, but it's not taken to the extreme that the evangelical purity culture is. So, yeah, I don't feel like I have a great answer for that. That's okay. Yeah. I mean, I think even just knowing that, like, each different part of religion may be different. And yeah, I mean, that's a that's a tough question.

[12:34] And also, like, there, there are definitely aspects of it that I'm missing and not equipped to speak on, because I know that there's sexual purity in other religions, like there's sexual purity ideas of sexual purity in Islam. And that is, we hear the stories where, like, if a woman is rendered impure by sexual violence. We hear these stories of like extreme consequences, such as her even being killed in an honor killing. And so like this isn't a...
It's not a brand new concept. It's something that the idea of purity has, the idea of sexual purity has been part of major world religions for thousands of years. Absolutely. What would you say, like, just in hearing from clients, are the most, like, harmful aspects of purity culture?
That's such a great question because there are so many aspects of it that are harmful. But overall, the big picture that I see is filling people with so much fear of what is a completely common, normal, holistic part of being a human, just making everything so scary. Here are the rules, and you should be really afraid that you are going to violate them in any way.

[13:47] Also, sex is this dangerous, full of landmines. You're going to constantly make a mistake. Your Immortal soul is going to be in jeopardy, so is your physical body. You're going to get sick, you're going to get hurt, you're going to get heartbroken. And the people that I work with who have been raised learning these things have fears about sexuality that would have never even occurred to me to be afraid of. Sometimes I'm just like, oh my gosh, I can't believe you were told that if you have sex with someone or enjoy masturbation before you get married, you're you're gonna be damaging your relationship, damaging the marital relationship.
Like to teach people that is purely to control their behavior.
I use the word purely in a correct sense. Yeah.
Yeah, right. It's just like totally to control their behavior.
So keeping people terrified at all times of something that is such an intrinsic part of who they are, that is damaging beyond belief.
Yeah, that's powerful. Obviously, I've experienced a lot of it myself, so I hear what you're saying. Yeah, that's tough.
How do you then approach teaching people about sexuality that's inclusive, that's sex positive.
While also acknowledging purity culture. Yeah, so my approach to sex education is.

[15:12] It's the same whether I'm working with someone who was raised in purity culture or not. And that is, I believe in giving people all of the information that they want, that is relevant to their experience, giving them the space to think critically about it for themselves, and then letting them make their own decisions about how they incorporate that information into their lives.
So even when I worked for years, I worked with teenagers, specifically teenagers who were in jail. So I worked in a juvenile detention center doing sex education. And these were young people that had had a lot of sexual violence. They were involved in the system in ways that were.

[15:51] That's a whole other conversation. Kids getting caught up in the criminal justice system is a mess, but they were young people that for a lot of adults, a lot of adults would be like, wow, they really shouldn't be having sex. They're out here having sex. They're making babies.
They're getting STIs. And never once when I worked with them, did I tell them like, you need to stop this. You need to do X, Y, or Z. It was like, okay, so you have a boyfriend.
He's pressuring you to have sex. What do you think about that? How do you feel about that?
These are the things that I want you to know. Do you feel like you're comfortable having these conversations with him, just giving people the skills and the information that can equip them to make their own decisions about sex. And so my approach is the same way, whether I'm working with a teenager in jail or whether I'm working with a 45-year-old woman who has three kids. It's here are the things you should know, and let's talk about how that information might make you feel and how you might apply it to your life.

[16:53] And when it comes to people coming out of purity culture, I am, I think it's important for me to understand what purity culture is and to be, you know, I use the word trauma informed.
I know that gets thrown around a lot, but to have a trauma informed perspective truly means to not assume the people you're talking to haven't been hurt and traumatized in some way.
So I don't push people to learn things that they're uncomfortable about to behave in ways that are, you know, uncomfortable for them.
It's more like, let's talk about how you feel, what you want to know, how you think this info applies to you.
It's just, I just make sure to do it in a way where people always have autonomy.
Because a big tenet of a high-control religion that might include purity culture is people don't get to make decisions, people aren't asked what they think or feel, people are just told how they think or feel, and told what is right and what's wrong.
So, I'm making a correlation in my head that I'd never made before just now, I'm having a big realization.

