56. Embracing Vulnerability: A Journey of Transformation with Dai Manuel

How often do we mask our struggles and fears behind a brave face, afraid to show vulnerability? Especially as a man?

Meet Dai Manuel, lifestyle mentor and executive performance coach, who knows this all too well. His journey, fraught with battles against food and alcohol addiction, inspires us all to face our personal demons and transform from within. Dai's candor about his early years and the honesty required to shift his mindset gives us a glimpse into his journey of transformation.

Self-discovery is often a long and winding road. For Dai, it started in his teenage years, when he realized he needed to make critical changes. From shedding weight to quitting drinking to confronting fears associated with personal growth, Dai's life is a testament to resilience.

Dai's compelling story is a beacon of transformation powered by vulnerability. From managing anxiety and depression to preventing self-sabotage, he provides vital insights on mental health.

Listen closely as he shares his unique approach to the 'Five Fs' that create a balanced life and his tips on managing commitments and sharing resources. Dai's journey is a must-listen for men, or anyone seeking to lead a healthier and more balanced life, a firm reminder that it's never too late to rewrite your story. Tune in and be inspired.

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:40

Hello everybody and welcome back. I had the pleasure of talking to Dai Manuel, who is a man with a vulnerable story to share. Dai is a lifestyle mentor and executive performance coach, and he shared very openly with me about his early struggles with food and alcohol and how he overcame both through honesty, openness and a shift in mindset that starts from the inside out. Now, if you're struggling with food or alcohol or anything else that you feel takes precedent over being present in your life, you will want to definitely take a listen to my interview with Dai, so tune in. Hey everybody.

Speaker 1: 1:26

Today I have Dai Manuel, who is a lifestyle mentor and executive performance coach and who knows the struggle of the juggle and keeping his health and happiness a priority. He models his work based on the 5 Fs fitness, family, faith and finances within overarching roof of fun, built on a rock solid foundation of health. Dai is on a mission to inspire and positively impact one million role models across the globe, encouraging them to lead a functionally healthy life through education, community and a whole lot of encouragement. As an award winning digital thought leader and author, dai has mastered the art of leading by example, always staying true to his values. He knows firsthand how challenging it can be to juggle life's responsibilities while prioritizing health and happiness. So welcome to the podcast, dai. How are you today?

Speaker 2: 2:25

Thanks, Heather, fantastic. It's Vancouver, canada. It's a beautiful day today. It's brisk out, but it's going to get warmer later. I love it. It's just kind of for a little walk, but get ready for this great conversation we're going to have. I'm honored to be here with you today. I really am Great.

Speaker 1: 2:43

Fantastic. So a couple of weeks ago we talked a little off air.

Speaker 1: 2:50

I know you have a personal story that's part of your overall life story and you've had your share of personal challenges that, I believe, led you to where you are today to become a coach who helps to inspire change in others and live their best lives. So why don't we just start there with your story? I mean, I know we talked about your childhood a little bit and your relationship with alcohol, and I'm suspecting that that probably has influenced where you are now. So why don't we just jump in with that?

Speaker 2: 3:27

Well, thanks, heather. Like many of us and I'm sure there's a lot of people listening and watching this that are will be very they're going to relate.

Speaker 1: 3:37

I believe because I think we all relate to this.

Speaker 2: 3:39

I've just sort of go by Joseph Campbell's work and he coined the term the hero's journey this idea of all of us going through this life and struggling and, as Buddha says, you don't get out of this life without some suffering and we all have those moments. But it's what do we do in those moments right? And, more importantly, what do we do after? And I definitely found myself in a couple situations where pardon the cliche, but that proverbial rock bottom, I felt like I was there, but more than that I was like, hey, I wonder what's under this rock. I'm going to pick it up and crawl under it. Oh, look at that, you can go deeper. There's a subbasement, yeah, anyways. So I can appreciate when people are feeling that that place of despair and like there's nowhere else to go.

Speaker 2: 4:27

And, to be fair, my life up to about age nine was very ideal, Like very, very rock, well-ish, Like it was my brother and I with my parents. We had some pets, had a nice home. Both my parents were working professionals. My dad had a vet practice that he started and I'd go as far to give him the label he was a workaholic. I grew up watching that. That was just normal.

Speaker 2: 4:51

But my mom, she loved to work. She got great fulfillment as a registered nurse, but she always had a side hustle. Always my mom was the one that always had something going on, Was it a little antique store or eventually getting into more of a B&B to work as an interior designer, I mean, it was just always something going on the side and so I grew up with that and so that was very normal, seeing these types of things and also picking up on that work ethic and. But at age nine, you know, sort of that bomb was dropped up. My brother and I and and you know I'm going to date myself right now I'm an eighties child, right so born in late seventies. Really, those four months of years were during the eighties.

Speaker 1: 5:33

Yeah, me too. That's okay, You're not dating yourself.

Speaker 2: 5:36

Great, well I have to for my kids, to give them context right. Because they just don't understand, because this is pre-Google right, and I tell my kids I'm older than Google, so you guys, smarten up. You know, I know what the world's like without all this tech and and of course, they always rebut with what? Are you older than TVs to you know? And I'm like whoa, now you're watching. Who pays for your education?

Speaker 1: 6:00

That's what I'm saying.

Speaker 2: 6:01

But you know. So here at age nine, though, a bomb was dropped and my parents told my brother and I that we were getting divorced, you know, and and separating, ultimately divorcing, and you know I know a lot of people are thinking, well, that's not a good idea. I mean, gosh, more than half the relationships in the world nowadays end in divorce and it's like sure. But back in the mid eighties, growing up in a small town, there was a lot of stigmatized beliefs around that, you know. And there was only one other kid in my class that didn't have his original parents together. So right away, you know, there's this minority group and we don't have any outlets, anyone to speak to or talk to, and there's no resources. I don't get to go online and find communities or information to help me with this. And my parents, you know they were busy, they had their own stuff going on.

