Have you ever considered the silent battles our children fight in their minds every day? Aligned with the recent Children's Mental Health Awareness Week, this podcast delves into children's mental health and provides help and guidance including recognising the signs, how to support and advice for parents and family members. Featuring Sally Tribe and Dr Omar Kowlessar, Vita's mental health experts.
During this eye-opening episode, we unravel practical approaches to help parents and caregivers nurture resilience in our young ones. The art of maintaining open communication channels, the value of shared activities, and the necessity of staying deeply involved in your child's life, regardless of their age, are explored. We recognize the adversity faced by today's youth—loneliness, a dip in motivation, and the pandemic's exacerbation of these issues—while also celebrating their incredible adaptability and strength. Join us as we not only discuss the challenges but also highlight the importance of early recognition of mental health struggles, emphasizing the theme of growth for Children's Mental Health Awareness Week. Don't miss this heartfelt journey into understanding and supporting the mental health of the children in our lives.
Have you ever considered the silent battles our children fight in their minds every day? Aligned with the recent Children's Mental Health Awareness Week, this podcast delves into children's mental health and provides help and guidance including recognising the signs, how to support and advice for parents and family members. Featuring Sally Tribe and Dr Omar Kowlessar, Vita's mental health experts.
During this eye-opening episode, we unravel practical approaches to help parents and caregivers nurture resilience in our young ones. The art of maintaining open communication channels, the value of shared activities, and the necessity of staying deeply involved in your child's life, regardless of their age, are explored. We recognize the adversity faced by today's youth—loneliness, a dip in motivation, and the pandemic's exacerbation of these issues—while also celebrating their incredible adaptability and strength. Join us as we not only discuss the challenges but also highlight the importance of early recognition of mental health struggles, emphasizing the theme of growth for Children's Mental Health Awareness Week. Don't miss this heartfelt journey into understanding and supporting the mental health of the children in our lives.
Yes, and welcome along to another of the Vita Health Group podcasts. Thanks so much for joining us. I'm Glenn Thompson and the aim of this series of podcasts is to raise awareness of what Vita Health Group has to offer. To do that, I'm joined on each episode by various experts in their chosen field, and today I'm joined by mental health experts Omar Kallessa and Sally Try. Both of you welcome to the podcast. Nice to know you're on board. How are you doing?
Speaker 3:Hi, glenn, doing well, thanks, how are you Excellent?
Speaker 2:I'm good. Thanks, sally, thanks Omar. Let's get a bit of background on both of you before we get underway with today's program. Then, and Sally, what do you do?
Speaker 3:So my job title in Vita Health Group is I'm the clinical lead for corporate mental health. So we work with occupational health and private medical insurers and we treat both adult and children adolescents.
Speaker 2:Okay, so you keep busy on. Imagine that moment there. Very busy yeah it's very busy. Okay, and Omar? What do you do, omar?
Speaker 4:Kallessa, hi, glenn. So I'm a clinical psychologist by background and I'm a regional clinical lead in Vita Health Group. I work on the adult mental health side of the company, so we work with individuals from 16 plus suffering with mental health problems.
Speaker 2:Okay. When you say regional, is that a region of the UK? What about Sally?
Speaker 4:Yeah, so the regions that I work within or the services that fall within my region are Basildon and Brentwood, leicester and West Essex.
Speaker 2:Okay, so, then, today's episode has a special emphasis on Children's Mental Health Awareness Week, which falls between the 7th and 13th of February of this year. A huge area. I mean. We're just going to, I think, touch on the surface of it today, but we'll get into as much as we can. I'm going to ask you first of all, sally, what is children's mental health? I was talking to my wife only last night about these two words, mental health, and it's become so more in our everyday lives now, hasn't it, I think, since the start of COVID. But what is children's mental health, sally?
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely, and it's something that is really close to my heart and very passionate about in terms of children's mental health. But, just like adults, we all have mental health, just like we all have physical health. Sometimes we feel well and sometimes we don't, and we will have good days and bad days. But when the negative thoughts and feelings start to affect your daily life and stop you from doing the things you enjoy or your ability to feel okay, this means you probably need some support with your mental health.
Speaker 2:And support is out there, isn't it?
