A Wiser Retirement®

296. Crypto Update: Big Beautiful Bill, GENIUS Act, & Crypto Company IPOs

• Wiser Wealth Management • Episode 296

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In this episode of A Wiser Retirement® Podcast, Casey Smith sits down with Robert Swarthout, founder and CEO of Teton Crypto Capital, to unpack how recent legislation is reshaping the crypto landscape in the U.S. From tax changes to new opportunities for investors, here’s what you need to know.

Related Podcast Episodes:
- Ep 281: Crypto Update: Tariffs, Ripple’s Victory, and What’s Next for Investors
- Ep 286: How can I evaluate crypto as a potential investment?

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Crypto Tax Changes Overview

Speaker 1

small crypto purchases are no longer taxable, so if the gain is less than $300, it is not a taxable event. There's a $5,000 cap on a yearly basis, so in some sense you can use it as a currency.

Speaker 3

Welcome to a Wiser Retirement Podcast. Are you curious about the latest news in the world of cryptocurrency? I'm Casey Smith. Today, I'm joined with Robert Swarthout, founder CEO portfolio manager of Teton Crypto Capital. Each week, we bring you practical advice on retirement, investing and planning for your financial future. Don't forget to subscribe to the podcast wherever you're listening. Let's get started. Hey Robert, how's it going? It's doing great. Yeah, it's doing great.

Speaker 1

Everything's great, it's hot, it is very hot, it's super hot. Yeah, I'm happy to be inside. Normally I'm outside in the mornings working on my wife's horse property, but to be, inside to record a podcast is quite pleasant.

Speaker 3

I love how you phrased that my wife's horse property. You're like the number one volunteer there. Yes, or slave labor or something. I don't know something, something, how's your pilot's license going?

Speaker 1

it's it's going slowly, I'm slowly working on.

Speaker 3

You got the private done now, which I think we congratulated you about, and now you're working on instrument training yeah, and it's.

Speaker 1

admittedly I haven't had tons of time to focus on it so it's going slow right now, but um did a three-leg trip week or so ago from atlanta out to um charleston and Hilton head, then back, so it was fun.

Speaker 3

What's your biggest surprise for instrument training so far?

Speaker 1

Um this, all the time in between, um that just kind of like feels like one of us has to be doing.

Speaker 3

You're just flying somewhere, not really doing anything.

Speaker 1

Um, but so you know, I am super early. I maybe have five hours into it at this point, so yeah, Well, you know, I am super early.

Speaker 3

I maybe have five hours into it at this point. So yeah, Well, you know, aviation is a lot like watching paint dry and then followed by 20 seconds of sheer terror. Right.

Speaker 1

Yeah, I think I was telling you that was the trip where we came back to Atlanta and we were dodging thunderstorm cells to get back into McCollum, yeah. And then we had this tunnel that we could see literally paralleling or directly down the runway at McCollum. Paralleling or directly down the runway at McCollum. Yeah, we landed and it was just like, probably got there. If we had gotten there five minutes later it wouldn't have been an option.

Speaker 3

So it was just on the ground in time right, we call the sucker holes.

Speaker 1

Yes, but it worked. You're not a sucker.

Speaker 3

Not a sucker this time landing's different, but when your crews across the country and you see this hole and you go through the hole, usually on the other side is not something very nice greeting you right, yeah, well, we knew there was a cell, I don't know, five miles west of there.

Speaker 1

So it was coming yeah, it was like either get down or hold for a while, right, exactly, hey, you need to practice holding, though. Well, that's what today's ground is all about. That's where I'm headed, after this that's cool that's.

Speaker 3

It's nice that they can use so much. Uh, simulators have advanced so much of these fight schools. Yeah, I didn't really have that option when, when I was coming up, you just had to get out there and bear bear holes in the sky sometimes. Yeah, that's cool. Well, let's get back to um crypto. So let's talk about the big beautiful bill. I just did I mean, I just did a little quick video with shauna about, uh, personal finance related to the big beautiful bill. Yeah, um, but we didn't really touch on crypto. So let's talk about how that changed the world for crypto.

Podcast Introduction with Robert

Speaker 1

I understand that that I can't um, I have to worry about wash sales now yeah, and that was a benefit of crypto dang it um so well, it's only gone up, so maybe that helped, because now we can't get out.

