Attract, Engage, Convert: Building a High-Performing OSC Program with Leah Fellows-164

Author and Blue Gypsy Inc. founder Leah Fellows joins Anya to unpack the playbook behind elite Online Sales Counselor (OSC) programs, and her new book, Attract, Engage, Convert. We cover what great OSCs actually do, how to hire the “unicorn,” and why top-down leadership buy-in is non-negotiable. Leah shares practical tactics for warmer websites, video-first outreach, ungated content, and human-centered nurturing—plus how to blend chat/AI tools without losing the personal touch.

You’ll learn:

-The must-have traits of a high-performing OSC (and the biggest hiring mistakes to avoid)

-How to structure training, processes, and metrics that move appointments → sales

-Website essentials for OSC success: strong CTAs, visible human presence, and smart use of video

-Why gating hurts conversion—and where to earn contact info instead

-Turning cold leads warm: segmented follow-ups, personalized video, and practical nurture tracks

-Smooth handoffs: chat/AI → OSC → onsite, with clear communication and accountability

-When (and how) to audit your existing OSC program for quick wins

Guest: Leah Fellows, Founder/CEO, Blue Gypsy Inc.; author of Attract, Engage, Convert.
Topics: online sales counselors, new home sales, home builder marketing, AI assistants vs. chatbots, lead nurturing, conversion optimization, customer experience.

If you’re a builder or marketer ready to level up your OSC program—and your conversions—this episode is your roadmap.

Transcript

Anya Chrisanthon 0:34

Hello and welcome everybody. Thank you so much for joining us for a new episode of Anewgo of new Home Sales. I'm your host, Anya Chrisanthon, and joining me today is a dear friend, founder, and CEO of Blue Gypsy Inc. And now a published author, of Attract, Engage, and Convert. Welcome to the show, Leah Fellows.

Leah Fellows 0:59

Hey, yes, attract, engage, convert. I finally did it. I finally wrote a book, A long overdue.

Anya Chrisanthon 1:08

Congratulations to you on that. What an accomplishment. It's really, really exciting. So for those listeners who may not know who you are, would you mind giving us a quick introduction of who you are and what is it that you do?

Leah Fellows 1:23

Sure. So, my name is Leah Fellows, like Anya said, and I've been in the building industry for nearly 20 years now, and most of that time has been spent in the online sales counselor world. I did, briefly begin onsite as an onsite sales assistant, and I did everything but write the contract when I did that. Then I kind of fell into the whole role of an online sales counselor back in 2007. And from there it just kind of became a passion to me. And so I worked the role for many years. I started out my company Blue Gypsy Inc. In 2010, where I started as a remote OSC, but quickly became a trainer. And so for over 10 years now, I've been. Working as a trainer in the new home building industry, training online sales counselors, growing programs, helping people hire, audit, improve. And so that's kind of where the, background for the book came from.

Anya Chrisanthon 2:22

Yes. So before we jump into your book, which is gonna be the topic of today's conversation. Mm-hmm. Tell us about those early days of OSC, because you were really boots on the ground before OSC was really a thing, as you like to say. Yes. So what drew you into the role and what were the early days really like?

