EP141: Lessons From A Lead Dad in the Mad Men Era

Interview with Pete Hunsinger / CRO of Condé Nast - Entrepreneur

HOSTED BY PAUL SULLIVAN

Want to know how to be a Lead Dad with a demanding career, four kids and a great marriage? One thing's certain: Getting it right doesn't happen without effort. As a publisher for Condé Nast in the heyday of glossy magazines, Pete Hunsinger spent a large amount of his career working to get that balance right. Now, looking back on it all - with the added perspective of being a new grandfather - Pete shares what he learned. Listen for a master class in how to be an in-demand dad.

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Transcript

00;00;01;07 - 00;00;27;21
Pete Hunsinger
The biggest thing that you want to concentrate on, on being a father is one to let kids be kids as long as you can. They have a lifetime to be an adult. And just don't don't speed the process, you know, let them play with the toy soldiers. Let them play with their younger siblings, you know, and just the fantasy worlds they come up with.

00;00;27;23 - 00;00;45;04
Pete Hunsinger
Take all the challenges of that are coming in terms of growing up and, going to a new school and all that. Let let that fade away. Let them be kids.

00;00;45;06 - 00;01;07;02
Paul Sullivan
Welcome to the Company of Dads podcast. After 120 plus episodes, we're doing something different this season. I'm still your host, Paul Sullivan, and we're still focused on lead dads, working moms, and how small changes at home or work can have a big impact on their lives. What's new is each episode now promises to deliver actionable advice on some area of concern at home or work.

00;01;07;05 - 00;01;42;05
Paul Sullivan
Short. Direct. Again. Actionable. Five questions, five answers. Today our guest is Pete Hunsinger, dad of four grandfather of two Conde Nast legend and entrepreneur trying to make better products for everyone. Pete did something many dads would love to do. Myself included. Yes, he plays golf with his daughter, but he also gets to go on golf trips with her. After a legendary career at Conning Asset Magazines and his gourmet Architectural Digest, Vanity Fair, brides, GQ and Golf Digest, he's the chief communications officer for Everyone's Earth.

00;01;42;10 - 00;01;49;09
Paul Sullivan
Think diapers, dryer sheets with all the plastics in them. Welcome, Pete, to the company Dads podcast.

00;01;49;11 - 00;01;51;12
Pete Hunsinger
Thanks, Paul. Nice to be with you.

00;01;51;14 - 00;02;08;04
Paul Sullivan
So four kids, two grandkids, another, grandson on the way. When you look back and you look at your own kids, what is the biggest mistake most young fathers make that can be avoided?

00;02;08;06 - 00;02;31;04
Pete Hunsinger
Gosh, I don't know if it's a mistake, but I think the the biggest thing that you want to concentrate on, on being a father, is one, to let kids be kids as long as you can. They have a lifetime to be an adult. And just don't don't speed the process, you know, let them play with the toy soldiers.

00;02;31;04 - 00;03;00;21
Pete Hunsinger
Let them play with their younger siblings, you know, and just the fantasy worlds. They come up with. Take all the challenges of that are coming in terms of growing up and, going to a new school and all that. Let let that fade away. Let them be kids and take them to Disney World and enjoy all that. And the other thing that we've found is sometimes you can in that process you can be too lenient.

00;03;00;23 - 00;03;27;26
Pete Hunsinger
Kids want limits. They don't say, hey, dad, you know, don't let me do this. But they love, you know, having that limit say, gee, I can't get that by the folks because they really don't want to do it. You know, sometimes it might be a sleepover at somebody's house that, you know, was a little too wild even for them, or that's venturing into the things where they have to make decisions they don't want to.

00;03;27;28 - 00;03;43;00
Pete Hunsinger
But I would say just staying focused on letting them be kids and keeping the limits that they secretly one is, you know, avoiding that. Yeah. You know, that can be a pitfall.

