We Are Selling with Lee Woodward
We Are Selling is a weekly podcast about real estate, business and tackling life's challenges. Hosted by renowned real estate industry coach, Lee Woodward, learn from experts in their field and maximise your life.
We Are Selling with Lee Woodward
181 - The Traits of the Greats With Adam Joske
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Adam Joske joins Lee Woodward for a coach-to-coach masterclass on the thinking patterns that separate top-performing real estate agents from average performers. The fundamental difference between winning and whinging in real estate comes down to self-honesty, professional sequences, and the courage to lead clients rather than serve them.
• Self-honesty is the number one trait of successful agents who take full responsibility rather than blaming vendors or buyers
• The best agents follow professional sequences and never skip steps, building trust through consistent communication
• Successful agents present with conviction rather than offering multiple options – "if this were my family's home, I'd absolutely go with this approach"
• Top performers regularly communicate market feedback to vendors, personalising it through buyer stories rather than stating personal opinions
• "Central locking selling" technique gets buyers back to properties they initially rejected by creating neutral environments for reconsideration
• Great agents claim doors in their core areas through consistent nurturing rather than just chasing new prospects
• The "warm chase" period (clients planning to sell in 3-24 months) represents the most significant opportunity most agents miss
For consulting with Adam Joske, contact adamjoske@outlook.com or call 0414-337-979. If attending the Complete Salesperson course, come and say hello and mention that you listened to the podcast.
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Hello and welcome back to the podcast we Are Selling this week. We have a very special feature as we go coach to coach and for those of you that know this gentleman or have had the opportunity to see him speak, mr Adam Joski joins us today from Melbourne. Adam, welcome to the program. Thank you again, lee. Good to be here again. Adam, I speak about you all the time because at the Complete Salesperson course I show your amazing targeted prospecting. So anyone listening to this now when I bring up the weatherboard report for Elstonwick or the 70 attached brick home, this is the agent who did it. So, adam, after your amazing real estate career, you went through and did some other things in real estate, but now you've come back to this passion for training and coaching. Tell us what you're doing today.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so, post a 20, well, 25 odd years sales career which I absolutely loved, I then became head of Victoria for both Bell Property and Hocking Stewart. So I ran the groups there and ran the academy and, look, I love that. But I felt like I was looking after a lot of people Probably didn't have as big an influence as I would have liked. So now I've now started my own consulting business, which I'm absolutely loving. At any time I've only got five, six, seven, maybe eight clients on rotation. And what I'm loving about it, lee, is that I get to work very closely with people and know what's going on in their lives. And it's very, very different to where I was, which was basically touching someone and then seeing them two months later and touching them again, and so, yeah, I'm in a very, very different place, but I'm enjoying it.
Speaker 1:What a fascinating part of your career. And to have impact like that on. Well, it's no different to the weatherboard report. It was very targeted. You only sent the report to people with weatherboard and now you want to do coaching. That has impact. And in the Melbourne marketplace, which has gone through a lot of transition, adam and we might even chat about that first up before we go into our great topic, which is the traits of the greats today. I just love that title. But Melbourne's predominantly been a director-driven real estate sales process business and that's now sort of brought a challenge to the marketplace in Melbourne that it's very hard to find new talent coming through and recruitment is a massive issue. You're on the ground down there. What's your views on that?
Speaker 2:Just about everyone I meet. They say to me that one of their biggest challenges is they just can't find enough good salespeople. And I think that you know I met, I had coffee not long ago with James Sosterman in Melbourne, who's one of Melbourne's top agents, and sort of 15 years ago he said to me what percentage of agents out there in Victoria do you think were really good? And I said, oh look, I think probably you know 60, 70% of people I met I think were good agents some better than others, but good agents and he said I reckon it's probably 5% or 10%. Now His observations were that every man and his dog is now getting into real estate.
Speaker 2:The point of entry is very low. There's no degree, there's no diploma and it's very easy to get in. I look at technology and technology is amazing, but I think that there's a lot of people out there who are using technology to run their sales career and maybe have forgotten about the basics, which is connecting with people, having face-to-face understanding, motivation. I feel like the industry in Victoria has become rather transactional.
Speaker 1:But what I'd like to discuss with you today, in reflection of what we just discussed, our topic is the traits of the greats. And before we learn the phone calls, the documents, the sequences, you've got to get your mind right and understand how the greats think, because they do think differently. And, adam, you've had that same opportunity to reflect and review thousands of agents and what they're doing, and you can walk've had that same opportunity to reflect and review thousands of agents and what they're doing, and you can walk into any office and you can see who's winning and who's whinging. Every day in real estate, you get this opportunity and you've got to make that decision Am I winning or whinging? And I don't know what's between those boots, but I tell you, from one side to the other, you can have a dramatic difference in someone's career. From one side to the other, you can have a dramatic difference in someone's career. So take us into it. What have you observed about the great thinking and what is?
Speaker 2:specifically that thinking that the greats have. The best way for me to illustrate this is to talk about a recent experience I had where I actually did some consulting in two offices for two different brands in the same marketplace. So they were both on a level playing field. There was no one with an advantage. One of these offices was performing very, very well. They've got market share. They've got lots of listings, days on market around 20. So things are going well. They just asked me to come in and spend a bit of time with some of the salespeople. Conversely, I went into this other office in the same area and they're really struggling. Days on market are blown out. They lose a lot of listings. They can't get their vendors to meet the market with their prices. So there's a whole lot of issues there that we're working through and I was really thinking hard about what am I seeing different in these two organizations and what I came down to and I think you and I have spoken off air about what are the number one trade of successful real estate agents, and I think a lot of people say things like you've got to be a good listener, you've got to be a good speaker, you've got to be able to talk or relate to people, and I think for me it's number one is about self-honesty and self-introspection. What I mean by that is really have an understanding that you need to be in control of your own destiny.
