Revenue Getter: Why Sales Leaders Are Getting Coaching Wrong and How to Fix It with Ryan Taft-180

In this episode of Anewgo of New Home Sales, host Anya Chrisanthon sits down with returning guest Ryan Taft, founder of Impact Eighty-Eight, to celebrate the launch of his brand new book, Revenue Getter. Ryan has spent 25 years in the home building industry, and this book is his answer to one of the most overlooked problems in sales leadership: nobody actually teaches managers how to develop people.

If you've ever wondered why your team isn't improving even after training, this episode is your wake-up call.

Ryan breaks down:

• The 6 manager types killing your team's performance (are you the buddy, server, savior, slave driver, or ghost?)
• The two biggest mistakes sales leaders make when they're behind on numbers
• His repeatable 4-E Coaching Method: Explain, Exhibit, Execute & Evaluate
• Why pipeline calls are NOT coaching and what real coaching actually looks like
• The micro-skill approach that moves the sales needle faster than any contest ever will

Whether you're a sales leader or anyone responsible for developing a team, Revenue Getter will completely change the way you think about management.

📖 Grab your copy of Revenue Getter Learn more at revenueGetter.com | impacteightyeight.com 

🎟️ Want to go deeper in person? Ryan and the Impact 88 team are hosting CoLab Live - a two-day, hands-on leadership workshop for homebuilding leaders, and Anewgo is a proud sponsor! No stages, no sales pitches - just real frameworks, real conversations, and real results. Seats are limited to 80 leaders per event. 📅 Charlotte, NC | April 22–23, 2026 📅 San Antonio, TX | Sept. 15–16, 2026 👉 Get your tickets now: colablive.com

Transcript

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Hello and welcome everybody. Thank you so much for joining me for another episode of Anewgo of new home sales podcast. I'm your host, Anya Chrisanthon, and joining me today is returning guest. Many of you probably already know him. Ryan Taft, who is the founder of Impact 88. Today we are celebrating and discussing Ryan's brand new book, Revenue Getter. So Ryan, first of all, congratulations on a brand new book. When do you have the time? I see you all over social media. You're always on the go. You're doing the thing. When do you have the time to write a book? You know, that has been asked of me so many times and the answer to it is I wrote this entire book. On an airplane or in a hotel, and that is literally the only time that I have to do I'm, I am actually most productive in those two environments.'cause what else are you gonna do? Watch a movie. Try not. That's right. Unless you're sitting on the airplane watching a movie and crying, there's no excuse. Right. Then the alternative is to work on my presentation. So, yeah. Or for you obviously writing a book, so, no. Yeah, no, I, I can't think, I don't think I've, I, I can't remember a time where I've cried on an airplane. I can't, well, that's not true. I think maybe over delays, that's possible. But thank you for having me back. I always love our chats. Thank you for being back. I feel the same way. So Ryan, for those listeners who may not know who you are, if they've been living under the rock. Tell us a little bit of your background. What is it that you do at Impact 88? And of course, tell us a little bit about your brand new book. Oh my gosh, there's a lot there. So I, founded Impact 88 last year. We had a fantastic first year. We are a performance improvement company, so we work with salespeople, sales leaders, helping them level up. Some of our mantras in training are, don't be a weirdo. It's not about you. And, if you can help improve someone else's life, that's the highest calling. So, there you go. As far as background, I've been in the home building industry. This is my 25th year in home building. I cannot believe how that happened. Just boom, gone. And as far as the book goes, I'm trying to answer all your questions in the order as far as the book goes. I think there's a huge need in the world of sales leadership, not just in home building, but in sales leadership in general. Because most people, when they get hired into sales leadership, it usually goes something like this, Hey, you were pretty good at sales. Why don't you come on board in leadership and get other people to do the same thing? Eh, I mean, maybe they don't talk like that, but that's the idea. There's no onboarding that teaches someone how to coach and skill develop. And train people. So what you have is you have a bunch of managers who are managing processes, they're managing numbers, and they're directing people that you need to get more sales. We need you to do this thing. We need to do better at that. And no one's actually developing any, anyone, not because they don't want to. I think the intention is people want to do that. Mm-hmm. But they don't know how to,'cause you don't get put into a class called. Learn how to develop people 1 0 1. Yes. So the book is the answer to that, and our certification program that goes along with it is the other answer to that. I love that. So in the book, you say, what happens when a team is feeling like they're behind? Right? What's the common, most wrong move that sales leaders actually make at that moment? And why does it actually reduce revenue instead of helping the team get ahead? Okay, so there's two answers to this, right? There's two, paths that people tend to take when, oh my gosh, we're behind and it's cracked, that we gotta get sales. The wrong answer is right. We come down hard and we start managing with an iron fist and we, really