Leah Fellows 2:42

Haha. Well, I like to call it back in the stone age. Before we had, you know, social media marketing when our websites were billboards on the internet. It was before we really had the lead magnets we do today. The way I got into it was actually by accident. Of all things in general. I, was working because, well, let's backtrack a little bit because some people don't know that. Before the building industry, I was a sailboat captain and a dive instructor and backpacking around the world for 13 years, right? And so I injured my shoulder, I moved to shore to have a shoulder surgery, and I had a neighbor who was working in new home construction as an onsite sales agent in 2006, and she needed an assistant. So that's how I accidentally got into the building industry. I never thought I'd stay here. I thought this was a temporary thing while I healed. But then, I met my husband, so I decided maybe I don't wanna go out on a sailboat again. I, I was originally gonna do that, so I, like I said, I started as an onsite and then I got my real estate license thinking I was gonna be an onsite sales agent. I was interviewing for a job, with a builder, and the phone was ringing off the hook. They said, we just lost our online sales counselor again, 2007. I had no idea what that was, but I didn't know that. Neither did they, right? They, they were new to it. They had someone and it didn't really work out. And so when they explained to me what they thought an OSC was, I said, well, why don't you put me in that role temporarily? While you look for someone who really knows what they're doing, and I can learn your company before you're ready to put me out on site. Well, for anyone that's been in the industry for a while, they know what started happening. In 2000 7, 8, 9, things started to change and I started realizing early on. They didn't know what this role could be. So I started creating, tracking around it. I started looking at how many appointments I was setting, and when I started showing my work, which the previous person did not, they're like, we don't want you to leave this position. We want you to stay. So for three years, I, I navigated that role, built it up from scratch, and at a time when OS. Cs did 20, maybe 25% of overall sales because again, we didn't have this digital, ecosystem we work in now. I was doing 32% or more of overall sales, so that was really kind of impressive back then. In this day and age we're like, ah, 32, you know, but. Back then, that was a big deal. And so when I started working in training pre COVID, I OSCs I was training, were doing 35, 40 5% of overall sales before COVID hit. So using the techniques. So, so that's kind of how I got started. That's how the beginning of, of this journey into the world of online sales and really kind of pioneering it, figuring out all the ins and outs of it, and really watching it grow and change. Over 19 years, it's, it's grown and changed and I've had to change with it. I've had to change some of my preconceived notions and, have really helped craft it into something that helps builders move the needle forward with their customer experience and their sales. So,

Anya Chrisanthon 6:05

so what I'm hearing you say is really that in the early days of OSC role, it was more almost like an administrative role, right? Like you are almost like a receptionist in a way, versus now it's really somebody who is driving a lot of sales for new home builders.

Leah Fellows 6:24

Well, you know, I don't think it was ever a receptionist. I think builders thought it was, I don't think builders knew what it was. I don't think we were ever a receptionist in that sense. And, but it was funny because they did think, well, anybody answering the phone could do what I did. But that wasn't true because you had to have certain qualities in certain, certain ideas and, and ways of doing things. And even before the building industry, I was in other. Sales roles. Mm-hmm. Um, whether it was selling, training, selling, scuba diving, selling drinks. I was a bartender for a long time. You learned how to upsell for anybody who's worked in the restaurant industry, you know, you learn how to upsell and you learn how to sell. But I even sold fine art. In a, in an art gallery where I had to go through Zig Ziglar's training and reading and stuff like that. So there were already a lot of sales skills that were involved even in the early days, but I don't think people really understood it and what it could do. So, yeah.

Anya Chrisanthon 7:27

So oftentimes when you talk about the sales skills of an OSC, I hear you refer to this person as a unicorn. Yeah. So can you tell us what makes somebody truly great in this role, and what are some of the biggest hiring mistakes that builders make today

Leah Fellows 7:44

Well, I, I think that's a great one.'cause I help builders hire OSCs all the time. And for those that don't utilize someone who knows what they're looking for, sometimes you get the wrong but in the wrong seat. We say that and the, we call OSCs unicorns because they're not, like you said, they're not administrative. People though they need to have a very organized brain, right? They're not techies though. They need to understand technology in order to use all the tools that are there. They're not salespeople'cause they're not closing the sale, they're closing the appointment. And so they're not therapists either, but they need to have that empathy to identify with people on why they want what they want, and what are their pain points. So that's one of the reasons why we call it a unicorn. Role because you have to have a little bit of everything and really know how to bring empathy and technology together in order to run it. And you have to do it all blind, right? Onsite people get to see body language. Most of the interactions that OSCs have are over the phone. Reading emails, that sort of thing. So that's why we say the people in this role are unicorns. And the biggest hiring mistakes I see is when builders try to hire someone because they're salespeople, or hire someone because they're an admin, but they don't look at all the life experience and all their abilities to do these things and understand everything that needs to go into the role. Also a big hiring mistake since you asked is when people see the OSC as a bench for their onsite, because they're constantly having to refill it, and there's a huge ramp up period in learning this role because it's not for one community, it's for all your communities. Everything you sell, and that's a lot of knowledge and information and you can't learn it overnight. You can't learn it in 30 days. You can't learn it in three months. And so once someone gets into the role and gets seasoned in it, you don't wanna move them out and move somebody new in.