Speaker 2:One of the officers that I was in with I was speaking to one of the salespeople there who's very, very successful, and he said to me I've got this frustration at the moment because I've got this offer and it's a good offer and I can't get the vendor to take it. I'm trying and I'm thinking and I'm workshopping it and I can't get the vendor to take it. And what I found with this agent is he's owning everything. So it's always his responsibility to be able to influence the vendor and I say influence in a good way, but it's his responsibility to influence the vendor to take that offer. And this agent is frustrated and he's saying to me Adam, what else can I do? These are the things I've done. Have you got any other ideas of what I can do? So the vendor is ready to go.
Speaker 2:Now, if I look at the other agent in the area who I believe hasn't got that self-honesty, I walk into his office. The same issue I've got a vendor that won't take an offer. I've got an offer on the table, that's fantastic, and he won't take it. And I'm saying, well, take me through that, what does it look like? And he's saying, well, they're greedy and they just won't take the offer and they're being an idiot. Yeah, well, and I hear this a lot from agents. And I said to them what do you mean? And they said, well, I said, have you done everything? And he said to me I've done absolutely everything and there's nothing else to do, and the vendor is just greedy. Now, my opinion on that, lee, is that if you have an attitude that you've done everything, there's nowhere to go. There's nowhere to go. You've got to stay on, mate, and you're not going to sell that property.
Speaker 2:Conversely, that first agent very much had that attitude of what else can I do, what else can I look at? I made some notes with this second agent and I was spending a lot of time with this agent on this new way of looking and he said to me well, I've done absolutely everything and the vendor won't take it. So we went through a whole lot of things and we said, well, have you met the vendor face-to-face or on Zoom at least once a week to build trust? And he said, well, no, I've met them a month ago and I've been speaking to them since then on the phone and we said well, have you set up a set to sell meeting to set up the campaign before you started to talk about expectations, alignments? No, did you get someone else from your office to speak to them with a different voice? No, have you messaged them daily on WhatsApp and text message to tell them what activity you're doing to help build trust?
Speaker 2:No, I haven't done that. Have you regularly presented them with comparable sales what else is on the market and what else has been sold in the past week to try and educate them what the market's doing? No, I haven't done that. Have you shown them competitors' properties that are in competition? No, I haven't. Have you provided them with case studies of other campaigns that have gone down a similar path in the last couple of weeks and what they've done to turn things around? No, I haven't.
Speaker 2:I think we went through this exercise and I think they were actually and I'm actually looking at it as we speak Lee and I've probably got 50 ideas there of things that they could have done that they didn't. Now this agent unfortunately had a mindset of the vendor's an idiot, the vendor's greedy and won't meet the market, versus that real, honest introspection of saying have I done everything and I can't get the vendor to move here, I can't get the buyer to come up, I need to go back to the drawing board and keep working on this to make it happen. And that's the big difference between that first agent and the second agent. And to answer your I know I'm answering a short question, long, but you asked me what my observations are out there the observation of the successful agent today is the one that just keeps going and asking themselves questions.
Speaker 1:Adam that was so powerful. If we unpack this and there's a lot to unpack in that the traits of the greats is they expect to follow a winning sequence to get a winning result. And it doesn't matter who you are and what you do. In any profession there's an approach to it, there's a way of thinking about it, and it's like when I have to go and speak on the road, you've got to take all this different gear with you because you've got to be mobile. You can't just zip back to base and pick up what you forgot. You've got to really think, and the packing checklists that we have to go through for all the different events is what a professional would do, versus you get there and the poor person's bought their ticket and you don't have the right gear and that means you're not in the right frame of mind and the outcome is going to follow. Not that you didn't perform well on stage, but you just didn't pack right the day before. So having a professional sequence is how a professional works, no different to the pilot of a plane. Doesn't skip the checklist because it's flight 300. They follow the exact same checklist as flight one. And what I love about what you explained there is. People expect to get an outcome, as in this is going to sell, but there's a gap between that moment and the starting moment. But none of those pieces can be missed. So, be it the setup to sell, meeting, the thank you for listing letters going out or email, and then the how did you feel about those? Thoughts were about to hit the market. The shift to focus letter then goes out when you look at that professional sequence, so that even in a week and a half, when that first buyer engagement moment happens, you can layer off everything that you did.
Speaker 1:But if you did not do it, you're going to be a person who's not taking the responsibility because you didn't do it, and then you're blaming the easiest thing, which is the person who's not in a position to understand what they don't know. The owner doesn't know what they don't know. If you miss all those steps along the way, it'd be like throwing someone in the last 10 minutes of the movie and say what did you think? And they go well, I don't know what happened before you. So who was that? And that person got killed and this happened and that happened.
Speaker 1:But if you didn't see the ramp up to the last 10 minutes of the movie. There's no way you could understand it. So we've listed it silence. And then suddenly we've got this great offer but the owner can't see or understand that that is all not a good offer yet the case studies, the reflection of the marketing and how that's been done. And the greatest thing about real estate is it'll never change in its three layers of attract, engage, commit. That's how real estate works, but that's on the front end, a hundred percent.
Speaker 2:Lee. Yeah, I spoke to an agent a few weeks ago and they said to me that they've had a property on the market for three months. Right. And I said to them when was the last time you met the vendor? And they said I've never met the vendor, wow. And I said why? And they said because the Vendor lives an hour and a half drive from here and this is a million dollar property with a 2% fee. And I said you're going to command a $20,000 fee and you've never met them. And I said how many offers have you presented? And they said none. Yet the owner's an idiot because they won't take the offer.
Speaker 1:Yeah, how's that serving you?
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I think you look at platforms where for digital signing, which are absolutely fantastic, but I think there's a danger there where agents are usually as an excuse not to meet vendors and not to connect and, again, the top agents are using these platforms but they're still sitting down with the owners and saying sign on the glass, and this agent is wondering why the vendor is not taking offers. Conversely, I walk into this office with this strong agent and he says invariably, the vendors turn around to him after a few weeks and say what do you think I should do? Should I take the offer, which is a very, very different position to be.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for sure, because they've built that trust. And, adam, so many times in coaching I'll have that phone call. Same thing vendor won't accept the offer. This is what we're up to as a coach. You're coming in at the last two minutes of the movie. You've got nothing there.