push, and my experience is when you push somebody, they tend to push back. Yes. Right. So that's one. And then the other way that we see it happen is we go, okay, we need sales. All right, everyone, let's do a sales contest. We're gonna give out money and spin the wheel. Right? And we do this big old thing, and that works for a certain percentage of people. But, there's a certain percentage of people on the team who don't care about sales contests. I know that sounds crazy, but they don't, they're just like, that's not my motivator. That's not, it's like if you read the Five Love Languages book. Right. Talks about how everyone gives and receives love differently. Well, everyone is motivated differently. Yeah. So to me, a sales contest where you're just giving away cash is sort of the shortcut to motivation that doesn't really touch everybody. It touches a couple, but those are the two responses. But nowhere in there is there developing anyone to actually do the job better. Yes. Pair it and stick is what it is. Absolutely. Now, in your book, you outlined six manager styles, so give us a quick kind of like symptoms. How do you know if you're being the buddy, the server, savior, slave, driver, or ghost, instead of being a true coach? Now. Okay. You've done your homework. Good job. So looking at the first one, the buddy,, I just saw this the other day actually. The buddy is where you want to hang out. You still want to be friends or you wanna like, Hey, let's get together after work. Let's go hit the club, the bar, let's go golf. And they want to be friends. And there's nothing wrong with that. But the mentality behind the buddy is somebody who thinks, if I am friends with you, you will perform because we are friends. Mm-hmm. And I will tell you, that will backfire on you. And it's not developing anyone. There's no development. It's a hope strategy. Mm-hmm. The server is like a cousin of the buddy. The server's always like, I'm gonna bring you coffee and I'm gonna bring you breakfast and I'm gonna bring you things. And they're leaning on something called the Law of Reciprocity that says, if I give you something, you're gonna give me something back. And hopefully it's sales. There's no development in that either. The savior is probably the most common, especially in home building, right? I come into your office and I ask you this question as your manager. How can I help? Right? And your salesperson goes, oh, thank God you're here. I have the Hernandez family on lot 42 and they've got all these issues and it's so good you're here. Could you? And you're like, I'm here to save the day. And the next thing you knew, you are doing their job and you're not developing anyone, you're just putting out fires. Which actually ends up being where people burn out in our industry, is that scenario. Hmm. It feels good. You think you're doing the right thing, but you're not, you're training them to have you solve their problems. The slave driver, I don't see as much in the companies that we work with, but I know they still exist. And that is the, I'm gonna just, basically, I want your numbers and your report and Saturday night and you need to tell me what's going on. And it's, I say, jump. You say how high? I used to work with a guy like this who he'd answer his phone, he'd see who it was. He'd be like, this better be good. Like, it's just someone who's I say you do. And there's, it's, they can never be wrong. And I've worked for a few of those. The ghost is pretty obvious. They're never in the field. Yep. You never see'em. You just ask a salesperson, when was the last time you saw your manager? I'm like, I haven't seen him in like six months. I had a division president, you'll like this Anya. I had a division president here in Phoenix ask me one time, what do you think of my sales leaders? And I said, do you want me to be honest or or nice? She said, be honest. I said, how much do you pay your admin people? And she told me, I said, you should get rid of your managers and hire a couple of admin people. You'll save yourself a couple hundred grand. She said, why? I said, because that's what they're doing. They're not in the field. They're just doing reports. I don't even need a human to do that anymore. I can use a AI tool for that. As, you know, I'm talking to you, you know, all this. But a coach on the other hand is someone who's in the field and they're developing, and the three favorite words of a coach are, do it again. That's the differentiator. Are you saying those words? And if you're not, you're probably one of the other five. So if somebody's listening right now and they're like, uh oh, I think I'm one of those five. Yeah. Yeah. That's What's the first shift that you would want them to practice this week to really change that? Well, the first thing they need to do is pre-order the book. Right? That's the first thing. But anyway, that's another thing. But as far as practice goes is I would be looking at. What is the micro skill that I could get someone to improve on even just 10%? Because if I can improve one little micro skill, 10%, you will see the needle of sales start to move in the right direction. So if you're listening and you're like, oh my gosh, I'm not coaching, first off, who on your team could you get to just improve a little bit? 10%. You're already better than most coaches out there. Right. Most people aren't even getting 0%. They're just not even in, they're not coaching. So that'd be the first thing I'd look at. There's a lot to unpack with that though, which is, well, are you in the field? How do you know what micro skills to even coach? What does that look like? So I look at people's