Speaker 1

So I did in the fund. We did a little bit of early tax loss harvesting. We had an opportunity earlier in the spring, so we did some. In hindsight it was great because that was you know, for those that don't know equities you obviously have to wait 30 days to rebuy something, or 31 days to capture the loss Crypto. You could literally buy it a second later after you sold it, and that was beautiful.

Speaker 3

Right.

Speaker 1

Now that will be going away. I don't think it's fully in effect yet, but I think certainly by the end of the year.

Speaker 3

Well, what that means is that crypto is becoming now more mainstream and on par with securities.

Speaker 1

Yeah, I mean how?

Speaker 3

they're treated. Part of me is complaining, but most of me is now more mainstream, mainstream and on par with securities.

Speaker 1

Yeah, I mean how they're treated. I, I part of me is complaining, but most of me is not. Admittedly, like I knew this day would come. I was, in some ways, you look forward to it, cause you knew you were growing up a little bit.

Speaker 4

Um as an industry.

Speaker 1

Yes, absolutely, um. So anyways, we um one of the three, one of the five things that was crypto related in the bill. Another thing was small crypto purchases are, no, no longer taxable. So if the gain is less than $300, it is not a taxable event. There's a $5,000 cap on a yearly basis, so in some sense you can use it as a currency, right. Right, you know, I would say this probably more applies to using stable coins than anything else. Other tokens are probably going to move depending on how much you hold enough to where, like, $300 gain could come into the equation.

Speaker 3

Right, but how would a stable coin move that much.

Speaker 1

The whole point is it's a stable coin. It's stable, but it's like, there's like you know, fractions of a penny right. So it's like you might have a small gain or loss depending on when you bought it If you moved a large transaction. Large transaction, or just like the market's a little bit different than when you bought versus when you're selling it.

Speaker 1

So you know, again, it's fractions of a penny, maybe thousands or tens of thousands of a penny difference, but that's technically a different value. So there's, it is now, or I guess, the tax part goes away now, so you don't have to pay taxes. And this is the third thing you don't have to pay taxes on staking or mining until you sell the actual token. Up into this point, this was a big one. This is a sticking point that a lot of crypto people, especially the ones that were doing staking and mining, really grumbled about, because you were still holding your tokens, um, if you're staking, and then you were getting these rewards if you're staking, and then you were getting these rewards Think of them as interest and in the meantime they were taxing the reward and then they were taxing it again if you were to sell it.

Speaker 1

So it felt like double taxation. You could make an argument I think that it was that part is going away. You don't pay taxes on staking or mining. You get to collect, and then you, as if you go to sell a portion or all of what you hold, um, then it would be, the taxes would be figured out capital gains um capital gains, yeah, so um crypto is treated just like any stock would be.

Speaker 3

So short-term and long-term capital gains, okay, um but if you're a person who's mining, that's kind of your income, so you're getting taxed at 15 or 20%, right, yeah, cause miners.

Speaker 1

I've I've never personally mined enough to where it really mattered, but, like I've heard, miners kind of take two strategies. One is they have constant costs electricity being the big one, cooling data centers so they have to constantly sell what they're mining to kind of pay for expenses. Others that have, I guess, bigger bank rolls they will. They'll sell in waves, kind of when the market's up versus when it's down. So, they'll kind of throw them in a piggy bank for a while and then they will go and sell them bigger lots, OTC A lot of times.

Speaker 1

a lot of these miners are selling to the ETFs at this point.

Speaker 3

So that makes sense.

Speaker 1

Yep, um. A fourth thing on the list is um lending your crypto doesn't trigger trigger a taxable event. So this was another thing. So there was lending platforms, um, whether it's DeFi or even a C5 platform, where you could come in and you lend your Bitcoin, ethereum or whatever that they offered.

Speaker 1

Um that was considered a taxable event. You got taxed on it and reset your basis. Um, not exactly optimal cause you were trying to probably just get cash flow from it. Um, now that does not trigger a taxable event. Nice, clean, simple um, and I believe this is the same way that a um, a loan against your equity portfolio, would act so I think there's a lot of alignment that's happening with these rules here.

Speaker 1

So makes sense and the fifth thing that was crypto related, that did not make it in the bill but was close was they tried to ban politicians from shilling crypto, shilling advertising pumping and dumping all the things, but it failed.

Speaker 3

So they still can do that.

Speaker 1

The Trump coin, the Trump one, is probably the best example, right, yes, so but but you know, going into the vote on the big beautiful bowl, I wasn't playing all that close attention to all this. And then it passed and this list came out. I'm like, oh, that's actually kind of good. There was obviously the bills, massive and no one's reading the whole thing.