Speaker 2: 6:44

I can relate to it now because, being in my mid forties now, you know that was sort of the age that they were when this all transpired as well, you know. So it's kind of neat to see that differently. Now, you know, I have a lot more respect and empathy. But I'll tell you, going through it back then I didn't know what to do, and that emotional overwhelm. I was looking for something that I could control and I found something, and that thing was video games, movie watching and really eating my emotions, or I should say eating to influence my emotions. I learned very quickly that if I eat certain types of foods, you know, and these are foods that are usually very high calorically speaking, so they have lots of calories but very poor nutrition value, you know, and and so I'm not sitting around Heather saying hey Heather can you pass me some more salad please?

Speaker 2: 7:32

You know like that was, that was never said, okay.

Speaker 1: 7:35

Yeah, you're not getting like satisfied on carrots and celery right.

Speaker 2: 7:39

No, no, no, not at all. And so, you know, this became my normal and I found very quickly I could influence how I was feeling in those moments by eating certain things or doing certain things, and that was a valuable lesson as far as understanding how to escape from my life, and that that continued for almost six years. And by the time I was age 15, I remember very distinctly the day my mom took me to the doctor's office. Dr Quinn pulls my mom aside and says hey, betty Ann, die is morbidly obese. And you know I'm sitting in the office, the doors of the jar. I can hear them having this conversation, which I think was by design.

Speaker 2: 8:22

And I'm already feeling pretty low, like I've got dealing with some mental health challenges, especially social anxiety, feeling very depressed. You know I was lonely, I was based on my own choice, though I was very introverted. You know I sort of escaped, like, and that was just that, made me really aware of self differently. And you know my dad was mystage and I remember we came out of that. And you know, of course, my mom's concerned and she's always been someone that's battled with her weight as well. So she feels somewhat responsible for my current state and, and you know it really wasn't their fault, it was, it was me. You know I was choosing to do that and life was just really hard. It was really hard.

Speaker 2: 9:00

But you know, before I turned 16, I had this moment one day and, and I know, down the state side you have ESPN and up in Canada we have TSN, the sports network. You're right, and I always used to love watching the highlights because you know they'd have these, these TSN turning points, right, these moments where just everything changes, the tide changes for maybe somebody that was losing, or behind a few points, and they come out ahead to win it. Right, this, this, this turnaround story, and I used to love that, right? I mean, who doesn't love those kind of stories?

Speaker 2: 9:31

I mean, come on, and you know, my TSN turning point was at 15, one day, getting out of the shower, and I didn't have a chance to do my hack and, heather, I had this great way of I'd stay in the shower just a couple minutes longer, right before I get out, and I turn the water on really hot, because I knew inevitably it would create so much heat in the room that the mirror would be covered in condensation by the time I got out this way. I didn't have to look at my reflection. I get like this is the extent of which I avoided to even acknowledge how I was, and I know everyone can relate to this. You know, like when we're feeling really low, we don't want any reminders of where we're at you know, it's like I already know where I am.

Speaker 2: 10:14

I don't need you telling me right. And that morning the mirror wasn't covering a condensation. I was being rushed by my dad to get out for some commitment. I don't know what it was, even today, but regardless, I got out and in my peripheral, as I was tall enough, I just decided to turn and look at me and it was hard, it was really hard. Like instantly I just became very overwhelmed with emotions and what preceded was the ugliest of cries. You know it was. I mean, it's crying every day? I mean, probably not, but it was that uncontrollable sobbing, you know. And just literally as quickly as I was trying to tie myself off, I was getting equally wet, especially my cheeks and chest downward right. And it was hard because I saw myself for really the first time and I also acknowledged wow, I am this person looking back at me, but I don't like that person.

Speaker 2: 11:09

And this feeling, right, just sort of overcame me and I found myself just just questioning everything, certain ideations as well that I don't need to bring up, but, as most people with those mental health challenges, that that's a very, very much a reality. That seems very appealing at times, you know, and something in me just started to realize, you know, sort of this question is like what if things don't get better than they are right now? Like what if? What if this is as good as it gets? And I was like, well, I can't be as good as it gets because I know it's taking me about five years to get here. Things haven't gotten better. Well, if I keep doing this, by the time I'm 20, you know, five years from now because right around then there's also a lot of talk at the high school. You know, you meet with the guidance counselor who's just trying to figure out where are you going to go. And so this future ideation was very much present for me, and which is probably a good thing at the time, because it forced me to really take account of where am I at right now and where do I want to go in the next few years.

Speaker 2: 12:15

You know, and completely honesty here, I was more afraid of not changing. You know, I really became very, very scared that, you know, I wasn't going to change, and so much so that, as intimidating it was to try to acknowledge myself that I think it's time to make some changes, I didn't have any idea what that was, or how to do it, or what I would do or, more importantly, who might help me. You know, like I don't know if I can do this on my own. And so there's all these big W questions, right, the big W is floating around my mind and and? But I didn't care, you know I did that.

Speaker 2: 12:55

That was less fearful than the idea of putting on more weight, becoming more introverted and continuing down this path that I've been on. And I remember charging out of the bathroom, got we got dressed, of course, and found my dad in the living room and, like I found my dad and just, and you can see something was going on with me, because I was like agitated, obviously my, my eyeballs read from the crying. But I said to him you know, dad, I want to be like this anymore, you know.