Speaker 1:But one question I ask which just fascinates me, doesn't get an answer. I'll say, okay, I understand that. So what are their names? And names are so important to me. Like there's Michael, mick and Mike. They're three different. They're all born with the same name but their names different when they come into life. So Mick and Mike and Michael are three different people. Then I ask why are they selling? It's amazing how many people don't know the true answer to that.
Speaker 1:We teach that question and, adam, you and I were having a coach-to-coach discussion about the listing conversation. To stop presenting and interview the owner. And to interview the owner is that question-based moment. And have you definitely made the decision to sell the property we have? And should we get a great result here? What we miss most about the home? And then the starting to warm up to the question line. And just so I'm clear, so I can help you best, adam, what is your current situation. It's that moment. I'm going to jump question to question here. Another thing I remember you and I were chatting one day and your daughter had to go and get braces and you went to the first dentist and he said you can do this, this, this or this, and you're like I don't know. And then the second person said you can do this, this, this and this, but if it was my daughter, I'll be doing this. That's the moment of leadership where you're not just there to provide these marketing options and float it on the portals, you're actually there to lead them to a decision.
Speaker 1:Another trait of the greats is they're good at leadership. But, adam, people, when I use the word leadership, think of CEOs, corporate. I'm not talking about that at all. The 22-year-old girl in the office who says I'll help with the onboarding and teach them the software. That is leadership. But in sales leadership, you've got to lead them to sign the agreement.
Speaker 1:Now you just mentioned about the sign on glass and people are not doing the, and I'm going to go back in time here because I love it. The quote pad close. So you're coming to this end of the listing conversation and I say, adam, if it's all right with you. I'd just like to put my quote in writing so I can leave it with you and you'll know exactly what it is I'm committing to.
Speaker 1:And, adam, a lot of agents say things but they don't deliver and that's been a challenge in our industry. So I'm going to point out everything I'm going to do, what the investment is, what we've agreed on, marketing, where the pricing is. That way, you know exactly what it is that I'm going to agree to and, if you're in agreement, you can sign the agreement and that will activate my services. But actually filling in the quote, which is the agency agreement, allowed people to understand the terms of it, whereas if you miss that part, which is the little bridge to yes, and you're whipped away and like I'll just quickly shoot you this link and they don't sign it, you miss the whole moment there of generating that trust and authenticity that they know who you are to go with you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you're spot on. And I think that when you sit down and go through the authority piece by piece and you know you've got that opportunity to open things up and it's amazing how many agents like you say they don't understand the motivation. And, you know, maybe they're not having real conversations, maybe they're not sitting down with Lee and saying, lee, okay, I know you want $700 for this home. You know what does it mean to you if you get $600?. You know, can you stay here for a few more years? What does that mean to you? How does that affect your life If you were here for another couple of years? What does that look like? If you sold and you got $50,000 less than what you wanted? How does that affect you? It's not until you ask these direct questions and I think people see it as trying, whilst the top operators see that as showing interest and genuinely helping people by trying to understand their needs and wants.
Speaker 2:I had an agent through my house not long ago. Audrey, my wife and I. We happened to bump into a house not far from here and we thought, okay, maybe we'll pursue it. We didn't end up buying it, we decided against it, but I had a top agent through my house here in Malvern in Melbourne Top top agent in the area gave me an appraisal, told me what my house was worth. But even that person failed to really understand or show an interest in why we've chosen to do this move. And what a lot of agents don't realize is that selling a house and buying a house is a big issue for people and there's always a big story. What's the big story for us at the moment? And it's amazing how few agents take the time to actually understand the story behind the sale rather than just talking price. And this is what it's worth and this is what I think you should auction it. And even these top agents fail to do that. And my wife actually noticed it and mentioned it to me.
Speaker 1:So that's a technique issue, isn't it? And from our original point there of interview the owner, to interview the owner is no different to an interviewing process. In a podcast like today, we're trying to fix something and trying to get to a point. Consultancy is like that. What am I fixing? I know when people ring up for my help, I say, look, I'm probably available, but what do you need me for? What can I do? Because I don't want to go somewhere for the sake of it. Unless you can add value and impact, it's a waste of money.
Speaker 1:Now, when someone's thinking and moving, they may need help with that thinking and that's why what's your current situation? If we got you a great price, where would you be off to what we miss most about this home? When do you need to be there? If it didn't get the price that you're hoping to achieve, is it still worth your plans to move on? And I love that direct line of questioning in leadership where you say and Adam, you're my vendor. And I say, adam, the offer we have now is the best I've got from everyone I've had through.
Speaker 1:The other three people that did offer have now purchased elsewhere, so they're instantaneously no longer part of this sale, whereas they were before. Now some of them paid more for a different property. Some of them paid less. But that competition is now gone and what I have on the table for you is the best I have by far in the buyer engagement level. Now, if that meets your expectations and you want to release the asset onto them, they will be the future owner. If you say no to them, adam, that makes you the highest bidder and you remain the owner, because you cannot sell it until you agree to release it to somebody else. Not sell it until you agree to release it to somebody else, but when you don't accept that you've outbid them. You've just paid this amount of money for the home and yet you wanted to move on. How am I best to help you here? But a trait of the greats is to not try and be right, but try and be understood.
Speaker 2:Yes, you can only have those conversations that you've just had with me is if you've had direct dialogue and frequency. Frequency builds trust and I love that. Saying the best agents that I meet they're in daily conversation with their vendors. They're speaking to them daily. I was with someone last week. They rang their vendor and they said oh hi, john, I just want to let you know I've got nothing to tell you today and nothing's happened today and I'll touch base tomorrow. And that was enough for the vendor to think well, john, you're thinking about me all the time. Well, sorry, the agent, you're thinking about me all the time. You've checked in with me today You've got nothing to report. I'm okay with that.
