EP147: Guiding Kids (and Parents) Through College Admissions

Interview with Lindsay Tanne / Founder of LogicPrep

HOSTED BY PAUL SULLIVAN

Applying to college is stressful - for students and parents. But does it really need to be? This week, Paul sits down with Lindsay Tanne, founder of LogicPrep, a globally recognized educational consultancy she started as a student at Harvard, growing a team of advisors, coaches, and tutors who’ve helped thousands of families successfully navigate the college admissions process. She discusses the most (and least) helpful ways parents can support their kids, and protecting mental and emotional health during this high-stakes journey.

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Transcript

00;00;00;03 - 00;00;26;24
Lindsay Tanner
Sometimes, you know, teenagers think I'm not interesting. So how will I ever have something to say? And so what? We really reassure our students and their parents of is one that everybody's interesting. And I genuinely believe that to be true. But also this is part of the work that we're doing as early as ninth grade to really create a thoughtful, intentional narrative in partnership with the student.

00;00;26;24 - 00;00;40;14
Lindsay Tanner
And that doesn't mean crafting the perfect applicant, because that's a fallacy. The perfect applicant is the best version of you, the best version of your child.

00;00;40;17 - 00;01;14;03
Paul Sullivan
Welcome to the company Dads podcast. I'm your host, Paul Sullivan. We're focused on lead dads, working moms, and how small changes at home or work can have a big impact on their lives. Each episode promises to deliver actionable advice and some area of concern at home or at work. Short. Direct. Again. Actionable. Five questions. Five answers. Today, our guest is Lindsay Tanner, founder of Logic Prep, a globally recognized educational consultancy provides strategic test prep, comprehensive college guidance and academic support.

00;01;14;05 - 00;01;36;12
Paul Sullivan
She started it as a student at this place called Harvard, and she now has a team of 50 college advisors, coaches and tutors who have helped thousands of families navigate the highly competitive, perhaps even stressful admissions landscape. What's your secret? She yells a lot at the parent and students. No, that's not true. She doesn't yell at all, she tells me.

00;01;36;15 - 00;01;47;11
Paul Sullivan
And we're going to talk today about what she does to ramp down that anxiety and still help those kids find the college that is the right fit for them. Welcome, Lindsay, to the Company Dads podcast.

00;01;47;14 - 00;01;51;01
Lindsay Tanner
It's very good to be here. Thank you for having me. And I'll try not to yell.

00;01;51;04 - 00;01;55;18
Paul Sullivan
You don't? Yeah, right. You don't yell. I mean, but if you yelled equally, it would be okay. Like. Yeah. Like.

00;01;55;20 - 00;01;57;03
Lindsay Tanner
Let's see.

00;01;57;05 - 00;02;00;22
Paul Sullivan
I'm just saying, maybe it's a new model. Like. And you could, you know, I don't know. You can.

00;02;00;22 - 00;02;01;02
Lindsay Tanner
Use it.

00;02;01;09 - 00;02;30;06
Paul Sullivan
Use it for free. If it works, it is yours. All right. Question one again, this is you know, people want to go. Kids want to go to college. It's become something that is they fixate on at times stressful. As you said, you know, before I got on it, it doesn't have to be that way. So question one, what's the most helpful and the least helpful thing fathers and mothers can do to help their children in the college admissions process?

00;02;30;08 - 00;02;43;17
Lindsay Tanner
I think the most helpful thing that parents can do is just be a support, be a sounding board, be a cheerleader. Not a taskmaster. That might be the least helpful thing.

00;02;43;17 - 00;02;48;22
Paul Sullivan
Like a cheerleader. Like, let's go Harvard. Now, that not that kind of thing.

00;02;48;25 - 00;03;13;25
Lindsay Tanner
I think that, this process can become so all consuming and doesn't need to, but it needs to be. It needs to be boundary. And that's part of the role of the parent to kind of exercise some restraint and say, I'm not going to bring up the college thing in every car ride around, every, you know, breakfast conversation.

00;03;13;27 - 00;03;37;20
Lindsay Tanner
To really kind of manage themselves to be there as consistent, loving, reminders that their children are good no matter what their, outcome is or what kind of the the achievement is that they're aiming for, that they love them, they're here and they want to help.