Speaker 3

Right.

Speaker 1

But it's, it's. It's cool to kind of see this kind of stuff got slipped in there, and it wasn't some. It had this happened a year ago or two years ago and we had a big, beautiful bill, then it would have been five things that we hated um not four things in one thing that missed.

BBA Impact on Cryptocurrency

Speaker 3

So right, yeah, I speaking of reading the whole bill. Um, you know, I asked rock. I said, hey, give me the personal finance highlights of the bill. And what's interesting is it gave me that. But then I did a segment with Sean, and Sean I had four more things that were definitely personal finance related that did not pick up, so I don't know if Grok's even read the whole bill.

Speaker 1

Yeah, it's funny, or it's like it felt like you wanted a shorter list. It's like give me the elongated list.

Speaker 3

That's like I guess you have to like download the bill and then upload it in the Grok and say read this for possibly to make it more accurate, cause I think it was just probably probably pulling it from other people's posts, right.

Speaker 1

And not that document itself. Yeah, I mean, that would be one massive PDF.

Speaker 3

Holy bananas, you probably have to have a super grok membership or something. Yeah, the premium actually upload it.

Speaker 1

So, but anyways, that's kind of a wrap on the um big beautiful bill part I. Again, it's growing up. This was, in some sense, pork that got thrown in the bill um, but and we'll get to it here in a few minutes but there's more crypto specific stuff that congress has been working on. That's um been exciting, so so the stable cone bill.

Speaker 3

So that's called the genius act. Genius at why is genius all caps.

Speaker 1

Um. It's an acronym they've been using and, admittedly, I don't know if it actually means anything or they're just referring to the bill as that Um. So we haven't recorded in almost two months cause I was sick a month ago, um. But so what happens in the meantime is the genius act was first in committee in the Senate and then went to Senate vote Um. It failed the first time, um. It came back and kind of a do or die type moment it did in a passing Um, and now it's waiting on the house to vote.

Speaker 1

Okay, this is the week of July the 14th and it likely is going to be brought up for house vote this week. It sounds like it likely will pass. Yeah, the house is a little bit trickier of a scenario than the senate was um what's the big takeaway there?

Speaker 1

the big takeaway is this this basically um puts basic legislation in place for stable coins. It kind of says how they have to be run, how they have to store their assets. What can actually back a stable coin? It can't be bitcoin, it has to be dollars or treasury yeah type products, um, and just generally, like you can think of this as the most basic, like a block, um from legislation perspective sure for crypto.

Speaker 1

Um, the market structure bill, which we'll talk about in a minute, kind of starts to build upon that, because some stuff you know stable coins can be used in defi and some other stuff that will be part of that bill.

Speaker 4

Yeah.

Speaker 1

But you know it's just moving along. Trump has said he'd wanted this on his desk before the August recess. It looks like it might make it. I'm still kind of like you know I have too much PTSD from the past of Congress saying they're going to do something with legislation and not happening.

Speaker 4

Yeah, from the past of.

Speaker 1

Congress saying they're going to do something with legislation and not happening. But it looks like we might be getting this one done. Um, whether it happens before August I don't know, but it does seem likely.

Speaker 3

So how does that really affect investors though?

Speaker 1

Um again, I don't think this particular bill is more just putting guidelines on stable coin right. It starts to put guidelines and then it helps them put guidelines around the whole industry with the market structure bill.

Speaker 2

Um which we're talking about next.

Speaker 1

Yes, so you know it's. It's no different than just kind of having basic rules, basic traffic laws, and now we're going to have a more thorough set of traffic laws when the market structure bill comes along.

Speaker 2

Before we jump back into the episode, do you know if you are ready to take off and launch into retirement? Get your pre-retirement checklist. A free guide from Wiser Wealth Management. From cashflow to social security, we've got your countdown covered. Go to wiserinvestorcom slash guides to download your free guide today. Now let's get back to the episode. Guides to download your free guide today.

Speaker 3

Now let's get back to the episode. So the market structure bill. What are the takeaways there?

