JenX: The Story Behind The Talk

 Everyone sees the talk. Few hear the story behind it.

JenX: The Story Behind the Talk

Fan-favorite guest Jen McClellan returns to Big Sexy Chat to take us behind the scenes of her recent TEDx talk and the deeply personal journey that led her to the red circle.

Jen is the founder of Plus Size Birth and host of the Plus Mommy Podcast, where she has spent years educating care providers about weight bias and advocating for respectful, dignified treatment in healthcare.

In this conversation, Chrystal and Jen go beyond the talk itself and explore what it really takes to step onto a stage like TEDx. From the emotional vulnerability of sharing her own experiences to the intense preparation required for just a few minutes on stage, Jen opens up about the pressure, growth, and courage behind the moment.

They also discuss the ongoing barriers fat people face, including travel challenges that can require paying for multiple seats simply to get from point A to point B, and why advocacy work like this remains so necessary. 

Whether you’ve dreamed of giving a TED-style talk, are curious about the process, or want an honest look at what happens after the spotlight fades, this episode offers a rare glimpse into the human story behind a powerful public moment.

In This Episode, We Talk About:

• What it’s really like to be invited to give a TEDx talk
• The vulnerability of sharing personal experiences on a global stage
• How Jen prepared for one of the biggest speaking moments of her career
• Weight bias and the importance of treating people with dignity
• Travel barriers and accessibility challenges for people in larger bodies
• Why this advocacy work continues to matter

About Jen McClellan

Jen McClellan is the founder of Plus Size Birth, a certified childbirth educator, and the voice behind the Plus Mommy Podcast. She travels nationwide educating healthcare providers about weight bias and how compassionate care can make a meaningful impact. 

Connect with Jen

🌐 Plus Size Birth: https://plussizebirth.com
🎙️ Plus Mommy Podcast

🎥 Watch Jen’s TEDx Talk

🎤 EveryBODY Deserves to be Treated with Dignity
📺 Watch on YouTube
In this powerful talk, Jen McClellan shares her personal experiences with weight bias in healthcare and advocates for treating every body with dignity.

Transcript

Welcome Back & Why Jen Matters

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Big Sexy Chat's fan favorite guest, Jen McClellan, is back. And this time, we're diving into her powerful TED X talk on weight bias and dignity. From the vulnerability of sharing her own story to the very real barriers fat people still face in healthcare, travel, and daily life, this conversation is honest, eye-opening, and deeply needed. Welcome to Gen X.

SPEAKER_04 0:28

Hey, you made it!

unknown 0:30

Ha!

SPEAKER_04 0:31

You're just in time for a little something juicy with crystal and murph. Talking fat. Sex big feels hot, takes and kicks. We're breaking all the rules, babe. What you think? It's big. Sexy chair. Say it back now. Sexy chair. Let's go.

SPEAKER_01 1:03

Hey Betty, welcome back to Big Sexy Chat. My name is Crystal, and I'm hosting Alone Tonight. My first time doing that since I started Big Sexy Chat way back in 2022 with Murph and Ashley. And I'm excited to have our lovely guest here today, someone who comes up on our podcast a lot. It seems like we talk about you a lot and we talk about Tigris a lot. Hi, Jen. Jen from Plus Mommy.

SPEAKER_03 1:23

Hi, Crystal. Thank you so much for having me again. It's always an honor to be on your incredible show.

SPEAKER_01 1:29

Thank you. It's so great to have you. And like we told you too, our your podcast that we did together last year was our number one most downloaded podcast in 2025.

SPEAKER_03 1:39

So yay, plus mommy. Thank you. I felt so honored. I was sharing all over.

SPEAKER_01 1:44

Very cool, very neat. Thank you for doing that. So welcome back, Jen. For those of you who don't know, Jen and I met in 2014 in person at Jess Baker's Body Love Conference in Tucson, Arizona.

SPEAKER_03 1:57

And I got to be your Vanna White with sex toys. It was like the highlight of the trip.

SPEAKER_01 2:03

That was really fun. Yeah, that was 2014, is that correct?

SPEAKER_03 2:06

Yes. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:08

Long time ago.

SPEAKER_03 2:09

I know. I know.

SPEAKER_01 2:10

Jess is really, she's not, she's not doing really, I don't think she's doing much in the fat liberation space right now, but I've heard from several people that she stays really busy with her other um advocacy work and things like that. So anyway, we hope she's doing great out there. So yes, and I got to meet a lot of amazing people that that particular first ever only body love conference. And oh man.

SPEAKER_03 2:34

I think they had one more, they had one more after, I think.

SPEAKER_01 2:37

Maybe one, right? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, and then I I think that it's hard. It's hard having an event where you have a lot of people helping out with the planning because everybody has their own opinions and stuff. I know this just because, you know. You're the expert with it. I'm just and you want to give people their agency and their autonomy and help you out with your event and stuff, but it can be tricky when you just like anything we all do with families or friends when there's other more than one human involved. Things are hard. It's not easy to make a group decision, you know. Have you ever gone out with like a on a camping ship with your friends or your girlfriends are like, what do you want to do? I don't care what you want to do. I don't care what you want to do. And I'm like, look, y'all, we can do what I want to do all freaking weekend, okay? But I'm not gonna sit here and I don't care, I don't care, because I know somebody cares and they're just not sane, and they're gonna be a martyr later. So I'm like, fine, if you don't care, I can I'll here's the here's the agenda. But I want everybody to put their input, but sometimes it doesn't work, right? You try to be gemocratic about it, and it's hard. Yeah, it's really hard.

