Greater Things
A podcast about how faith fits with your everyday life. Matt interviews various speakers from around the globe and invites them to share their own experiences. For those who are asking big questions around faith, religion, church, and life.
https://www.greaterthingsinternational.com
Greater Things
Connected Living: Finding Freedom in a Disconnected World with Lana Engelbrecht
What happens when we learn to embrace connection in a world designed to keep us disconnected? South African-born Lana Enkelbrecht joins us to share her powerful insights on finding freedom through connected living.
Drawing from her experiences across three countries and cultures, Lana reveals how disconnection from our true identity creates literal "dis-ease" in our bodies and relationships. With warmth and wisdom, she explores how our fast-paced, digitally-saturated world has eroded our capacity for genuine connection—with ourselves, with God, and with those around us.
The conversation takes a fascinating turn as Lana unpacks the Hebrew concept of "shalom"—not just peace, but bringing order and beauty from chaos. She describes practical ways to remain grounded amid life's storms, including intentional moments of presence and curiosity. Rather than seeing challenges as attacks, Lana suggests they reveal heart positions we might otherwise ignore, creating opportunities for transformation.
As someone preparing to write a book on connected living, Lana offers profound insights about nurturing connection in families, embracing our purpose, and creating environments where others experience the peace of heaven. Her perspective on approaching life with curiosity rather than judgment opens new pathways for authentic relationship and spiritual growth.
Whether you're feeling isolated, overwhelmed, or simply seeking deeper connections, this conversation offers practical wisdom for experiencing the freedom that comes when we live as the connected beings we were designed to be. Listen now to discover how small shifts in awareness can transform your experience of everyday life.
www.greaterthingsinternational.com
In this episode of the Greater Things Podcast, I'm back with a great friend to Trish and I, that's Lana Enkelbrecht, and we're talking about a new thing that she is doing. She is becoming a writer and she is going to be sharing what her book is all about. Well, today, on the Greater Things Podcast, I'm back with a very dear friend to Trish and I, the Lana Enkelbrecht. How are you, lana?
Speaker 2:Hi, matt, it's lovely to be sitting here with you. I always love our time together and where our conversations start off and where it goes and where it ends. It's always such a treat.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it is Now. Since we last spoke on this podcast, you've become Australian.
Speaker 2:I have People can't place my accent. It's very funny. I have conversations and then they all start looking at me funny and they're like we can't place where you're from. And then I'm oh, originally South Africa, 18 years in New Zealand and now in Australia and they're like, oh gosh.
Speaker 1:So are you used to calling yourself Australian, or you're still a New Zealander, or you're South African.
Speaker 2:Oh gosh, it depends on who I'm talking to and where I am. If I speak to my close friends, they all think still of me as South African. I think maybe because I can't lose the accent, there's still some of that twang in my pronunciations. And if I speak to my friends in New Zealand, then they think of me as Kiwi. And then the new friends I've made here mostly South Africans currently and some Australians, but I've already knew you guys beforehand. So I think I don't know how do you see me, matt? Do you see me as Australian, or New Zealand or South African?
Speaker 1:How do I see you as friend? I?
Speaker 2:love that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yep. I think that would be the easiest way to describe that, lana, I'm interested to hear whether you've picked up any Aussie slang yet.
Speaker 2:No, some conversations I actually have to stop people to just ask them to explain to me what they have just said. There is something that goes over my head, enjoying the learning experience. I've made a really good friend here, naomi, and she's very good in teaching us some Australian slang. Every time we have a family meal she brings out some of the slang and then we all get to laugh.
Speaker 1:That's awesome. So when New Zealanders say g'day, do you ever say g'day?
Speaker 2:No, no, I don't think I could ever say g'day. I always say hello or hi, hello, hello, like I like the repetition, it's my thing, I repeat it To say to somebody I see you, I want to connect with you, I want to let you know that I want to have a conversation.
Speaker 1:So g'day mate Is not something that's going to come out of your mouth.
Speaker 2:Oh no, that just feels too foreign for me, Even though I've lived there for almost 18 years. Yep, no.
Speaker 1:We'll get you there, Lana.
Speaker 2:I don't know, matt, I don't know. You know, can you teach a dog new tricks, an old dog new tricks? I don't know.