Speaker 2:Now, if you're doing that every day and you're sending a little WhatsApp message or you're sending a text message daily saying just had two inquiries on REA, follow them up, one of them might come on the weekend. I'll keep you posted, chat soon. Just those little touch points. Put yourself in a position where, when you do get that offer, lee, you want that vendor saying well, what's your advice? What shall I do? Because they're confident and they know that every stone's been turned. And if they don't think that every stone's been turned and that you haven't done absolutely everything, they're not in a position to release the property.
Speaker 1:Couldn't agree more. Another great trade of the greats here. I'd be driving back to the office and I'd see a Ray White sign and have a soul sticker on it, and it wouldn't be dissimilar to one of the ones I've got which has got an unsold sticker on it. And I'd rock into the office and go does anyone know who bought that property at 26 Tall Road? And one of the guys go yeah, that was one of mine. They paid X amount of dollars for it and they exchanged two days ago. Great, did they see our one? Yeah, yeah, took them through yours and no, it wasn't for them.
Speaker 1:Straight onto the phone to the owner Hi, helen, just want to report back to you on some action in the marketplace today. They go what's happening? Well, there's a lady called Robin Williams who came through your home two weeks ago, loved the home, thought it was one of the best presented homes on the market. But two days ago she's exchanged on the property that you've probably driven past there at 35 Tall Road with Ray White. Now she purchased that one for $40,000 less than us, but we did investigate to find out why and she said it wasn't as well presented but it had more volume.
Speaker 1:There was a rumpus room, there was a parents retreat, and to generate that or build that and add it on would be probably 200,000. So they felt that was the right decision. But it's good to see in the marketplace we're getting a reaction like that. Now if they drive past Ray Whiteside and actually think that's sold, my house is better, my agent's crap. That's the outcome of that. So every time I see a sold sign, who bought it? And you've got to be so careful. It's one of your own buyers that you're speaking to, but you don't ask that question.
Speaker 2:What you've just done there is, which is, a lot of agents are so scared of giving bad news. Right, and the reason they're scared of giving bad news is because what they do is they say well, lee, you're my vendor. Now I've had a look at all the sales in the area and there's one here that's Ray White, just sold on the weekend and if you have a look at it, lee, it's got an extra bedroom and it's 200 square meters bigger. And when we look at that and we look at yours, I think that that's probably worth $40,000 more than yours. Now that's a very uncomfortable conversation. If the vendor thinks that you don't believe that you're going to get the price, then you're not going to get the price.
Speaker 2:What you've done is you've actually separated the agent from it and you've said this is the feedback. The buyer said that they preferred the other one. This is why they liked the other one. We investigated why and if agents do that and all the top agents do that they personify it into a buyer's feedback and when you do that, you shouldn't be scared of giving that regular news, because it's not your news, it's not your opinion. You're just passing on the feedback. So don't cheat the messenger, so to speak. I love how you did that. You're just passing on the feedback, so don't shoot the messenger, so to speak.
Speaker 1:I love how you did that. Storytelling is a skill and the owners don't forget anyone Like you're three weeks into a campaign and they go. What happened to the guy with the duffel coat in the rain jacket at the first day? And you're like I hope they locked him up. But they don't forget anyone. Oh, they were back out the front the other day. Okay, thanks for letting me know that.
Speaker 1:But if you do forget a story, everything's about soul stories, the reason why someone buys, the reason why someone sells, and, adam, this one just come to my radar as we're doing Traits of the Greats. One of the Traits of the Greats is to not say it was easy, which is a massive mistake. And for all our listeners, write this one down fake read. So, adam, you and I could be chatting you're my potential seller and you ring me up and you go Lee, I can't believe the result you got for that property in Marshall Street. I go, adam, that was a very, very good result. Our owners are delighted, but I've got to tell you, adam, behind the scenes, it's a bit of a fake read and you'll go. What do you mean? Well, the owner's invested $20,000 in repairs to get the property to a level of finished product, because the only good results we're seeing at the moment especially that one is for finished product. If something's unfinished skirting boards aren't painted or missing, or a door's not there or it's swinging loose, people aren't prepared to take on somebody else's not there or it's swinging loose, people aren't prepared to take on somebody else's problems.
Speaker 1:We took it to the market and we used our attract engage commit. We had a very detailed offering with the floor plan, the video, the walkthrough. We were going for an international purchaser. We've got a lot of people registered overseas who are Australian residents but trying to buy back in the area. So we went right through to the international launch, which was obviously everyone registered on REA and the buyer we attracted was great and agreed to pay the price. But then the bank mathematically said no, there's no surrounding sales at that level. We're not funding it. So, adam, I spent two weeks getting the right surrounding sales, working with the bank closely, and then it went through. So when you see the sold result, it's like, oh, look at that amazing Bit of a fake read. There was a lot went on behind the scenes on that one.
Speaker 2:If you make it too easy, they expect that same result.
Speaker 1:Well, and the other issue is oh yeah, that was easy. We sold it off market over reserve or over their expectations. We want to put ours on the market. It's so easy. Why are you?
Speaker 1:charging me so much and it doesn't. Off-agent will be the next craze, as off-market just means you didn't have an agreement signed. So all these thoughts, adam, are just amazing, especially in this vendor communication, vendor management stage. One thing I'm noticing in the marketplace now, and it's probably my younger agents who are better at this, whereas some of my traditional agents they're still not over the wall and they still think these things are going to happen. And it's amazing how it's a two-way street, that in prospecting and lead generation, some of our more traditional agents did it well and it was just part of it, whereas today, in some of our more traditional agents did it well and it was just part of it, whereas today, in some of the younger agents, they're trying to skip that step. And you can't skip the step of building a database of followers who want to ask you questions and need your assistance in the marketplace.