Speaker 1: 13:24

I want to be healthy.

Speaker 2: 13:26

And I said my dad, he was controlling his elateness right, like he was happy at this point, because, you know, over the years, him and my mom, I mean, when you have kids, all you want to do is make that smile reappear when they're feeling down. I mean, the hardest thing is a parent and senior kids. I'm happy and I really get that now and such a big way, you know, being a father of two, and my dad's like, okay, sure, yeah, what can we do? You know, like, how can I help you? And I'm like dad.

Speaker 2: 13:54

You know, I remember as a kid I just love riding a bike. Do you think we could get me a bike? And sure enough, it's like, yeah, let's do that. And we literally went out within the hour and got me a bike. I brought it back when I went for a bike ride. It was about three blocks. I was pretty gassed after, wasn't going very far initially, but I was excited that here was something I could do. I enjoyed it. I knew it was going to be hard, but I was excited that this is how the change is going to start.

Speaker 1: 14:25

And that's a lot of insight for a 16 year old, I mean that's impacted.

Speaker 2: 14:29

now I'm sort of repeating back.

Speaker 2: 14:31

I've also, you know the I'm skipping over some stuff, but you know wasn't until my early 30s about 15 years ago I really gave myself the space to go back and reconcile things with myself as that younger self.

Speaker 2: 14:45

You know, we often hear people speaking about this type of inner work and I'm a big proponent for it.

Speaker 2: 14:49

Now, at the time I used to be thinking it was more woo-woo than anything and I'm just being honest, you know, that was sort of my opinion, my belief system, you know, thinking that, yeah, I'm not crazy, I'm not a CS psychologist, you know like, and this is just where I was, you know, early 30s, most of my association with other men that had the same belief, you know, would say the same things, and so I was just doing what everybody else is doing, that I was hanging out with. I didn't know anything different, and this was something that's been repeated quite often in my life up until my early 30s, you know, is sort of trying to keep up with everybody else, trying to do what everybody else or what I believed everybody else expected of me, versus actually getting honest with myself. And I was like who am I? And really big questions, of course, and those weren't questions that were front of mind for me as a teenager, because if you were to ask me what was the big motivation, I'll tell you, heather, I wanted a girlfriend, okay.

Speaker 1: 15:46

I did.

Speaker 2: 15:47

That was the extrinsic driver for me at that time. And you know, if we dig below that, obviously I was wanting somebody to want me. You know, I wanted to feel like I had something of value and I was seen as someone that value. And I got started with that change, you know, went to the library, got books out, you know like and this is where my kids usually interject I wanted to just Google it. Well, they don't understand how to find a book in a library, which I think is hilarious. But and I brought them back and I just started to consume information, to grow my knowledge.

Speaker 2: 16:24

I also started to gain a little bit of confidence as I started to see some changes and that gave me a little bit of a. Maybe I can talk to a couple of my peers at school. You know, some of the cool kids, the jocks right, like, maybe just ask them. You know, and, and fortunately for me, like, there was one guy in particular that was very good at answering questions for me, especially when I talk about exercise or working out. You know, he's a really thick guy and I admired him and and he was open to those conversations.

Speaker 2: 16:49

So you know, this started what turned into a 20 month journey and really it's been my life ever since then. But it took me 20 months to release the weight. That took me six years to put on, and that's a big thing I want people to take away. If they don't take away anything from this little anecdote here, is that one change, when you decide for it to happen, start doing things differently than you're doing, for a change does happen rather quickly if you want. But, more importantly, this idea of I don't know where I was going with that Anyway, so we'll just leave it at that. It's.

Speaker 1: 17:23

No, I agree with you. I'm going to interrupt you for a minute. I think change can happen very quickly. It's just that this is where I'm listening to your story and I'm really intrigued, because there's that line between overeating you're eating emotionally, you're eating to soothe your feelings you totally get that story a similar story when I was younger too and then there's this line that you just cross over and switch clicks on.

Speaker 2: 17:59

This sounds like for you and you've had enough.

Speaker 1: 18:02

You've had enough and you're compassionate enough with yourself to change. Now you wanted a girlfriend too, and that's valid. But then, once you make the decision for change, it can happen, really quickly. It can happen pretty quickly, yes, so it sounds like that's what happened with you.

Speaker 2: 18:25

It did. But there's still a lot of questions because there's so many unknowns and I know the unknowns can be very intimidating for all of us, the fear of the unknown. We often hear about that Because it does usually imply there will be some changes that are coming, and change is typically challenging. I mean it just is the bigger the challenge, the more the change will be, the more pronounced the change. From my experience and what I've heard from others, it seems to be hard for the chorus, but it's not like we wake up in the morning and say, hey, you know what I want today? I want some more change.

Speaker 1: 19:01

We really wake up like that People don't like change, change is uncomfortable Change is scary and when you're in a routine of you're probably like as a 16-year-old, it can be terrifying to think about changing and all the what-ifs and everything. And then you have to deal with the long-term change. Then you change and you lose the way to, then I'm just wondering was there a point where you felt fearful that you could go backwards?

Speaker 2: 19:37

There's always that concern, that fear, but I never really gave it a lot of thought. To be honest with you, I knew the path that I was then on, the way that I felt when I would work out and the way that I would feel by eating certain foods versus what my normal way of eating was before. I noticed very, very I mean, it was real my energy was different, I wasn't feeling like I needed a nap, my joints started to feel better. My homeroom class was on the third floor, so I'd walk three flights of stairs every morning and I remember not being gassed or not having a little bit of a bead of sweat form on my brow. That was a big deal. That was a sign that there were things for changing, and they were changing because I was choosing to do certain things that would allow for the change to happen. And so it did build this sort of confidence for me that I can change and I can change when I want to.