Speaker 1:You're much younger than me, lana, so I'm not going to be calling you old, because that would be a recipe for pasta for me.
Speaker 2:It's that age thing with women that we have to be very sensitive about. You know, very aware of it.
Speaker 1:Very true, lana. For people who may not have listened to you on the podcast before, it's been a while since you've been on it. Do you mind just introducing yourself? Who is Lana?
Speaker 2:Who is Lana? Lana is a wife to Conrad, mother to three world changers Samuel, who's 19, Kayla, who's 17, and Zoe, who's 11. And I've got a lot of passions and hobbies and I love having conversations with people and building connection and listening to other people's stories and finding truth and finding hope and discovering new things and exploring. So it's wonderful to be in Australia because I get to do this now in a physical way too. I get to explore a new country and sit with people and meet new people and, yeah, see what God reveals in those moments to me. And, oh, I love the nature here. I just the bird life and the heat. I love the heat here. I just the bird life and the heat. I love the heat going. I've had winter for 18 years, so I'm embracing the Queensland heat, enjoying every moment of it, just being grateful for where I'm at.
Speaker 2:We've transitioned as a family. We've transitioned as a family. When we moved to Australia, my son stayed back in New Zealand to do his first year of studies and our daughter, Kayla, is in a boarding house in Sydney for performing arts school, and Zoe was the only one that moved to Brisbane with us. So that was quite an adjustment, being. You know having a bit of an emptiness, but I'm so grateful we had being. You know having a bit of an emptiness, but I'm so grateful we had. We've got Zoe. That's with us.
Speaker 2:I can still mother her in this space, but now my son is moving back home. So this mom is very excited for this new chapter with him and the faces and I love my kids' faces that each one had such a unique and special phase of their lives of discovering who they are and what's on their scroll and exploring and voicing out what they're thinking. And we're having all these wonderful conversations in between things, and I'm they. They're teaching me a lot through their stages of life, where they're at and what they're doing. So I'm a mother that enjoys life and a friend, and I'm currently working in a natural bath clinic because I'm very passionate about health and wellness and understanding how to steward our bodies well and, yeah, to understand that we have a responsibility about that too and how to live it out in our daily life and our choices, that we have a responsibility about that too, and how to live it out in our daily life and our choices that we make. So, yes, I think that's it. Does it sum me up, Matt Friend. Yes.
Speaker 1:So for everybody listening, you get to hear the heart of Lana and for anyone who knows Lana can connect and resonate with so many of the words that she's just shared, and even the way that she loves her kids and loves her husband and spends time so deeply connected with family. For anyone who sits at Lana's table, which Trish and I have, you get to connect your heart with theirs, and that's a very beautiful part of doing relationship with such an extraordinary family. One of the things I've always found about Jelana, ever since I met you, which is now a few years ago, is you're curious.
Speaker 2:Oh, very much, Matt.
Speaker 2:I think that's part of how God created us is to discover things.
Speaker 2:If we just think about Eden and the Garden of Eden and his you know walking with Adam and Eve and how I think they daily discovered something beautiful within that and asked questions and had conversations, and I'm so grateful for people like you that we can come and have these, ask these questions with, have permission to be curious, have permission to be curious, have permission to question things and have a safe soundboard to reflect on things.
Speaker 2:And I think with curiosity we expand our understanding, expand we understand that we're actually limitless in so many ways. Curiosity invites us into that space of creativity too, you know, and connection and beauty. There's so much beauty within curiosity and I think when you sit with people in relationships and you're curious about their lives and their stories and you know their journey and you start asking questions, you get to see an aspect of Jesus reflecting through them that you've not seen before. So every day is like a journey of finding something beautiful and finding something new and something that he wants to bring to your attention and solidifying your heart. So, yeah, I love the fact that God created us to be curious.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's a very beautiful part of being in friendship with you too because, again, curiosity, when it's religious, we can go to judgment, but when curiosity is relational or love-based, we can have a very safe place to explore areas that we're pondering, we're thinking. Now, one of these areas that we've been pondering and thinking is that, well, I've been on your tail a bit to write a book.
Speaker 2:Oh yes, oh gosh, that is on my, it's on my radar.