[17:59] That was always powerful to a young person who is being controlled, you know, a young person who has to ask when they can go to the bathroom and when they can come out of their room.
Giving them the option as to whether or not to talk to me or to talk about certain topics always felt really like, wow, this lady's giving me agency.
And I think it's similar when you're working with people that come out of a high control religion.
And if I'm like, so tell me what you think, tell me what you want to learn, tell me how this makes you feel. can be.
Really powerful and also it can be really difficult for somebody who's so used to being told how to be.

[18:37] So I often get people that are like, well, I know what the purity culture rules are.
Can you just give me a new set of rules? I'm like, no, I am not going to give you a new set of rules.
That is not why I'm here.
I am not here to be your next guru. I want you to make your own set of rules.
Oh, that hits me so hard. That is so true.
You're told what to do and not to ask why or how or whatever. It's just like, this is what you do.
Yeah. And that's just not going to fly when it comes to something as intimate as, impersonal as sexuality.

[19:13] Yeah. You have to utilize your own tool to know what, and I don't mean the actual, you know, to be able to decide what you want and your needs and all that.
Yeah. It's so different for everybody.
Absolutely. So what advice would you give somebody maybe that's struggling with kind of like this purity sexuality piece? Maybe they're just getting started on this journey.
That is, you know, as you know, from personal experience, it feels insurmountable when you first begin to question it, especially if you were raised in a family that has the same values.
Same values. You know, I've met people that were like, my family doesn't really believe in this, but I went to youth group and with my friend and I got it that way. But if you were someone who's like family or parents are very invested in the idea of your purity as well, it can feel so scary to begin to question what your reality has been for your whole life. And I want people to know that it can be done and you are not crazy. If you feel like if you feel like this is making me like.

[20:22] Overwhelming, and I can't ever get out from under it, like, you are one of so many people who have already begun the deconstruction journey around purity culture, and you were in really good company.
And the idea of evangelical Christian purity isn't the only perspective on sex.
It is not the only take on sex. It's the only one you've been given so far.
But there's so much more out there to learn, and so many different perspectives that don't involve shame, blame, and control. I would tell people to be really gentle with yourself, give yourself time, seek out resources about sex that are not based in religion. And I mean that.

[21:08] Let me back up for a second. There are some folks in the deconstruction space who have sort of like deconstructed purity culture values and still find a really like wonderful loving way to be Christian. It's just not the same way of being Christian that they might have been raised with. So you don't have to give up your religion as a whole to give up purity culture. Some people do land there, but others don't. And other people are like, I have a different relationship with Jesus, different than the one I was, you know, taught to have. So you don't have to give up your religion entirely, but if you do, you are also in good company.
Absolutely. Yeah, it's kind of like back to what you were saying about like.

[21:53] You kind of have to just find the tools that work for you essentially and it's like your sexuality like it's gonna it's a really personal journey so uh when you're talking about like educating um in jail and stuff but like beyond that so we have parents and educators who listen to this podcast if they want to like approach sex education more positively and inclusively but they're kind of maybe struggling with that societal pressure what advice would you give to them, It's so difficult, especially if you are in the United States right now.
The backlash against sex education and the backlash against people that provide sex education to young people is really terrifying right now.
So if you are in the position where you're like, I want young people to have this information that I consider life-saving and information that I consider abuse prevention, you have to remember why you're doing this, why you want young people to have this information.