calendars. Mm-hmm. Do they have time blocked off in their calendars for coaching? Most don't. If I look at someone's 30 day snapshot of their calendar, and they're a manager. Here's what I tend to see. Purchasing, meeting, marketing, meeting starts, meeting closings, meeting new communities, meeting. That's what I see. And in there I'm like, all right, show me where you're actively coaching people. Right? And the answer is, oh, that's not on my calendar. So this is the whole point, Anya, and this is why I wrote the book. I have forever believed that management is not the direction of people. It's the development of people. It falls under the sort of the concept, that circles in churches that says if you build the people build the church, right? The same thing is true with a sales team. If you build the skills of your sales team, they will build your revenue ladder. So revenue getter really is coaching. And so in your book, you lay out this repeatable four step coaching approach. Yeah. Which, is explain exhibit, execute and out. Evaluate. Evaluate. Mm-hmm. Thank you. You're welcome. I guess you did write the book, you know your stuff. So can you walk us through what this great looks like for each one of those steps? Like, what are we Yeah. Well. So let me give you the idea of where this came from. This isn't new as far as concept goes of how we learn. If you go back to, the cone of learning, Edgar Dale, right in the, I think it was 1969, he developed this idea that says we, will retain. Learnings based off of our level of participation, right? If you only hear it, it's like 10%. If you see it and hear it, it's 20%. If you write it down, it increases and it goes all the way up to active participation. Takes you up to 90% retention. Right? And we know this instinctively'cause if you've ever had someone try to show you how to. Create a formula and a spreadsheet, you're like, well, let me get on the computer and do it, because you know, you learn better that way. Right. So the, for the framework, what we call the four e coaching method, is designed to hit the three core learning modalities, auditory, visual, and kinesthetic. And it's all goes back to the cone of learning, from Dale, which is in the book. But the repeatable framework is this, is that I'm gonna use E one, which is, I'm gonna explain, so I'm gonna explain the micro skill issue that we're gonna work on. Mm-hmm. Now I don't just say, Hey, you sucked at this.'cause that's, that's right. That's no bueno. What I am gonna do is I'm gonna tell you what I saw happen. Why it matters and what I'd like to see differently. So I'm telling you, and this is unfortunately Anya, where most people think training and coaching starts and stops, right? They get in front of a sales team, they've got a new addendum they gotta introduce, you've been in these, okay, everyone, we're gonna need everyone to start inserting this addendum into the contract. We need a initial in the middle page, and then a signature on the bottom. Is everyone good? And raise your hand. You got it? And then how many of'em come in? Correct. The next Monday, zero. Why? Because they only told them. They only explained. So there's three other pieces to learning. So that's E one, E two. When we move over to exhibit hits, the visual aspect. So in this one I'm gonna show you. The micro skill that I saw, and then I'm going to show you the micro skill I'd like to see. Mm-hmm. So for example, if, let's say when someone's asking for the sale, I notice that they, they lift their shoulder when they, when they ask. So is this, do you guys wanna take it off the market? And they do this thing, I'll, I'll explain to them what I saw with the shoulder, why it matters, and what I'd like to see differently. And then I will step into their shoes and I'll say, here's what it looked like. Here's what I'd like it to look like. Are you ready to take the home off the market? Did you see the Schultz? Right? So there's that visual. Mm-hmm. This is a question that usually comes up is where does most coaching fail if they even get this far? This next piece is where the majority of sales coaches and managers fall apart, like a$2 suitcase. It's an E three, which is where I want them to execute. Mm-hmm. Now it's you do it, you try it. Here's the challenge. Salespeople don't wanna role play. They don't wanna practice, and what they will do is they will distract a manager. Well, you know, I already do that. You know, I, you know, if you, you just saw me, I was having an off day and, you know, but I do this, I do this all the time. And you know what, they don't do it all the, there's no way they do it all the time. It's just, I don't wanna be put on the spot. And this is where the buddy and the server and the ghost and those, they will never get to this because. They don't understand accountability and most of revenue getter is not just how to coach, it's how to hold people accountable to be better than they were before you coached them. Does that make sense? Absolutely. Accountability is huge and so. I mean, one of the challenges with accountability and coaching is that we are so busy as sales managers, there's so many different fires you have to put out. So, so many different reports. So if I'm a sales manager, I'm like, all right, I only have 15 minutes to spend with this individual. How would you run your training so that you do hit all four of those? Yeah, it, well, first off, you have to know'em, right? You have to know what you're doing. So a lot of coaching has planning that comes before that moment. So we talk about gathering intel so you know the micro skills that you'll be coaching. One of the biggest