SPEAKER_03 3:41

I don't go camping though anymore. I am past past sleeping on the ground. I was I was a camp counselor for many summers in my youth. That was fun.

Origins In Fat Liberation Community

SPEAKER_01 3:51

No more, no more. Can't do it too. My body doesn't like it. Anyway, um, before we get into too much about your TED talk, which I can't wait to talk about, tell everybody a little bit about who you are and how to find you and all that good stuff.

SPEAKER_03 4:03

Thank you so much for the opportunity. Of course. My name is Jen McClellan, and I'm the founder of Plus Size Birth and the Plus Mommy podcast. So in 2011 now, I um started at plus size birth talking about plus size pregnancy and creating all the resources that I couldn't find when I was plus size and pregnant and became a certified childbirth educator. So I get to travel the nation talking to care providers about weight bias and healthcare and how we can all make an impact and treat people with dignity. And it's an honor to do that work. And then I've had the podcast since 2014. It's on a little hiatus now that that happens every now and again, but um, it's definitely there. And the tagline is from bumps to bellies, we talk about it all. So lots of pregnancy content, but it goes beyond that as well.

SPEAKER_01 4:54

I like to remind people that um fat people have been having babies since the beginning of time.

SPEAKER_03 5:01

Uh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:04

Why? Uh and I, whenever I talk about you, I tell people, oh, you have to listen to her talk about gestational diabetes. You have to understand that it's so nuanced, there's so much more to it. And everybody just assumes that you're fat, you're gonna have gestational diabetes. It turns out everybody gets gestational diabetes, not just fat people. And anyway, that and the fact that, yeah, fat people have been having babies since the beginning of time. Nothing new.

SPEAKER_03 5:25

And and look, people of all sizes who go into pregnancy without blood sugar issues, yes, there's risks and there's increased risk, but they're actually not as astronomical as we're led to believe. And I know this one isn't about pregnancy, but just real quick, yes, it you have like, I like to flip the script. So instead of feeling overwhelmed statistically, you've got about an 83% chance of not incurring gestational diabetes if you're in a larger body and that number isn't fixed. Like you can bring it down more. So don't buy into all the fear-mongering there there is.

SPEAKER_01 6:01

Great advice. Yes. Okay. TED Talk. Wow. Oh my gosh, so amazing. I know two fatties that have done TED Talks, you and Lillian Bustle. Yes, I know there are more.

SPEAKER_03 6:13

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:14

Like who else? Can you think of any others?

Jen’s Work: Plus Size Birth & Care Bias

SPEAKER_03 6:16

Yes, the um, I'm so bad with names, and we're recording late at night, so I apologize. But the um the amazing uh producers and directors behind the incredible documentary, and I'm stalling a little bit to remember the name of it.

SPEAKER_01 6:33

Oh, that Aubrey made? Aubrey Gordon? That one?

SPEAKER_03 6:36

No.

SPEAKER_01 6:36

I know the button the button poetry lady has a TED Talk too, I believe.

SPEAKER_03 6:40

Yeah, no, I can't think of her name. I feel so much. Okay, we'll have to put it in the show notes.

SPEAKER_01 6:46

Yeah, yeah, for sure. But so, okay, everybody knows what a TED talk is, and we always joke about how we all have our own TED Talks, right? That we do practically daily on social media, especially if you're in a south body. But how in the hell did you get to do? Did they find you? Did you find them? Did you apply? What the heck? How did that all work?

SPEAKER_03 7:04

When I started public speaking in like 2012, 2013, uh, I lived in Colorado and I really wanted to do a why not apply for a TED Talk? And I don't even think I heard back. And I was trying to remember if I applied once or twice, but I never, I never heard back or made it to the next stage. And uh in June of 2025, so just last year, on Instagram, I got a message from um the incredible um leader of TED X ABQ, so Albuquerque, here where I live, um, Alex Andrigo Adams. And she said, I would love to talk to you about giving a TED talk. And I was just like, oh my gosh, like this is amazing. Okay. And we had coffee, and at that coffee date, she said, you know, we had talked about her vision and that she'd really love me from following me and getting to know my work for quite some time to talk about weight bias and healthcare. And and I then she asked, Will you do it? And I was like, wait, like there's no, I don't have like this is it, like this is the I'm in. And um, she was like, Yeah, I'm we're having a lot of people um do like a speed dating speaking event to to apply, and then a handful of people she hand selected, and I was honored to be one of them. So it was, it just felt so yeah, I cried. I was so honored.

SPEAKER_01 8:32

So this had nothing to do with your application. She's just been watching your work on Instagram.

SPEAKER_03 8:36

No, but I share that I applied years ago and never heard back because don't give up. If you've ever wanted to give a TED talk, um, and local TED, so there's TED, right? And then there's TEDx, and TEDx are independently put together, but under the TED umbrella, and then they're throughout the world. So um, yeah, look into your local TED events and they're always doing calls for speakers every year. So don't let a rejection hold you back because I just gave a TED talk.

SPEAKER_01 9:08

So when you apply, you don't have to file any money or anything like that, do you?

SPEAKER_03 9:12

No, no, you you don't pay for this and you don't get paid. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 9:20

And then you had a coach. Yes, even though you've done this a thousand times, done these talks and stuff, but you had like a talk uh person that helps you coach you for this TED talk.