Speaker 1:But one thing I've been able to get some of the younger agents to understand is VPA and value performance advertising being the new agents to understand. Is VPA and value performance advertising being the new term for that is to explain to the consumer that you don't have to use your own money. It can come off on settlement. We have our sale fund up process and with an authority signed we'd get up to 60,000, which we don't need. But we can do all the repairs, we can do those changes and this is your last chance to flip the property. It's your principal place of residence and it's tax-free. The amount of agents that don't communicate the opportunity to do a price improvement program versus whacking on the net? See what we get. And Adam, I've been down to Melbourne a little bit recently, more than normal, and again finished product is getting the result out there.
Speaker 2:Look, I 100% agree. I think that, again, talking about the traits of the greats, the traits of the greats feel it's their responsibility as a professional to say it the way it is and they're not afraid to do so. And if they feel like the property needs some money spent, they understand that they need to make those recommendations. They don't shy away from giving the right advice. And the other thing is they don't make excuses. And it's amazing how many times I'll hear an agent make an offer to a vendor or pass an offer on to the vendor and they say, oh, don't worry about that one because that one was run down, and they make excuses for the vendor. So they're not giving that news straight. The best agents they speak candidly. They're very forthright in their advice. What we find now is a lot of agents are customer service orientated. They very much come from the stance of nothing's too much trouble and whatever you want, we'll do. And, Lee, I tell the story about my daughter when she needed some work done on her mouth a couple of years ago, and I think it's a great way to really separate the high performingperforming agent from the average agent.
Speaker 2:We went to see an orthodontist and the orthodontist said to us well, yes, Layla needs some work done. These are the options. She can either have braces, she can have Invisalign, she can have a plate. You can leave it and do nothing and see what happens. All of these options are available to you, Adam. You're the client. Whatever you want, we're here to please, and whichever you want, we can go down that path.
Speaker 2:What would you like to do? We didn't know what to do. We're saying well, hang on, you're the expert here, what's your recommendation? We then didn't feel very comfortable with that. Orthodontist went to another orthodontist and he looked at our daughter's mouth and he said ah, I've seen this before, I've seen this hundreds of times before, this situation, this problem. That gave us instant trust that he's encountered that hundreds of times before and it's nothing new. And he said you can do Invisalign, you can have braces, you can have a plate, you can do all these things. But there's absolutely no doubt in my mind that if this was my daughter, I'd be going down the braces option, Absolutely no doubt. Now, what would you like to do, Adam?
Speaker 1:Love it.
Speaker 2:We absolutely went with that dentist. There was absolutely no choice for us. They were forthright in their recommendation. They showed us that they'd done it hundreds of times before, so they had proof of evidence that it works. And we wanted to be guided. We wanted to be guided and and I find so many agents and lee, you know, you've said to me off camera, you've seen the same thing. You know their customer service. What would you like, mr and mrs vendor? Here's three advertising packages. Would you like gold, silver or bronze? We're advertising packages. Would you like gold, silver or bronze? We're here to please. Whatever you like, we can do it for you. Whilst the agent, that is, the high-performing agent that gets what they want because they know it's in the vendor's best interest. It's very much. This is the campaign that I would use on my family's home. This is gold. You can do silver and bronze if you want, but if you're my family, there's absolutely no doubt in my mind. I've done it before hundreds of times. This is the campaign to go down, adam.
Speaker 1:I love this one, I love this one, and I was teaching this yesterday. So let's discuss the marketing of your property. You've got many, many options, but they really come down to two. You can go with the essentials marketing package or the amplified marketing package, and if it was my place, I'm going amplified. I would not risk putting a property of this level on the market unamplified. So that's my recommendation. And they go right, amplified. It's so simple.
Speaker 2:I love that terminology, and as soon as you present two advertising schedules to a vendor or you say these are the things you could do to your house.
Speaker 2:You could paint. You could not paint. You could do the garden you could not. What you're actually saying to the vendor is they're not essential. You present two packages. I'm going to go the lower one. Again, we talk traits of the best, traits of the greats. They present one schedule and they sell it with conviction. This is what I'll be doing. This is absolutely no doubt. This is what you need to do.
Speaker 1:And a great analogy here for the non-believing of marketer is to say look, just before I explain the marketing to you, when was the last time you sold a car? I said, oh, we sold one a couple of years ago. Okay, did you empty it? Yep. Did you detail it? Yep. Did you clean it? Yep. Did you not drive it because people were seeing it? Yep. You went to all that trouble for the car, which is probably the total cost of one offer that we're going to get on your house. So let's discuss the marketing of the most important part of this whole thing the value, performance advertising that we need to get you the result you deserve. And we're not here to price it, we're here to promote it. And in the promotions you can go the essentials package or you go the amplified package, but it's pretty much like detailing a car or not detailing the car.
Speaker 1:You just hosed it down. But everyone knows, the last time they sell the car they get it all ready to go and don't drive it, leave it in the driver. They're coming to see it. Well, that's no different to a house. But just you know the car could be worth 20 grand, 30 grand. That's one offer on the big asset. So let's make sure we amplify the campaign and get you the profit you deserve. This is one of my favorite traits of the greats.
Speaker 1:The best buyers quite often aren't looking at REA if they've given up. So, for example, they go out, they look at stack of homes they sell at auction. They think you know what, I've had enough, we're going to park it, we're going to put it on the back burner. Suddenly you've got the most cracking listing that comes up. You reach out to them and say, adam, I know you've stopped looking, but I've actually had another one come up. It hasn't been on the portals yet. It seems to me it's got the perfect connection to what you were looking for. Would you allow me the opportunity to take you through it? And they go through and they buy it. And everyone says why do they buy it? Because they're not looking at anything else. That's the reason they buy it. But bringing someone back into the market and I'll announce this one as an official one. Adam, we just bought a property in our street and we nearly didn't because there was no letterbox drops to say this property was on the market. So agents in our street think, oh, you'll see it on REA. I wasn't looking to buy, so I wasn't looking at REA, but I do like the street and we put our daughter into the property. So for all the agents, they think, oh, you don't need to do the Marble Shops anymore, you don't need to do this, the most important part of the street campaign, and I teach this nonstop and people miss it. They think, okay, we've got this property in the street, but there's no need to do the DL because they'll see it on REA. That is an incorrect thought.