Speaker 2:I'm currently engaging with the process of writing and I do love writing poetry, so I've done a few, you know a few poems here and there.
Speaker 2:It's a natural outflow for me to find beauty within words and I've just been thinking so much about the power of words these couple of days. I've had multiple conversations with different friends and we were talking about, you know, words and understanding that we've lost the wonder of words. We just throw it around without understanding the meaning of it or embracing its potential or understanding whether it builds something up or break something down. And so, with this whole process of engaging, of writing this book that I feel like God's asked me to do, which I've tried to ignore a few times because, yeah, I know I'm, yes, I was avoiding it for a bit, but now I'm fully committed to it I get to write words that I feel comes from his heart, to build up and to bring understanding and to create curiosity. You know what I mean Open up new fields for people to engage with and to think about, like thoughts to think about and to sift through in their hearts to see whether it resonates with them or not.
Speaker 1:I love this? Well, because we've been talking about it for quite some time that there might be a book within you, and, again, everyone who talks to you wants to hear more from you. And that's been something of a journey, too, for you as well, because I remember when we first met Lana and I said do you want to do a podcast with me? And you were like me.
Speaker 2:Yes, you really want to talk to me, yep.
Speaker 1:And it was about, like, because I'd seen you in a couple of courses, I did something with Lana Vores and you were in there, and every now and then I heard this wonder that happened within you, and so when I said, can you do a podcast with me? It was that moment of going, ooh, do I have a voice? You've got a voice right and you own that now.
Speaker 2:I am embracing it now, understanding that. You know we each have such a unique expression, we each speak differently, like even embracing my accent, because a lot of the times I was thinking, oh gosh, I sound too South African, who would love one Kind of thing, you know. But understanding that makes me, that's part of my expression, you know that's for some people it would just resonate with them what I, how I speak, and what I have to say. And I'm thinking, you know, with my part of my growing into this was addressing a lot of insecurities, was addressing was embracing my identity and embracing what God sees about me. And it's because of people like you inviting me into a space wanting to hear my story, wanting to hear what you know what questions I have, like where am I going? What am I thinking that has just helped me embrace my voice and to be more comfortable to bring it out to and to trust God to do with it what he chooses to do with it. Because I've came to realize like he is so much about, he's heard so much about our availability, our willingness to do things, not about it being perfect or so polished you know what I mean. Like he can work with my lack of pronunciation and he can still bring life from that. But if my heart position is there to release what he's asked me to release, to bring hope, to encourage, to speak life into situations, then he takes those seeds and he grows it. He's just looking for the people. Who's willing to say I will do it, I will step into the space and I will speak about it.
Speaker 2:And I think it's so important for us to start talking about topics that we tend to not talk about talk about relationships, talk about insecurities, talk about fears you know, because we all go through it in some stage of our lives but it's almost like you're not allowed to talk about it, you're not allowed to acknowledge that you are going through it, because either that reveals a lack of faith or, you know, the whole religious thinking comes in into that space. But when we start now actually voicing these things out and saying, listen, this is what I'm feeling, and voicing it in a safe space where you know the person and you know their heart is for you, and then being open to discover what's behind it, revelation comes and freedom comes. And we are designed for connection, matt, we're designed to sit with one another and to hear one another's story and hear one another's heart. You know, that's how God created us, and so when we get this opportunity to sit with somebody and share our stories with them and they actually listen, that brings life, isn't it? And that brings freedom.
Speaker 2:And it reminds me so much about the Bible, where it says you know how important our testimony is, and those conversations.
Speaker 2:That is where we start sharing our testimony and it's where it gets shaped and it's almost like it gets polished into something so beautiful every time you get to share it with somebody. But it's creating that space, isn't it? It's creating a space where we will sit with somebody and listen to their story and be curious about their story, instead of saying, actually, because I don't agree with you on this point, I can't listen to your story anymore, this point, I can't listen to your story anymore, you know, and shutting it down, instead of asking questions and saying let me, can you let? Can you let me understand where you're coming from? Where does that you know? Where did you get that idea from? Explain to me your heart position about this. There's so much gold to find in people like day to day people that we do life with that we passed. If only we would take a moment to just slow down, you know, put our phones aside and be present.