Speaker 3:Absolutely yes. The support is out there for both adult and children.
Speaker 4:As Sally's just mentioned, children's mental health is not radically different to adult mental health. We both have. When I'm talking about both, I mean children and adults have physical health and mental health, and we all tend to look after our physical health, don't we? When we're unwell, or when we need to go and see the GP, or when we need to pick up a prescription, we're quite, I suppose, open and we don't think twice about accessing our GPs or going to the hospital when we have a broken bone or have an infection. And the same is true for mental health as well. It's something that requires ongoing care and attention, and we don't often give it that same level of priority as we do our physical health, but the two work hand in hand. So there is no distinction between children and adult mental health. There is just mental health that requires looking after. In the same way we look after our physical health through our diet, exercise, activity, we have to look after our mental health as well.
Speaker 2:Why is it? Do you think, both of you? A question to both of you really, why is it that children's mental health has become such a thing now? I remember when I was a kid, going back a number of years. Now I've got to tell you it's something we never heard of. I mean, it was probably around, it was probably apparent in a lot of children, but you know, as kids we played outside, we had good fun. There was never an issue with mental health. Why has it become more apparent now? Do you think in 2022,? Sally?
Speaker 3:I think this is a really good question. Actually, one thing I often ask myself too and it's really hard to say whether children's mental health is increasing or we're better at identifying, we're better at asking for help and we're better at diagnosing children's mental health.
Speaker 2:You're saying, then, that many years ago there probably was mental health, but we weren't aware of it.
Speaker 3:Absolutely, but what we do know also is that it has increased, especially since the pandemic. So, for example, it used to be around one in 10 children have a diagnosable mental health, and today that sits at one in six children have a diagnosable mental health condition, and many of the children and young people who do not have a diagnosable condition make spirits a period of mental ill health or emotional distress.
Speaker 2:And you know, you see kids playing around and they're happy on their bikes. They're happy outside playing with their mates. But there could be some underlying issue there, do you reckon?
Speaker 4:Actually, glenn, I wanted to come back to something you mentioned before, which was when you were younger and I suppose children's mental health wasn't spoken about. It was something that wasn't in people's awareness. It raises a question of did children used to have mental health problems? And I think it's always been around, as Sally was mentioning before. We're now more aware of what this idea of this concept of mental health actually is and the factors which affect it, and children have always, like they've had physical health, they've always had mental health and they've always had mental health. They've always had mental health problems and there's always been issues that have affected their mental health.
Speaker 4:It's just that we've perhaps never been as good at recognizing the signs of symptoms and having this general awareness and being open about talking about it. One of the other things is like depression, for instance. I've spoken to certain individuals in my personal life from a certain kind of cohort, you know, if you like, in terms of age group, when you mention topics such as depression. They would sometimes say, well, that was never around when I was younger. Guarantee, it was. It just wasn't spoken about or people didn't manage it or recognize it in the way we do now. Depression is not a new concept. It's not a new disorder. It has been around and, just like children's mental health, it has been around for a long time too. I think we're just better at recognizing it, understanding it and talking about it now.
Speaker 2:Well, come on to the challenges for parents, very shortly but Sally coming to you if I can. What are the signs that something may be wrong, that a child has got some sort of mental health issues? Are they sort of introvert? Do they not sort of mix and mingle with other people? I guess every case is different, isn't it?
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely so. Sometimes it is internal, sometimes it's external. So feeling hopeless, struggling to see the positives in life or wishing you didn't exist, children getting into lots of arguments or fights, other things such as children feeling sad, angry or anxious all the time, having extreme highs or lows, and other things such as changing to the eating patterns, sleeping patterns and, as you said, going and keeping away from friends and family. They can all be signs that parents can look out for.
Speaker 2:Do you also think and I'm going to sound very old-fashioned here now do you also think that we live in a very fast-paced world, don't we? We've got all the latest mod cons. You've got mobile devices. Kids are constantly on their mobile phones. You see them coming out of school. They're all fixed to the screen. They're not watching where they're walking. Do you think a lot of that is maybe a problem? There's a lot of pressure, a lot of peer pressure now with social media. That is causing issues as well with mental health.