Speaker 1:The actual opportunity of door knocking the street on the Wednesday. So if I door knocked your house, there's so many people working from home now, adam, it's just fantastic. You're going to catch more people than ever in your statistical life of working and they open the door. Hi, lee from ABC Real Estate, just letting you know number 12, marshall Street's coming on the market this Saturday If you're open to attending. It's at 11.30.
Speaker 1:We're just letting all the residents know the chance to claim the door and the person then says to you oh, what do you think it's going to go for? Well, they've chosen auction, they want an outcome on price, but the surrounding sales have been from this to this. Would you like me to texture the sole result? When it's done, they go yeah, that'd be great. Just grab your mobile number. I'll just share my contact with you so you know it's me and not some weird scam out there. And you've claimed the door In your world. Adam, it was number 18 Marshall Street. It's a weatherboard home. You're ticking that in the database to go find weatherboard send. Claiming doors is the most important reason to take a property to the market. We know it's going to sell, but how many doors can you claim along the way? And there's no better than that face-to-face moment. Would you like me to text you the sold result? But if people find that boring and too much hassle and I'll just wait for the buyers to come through, you've missed the trade of the great.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely. And how good is it when you're one of those greats and you can communicate with your vendor regularly and show them that absolutely every stone has been turned. This is the best offer that's out there. You've gone to the neighbors. You've done your letter drops. You've scoured the street. You've done your letter drops. You've scoured the street. You've targeted both the active and the passive buyer. Hand on heart, you can say this is the best offer.
Speaker 1:It's time to accept it 100%, otherwise it's just a massive gap. And then there's this they're an idiot. And then, geez, your last 10 vendors in a row have been idiots. How's your career going? And you realize it's not them. If it's to be, it's up to me. And I think anyone listening to this audio today just shift your thinking.
Speaker 1:And some of the biggest breakthroughs I've had with people is when they're asking me for advice, say, okay, yeah, tell me your story, yep, good, and you think it's all this and that. And then I'll say what if you're wrong? They go. What do you mean? What if you think is absolutely wrong and you're going to spend the next 10 years of your career doing something that I can tell you now is absolutely wrong?
Speaker 1:That favorite saying comes up you can't read the label from inside the jar. You've reached out for professional help. I look after people doing 10 times your volume and you're asking me a question and from what you've just proposed and said to me, I'm telling you you see it wrong and unless you can unsee it wrong, it's not going to serve you well. It doesn't matter how many people you ask. Some people have too many voices, but I get some incredible phone calls from incredible people that need to have a conversation at that level, but they trust your judgment, and the powerful thing about coaching as you know, adam, for being a wonderful coach is we're neutral, we're not financially affected by it. They're reaching out because they trust your guidance, but also you're seeing it from a broader range and not isolated to one situation.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely. To be able to have those conversations is essential. You know you talk about marketing, you know we talked a fair bit about marketing and you know we go back to the traits of the greats. You know the traits of the greats when they can only sell a $5,000 campaign instead of a $9,000 campaign, they don't turn around and say, well, the vendor wouldn't spend more than five grand. They turn around and say why haven't I been able to convince the vendor to spend the nine? Why have I only been able to convince him to spend five? What am I missing here? I need to go back to the drawing board. I need to look at my dialogue. I need to look at my collateral that I'm bringing to that meeting because I've only been able to convince them to spend five.
Speaker 2:And the top, top agents in this country, they always have that attitude. It's always about them and why they haven't been able to do it. Why haven't they been able to close the gap between the buyer and seller? Why haven't they been able to get the buyer up? Not that the buyer won't pay more, because the buyer's an idiot, but why haven't I been able to get the buyer up?
Speaker 2:And when you have that attitude of owning that situation. If it is to be, it's up to me. That's when you'll ask the question, say okay, well, maybe I've got to get the buyer into the office. Maybe I need to show the buyer other brochures of other things that have sold, like what you might do with a vendor. Maybe I need to do that exercise with the buyer and show them that it's worth more. These are what the greats are doing today. They're constantly asking questions of themselves why can't I get the buyer? Why have I got this deal made? What am I missing? What more can I do? Can I get someone else in my office to sit in a meeting and say well, mr and Mrs Buyer pay more because I sold this one. So there's always more to do.
Speaker 1:Couldn't agree more. And final trade of the greats here, if I had a buyer who I know is the buyer for the property. But they just don't know it yet and I need to assist them in that process. One I know I need to be in conversation. I need to be in conversation face-to-face. However, I also need to neutralize the situation, and to neutralize it is very simple.
Speaker 1:You ring up, you say, adam, we don't seem to be able to pull this together for you on 26 Tall Road, so let's park that one that's going to sell anyway. Someone will take that sooner or later. But I still have to find you somewhere and if we're not going to go the distance on that one, I've got another property I can show you. Are you available tomorrow afternoon 3.15? I'll whiz past your place, pick you up and I'll go out to the property. It's not too far from where you are and it's actually only two streets away from the one that you've fell in love with. So can I pick you up tomorrow and I pick them up and show them something that they're just not going to like at all. But I've got central locking selling going on. I can lock all the doors. Yeah, I love it and I can have this conversation and then they'll go no, no, that was terrible, that wasn't what we're looking for.
Speaker 1:And I said you know that home will sell as well. The one that you didn't go ahead with that I truly believe you should will also sell. And the only thing that's happening here is just homes are selling and you're not acquiring one. Maybe we need to look at it different, and I know you feel this way at the moment. But if I was to ring you tomorrow and say that one's gone and that one's gone, they're out of the marketplace and we've got nothing else to show you, at the moment you're still in the same spot.