Landing A TEDx: Invitation And Process

SPEAKER_03 9:31

Yeah, after I was asked to speak, I was like, okay, I've been speaking for a decade. I've spoken in front of like 500 people, I've got this, but I also had never been coached. And part of TEDx ABQ includes coaching. They really want, you know, stellar talks and people to feel really good and confident. And while they've invited you or you've you've been accepted, you're not fully green lit until you know a couple months later, leading right up to the TED event. Um, so even though I I I was in, I still had to be approved by the coaches and to see how the talk came through. So the coaching was optional, except for they wanted you to attend at least two or three. But I was like, oh my gosh, like I've always wanted to have a speaking coach. So I'm gonna, I'm gonna do this. And so I went in, I went in humble. Like that was really important to me to be like, even though I have this experience, I want to take advantage of this amazing dream and opportunity. And so it was interesting because Crystal, I thought, oh, you know, I've been speaking for so long. I I got this, I can do this. But speaking and educating is so different than a TED talk. A TED talk is really designed to be, as um TK O'Giri says, my coach, like a conversation at a picnic. So for me, it was so much growth, unexpected growth and challenges. I felt I felt more challenged creating an eight to ten minute talk than I've given hour and a half talks to like maternity care groups. So um, yeah, it was how do you how do you pare it down to such?

SPEAKER_01 11:16

I mean, I've seen you speak, you're a great speaker.

SPEAKER_03 11:18

Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 11:19

I don't I don't know how you did it. I know, I think it's like about nine minutes, is that right?

SPEAKER_03 11:23

Yeah, mine was just just around 10 minutes. Okay. Um, some are longer, like the longest they really wanted is like 17, but TEDx ABQ wanted it eight minutes. And so we all went in, um, because I think there was originally like 15 of us, and there ended up being 12 or 13 at the end. So again, not everyone makes it. You really gotta put in your all. Um, but it it was intense. And so it just started by just showing up at coaching and the coach who was pretty hardcore. I mean, she's straight to the point um saying, speak.

SPEAKER_01 11:56

What did she what did you learn? What did you learn about yourself that you're like, oh shit, do I do that? And you're like, I do that.

SPEAKER_03 12:02

I I went into this, like, you know, I I've spoken for so many years, but it's been about teaching about weight bias and a plus size pregnancy experience or body love for parents and body love for ourselves. And while I had shared parts of my stories throughout, it was never fully about me. And so that became a thing of like, I wanted you want to tell a story, like you want people to be engaged, you're not, and you're there to teach. And so a lot of it is you being vulnerable and open. I mean, it depends what direction you take, but that's what I did. And it was surprising to me how challenging it was because like the the first time you're just kind of getting the ball rolling, but then the second time I had really worked on my script and showed up to coaching, and I was basically like, don't be an asshole to fat people. I was like almost aggressive in how I was speaking, and they're like, Okay, well, that was something, but that's not really a kid talking. So I was I was so glad I went in humble because I was just like, Oh, great, give me feedback, tell me more. What can I do different? What can I do better? And so you just spend weeks tweaking minute little things. Like, if you're only speaking for eight to 10 minutes, every sentence matters. What are you trying to say?

SPEAKER_01 13:21

Did you have any tears at all during all that process?

Coaching, Vulnerability & Writing The Talk

SPEAKER_03 13:24

Oh my gosh, so many. Like, I never worked so hard on something for 10 minutes in my life, like it became so intense that I even stopped going to coaching twice a week because it was just like so much, felt so overwhelming and felt so vulnerable. Um, yeah. And you know, my my talk starts off by me sharing how a care provider assumed that I needed to be on oxygen because I was struggling to breathe and wasn't even helping me. They were just like, Well, here's your BMI, maybe you just need to be on oxygen. And I was just literally like this. I was like, this is not my normal. And so talking about my own experiences with weight bias, um, and then my journey to the work that I do now, and like talking about what is the solution to to changing the conversation around weight bias. And um so it was, it was so much work, Crystal. But one of the things that stands out to me that I'd love to share is I got to the point where I felt like I was making good points. And um, you know, the title is like everybody deserves to be treated with dignity, which I probably would have changed the title now, thinking about search engine optimization. But that was really my message is that we all deserve it. But there was no levity in my talk, like none. I knew it was missing, and people made some suggestions because you kind of like your coach does the main work, but then other people will help too. And they make these suggestions, but they were kind of self-deprecating jokes. And it was very important to me as a fat woman talking about weight bias that I was not going to be self-deprecating. And that took work of like, right, how do you write a joke as a fat person that isn't going to be self-deprecating when you're specifically talking about weight? And so, funny enough, and it did get laps. Um, my parents actually met at Weight Watchers. So that was like the perfect thing when I talked about how, like, growing up, the first thing doctors always talked about was like, What diet are you on? Right. And then I, you know, at least I as if I hadn't tried them all twice. Um I say, you know, in fact, um my parents met at Weight Watchers. So technically I've been attending meetings since before I was even born. So that's the joke that I went with. I was like, do I say like I'm the best out of Weight Watchers? No, I don't have that big of an ego. But like I played a lot with like we're the joke. And the other joke was around BMI. Um, you know, that it was created in the 1800s by a mathematician, you know, around the same time, you know, that leeches were, you know, the advancements in technology. I don't say exactly like that, but you know, so so that was tricky though, because you want to move hearts and minds, and part of that is making people laugh. And that's I think that's a lot of what I what I do on the daily and my personality and showing up, you know, in in Instagram stories. Um but it felt challenging to write that into a very tight script, but I did it.