Speaker 3:I think that's a really good question and I think that it's always been there. So peer pressure, social judgement, has always been there. But it's 24-7 now for children, whereas before it would be the school or any other peer groups outside of the school that this peer pressure or social judgement used to be a problem. But now, with the cyber world, children are experiencing it 24-7, so they don't really get a break from it.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, omar. The challenge is for parents then. The impact of homes, calling on parents, mental health lots of things for parents to think about, isn't there really? I mean, it's a huge issue for kids and parents, a lot really.
Speaker 4:It has been and it continues to be. We do know that the parents' mental health has a direct impact on the children in the family, their mental health and vice versa. So there's this kind of symbiotic relationship between families in the same household In terms of the things that parents can do to look after themselves and, in particular, during the times of homeschooling. Personally, I can talk about my experiences of during the first lockdown. I've got two children, both at the time we're in primary school. It was highly stressful, trying to juggle working from home and also occupying the role of teacher. How did you cope? Well, we struggled. We didn't cope very well because we soon realised we couldn't do both. I couldn't work from home and actually be a teacher and deliver the curriculum that the school were expecting us to deliver to the standard. At the same time, what we realised is that we were feeling quite pressured and stressed to deliver the teaching to our children and we were passing that stress onto them.
Speaker 2:How did you do that? You're the first person I've spoken to who's got young children at school and you're also trying to keep a job down, working from home. I mean, how did you split that time? How did you do that? How did you divide the time between the kids and what you do for a living?
Speaker 4:Well, you really needed to carve out times in your diary to dedicate to work and to be with your children, and obviously your employer had to know exactly what you were juggling in the background as well. To kind of have that understanding was really really helpful. You had to kind of carve out the time in your day to do that and you also, if you were, if you had a partner at home, a wife or a partner or a husband, for instance, to work alongside them, so essentially to tag team. But even then it was really really tricky. So what we decided to do was to stop trying to deliver or stop trying to be parents as well as teachers.
Speaker 4:And this is my opinion, glenn just because you're a mum, just because you're a dad, it doesn't mean you're cut out to be a teacher. Sure, just like what your children are expecting when they go to school. It doesn't mean you can be that as well. I think parents occupy obviously various roles during their parenting, but to be a teacher of that standard is just not realistic. So the way we coped is by acknowledging that, realising that we were getting stressed, which wasn't helping our children, and then we started to kind of really filter and cut down on the work we were giving them.
Speaker 2:So and did you recognise this coming out in yourself? Did you sort of recognise the anxiety and the stress coming out?
Speaker 4:We did, we did. We recognised it in our children as well, because they weren't enjoying it. Neither were we, and it was becoming a stressful environment. So if school gave us four tasks to do for the day, we would look at them and pick one or two and we would give that to them and support them to do it. And whatever they did, that was fine. Rather than actually delivering it to a standard which we felt we had to meet. It was to a good enough standard. That's what we settled on, and soon enough we found the experience more manageable. And that was two of us at home with two children. But there would have been countless other parents out there, single parents with one, two more children that had to do exactly the same thing. Did you breathe?
Speaker 2:a sigh of relief when they went back to school.
Speaker 4:Yes, absolutely it was. It was good to hand them back into school and I think, more importantly, the children needed it as well. One day they were in their school environments with their friends and the following day at home, and having to learn at home, not in their peer groups. So I think the children missed that social connection too. So, going back to your initial question of what comparements do to look after their mental health, is recognizing that signs and symptoms that are an indication that they're not maybe coping well, similar to what Sally mentioned regarding children. So changes in your behavior in terms of being more withdrawn, being a bit more snappy, irritable, maybe going a bit more into yourself, you know, overthinking things, noticing signs of anxiety and kind of stress.
Speaker 3:And just to add to what Omar was saying is that parents often blame themselves or don't take time for themselves, and I know there are a lot of people during the pandemic, when they were trying to homeschool their children and hold down a job, didn't take time for themselves. To be you, the person. That's not the mom, not the teacher, not the employee, and I think it's really important to still practice self-care, because if you can't care for yourself, then you're not going to be able to support your child in the best way possible.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely. We keep going back to this on the podcast, don't we that there is support out there for people who have been undergoing that problem? I mean, now things are back to normal Well, not fully back to normal, omar. I'll come to you on this one, because you've had the kids at home and what have you? As things are getting back to normal, does that stress and anxiety continue even though the kids are back at school now? Does that mental health sort of calm down or is it still very much apparent?
