How does a successful ad funnel thrive on Facebook and Instagram? Let's crack the code together with Jennifer Spivak, the powerhouse behind The Ad Girls Agency and a top Facebook Ads Manager to watch.
Jennifer breaks down the importance of refining your offer and your messaging and why bold copy and creative REALLY matters. She’ll also dissect the strategies that have worked to skyrocket her client Pia’s business - and how she guides potential leads through a high-ticket sales funnel with pinpoint precision.
We’re spilling the secrets on free guides, webinars, and video sales letters that will captivate a niche audience and foster high-quality leads that will book a call with you. If you're battling to improve your ad campaigns, this conversation is your blueprint for success.
Resources & Links
Connect with Jennifer on Facebook and Instagram and learn more about The Ad Girls Agency.
The Meta Ad Library is a goldmine of examples. Search “Jennifer Spivak” to see what ads Jenn is running.
Want to make Missions to Movements even better? Take a screenshot of this episode and share it on Instagram. Be sure to tag @positivequation so I can connect with you.
Don’t miss DonorPerfect’s Community Conference SPARK on June 4 & 5! It’s for any fundraiser wanting to excel in donor management, program innovation, community engagement, and organizational growth. Register for FREE! RSVP: https://bit.ly/DSSPARK
Want a donor acquisition plan tailored to you? All you need to do is answer 5 simple questions. Get your personalized growth plan: https://bit.ly/DonorGrowthQuiz
The NIO Summit is the nonprofit industry’s premier digital fundraising event! Join hundreds of fellow nonprofit professionals in Indianapolis September 18-19 and save $600 on your ticket -- the lowest price available anywhere right here: https://bit.ly/NIOSummit2024
Let's Connect!
How does a successful ad funnel thrive on Facebook and Instagram? Let's crack the code together with Jennifer Spivak, the powerhouse behind The Ad Girls Agency and a top Facebook Ads Manager to watch.
Jennifer breaks down the importance of refining your offer and your messaging and why bold copy and creative REALLY matters. She’ll also dissect the strategies that have worked to skyrocket her client Pia’s business - and how she guides potential leads through a high-ticket sales funnel with pinpoint precision.
We’re spilling the secrets on free guides, webinars, and video sales letters that will captivate a niche audience and foster high-quality leads that will book a call with you. If you're battling to improve your ad campaigns, this conversation is your blueprint for success.
Resources & Links
Connect with Jennifer on Facebook and Instagram and learn more about The Ad Girls Agency.
The Meta Ad Library is a goldmine of examples. Search “Jennifer Spivak” to see what ads Jenn is running.
Want to make Missions to Movements even better? Take a screenshot of this episode and share it on Instagram. Be sure to tag @positivequation so I can connect with you.
Don’t miss DonorPerfect’s Community Conference SPARK on June 4 & 5! It’s for any fundraiser wanting to excel in donor management, program innovation, community engagement, and organizational growth. Register for FREE! RSVP: https://bit.ly/DSSPARK
Want a donor acquisition plan tailored to you? All you need to do is answer 5 simple questions. Get your personalized growth plan: https://bit.ly/DonorGrowthQuiz
The NIO Summit is the nonprofit industry’s premier digital fundraising event! Join hundreds of fellow nonprofit professionals in Indianapolis September 18-19 and save $600 on your ticket -- the lowest price available anywhere right here: https://bit.ly/NIOSummit2024
Let's Connect!
about 75% of all of the clients that come to us are from our Facebook ad funnel. I'm, on average, spending $1,000 to acquire a new client and we do a four-month minimum at $5,000 a month for our fee. So that's a 20k contract and I am rinse and repeat for the last four years $1,000 in, 20k out. This is how we've grown a multi-million dollar agency with high quality, amazing, fit clients who are awesome, who are coming from my ad.
Speaker 2:Hey there, you're listening to the Missions to Moomis podcast and I'm your host, dana Snyder, digital Strategist for Non-Profits and Founder and CEO of Positive Equations. This show highlights the digital strategies of organizations making a positive impact in the world. Ready to learn the latest trends, actionable tips and the real stories from behind the feed? Let's transform your mission into a movement. Welcome back to another amazing episode of Missions to Movements. Today we have a guest that is a fan of something that I also love, and that is Facebook and Instagram ads. And you might be like ooh what? Jennifer and I are going to be chatting about a very unique and maybe not so unique after we chat about it, but case study, and I think it's going to blow your minds. Jennifer Spivak is the CEO and founder of the AdGirls, a female focused Facebook and Instagram advertising agency. Love this next line of your bio named a top Facebook ads manager to watch and called in quotes the conversion queen by Forbes. Okay, let's go, let's bring Jennifer in to this show. I also want to note 60 million in revenue for your clients via Facebook ads. Yes, hashtag, beyonce, bow down, we're going up over here. Jennifer, how did you get into the wild world of ads. And then, part B, decide to start your own shop.