SPEAKER_01 16:35

Yeah. And I I I loved it, it was a good laugh. And also I could definitely hear uh when you got choked up during the talk, you could definitely hear that in your and not just because I know you, but because you could tell that you're feeling emotional about it. I know it was it's it's it's it's uh uh it's a tough topic for all of us, no matter how even though we've been doing it forever, it's still hard to reconcile that people just feel they have disdain towards us.

SPEAKER_03 17:00

Yeah, and also the uh Alex, amazing human who put this together, but she had this huge big vision of like a circus theme. So there were acrobats and all this stuff, but it was a round stage, round with people sitting all the way around you 360. And so I, as someone who has spoken, you know, and has experienced, was like way overwhelmed and scared. Because I'm like, okay, I really have to engage all the way around, but not only that, people are gonna be staring at my butt at times, and so what the fuck do I wear? And like wanting to do that. Because she wanted the circus theme and and curiosity and creativity was like the the theme of it. Yeah, and it it was such an amazing event, and the video is incredible, it's great, yeah. It looks so great, but it really was like people who had hardly done any speaking, they're just like, okay, like going through the motions of learning. And I'm just like, whoo, do they not realize how hard this is? It is hard, and then also just being vulnerable and honest of hey, if you guys are gonna have stairs up to the you know the platform, like I'm a little nervous about that, and I might be out of breath, and right being vulnerable and sharing all that. And they had a lovely um person who escorted me and held my hand up to the stage, so I felt fully supported. Um, and also I had to not I had I didn't have to, but part of my talk and really like the theme throughout of like inclusivity was I chose to sit in a chair with arms on stage and show how it didn't fit my body.

SPEAKER_01 18:49

But that's the fat person on the planet is like, that's me. There I am, that's my whole life right there.

Humor Without Self‑Deprecation

SPEAKER_03 18:55

But I didn't get to rehearse that in advance. Oh, really? The chair was not there at rehearsals, so I man, I got a picture of like which chair do you want, Jen? And I pick I picked the smaller one intentionally. So the day of I'm showing up to like give this talk that I've dreamed of, and I'm like, shit, so the chair can't be too small, but I don't want it too big. And I can't, I mean, I could, but I don't want to break the chair on stage. And I tell you, Crystal, it was like a glass slipper, like it would tight enough too tight. So it all, you know, I feel like everything worked out and all the hard work. Like every, every day that I dropped my kid off at high school, on the way back, I was rehearsing, every shower I was rehearsing, and any time in the car alone, I was rehearsing. I've never, I've never, yeah, worked so hard on something before.

SPEAKER_01 19:47

Man, and rehearsal is makes all the difference because I've tried to wing things before. The rehearsal makes it so much better always, but it was so good, Jen. And then also just in the when you're a speaker, you're trying to engage with your entire audience, right? So you're trying to make sure you make eye contact with everybody, but you have to figure out how to do that three steps.

SPEAKER_03 20:08

All the way around.

SPEAKER_01 20:10

What the hell? That's a challenge on its own.

SPEAKER_03 20:12

That's where a lot of the coaching came in. And also, I wasn't good at breathing in the beginning because I felt like I gotta talk about this. I'm so impassioned. And they're like, breathe. So breathing and pacing, like I know I'm gonna be such a stronger speaker from everything I learned from this experience. And I've talked to other people who have given a TED talk and they had to hire their own coaches. So I'm so thankful that this was provided to me because it really, even though I have so much experience, made such a difference.

SPEAKER_01 20:46

And what it must be crazy expensive to hire a TEDx talks coach.

SPEAKER_03 20:51

Yeah, I don't know. I mean, I'll shout out TKO Gary again. She's amazing. Uh, but yeah, that was included as us, you know, donating our time to give this TED talk.

SPEAKER_01 21:03

And that was all there in near near you. So you do all you do all this coaching stuff in person, not Zoom.

SPEAKER_03 21:08

Yeah, all in person.

SPEAKER_01 21:10

Wow. And you looked adorable.

SPEAKER_03 21:12

Thanks. That was another thing is you can't wear black. And um, you couldn't wear darker colors because you'd blend in part of TEDx to be a part of TEDx is high production level, and that's why every TED video you've ever seen is such great quality. So they're very, you know, have guidance on what you can wear, what you can do, you can't do, all this stuff. And that was a struggle because yeah, I still have internalized fat phobia, and I was fearful of what my body was gonna look like 360, you know, in this momentous opportunity. And I wanted to wear black. I'll be straight honest with that. Like, I have a really cute black dress, and that's what I wanted to wear. And I even pushed back, and they were like, well, just you know, think and try and. It took some internal work to be like, Jen, like this is why you're here.

SPEAKER_01 22:04

Like, no matter how much black we wear, we people can still see how much space we take up. But it is, it's just an easy thing to do. It's, I mean, even for me, just like not seeing too much busyness underneath my eyeline. Like, I just prefer solids. I don't wear things that are fussy. And I know this is years and years of conditioning that I've received, and I probably should undo it at some point. But it's just so much easier, you know? You have like a uniform, I have my uniform. People know me for my pants and my undershirt and my overtop. You have your cute leggings and your um tunics and your super cute shoes, and that's your style. We all know that's what you're gonna show. We always have a cute dress on.

SPEAKER_03 22:46

But I was thankful for snag tights because I could wear tights that actually fit my body. So giving them a shout out. And absolutely. And I went I went for a navy, like no, not even navy, like a bright blue dress. And and I really worked through like why am I feeling this way? And why do I want to wear black? Because yeah, it is all internalized fat movia. And and so then I was like, no, you have to show up. And so I did, and I felt so pretty. And I you did, and you looked adorable.