00;03;37;22 - 00;03;48;19
Paul Sullivan
Okay. Now. Yeah. So if they're not talking about the college process in every car, right. Do they talk about like the AP test in every car? Right. Would it.

00;03;48;21 - 00;04;06;00
Lindsay Tanner
You know, if there's a lot of interesting stuff in the word, maybe talk about, like what? What, what TV shows they're watching, who they're hanging out with, what they're doing over the weekend. I know this is, like, novel stuff, but, teenagers are really interesting. At least I think so. And so ask questions.

00;04;06;02 - 00;04;19;17
Paul Sullivan
I love it. I love it. You know, what's the flip side to that question? Because I asked it as the most and the least helpful thing that they can do. So, you know, talk about like, be a little prescriptive as to what parents should, should sort of bear in mind.

00;04;19;19 - 00;04;23;28
Lindsay Tanner
Yeah. I think,

00;04;24;00 - 00;05;12;24
Lindsay Tanner
I would say talk less about outcomes, more about effort. Really focus on helping your children to reframe success as growth and self-discovery. And I think one of the best ways to do that is to model that. I think you as a parent can also really, imbue this process with fun. If you so choose. So, for example, college visits are an amazing bonding opportunity to get to hang out with your kid and get on the road and go see a sports game, like, or go see a theater performance if that's what your child's into.

00;05;12;26 - 00;05;25;11
Lindsay Tanner
So to really kind of elevate and shift your mindset and to get to a place of this could actually be really fun. And also, the days with your children at home are limited. This is kind of the final chapter, so enjoy it.

00;05;25;13 - 00;05;43;16
Paul Sullivan
I love it. You know, question two you know, my oldest is in ninth grade, and, fortunately, my wife and I have already practiced what you're preaching here and that we focus more on the effort, on the studying, on. You know, you're a great. It's just a reflection on how much you know, it's not a reflection. Right?

00;05;43;19 - 00;05;44;20
Lindsay Tanner
Who you are.

00;05;44;22 - 00;06;01;19
Paul Sullivan
Right? Again, if you get in a while, you seem to have learned the material. And if you get to see you, you seem not to have learned the material. So that's how we've been since I've been very, young. But as you know, better than most, teenagers, they're not listening to the parents all the time. They're in this this mix with their friends.

00;06;01;19 - 00;06;11;01
Paul Sullivan
And as I point out to my daughter, your friends are lovely. People are lovely. But they don't know anything. They literally don't know what they're talking about. They're just parroting what they're through.

00;06;11;08 - 00;06;11;14
Lindsay Tanner
Yeah.

00;06;11;14 - 00;06;38;07
Paul Sullivan
You're nothing. They are parroting what they've heard or seen or, you know, think is the outcomes. Right. So question two is really what is, you know, the often the most stressful thing for children in this college process that in your, your education, they really don't need to worry about that thing that they fixate on. And if we as parents could help them say, hey, this doesn't matter as much as it may seem to you or your friend group.

00;06;38;09 - 00;06;39;00
Paul Sullivan
Yeah.

00;06;39;02 - 00;07;04;23
Lindsay Tanner
I think there is so much anxious anticipation around the essay writing process, as it pertains to kind of the whole college application journey, I feel like starting as early as ninth, 10th grade, I hear students and the parents of those students sort of lament and sort of bemoan. Sometimes they're almost like apparent lack of bad luck and say, oh, nothing bad has happened to me.

00;07;04;23 - 00;07;25;15
Lindsay Tanner
What am I going to ever write about? And so I think there's just like this. The state has been built up for so many kids, probably because kids are talking to kids as like such a thing. And I think sometimes, you know, teenagers think I'm not interesting. So how will I ever have something to say? And so what?

00;07;25;15 - 00;07;48;18
Lindsay Tanner
We really reassure our students and their parents of is one that everybody's interesting. And I genuinely believe that to be true. But also this is part of the work that we're doing as early as ninth grade to really create a thoughtful, intentional narrative in partnership with the student. And that doesn't mean crafting the perfect applicant, because that's a fallacy.