Anya Chrisanthon 9:50

Right. That makes sense. So Leah, what prompted you to come out with this book now? Like why now?

Leah Fellows 9:56

Why now? Because it's so long overdue. I've started writing books over the years on everything from travel to the building industry, and especially in the last, you know. 10, 15 years on the building industry and I've never completed it. And the thing that lit a fire under my butt for this one was actually, for the last three years, I've been able to teach a training track at the Home Builder Digital Marketing Summit. And every year that I go and we're looking at what are we putting in the swag bags, I always think. I wanna give people something that they're not just gonna throw away. Right. And I, and I always try to be creative with my swag and whatever reason. This year I said, I'm gonna write a book. Well, I didn't know all the things behind getting a book written and published, but I did get the whole book written. And edited, and we released the first three chapters in a, sort of a sneak peek at the Home Builder Digital Marketing Summit this year. So it was, it came from me saying I need to get something in the swag bag, but it's something that I have rolled around and worked on. I jokingly say I wrote it in 10 days. Because I did when I finally sat down and focused on it, but it was from writings I had written for many, many years. I pulled together blogs and pieces of content that I give to my customers all of the time, and I organized it into a book that just made sense for the building industry because nothing like this has been written in over a decade for this little tiny niche of online sales. So, yeah.

Anya Chrisanthon 11:35

Well, congratulations again. So in your book, when you talk about hiring,, you really talk about this top down, buy-in from leadership, that you say is non-negotiable. It's a first step in order to have a successful OSC program. So elaborate a little bit more on that. Why is that non-negotiable?

Leah Fellows 11:58

Well, and I've, I've been saying this for years, is like, if the people at the very top of the company at the leadership rung does not understand why this role is so important and what it can do to drive their sales, then the program is hobbled from the beginning. It's change, right? And believe it or not, a lot of people that may be listening to this already have online sales counselors. They say, well, we already have a program. But there are still builders out there that don't have the program. And even those that do, the leadership doesn't understand what these unicorns are doing behind the scenes. So they can't support the role. And then you get friction points because a lot of times we end up working in silos of marketing, online sales and sales. And if leadership isn't helping to be able to create that connection, an OSC is not in a position where they can tell the onsite sales agents, you must do this. But the leadership has to understand it. So they can tell onsite sales, this is how it's gonna go. Because when we all work together, rowing in the same direction, we're going to get more sales, we're going to collaborate together, and we're gonna make, make it better for the customer, for the company, for everybody involved. So that's why I say top down leadership understanding is really important and you can't force change from the bottom up. You have to force it from the top down.

Anya Chrisanthon 13:21

Okay. And even if a builder has an OSC program, it doesn't stop there. So can you talk about what is bad training or lack of training cost to a builder in real dollars or a reputation?