00;03;43;02 - 00;04;04;13
Paul Sullivan
That's great. And question two flows right from that one. I mean, your kids grew up into cannon, Connecticut, great town where my kids are growing up. But it's an intense town at times, particularly with kids and sporting activities. And just like you said, like kids be kids as long as they can. But, you know, practically, you know, how how do you manage that out of parents manage that in towns like, you know, you can.

00;04;04;13 - 00;04;20;05
Paul Sullivan
And there, you know, scores of these towns around the country where there is that pressure, you know, it is. I'm not gonna let my kid be kid. I can't I'm going to have my kid play, you know, come in as publisher and get dressed up and get ready for the real world there. How do you manage that? Within your own family.

00;04;20;05 - 00;04;29;19
Paul Sullivan
But also from that, you know, external pressure that's coming from perhaps to to push them, a little bit, you know, too far, too fast.

00;04;29;21 - 00;04;58;10
Pete Hunsinger
You know, you're right. It's a competitive town. And not just for the kids, you know. And I think that, you know, like anything, it's communication. Even though I was was working, I kind of set it up so that I did the dawn patrol with with our team. You know, I was on the ladder very early 5:30 a.m. train every day and often had activities at night.

00;04;58;10 - 00;05;24;26
Pete Hunsinger
But I made sure that I got home three nights a week for dinner and for bath and that, you know, that kind of helped, us have that dialog where things would come up where you could address these issues and, and, you know, not pressure them into, a lot of the things that, again, they, they don't want to do.

00;05;24;29 - 00;05;51;16
Pete Hunsinger
That meal time is so key when things come up where they're dealing with these competitive issues. And, you know, not everybody can do it. One of the things we did is when we had to remodel our 1950s house to make room for an expanding family, and we added a fireplace that is like at table height next to our dinner table.

00;05;51;19 - 00;06;24;08
Pete Hunsinger
And, you know, darned if that thing didn't take dinner from 20 minutes to two an hour because it's just like, Joe Strummer of The clash. He call that campfire a conversation lamp. And that's what it did. I mean, it's a silly little thing, but boy, did that work. The other thing we did is Jane's family had had this little old fishing cottage, you know, outdoor shower.

00;06;24;11 - 00;06;48;24
Pete Hunsinger
You know, no insulation, no heat, no air conditioning, screened in porch, two bedrooms. It was, it was a kit from the 50s that was an old fishing village right by the Shinnecock Indian Reservation. So every summer, we'd take the kids out there for 2 or 3 weeks. And that was a total break from New Canaan. You know, they could.

00;06;48;26 - 00;07;12;09
Pete Hunsinger
They'd read books, no television. They'd go spear, crab, spend the whole day at the beach. And that was such a, you know, being able to change, get them out of that world of, of a kind of a high performing alpha community like we had that was rejuvenating for them. And I think those things really worked to help address that.

00;07;12;11 - 00;07;30;03
Paul Sullivan
I love that because, you know, I think about my own kids, like when you get out and you do something, you know, different. Like you were chatting before this went on, that I was at Disney last week and it's not Disney like I don't care less about it being somewhere and the memories and it breaks up the routine because otherwise, you know, it just kind of goes.

00;07;30;03 - 00;07;36;15
Paul Sullivan
It's one thing after another. At school, it's an activity. It's summer camp. But having that escape out to Long Island's amazing.

00;07;36;17 - 00;07;52;20
Pete Hunsinger
And this was like it was camping and it just it just tore down all the, the pressures and really a lot of fun. We eventually bought it from James sister. So, you know, now they still go out there and love it.

00;07;52;22 - 00;08;10;11
Pete Hunsinger
But it's because of those childhood memories. Yeah. You know, so you're making a memory that is. It was a total change of pace from, you know, an air conditioned being able to watch TV, having all your toys and video games. Right. It was terrific for them.

00;08;10;13 - 00;08;31;19
Paul Sullivan
I love it. All right. Question three and you touched on this again in the previous one. But you know, you you came up working at conning us in that, that company's, you know, heyday. How did you balance, you know, being a father with your career as a rising star on the on the business side because, as you said, you know, you would have things to do at night.