Speaker 2: 20:33

But here's the thing I was so focused on the exterior, anything that was perceivable from the outside. Looking in, I didn't know. Inner work, the idea of personal development, self development no, it wasn't even there, even though people would argue that what I was doing was self development. I wasn't thinking of it like that. It was just like I want to get my body looking healthy, so hopefully other people either think I'm cool or give me attention, or maybe a girl will like me, and that's what I believed I needed to do to create that. And then again I'm a 15, 16 year old boy and most of my inputs at that time is through media or peers at school. So that was just what I thought and felt.

Speaker 2: 21:18

But I remember at age 17, so I'd made these changes, but I was still perceiving myself as that morbidly obese teenager, that inner person, that way that I would often see myself even in the mirror and whatnot. A bit of body dysmorphia, for sure. But more importantly, the mental aspect of my health hadn't improved. Really, I still had a lot of those feelings and that low self opinion and just depression was still there and I was still quite introverted.

Speaker 2: 21:51

But I remember being invited to a party and going, and I also remember being offered my first drink, then another one, and I remember how I felt after those two drinks. I remember a lot of those inner voices got really quiet, so much so that I feel pretty good. Right now there's those girls over there. I know we've been looking at each other. I'm going to go talk to one of them and then even interacting with other guys. It was just more dynamic, more engaging. I found out I was more extroverted and I found that people were responding really well to that. Well, it doesn't take rocket science to figure out where I'm going with this, but I started to associate the person I was when I would drink as being the person that people preferred. That was who they valued more. That was who they were invited to come to the party next weekend, right.

Speaker 1: 22:40

The fun guy who drinks a lot and can be the party guy.

Speaker 2: 22:44

I'm a fun guy when I drink I always was. It wasn't like I was a bad drunk. I was very fun, very jovial. I saw it as a pass to do the things that I always wanted to do Be the extroverted guy, be the jokey guy, be the guy that people want to hang out with.

Speaker 2: 23:00

And really a lot of that ego play. But again, I was 17th time and alcohol seemed to provide me that. It created the bridge and it became a very regular thing, so much so that even well into my 20s you meet my wife. It met her under the pretense that if you drinks in me, I had a restaurant and there was an introduction through my brother and things took off. But just to give a prime example of how much this played into my life, my eldest daughter her name is Chardonnay and it's not off the grate, it was apparently off the show. My wife and I shared a lot of bottles of Chardonnay when we were initially courting and really taking our relationship to a serious level. So it was always very meaningful and it was a name I liked, being that I do speak French and I appreciate the French and I love that. Just that name. But that was just how prominent alcohol was. It was so significant and such a big part of our life. I named my first daughter off of my favorite wine.

Speaker 2: 24:05

So, yeah, this is again just to give some context, and meanwhile, though, in my 20s, I've moved across the country. I started going to university, but then I fell into a career selling fitness equipment, and I realized I'm actually pretty good at this because I, like I, can talk to people about health, and fitness is something that I love. I've had a big transformation myself, so I feel very much I can help others with that too. Alcohol was just always there. All right, it was always there, and it's so accepted.

Speaker 1: 24:32

Yes, exactly, I mean everyone's doing it right. I mean seemingly, and it is very normal and acceptable.

Speaker 2: 24:43

It's wild how normal it is, especially even today. Now, because after the pandemic I mean, when you look at the statistics, of what industries are they experienced a boom. The alcohol industry, massive. Oh, massive Like ridiculous, Like we're talking like 3X, 4X, like crazy, and I mean it could be a reallocation because there was no restaurants. We can argue that. I talk to even some of my close friends. They recognize that their consumption just went up.

Speaker 2: 25:14

Well there's nothing else to do, you find yourself sitting at home, and so it is just very real for everyone. I don't think anyone gets out of this one, and it became very normal for me. It was 15 years, age 17, when I had that first sort of drink. To age 32, where the wheels on the proverbial bus fell off in a big way and everything that I worked for and believed that was what I wanted. I'm like I do.

Speaker 2: 25:41

I've always been someone that I like to think I'm someone of integrity, someone that honors their values, because when we have these core values, those are sort of the things like Heather and I know you're aware of this but for those that are listening or watching, these core values are those things that are non-negotiable. They're hardwired beliefs that usually have been instilled in us for a very long time. We are sort of creatures of habit. We're also creatures of our environments at times, and so that sort of nature versus nurture idea they both apply, and so certain beliefs around family were always things that I maintained as being very important to me, because they were, and I was raised that way. However, when I would drink, I remember even turning my phone off to tell my wife oh, my phone died. Sorry, babe, I lost track of time so I wouldn't have to worry about getting home. And I mean, that's just tip of the iceberg.

Speaker 2: 26:41

There's lots of things that I would do that would compromise on my values, and this is where I think a lot of us run into challenges, because it creates a situation that's far worse, in my opinion, because we're constantly lying to ourselves when we portray ourselves as one thing, but we know, truthfully, this is how we're really showing up what we truly are valuing and prioritizing, which, for me, was drinking, and showing up as that guy when I would drink, and it's hard, it's hard. And my wife, she was gonna have nothing to do with it. We got to 10 years in our relationship. We'd had many conversations about my drinking, but I was always very good at being great for a few weeks after one of those conversations, to the point that I would be like well, yeah, look at how good I've been the last few weeks. Well, I'm going out tonight with a guy supplier in town or I'm celebrating the guys tonight. I'm gonna take them out after work.

Speaker 2: 27:40

Well there's always an excuse right.