Leah Fellows 13:38

Well, it's, it's really interesting because, a lot of times builders are trying to figure out okay, well how many more sales is this, program really gonna make me, wouldn't we have made those sales anyway? And it's really hard to distill that out and to figure out, okay, what would you and wouldn't you have made, like, I do know that from past experience we've seen with programs that didn't exist where there was no OSC. Of the digital leads that were generated, only 10, 20% or more of those could be tracked if they were even tracked.'cause half, most of the time they're not even being tracked, but only 10 to 20% of those digital leads were maybe turning into sales without online sales counselors. And then when we add the OSCs or, or let's say 10 to 20% represented. Sales for the builder. I don't wanna say the lead percentage converted, but the, but actually that they represent a 10 to 20% of the overall sales for the builder. When you put a well-trained, well thought out online sales program and the right person in place, you can see 40, 50, 60% or more of your sales come from that online sales department. So that's really powerful and when you're spending so much money on marketing dollars. You need to have the right person receiving those leads. When you have, say, 20 onsite sales agents and those leads are going out to those 20 people, they're all being handled in a very different way, and none of them have been trained on how to handle those digital leads. Some people love'em, some people hate'em, and so they're not converting. They might, and we do a survey every year. Where we look at 50 builders across the country and how leads are being handled, and we look at a 30 day period from the time a lead comes in to what is done with them and time and again, we see builders that don't have online sales programs drop the ball. And that lead gets dropped into a database and never goes anywhere. Right now with the way the economy is and how little leads we're getting, we can't afford to do that. You have to have a strong program. Yeah,

Anya Chrisanthon 15:51

absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. So let's talk a little bit about engaging your prospects. So in your book, you say that your website is. The OSCs digital model home, or just really a digital model home, which we know is the case, right? That's where most people start their search. But what are some of the must haves for an OSC friendly site? Because for them, that's really one of the most important resources that a builder has.

Leah Fellows 16:20

Yeah. You know, it's funny, I, feel like a lot of times builders have OSCs, but there's no sign of them on the website, so people don't know that there's actually a real human there to help them and Okay. And I know we know each other well, Anya, we know not everybody wants to talk to a person. Right. Some people just wanna talk to chat. They want, they want answers. They don't wanna be bothered by human beings. But there are the people who hit a certain point in their journey. They hit a certain point in their research where it's time to talk. And if they can't see that there's a person there to help them. It, becomes very sterile. It's, very transactional and transaction is great on Amazon where I just wanna buy a widget, but it's not great when I wanna spend a half a million, a million dollars on a home, and now I need some answers and I gotta get somebody's take on what's actually going on. So while we continue to improve the quality of our websites compared to those billboards on the internet that I, you know, experienced when I first started. What we need is we need the warmth and the presence, just like. I, don't think that model homes function as well when there's not a person there to greet them. That's still my opinion. I'm sure there's a lot of people that could debate, debate me on that one as well. But I think that it's that greeter, it's that person, that presence that's there to help you. You can do this through having great calls to action on your website, having videos. Having the OSCs photograph there, their phone number, ask questions, boxes, demos, things like that. There's all sorts of ways to warm up your website with an OSC presence, that shows that you're there. And what's funny is early on I used to see far more OSC videos on websites than I do now. It's like we've somehow gone backwards and I don't know why.

Anya Chrisanthon 18:14

Yeah. So speaking of videos, can you tell us how does video help OSCs really turn those clicks into conversations and build trust faster?

Leah Fellows 18:23

So. Think of how much scrolling you do on TikTok. People engage and they wanna watch. They wanna zone out to video. So you've gotta have video there for people that is gonna be strong content for their website. Your OSC is a great. Sort of face of your website that can present that. When you're hiring for this role, you need to hire someone who's not afraid of being on camera, right? It doesn't mean you have to hire models and really pretty people because people like people who are just normal, everyday people. But using video content on your website, using video, emailing in your processes, really engaging and moving forward. We know that video emails have a higher open rate and watch rate than a regular email. So when you're positioning things properly and you're setting up a process and not just a willy-nilly, Hey, let's do this, you're gonna get a lot more engagement, and that means conversation, which leads to conversion.

Anya Chrisanthon 19:27

Yes. Now, Leah, you're also a big advocate for removing gated content on your website. Oh, yeah. So can you talk a little bit about that? Why does that approach actually hurt More than It helps

Leah Fellows 19:41

because look, in, in this day and age, people want information and they wanna quickly, when we put up a gate and we ask them for their information, they stop short. How many things have you filled out, Anya? On the internet and you weren't ready to give your information yet, or you wanted to go check something out and it immediately wants your info, do you stay or do you run away?