[22:52] And one thing that I will say is it has been proven not just through research and longitudinal studies about abstinence only education, but I'm thinking of just all the people that I've met in this work, keeping information from young people or adults about their bodies and about their sexuality does not result in positive outcomes. It can cause people to be more vulnerable to abuse and exploitation. If a child doesn't know about consent, if a child doesn't know about bodily autonomy, if a child doesn't know that their private body parts are just for them, if a child doesn't know how their body works, it can create a a situation where it could be easier for someone to take advantage of them.
That is like a really intense thing to say, but it is important when you're thinking of like, well, why do kids need this information? Kids don't need this information.
Said for kids isn't going to kindergartners and being like, Let's talk about.
Anal sex and dildos. That's not what we're doing. That is not what anyone is trying to do, but that is the people who we're anti-sex ed are trying to push that narrative. When in reality, if you're talking about young people, there's age-appropriate information you deliver at different ages. And I would say to anyone trying to do that in the face of this current.

[24:18] Political climate, remember the young people you care about what they need. That is the important thing. You want them to be able to be empowered with this information and you want them to not be vulnerable and you want them to grow up with a healthy relationship to their own bodies and a healthy relationship to their sexuality when that becomes a bigger part of their life.
And by not giving them information, you're setting them up for anything from unwanted sexual health outcomes to just extreme fear and shame, which we know can carry into adult relationships, can carry into marriages, can be something that you grapple with for decades.

[25:01] Yeah, it definitely just lives within you, like your body, your mind, everything. Yeah.
So one more question before we kind of get towards the end. How might individuals who have experienced like shame, guilt related to sexual experiences or sexuality find healing or acceptance and maybe even hope? I have so many success stories from people and I think of those often. I know that it can feel like, oh this is just, I'm just broken. This is just a part of me that is never going to heal because I was, you know, raised in purity culture so I'm always going to feel this way. And the truth is you don't have to. I have worked with so many people who who have had.

[25:43] Incredible victories when it comes to battling shame or maybe even like enjoying their sexuality getting to do things that they never conceived of as possible and it takes.
It takes effort if you're thinking like well this is never gonna change for me.

[25:59] It's never going to change if you don't do something. You have to do something and that could be different for a lot of people.
Some people seek therapy, some people seek my resources, some people do a combo, which is always wonderful, or they find ways to heal.
They make their own roadmap to healing, but it is never too late.
Even if you're like, I feel like a late bloomer, I've never had a sexual experience or I'm too old to be dealing with this, or I just came out and I feel like I'm an older person coming out.
Like sexuality and sexual exploration doesn't just belong to young people.
It's not like a window closes when you're 25 and it's like, well, now you got to settle down and you should have gotten all that fun out of your way.
That is absolutely not true.
You can have new experiences, your sexuality, you can learn new things.
You can enjoy it until for your whole life.
You're a sexual being for your whole life. Yeah, right.
Yeah. There's absolutely no time limit, even if you feel like you are behind.
I promise you, you are in good company with other people and you need to get out there and make the change for yourself.
It just, you're in charge now. You can't change how you were raised and you can't change the experiences that you were given, but now you are in charge and what will you do with the rest of your time?

[27:25] Can make it happen. Yeah, mic drop. No, that's so good. Keeps going back to what I keep thinking of is like those tools like research your tools, understand the tools, learn how to use them. And it's not right or wrong, which can also be a thing that we think a lot in purity culture is right or wrong. Just Yes, the nuance that is something that I tell people all the time black and white thinking in regards to sexuality is rarely useful. There's so much gray, so much gray and to get comfortable in that gray is hard for people. Yeah, it is. It does feel uncomfortable, but at the end of the day, it's helpful. Awesome. Well, I know we're getting towards the end of our conversation and this is the part of the episode where I ask each of my guests to share a unique piece or reflection related to a word. And of course, Erica wrote this in advance, so I'm really excited to hear what her piece is on the word purity. So without further ado Erica over to you just kind of let us know what you're sharing with us and feel free to read it. Okay so I just you know off the top of my head this was kind of like a what's the word free writing it was a free writing I was just like, The word purity brings up such, so many, it's just one of the most loaded words.
So I just, I just let myself go.
Good. Okay.