00;08;31;20 - 00;08;48;16
Paul Sullivan
So, so talk about that. Because I think now that we're in this world where, the, the work from home is becoming more hybrid and people are sort of, you know, rethinking how we're going to work. How did you balance it back then, and what are the tips that you have for for today?

00;08;48;19 - 00;09;19;16
Pete Hunsinger
You know, the there was a lot involved in that because it was I'm sure that has heard the reputation of of can be nasty and we were able to the great thing about it, it was very much, a decentralized organization. My job was publisher, which I ran the business side of it. So I reported to, the CEO and Cy Newhouse, and we'd have a meeting once a month.

00;09;19;18 - 00;09;44;26
Pete Hunsinger
So the biggest way I dealt with it was build a culture that was pertain to our individual, brand, not to Condé Nast. And and we were able to avoid it. You know, I had the reputation as being a nice guy, which is the kiss of death. But I did make it work for it, because even some of the guys say you like Pete competes harder than anybody else.

00;09;44;29 - 00;10;11;03
Pete Hunsinger
He just goes about it. A different way. And, you know, it's you have to, you know, the kids have to understand what we do. You got to balance your time. And, you know, I always had pictures of the family up in the office, and I think that was actually a good thing. So my team members, you know, they saw high value that.

00;10;11;09 - 00;10;18;00
Pete Hunsinger
And I think that developed, an aura of trust with the people I was working with.

00;10;18;03 - 00;10;19;02
Paul Sullivan
Yeah.

00;10;19;04 - 00;10;45;04
Pete Hunsinger
Because they really knew who I was. And I think that's probably the biggest thing both the kids and the company do was I went about it a certain way. And, you know, there there were challenges with sometimes that GQ and Vanity Fair, you know, people say, well, dad, what's this? You know, how come the woman isn't dressed in the cover?

00;10;45;06 - 00;11;05;08
Pete Hunsinger
And I said, don't look at that. You know? It worked out. And, I think it in one sense, it helped them read more. And, look at, you know, I'd get a mad magazine and highlights, which were all big back in the day and and that kind of thing.

00;11;05;11 - 00;11;13;23
Paul Sullivan
I love that that being a nice guy was the kiss of death, because I can imagine every time you just fire somebody randomly, like, all right, he's having a bad day. Like.

00;11;13;25 - 00;11;39;19
Pete Hunsinger
You know, we used to, have, you know, you put the cover of the magazine on, the, the signature of your email. And so one time, our pastor, I was on a committee at church and sent an email around to people. And the cover, you know, Lindsay Lohan, you know, in a bikini, chopping cherries on a cutting board.

00;11;39;19 - 00;11;49;28
Pete Hunsinger
And my pastor was good. How come you let a pornographer work on you? So I kept that from the kids, too.

00;11;50;00 - 00;12;10;20
Paul Sullivan
You know, following on that year, you see, your professional career, you know, did an amazing run at kind of nice. But what was the impetus to start, you know, this non publishing business, the the the dryer sheets, the diapers, the socks. Before that. What was the impetus to start something that was, you know, a product per se after already having, you know, such an amazing run.

00;12;10;23 - 00;12;39;12
Pete Hunsinger
You know, it just I wanted to do something. I had a good friend who, I was on the board of his company while I was at Conde Nast, and he told me this dream about, you know, that we're still working on of substituting natural fibers for for consumer goods. That will address a lot of the carbon issues, the environmental issues.

00;12;39;12 - 00;13;13;11
Pete Hunsinger
You know, the less plastic we use, the better off we are, as a taking care of the planet and the conservation, sustainability. And it just, you know, it was the dawn of when I left Condé Nast. It was kind of the dawn of the direct to consumer age via social platforms and all that. You know, in, the mid, 20 teens, you know, you could put anything on Facebook and make money.