Anya Chrisanthon 20:03

Runaway.

Leah Fellows 20:06

See, and and why do we think that the people who want to check out certain aspects of our website wanna give us that information? You need to make the calls to action something that they want to give you, not something they're. Required to give you in order to see information. Information is everywhere, and we have plenty of competitors that will provide information, whether it's pricing, floor plans, all of that. Back when I was in OSC, every one of our floor plans was gated, so you had to enter your information and it created a lot of spam leads. Then you have your online sales counselors working a lot of spam instead of actual real buyers, so that's why it's so important too. It's okay to have some things that are downloaded, like if someone is creating a wishlist or saving floor plans and you're creating areas where they can save interactive floor plans and things that they've spent hours on, which, you know, with what you do, that's where you can gather their information because you've earned it.

Anya Chrisanthon 21:10

Yep, exactly. That's the strategy that we advocate here as well. Make it easy for people to find information, especially if you have interactive content. Sometimes. One of the mistakes I see for builders is you can't even find it. It's buried beanie. So many different menus make it accessible, make it easy for people to find it, play with it, and then they will be more than happy to save their favorites, give you their information, because again, they don't wanna start from square one, right? They wanna go back and pick up where they left off. So allow them to do that.

Leah Fellows 21:41

That's the best way to collect people's information. Not, Hey, give us your info. It's even the same like on live chat or if you're using a chat bot or if you're using AI chat, whatever it is. If you're asking for information upfront before you start providing them information, you're stopping people before they start, before they know whether or not they like you enough to engage with you. You know?

Anya Chrisanthon 22:05

So speaking of chatbots mm-hmm. You certainly emphasized that conversion is human and not automated. So how can builders blend that technology like AI chatbots now, that are so popular without losing the personal touch?

Leah Fellows 22:26

That's important, and especially in what we do. For the longest time, for nearly 20 years, we've said that about one to 3% of the unique visitors to our website will convert into an inquiry. Right. That's about 97 to 99%. And I see it even more.'cause sometimes I see builders not converting the unique visitors. We're not talking about all the visits or sessions people are doing. But the unique monthly visitors convert. So you've gotta have. Other ways for people to engage, because like we've said, not everybody I know, Anya, you're one of those people that if you can avoid talking to anyone, you will. And we have to honor that, that there's people out there that will do that. So when you have chat or chat bots, or AI assistants or things like that on the website to help nurture along those people that don't wanna communicate, right? Then you're opening up your pool of unique visitors. That are coming to the website that will engage with your website, and then we're gonna create more engagement as the OSC role grows. They need to be the people that understand all that engagement that's happening. Right. You still can't just. Set it up on your website, put up these chat bots and go, okay, we don't need humans to look at this because somebody has to monitor that engagement. Figure out when is it appropriate to step in. When do you offer within that engagement a real person on the line? Because if there's frustrations, I mean a lot of the if then chats. Are easy to break, right? And I know AI is becoming more intuitive and more generative and all of that, but at some point in time, people still need a human to talk to. And I hope we, keep that human content because human connection is so important. And I feel like in society today, and this is a broader thing, we're getting further and further away from each other. And so we need that person that can oversee that so there is a place and space for the chats and that sort of thing to help engage more people that wouldn't naturally reach out and speak to an OSC.

Anya Chrisanthon 24:36

Hmm, a hundred percent agree with you. Here at Anewgo we are working on our own version of AI Assistant, but again, we are not, planning for it to replace OSCs there is certainly place for OSC. So can you talk a little bit about, that transition from chat to OSC, like how can we make that a smooth transition and not clunky, awkward transition?