Speaker 1:Well, honestly, I went to school for marketing. I graduated college in 2011. And basically, what happened if you had any sort of marketing skillset in 2011 and like the heyday of social media? They were like you're young, you're a kid, you know social media go, and so it's sort of getting pushed in that direction.
Speaker 2:It was like a little bit of where I graduated I'm December 2010.
Speaker 1:Same thing, yeah right, and so I was May of 2011,. Like right there, and so it was a very interesting time where you were that age and they were like great, all these opportunities. You guys know stuff.
Speaker 2:So we don't know.
Speaker 1:Yes, and so it just sort of happened. But in the first couple of years of being in that like quote unquote social media space, ads started to become a thing and I just realized that I felt a lot more in integrity selling something that I could really connect to a financial return, versus everything before ads came onto the scene with social media, which was like engagement and audience building and there's nothing wrong with any of that, by the way, it all has a place but I just loved the idea of being able to say we're going to do this thing and it's going to make you this amount of money and we can directly track and see, and that just felt so much cooler to me than just you'll get for Facebook. So that was a little bit of like the journey to ads specifically. And then second question was like why did I decide to do it on my own or how did I get there? Why did you decide to start your shot? I mean, entrepreneurship has felt like the thing for me since I was literally a child. I was always like scheming and doing these weird things, like putting on carnivals in my backyard and like selling candy around the neighborhood, Did you?
Speaker 2:also love doing the. This is gonna make me sound horrible, not knowing what they're called the trifle, or it's like the first copy and then the yellow copy and then the third copy. It's like three. Oh my gosh, what are those? Called Like the piece of the paper, like paper that you'd write receipts on back in the day and you would tear off the middle and give it to somebody. I love playing with my parents, being of that.
Speaker 1:Oh my God, that's so funny. So my obsession when I was little was just a clipboard. Like if you went anywhere with a clipboard, obviously you were like really cool and really important and I just felt like that's what I wanted. So I would like be at my backyard carnival, like with a clipboard, like signing people in. So you know different, but the same. I can see that clipboards was definitely my thing. So I mean, I always knew that I was gonna go out on my own. That was sort of really, really clear to me. My sort of first like job out of college was actually partnering with this guy that was building his own agency and he really brought me on from the beginning as somebody who he would eventually train to like take over and run the company while he went back to school to get his MBA. So even though it was like quote unquote a job, obviously it was still very entrepreneurial and so kind of like what I always say is I got to play entrepreneur with someone else's money, like I had a salary, but I was really figuring out how to grow this agency from the ground up and it reached a certain point where I kind of looked around. This was like in 2014. So I'm like three years into my career. I looked around and I was like, man, this has become like such a boys club and I just felt like and I have so much respect, by the way, for this company and the guy that was my business partner at the time like they're amazing. But I started to feel like, oh, like working earlier and earlier and longer hours is like being really glorified here and I just was starting to notice things that was also that time.
Speaker 2:I very much felt that too, and I think that was like a lifestyle back then.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I was like starting to get into the world of like I don't know more, like energetic stuff and money mindset and like all these things, and I was like, hmm, like let me kill myself and work as hard as possible, and that this is the way doesn't necessarily feel right and like, honestly, I built this agency, like I know how to do this, and so I just like had this moment where I was like, yeah, I'm going to go take everything I've learned. I feel like I already made all the mistakes with someone else's money. Essentially, I'm going to go out and start something.
Speaker 2:It's awesome. That's the best way to learn, and so what year did you create your agency? So?
Speaker 1:it was the end of 2014. It's like November 2014. So this is like we're coming up on year 10. Wow, we just passed nine years, which is insane. And you know, for many, many years, in the beginning, I really was just more of a freelancer. I actually, having come from that experience of the previous agency, felt really sure that I didn't want to build an agency. I didn't want to manage people. Like I had all of these ideas of things that I didn't want to do. I'm a little bit of like a marketing purist, like I love marketing genuinely and I didn't want my job to not be marketing and just like managing people, and so I felt really strongly about that for a while. But I think I just got to this point where I had so many clients and I was making great money but, like I mean, I was working 24 seven and I was like, okay, this isn't the vibe either, and so slowly started hiring people. And then, all of a sudden, I was like, hey, wait a minute, I don't think an agency is that bad, like if I do it my way.
