EP120: What Does It Mean To Be A Successful Working Parent?

Interview with Anthony Franzese / Seeker of Fatherhood Wisdom

HOSTED BY PAUL SULLIVAN

What does it mean to be a Successful Working Parent? It's a question Anthony Franzese, a healthcare sales executive, had when he became a father. So he went on a quest: if you have fatherhood questions, ask a parent - or 52 of them. That's what Anthony did and nearing the end of the year he has some revelations. Listen in. 

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Transcript

00;00;05;23 - 00;00;26;25
Paul Sullivan
Welcome to the Company of Dads podcast, where we explore the sweet, silly, strange and sublime aspects of being a lead dad in a world where men with a go to parent aren't always accepted at work, among their friends or the community for what they're doing. I'm your host, Paul Sullivan. Our podcast is just one of the many things we produce each week at the company that we have various features, including the lead dad of the week.

00;00;26;26 - 00;00;48;24
Paul Sullivan
We have our monthly meet. We have a new resource library for all fathers. The one stop shop for all of this is our newsletter, The Dad. So sign up today at the Company of dads.com backslash the dad. Today our guest is Anthony Franzese, a digital health expert and new dad. He's also the host of the successful Working Parent podcast.

00;00;48;27 - 00;01;10;16
Paul Sullivan
His wife is a school principal whose schedule is completely inflexible. Want a vacation? Wait until school's out. Anthony on the other hand, works in sales, which has afforded him some autonomy over his day to day life. This has led him to become the lead dad to their young daughter. He's also a former lead dad for the week.

00;01;10;19 - 00;01;12;24
Paul Sullivan
Welcome, Anthony., to The Company of Dads podcast.

00;01;12;26 - 00;01;16;00
Anthony Franzese
Oh, thank you for having me. What a what an intro.

00;01;16;03 - 00;01;21;03
Paul Sullivan
What is it? And we specialize in good interest. You know, we want everything to start off nicely.

00;01;21;05 - 00;01;25;19
Anthony Franzese
I mean, you got it. You got a great podcast, boy. I don't know if people tell you that, but you got a great one.

00;01;25;21 - 00;01;31;10
Paul Sullivan
I'm an only child, so I'm a sucker for flattery. So at any point, just intersperse it throughout the podcast. It will be fine.

00;01;31;17 - 00;01;33;01
Anthony Franzese
Noted. What.

00;01;33;01 - 00;01;40;11
Paul Sullivan
Did you think fatherhood, was going to be like when your wife was pregnant? You know, this is what it actually became.

00;01;40;13 - 00;02;01;06
Anthony Franzese
Okay, so this is sometimes controversial when I say this, but I feel like people made it seem like it was gonna be really so hard to be a parent. And it is in, in some ways, but I don't think it's as bad as everybody made. It made me feel like it was going to be, and it felt like it.

00;02;01;10 - 00;02;20;12
Anthony Franzese
You know, and I think it's got a bad rep out there, you know. And so to answer your question, I thought it was going to be feeling like a zombie for a very long time and losing all, you know, freedoms and sense of myself and never seeing my friends and just, you know, all the things that you hear.

00;02;20;12 - 00;02;35;01
Anthony Franzese
And that stuff does happen in some ways. But I to me, I think the joy of parenthood far outweighs any of those things. And I think that those things aren't really as bad as people make you feel like they are.

00;02;35;04 - 00;03;05;15
Paul Sullivan
Do you think, though, that your your opinion evolved, given that, you know, you, as all of us, were part of this transition to sort of working from home some or all of the time? And so, you know, while your wife is pregnant and she was going off to, to, to her school, but did you see something, you know, a different possibility, like how do you had your daughter in 2019 versus when you actually had her was 20, 23?

00;03;05;17 - 00;03;14;01
Paul Sullivan
Was there something about that move to a more flexible work environment, at least for you, that allowed you to envision parenthood, fatherhood differently.

00;03;14;04 - 00;03;30;18
Anthony Franzese
For sure. I think that's a good point. And also, to be clear, I, the father I didn't carry the child or birth the child and go through some of that stuff. So I don't want this is how like, it's not hard because I know it was harder on my wife than it was on me, in general.