Speaker 1:Yeah yeah, there's a bit of a clue there, isn't it? Putting our phones aside, there's such a distraction to so much of life today. Well, lana, one of the joys that Patricia and I are sitting down listening to yours and Conrad's story right all the way back from being this little girl in South Africa and Conrad working out life in South Africa, it was just such a joy to listen. But your story has begun to become a story or a book. What's the thread? What's the theme? Like what are you trying to communicate with this book you're wanting to write?
Speaker 2:So when I was sitting with Jesus about the book, I was like Lord, I don't want to write a book that people just consume, because we're in such a world where consumerism is driven but it doesn't really bring change and it doesn't bring accountability, and it doesn't bring about responsibility and you know, and then sometimes it doesn't bring transformation, it just depends. And then I realized that what he's asking me to do is actually write a guide, a guide of connected living, how to be connected again, because everywhere I look I see people disconnected disconnected in families, disconnected in societies, disconnected in their relationships with their spouses, but also disconnected to themselves, you know from themselves, like their body, not understanding the beauty of having a body and how God created our body so uniquely and so beautifully, and not understanding what our body is trying to say to us in different spaces or in different moments of our lives. And so my heart's desire with this book is that people will find a tool that can help them to start feeling connected to themselves, to God, to their identity, to their purpose, to their bigger community, but to their families, to their inner circles, inner circles to just understand the beauty of connected living, because I think in that is where true freedom comes, when we build true connections with people. That's true discipleship. For me, that is where, you know, if I look in the Bible and I see Jesus doing life with the disciples. He was connected with them, he had conversations with them. You know, they did life together, and our current world is set up in such a way that it's operating at such a speed that people feel like they don't have the capacity to connect, and I see more and more people feeling isolated, you know, feeling like they're not seen and heard.
Speaker 2:Then we do the substitution of connection through the phones we feel.
Speaker 2:You know that's how the phones are geared to make us feel that we are connected, but it actually disconnects us even further from being present.
Speaker 2:And so my hope is, with this book, that people will find a guide that they can walk through and that they can have those moments of ha-ha, of understanding they are connected beings and how important it is to build those connections and bring what do you call it union within one another, you know, with our bigger society, so that we can start bringing down what's in heaven into earth, like when we're in unity, when we are connected, when we carry one another's heart and that movement it brings, that freedom it brings, the revelation it brings. I can just see these waves and waves coming down of freedom and of fulfillment, and I've seen a lot of people not understanding their purpose, you know, and so the idea for them to get connected with their purpose. I've seen what it does when somebody gets their purpose too, how it just brings such a joy in their lives and how that changes their family, how it changes their community, you know. And if we can, as His beloved bride can, live connected lives, it will transform the world we live in.
Speaker 1:So true. So a revelation like this doesn't happen overnight. A revelation like this? Well, again, because I've been a party to some of your journey and this little Pentecostal girl that grew up in South Africa and blew her husband's mind when he all of a sudden realized he'd married a Pentecostal girl and he was this quite conservative, up-and-coming young professional doctor and all that sort of stuff. But where does this revelation start from? Is it from those times or has it been a recent revelation?
Speaker 2:Oh, I've been sitting with God asking him so, because you can write books about so many themes, you know. You can go into any field you want to or any topic you want to do. I asked him what is the message I carry? What is you know? What is the thing that I'm that he wants me to talk about or what I get really passionate about? And then I realized it's connection. You know, I really value connection. I want to sit with people and build connection.
Speaker 2:I really struggle doing a relationship if there isn't a connection, or doing things with people when they're, you know, without any connection. I really struggle doing a relationship if there isn't a connection, or doing things with people when they're, you know, without any connection. And then I started realizing that's the message I carry. And then I look back on my own journey of, you know, growing up and my own health issues and then understanding that a lot of those health issues came from being disconnected from my body, you know, and being disconnected from my true identity and being partnering with things that people said about me. That wasn't true, but because I didn't understand or I didn't have a framework to weigh it with against or have a community where I could voice it at that stage to see whether it's true or not. I partnered with that and that caused a lot of dis-ease in my life and conflict in my life because it wasn't true to who I am, you know, and so that's my message, that's what I carry.