Speaker 2:Of course, of course, yeah, you have the ability to structure it in the way that you want. Yes, yes, 100%. Well, and I think what's interesting is, if you've been working in this ad space for nearly a decade, oh my goodness, how there have been so many changes in what's worked, what hasn't worked, everything with iOS, of course. Is there a formula that you tend to see working best in this moment of Q1 of 2024?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean the formula is have really good freaking messaging. Like that's the formula, honestly, you know it's so funny. I feel like the types of questions people always want to ask me are like, what's the best way to target my audience? And like is image or video better? And I'm like all the questions that you're asking are wrong. Like, honestly, have a good offer yes, clearly we don't give a nearly enough attention to that and then, on top of that, know how to communicate that offer in a way that actually means something to the audience that you're going after. Like, if we really focus on Mastering those foundational pieces, then Facebook ads is really just a matter of well, we're leveraging a platform where the world is, so we're getting in front of people with the foundational stuff that we know works, and then we just get to really optimize and perfect the numbers component of it, so that the math, maths, basically, and that's it. Like that's the secret, so to speak.
Speaker 2:No, and it's so. On point, I mean there's been so many conversations about go broad with your audiences, go super niche with your audiences, but honestly, none of it's gonna work if your messaging is crap.
Speaker 1:Exactly, and you know like today I do prefer broad audiences, but like that's the thing that ebbs and flows and also is different by account and it's different by industry and which time we're working with. To me, if you're putting your energy on that, you are missing the thing that drives 75 to 80 percent of your success. Yes, of course there are certain best practices and of course those can change over time. But if you master the best practices and you don't have the foundational pieces, you don't have great messaging and scroll stopping creative. You can't win. If you don't know the best practices and you have the foundational stuff, you actually could still be successful, and so it's just like prioritizing what should get the majority of your energy.
Speaker 2:Yes, absolutely, and I think today we're gonna talk through a really interesting case study that happens to be around a high ticket offer, which I think a lot of times we're thinking about, kind of what you started on the beginning is the awareness, which is great to use it for. I teach a grow your list program For organizations looking to build up their email list if it's feeling very stagnant, and to grow some leads, which you can absolutely do. But I thought this was a very unique case study that I want to dive into with you on your client, pia, can you explain a little bit about her business and like what? Now, alan, she came to you with yes.
Speaker 1:So Pia, just like shout out to her because I love her, she's like a great human on top of being a really great client with a great great offer. So basically, she has a program where she teaches and this is like so specific. She teaches one to two person branding agencies, so like sort of like micro branding agencies a very specific methodology on how to grow and scale to thirty thousand dollar months While still remaining like a micro at one to two people. So that's her offer. Super niche yeah, super niche. Really good offer, really really good value proposition. And you know, she came to us and this is the case for so many of our clients knowing I have an amazing offer. I know the work that we do like when we get clients. We kill it for them, like all these testimonials, all these success stories, and yet we've tried multiple other agencies, we've tried to run ads ourselves and we can't get it to work for us it just seems to bring in tire kickers and ads don't convert. And that is a conversation that I have, not that we only do high ticket, but that is a lot of the type of client that we work with and I end up having that conversation with people when they come in Quite a bit, and so that was repealist when we first started working together, which was, I want to say, maybe nine or ten months ago. We're coming up on a year.
Speaker 2:Nice. I'm sure many people listeners are shaking their head of yes, I've hired people to do it before. Nothing has happened. What are we doing wrong? What's missing? What was when you did? I don't know if you do this, but like an auditor, you peaked into her account. What were you seeing? That was missing? What was off?