mistakes is we try and jam 20 pounds of coaching into a one pound bag. We tell'em way too many things to fix. I just wanna work on the shoulder lift. That's it. So micro skill, and you've gotta get the four e coaching method down to where you already know where you're going. You're not like, what's, what's my next step? What do I do? What's, what's E three? Anybody? E three, you can't do that. You literally have to be able to go, okay, here's what I saw. Here's why it matters. Here's what I need you to do. Let me show you what I saw you do. Let me show you what I want it to look like. Got it. Fabulous. Let me have you do it. Perfect. Then E four, evaluate. I'm gonna tell'em what went right. Ask'em for their insights and say, what do you do next time? And I could probably get three or four cycles. Of doing the four e coaching method done inside of 15 minutes because it's not, it's not a big training. Micro skill doesn't take a lot of time. It takes a lot of intentionality. Yeah. And so what somebody's like, well, you know what? We have this trainer coming in and he's gonna do the training. But you're very blunt in your book where you say that essentially daily trainings and daily discipline will. Outperform, versus where, you see the numbers dip and you bring the trainer and it kind of like fixes all your problems, right? Yeah. So why do you believe that this kind of a micro coaching daily habit beats that every time? Well, because it, you don't build a habit in attending a seminar, I was actually backstage with, Les Brown, the famous motivational speaker, and Les Brown looked at me and he said. You'll never learn how to ride a bike in a seminar. It was sort of random, right? Like I was like, does he have Tourettes right now? What is going on? But I thought about it later and he's a hundred percent right, so you might even have a company trainer who works for your company. Mm-hmm. But they're spread between all the divisions typically, or they're spread between all the salespeople. Sales managers cannot give up the responsibility of developing their teams and hope that the outside trainer, right, like that's me. Like I come in and I do outside training, but there's three things that. Skill development happen. One is good training, two is coachable salespeople, and three is sales leaders who will practice with them and hold them accountable. So it becomes habit. I'm not gonna build a habit if I go to the gym one time and see a trainer one time a month, not even once every other week. You're there all the time. You're doing it constantly. So it becomes what I call a reflex response. And so that it's just repetition. They talk about the 10,000, hour rule, right? Do do something for 10,000 hours, you're a master of it. That's a little extreme, but what you do a lot is what shows up unconsciously, and you can't do that by doing it every once in a while. That's why I do it again, are my favorite words. And what you do again and again, it becomes culture. And so you talk in your book specifically about protecting your culture. So are there any early warning signs that maybe cultures actually slipping in your organization? Yeah, a hundred percent. One is that you have, what I would argue is uncoachable, I'll give you an example of this I have a fun story. There was a guy in the, company I worked with in Las Vegas, and, the sale, he nod, he nodded and smiled during training, but you knew he was the guy who was talking trash about. Training about the company, like he was just a negative person and he'd run off multiple people. And when you start to see one person who is that person, then what happens is you as the leader start to get tested, your culture standards will be tested in that moment. Mm-hmm. And what happens, especially as a market is normalizing and doing the things we're seeing it do is. Do you fall apart like a$2 suitcase on your culture standards? And here's what happens. They go, well, he makes a lot of sales and so here's how I hear that. Okay, so you're willing for everyone to hate your company, hate your leadership style just so you can get some sales. I. Good plan. And so you and I both know this is a horrible plan. And so when, and look, someone might start off being really good, really coachable, but do people get soured? Yes. That's why your attention and your strategy on how you build people and how you develop people is the culture builder. I'm gonna pour into you, so you pour into yourself and into your people. But if you, you don't see me and I'm not pouring into you, and every time you see me, I have something I'm telling you you did wrong and you need to change. And. I'm just some guy who's managing you and I'm just gonna be honest. Nobody wants to be managed. No. They wanna be developed. They do there is a chapter in your book that's called Trust but Verify. Actually Just verify. So what is that verification process actually looks like without creating the culture of micromanaging somebody? Yeah, this is, this is, this is the key, right? Because you don't want be a micromanager, you wanna be a micro developer. That's a different story. Here's what. My thought process is, especially right now, and if you're listening to this and you're a sales leader, if you're new, right? You're, you're, you're a year into this. Mm-hmm. You probably haven't had this happen yet, but if you've been around for a couple of minutes, you, this has happened. At some point in your career, you're going to get called into the office. You're gonna get the email, you're gonna get the phone call that says, Hey, we need to talk. And it's your division president. It's your CEO, it's your company