00;07;48;22 - 00;08;13;04
Lindsay Tanner
The perfect applicant is the best version of you, the best version of your child. So if your child is spending their time meaningfully, deeply, thoughtfully engaged in their high school experience, trying new things over the summer, taking on leadership positions, learning new skills, there is no doubt in my mind that they will have a fabulous story to tell when the time comes.

00;08;13;07 - 00;08;39;07
Paul Sullivan
Yeah, turn that to energy. Kind of follow on question to that. You know, being in the shoes of some, you know, poor, college admissions, officer who has to read hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of these essays. You know, obviously you're talking to these people for them. Is it just really solid writing that stands out? Is it in some cases, the story?

00;08;39;07 - 00;08;51;18
Paul Sullivan
What is it in? Because again, like a ninth grader doesn't know what he or she really should write about. But they think they do and they're friends. Tell them what they should do. What what you know, when you're on the other end of that, what makes it. Yeah.

00;08;51;18 - 00;09;01;01
Lindsay Tanner
What makes something pop. And so our team of advisors are actually all former admissions officers, and we have a team of SC coaches, too, or who are all professional storytellers in our lives.

00;09;01;01 - 00;09;03;04
Paul Sullivan
They're like Navy Seals. They've kind of come to the US.

00;09;03;04 - 00;09;04;22
Lindsay Tanner
I say yes like this.

00;09;04;22 - 00;09;04;29
Paul Sullivan
Yeah.

00;09;04;29 - 00;09;07;11
Lindsay Tanner
And they are pro. So they've read.

00;09;07;13 - 00;09;08;18
Paul Sullivan
Thousands.

00;09;08;20 - 00;09;09;24
Lindsay Tanner
Of applications.

00;09;09;26 - 00;09;11;29
Paul Sullivan
So much bad writing over the years.

00;09;12;02 - 00;09;37;08
Lindsay Tanner
I'm sure that's true. And the thing, you know, they often say that it's not the most grandiose stories that stand out. It's sometimes the most mundane. As long as it offers like a compelling window into how that student sees the world. I also think there's sometimes a false sense that students have, like their college essay, supposed to be like a time capsule and say everything about them, and we sort of push back on that.

00;09;37;08 - 00;10;00;10
Lindsay Tanner
I'm not sure that it needs to be a time capsule. I think it just needs to be a really beautiful open window into who they are today, recognizing that they might change. I think we all recognize that teenagers are not fully formed, but still present a sense of direction and cohesion around, okay, this is how I see the world, or this is kind of what's interesting to me.

00;10;00;12 - 00;10;34;16
Paul Sullivan
Yeah. That's wonderful. Thank you. You know, question three, and I don't know if this is where your team goes or not or if there's more with the parent, but I'll throw it out there anyways. And that is, you know, how can we as parents working with a team like yours as college coaches help our children with their, you know, mental and emotional health through these, you know, final years of high school, of secondary school and prepare them to go off as, you know, happy, engaged, interesting, young people into the college world.

00;10;34;19 - 00;11;01;21
Lindsay Tanner
Is I think, you know, this is such an excellent opportunity to teach students how to, I would say, seek out and really benefit from the support of mentors and coaches that are not their parents. I think when this goes really well from from my perspective with my team, parents are in the equation as parents. As I said earlier, they're the cheerleaders of the coaches.

00;11;01;21 - 00;11;35;21
Lindsay Tanner
They're the safe space. And in this dynamic, the parent is really empowering. Our advisor, our essay coach, to offer expert advice and collaborate with the student and speak to that student as the young person or as the young adult that they're becoming. Yeah. And so I think when parents are feeling the stress and anxiety in their house, and I think that's inevitable, it takes, really both courage and good sense to say, you know what?

00;11;35;21 - 00;11;46;22
Lindsay Tanner
That's a great question. I'm not going to answer that for you. I think you should call your advisor. It's both empowering for the student. And I think preserving of the relationship in the household.

00;11;46;24 - 00;12;19;07
Paul Sullivan
I love it. That's good. You know the question for, when you think about the work that the, the students and the parents have to do to actually select, a college coach, as you said, you have 50 some odd people doing this. How do they go about vetting that person? Because as we were talking, you know, before I start recording, so much of this is parent, a sister parent be a we use so and so and this is great but but or parents as a parent B we use so-and-so.