Speaker 1:the biggest thing that I remember was Her creative, just like not being strong. I don't know if it was that she was doing this intentionally, but there's been this conversation of like, oh, you want to have ads that don't look like ads, and I don't actually agree with that. Now I do feel like there was a time and place for that a couple of years ago, but the problem is that, like right now, what is working really really well across so many of our clients accounts are like big, bold text, really taking advantage of the real estate of the creative I've seen that too to write to say something, and so if that's what you're competing with, and Then you're like, well, I don't want to look like I'm running an ad, and so here's just like a photo of me like having fun, like sipping out of my mug, and it doesn't say anything. And you've got again the largest real estate of the ad unit, not saying anything. And so that's sort of what I felt like there was just some pieces of creative, some ads that were running, that were Just photos of Pia she's adorable but again wasn't saying anything, wasn't communicating anything. You know, one of her sort of front-end offers was this blueprint guide, and so there was like a mock-up almost of like what the blueprint guide might Look like as a book, but with just like a plain-colored background, like no context, and so that was the biggest thing. We've got this massive real estate of the ad unit and we're using it to say Absolutely nothing. And you pointed out, the audience is so niche, right? So this isn't gonna be a play of let's find this perfectly layered target audience. We can't specifically target one to two person branding agencies, we just can't, and so instead we do have to go into that branding agency space Cast a little bit of a wider net inside of that and have the messaging and creative that very clearly call out and speak to in Half a second who this is for and who it isn't, and so that was the biggest thing that was missing with her Original ad. They just weren't doing that, they weren't and they weren't really using, I just think, as strong of messaging as they could, given how amazing her value proposition is and the work that she really does awesome.
Speaker 2:Okay, so I want to break this down in a little bit of like a reverse. I want to go through the audience and, like, specifically talk about what you did do on the creative to change that. So I Always like to start with where people can end up. So what was the purpose when she decided to do an ad campaign For this offer that she has? What was the concept of it? Was booking a call right?
Speaker 1:Yes, so we are driving to a booked call. She does have a small but really powerful and effective sales team, and so it was getting people to book a call where they sell you into her high ticket offer.
Speaker 2:Okay, so are they being led to kind of like a sales landing page with like a button to book a calendar calendar, like I'm just trying to like visualize?
Speaker 1:Yes, so there's actually two entry points. So originally, when Pia first came to us, if I remember correctly, she was mostly running traffic to this blueprint. Right, it's this guide that walks through her methodology. It's basically like a free download and then in the guide, in the follow-up email sequence, there's all of these calls to action to say, hey, you know, do you want more or less, do you want help with this? Go ahead and book a call, and then they would go through something like a calendar and then her sales team has to close them. So that's one funnel that we've been running.
Speaker 2:Was that converting from the email standpoint? No, okay, it really wasn't.
Speaker 1:I don't remember if it was converting at all. And again, part of what she felt like was happening was she wasn't even getting the right people in the door to begin with, and so people that were coming in and booking calls just like weren't the right quality, weren't really ready to invest. I wanna say I mean again, she's like a smart business woman so I'm sure like maybe organically it was working. You know, it's not like it was doing nothing, but just ads specifically for that funnel were not put in quote bringing in the right people, which was like the experience that she was having.
Speaker 2:Yep, yep, which can happen a lot of times. Okay, so then, what did she end up switching to?
Speaker 1:So we actually are still running that, but we are fans of either like webinar or BSL to book a call Not that that's the only option, but the thing is, at the end of the day, when you are selling high ticket, there is definitely something to having face time with the person that you're about to invest like quite a bit of money into in order to get people interested enough to book a call, and so video as a medium for whatever your first funnel touch point is does tend to work. And so we were sort of guiding her to say let's keep the blueprint, because the content I think some people do like downloadable guides and the contents like you're not really saying much of anything. That was not the case Pia's content and they were so good and so strong that we were like maybe with better messaging we can optimize this. But we also feel really strongly that getting a BSL funnel going, which basically is right running traffic to sort of like a super mini training. So people are clicking on the ad about the mini training, they're getting to a landing page, they're putting in their name and email to opt in or sign up for that training. Then on the next page they get to watch the training and then there's an immediate call to action to go to book a call. So it's sort of just two different entry points. One is like hey, sit with me, for I don't know. I wanna say her training is like 20 minutes, 21 minutes, so with me, yeah, watch this video and then go book a call. And then the other entry way point is hey, get this guide and then go book a call.
Speaker 2:Okay, got it. What was the ad type for the campaigns ready to those conversions? Yes, Okay, with the goal of booking the call or signing up for the webinar.
Speaker 1:What we are running now and have been running are always conversion campaigns. We don't really mess around with anything else unless we're doing like middle of funnel retargeting. So obviously we wanna bring in quality people from the beginning and optimizing for conversion really helps with that. We are specifically optimizing for the webinar signup or the download of the guide. We've tested for a couple of different clients and we'll always test like what if we actually optimize for the booking, like the thing at the end of the day? I find that sometimes that works and sometimes it doesn't. For this particular account, it has been most effective to continue optimizing for that sort of first like conversion event, if you will. Okay, gotcha.