SPEAKER_01 23:16

Yeah, weren't you taught, taught, like, especially when you're gonna be on television, nothing fussy, not not too many prints, not too much plaid. Everything just gets so blown out on television. Yep.

Staging Challenges: 360 Stage And Chair

SPEAKER_03 23:25

And then there was like no patterns. I'm like for your show, I I gotta without the fat babe sweatshirt, right? Um, but yeah, there was no words on your shirt, like very, very clear on what to do and and not to do. But in in those rules are set so that you shine the best you can and that your TED talk does as well.

SPEAKER_01 23:47

I think the point is that they don't want people's attention to be go somewhere else if you're wearing something or like your your shirts rising up in the back or it's opening up at the bra. They want to get rid of all that stuff, all that noise, right?

SPEAKER_03 24:01

So and props are not normally used in a TED talk. So that was something that we went back and forth on, but it really added an important element because my my takeaway was really like to start thinking about how weight bias shows up in our everyday lives. Um, you know, from the chairs we choose, the questions we ask, how we show up. So it it fit great. One other element of my talk that I didn't really get to experience until being on the Ted stage on that red dot was I included horrific things that have been said about my body. True screenshots of of awful things, which I was shocked because I didn't get to see this the pictures before that the faces weren't blurred out. I I asked them to be blurred out for the actual video that came out just for liability. But like I just gave them examples of screenshots of actual comments that people have said to me on social media that are just horrific. And so I had to stand on stage and they did an audio overlay of these things, and then they were also on the screen. And I just kept telling myself as I'm hearing all these awful things, just hold your head up, girl, hold your head up. And I did, but that was intense too. Like I knew that was an element of my talk. I just didn't get to to rehearse it. And that was one thing that I was like, but I I really was like, don't look down, don't look down, look up, own it.

SPEAKER_01 25:33

Right. Yeah, gosh, man. So since it happened, how long did it take for the by the time you finished the recording and everything? They produced it and they made it available. How long did that take?

SPEAKER_03 25:43

Um, it it was the TED Talk was in late September, and then it came out. Like, when did I when did I post about it? Because I I admit I was stalking Ted's um Ted's YouTube because that's where it where it drops. And it was it was November, but I don't remember exactly when. I'm sure I can find it right here. It was oh no, that's when I did my talk. That's just a photo. But um, let's see here. I made too many reels, Crystal. But not too many, you made just the right minute. In mid-November. Mid-November. So it was it was a wait after doing something. Like you're just so anxious and so excited, but it also just felt so good to be done after doing something. Like you worked so hard on, too.

SPEAKER_01 26:31

Did you have that like endorphins and you couldn't sleep for a few days?

Hearing The Hate And Holding Steady

SPEAKER_03 26:35

Oh my gosh, like I I don't, I mean, I still get a little nervous before sneaking. I have these routines and breathing exercises, but at the rehearsal, I was sweating buckets. I was so thankful for the um volunteer, the speaker coordinator, Lenisha. She was like fanning me down, and I had a fan, and I'm like, oh, I got my dress dry cleaned, and I have to wear this tomorrow. And I'm just like, it just felt so vulnerable to share my own journey. And um, but the day, the day of I was less nervous, thankfully. Uh, and once I was on that stage, I felt like I just knew it. I mean, it had been so internalized from rehearsing so much. There were a few little things that I dropped. When you hear me make the pause and it like comes across as emotional, that was me actually going, oh fuck, oh fuck. But I but I've been speaking for so long, I know how to like pivot. Because I there was nervousness and my my loving my loving partner, Chris, um was sobbing in the front row. And I just like I'm like, I can't look at you. What are you doing to me?

SPEAKER_01 27:48

So proud of you.

SPEAKER_03 27:50

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 27:51

It's so beautiful. So mostly good has come from it. I'm hoping that like have you gotten a lot of like negative.

SPEAKER_03 27:58

Well, here's something that we can relate to all yeah, like positive, positive response to it. But I thought, okay, here's the dream. You get TEDx, and then I've you know, would love to get a speaking agent and do a lot more speaking. And then Southwest happened. And I used to fly. I say used to. I haven't flown since this all happened, but flew exclusively Southwest because of their customer size. That's how I've flown the country to speak about weight bias in healthcare. And now that's taken away, and I'm afraid. So I recently got a you know, outreach about a speaking opportunity. It was the first time I had to be like, hey, yes, thank you for this opportunity. But by the way, like my part of my expenses is gonna have to be you covering possibly two seats, and that was hard. And it was even someone I knew was booking me for their amazing conference. Like it was emotional and it was again, I say embarrassing because I still have that internalized fat phobia, even though I've worked so hard, but I'm I own it. Like I was embarrassed to have that conversation of like, listen, and money is always a tricky conversation too, because that can be up to another$400. So it was it was hard to navigate, and so it makes me I need to own it, and I feel like once I fly for the first time since it's gone, I'll feel better, more confident. But it's just been devastating.

SPEAKER_01 29:30

Yeah, I did fly recently, but I got ride on under the last the day before 27th. Yeah, so and I I wasn't sure because the flight was full, but I just I don't really call them anyway because I'm just so pissed off. And they gave me like my$179 back. I was like, well, it was really great knowing y'all. I probably won't be flying with you guys anymore. It's been a great 15 years, thank you so much, you know. And they're like, you know, the people you talk to on the phone, they're very they're like, I'm sorry, you know, it's a corporate decision, we know that, but it's like, man, I've given you all of my business, like 100% of my business. I started flying again because of them 15 years ago, and now I'm like, why would I fly southwest? Because I I mean it's bare bones, and then I'd rather fly if I'm gonna pay all this money, I'm rather go fly Americ, uh, American or Alaska or whatever, but it just means I'm never gonna, I'm gonna always have to pay double what normal people pay to travel across the country.