Speaker 1: 27:43

I mean when you're in that and when you're numbing out with alcohol. So it sounds like you went from numbing out with food and then transferred it to alcohol, and when you're numbing out with alcohol there's always always a great excuse. I mean it's.

Speaker 2: 28:01

Friday night it's happy hour.

Speaker 1: 28:03

I'm having a bad day, I'm having a good day. Let's celebrate like there's always something right.

Speaker 2: 28:08

I'm breathing today. This is a good. Let's celebrate.

Speaker 1: 28:14

Yeah, there's always a justification for it, until you realize, right, what you're really doing is numbing.

Speaker 2: 28:22

It doesn't matter how much good you do, though, because that habit, that one thing, can undermine all the good, like almost instantly, especially if it's something that everyone's aware. That's a challenge and there's an intention to maybe improve on that, and you constantly just don't right, like I wasn't. I was just not respecting it because I didn't really want to change. I didn't, you know, and it was such a huge part of my identity. I was like I don't know how I could be anything other than this, and this is what I always thought I was working towards. So why would I change that? You know like.

Speaker 2: 28:58

And then, at 32, you know, everything changed, my wife and I won't go into all the whole story, but if people are interested, I did do a TEDx talk about this a couple years ago where I shared about this very particular moment, and I'll give you sort of the up. In Canada I don't know if we even have any more again, dame myself Kohl's Notes versions of the story. People probably like what's Kohl's Notes. They used to be a Polk store anyways, and you could buy these little crib notes of you know. If you had a paper due and you didn't want to read the Scarlet Letter, you could go find this little pamphlet that would give you all the high notes right.

Speaker 1: 29:29

Oh yeah, we have those two. They're called something else I can't remember yeah crib notes, I think.

Speaker 2: 29:36

Crib notes. Yeah, so the Kohl's Notes was. I'm gonna give you that version and long and short of it. We were sitting at the table after this one morning. It was actually almost noon because I wasn't waking up. You know, I'd been out all night the night before and I don't remember how I even got home. I didn't even make it to bed. I slept on the berber beside the bed that night. I guess I mean, it was just not a good night.

Speaker 2: 30:02

And when I got down to the kitchen, she sat me down rather quickly and there was this look in her eye and it was. I could just tell that this is something very serious. It was a look I'd never had before from her and we've only got it for 10 years. At this point, both of our kids are under the age of six. So, like, if it's not, like we had just met I mean, we got some history and she was looking at me in this way that made me feel so fearful, you know, like really afraid, not so much of her, but afraid of the situation I'm walking into, you know, because there's something here, there's something big happening. And she sat me down and almost immediately out of her mouth she's like, well, we need to formulate a plan on how we're gonna co-parent our kids, because this isn't gonna continue. This is not the environment that we're raising our girls in.

Speaker 2: 30:57

And of course I'm like, oh gosh, what do you mean? Like, you know, trying to justify myself and like I would do every time, right, like, and it was just falling on death ears. She wasn't giving it any time or attention because, to be fair, the time for excuses were done. You know no more of that, and as much as I would often say here's what I'm gonna do or these are changes I'm going to make.

Speaker 2: 31:22

I was very good, again, part of my sales background, now my speaking background. I can be articulate when I need to be, and it can be insane, you know. And she just saw through it all and she's like listen, I don't wanna hear anymore, I want you to show me. And you know I was ready for her to say that and she proceeded after a little bit more time. She asked me a question and this is ultimately the crux of this story everything, my whole life story, really. This is that pinnacle moment where really everything finally changed for real, like not just the external, but the internal was then put in a position to change and she asked me a question. She said die you'd be in the type of man you'd want to marry your daughters.

Speaker 1: 32:14

Good question.

Speaker 2: 32:15

Oh man, heather, I was like, oh my goodness, you could not have asked a worse, better question ever. You know, like it was instantaneous, almost because I had this instant vision of someone like me at that time showing up on my doorstep, wanting to come in and get close to the three most important women in my life at that time. I wouldn't let them across the threshold. There's no way, there's no way. But that's what I was modeling, that's how I was mentoring, just through my actions every day, showing my kids this is what a dad is, this is what a husband is, this is what a son is, this is what a brother is, this is what a business owner is, this is what a community leader is. This is what I was telling them. Like I was the bar right, the standard, and I wanted them very high, you know, and I realized this very quickly in her asking me that question, and I'll sort of skate over some of the stuff but I got to a place where I was just I'm ready to make a change and it was it's eerie, because it was that same sort of feeling I experienced at 15, looking in the mirror when I got out of the shower that day and finally saw myself. You know, but I think in this instance it was like Christie's eyes were reflecting back.

Speaker 2: 33:26

You know, really, what I was at that time, specifically around alcohol. Just this relationship I had with it was not healthy at all, you know, and it was my first time really accepting that. Because you know what's interesting is and I just got to say this because I'm sure there's some men listening that are maybe opinionated or maybe well, let's just say, maybe you have a different belief around this, but I remember very distinctly being out with the guys on some nights and you know we'd be watching the UFC having a few rounds. The conversation is very surface, right, like we're never going very deep. Okay, we're not gonna be talking about the meaning of life or any of that stuff. I mean, that's not happening in these conversations but we would often talk about our spouses or our partners and it wasn't positive conversation. It was usually as begging about stuff, you know, and it was just so normal and okay. But I also remember them very passionately defending my drinking. I just define that everything I was doing was totally right and my wife said you know she's wrong.