Speaker 2:I can see my whole journey, from childhood going through from where moments of disconnect happened and then seeing the fruit of the disconnection you know, and how it brought destruction and how it brought, you know, death in some places, relationship wise, and how it just made my whole being in conflict. And when we are connected, as with ourselves, with Jesus, with our body, with our environment, you operate in shalom. You're not in that conflict anymore. You know what I mean. Like you don't feel like you have to be in fight and flight mode because our world is also just wired that most of the time we are in fight and flight mode.
Speaker 2:But when you're a connected person and aware of it, aware of your environment and having these healthier relationships, healthier relationships with yourself, you know nurturing yourself and understanding you have a responsibility for that Things shift. You get a freedom, you get grace, you get capacity, and so my heart's desire is to see people functioning from that place of shalom, of fully embracing who they are, fully being present in their lives, in their families, in their relationships. I think some of the most damage I've seen in the world is in families being disconnected and there's a lot of things that happened in our world since COVID that caused a lot of disconnection and brought a lot of breaking of relationships and you can see the results of that and you can see the results of that and you can see the impact on mental health and I think part of the issues we have in mental health is this being disconnected and finding the key of being connected beings again.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I love that and so it sounds to me like, whether it's in these pages or not, but people are going to be hearing your story, like they're going to be able to like and it's your testimony, like you said before, like I love the verse in Revelation 19 where it says prophecy is the essence of prophecy is bearing witness, or testifying to what Jesus has done, or testifying to Jesus, and so I think the value that we place on people's stories I know in the last few years for me, lana, I've put more value on people's stories than I've ever done and I find like when I sit and listen to someone share their story, it's an action of love, it allows them to be heard, and the more that you love, the safer that environment becomes.
Speaker 1:And what I've found over years is, the safer that environment is, the more that you discover about the person. And so it's not just all the great things that has happened, but it's also the challenging things that we've had to walk through, and that's what Trish and I our experience with you and Conrad. Every time we get a chance to sit down and chat, parts of our story come up and they come out and it's safe for us to share and then hopefully, it's your feeling, it's safe for you to share as well. So are people going to hear in this book the story of Lana, or is that what you're framing up or what are you thinking?
Speaker 2:They will have the journey.
Speaker 2:I think I would start off with my realization of disconnected living and how it was reflected in my life and in different phases of my life, kind of thing.
Speaker 2:So there will be definitely moments that I will share with them of this is where I was at, this is how it came about, this is the revelation, you know, I received in that moment, and then having moments for them to reflect of where are they at now, is there anything in their world that is, you know, revealing this connection to them and how to then address it? Where does it come from originally? What is it? What made them believe that they are disconnected? Because a lot of that thinking we are disconnected comes from a belief system, and so it's inviting them to reflect on that and deciding whether they still want to live from that point. And I mean, like you said, the best example is people's stories, like the things, the moments we've walked out, of understanding this is the fruit of being disconnected and how to walk from there and the choices we can make to bring it back into being connected again.
Speaker 1:I love it. The phrase you used also was to live from shalom, so what does that mean to Lana?
Speaker 2:That is to embrace every day with grace, having grace for myself. I mean there are moments in my day that didn't go as planned, because, you know, like everybody out there, I do like it when things go as planned, but a lot of the times it doesn't. And then taking a moment thinking, oh actually, what's going on here, and not reacting but responding Like take, you know, it's almost like having CLR moments in my day of saying, okay, let me just stop, let me just reflect. Where am I at? What's happening? What do I engage with? What is not my battles to fight? Because I've realized that in the past I got involved into storms or pulled into storms that was not my storms to be part of, into storms that was not my storms to be part of, and then that caused a lot of discomfort. And now being able to say, oh, actually, when things come my way, is this my storm? Is this the place I need to engage with? Having those check-ins with Jesus, like you know, every now and again, is this where you want me to be? Is this reflecting your nature? When I speak to other people, am I showing your compassion, your heart to them? Am I showing it to my kids? Am I, you know, loving them well and then taking moments to love myself well too, understanding that I have permission to go and for a walk, to do exercise. You know some basic things have a moment to sit and enjoy a cup of coffee and actually tasting it and not just like swallowing it down. You rush through the other things and understanding you know that things don't always have to be rushed. We can actually slow down the pace and create moments of bliss and enjoyment within our day.
Speaker 2:For me, it's really important to enjoy things.