Leah Fellows 25:03

It's always a work in process, especially with the new stuff. Like how do we transition from chat or AI to human, the OSC to agent, to onsite agent handoff has been, taught for decades now, believe it or not, and even then it still has, its. Problems. And part of it is all about, communication. What are the communication tools we use? How do we communicate with each other? How do we open up dialogue and, collaborate with the other people? No matter what you're doing, there has to be collaboration and communication through your tools, through your knowledge. I mean, that's one of the reasons I'm a big advocate of OSCs being part of a builder's company. Mm-hmm. Because there nothing replaces you as an OSC, getting up outta your chair. Going over to that community, sitting down with that onsite agent and listening to what they're experiencing right now in the market. Really being able to do that. If somebody is all the way across the country, if they're not really a part of your company culture, if they don't know the day to day, there's not as much understanding of what everyone is going through. So, you've gotta open up lines of collaboration, communication for all those transitions from, chat to online sales counselor, online sales counselor, to onsite the chat to online sales counselor is gonna have to be a really good understanding of technology and a really good understanding of. Just like with OSCs, how much information is too much for an OSC to provide? When is it time to transition them to onsite is the same for chat. We're gonna have to decide how much can chat and AI bots handle, and when is it appropriate to transition it to a human so we don't lose them? Right.

Anya Chrisanthon 26:48

Absolutely. So Leah, you mentioned that, things are slowing down right now, and we certainly hear that from builders across the country. It's not an easy market right now, so maybe you don't have a ton of new leads coming in, but how can OSCs revive cold leads effectively without feeling like spammy or desperate?

Leah Fellows 27:12

Oh, that's a great one. I think you go back to video, right? And, really starting a video conversation. Hey, I know it's been a while since you've, reached out and I wanna know where you are. If you're still thinking of a home with, you know, X, Y, Z builder, because I'm here, I wanna remind you, I'm an actual human here to help you, and that sort of thing. And if you make it conversational, you customize it. You also can't e-blast that to your entire data base, right? You've gotta partition your database and understand who's interested in what and why and where they were. Some of that comes from the earlier on note taking, you did. And, how you can parse out each of your lead sets. But like right now, even, I'm telling OSCs, you've gotta go through the list of appointments you've already sat in the last one month, three months, six months, because those are the people that already came out and visited your community. Where are they in process? So you've gotta collaborate with your agents and figure out where they are in process. You've gotta get those folks in the way that you talk to someone who is rated an A. Back in July and they still have an A rating from July and you're like, wait, it's been more than 30 days. Why haven't they bought? Then someone who maybe was rated a C is different. And so you have to customize your conversations based on the people, even if it's a group of people. So that you're not doing one off every time, you've gotta have a general idea of what's driving different groups of people and what they're interested in so that you can still make that message sound customized.

Anya Chrisanthon 28:49

Yes, absolutely. People expect personalization these days, right? And if it's automated, marketing messages, people just tend to delete those. I know personally, I certainly do. Mm-hmm. So in your book you teach that nurturing is the conversion secret sauce. Mm-hmm. So can you talk about what does effective nurturing actually looks like in practice?

Leah Fellows 29:13

In the past, I haven't given templates to, builders that I work with because I'm afraid when I give you a canned template, that's all you're going to use. And, recently I have started creating some general follow up processes that I give to builders. You know, the general follow up process I've always worked on with the OSC. And then I started to find that some of the OSCs would take'em off the general when it no longer applied. But they weren't putting something behind it. I've always said, you still need customized follow up after that. There always has to be a next step, but whether or not they were doing it. Was not really, apparent with some of them. So I created some different customized nurture plans that they could then customize further, whether it's a 30 day ghosting, you know, you'd be getting ghosted for 30 days, a seven day hot lead, somebody that you talk to, but you couldn't get them to an appoint. So what are the next steps and how do you nurture it? So you've gotta have different plans in mind that you can attach to people when they no longer fit the one that they were on. Some of that can be automated, the evergreen content in it, but some of it has to be personalized based on what they're doing. Now, we don't want anybody managing a database of 20,000 people manually on a daily basis. That's overwhelming. But there have to be some manual actions in there that make you look into their, their record and see what they're doing, so, mm-hmm.