Post‑Talk Release, Nerves & Performance

SPEAKER_03 30:25

Yeah, as I loved what Reagan Trustine recently said about like, you know, we have to pay double to go from point A to point B just because of our size. Like that really stuck home to me. To me, it was like you had this inclusive policy that made such an impact and gave people such dignity. And it wasn't just for people of size, it was for the people, I mean, it wasn't just for the people who share a role with us, it was also for us. Like, I don't like to snuggle with strangers either. So, um, yeah, it it's been hard. And also, like, I worked with Southwest, like they flew me out for their first ever creators event because a reel that I made about their policy went viral with like over three million plays. So to have them pick me because of my size, and then you know, a year and a half later say we don't care about people of size was it's wild.

SPEAKER_01 31:18

I mean, I they were making billions of dollars of profit while using this person of size policy. I wonder if we're not flying with them anymore, or are they gonna feel it? Because imagine how many people bought tickets because of you and me. Just just the people that you and I have influenced. Yeah, like my cousins, my family members, yeah, my people in my my you know, Kirby girl community. Well, yeah, I'm flying. They can see me and see how fat I am. I'm I'm flying. I get a second flight, I get a second seat, I get the seatbelt extender, and they're like, You can fly. I go, I can fly. Thanks to Southwest. And now I don't know. I'm not, I probably I don't see me flying them again. I don't why would I?

SPEAKER_03 31:58

Yeah, pretzels? They're both baggy pretzels. It's hard. And I've also an Albuquerque, so I've heard spirits like the front row is great. I don't even think we have spirit. Like we are a very tiny airport here.

SPEAKER_02 32:10

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 32:11

I don't have a lot of options, and yeah, so yeah, to go from like thinking, oh, I want to speak everywhere to like, I know what what do I what how yeah, I mean it's it was emotional enough putting myself in public on a plane out there um in general, because you see how people look at you.

SPEAKER_01 32:30

People are gonna be rude.

SPEAKER_03 32:31

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You sign up for that, we know, yeah, yeah. And now it just feels like oh, back to that.

SPEAKER_01 32:37

Yeah, I know. We went backwards, just like everything, unfortunately. This whole GLP one thing has brought took a lot of her progress away. But I'm still working on it. I know you are still too, and I'm just so proud of you and so excited for you. And yeah, maybe we can find. I know Tigris always has some good ideas about traveling, you know, she travels a lot.

SPEAKER_03 32:57

And yeah, her group is like my number one resource on or flying while fat. That's hers, right?

SPEAKER_01 33:03

That's uh, I think that's Stacey Bias's group. Oh, sorry.

SPEAKER_03 33:07

I'm sorry, Tigris has amazing resources though.

SPEAKER_01 33:10

Yeah, and she's always flying for NAFA, so she does have a lot of great resources.

SPEAKER_03 33:13

Yeah, sorry, I got that again later at night. My brain is fried. Yeah, me too.

SPEAKER_01 33:18

And like like you, Tigris comes up on our all of our episodes. Yeah, yeah. Because she is such a great resource.

SPEAKER_03 33:23

Amazing so much admire the work of Tigris and and every really every fat activist who has been doing this work for decades, right? And you know, it yeah, it the pendulum will swing back again.

Travel Access Lost: Southwest Policy Shift

SPEAKER_01 33:38

You know, people are learning now that the GLP ones aren't, you know, they weren't as perfect as they thought they might be, and like all of their diets, people are gaining their weight back, and then additional weight, the rebound weight plus some. So and some people will be able to stay on it the rest of their lives, and that's great too. I always want people to do what they need to do for their bodies, you know. I if you were a friend of mine, you asked me directly, and you want my opinion, I would tell you. But I'm not gonna, you know, if you if you're a fat person, you need to do it. It's a great drug for uh diabetes, we know that. And you know, people get their diabetes turned around right away. I mean, you once you're a diabetic, you're always a diabetic, but I think it's great, but I just I hate I hate to well, I feel like it's a little bit like eugenics-y right now, like they're trying to get rid of all this fatties, you know. I'm like, well, I'm not going anywhere, so I'll probably go stay fat my whole life just because I've been fat for like almost 58 years. So just thinking maybe it's my genetic code.

SPEAKER_03 34:35

Like even in my work in as a child of earth educator, like we're hearing care providers at this six-week postpartum visit recommending a GLP one for people in larger bodies, and there's no studies to show that it says for breastfeeding and chest feeding. So and we know the benefits of those things. Um, so yeah, it's it's there's so much to unpack. Um, but you know, no matter what, there's always gonna be people of all different sizes. So of course I'm still gonna be speaking about weight bias. You're still gonna be doing the work that you've been doing, and and we're gonna keep showing up because, you know, there's always gonna be a need, sadly, to combat these damn biases that again I have even admitted multiple times now. I still carry, I I'll never forget doing the Harvard implicit bias test. Have you ever done that, Crystal?

SPEAKER_01 35:26

Yes, yes, yes.

SPEAKER_03 35:27

I encourage people listening, you can do it from multiple biases, which is so important. But for weight bias, I've probably even shared it with you on the show. Like, I was ashamed of my result. But I think it helps just to normalize even I'm still unpacking stuff. I think it helps to alleviate some of that pressure to be like a good human, and oh, I would never. We all do, we all hold our biases.