00;03;30;18 - 00;03;54;14
Anthony Franzese
But yeah, I it was actually really nice to be working from home because even though you're working, especially early on when my wife is still on leave, I just felt like I still got to be a part of my daughter's life. And, you know, it's just working from home is is easier on your other stress. You don't have to you have no commute, so you can sleep in a little bit longer if you have to or squeeze in in a quick narrative if needed.

00;03;54;14 - 00;04;12;16
Anthony Franzese
And so you're able to kind of keep track. You know, keep your house in order, and your mental health in order a little bit easier when you're dealing with all that stuff. So yeah, I and I can't relate because I never went through it. But if I was going to an office every day after, you know, 3 or 4 or 5 or 6 weeks, it probably would have been harder.

00;04;12;19 - 00;04;31;13
Paul Sullivan
Yeah. You know, I, I often get accused of being too positive on these things and bringing out the positive aspects of being a dad. So I'll just tell you the story that's not at all positive. This past week and we were sort of organizing our three kids who are almost seven, 11 and 15, and we look back to like that stage when we had the baby.

00;04;31;13 - 00;04;48;18
Paul Sullivan
Baby, which is what you have right now because they are a lot more, a lot more portable. But I mean, this is not a question. As much as I can reminisce, like, you can maintain that, and they keep their kid portable. And don't go and have, like, five of them. Keep it to imagine. Monitor.

00;04;48;18 - 00;04;49;00
Paul Sullivan
It's a lot.

00;04;49;00 - 00;05;06;13
Anthony Franzese
Better. Yeah. Yeah. Well, one of the one of the little pieces of advice you gave me when I had you on my show was to travel. Whether whether small. Because. And it's it's been true. We started traveling kind of soon after that, and it's been nice because she's free and she's she's compact and portable, as you said. So it's been good a good piece of advice.

00;05;06;14 - 00;05;20;07
Paul Sullivan
Yeah, I mean forever up until two kids fly for free and then they just sit on your lap. Once they start walking, it's a pain in the ass. And because they're not good at it, they're really bad at walking. But they want to show everybody that they can walk, but they're awful at it. So then it becomes dangerous.

00;05;20;07 - 00;05;44;06
Paul Sullivan
But now awesome time to travel. Yeah. What about being a, you know, your city, dad, you got some news we'll talk about in a second. But you're a city, dad. And, you know, you have the stroller, the stuff, all the crap that we as suburban dads can pile into a car. You've got to sort of equip yourself like you're a Navy Seal and training to go get a cup of coffee.

00;05;44;08 - 00;05;59;02
Paul Sullivan
What is that been like in terms of, you know, the the sort of probably a faster way you moved about the city before having a child and how you go about it now and what's it made you aware of that, that other, you know, non dads might not be aware of living in the city.

00;05;59;04 - 00;06;19;01
Anthony Franzese
Well, I think you realize what is involved when you have to move a baby and not just yourself. Right. Like that's, that's first and but then I think you also realize you can do it really low low touch. So we have the, the car seat that comes off of the stroller. And so my daughter's been in and out of Ubers since she was a, you know, a week old.

00;06;19;05 - 00;06;23;18
Anthony Franzese
We Uber at home from the hospital. So you know she's a she's always been an Uber. You know what.

00;06;23;20 - 00;06;27;11
Paul Sullivan
What's your like what's her rating like. How many stars is your daughter getting from the Uber drivers.

00;06;27;12 - 00;06;42;14
Anthony Franzese
She's she's she's by a she's better overall rating down quite a bit unfortunately. So we're going to have to maybe start a new account at some point. But yeah you know you strap in the you strap it, it's going to even use the base. Right. We strap we should have the seat belt there on the car seat, throw everything in the trunk.

00;06;42;14 - 00;07;05;21
Anthony Franzese
And so we're getting used to that. I think that, you, you become more aware of, like, the just the dangers of the world when you're walking a little baby down the street in the city, which I think you might, you know, you might take for granted elsewhere. When you become a dad or a parent general, you become instantly aware of, like, oh, this really fragile being now needs my protection.

00;07;05;24 - 00;07;23;09
Anthony Franzese
And then when you walk around and hand, you're like, everything could kill us. So I think, I think that that has been, you know, part of the, the, the discussion with my wife that maybe we should, you know, go to the burbs at some point. Because, yeah, it's it's, you know, it's a jungle out there.

00;07;23;11 - 00;07;39;03
Paul Sullivan
Yeah. And that's the next part here. But before we went on air, you were telling me that you're making the move. You're making the move to the land of milk and honey, otherwise known as the the suburbs. That's going to be, an adjustment. And we can never know what we're going to do until we actually do it.