Speaker 4:It's still there. It's still there because, as things get back to normal, it feels like one day we're taking one step towards normality and the next day we're either gone backwards or we don't know if we're going to move forward again. You know, things are so up in the air and that uncertainty, I think it, breeds more anxiety. That will be happening across the board. So as things get back to normal ie children go back to school and parents are able to work either at home or back in their kind of their bases, and life feels a bit more normal, that will certainly help. But it doesn't mean that mental health as an issue is solved or goes away. I think those issues still remain and we still need to be aware of those signs of symptoms and to be kind of self-aware about how we can best look after ourselves.
Speaker 2:Sally, come to you, if I can. We focused there on the parents. Let's come back to the children again. What can parents do to support their children in times of, you know, anxiety, mental health, depression, if you like? What can parents do?
Speaker 3:There are a few things parents can do to support their children. So I'd just say try and talk to your children. So talking to your child about how they're feeling can be hard, but doing things such as taking 20 minutes to do an activity that you can both enjoy create some time and space when you both feel relaxed and able to connect. You encourage your child to open up, but don't push them too far. They might want to talk first or they might want to do an activity first, but let them know you're concerned about them. Stay involved in their life. So take an interest. Take an interest in what's important to them. It not only helps them to value who they are, but it also makes it easier for you to spot problems and to support children.
Speaker 4:Yeah, and I would just add in there, sal, that kind of showing an interest in your child's life. That's regardless of the child's age. So you know, a five, six year old to a 14, 15 year old, I suppose the activity is going to be different, isn't it? But for the parent to kind of remain engaged and want to do something with their children, I think that's key spending time together.
Speaker 2:Both of you in your own separate fields I mean you, sally, as a cognitive behavioural therapist and you, omar, as a regional clinical lead. Have you seen a big increase in mental health across all the generations, if you like, since we went into the pandemic, you know, a couple of years ago now, have you seen a huge increase? What's it been like for you?
Speaker 3:We've seen a huge impact on children's mental health since the pandemic. If you think about kind of the function of a school, it provides a safe environment, it provides structure, routine and it can be really helpful for children and what we found is that children of all ages have been missing out on really important milestones. So for some children it's going to be their first ever experience of learning social boundaries and the impact that could have on their developmental milestones is quite huge. So, for example, they could be left behind socially. So we're finding quite a lot of people. Even though the pandemic, even though lockdown hasn't happened since you lockdown three, we're still finding that there's repercussions for children and adult mental health since it begun.
Speaker 2:OK. Is it true that well-adjusted children tend to be more robust and adaptable, would you say? Omar?
Speaker 4:Yes, I would say so. I think, despite the difficulties and challenges our children today are having to face living through Covid and obviously some of the other themes that we've touched on already, such as this kind of always online culture, being attached to devices and so on I think, on the whole, children are very, very adaptable and robust when it comes to change, which is positive. You know, our children have managed and are continuing to manage this kind of very uncertain world rather well and I think it does come down to the child's kind of general personality makeup and their kind of support structure in their family system. And if a child is well-adjusted and you've got stable attachments, then, yes, they can navigate with support those kind of challenges through life Similar to adults. Our early experiences as children and young people form a template for how we function and behave as adults.
Speaker 2:Sally, coming to you, I guess the key is being able to recognise the problems. As a parent, seeing that maybe a different type of behaviour in your children, even as adults, trying to recognise what the problems are, as Omar said earlier, you may feel more stressed, more anxious about things. It's being able to recognise it and where to turn to for help, isn't it?
Speaker 3:Absolutely. It's really important to be aware of this, but not to over pathologise children's mental health, but to recognise the signs and symptoms that your child might be struggling, because untreated mental health, on top of the child's distress, might have implications for learning and for them enjoying and experiencing new opportunities and enjoying their life, and essentially it puts their life on hold. So recognising the signs early and getting the right support is key.
Speaker 2:And Children's Mental Health Awareness Week, which has a set at the start of the podcast between the 7th and 13th Feb this year. What are the sort of typical areas they're going to be focusing on during that week?