owner. It's somebody that you're like. Houston, do we have a problem? And you're wondering, is this the meeting where I lose my job? That will happen. Every one of us has been through this. It's not whether you will have that conversation or not. It's a matter of how prepared are you for that conversation. Here's where most people go wrong with that Anya, is they go into that conversation and they say things like, well, we're doing the best we can fail. Or, you know what I mean? Marketing. I've talked to them about getting us some bed relief. You just shifted blame. Well, you know, I mean it's, you know, we're, if we, if we could just get some more incentives. You just told them to give money away from the bottom line. Like these are the wrong answers. And so what we want to do here, is we want to. Know that our team is taking every sale as far as it will go. And the way you do that C can be fun, right? I told a a group the other day, they said, well, our team's really struggling with how to share with someone, why now is the right time to buy a home? And I said, here's a framework. Have'em, write it down, have'em go record it, practice it over and over, run a contest on it. Who can do this on the fly? Right? Being caught doing it right. So there, that makes it fun, not micromanaging. And then I would literally make sure, as the sales leader, at some point in every conversation with everyone on the team, I would ask the question, why is now time to buy a home and have them be able to rattle it off? And if they can't, micro skill development, let's get you up there. Because I wanna sit in front of that division president, that company owner, and be able to say, well, what I can tell you is the notes in our CRM are all story based. We are doing the training that we've paid for. I've tested every one of them on it. We ran a contest on why buy now. They all know how to do it. And I know for a fact we're asking for the sale on the first visit because I'm getting trackers that show that. So if there's a problem, it is not because of my team. You have to have certainty in that meeting. You can't walk in going, eh, we're trying. That didn't work. So that's why I say trust, but verify. Actually, just go verify. Interesting. I get all excited about this stuff. You can tell. I can tell, I can tell. Now, Ryan, obviously you see so many different people when it comes to coaching, and so in the new book you cover some of the toughest profiles for salespeople, and scenarios as far as training goes. So can you talk to us about maybe two or three hardest types of reps to coach and maybe some of the mistakes that coaching leaders or sales leaders make with each one of those? Types of steps. Yeah. So one is, when you look at tough scenarios or tough profiles, one of the toughest that I see, and I just had this conversation yesterday, literally yesterday, is when you are on the floor as a sales rep and then you get promoted to management and now you're managing the people that you used to go to lunch with and complain about the leadership. Mm-hmm. That's right. Now you're one of the leadership and. That person usually struggles with the disconnect of how they no longer are able to have, and it's just kind of weird. It's like, it's like running into your ex. It's just weird, right? Yeah, yeah. Everyone listening is like, yeah, I know exactly what you're talking about. And so the advice I give to them is that relationships are built on agreements. And so if you're in that spot, you have to be able to say to that new person, listen, I still care about you. I still wanna be friends, and my role has changed, which means our conversations are gonna change a little bit. I'm cool with that. Are you cool with that? Does that make sense? And we get an agreement on how we proceed forward in our relationship, not hope that we can avoid it and that it's weird, or make the mistake of assuming that it's gonna be the same'cause it's not. It's just not. So that's one of the weird ones. The other toughest scenario, I'll give you this one. Sometimes you'll do a coaching session. Mm-hmm. And uh, the person will, lose it. Oh yeah. I've had this happen a couple times. I call this the walkout or the emotional outburst. Right. Well, something happens, and I've had this happen to me several times. I was doing a training in, oklahoma City, I think it was. And we were about to go into a practice session and I don't put people on the spot and make'em feel weird. This person just was really uncomfortable. Mm-hmm. And I said, all right, let's get going. And I was walking around and there was a sales person in the sales office standing there by himself, and I was like, where's your partner? And he goes, and he points out the window and I see this car drive away. They literally got in their car and left. Wow. Yeah. So sometimes you'll have people who walk out. And if it happens, I give strategies in the book about what to do with that so you don't make that even worse. Mm-hmm. And it might be giving them some time to cool off whatever, it needs to happen. Here's another scenario that we tend to see is when you as the coach are having an off day, right? Mm-hmm. I've got a coaching scheduled with you and right before I pulled up to your community. I got a call from my senior VP of sales and marketing, and he or she just lit me up over an incentive that I approved and, and, and I now feel like I'm the worst manager on the planet and I'm walking into this coaching session where I'm supposed to develop you, right? Two things. You either have to learn how to do a mental reset right there. Or you need to reschedule because you can't come into that damaged because you're no good to that person. So one of those two things has to happen. So I go through those scenarios that I've experienced over the last 20 plus years and I've, there isn't a scenario I haven't dealt with. I told somebody in Raleigh two years ago, said, this just isn't real. This is bs and I know how to sell. I've been doing this forever and picked up, her person just walked out. Okay? Yep. Now, these are one-offs. Yeah, that's 99. 