Speaker 2:All right. So that's the type of campaign Now we're looking for branding agencies, audience-wise, yes, and there's been lots of changes with interest-based targeting in the past year, past six months. What have you found as like when you say broad, what does that mean? When somebody is saying and they're thinking about it, maybe they have nothing to do with branding, right, but what are you looking for when you're doing, you're creating that audience build?
Speaker 1:Yeah. So I think this is a great conversation, because there's definitely conversation in, like the online ad space, where, when people are talking about broad, they literally mean like setting an age range and agenda and nothing else, and that's not what we're talking about here. What I am saying is we're not trying to layer, we're not saying, well, they have to like this as well as this and also this, and they have to have this income and also this. Like that type of layering doesn't work the way that it used to, but we are still wanting to make sure that we're maximizing spend. So, for example, like one of the interests that we have targeted is branding agency. like that dumb yes, like that is one of the interests that we are targeting branding agency and again, that's why that copy has to be so important, because there are gonna be some people in that audience that are actively looking for a branding agency to hire and those are not our people. There are gonna be people in that audience who have a branding agency, but it's much larger, and so that's where we're casting a wide net within the space of, like the general vicinity of where we wanna go, and then letting the messaging and the creative really do its work. I was looking at this morning in preparation, obviously, for this recording and like another one is like design.
Speaker 2:Oh, so broad, so those are different. You're saying you're doing comparisons on, we're testing the branding agency, we're testing just the keyword design.
Speaker 1:Yes, or like design and entrepreneurship.
Speaker 2:Yeah, trying to find that mesh of the person. Okay, so those must. Well, I would ask you, I guess, the size? Are you looking for a particular range of audience size or does not really matter?
Speaker 1:Yes and no. I mean I definitely these days prefer something that's like two to five mil at like the bottom end in terms of size and then just up from there. But again, if you are super niche, that wouldn't be the thing that I would put like a ton of focus on, because there isn't necessarily a 10 million person market for this to begin with. But loosely trying to find I mean in general this idea of having broader audiences that are at least like two to five mil, if not over 10 mil, tend to be more cost effective, like following. That only works if your copy and creative can do the job to still find the right people within that. Obviously more cost effective reach doesn't really mean anything if the copy and creative isn't doing its job. But in general that is gonna be something that is going to make more sense for optimizing the spend that you have.
Speaker 2:Yes, okay, so we've got our audiences. If we're thinking through budget and timeline, ideal range for doing initial tests.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the truth is we've been working with this client. Now, again, I think we're coming up on a year and we're testing all the time. I mean we just constantly, are constantly refreshing things we have found. Here's the way I always like to think about it. In the beginning, your testing lane is really wide. Over time, if you are doing testing properly and learning what's working and what's not, your testing lane can become more narrow. You're not trying to figure out what's the hook that people care about. You're like oh I know it's these three hooks. What are new, fresh ways that I could execute, copy and creative around these concepts or hooks that we know to work? That's that testing lane becoming more narrowed, but constantly keeping things fresh and preventing add fatigue, even sometimes just taking like this is one of my favorite little hacks taking a piece of creative that's performing really well but has shown a little bit of fatigue and just changing some of the colors, like it just breathes new life into the thing that's already working. So we are constantly testing, but I do feel like it was really the first 30 to 45 days of okay, like we're starting out a blank slate. Ads has not been able to work successfully for this business before. What are the different levers we need to pull? Which is the right entry point of the two funnels? What's the right messaging that brings in the right high quality people, and then also tackling no show rates, which is a thing that comes up for a lot of people that are using ads to drive calls. So that whole process was optimized to an extent by like the 30 to 45 day mark where we were seeing consistent results, and from there it's just been all right. Now we need to maintain these results, and so how do we constantly keep things fresh to prevent that ad fatigue?
Speaker 2:Yes, and I want to put like an asterisk on ad fatigue. For those of you that aren't familiar, there is a metric called frequency within your metrics reporting and you're able to see how many times has somebody seen this ad. What is your rule of thumb where, if you are calling something ad fatigue, how much is too much?