00;13;13;11 - 00;13;42;12
Pete Hunsinger
It's since they've re monetized it now they can get top dollar and we didn't quite hit it, but I think it was just the dream of, of doing something more on the consumer side that it's tangible. You know, the magazine was but you know, that era changed as well. And just, just the thought of really doing something good that could be a strong business but also have a positive impact.

00;13;42;14 - 00;14;13;27
Paul Sullivan
Yeah, I love it. Question for, you know, one of my favorite things is to find time to do things separately, which each of my three kids and I know you like that as well. And of your for at least one of them plays, plays golf with you because I've seen you out there, whether you see me out there with one of my daughters, you know, what tips do you have for fathers with, you know, multiple kids, two, three, 4 or 5 kids to get time alone with them and talk about you know, how valuable that's been to you and your kids over the years that that sort of one on one, alone time

00;14;13;27 - 00;14;16;22
Paul Sullivan
when they're part of, of a bigger family?

00;14;16;25 - 00;14;43;28
Pete Hunsinger
Yeah. You know, I think it's you're exactly right. You got to find the the unique share that you have with with each of your kids. And, you know, that evolved. But it will it will start with one idea, like with my son, you know, we had the Bengals because I grew up in Cincinnati, but, you know, he when he was a little kid, he wore his, Peter Warrick jersey to school.

00;14;43;28 - 00;15;08;07
Pete Hunsinger
One day, he came home in tears because that's when the Bengals were so bad. So eventually we got a Super Bowl. We haven't won. But, you know, just, in December, we went to Dallas to see the Bengals play, the the Cowboys and stayed there. And that was fun. With Emma, our oldest, we we had bike riding and we used to ride in the, in Westport.

00;15;08;07 - 00;15;29;06
Pete Hunsinger
They had the Tony Fenton bike ride. And, you know, you go ride all around the Long Island Sound through all of Westport and back into the hills for 26 miles and do it as a, as a fundraiser. With with Olivia, we had golf, you know, she just she started that and picked it up. I think that was from her.

00;15;29;09 - 00;15;57;08
Pete Hunsinger
Her field hockey days and and that kind of thing. So having that unique thing with, with George, it was books and reading and, that kind of stuff. And then it just finding silly little things, that you can invent, I think sometimes, like at the beach, we'll have it could be throwing rocks at something that's floating out in the pond and sea.

00;15;57;11 - 00;16;06;03
Pete Hunsinger
Closest, you know, just the when you can do something out of nothing, you can kind of come up with those unique shares.

00;16;06;05 - 00;16;19;22
Paul Sullivan
But to tell the truth, your, you know, you did lovely things for your first three kids. But when it came to Olivia, did you, like, put the pressure on or like, look, one of you needs to play golf with me. Come on, dad wants to play golf. You know who wants to be the favorite child?

00;16;19;24 - 00;16;43;04
Pete Hunsinger
She saw it. I think she saw the gap. And, you know, she. I think she loves the whole gestalt around golf, too, which she's come around to. And then the combination of she's very active in yoga and played field hockey. Those two things, you know I did and it it's like she discovered after a little while she can be good at that.

00;16;43;04 - 00;16;46;08
Pete Hunsinger
And you know, she loves the recognition.

00;16;46;10 - 00;17;02;24
Paul Sullivan
Yeah I love this because it's something that I just I think because I'm an only child, I just intuitively want it to have individual things to do with my daughters and people ask me like, you know, do you ever play paddle? And I said, I only play paddle with my middle daughter because she likes it, and we'll go once a week.

00;17;02;24 - 00;17;26;03
Paul Sullivan
We have a standing appointment and we go at 5:00 at three Wednesday. And it we're not we're not. Our goal is not to get any better. We could care less. Our goal is to, you know, hit around with one of the pros, be silly and have fun. And they all it's funny, like when they know that each child has something individual to do with dad, they want to have their individual thing.