Speaker 1:Why don't we go back to the house that you do have a connection with and just step me through what you think you'd have to do or not do, and I'll see what I can do for you? They'd walk in and, sure enough, on that third or fourth time and getting someone back the fourth time is a skill and a half. They just see it different. But you're in the house and then you can do the braces technique. If it was me, I'd just take it. I'm sick of waiting and watching all these other ones going up, and it's that one moment they go all right. What do we need to do? But that's the skill. How do you get them back there?
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely. You've hit the nail on the head. You're picking them up, you're taking them. How do you get them back there? Well, you've said I'll come past and pick you up. That's how you're getting them back there. Central Locker yeah, and you know what that's? Old school real estate. That's how we used to do things and connect with people and the traits of the greats. The greats are still doing that. The greats are still picking up a buyer and putting him in the car. The greats are still meeting a vendor with an iPad instead of sending an authority. They're meeting the buyer. You know, and this is you know. We haven't touched on this, but you know.
Speaker 2:As far as buyer work, you know I'm seeing agents today. You know. This is the typical thing that I'm witnessing. You buyer calls up the agent and says I came to on Saturday, I'd like to make an offer on the property, and the agent says well, no problems, what I'm going to do is I'm going to send you a link. Please fill it in with your offer and send it back to me.
Speaker 2:And I'm seeing more and more of that sort of activity happening where, again, it's customer service, it's not sales, it's not hunting the best out there are still saying I know you want to make an offer. Rather than me sending you a link, let me come and see you and talk you through the process. And every time I've seen an agent do that and literally jump in the car and go see the buyer, every single time, without exception, they've managed to get more money out of the buyer. They've managed to reduce that settlement from 90 days to 60 days. They've managed to overcome the objection about, well, I've only got 5% deposit, not 10%. But the best are still doing that.
Speaker 2:The best are still meeting the buyer Even better. They'd say to the buyer well, listen, why don't you meet me down at the property? You know, even better. They'd say to the buyer well, listen, you know why don't you meet me down at the property? I'm going to be there nearby and we'll do the paperwork together and solidifying the buyer's want for that property. And again, you know we talk about the great versus the not great. You know the not great are sending the link and waiting for it to come back and they're not negotiating.
Speaker 1:And that sales skill of influence the greats have that still, yeah, and call it influence or leadership. Another trait of the greats is the takeaway. So you've got the buyer up in price and now the vendors not seeing it correctly, and we've had that conversation. You can say no and remain the owner and Adam, there's no stamp duty. You can say no and remain the owner and Adam, there's no stamp duty. The second time around, when you're the highest bidder. So you know there's a win.
Speaker 1:But, then you've got to ring back late at night and say Adam, I didn't get them up any further but I didn't want to leave you unknowing. But I did go back. We had a very detailed conversation and they said something to me that was interesting. They used a word that always concerns me. They didn't say they can't pay anymore. They said they won't pay anymore. And, Adam, that word is very different in my world. Can't I'll find someone who can, but when they can and won't, that means they're paying a premium. So, Adam, I need your consent now to release them. I'm going to take them off your property, but I just wanted to have this conversation with you because I'm going to sell them something else. But I just need your consent to sell them something else. And you're prepared to release them off your property, or would you like to think about it tonight and come back to me tomorrow?
Speaker 2:I love that. I love that. I love that. I love how you're asking permission, permission To let them go, because it's final, this is it, this is it, it's final. It's actually saying to them when you said that to me, it was like shit, am I in or am I out?
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I'm actually asking the owner to take responsibility for the person moving on. As funny as it is that line about you can always say no and remain the owner because you're the highest bidder, there's something really powerful about that, where the owner thinks but I don't want the property, I want to sell it, so why do you keep buying it back?
Speaker 2:That was actually scary when you said that to me, because I thought well shit, am I keeping it.
Speaker 1:It had a real impact and most owners will think I wouldn't pay that for this place. That's the exact point. But, adam, a great session today and I love just having a very high-end coach on the program who's had an incredible real estate career. And, adam, my final point to you, which is your own trade of the greats, was right now everyone's still saying lead generation listings are tight, is the hardest thing, and you had a prospecting system that just produced over 100 deals a year. It was so mapped out, you blended it beautifully. You must see that missing as you're coaching now, because you had it perfected.
Speaker 2:We talk about insanity. I find that there are people in this industry who are always looking for new people to do business with. I'll give you an example. I did some work recently with a gentleman been in real estate for 30 years, nicest guy you'll ever meet. He's just the most lovable. You can't not like this guy. And I said to him let's just call him Barry, not his real name. But I said Barry, how many properties have you sold in your 30-year career? And he said I've got no idea. I said guess for me. He said probably 500. And I said okay, and how many of these 500? So if you've done 500 sales, you've got 500 buyers, 500 sellers, so you've got a thousand people. I said how many?
Speaker 1:of those thousand do you reckon?
Speaker 2:like you? And he said probably 950. And I said I'm of those thousand. Do you reckon like you? And he said probably 950. And I said I'm sure they probably do, because you're a great guy. And I said, out of these 500 properties that you've sold, how many of these thousand people have you stayed in contact with? And he said almost none of them. I just hope that they're going to come back to me.
Speaker 2:Seven years later, 10 years later, and I said to him well, and he actually approached me because he wanted to start running a patch and he's not good with technology, he's an older gentleman and it took about five minutes for us to realize that the best activity for him to do is actually connect with those thousand people who know trust, like him already, and rather than trying to find new people, let's start nurturing those people.