00;07;39;05 - 00;07;51;24
Paul Sullivan
But, what precipitating that? And how do you hope to sort of, you know, recreate the sort of work, worked at life that you've, you've created in your city apartment?

00;07;51;26 - 00;08;14;15
Anthony Franzese
Yeah. So even more than some of the, the logistics we just talked about is actually just quite expensive to live, you know, fairly comfortably in the city, between the larger apartment that you need and daycare or whatever your child care is just our our overhead went up, you know, quite a bit, exponentially in the last year.

00;08;14;17 - 00;08;36;02
Anthony Franzese
So that's been really one of the bigger drivers is just the amount of space you get for for the money and even just, you know, to train right, to train stops outside of the city. I think that the adjustments are going to be tough. I mean, we you know, we were talking about the adjustment into parenthood being tough, but being a suburbanite from being a city guy for, for, you know, almost 20 years.

00;08;36;02 - 00;09;03;01
Anthony Franzese
I think that's going to be tough, too. So I think we're going to be, I think, trying to focus on the positive of our daughter having more space, the ability to to play more freely in various areas and just more, more greenery. I think that when it comes to working, it's going to take a while to get into a routine because there's going to be more driving, driving and childcare now and just trying to figure out how best to to manage all that.

00;09;03;04 - 00;09;14;19
Anthony Franzese
My wife also is going to be potentially taking on a role that does give her the ability to work from home once or twice a week. So that would be interesting. But then we're going to have to figure out how we both work. Work from home together all day.

00;09;14;21 - 00;09;32;05
Paul Sullivan
All right. That's fair enough. Not to me about this. You know, before you had your daughter, you had one job. You kept that job for a while, and recently you got a new job. How has being a father factored in to the career decisions that you've made?

00;09;32;07 - 00;09;57;19
Anthony Franzese
So I, I when I became a father, I felt really, pulled in two directions of this desire to be with my daughter. More like nothing's more important than that, but also this desire to provide for her. Take care of her. Right. So that you got that it was hard work. Right. So on the one hand, it's like you want to work hard, drive her, but the more you're working, the less you're with it.

00;09;57;19 - 00;10;24;22
Anthony Franzese
So there's sort of these two opposing poles. I like sales and as you mentioned in the beginning, it does give me some autonomy over my schedule. So that's something that I'm sticking with, because the ability to work from home and create my schedule a bit gives me the flexibility to take care of things in the house, drop my daughter off and pick her up from daycare and and you know, if she's sick, take care of her and things like that.

00;10;24;25 - 00;10;43;17
Anthony Franzese
But I will say with that, there's a very clear goal that I have to achieve in sales. And so I could I could take the whole the whole week off if I really want to, but I then if there's if there's no number at the end that I've achieved, then that's it's pretty clear. You know, that I've not reached a goal and that there's repercussions to that.

00;10;43;20 - 00;11;09;26
Anthony Franzese
So when I look for a job and I was looking for something a little more stable because I spent a lot of time in the early startup world, like this series, a kind of environment and that can sometimes have more flexibility because there's just no layers of bureaucracy at all. But comes with certainly less stability and more volatility.

00;11;09;27 - 00;11;28;11
Anthony Franzese
And just you're at the whims of, you know, fewer people and easier to get pulled in by market forces. And so I was looking for something that was a little more stable, a little more established, but still had the, you know, the remote flexibility and just the individual contributor sales role.

00;11;28;14 - 00;11;50;07
Paul Sullivan
In some ways, being in sales, I mean, sales is tangible. You're either selling what you're supposed to sell or you're not. Does that, take some of the pressure off of the sway between, you know, work and fatherhood? Or does it is the pressure just shift to the to something else?

00;11;50;09 - 00;12;18;27
Anthony Franzese
Well, I think the pressure is there because they're, you know, when you're like most sales people don't really rest easy. Right? So unless you have like really had a, a really amazing quarter or year, however you're quoted, you're kind of always restless and wanting to get another deal and build build more pipeline. And so I think that it it, it is a stressor because at the end of the day, it's like I need to close a deal to, to feed to feed the family.

00;12;18;29 - 00;12;24;28
Anthony Franzese
Yeah. But like I said, it comes with that, that benefit of of a little more flexibility and autonomy.