Speaker 1:It's hard to say. I feel like for a cold audience, like once, we're getting up to like five to seven. It's not that I'm like turn it off, but I'm looking at house performance, right, because the thing is, if the ad continues to work and it has a high frequency and performance is still steady, then who cares? And so it's a combination of OK, it's getting up to five to seven. I have my watching it to just see are we seeing a different performance or not? Because if we start to see a dip, we would have an idea of why and want to again just keep things fresh with small tweaks and small changes, so that the person who has already seen the ad seven to 10 times and hasn't clicked, if they see it again in a different execution, they're not immediately assuming we'd have seen this before. I'm not paying attention. We have like a new, fresh chance to potentially get their attention.
Speaker 2:Yes, ok, thank you for that clarity on Ad Fatigue. So then, all right, so I'm breaking it down. I'm thinking about my ads manager account and going through the steps, all right, so now we've gone through that. What is your approximate budget when you're doing testing? Are you a lifetime budget spender or are you a per day spender?
Speaker 1:Definitely per day. I do not like lifetime budgets at all for anything. Yeah, just like, don't ever use those. So definitely definitely per day. I mean here's what I will say, because I think there's like a lot of different things we could talk about regarding what is the right budget for testing and what's the minimum or maximum you should spend. I don't know that there is one right answer. Like at my agency, we do have like a minimum monthly spend requirement of $5,000 a month and that's by design. That isn't like arbitrary, basically what that means, right, we divide that by 30. That's about $166 a day and we found that when factoring in a good amount of top of funnel cold audience testing and still wanting to have a little bit of budget for some middle of funnel or bottom of funnel retargeting, that that gives us enough wiggle room to go through a testing process and within 30, 45 days get to a place in which we're seeing actual results and then be able to scale up from there. We have clients that come in with much higher budgets and will start higher, but somewhere around like $166, $200 a day, $150 a day that's a reasonable amount to start with and be able to run through enough options and iterations in that first 30 days, to really not just have said, well, I did testing, but to actually have gotten to the other side of like, oh, now I have an understanding, truly, of what is working and why, and being able to continue to improve and iterate on those concepts that have been proven to work.
Speaker 2:So important and I think a lot of times people give up before they reach that stage Totally. And that's the problem, that golden nugget right there is. You have to give time and testing to be able to validate what's going to work. So let's talk about this one. So let's continue on. What was the specific ad creatives that now we've fast forwarded, that you really saw working, and what did those results look like?
Speaker 1:A lot of big bold taxes we were talking about earlier. We definitely tested some video. I feel like a lot of our clients are like video is working best. Right, we should test that and again test everything for sure. But video is not a big winner on this account for top of funnel, cold audiences. One of our ads that we've been running for a really long time and I'm sure you've seen this, is like a mock up of like a notes app in someone's phone that has like a list of things that you're going to learn inside of the training. So like nothing super complex. Again, it's knowing the hooks that people care about and big, bold, eye catchy scroll stopping, still image creatives above all else. You know this is like a slightly different topic, but we did a massive launch for another one of our clients several months ago where you know the spend was over half a million dollars in like a six week period. So like I mean man, the amount of testing you're doing, you're doing with that kind of spend in a six week period, and so I feel like wow gave us such a good view into what's working, right If you're really reaching that many users on Facebook and still images with big bold text. Repeatedly outperformed videos, gifts, carousel ads, stories, ads all of it still images, big bold text. Now, granted, it's because we have the right hooks. We can't just, you know, have the still image, big, bold text, without the right hooks, but that does seem to be tried and true, while obviously there's always additional things you can add in. You execute a video Well, of course, it can definitely work, but I love the simplicity of it. It's literally just like hey, here's what this is, and people are like great, that sounds cool. I would like that.
Speaker 2:Yes, and the messaging is so, so, so important. That hook that you're talking about and really focusing in on that copy. Ok, so then this continuously runs. So I mean, the most important question that people are going to wonder is what is the ROI of this ad?
Speaker 1:And we're running multiple ads. I mean I don't even know how many. I would have to go look in the ad account. So many ads because we're constantly again testing a couple of different variations at once across multiple different audiences. And we do still have the VSL funnel as well as the print downloadable guide. But overall we are seeing pretty consistently around a 10x return on ad spend every single month. Now I do want to just be realistic here. Let's preface that amazing stat with this is a very high ticket offer. That is part of what contributes to that like to not acknowledge that is silly. If you're selling a $99 course, you cannot get a 10x return on ad spend, even if you have the best ad messaging, the best ads manager. Not that it's impossible, nothing is but that would be, pretty challenging to do with just what it costs to run ads. That is part of it, but we've been able to do that pretty consistently. Obviously, week to week there's definitely some fluctuation, but on average now again, going on like eight, nine or 10 months, we are seeing a pretty consistent 10x return on ad spend Amazing Congratulations, thank you.