Speaker 2: 34:41

Like you know, like now, especially after that conversation, I'm just like, oh my goodness you know, birds of a feather right Like it's just so, like I just want to invite people, really take a hard look at who you spend the most amount of time with and if you're not thinking or speaking or believing similar things to those individuals and it's not a positive thing that what you're believing in chances are just this collective. You know it's just it's hard to break that cycle, right, because of those connections. We think, well, they're my best friends and you know, like we've been friends forever and oh, anyways, I won't get into that too much right now. But I realized that everything to this point was my own doing and I made a commitment to go one year without drinking.

Speaker 2: 35:24

And I know there's people like only a year Sounds like you're kind of had a worse problem than that. I mean, maybe you should just be like not driven at all and listen, I tried making those statements before. I'm never going to have another drink again. You know it's usually after an all night stipper, right, or hey, whoa, I'm never doing that again, right, but you sort of say it jokingly and you know, three days later it's like oh yeah, what are we having for lunch?

Speaker 2: 35:47

It is yeah, it's happy, all right yeah.

Speaker 1: 35:49

And it's amazing how quickly you can forget.

Speaker 2: 35:51

Yes, thank you. Thank you, heather, and. But I decided I was going to go one year, you know, because it was. It was something that was measurable, but also what I felt was attainable. You know, I mean, if we follow the SMART goal acronym, right, like it was very specific, measurable, attainable, I thought realistic. But it was also time bound. Right, it was one year and I've been successful at doing a couple of sober months, like sober January is to kick off my new years. I think I've done that twice, so you know that's 15 years span. I'd had two months before I was sober. Right, like I mean it's yeah, I used to be embarrassed sharing this.

Speaker 2: 36:28

To be honest, heather, I used to be embarrassed, but it's like so far removed, it's like I'm talking about a different person now, right, like it's just. But that's just what I was, that's how it was.

Speaker 1: 36:37

Yeah, and when you do things like sober January, then you're just like looking at the clock, almost like counting the dates until. February 1st.

Speaker 2: 36:47

Well, we weren't even one more. We waited until like midnight. We timed it to have a late dinner and yeah, anyway, embarrassed about that.

Speaker 2: 36:55

But yeah, we were we were eager, right, and so I made that commitment to go one year in. And you know I made it to my girls. You know all. I got all three on the couch and made that commitment to them, but it was me that wanted it Like. I let them know I'm doing this for me. I would say it was my most, my second, most uncomfortable conversation in my life. You know, the first one proceeded a few weeks later when I realized, holy smokes, what did I commit myself to?

Speaker 2: 37:25

You know, I was about five, six weeks in and I'm like this is unbearable. I didn't know how to function, like they had become such wonderful crutches for me to function in my life. I took those crutches away but I had a bad leg, you know, and I was looking pretty bad and it was tough, like really, really hard, and we sat down one night on the couch and I don't know what came over me, but it was the very first time in my life I've ever been 100% vulnerable with my wife. You know, there's always those things that you hold back right, we all hold back but when you get to know somebody, especially if no one knows me better than her but even in our relationship of 10 years, at that point I've never truly been open with her about what was going on internally for me. You know, I could express happiness and I could express anger, but those are the only two shades of emotion I was good and comfortable at describing. I imagine there's like a hundred men, thousands of men listening to this right now, being like oh yeah, I know what you're talking about. You know, like it's an I pardon the cliche and stereotypes, but it is very true and I can only say this because you know, I run men's groups and I do a lot of facilitating in this space now and I hear this often, very often, and so I just verbal diarrheaed it all over my life.

Speaker 2: 38:40

I just I told her everything that I was feeling. I told her about how I felt as a kid and how I felt when I drank and why I feel like I need to drink, you know, to have connection in life. And if I didn't drink, christy, I don't think we'd be together. You know, like just going through everything with her, we got to the end of that and she's looking at me and she says thank you, thank you for sharing that. It's gonna be okay, I love you. I was perfect, you know, perfect dancer. And then she says I think you should talk to somebody. Yeah, and at the time again, I shared with you sort of my belief around mental health supporters, people that work in the space and help people with that, especially the psychologist went on. I had a very negative opinion on that and so, but in that moment I was like I felt so good after sharing with her, like so good, like I felt this weight lifted. You know, I was very cathartic. It was like that ugly sob I had in the bathroom at 15, right, same sort of emotional release that I experienced and I was like, well, there's obviously something to the sharing thing. So, okay, I will, I'll talk to somebody.

Speaker 2: 39:53

Went out and found the psychologist, also found a relationship counselor, like a therapist, to work with us on communication. But here, a little funny side note we're on the couch there coming to the end of that first session. You know she's looking at Christie now and she's like you know, christie die. I think it's better if die comes back on his own for a bit, you know. So I just thought it was funny, full intention couples, you know therapy, but they wanted me back by myself.

Speaker 2: 40:16

So I'm not painting a pretty picture, I know, but I want people to know. That's just how things were, but from everybody on the outside looking at us as a family and as me as an individual. And most people had no idea, no idea that things were as unruly as they were, you know. And I went all in Sort of like with my fitness changes I made, because I learned that change is possible. It's possible when I decide to make things happen. But I also I fully committed everything to getting healthy. And so here I was again. I'm like I'm gonna commit everything to doing this work to really figure out who am I.

Speaker 1: 40:56

I mean, that's what I'm hearing I think that's what I'm hearing a lot from your story is that you did a lot of. You know this initial like outer work. You know you had an issue with food and you're just gonna buckle down and lose the weight and get fit and everything. And then same with alcohol. You know, right, you had this problem and you were just gonna fix it. Right, like a lot of men do you know, and a lot of women, I mean, you just wanna, you wanna get it fixed, but you need to start from the inside.

Speaker 2: 41:30

Oh yeah.