00;17;26;10 - 00;17;39;25
Paul Sullivan
And like you're saying about the, you know, the fireplace at dinner time, it's in those rides back and forth when there's nobody competing, there's nobody, you know, fussing where what you hear from them is goal. You hear all these stories that you'd never hear otherwise.

00;17;39;28 - 00;18;06;03
Pete Hunsinger
And you don't want to. Especially with daughters. I think, you know, self-esteem is such an issue these days. And I really believe that, you know, we both have three daughters that, a girl's self-esteem, her self-worth. It's all centered around her relationship with her father. As long as I know I'm loved by my dad. Okay.

00;18;06;05 - 00;18;06;21
Paul Sullivan


00;18;06;24 - 00;18;09;12
Pete Hunsinger
You know, that's so key for them.

00;18;09;14 - 00;18;33;05
Paul Sullivan
Yeah. You know, question five. You know, you and I share another core belief and that, you know, kids are watching what we do way more than they're listening to what we say. What were some of the strategies, you know, you use particularly you joke about the, you know, the racy Vanity Fair covers, but yeah, I don't do that.

00;18;33;07 - 00;18;51;06
Paul Sullivan
You know, I don't cut cherries naked. None of you. That's not a good idea. But, you know, what are some strategies you used when your kids were were growing up? And, you know, you know, three of your kids have kids now, you know, what are some of the strategies that you see them, you know, using that maybe they learn from from you or your wife.

00;18;51;09 - 00;19;22;10
Pete Hunsinger
But never forget, you know, I went to, and when I was at gourmet, I went to a travel conference in 1992, and, it was post the first, Iraq war. And Colin Powell was thinking about running for president, and he spoke at this convention, and he did his, you know, his stump speech that he always and his whole thing was about, when will our kids learn that or when will we, as I'm say?

00;19;22;10 - 00;19;54;24
Pete Hunsinger
He said, when will we as a society learn that our kids do as we do, not as we say? And he the he built the whole speech around it. It was the guy just exuded leadership. I was I was so impressed with him and kind of sorry he didn't run. But anyway, I think among those many strategies, one of the best things is let them see a great relationship with your spouse.

00;19;54;27 - 00;20;29;04
Pete Hunsinger
You know, if they see, you know, that you work together, that you care about it. If you can model what a good human, you know, lasting marital relationship is about that, it goes so far. When our daughter had her interview at Emma, our oldest, when she had her, admissions interview at Wake Forest, back when they do it live, you know, we were dropped her off at admissions or waiting in the car and.

00;20;29;06 - 00;20;41;19
Pete Hunsinger
She came back into the car and we said, how'd it go? She said, oh, I nailed it. I said, well, what was what did they ask? And she said, well, they asked this, what's the best thing about your life? And she said, my answer was, my mom and dad really love each other.

00;20;41;21 - 00;20;44;12
Paul Sullivan
That's a remark that was.

00;20;44;15 - 00;20;45;08
Pete Hunsinger
You know.

00;20;45;11 - 00;20;48;21
Paul Sullivan
She nailed it. But you want I mean, that that's weird right there.

00;20;48;23 - 00;21;12;03
Pete Hunsinger
But I think that is, you know, of the many things, but also just showing them that they, you know, that they can trust you. You know, that, that you're there for them and that, you know, acknowledge when you fail, you know, and being able to, to forgive them, you know, is, are really the fundamentals to it all.

00;21;12;03 - 00;21;28;27
Pete Hunsinger
But I think it's just, you know, love conquers all, doesn't it? As long as they know they're loved and you exhibit that with and and are consistent without any kind of hypocrisy that's, you know, that would bring it home.

00;21;28;29 - 00;21;51;19
Paul Sullivan
Pete Hunt, singer data for grandad of two. Soon to be three. What a great time having you on the company. Dad's podcast today. But we say five questions. But for you, I have a bonus question that I want to throw out. You know, one of your colleagues winning former colleagues at Connie Nass was the legendary editor of Vanity Fair, Graydon Carter.