99 times out of a hundred. Not even that's happened to me. Like I'd say walkouts, I can, I can think of in the last 15 years, three times that's happened. But it's, that's crazy that people actually behave that way. I bet you have some fun stories from the road. I, you know, I'm, I'm never amazed at people. I had one person who I went out there to go coach her on asking for the sale, which was weird'cause she went through training with me back in 2001. Mm-hmm. And come to find out it wasn't that she forgot how to ask for the sale. Her abusive father was back in her life. Oh, and he would always abuse her when she would ask for things. And so now I'm in a, oh, okay, we're in a, we're in a therapy session is what we're in. And that is a form of coaching sometimes, as we know. Wow. Yeah. So you experience a lot. That's why I wrote the book. I'm like, people think coaching is just go get more sales. Okay. Okay. It's not, well, I mean, if somebody walked out in my organization like that, it'd be like. Is that somebody we need to hold onto. But sometimes I find that some of the top producers can actually be the biggest resistors to coaching because they're like, I know what I'm doing. I don't need this. So do you have any tips on handling that kind of personality? 100%. This is, this is very common and we tend to avoid our top producers'cause we think they got it. They're good. I don't need to spend time with them. Right. I would disagree with that because if you're not spending time with them, your competitor is, and they're trying to recruit them, that's normal. Here's a fun story. At my former company, we worked with a guy you might know. Do you know Patrick Crocetta? No. Okay. The name sounds familiar, but I don't think I really Good dude. Really good dude. And unbeknownst to me, he called me and my former boss and asked us both the same question. And I tell this story in the book, and, this was this scenario, it was, Hey, what do you do if you have a top producer? And this is exactly what you just said. You have a top producer who does not want to get any coaching. And I said, well, what, how do you know he doesn't want any coaching? And he says, well, I went into his office to do coaching. The guy's name is Mike. And Mike said, why are you even here? Like, why are you talking to me like I'm your top guy? Go work with someone that needs you. And like pretty bold to tell your vp, like, take a hike buddy. And Patrick was so thrown off, he's like, what do I do? And he got advice from me and my former boss and, and we actually gave the exact same advice, which was. Good that we were on that same page. And here's what the advice was. I said, well, let me ask you a question. This is my first question. I said, what is the name of that meeting on your calendar? And he looked it up and it was called something like the B Lead conversion meeting. Mm-hmm. And I said, all right, so talk to me like, who, who's that meeting for you or him? And he said, well, clearly me. I said, okay. So he's being invited to a meeting that is not for him. You already got resistance right there. I said, tell me why your top guy, Mike, would want to get better. And the answer was, doesn't everybody wanna make more money? I'm like, I don't know. I said, you should probably find that out. So I encouraged him to take this guy out to a coffee, something offsite, something neutral, location. Don't bring him into the division office and don't do it at the community. Take him out and just get to know him and find out if there would be any reason why he would want to do more. It's like selling a home. Why do you wanna move? And so he did. And he calls me back and he says, man, that was the best conversation. I said, what'd you learn? And it turns out he had two daughters that, he wanted them to go to college'cause nobody in his family had been to college before or something along those lines. And he said, I want to have my daughters go, but I want them to go debt free. And because of the downturn. In 2008, right? In that timeframe, he was behind his financial goals. His oldest daughter, he had set up his youngest, her name was Jessica, if I remember correctly. She, he wasn't up to speed and so Patrick got the gap of what it was, and now he comes back and he says, okay, that's it. And I said, I asked Patrick, I said, well, what's the new name of this coaching session? And he said, as you could guess, Jessica's college fund session. Now you have coaching that's for someone, not to someone. Mm-hmm. And most people don't have any idea why someone wants to get better. They just want them to get better. And I tell'em, I, I stand up on stages all the time Anya. And I say, let me just in front of company owners. I'll say it. I'll say, I'm just gonna clue you in. Your sales team doesn't care about your company. They don't care about the company goals. They're not interested in your revenue, your profit, what you want. They might nod and smile, but I'm here to tell you that is not what is gonna motivate them unless they wanna be in leadership. But even that is self-serving. So if you don't know your team's motivation for wanting to get better, your coaching is for you by default. Yeah. That's