00;12;25;01 - 00;12;41;27
Paul Sullivan
You know, when you were moving into this, this new role at this new job, did it come up your your role as a dad? Did you talk about, you know, how, you know, being a dad is sort of integral to who you are as a, as a person, not just as a as a worker.

00;12;42;00 - 00;12;59;18
Anthony Franzese
Yeah. It did. So I asked about some of the, you know, the general policies, first of all, even the paternity leave policy. I'm not making any announcement here, but just in general, I was wondering, you know, what what that was. I also, through my interview process and the people I met with, just learned that that was a part of the culture.

00;12;59;18 - 00;13;18;20
Anthony Franzese
So I did, you know, it's something that you wanted that, but it was kind of being presented to me, so I didn't have to really do too much digging. Everybody on the team, or also that most of the people on my team are parents themselves. And so I was really kind of got the sense that, yeah, it's of course we all work hard and we all have those two goals to hit.

00;13;18;20 - 00;13;37;04
Anthony Franzese
But this company understands that, you know, people are people and we have families, we have lives outside of work. And I think that the concept of like working to live versus living to work is something that I've always thought a lot about. And you can't really ask that. I mean, I don't think you can, but I guess you could.

00;13;37;04 - 00;13;59;23
Anthony Franzese
But it's hard to ask your future boss. Hey, like, I, I've really like to work. To live. Not not live to work. That's cool with you, right? On the one hand, I think you want to be clear with what your expectations are. But the other hand, you know, you're you're being hired to do a job, so you have to at least seem like you want to do it right.

00;13;59;23 - 00;14;09;13
Anthony Franzese
So I think that it was helpful for me that it was so abundantly clear and present it to me, so I didn't have to just kind of like, ask directly all of those things.

00;14;09;15 - 00;14;15;02
Paul Sullivan
I mean, was that a deciding factor in moving to this company the way, the way they thought about family and parenthood.

00;14;15;04 - 00;14;29;22
Anthony Franzese
For sure? Yeah, I think that that was a big part of it. And even on one of the interviews I was on, like their kid came on for, for a second. And so, you know, you get the sense that, okay, if I, if I'm in a position where my daughter sick and I'm the one taking care of her, it's okay if she's I call, she's okay if I, if I move things.

00;14;29;24 - 00;14;40;14
Anthony Franzese
I think that that's really important, especially in this like lead that kind of role where I'm more likely to be taking care of things if if something comes up.

00;14;40;17 - 00;14;56;28
Paul Sullivan
You know, we often talk at the company dads, but we go in and work with companies that you can have the absolute best designed, you know, parental leave policy. You can have all the policies that are set up that make you look like the most appealing company out there, but it only takes 1 or 2 managers to say something ridiculous.

00;14;56;28 - 00;15;24;21
Paul Sullivan
And it's all out the window. They go, okay, they don't really mean this. Your story is the flip side of that before you. As you if I understood correctly, before you're even asking some of these questions, they were showing you, they weren't telling you, they were showing you that this was a culture. What were some of the things that stood out to you, some of you you talked about, you know, a manager's child coming on a call or some of the other things that they sort of brought up unprovoked that made you think, okay, this is good company, this company I want to work for.

00;15;24;23 - 00;15;46;15
Anthony Franzese
I think that just kind of asking non-business questions about me trying to understand a little bit more about who I am and what I'm about and, you know, introducing themselves in that way as well, sharing things about them and how they like to spend their time. I think that you can get a sense for if they're interested in, like the whole, you know, view you as a whole person or not.

00;15;46;18 - 00;16;05;10
Anthony Franzese
So I think that was a really big part of it. The other one is also, you know, Glassdoor for anybody who's looking for jobs, I think Glassdoor has been a great resource. For me. And so you get to learn a little bit more about the culture there. It's kind of like Yelp where you I guess you get a disgruntled person who might not be fully reflecting the way things are, but I found it to be valuable.

00;16;05;10 - 00;16;35;13
Anthony Franzese
I found it in retrospect to be accurate when I've worked at a place and then look at reviews. So that helped as well. And then the other thing I think that they, they were doing is, like under not asking too pointedly about like work ethic and just like, like, wanting to know like how specifically I performed at elsewhere.

00;16;35;13 - 00;16;49;05
Anthony Franzese
So it was really more about like, you know, what's your strategy? Like, what do you what do you how do you approach the role? How do you approach your territory, but not necessarily like demanding to know exactly like what I've done in the past?