Anya Chrisanthon 30:44

Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Great advice there. So, Leah, for home builders who may still not have an OSC program today, what's the single best place to start?

Leah Fellows 30:57

I mean, I'm not trying to be cocky or anything, but just like talk to me because I give free advice. If I got paid for all the free advice that I ever gave compared to like what I actually get paid for, I'd be really rich monetarily. I'm really rich spiritually because I do give my time all the time, right? I give my time away for free all the time because I'm more than happy to talk people through. And I try not to sugarcoat stuff. If I think you're doing something wrong, I'll tell you because I don't want you to keep making the same mistakes, life is too short, right? I, I think it's better to have someone you can trust that'll tell you, like it is then someone who's just trying to tell you what you wanna hear to get your business. So, I'm a good place to start,

Anya Chrisanthon 31:44

you know? Definitely guys, if you don't have an OSC program, if you're looking for somebody in-house, Leah can take care of that for you. She'll find the perfect person, she'll interview them, she'll train them. So it makes it really, really easy. Now, I know the answer to this question already, and we've talked about it throughout, our conversation today, but you do end the book with conversion. Is human. So what does that mean to you personally after training hundreds of OSCs?

Leah Fellows 32:16

We've hit on it that, humanity is important. If I could say that, treating everybody like an entire human being and not just what they want, we're here to solve problems and we're here to understand. Why people want what they want and why people are motivated to buy a new home. And how can we help connect them. It's almost like being a matchmaker, but a matchmaker of families to homes instead of, you know, husband and wife or partner to partner, whatever it would be. And, and I just think that, at the end of the day, we have to approach this with our humanity and how we're gonna help. I don't know. I just, I'm, I'm a person that believes in service to the community. So I feel like you can't have service without humanity, so.

Anya Chrisanthon 33:06

Well, that's great advice. Leah, if somebody wants to pick up a copy of your book, where can people find it? So tell us also where can people learn more about your company and connect with you personally?

Leah Fellows 33:19

Sure. Well, my company is Blue Gypsy Inc. So the website is. Blue Gypsy inc.com. And that's INC, not INK, like the tattoo parlor, right? So it's blue gypsy ink.com. I have links out to about the book out to Amazon. You can find it on Amazon. It's called Attract, engage, convert. So you can find it there. And you can find me on. My website, you can find me on LinkedIn. I do have a Facebook business page, too, but I think most people find me through LinkedIn and that sort of thing. So,

Anya Chrisanthon 33:51

and I'll be sure to link all of that in show notes to make it easy for you guys to connect with Leah and get her. New book, Leah, before I let you go, was there anything that I didn't ask you today or you think is important for our listeners to understand about any of the topics we discussed today or anything else?

Leah Fellows 34:13

Well, I think it's important for you to understand that, it's easy to say I need an online sales program, but it's not as easy to make sure you set it up for success. Right, and when you set up a program or you're running a program that's not optimal, you're doing a disservice to your company, your clients, and you're, you know, you could, you could be causing more damage than good. So it's important from time to time to audit a program. So not only do I help builders set up new programs, but we audit existing programs to figure out where there's opportunities for improvement. Mm-hmm. You can't just set it and forget it. If you've had a program running for years and years and years and you're not checking on what's going on, there could be a lot of things going on behind the scenes that you don't realize For sure. So I think, that's really important as well.

Anya Chrisanthon 35:07

Great advice. So you guys definitely check out Leah's new book and connect with her if you don't have a program in place or you have an existing program, but you're looking to improve that and take it to the next level. Dear Leah, thank you so much for being here today with me. It's always so enlightening talking with you, and it's always my pleasure and I look forward to seeing you. In Denver in a couple of weeks for the NHB fall leadership meetings.

Leah Fellows 35:34

That's right. That's right. I'll see you in Denver. So, all

Anya Chrisanthon 35:37

right. I will talk to you very soon. Thank you so much for being here.

Leah Fellows 35:40

Okay. See you. Thank you so much for having me, Anya. I so appreciate it.