[28:46] I have never seen the word purity applied to humans in a way that isn't harmful.
The most obvious example is sexual purity.
Deciding that people, most especially women, need to act or behave in a certain way that deems them worthy or unworthy is complete madness.
By very definition, there is no way to be pure according to the rules unless you intentionally repress and turn off natural parts of your human experience.
We do not ask people to do this for any other part of their humanity.
Our experience of sexuality is such a fundamental part of being human.
This doesn't mean we all experience it in the same way or experience the same aspects of it. The opposite is true.
There are just as many varied ways for a person to experience their sexuality as there are people on this planet. We all have different likes, dislikes, inclinations, desires, values, life situations, cultures, etc. that affect what we do and what we like, that affect how important sexuality even is to us. To try to make every human conform to one idea of what is acceptable is ridiculous and sets up 99% of people for failure.
Purity as a concept has no place being applied to humans or our behavior.
Purity is great when it comes to water or an inanimate object.

[30:11] Requiring purity of humans just sets us up to fail and feel inadequate and handily serves as a tool for policing people's behavior, groups, and individuals.
Wow. Yeah, that was a great free right. It's it nails everything right like yeah it's it's to control us. You can't. I have compared.
You could do a whole topic on this, but I have compared purity culture also to diet culture and like the cult of thinness. You're never going to be good enough. Never. And the energy you expend trying to achieve this standard, which maybe not even isn't your standard, is going to, sideline the other things of your life that you could be spending your energy on.
That is so true. It's amazing. Yeah. Like you said, we could go into, we could go for another hours to talk about that. But yeah, that's so true. Well, thank you so much, Erica. It's been a pleasure to talk about purity and your work as a sexual educator. And I, again, thank you for all your work that you put out there. Of course. Thank you, Chrissy. I'm so glad that you have a platform and that you get to, you know, give people the space to kind of engage with these topics. Thank you.

[31:25] Music.

[31:36] Today's book recommendation is Pure, Inside the Evangelical Movement That Shamed a Generation of Young Women and How I Broke Free by Linda K. Kline.
In the 1990s, a purity industry emerged out of white evangelical Christian culture. Purity Purity Pledges, and Purity Balls came with a dangerous message.
Girls are potential sexual stumbling blocks for boys and men, and any expression of a girl's sexuality could reflect on the corruption of her character.
This message traumatized many girls, resulting in anxiety, fear, and experiences that mimic the symptoms of post-traumatic stress disorder and trap them in a cycle of shame.

[32:15] This is the sex education Linda K. Klein grew up with. Fearing being marked by a Jezebel, Klein broke up with her high school boyfriend because she thought God told her to and took pregnancy tests despite being a virgin, terrified that any sexual activity would be punished with an out-of-wedlock pregnancy. When the youth pastor of her church was convicted of a sexual enticement of a 12-year-old girl, Klein began to question purity-based sexual ethics. She contacted young women she knew, asking if they were coping with the same shame-induced issues she was.
These intimate conversations developed into a 12-year-old quest that took her across the country and into the lives of women raised in similar religious communities, a journey that facilitated her own healing and led her to churches that are seeking a new way to reconcile sexuality and spirituality.
Before I wrap up the episode, I encourage you to grab a paper and pen, notebook or phone to write down your answer to these questions.
How has societal expectations or the idea of purity affected your mental health?
Can purity be achieved or is it an unattainable ideal?

[33:25] How do you handle situations that challenge your sense of purity?
Feel free to pause the episode and come back to these questions later.
If you have any thoughts on this episode, suggestions for a future episode, or if you, or someone you know wants to be a guest on the show, contact me via my website at www.chrissyholm.com.
That's C-H-R-I-S-S-Y-H-O-L-M.

[33:57] Thanks for listening to another episode of Stirred by Words, meditations and conversations about writing and wellness.
This has been your host, Chrissy Holm.
Tune in to future podcast episodes. And until next time, keep learning new words, Stay healthy and stay cured.

[34:12] Music.