Speaker 2:Good job Pia. Good job team. That's amazing. I think that's awesome. How did you end up? You were talking about a little bit before there were some no-shows. Did you tweak that with messaging to get that to stop, or did the webinar change on the back end?
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was really two core things. Look, I think there's a little bit of. First, we just have to accept that we are. When you're launching ads on Facebook and Instagram, you are getting in front of the world. The masses there will just be. It's a little bit of the nature of the beast from my perspective. There will be some no-shows. I would usually plan with most of my clients for 20 percent no-show rate. If we're 20 percent or less, we're cool with that. Once we get above 20 percent, that's when we start to say this isn't as effective as possible for our spend. First place we always look for dealing with no-shows is do we have the right touchpoints after somebody books? Email sequences, retargeting ads, text messages, reminders to just logistically make sure that if somebody books and they are interested that they are seeing those additional touchpoints. That's one part of it. But also we've just been super involved. This is just a very real-time component of doing this, where we are tracking the no-show rate in real-time every single week, obviously in collaboration with PS sales team. They're giving us constant feedback of did this person show up, even if they didn't close, what was the quality of that lead? Were they the right person? If we're all of a sudden seeing a higher no-show rate in one particular week, then is our norm. We can usually pinpoint it back to a specific ad or audience. Sometimes what we would find is, all of a sudden our cost per booked call would go down, which is a good thing. All of a sudden we're getting calls for cheaper but had a higher no-show rate. We were able to then pinpoint that there was maybe a quality issue with that ad or audience and we would ultimately kill that. That's why the tracking that Facebook is going to allow you alone when you're doing high-ticket book a call, is only going to go so far. You can get a bunch of really cheap bookings, but if they are not the right people who are showing up and closing, then who cares? There's only so many decisions that we're able to make just based off of the pixel and pixel tracking. There's this qualitative piece as well, and being really really involved with Pia and her sales team in real time so we could quickly identify. Okay, the algorithm is now optimizing to get us more of those people because it thinks it's doing good, because all it can track is how many bookings there are. We've got to nip that in the bud, immediately kill that campaign, start something else over Just that high level of involvement with what was happening in real life, a human element of it. Exactly, not just like we're in the ads manager and this is what the numbers say, but really what was actually happening, and just responding to that in real time has also been a big part of the success here.
Speaker 2:I want to speak to this high-ticket offer component where we think that we can't find and this could be. I do that in the nonprofit world. This could be a big donor that's going to come, and this could be a board director that's going to come, and this could be, you never know. Same thing with bigger price items. I had a very similar experience. I was running Facebook ads to a mastermind program of mine. At the time it was a $6,000 offer and somebody cold came right through my ads yeah, crazy, roi return. I think I only ended up spending like it was very low, a couple hundred bucks, right For a six, and you would be like what, how? Yeah, but if you have, like, you're saying the right messaging and I was doing different testing I think I was a video at the time yeah, but it is definitely possible.
Speaker 1:Of course it's possible. I mean, again, I always challenge people where I'm like, where is this actually? A little bit of a mindset issue. Let's be real. The world is on Facebook and Instagram like it's like. Can we all agree on that, right? Like that's not really up for debate. Let's look at the numbers. Like those are the platforms in which the world lives on, and so if that's true, if, like the world is there, then what makes you think that this person who you've like put on a pedestal is like this, so high and mighty above person that doesn't use social meat? Like that's not true. They're there. You just need the patience and the right messaging and creative to call out to them. I mean, even in growing my agency, we, for the last four years, about 75% of all the clients that come to us are from our Facebook ad funnel. I'm, on average, spending a thousand dollars to acquire a new client and we do a four month minimum at $5,000 a month for our fee. So that's a 20k contract and I am rinse and repeat for the last four years $1,000 in, 20k out. This is how we've grown a multi-million dollar agency With high quality, amazing, fit clients who are awesome, who are coming from my ads and, by the way, it's like one ad, one audience that I've been running so lazily for like a lot several years, but it's good, clear messaging and it gets in front of a lot of people. There's often like arguments in the comments right on that ad of like this really isn't for small businesses who can afford this, and like just all these people arguing. But like the right people are coming and booking and becoming a client, and so I welcome that social proof as it boosts my ad in the algorithm and gets me more of the dreamy clients I want to be working.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so it's all about okay. So I'm gonna ask you listeners. There's a place called the ad library and if this ad exists, I'd love to see things to be able to put it in the show notes so people can see the actual visuals. If it's possible to share One of Pia's ads but they look like from an ads manager link and even or the one that you just described For your own agency it would be really interesting for people to be able to look at see what does a good hook mean. What is this big, bold ad or visuals look like? I think that would be fabulous to showcase.