00;12;19;07 - 00;12;41;00
Paul Sullivan
And he was awful. But that's really meaningless because it's the experience that they had for their child in that particular moment. So for parents who are not, you know, journalists who ask questions all the time or in roles where they're interviewing people to sort of get information, get a sense, how do you advise them to vet, a college coach, your coaches or others to make sure the.

00;12;41;00 - 00;13;05;22
Lindsay Tanner
Yeah, I mean, I think I think that's a really I think it's a really interesting question. I think, in my view, I would look at both results and process. I think obviously outcome matters here. And so really understanding how does this individual or this firm measure success. What does success look like for you as a family, and does it align with how this organization sees success?

00;13;05;22 - 00;13;28;01
Lindsay Tanner
In other words, is it ivy or bust, or is it more holistic than that? And then I think there's absolutely a process piece of this too, because in our best relationships, you know, families are working alongside our team for maybe four years. So the question is, is this someone that my child is going to respect and relate to and want to listen to?

00;13;28;03 - 00;13;46;20
Lindsay Tanner
Does it feel like a partnership? Is the communication style kind of aligned with mine? To what extent will I, as a parent, be involved in this process? How much do I want to be involved in this process? And I think the first step, right, is kind of that introspection as a parent. What do I want this process to look and feel like?

00;13;46;20 - 00;13;50;27
Lindsay Tanner
And then does it align with, you know, with what's being offered?

00;13;50;29 - 00;14;02;22
Paul Sullivan
I mean, you know, within your firm, I mean, what happens if it isn't a good fit? What happens if somebody says, I want to work with with Sally, but really, Susie, is there a better fit? How do you what do you do in that process?

00;14;02;24 - 00;14;23;25
Lindsay Tanner
Yeah. No, I think it's a great question. And I think we are pretty intentional and bespoke about our matching process. And that is something, you know, from the get go that we really give a lot of thought to. We have a, a fabulous, head of our college advising journey who is a former admissions officer herself. She's also a former psychotherapist.

00;14;23;27 - 00;14;44;24
Lindsay Tanner
So she really thinks about kind of holistically what is going to work for this student and this family. And so I think the first thing is to really give good thought to, okay, what's going to be a good match then, if for whatever reason, it doesn't work out. And I do think this is one of the benefits of working with a team rather than a solo practitioner for this process, we've got a deep bench.

00;14;44;24 - 00;15;06;08
Lindsay Tanner
We can say, okay, what stylistically was not working, what could be working better. You know, our advisors are more or less operating out of the same playbook in terms of collective knowledge, and they're collaborating on our students behalf. You know, they're working off of the same curriculum, the same cadence of, yeah, you know, communication. But obviously everyone has their own vibe, their own style.

00;15;06;08 - 00;15;15;08
Lindsay Tanner
And so, you know, with the oversight of our team, a parent could say, look like this isn't quite working. Let me interview some other people. And that's always an option.

00;15;15;11 - 00;15;38;06
Paul Sullivan
And I guess the flip side, it's good to know that if you know, one of your coaches, you know, falls out of the game, you've got somebody come in off the bench, that's great. But you know what? If the kid is fouling out, what if the kid isn't, you know, pulling his or her own weight? You know, what can what can a parent, expect to hear as a feedback from, from that college coach that they're, they're paying good money to help them out?

00;15;38;12 - 00;15;59;04
Lindsay Tanner
Yeah. I mean, I think that is part of the job of our advisors is to kind of flag when things maybe aren't working the way that they should be, or something seems a little bit off. And in those cases, if the advisor would reach out to the parent, I think more often with curiosity inquisitively to say, look, this is what I've observed, this is what I'm seeing.

00;15;59;06 - 00;16;18;09
Lindsay Tanner
What are you seeing? What are you make this behavior because, I mean, sometimes we see things. Then they presented something but aren't actually that thing. So, for example, like when it comes time to work on essays, sometimes students just shut down. We see them, like, not want to show up for sessions or they're, you know, not handing in drafts.