SPEAKER_01 35:51

So you gotta just like fish don't know they're swimming in water, you know. We we're swimming in it all. We are swimming in all of it. It's just inherent in our culture and diet culture is everywhere. It's like white supremacy, it's just everywhere. It's it's I know everything we do in our country, especially uh is steeped in white supremacy and diet culture. And most fucked up. So okay, so back to business of stuff, a business of the TED Talk stuff. Can you use the video and put on your website? Can you can you say I'm a TEDx speaker? Like, can you use all that kind of labeling and branding for your stuff?

SPEAKER_03 36:30

Ted owns the video. So one thing we can't do is like take the video and download it. Okay, you see everyone making reels, which I still haven't done. I need to make my I need to make my own reel. But um, you can embed the video from YouTube anywhere, so it's all or all over my website. And so you can embed anywhere from YouTube, right? So, yes, you can put on your website as long as you embed it. And yes, I am a TEDx speaker. I can say that and use the logo and definitely updated all of my bios. That is the highlight. And um, I did actually get an email the other day from someone saying, Oh, I saw your TED talk and I'm interested in speaking. And so I'm hopeful that those messages still keep coming in because I love what I do. Um, I just wish it wasn't there weren't so many barriers to even just showing up.

SPEAKER_01 37:19

I wonder what words you can search on that lets that TED talk come up. Like I was I just did like Jen, comma plus mommy, comma, TED Talk, and then bam. But you know, I know you specifically, but like I wonder if I didn't know you, and I just want to know if you just are any talks.

SPEAKER_03 37:35

If you just type in Jen McClellan, it'll come up as the first video, the TED Talk. But um, I mean, the name of it is Everybody Deserves to be treated with dignity, so it'll pop up that way. Um but with my name, it comes up. Um, but if you do, if you do search for TED Talks on weight bias, there are some. Mine just won't pop up because of the title. And so that's one thing I wish I would have done a little different, but but it is what it is, and like if that's my only thing I wish I would have done different, then I'm very proud.

SPEAKER_01 38:08

I know you're an analytics girl, so are you getting traffic from the TED Talk to you?

SPEAKER_03 38:14

It's I mean, it it dropped right before the holidays, and then I got pneumonia. So even I haven't promoted it as much as I want to. Um, so I'm gonna do another round. I mean, it it you know is my goal that it would so it's on the main um it's like a part of the YouTube of Ted, which has like uh millions of subscribers. Um so you you want Ted to like profile it. So that hasn't happened. That's still the dream. Um, and I I want a lot more people to watch it. So if you're listening, it's like just around 10 minutes, it's not that long. Um but I would love more people to watch it.

SPEAKER_01 38:53

When when I don't know if you know this about groupons, but when you do a group on, if you promote your group on, the more people that go and click on your group on, the more group on does for you. Oh. So then they're all of a sudden that you show up in their newsletters, not just on the group on page. And then you'll get in their weekly newsletter or their weekend newsletter. And I only know I tested this twice when I had the store, Curvy Girl. Yeah, yeah. And they wanted to become an electrologist. And I was like, oh, I see how this works. So the more I did trying to get people to go to my group on, even if they didn't buy it, I said, just go to that, please. Yeah, yeah, go to the line. Just everybody goes there a few times a month or once a month or once a quarter. I think that helps them. Have you ever been um have you ever been highlighted on Apple podcasting? You know, some people move on to the four-year page or whatever.

SPEAKER_03 39:42

Oh, yes. When when the show dropped, it was like in a top pregnant family, family podcast.

SPEAKER_01 39:48

Okay, yeah. I think it's kind of like that. It's like how much they they notice how much interest there is about you, and then when you start bubbling up, then they start going, hey, we should, it's like the rich get richer kind of thing.

Costs, Anxiety, And Finding Alternatives

SPEAKER_03 39:59

Definitely, definitely. Yes, yes. I need to keep pushing, pushing eyeballs onto the the TED um YouTube. Yeah, I yeah, I I I want so many people to see it because it just means so much. And I hope that it in a relatable way shows, you know, the the life existence of being someone in a fat body and where it started and dieting and diet culture, and that I had this amazing experience where a care team didn't just look at my weight, like it was the first time as an adult that I was treated with dignity, and it's when I was pregnant. And because of that, that's why I've been doing the work I've been doing for 15 years now almost, because I was treated with such kindness by a care team. Like it seems so simple, Graceful, but it's like I know, I you know, I I in a long thing of Jen admitting her faults, I will also add that I used to be like, it's just so frustrating to like just be compassionate, it's not that hard. But with my husband losing his vision, I've realized how able the world is and how able I am too. Yep, me too. Trying to help him navigate the world with hardly any vision. So it's made me even more compassionate within my own work of like, yeah, you don't know what you don't know. And I think that my TED talk helps to point that out a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 41:27

I wonder how many people don't understand or realize how much ableism we all have in our own heads. It's it's a lot. When you start looking at it really hard, you're like, God dang, I suck, you know? Um, I try and like my fat joy events are always trying to make sure everything is really accessible. And yes, I had to go over all kinds of different venues and like, no, I want everything on the ground floor. I don't even want to have to elevators this time, you know. Like, well, I want everybody to just be able to walk right in or roll right in and not have to even think about it. Yeah, three steps up or two steps up. Because what's two or three steps, no big deal. But it is if you have a wheelchair or a walker or a cane or a I mean, it just it's we're all so bad. And then I wonder too, do are there fat people do talks on TED Talk, but not about fatness?