interesting that, that you have to figure out what's gonna move the needle for that person. Yeah. It's, it, it's a, it's more work. What I'm suggesting is more work. I mean, if you read the book, you're like, I don't know if I have time for this. And my, my point is this is, well, what are you doing right? If you don't have time for coaching and doing these things, what are you filling your time with? And here's what it is. Stupid meetings that don't generate revenue, period. That's why I call it revenue getter. Mm-hmm. Imagine watching a football game and you know how they'll pan the camera over to the sideline where the coach is, right? And the coach has got like the, the clipboard up and you know, he is kind of calling plays out and well, it looks like, the coach is really, imagine if they can't pan the camera over to find the coach. And they're like, where'd the coach go? We can't find him. He's not on the field. Where is the coach? And then. The camera pans up to the executive offices way up top and they get a drone to zoom in on that. And he's in the middle of a marketing meeting while the freaking game, you know, he'd be fired like that. Right. And most people aren't where the game is being played. Yeah. Not in meetings. That's, that's a great, great, great analogy there. Now, Ryan, you end the book with a three-tiered plan. For immediate actions, your next 30 day plan, and then ongoing habits. So can you give us. One example for each. So if I'm listening, I'm like, okay, for the next 48 hours, what's one thing I can do in the next 30 days? Is there a system I can implement and an ongoing, what's that one habit that I need to really drill down? Well, you're asking me to take a whole lot of content and put it into a small amount. Lemme just, I'm gonna, I'm gonna pull, so here's the first one is you have to assess the coachability of your team. Mm-hmm. Like stat, because trying to coach someone who's not coachable is like trying to push a rope uphill. It's frustrating for the rope and for you. And I just use a one to 10 scale. I ask leaders all the time, one to 10, 10 is I, I'm coachable. Coach me, someone coach me. How do I learn? And a one is, I know everything. If you got a bunch of people that aren't coachable, you could go do coaching all you want, but you might have a culture issue and a staffing issue. Before you ever coach anybody. It's just, you gotta kind of figure that out. So that's one. I literally, I'm like, all right, that's it. I would get used to looking at micro skills. Mm-hmm. Not macro skills and micro skills are just very, very small. Little like, here's an example of micro skill, shaking your head no when you quote price. So the price line's gonna be about 1.2 million. I'm like. Are we shaking our head? No. So that might be it. It's not the whole presentation, it's that little, that little tweak. How do we do that? So that's one. Inside of the next 30 days, I tell people that they should, work on calendar management, proactively claim the territory on your calendar. And in there write down who, what, how, why, where and when. So it doesn't just say busy, it says I'm gonna go out to Pinecrest. I'm coaching Brian Rob on asking for the sale. We're down in sales and his conversion rate is 10% below everyone else's, right? It's very specific. So I would be looking at your calendar'cause you show me your calendar and I will show you what you value as a leader, as a human, frankly. So that's huge. Let's see, ongoing so one of the things people do is they mistake. Calls like these conversations, which would be called like, I call'em pipeline impact calls. Mm-hmm. And this is where you and I are discussing who's in the pipeline, what sales are coming, what do we need to do to get'em over the finish line? Very common manager salesperson conversation, right? Mm-hmm. The mistake that sales leaders make is they assume that that is coaching. That is not coaching and you can tell.'cause nowhere in there is there the words do it again. There's no four e coaching method, there's no practice. It's just, okay, what do you need to get'em over? Well, I think if we could, you know, do this and we change that, maybe if we swap this out, okay, why don't you tell'em this, get'em that and see what we get back and whatever. That's just collaborating strategy that's not coaching. Mm-hmm. So what I tell people is, while you're having those calls. If you ask enough of the right questions about the interaction, like for example, if I say, well, what was the, what objections did they have? And they say, well, they really didn't like the size of the backyard. And I say, okay, well how did you handle that in that conversation, I am going to hear gaps in skill, most likely. Right. I'm gonna hear, oh, they're not getting the story. They're not asking for the sale. Oh, they're weak in their follow up. I hear that. That is Intel gathering. And so for the long term, you want to not just be getting sales, you wanna be developing people, right? So I'm listening for where are the skill gaps, micro skills specifically, and that then populates my coaching sessions next week or tomorrow or whenever I see this person. So they're two different events, collaborative calls to get sales coaching sessions to develop skills. And people combine those all the time. Wow. As a sales manager, I think I had never the full appreciation of all the things they gotta do. And now it's, you gotta be a full on psychologist, psychiatrist. Well, yeah, the whole thing. So you do. You do. But, but you know, Steve Jobs said it best, he said the knowing what to say no to is more powerful than knowing what to say yes to. Mm-hmm. I