00;16;18;09 - 00;16;32;15
Lindsay Tanner
And I think it can easily be misinterpreted as laziness or lack of engagement or, oh, this student isn't even interested at all. And a lot of times it's actually quite the opposite that the student is wildly nervous and putting an enormous.

00;16;32;16 - 00;16;32;29
Paul Sullivan
Whelmed.

00;16;33;00 - 00;16;43;18
Lindsay Tanner
Pressure. Right. And so I think our advisors are particularly attuned to those dynamics and then can approach the parent and say, hey, this is fantastic. What do you think? And the problem together.

00;16;43;21 - 00;16;58;17
Paul Sullivan
I love it. That's great. You know, you talked question five. Last question. It's been wonderful. But question you talk a lot about, you know, that shift from, you know, fixer to coach and that that's fairly intuitive. You know, parents are like, am I going to make all the problems the way I'm going to do this for you to to the coaches?

00;16;58;17 - 00;17;23;23
Paul Sullivan
Oh, come on, you can do this. You know, run, run some laps. Let's get this out. But that's a great, you know, thing for people to remember as it's going to be I'm not going to be the picture, I'm going to be the coach. But when you think more deeply about, you know, the parent child relationships that have come out as good, if not better through this problem, through this problem, that would have been a what a slipped through this college process.

00;17;23;26 - 00;17;36;05
Paul Sullivan
Yeah. What advice do you give to those parents to ensure that their relationship with their child is as good or better at the end of the process?

00;17;36;07 - 00;17;53;29
Lindsay Tanner
I mean, this is such an opportunity for parents to actually get to know their children better if they're open to it, because for so many children, this is the first time any adult and these are college admissions options as the adults are sort of asking like, who are you? Who do you want to become? What are you interested in?

00;17;54;01 - 00;18;15;26
Lindsay Tanner
And I think for some parents, if the answer is that they're their children, you know, come to the table with or not, what they might be expecting that can be uncomfortable or surprising, but it can also be really amazing and a really great chance to say, oh, that's really cool. I'm not sure I knew that or how can we, how can we lean into that more?

00;18;15;26 - 00;18;39;08
Lindsay Tanner
What else do I not know? And, you know, this is an opportunity, this process, I think when when done really thoughtfully and done well for students to really shape the way that they see themselves, you know, they're writing the story of this next chapter. And so I think, hopefully parents can see it as not just a means to an end, because college is not the end, as we all know.

00;18;39;08 - 00;18;49;21
Lindsay Tanner
It's just a beginning, but as a really amazing, transformative step on the journey that's going to unfold as their child becomes the person that they're growing into.

00;18;49;24 - 00;19;00;11
Paul Sullivan
Lindsay Tanner, founder of Logic Prep, Globally Recognized Education Cotati, thank you so much for being my guest today on the Company of Dads podcast.

00;19;00;13 - 00;19;01;23
Lindsay Tanner
Thank you. This is fun.

00;19;01;26 - 00;19;08;19
Paul Sullivan
One last thing. Tell the listeners how how do they find if they want to sort of avail themselves of your services, how do they find you?

00;19;08;25 - 00;19;25;22
Lindsay Tanner
Sure. So we are logic prep. Our website is Logic prep.com. And just shoot me an email. I always love to talk to families and hear what's on their minds. I'm Lindsay Lindsay at Logic prep.com and I hope to connect with many of you.

00;19;25;24 - 00;19;47;15
Paul Sullivan
Okay. Thank you again, Lindsay. I thoroughly enjoyed this. Thank you for listening to another episode of the Company Dads podcast. I really appreciate you tuning in week after week to really use this moment here, to thank the people who make it possible. Number one, of course, held are mirror, who is our podcast editor. We also have Skip Terry home to many of you know from lead Diaries.

00;19;47;15 - 00;20;10;19
Paul Sullivan
He's taken over our social media. Terry Brennan is helping us with our audience development, and Emily Servant is there, each and every day helping with the web development akin to any of this without, an amazing board, of advisors. So I just want to say thank you to all of you who help. And I want to say thank you to everyone who listens.

00;20;10;19 - 00;20;14;01
Paul Sullivan
And, hopefully you'll tune in again next week. Thanks so much.