SPEAKER_03 42:15

I would hope so. I was funny enough, there was a commercial last night. I don't know everything in my world revolves around birds, but it was a midwifery or um at midwifery school here in Albuquerque, and it was like a fat midwife and a fat patient, and I was literally like bouncing and clapping and so excited. And it was just about midwifery, it wasn't about being fat. So, yeah, I mean, right? Like, people of all sizes. Um, but it's another thing for us to think about of yeah, when people are planning a conference, like diversity is so important. That that was really important to me with being here in you know New Mexico, where there's a huge indigenous population and making sure that that representation was gonna be a part of it. Like in the back of my head, I was like, okay, maybe there needs to be diversity, like that is incredibly important for all of us.

SPEAKER_01 43:05

It really is. It's just yeah, it makes the world so much better, but it's hard for people to um understand. Like, I know I get shit on a lot as a fat person, but when you have a disability and you're fat or other, you have more than one marginalization, it's just gets so bad. And yeah, a lot of people with disabilities don't even like base, basically they don't even want to struggle trying to leave their house. They're just like, let's have all my friends come over here because it's just easier. You know, like, man, I hate that for them, you know. I'm like, God dang it, Crystal, you gotta do better. So I know you're trying to do better and trying to do better, but we need everybody to try to do better, you know.

GLP‑1s, Healthcare, And Nuance

SPEAKER_03 43:39

Well, you've taught me so much, Crystal. I remember when you came to Denver and I lived in Denver and we did the Cheesecake Factory, and there was a chair with arms, and you're like, No, girl, I need a chair without arms, and like you just asked for it and it was there. And like, yeah, we've we've loved and supported on one another for so long, and I I've learned from you. And um, hopefully I've shared some wisdom with you and it Yes, you have. You know, it it's it's all learning and growing. And but it's a the basis of it is just meeting people with kindness and meeting people where they're at and and uh just not hard to be kind.

SPEAKER_01 44:14

It's so easy.

SPEAKER_03 44:16

But I look at you know, I have a high schooler and he deals with the bullying that I dealt with when I was in high school. Like it doesn't it doesn't really change, but we gotta keep showing up even when we don't want to, and uh it's not always easy, but it's so incredibly important.

SPEAKER_01 44:33

Before we wrap up, what's your plans for 2026? Have you I know I've had pneumonia in the past as a nightmare, and I bet you have no energy, I'm sure. But um, what's going on for you? What are you hoping to um try to accomplish this year?

SPEAKER_03 44:44

I um developed a course on size inclusivity for maternity professionals. So that's my real goal is to get it out. It got approved um by the California Board of Nursing for nursing credits. So nursing nationwide can take it, and also general contact hours for like doulas and nutritionists. Like if you work with pregnant people, let check out my course. So that's my big hope is to get that out into the world um this year and and hopefully speak more. Like that that would be a dream. I just need to be able to figure out how to get there and not um not have so much anxiety and stress around it.

SPEAKER_01 45:25

Yeah. Yeah, it's so hard to imagine you have any anxiety or stress over it. But like for me, I don't get too nervous if I know what I'm talking about, you know? But I even if I know what I'm talking about, I still get a little bit of butterflies just because.

SPEAKER_03 45:37

Oh no, I meant flying. Flying. Oh, oh yeah, flying, okay, yes. No, no, I don't, yeah, I'm not really better. I get, I mean, I still get a little bit of nerves, but just a little bit, right? I have my breathing exercises, and then rescue remedy is amazing, and you can get it almost anywhere, and it just kind of helps take the edge off and soothes me. Um no, I'm I'm more how sad is that? I am more anxious, Crystal, about getting uh going to an airport and getting on a plane than speaking in front of 500 people. I mean, that's really the reality.

SPEAKER_01 46:08

It's weird. Most most people aren't like that.

SPEAKER_03 46:11

No, no, I'm like what I love to do and want to do is a lot of people's worst nightmare.

SPEAKER_01 46:17

Exactly. Yeah, you're an anomaly, for sure. For sure. That's so great chatting with you. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_02 46:22

And so thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_01 46:23

Yeah, I can't wait to share this with you because I want to share the link and share everybody, have everybody check you out. And you don't have to be even pregnant or interested in being pregnant just to watch it. It's so it's great.

SPEAKER_03 46:34

It's not even about pregnancy. It's that I mean that's a part of my story. Um, yeah, but it's not, it's just about, you know, how do we meet people with dignity and treat them with dignity and just thinking about weight bias and how it impacts so many people more than more than we realize. So with the uh American Psychological Association, uh showed that like 42% of adults have experienced weight bias. So a lot of us. And so it's a conversation we need to be having.

SPEAKER_01 47:05

Yep, yep, yep. So again, Torvey, how to find you?

SPEAKER_03 47:08

Thank you, Crystal. Um, plus size birth.com for everything, plus size and trying to conceive pregnancy postpartum. I'm a certified childbirth educator and have a ton of resources on there from where to find maternity clubs, because that's important to how to advocate in healthcare settings. Uh, and then uh plus mommy is kind of where I just show up as Jen. Yeah. I hang out on Instagram as besties and um we gotta get the podcast back up because I have been harassing Crystal to be on it since 2014. So um that's a reason for me to get it back up.

SPEAKER_01 47:43

Okay, sounds like a plan to me. All right, Chico. Thank you so much. Thanks for everybody. See you guys. See you later, alligators. Bye. After crocodiles. Thank you.