Speaker 2:So the first thing that we did was we actually sent an apology letter to those thousands saying I'm sorry, it's been remiss of me. You slipped through the cracks and you got lost in the system, but I'm here now and you did sell with me five years ago and I'd like to reconnect. And Barry realized that if he starts connecting with those thousand people and five of them 5% transact every year. Well, there's 50 listings. He's starting to make a pretty good career of that. So there are so many Barry's out there that are always looking for new people and doing the social and the media, and you and I have spoken a lot about nurturing the people. That you already know and that's what I spend a lot of time with is spending time with the Barry's on saying, well, how are we going to communicate with these people with good, direct, targeted marketing forever? So when Barry sells in 10 years, it's just a no brainer that you're getting a seat in the lounge room.
Speaker 1:Adam, this is my favorite topic in the world, so love the one you're with is the greatest marketing campaign in the world. Now, last year I wrote the book Claiming Doors, which is for everyone coming in and they don't have people. For Barry it's reclaiming doors. He's already had the doors but have done nothing with them and it's amazing how people chase strangers and they don't realize. I'll give an example. I had to tour this week for McGrath and I've got another tour for them next week. But what's important about that is not the brand, but John McGrath was my first customer. So to be touring 30 years later for the same first established client and I'm still working for the brand today and then to record the Matt Steinway program the other week. You could look at it two ways. You could think you haven't gone far when you look at it that way. Or I'm just honored when an established client rings up and I get many phone calls where they say Lee came to the course 15 years ago, five years ago, and we were at our best when we were with you and we want to get back to. And really all they want to get back to is structure and stop hoping it's all just going to turn up.
Speaker 1:Simple is difficult, and I say that a lot because people are looking for this next app trick way to do it. Yet I know myself. I have to follow checklists, I have to follow sequences. I'm passionate about marketing, but I use continuous marketing, so continuous marketing is. Every day I do something that will prompt that opportunity to happen. The podcast comes out every week. Everyone's listening to it and I'm blessed that people listen to the podcast. And, adam, having someone of your caliber on board today is why the podcast works. But this is my number one lead source in the and you can see how it works. Love the one you're with. Everyone who's ever met me or seen me speak gets the podcast and I just hope they profit from that knowledge. But I'm refreshing my name. I'm still here should you need me.
Speaker 2:And that's all. Marketing is yeah, and everyone knows who you are, Lee, because you do that. Well, you know, I spoke to a I'm off to Adelaide on Monday and said to someone I'm working with Lee Woodward. I've been working. He's been a guy who's just started in real estate but he knows who you are because you get your name out.
Speaker 1:And then they get to the seminar, adam, and they go. I thought he'd be taller.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, he actually said that to me on five. That's why you should do it on Zoom. It's fine. Actually I'm working with this guy. I'll just say very, very quickly because I'll just tell you where I think the biggest hole in our business is. If we've got a couple more minutes, we do. And this is what I've discovered over the last two years. The biggest hole in our business is the vendor that says I'm going to sell between three months, or let's call it three to six months, and two years, and I'm finding that most agents that I meet have no system for nurturing in that period of time. And I call it the Marshall syndrome and he won't mind me saying this.
Speaker 2:When I was at Gary Pier in Melbourne selling full-time, when I was up against Marshall, who was my main competitor and we're very, very good friends now so I can say this and he knows I do reference to him but Marshall was a really good presenter in the lounge room and when I sat down and I was competing against Marshall, I was probably 50-50 to get it. He was a good presenter. I was a good presenter when the client said I'm going to sell in 12 months or I'm going to sell in 9 months or 18 months. I knew I'd beat Marshall every single time. Every single time Because I know that Marshall's got about three months of chase in him and then he drops off.
Speaker 2:And this is typical of about 90% of agents I meet and I spend a lot of time with agents on that three-month to 24-month period because I actually don't understand why an agent goes to an appraisal with someone and I call you for an appraisal and you say, look, I'm looking at selling in 12 months' time For the agent that doesn't do much in that 12 months because they've got a diary system and they've got another contact note to call up Lee and then eventually they get lost in cyberspace. I kind of go well, why go if you're not going to communicate for the next 12 months? So for agents, you get that period right and I call it that warm period. They tend to double their income or triple their income for not much more work and I reckon that's the biggest hole where agents can 2x their income if they get that warm list right or that warm chase list. It's the biggest hole in our industry.
Speaker 1:I 100% agree with you and let's give that a final label on term of traits of the greats, If you look at what a brilliant agent does, any of the greats, they chip and chase. Yeah, Chip and chase. And chip and chase is such a skill versus I found it, they didn't list. I found it, they didn't list. You can't just keep doing that and Charles Tarby said this to me. It was such a powerful thing, Lee, when you get a certain level of professionalism, the money finds you and the opportunity of nurturing is to actually demonstrate professionalism. But it protects you on fee. It protects you on the shootouts. You'll get 80% of the business. Of the people who know you, the hardest ones are met. You once don't know who you are and I sent you that Matt Steinway program and you look and listen to that. And Matt was just so good at nurturing he never prospected to get a listing that day. I just want to build that relationship and in a couple of years time all these things come back to me.
Speaker 2:But he was so simple, and simple is difficult and bringing it across that way yeah, I love it and it's gold and for someone like Matt, he understands that medium to long-term choice and that's where the money is.
Speaker 1:That's where the money is. Well, Adam Joski, we will definitely have you on the program in the future. Great to see you in the consulting and training world. How do people get hold of you if they want some of the Adam Joski consultancy?
Speaker 2:Yes, well, they can email me at adamjoski at outlookcom, which is A-D-A-M-J-O-S-K-E at outlookcom, or ring me anytime, day or night, 0414-337-979. And, yeah, happy to help anyone at any time, particularly with my little baby that I love and you know that, which is database management, nurturing and the warm chase which is what we just spoke about. And yeah, look, it's something that I'm passionate about and I love doing it.
Speaker 1:Adam Joski, thank you for joining us. Thanks, Lee, Adam Joski, thank you for joining us. Thanks, Lee. And that concludes another edition of we Are Selling. For those of you attending the Complete Salesperson course, make sure you come up and say hello and that you are listening to the podcast. We've had so many great agents come through the course this year and I look forward to seeing you at the Complete Salesperson.