Speaker 3:So this year Children's Mental Health Awareness Week is focusing on growth, and so at Vita Health Group we're looking at all the children we treat and looking at what growth means to them. So it could be physical growth, it could be emotional growth, it could be growth of a family pet, it could be their own kind of height growth. So it's going to be a really interesting week where we look at kind of what growth means to children.
Speaker 2:Sally, we touched on challenges earlier in the podcast, but I'm keen to focus back on this again and find out other typical challenges that are facing children of all ages, really when it comes to mental health.
Speaker 3:The challenges children face today have been compounded by Covid, so children change markedly throughout their childhood and their social development milestones, and the pandemic has been exacerbated some of the things they would naturally experience. So, for example, loneliness and social isolation, has been a big factor from the lockdowns that children felt lonely or isolated. During the lockdown periods Some had been able to stay in touch with friends, but social contact was much harder than it would otherwise have been, and daily activities that previously acted as coping mechanisms, including seeing friends and taking part in regular activities, were extremely limited, and so for young children they could end up being a period of just overthinking things, and they no longer had distractions that could alleviate that emotional distress, loss of motivation and purpose. So many young children felt quite unproductive, especially those who were meant to be working or having exams. Also, young children reported more feelings of depression and also physical symptoms, such as you spending more time sleeping or in bed during this time.
Speaker 3:Also, another big thing is anxiety. So young people on the whole reported an increase in anxiety because of concerns about the virus and concerns about their members of their family being affected, and they did not feel comfortable. Some of them didn't feel comfortable leaving homes, having been inside for such a long time because of this fear of passing on the virus. If you think about the general population, I think that everybody has been affected by loss over the last two years, and children aren't immune to that. They've still experienced loss in some way or another.
Speaker 3:It's a loss of a peer group, loss of a family member, loss of what it means to them, their identity, and especially in key developmental milestones, where children are certainly starting to identify with their peers. Imagine you're a child and then you've got no one to identify with. How much anxiety that's going to cause you. I think that children have had a really tough time over the last 24 months and we, like I said before, we are still seeing the repercussions of that.
Speaker 2:Sally, are we talking of a vast age range here, of children, not just youngsters, but sort of teenagers, particularly teenagers, I guess, right into their 20s.
Speaker 3:Yes, it could affect a wide range of children and young people. So, for example, at Vita Health Group we work with children as young as five and if you're thinking about kind of certain developmental stages that could last up until you're 25 years old, and so when you're working with children and young people in this age range, you, therapists, have got to understand the certain key themes that affecting children and young people in this time.
Speaker 2:Okay. Well, it's a fascinating subject and one we've only scratched the surface on. But if you are a parent yourself and you may be feeling anxious, depressed, you can see that also in your children. Sally, I'm guessing, sally, the first port of call has to be your GP.
Speaker 3:Absolutely. I'd encourage anyone to go to the GP if they're feeling you, stress, anxious or depressed and if they see it in their children. There is so much out there for the children and for parents for support. So, for example, the Young Minds website for parents and carers so it provides advice for mental health and behavioral problems in children and young people and they're very good. And there's other helplines and websites for children and young people, such as Shout, Childline and the Mix. So there is a plethora of information and good support websites out there for parents and for children as well.
Speaker 4:I'd also like to add if you're 16 plus and you're struggling with your own mental health issues like stress, anxiety, worry, you're mood, you don't have to go into your GP to seek support and treatment. You can go online, for instance, a VTEL group, you can self refer, use an online web form or you can just phone us directly as well. So there's multiple ways you can seek support. You don't have to go into your GP if you're an adult.
Speaker 2:Okay, contact details of VTEL coming up in just a moment. We've only touched the surface of the subject today. Mental health, of course, and don't forget children's mental health. Awareness week falls between the 7th and 13th of February. Sally Tribe, clinical lead for corporate mental health, and also Omar Kallessa, who is, of course, a regional clinical lead. Thank you both for joining us on the podcast today.
Speaker 1:Thank you for listening to this Making People Better podcast, part of the Wellbeing series from Vita Health Group. Improving your lives, physically and mentally, drives everything we do, and getting you back to doing what you love is our priority. Vita Health Group Making People Better wwwVitaHealthGroupcouk.