00;21;51;22 - 00;22;00;15
Paul Sullivan
He has a memoir coming out right about the time when this podcast will air. Ever get a parenting tip from from Graydon?

00;22;00;17 - 00;22;34;13
Pete Hunsinger
Well, I've a lot to say about that in the sense that, you know, we worked together for three great years and, the name of this book is When the Going Was Good. And it really is true. I mean, it was an extraordinary time because, you know, a page of advertising was close to $100,000 and we sold and, you know, by the hundreds and, you know, especially at Vanity Fair, which was right at the height of the zeitgeist.

00;22;34;13 - 00;23;20;24
Pete Hunsinger
And, you know, Graydon is a fantastic father. He really cares about his kids. And he understands the importance of of exhibiting family. You know, we create a program called Campaign Hollywood during the Oscars. And so we go out there and we'd have he we both had a suite at the, at the Beverly Hills Hotel where the kids stayed, and we were there for two weeks because we'd have events the whole time leading up to the Vanity Fair Oscar party, and we both had cabanas at the pool at the Beverly Hills right next to each other.

00;23;20;26 - 00;23;45;10
Pete Hunsinger
And our kids were there, and some of the kids were the same age, you know, and I'll never forget, Olivia stealing French fries off of Clive Davis, dinner and stuff like that. And Georgia and Brownwood took baths together, and, you know, he just, you know, great. And, Maureen Dowd just wrote an article where everything she said about him is true.

00;23;45;10 - 00;24;08;24
Pete Hunsinger
The first time I met him, when I was at gourmet at, the Royalton, which was the Candy Nast cafeteria during the, the Madison Avenue days and Times Square. You know, somebody introduced me to him. He stood up, shook my hand and said, nice to meet you. When he had no clue I was. Who does that anymore?

00;24;08;24 - 00;24;44;17
Pete Hunsinger
You know, and he just he really cared about his kids. He's involved with them, you know, several of them worked with him at Air mail. You know, I'll never forget. I think it was spike got up at his farewell dinner at Balthazar when he left Vanity Fair and he talked about, you know, Graydon had had a rough day, and he came home and, you know, there was a package waiting from him that had come from, you know, was hand wrapped and all that.

00;24;44;17 - 00;25;11;07
Pete Hunsinger
Something like he got off eBay and he said his day totally changed. He said, wow, I got it. This vintage string I've been looking for, you know, the great had all these details that that he cared about. And he always talked about his kids. And it just you knew he really cared about him and he cared about family, which I think was, you know, the home run of of him.

00;25;11;10 - 00;25;25;11
Pete Hunsinger
And, you know, it was just it was very counter to a lot of the typical Connie ness bravado that they'll be looking at. But I'm sure it's going to be a great read. As good as it gets.

00;25;25;13 - 00;25;30;08
Paul Sullivan
Thank you again, Pete, for joining me on the Company of Dads podcast. It's been a blast.

00;25;30;10 - 00;25;50;02
Pete Hunsinger
Okay, Paul, thank you. And congratulations on the community, your building. And, you know, it's, it's impossible to underestimate the power of parenting and what it means for a future generation. So, you know, you're you're doing great work. And, thank you for that.

00;25;50;05 - 00;25;52;19
Paul Sullivan
Thanks. Be.

00;25;52;21 - 00;26;10;17
Paul Sullivan
Thank you for listening to another episode of the Company of Dads podcast. I really appreciate you tuning in week after week to really use this moment here, to thank the people who make it possible. Number one, of course, Held Mirror, who is our podcast editor. We also have Skip Terry home to many of you know from Lead Diaries.

00;26;10;17 - 00;26;33;21
Paul Sullivan
He's taken over our social media. Terry Brennan is helping us with our audience development. And Emily Servant is there, each and every day helping with the web development and can't do any of this without, an amazing board, of advisors. So I just want to say thank you to all of you who help. And I want to say thank you to everyone who listened.

00;26;33;21 - 00;26;37;04
Paul Sullivan
And, hopefully you'll tune in again next week. Thanks so much.