have a sales leader that, texted me the other day. Her name's Janice. And Janice said she's in my revenue getter, mastermind group that we're doing this here. And she said, I'm so excited. I had a coaching session planned on my calendar, and another department head told me I needed to cancel it because this meeting was more important. And I said, what, what happened? She goes, well, it might be more important to her, but it's not more important to me. So I kept my coaching session and they rescheduled the meeting. I'm like. Boom. You train people how to treat you. Yeah. Without these managers developing, people we're hoping they get better. Mm-hmm. But they're not. I got a guy, I tell a story in the book. This was from Chelsea Timmons, Chelsea had this guy who had been selling homes for 30 years and he told her picture like the walking Texas cliche, right? Big old mustache. He's got the boots and the big old belt. And he's like, sweetheart, I've been selling homes for 30 years. I know what I'm doing, right? Like the worst thing you could say to somebody. And she's like, oh, that's cute. Do it again. And she was just like on it. The problem was that guy had 30 years of time on the job. He didn't have 30 years of experience because the guy's the same sales guy he was in year one, guaranteed. So time doesn't make you better. It might actually make you worse. Yeah. Coaching and development with practice makes you better. And if we can get that figured out, man, I'm telling you, we can create some superstars in this industry and it makes the manager's job easier too, by the way, over time. Of course, I, I can imagine once you have the foundation and the habits and everything else, but I bet it's not an easy task to get it going. So, as we wrap up this conversation, two questions for you. So one is, if you could just, you know, wave that magic wand and get every single salesperson to kind of adapt that one belief from this book, what would it be? A salesperson or sales leader from this book? Sales leader. Sorry? Sales leader. Sales leader. It would be what I said in the beginning. Management is not the direction of people, it is the development of people. That's the primary job. Because if you develop the people, you stop getting the same calls and the same problems. Right. That, that would be the belief. Perfect. So who should buy this book, you guys? I will have this book linked in the show notes, so you can easily click right here in a conversation. But who should buy this book, Ryan? Anybody who's in charge of managing somebody else, or if you're an up and coming leader. And frankly, you know what, I've been thinking about this Anya, because I've had a chance to really work with some teams, on this content. Mm-hmm. And I'm almost of the opinion now that salespeople, if they're responsible for practicing with other salespeople mm-hmm. That may, because if they can learn how to coach it, they will get better at it. So, but ideally, I wrote it for the. For sales leaders who are responsible for developing other people and not even sales leaders. You could be an engineer who's in charge of the performance of your team. Mm-hmm. So if you are responsible for other people from a leadership perspective and you think coaching might actually be something you should know, then this is the book. And it's not written for home building specific, it's for anybody in that position. Marketing, sales, if you're managing somebody, this is, this will help. Love this. So you guys make sure to pick up a copy of Revenue Getter. It's gonna be out as we speak. So again, the easy way to do it is a link is right in the show notes right there. And Ryan, before I let you go, was there anything that I did not ask you today or we didn't cover that you think is important for our listeners to understand? Your questions are so good. Like you pulled out like a whole lot. So the only thing, I think is that. The question is, is when you read the book, is that enough? You know, sometimes people ask, is that enough? And my answer to that is probably not right? Because here's what people do is they read a book and then they go, that was good, and then they put it on the shelf and it becomes shelf help. So how do you put it into action? Well, that's why the 30 day action plan and all that is in the back of the book, right? But then we also have our revenue getter certification program that if you want tactical hands-on coaching with that. Then you should check out, revenue getter.com where we have the book and the mastermind program all laid out there. Awesome. So you guys, I'll be sure to link to all of that. And Ryan, if somebody wants to connect with you personally, learn more about Impact 88, where do they go to find you? Well, my home address, no, I'm kidding. Um, uh, LinkedIn, either Ryan Taft or, search impact 88 Instagram. We're on all the socials doing all the things. But our website, for Impact is really full of everything that we do, especially with, Cassie and Jeremiah and our whole team, Lindsay, who's wait till you see what she's about to roll out. But, uh, teaser, impact 80 eight.com. All spelled out. No numbers. Just impact 80 eight.com. Awesome. So you guys, you heard it here, go run. Pick up your book right now. It doesn't matter if you're in sales leadership or if you're just in charge of people. So some really, really great habits there. So Ryan, thank you so much for coming on again. It's always such pleasure to talk to you could talk to you for hours and hours and I learned so much from you. Thank you all. Thank you. Thanks for having me on. Let's do it again. Absolutely. Talk to you very soon. Bye. Bye.