Speaker 2:I think it is something that we've not allowed ourselves a lot in the past in faith communities Like it's almost, you know, it's almost a sin to enjoy life.
Speaker 2:Faith communities like it's almost you know it's almost a sin to enjoy life. But actually I think God created us to enjoy things, to enjoy the taste of food, to enjoy cooking, you know, enjoy sitting at table and having people come around the table or baking something, or going for a walk, or just having a Zoom call with one of your dearest friends sitting in those moments of saying, oh, this is just beautiful, lord, this is just beautiful to have this opportunity to sit with them and have these conversations, or, you know, when I'm driving in my car looking at what's around me, then thinking I'm so grateful to be here, I'm so grateful to be alive now, then thinking I'm so grateful to be here, I'm so grateful to be alive now, and I know, you know, that we are all here for a purpose and for this specific time and it's just creating this awareness of conversation with Him is like okay, god, what are we doing today? What are we going to explore as His child and as Jesus' lover, like you know that, just yeah.
Speaker 1:I love that because shalom, for me, is such a valuable word and such a rich word. So again from the Hebrew and I remember studying this years ago and if my memory serves me correctly, it means to bring peace out of chaos. And I think that concept it's not just having peace, but it's bringing peace in chaotic times, and we are living in chaotic times where fear will steal what peace can draw out of chaos.
Speaker 1:Now what you're talking about, in my understanding, is presence and allowing us to be grounded, allowing us to be alive within the moment that we're, in, understanding that the most important moment of our lives is the one we're in, not the one that we're thinking about tomorrow, but the one that we're in.
Speaker 1:We can make choices today, this moment, that can affect the rest of our lives or, so to speak. That can affect the rest of our lives, so to speak. But shalom and like Gideon picks this up and I love the story of Gideon Lani, you know that, and it's the first time that God is called the God of shalom, the God of peace, and he's the one who uses it, and I'm always curious about that, because he was the one hiding out threshing wheat in a wine press. He's the one who got it, confronted by the angel of the Lord and decided to cook him a goat. And the Bible says that a lightning bolt basically comes from heaven and consumes the goat and, for whatever reason, he then says this is the God of Shalom. I think I would have been trembling.
Speaker 2:Realization.
Speaker 1:Talk about chaos. Maybe that was a prophecy Bring peace in this moment of chaos. I don't know. But he came to the realization in one of the most chaotic times in Israel's life, where God met him as Shalom, the God who brings peace in chaos. How do you feel about that, lana?
Speaker 2:I love that, matt. I think we all can access this shalom at all times and where we go, we can release it, like I've seen it, like at the clinic that I work, like I'm very intentional when I go in there to bring a rhythm of calmness and peace and release that in that environment. And I think we're all called to do that, and that draws people into us. They will say, oh, actually, I feel safe in your environment, I feel calm in your environment, and so they can taste something of heaven that we carry and that we have access to. And don't get me wrong, I face challenges as much as anybody else, you know. But it's how we choose to embrace that and how we choose to sit in it. And if we choose to let the chaos just flow through us, you know, then that is what our environment will be like and we won't be able to access his shalom. But if we take that moment of pause and just say, okay, I feel a little bit overwhelmed, now I can feel this building up. I just want to feel your presence. I just want to feel your embrace and being intentional of connecting with Him and asking Him that he would release His peace through us in those moments. That transforms our circumstances. It might not change our reality quite immediately, but it will change our heart position. It will change where we feel we are seated and connect us with that of being seated in heavenly places, because that is where we are, you know, and sometimes we so disconnected from that truth. You know that it doesn't reflect in our circumstances. So the invitation for us is always there to be connected with that truth. You know emotional storms or challenges that surround them, but they link into His presence, they link into being seated in heavenly places and they release that.
Speaker 2:And people look at it and they're like how can you stay this calm in this situation? You know, how do you stay so grounded, calm in this situation? You know, how do you stay so grounded Then? That speaks so much to their heart. It invites them to this place where they also want to taste it, because our world is hungry for this. They want to have rest. You know, if you look at most of the things that's being sold, it's this idea of rest that's being sold to us, you know, on Instagram and on Facebook, but we, as believers, we can access it every day and we can release it into our earthly circumstances and that brings invitations for people from the world to want to partake of it, to want to see. Where do you get that from? How do you get that from? How is it that there's this calmness around you? And that's such a beautiful testimony of our Lord and what he's done for us and His consistent presence with us and walking things through with us.