Speaker 1: 41:31

Right, and it sounds like it took your experience this bottoming out, if you want to call it with alcohol to then finally get really vulnerable with your wife and get real.

Speaker 2: 41:45

And I went all in. When you fully apply yourself to change or a change process, it's incredible how quickly it can happen, especially when you're feeling supported, because it takes care of a lot of that fear. But, more importantly, it also provides the clarity and the confidence to continuously take the actions. I find that lack of clarity that creates lack of confidence and we're not feeling confident. I mean gosh, we procrastinate like crazy. I do, I procrastinate, I'll put things up, I'll do everything but the thing, and I didn't want to allow that to happen this time.

Speaker 2: 42:18

So I just went all in. I literally did. I went. What's the worst that can happen? And worst that could happen is that I improve. I understand. Why do I have this connection to alcohol? Am I acting or believing these things about myself? I know if I talked to anybody out there they don't believe those to be true. Why don't I try to prove them not to be true?

Speaker 2: 42:42

And so it was wonderful learning all this new sort of way of unpacking and repacking this. And that's also where I got all the clarity of what I was enduring when my parents' divorce and then being obese and dealing with some of the peer pressures as well as the bullying that I had to deal with at that time and just really getting a better understanding but to develop more compassion towards that child within me. We hear about this all the time and I used to laugh at it. It's so funny. I just see where I am now, where I was before, and I look at that guy that I was. I was like man, you really knew nothing, nothing. I know much right now, but I don't want more now through life experience, but I chose to walk that path as hard as it was Okay, because it is hard. Making those changes are hard, you know, but man, were they worth it? So that's sort of it, you know. And it set me on a trajectory and this is the one thing I want to just sort of give as a word of caution to everyone and it's sort of tongue in cheek I say this, but when you go through some big changes like this, you have to be prepared for everything else to change as well, because when you start to change yourself, your worldview, your world perspective, but also your perspective of self changes and all of a sudden, what you thought created a lot of fulfillment, joy and happiness for you might change and which changes your direction. And that's what I'm going to be.

Speaker 2: 44:06

I left a career of 17 years, a company I co-founded. I was just like I can't be here anymore. You know, over a period of a few years after that big shift, I exited that out and, you know, went all in with my coaching and some of my online stuff. But, more importantly, I quit a career. A month later, my wife quit her. Two months after that, we basically pulled the kids out of school, gave away all our stuff, packed up the SUV, whatever we couldn't fit, went into storage and we went traveling as a family, and so all these things happened as a result of me saying no to alcohol, so I could say yes to the life that I'd always wanted, you know.

Speaker 1: 44:40

That's a lot of people's dream right, just to pack it up and hit the road. You know, anybody can do it. Anybody can do it. Yeah, but that takes a lot of change right. That takes some that inner work and everything.

Speaker 1: 44:53

I have a question, though, for you about self-sabotage, you know, because how do you prevent and how have you prevented just self-sabotage? You know I mean going backwards and, you know, blowing it all. You know I'm, you know, I'm really wondering if, like you know, underneath your like, am I going to be able to maintain this Like, am I going to be able to like, really, is this going to be the rest of my life where I don't drink, or am I going to be able to maintain my weight and my you know and my fitness? Do you ever have those fears of going backwards?

Speaker 2: 45:30

Yeah, well, it's funny because I still deal with a bit of anxiety from time to time, but I manage it really well. And same like depression, I have moments where I feel depressed as well, and I mean, I don't know if any of us got into the pandemic without those emotions occasionally, but it's always been a part of who I am and learning to manage. What's important and why I'm bringing this up is it's that the interesting thing about beliefs are we're very good at defending our beliefs, whether they're negative or positive. I mean, we have a belief that's not a positive one about ourselves, like I am this. We will often go out and try to prove that, and you know there's some people that refer to this also as confirmation bias. You know, like it could be a belief that's completely erroneous, but we believe it to be true and that's enough. And it's enough so much so that we will do whatever we can to prove it to be true.

Speaker 2: 46:21

I believe that what can really be helpful and it was helpful for myself especially was identifying what are some of those things. You know, what are those beliefs that are sort of the default beliefs, because you know, the neat thing about our brains is they are what they call it. It's got sort of it's like plastic right. They call it neuroplasticity. Like this is the ability for the brain to be rewired, quite literally. But the only way you override certain habits is you have to create a new habit and that has to be the primary normal habit, that you do enough that it overrides the old one. Eventually, people are like well, how long does that take? I'm like I don't know as long as it takes you know, like you look that up online.

Speaker 2: 47:04

I mean, it's nothing more frustrating than typing that in. How long does it take to form a new habit? Like, just take that question. You're going to get 101 different answers and everyone will say this has been scientifically proven. I'm like, okay, well, we got a problem here because you're all saying it's scientifically proven, that it's you know three weeks, you know 21 days. Oh well, five right.

Speaker 1: 47:22

Yeah, many days, 21 days, but right to make a new habit.

Speaker 2: 47:26

Yes, yeah, and so I can appreciate. Maybe that was in that moment and that one study for that group of people. Sure it works, but typically it takes a while and it's going to take as long as it takes, probably, for you to form the initial one, to form the new one. You know, and I started with a one year commitment and I invite people to start with a smaller commitment because you have to be able to prove to yourself that you can follow through with a commitment, that you can achieve results, because if you have that underlying belief, a limiting belief, that I do things, I never finished them, or I do things and I fail.

Speaker 2: 48:00

I got to look at the fitness industry and this is very, very common. You know people, especially when it comes to diet culture. You know they have done 101 diets and they've had 101 great results where they've lost the weight but then they gained it back Right, sometimes more than what they had before. So now they have a belief that anytime I do a diet it's a failure. Anyways, I'm never going to keep it off.