00;16;49;07 - 00;17;13;07
Paul Sullivan
That's great, this part. But pivot for a second and talk about your podcast that the folks is, you know, as the title says, successful working parents. You've done a bunch of these. Now, I was I was fortunate enough to be a guest here. I thoroughly enjoyed it. But when you, you know, the one of the great benefits of being to talk to people or something you're passionate about day in and day out is by the end you realize, okay, I know some stuff, you know?

00;17;13;07 - 00;17;27;29
Paul Sullivan
And again, these three, 4 or 5, six things are coming up again and again when you talk to these successful working parents, what are the things that have resonated with you the most that that they've been doing in, in their own lives?

00;17;28;02 - 00;17;47;27
Anthony Franzese
Yeah, that's a great question. I, I it's almost a year now, so it'll be about I think I've done 50 interviews. I have a couple more left to do, for the, for the one year anniversary. But I've learned a lot now that it started even right before my daughter was born. So it's been a really great educational resource for me.

00;17;47;29 - 00;18;09;09
Anthony Franzese
The first one is just in the title itself, successful working parents. A lot of people are, hesitant to call themselves that or or identify as that. And maybe we should change the title, but it's interesting to see, you know, regardless of whom speaking to, you know, CEOs of companies, entrepreneurs, and, you know, very successful people, everybody's just really trying to figure it out.

00;18;09;13 - 00;18;31;17
Anthony Franzese
And I think that that's the one of the great things that I know the audience has appreciated about the show is just seeing how other people are doing it and and normalizing that it is, you know, it is hard and it is something to to be figured out with. Some of the things that come up. A lot are on that note, people saying like, be okay with not being okay or like not being an A+ and everything.

00;18;31;20 - 00;18;52;12
Anthony Franzese
Again, if people are successful, they had a successful career. I think it's hard to then transition into parenthood where you're you don't feel like you're a rock star parent, and then you're also not a rock star employee anymore, rock star business person anymore. So that's a big one. Just being able to raise your hand and ask for help, I think is important in life in general, and it definitely is something that all these working parents have shared.

00;18;52;15 - 00;19;16;12
Anthony Franzese
And then time management, how did it how do they how do they block out their time? Do they, do they schedule like actual self-care into their day? Do they have some arrangement with their partner where they take turns, doing things for themselves? Or, you know, how are they able to control their calendar in a way that gives them some sense of flexibility or just just sanity, that they have it under control?

00;19;16;14 - 00;19;38;27
Paul Sullivan
And the last one is really, intriguing to me because we've talked a lot about, you know, people who are leading by calendar at at work and by parenting publicly, it can have an outsized impact upon, your equivalent, your superior, your subordinates. But when you talk to the successful working parents, how are they calendaring in time for themselves?

00;19;38;27 - 00;19;56;22
Paul Sullivan
How do they value whatever how whatever form that takes? How do they value that versus an obligation at work? And obligation, you know, in parenthood, I mean, there are a lot of fun things we do with our children, but they're also a lot of obligation things you have to do. How do they fit in that, that time to sort of recharge?

00;19;56;24 - 00;20;15;12
Anthony Franzese
Yeah. Well, so first of all, it goes back to what we were saying before. It is something that should be modeled from the top down. Right. So like when you're when you're vetting a company and you see, you know, when you're manager, you know, you, you know, your manager puts kid's graduation on their calendar or whatever it is that they're blocking off, you get a sense that, okay, it will be a, you know, it'll be supportive when I do that.

00;20;15;14 - 00;20;40;28
Anthony Franzese
I think that the transparent calendar is a big thing. And so people are are putting what they're doing, even if it's if it's yoga at at at 11 a.m.. Right. So I think that having that level of calendar transparency that has to it does have to, I think, be supported from the top down so that people feel like it's okay to show that, hey, like, I'm taking I'm working all week and I'm taking 45 minutes out on Thursday for myself, and it's not a big deal.

00;20;41;00 - 00;21;01;01
Anthony Franzese
Right? So I think that giving people the the encouragement to do that is a really a big one. And then I think it's also in the culture of, okay, what are like meeting like can't move or shouldn't, right. For most of our people can move things. You know, I talked to a surgeon who did a lot harder for him to move his meetings.