Speaker 1:So good, I think, for me too. I think for the longest time I determined that chaos was evil. When maybe chaos is the circumstances we find ourselves in, it doesn't mean it's evil. But what this word shalom gives to me is the ability to find God in chaos, like God created out of the chaos. That's what the word means to create out of chaos. And so he didn't define chaos as evil, no, but he brought order inside of that place, and shalom for me helps me find order in the chaos. But if I declare the chaos as evil, then I'm saying that Satan's somehow rather messing up all my circumstances. But if I believe chaos might just be the circumstances of my life, can I find God in it? I don't know about you, lana, but that to me is a different conversation altogether from what I would have had a few years ago.
Speaker 2:So it reminds me of the concept that you share with us a lot about the tree of the knowledge of good and evil or the tree of life. When we sit under the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, we tend to see things, as you know, consistently either as evil or coming at us or at war kind of thing, while if we're sitting under the tree of life, we understand that we can create peace within the chaos, like that is part of I think that is part of governing creation as his sons and daughters. That is part of what he wants us to do is bring peace within the chaos. And you know, chaos can reveal a lot of things, matt. It can reveal a lot of hard positions that we want to ignore or that we weren't aware. Is there want to ignore or that we weren't aware, is there?
Speaker 2:So if we actually ask him to create beauty out of this, you know, create life out of this, instead of thinking and seeing it as evil and, you know, going into full attack around it, I wonder what the outcome will be, how different our you know our experience of it would be and how we would face it every time that we feel chaos is coming If we see it as moments of oh, we can create beauty out of it, or ah, freedom is coming, because there's a hard position that is being revealed in my heart that you know that I can bring before him now and it's not fit for me to go further. You know that I can bring before Him now and it's not fit for me to go further. You know it's something that he wants me to change or leave behind, like the old wineskin that we talk about. It's having those conversations with Him in chaos and asking Him God, what is this revealing about your heart to me in this and what is it revealing about my heart in this? You know, and it's these things that we need to adjust and realign.
Speaker 2:Can I speak, you know, life into it, healing into it? Can I see your love being expressed within it? It's a whole different way of approaching it, eh.
Speaker 1:There is. I'm just going to try and land this, this baby, because we're kind of at that time. Lana, the more that you talk, the more that I want to read the book that you're writing and I'm sure, for people listening along, there's gold here that Lana's dropping that I'm sure will practically useful every day of your life.
Speaker 2:So, lana, can I dare to ask when I'm hoping?
Speaker 1:by March, before my birthday, march wow.
Speaker 2:And so, yes, I will keep you posted guys.
Speaker 1:So March 2025.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think it would be a good way to enter my new you know age into a new chapter of my life by writing this book and seeing what God wants to reveal in the next chapter of my life.
Speaker 1:Good and this for me, like I love empowering writers, I love empowering creatives. And for people, I love empowering creatives.
Speaker 2:Matt, we need a publishing house. You know, by talking about, thinking about the, both of us need to set up a publishing house here in Australia.
Speaker 1:Deal Done. When two of us agree, anything we ask in Jesus' name, we should consider it done Great.
Speaker 2:Watch out Australia, the publishing house is coming.
Speaker 1:Alana, thank you so much for your time. We will be thinking, praying, supporting, looking forward to, with eager expectation of the book that's flowing from you. But just thank you for hanging out with me on the Greater Things podcast.
Speaker 2:Oh, matt, I always love sitting with you and having conversations, because we never know where it will go. It's such joy to see how you landed, so true.
Speaker 1:Well, for everyone else listening along, this is the Greater Things podcast. If this has been helpful and you'd like to support us in a financial way, you can click on the little link on the podcast called Buy Me a Coffee, and it just supports all the things that we are doing with Greater Things and we're just so thankful for you guys who are doing that, but otherwise we will be back in your ears next time. Bye, for now. You can find us on Facebook, instagram and YouTube, or go to our website, greaterthingsinternationalcom. You can find us on Facebook, instagram and YouTube.