Speaker 1: 48:20

This is why I'm asking, I think, just about the self sabotage, because I think that like, at least again for my clients, my women, that they get stuck in this. It is a self sabotage, you know, like I already know, I'm going to fail, like I'm going to do this and then I'm going to fail, and it's a hard sometimes, it's a hard cycle to get out of. I love that, I just love this, this part of this conversation, because I think the one thing that also just stood you mentioned two things your why and just the phrase. This will pass, this too shall pass right, and that we have to sometimes get uncomfortable with discomfort. You know, and be okay, and I know, with alcohol especially and with food, but I know in my experience I mean that is something I have to get very comfortable with when I stopped drinking was I want the drink right now and rather than just go for that instant gratification, I just had to let the feeling pass. You know like it's and it does and it does pass, but you have to let it. You have to let it pass. And also the.

Speaker 1: 49:32

I think having your the why behind some of these big changes that you want to make is so important. It's everything I mean. It's you have to have something to hold on to. You. Had you stopped drinking and you had your kids and your wife right, I mean to to you know, think about, and so the why is is incredibly important. But I want to just talk to you also quickly about your five F's and your fitness, family, faith, finances and fun. So are these the five things that that most people should value, or are these your values, or these the things that that make up a a well-balanced life? Talk to me more about that.

Speaker 2: 50:24

Sure Well, I guess the writer in me likes the alliteration right. I like the five-ast, Easy to remember for me.

Speaker 1: 50:32

But we all have different. Yeah, yeah, it is.

Speaker 2: 50:36

But it's also it's. It fit very much my values, you know, and I give these sort of as a framework, but of course I invite people, if these s aren't your s, replace it with the value that is. You know, and I sort of use this analogy or a metaphor of a home. So imagine our lives that we're living as a home that we're an architect of, and so we're building these homes, our lives, right, we're designing them, we're building them, we're reinforcing them. We've built these homes, we put stuff in it, you know through experiences. But here's the thing we have a foundation, first and foremost. Any home or any building has got to be built on a solid foundation.

Speaker 2: 51:16

For me, I believe the foundation's health. Health first, not going mental health, emotional, spiritual health. I mean you can qualify it any way we want, but health. But now we got the five s that live on top of that. We've got four walls and a roof. Okay so, fitness, faith, family finances with an overarching roof of fun Okay, because if you're not smiling at least once a day, man, there's a lot of room for improvement. You know so. But this is sort of that idea, because here's the thing, if I know that one wall's got some termites and they're doing so well, I'm going to focus on that wall a bit more than the other walls. You know, like, if you're struggling with maybe putting some weight on, well, you know that fitness wall, maybe it's got some issues, maybe there is a storm coming in that's going to rock this home, right, and those will pass. But are we good to weather the storm when those happen? And I always equate this. You know why I talk about health so often, and I'm talking about the physical, the emotional, psychological.

Speaker 2: 52:16

But that health component is, if you think about it, like a rheostat dial or like a speedometer. Right, like we have, we get the engine revving. Right, it goes up to all these different speeds. So we got like zero to 60 miles an hour, right, well, if we say being healthy or optimal gets us around that 50 miles an hour, you know well, great, we're optimal, we're cruising along really well here, but all of a sudden, boom, ailments come in. Uh-oh, we're going to start to slow down a bit. Oh, but I'm still going 40. Okay, I can still cover a lot of distance here and I can work on things to get it back to 50, but you know, if you're starting and you're at like 10 miles an hour and all of a sudden you get sick and that's your top speed is 10 miles an hour. You're getting down to zero.

Speaker 2: 52:58

You know, like your room, right, that runway to stave off illness, chronic ailments, big changes that happen to you, right, but you feel like you've been thrust upon you. You can manage those much, much more effectively. And so this idea of the home is really that idea of people to be the architects, design the life that you want, but prioritize those values that are most important to you and honor them. And so that's sort of how those 5s work. It's really just a framework or, probably more appropriately, a filter you know, through which we can pass our decision-making processes but also what actions to prioritize.

Speaker 2: 53:39

And stop worrying about time management, because people probably think, well, how do I get all the time to do all this stuff? It's like, yeah, don't worry about time management, but worry about commitment management. You don't manage how you're committing to use those blocks of time every week and I'll make sure that everything's getting a little bit of time, and if it does good, things will start to happen. You know they really will. But sometimes we have to create or take the time to do it.

Speaker 1: 54:04

I like that, I like thinking of it, and time management is sort of like such a catchphrase, you know, but I love commitment management. I mean, right, how are we going to commit to these really important things in our lives? Ty, it was so nice to speak with you and I really appreciate you being so incredibly vulnerable and telling your story, because I know that people will really appreciate it. And how can people find you and work with you? And are you doing one-on-one coaching, group coaching? I?

Speaker 2: 54:41

do a whole mix of all that stuff and have the non-line community launching in about a month's time so Q4 of 2023, depending on when this drops, so it might be up by then new website launching as well, and that's really just my way of sharing a lot of free resources, just giving people the information. So, because once you improve on your knowledge, it's amazing how we can convert that into wisdom fairly quickly. If you want to connect with me on social, I'm on all of them, like all of them, but the ones that I'm really active consistently on are Facebook, instagram and LinkedIn. Really appreciate the opportunity to be here and thank you for creating a platform to capture these conversations. You know, really the world needs more of this, and thank you for leading and showing us what's possible. You know, and, yeah, just feel a lot of gratitude for you and thank you for today.

Speaker 1: 55:29

Thank you, I appreciate that.