00;21;01;01 - 00;21;25;20
Anthony Franzese
But, for the most part, things move. So like. Yeah, what what could I what would I not want to I should not move. What can I and what, what what if, if is okay to do asynchronously or if I have my kid with me, is it okay like I have a couple of minutes tomorrow where, my daughter is actually a little under the weather, and I'm like, okay, well, these two meetings, I think it'd be okay if I'm if I have it with me or I'm taking care of it during it.

00;21;25;20 - 00;21;35;25
Anthony Franzese
So I think building into the culture is really important transparency of the calendar and just making, you know, understanding what meetings can be blended and what meetings can't be fed.

00;21;35;25 - 00;21;41;05
Paul Sullivan
Assume that the surgeon can't take, a child to work. Is that, like something they can't you.

00;21;41;07 - 00;21;54;25
Anthony Franzese
Can't do that either. Yeah. So that was that was very interesting because that conversation was about what they were referred to as the default parent, which is obviously similar to the Tilly dad, though in that case, the the mom was, was the default parent.

00;21;54;28 - 00;22;30;02
Paul Sullivan
Yeah. And it's been great. Let me ask you this question here. And you know, your wife, we decided she the principal of a high school, great job. But, you know, teachers don't have any, any flexibility. So when your daughter was born and you went into this role being the dad, was this a conversation that the two of you had, or is this just something where you knew that you had the flexibility or you knew you had the the different, you know, skill set where this would be something where you could you could do it and excel at it while also excelling at work.

00;22;30;04 - 00;22;51;20
Anthony Franzese
I think it was a little bit of a natural gravitation. I've always been a little type. I guess type is a positive way to say, but I guess like anal and controlling is the more negative way to say it. But you know, it has been sort of yeah, like those things. And so I already was, you know, doing the laundry and cooking and cleaning because I just like to handle those things.

00;22;51;20 - 00;23;13;02
Anthony Franzese
And it was the same situation just because we'd have a kid. She was still at an office all day, and I wasn't. So I naturally gravitated towards some of those things. So I think that that was the the understanding at the time was, I'm going to be picking up these, you know, some of these things. And then and that's okay, because she finds a lot of fulfillment in her career.

00;23;13;02 - 00;23;32;13
Anthony Franzese
And and she, she doesn't just see it as like a means to an end. She really sees this something that she, she's, you know, called to do in a lot of ways. And so I'm happy to let her do that. While I, you know, work my job and then pick up some of the, some of the domestic duties on my end.

00;23;32;16 - 00;23;54;17
Paul Sullivan
Anthony, friends, you've been a great guest on the company Dads podcast. One final question for you. Other young dads like yourself who are listening to this and wondering, like, can I do this? Can I swing it? What's going to be difficult? What will I excel at? What's the advice that you give those, you know, dads to be, from lessons that you've learned over over the past.

00;23;54;17 - 00;24;20;01
Anthony Franzese
Year, this advice is to really overcommunicate with your partner. I think that it's easy to just fall into into certain rhythms and not checking in with each other on on what you know, what's working for both of you and what's not. It's really important. Again, going back to like time for yourself to to communicate with your partner on what you're both going to do that for each other, and then when you're going to chip in so that the other can do that.

00;24;20;04 - 00;24;28;05
Anthony Franzese
So that really that really can't be understated is over communicating. Any, you know, getting ahead of being proactive with it.

00;24;28;07 - 00;24;34;07
Paul Sullivan
Yeah. Anthony friends is thank you again for being my guest today on the Company Death Podcast.

00;24;34;10 - 00;24;36;25
Anthony Franzese
Thank you for having me. It was fun.

00;24;36;27 - 00;25;02;09
Paul Sullivan
Thank you for listening to the Company of Dads podcast. I also want to thank the people who make this podcast and everything else that we do. The company of dads, possible, Helder, Mira, who is our audio producer Lindsey Decker handles all of our social media. Terry Brennan, who's helping us with the newsletter and audience acquisition, Emily Servin, who is our web maestro, and of course, Evan Roosevelt, who is working side by side with me.

00;25;02;09 - 00;25;19;28
Paul Sullivan
And many of the things that we do here at the Company of Dads. It's a great team. And we're, we're just trying to bring you the best in fatherhood. Remember, the one stop shop for everything is our newsletter, the dad sign up at the Company of dads.com backslash. The dad. Thank you again for listening.