Speaker 1:Yeah, totally. And by the way, if you go look my very formal process of getting to the ad's library every single time is I just Google meta ads library, because I can never remember the damn link. So literally yeah, google meta ad library, something will open up. If you put in Jennifer speed back my full name, like that's the name of my page, you can easily go and see the ads that I'm running, which, again, there's usually like two or three, and there you go. Yeah, they just work.
Speaker 2:But that's proof, right, is? You just have to find what works. Yep, be patient to figure it out, and I think that is the hardest thing to do. Yeah, hard as thing to do with. That said, I want to go ahead and wrap with three final questions. Okay, put you know on the spot, jennifer. If there's somebody in marketing that you think is killing it, or an organization or brand that should be on the show, who would it be?
Speaker 1:So I mean this would be like another obviously Facebook ads person, but I just feel like that's my world. Tara Zercher I don't know if you follow her. She is just awesome. I think that she's so great. So she is really on the side of training business owners on how to run Facebook ads. We don't really do any training, we just do done for you. So anytime anyone's like do you have any trainings I can buy, I'm like no, go to Tara Zercher. She's just lovely and really smart and, yeah, really you know having a lot of, I think, like very Accessible offers for business owners who want to actually learn to run ads themselves.
Speaker 2:Cool, awesome, yeah, amazing. In my Next career list challenge I think it's gonna be I haven't sent merch or April, so coming up soon which I run it as a small cohort where I review the ad copy and the ad graphics and we build it all together and it's a hundred, a Guaranteed of a hundred new emails in seven days.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's a very good promise.
Speaker 2:Organizations. Crush it. I love it. Crush it, awesome. Okay, so what is one thing that you would like to ask for help or support on?
Speaker 1:Hmm, that's a good Question. You know this is Kind of random and vague, but I'll just put it out there cuz you never know like. So I've been running my agency for a really long time. We are in such like beautiful, healthy, stable place. So good, get a girl. Oh, it's so great, like my team and just we're actually the thing one client away from being full, like just straight up full, and so, yeah, really really beautiful stuff happening over there after just like a lot of obviously like love and attention and time Pour it into it. And so, with that, my like next endeavor that I want to start exploring is like acquiring other businesses super open blank slate, but Open tote whatever might come through in that area. So that's just something that I want to, you know, look into and start exploring this year and creating some additional revenue streams fun and super fun.
Speaker 2:Okay, yeah, listeners, okay. And then, finally, with that note, where can they connect with you to tell you?
Speaker 1:Yes, on Facebook or Instagram. I am Jen Spivak. Jen with two ends. If you want to learn about the agency, book a call, discuss actually working with us. We're gonna be over at the ad girls calm, awesome, beautiful.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much for the work that you do to empower Our female-owned businesses. And congratulations on a decade. That's incredible.
Speaker 1:I'm so old, but thank you so much. I'm like so I'm obviously like so a baby, but it's just so Weird. Like sometimes I think back. People be like how did you have the confidence to like start out in the beginning? And I'm like that's a wonderful question. I don't know where I got the balls. I just went and did it and like now I'm here and like man looking back, like there's a whole thing that exists in the world, like a company that like employees, 15 women that I made up. It's an interesting thing to think about often.
Speaker 2:I always like to say it comes from a little bit of being naive and Not really knowing all of it and just starting me like I mean I could do it right.
Speaker 1:So, like an overabundance of misplaced confidence that I like managed to channel towards something that actually worked, yeah.
Speaker 2:Little bit of luck, little bit of faith or the rest work relationships and, yeah, just a dose of confidence to make it all happen. Yeah for Iraq. Thank you so much for being here. It's been an blast talking with you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, likewise Thank you for having me.
Speaker 2:Can you tell I love talking. All things digital to make this show better. I'd be so grateful for your feedback. Leave a review, take a screenshot of this episode, share it on Instagram stories and tag positive equation with one e so I can reshare and connect with you.