Speaker 1

Yes. So the market structure bill, we'll talk about the timeline first and then we can kind of go into some details. So the bill should be introduced after the August recess. That's going to be after the August recess, that's me before the August recess markup done in late September and potentially done by this, the Senate, by late September. So the idea that we had both of these done by the end of the year two or three months ago seemed like a fairy tale. Now it seems like a decent reality that's coming down the pipe. The market structure bill is going to put into place who governs this stuff. In the past, before this administration, the SEC was kind of using a heavy hand, trying to kind of, I guess, expand their turf and saying everything was a security. We've talked a lot about this.

Speaker 3

Right.

Speaker 1

Now I think it's more likely that it's a combination of the SEC, the CFTC I don't think a third agency kind of gets in the mix at all. The Treasury has kind of stuck its hand up a little bit about stable coins. I don't think that that's going to be granted. I think they're going to try to keep it a little more simple, at least from the read that I've done at this point. But again, it helps define what's the security. I know the SEC is trying to do some work around.

Speaker 1

Hester Peirce, one of the commissioners, is pushing for what would be called like a safe harbor, would allow a token potentially up to two years from launch, to kind of get its ducks in a row, just start to prove some decentralization, Because when they launch admittedly they're securities, Like there's literally probably one guy that clicked the button on the computer say go, and then it progresses from there and as tokens get dispersed or whatever the tokenomics are of that chain, it goes from being, in many people's opinion, going from security to a commodity or some other form, maybe some hybrid form of those two. So it puts rules around that to a commodity or some other form, maybe some hybrid form of those two. Yeah, so it puts rules around that. And what's really cool is the industry and the government, so the SEC and the CFTC seem highly collaborative right now. We're coming out of a phase of four, five, six, seven years where it was very like combative yeah. So we, you know we can't count our chickens before they've hatched here, but they seem like they're incubating well.

Speaker 3

Um so, so the the market structure bill sounds like that. That's what's really going to give us um more of the roadmap and make everything, everything legit. It puts it puts everything, everything we've been asking for for the last five years, or more yeah. Kind of comes full circle here and obviously it would make it harder for future administrations to walk it back, right?

Speaker 4

And if you had a different?

Speaker 3

if you had a different SEC chair right, then they wouldn't have the authority to do the things that have been done in the past.

Speaker 1

Right, and part of that comes down to what makes it in the bill and what in, I guess, separately. What does the bill give leeway to the agencies for rulemaking? Yeah, because the rulemaking is where we can have a wild hair SEC decide that, oh we the are, we're wrong before we're changing the rules.

Speaker 3

Yeah, yeah, correct.

Speaker 1

Correct, so that that's where the risk comes. But again, we also have a lot of representatives in Congress that don't understand this stuff, so I'm not sure I want them writing the rules either. So there's like this very fine line that has to be walked right now. Yeah, um, and I think it's some level, you get precedence the longer, longer you go along in a rule, almost in some sense becomes law.

Speaker 1

Yeah, um, because there's, I guess, some gravity behind it that makes sense. But, um, but yeah, we're moving along it in it. This market structure bill, I think it's safe to say, will be the moment where crypto arrives. Like it can be used by banks in the us. It can be, like you, used by businesses. Right now, there's a most outside of startups. These, um, institutions are keeping it at arm's length.

Speaker 3

Right Because there was there's severe penalty to pay Right For for dabbling in it, exactly which is about to be.

Speaker 1

Not that case at all. Right, it's going to flipping and all of a sudden become got the rubber stamp of approval. So, um, you know it's, it almost feels. It doesn't feel real, um, cause you've been through so much of this, the other direction. But it's, um, it's getting close.

Crypto IPOs and Market Analysis

Speaker 3

So, uh, let's talk about crypto IPOs. So these are crypto based companies that are now going public. Yeah, I I'll skip down to the second one real quick. Grayscale, uh, is going to follow the sec. I, I, I don't know why, but why would anybody buy the Greystone stock? That doesn't make sense to me.

Speaker 1

I. So they, they have trust and they have ETFs.

Speaker 3

Yeah.

Speaker 1

So they have fees that they're gaining.

Speaker 3

That's true. Maybe the company's good because they make so much money doing this, but to invest in it maybe that's not the best.

Speaker 1

Because yeah, invest in their products, to buy the product.

Speaker 3

Yeah, I just know that's not the best, because, yeah, invest in their products.

Speaker 1

To buy the product?

Speaker 3

Yeah, I just know that they're the most expensive ones. Like, why would you do that when you go to Bitwise and you get it for fractions to the dollar?

Speaker 1

I mean like less than 20% of the cost of the other one Right?

Speaker 2

Yeah, it's a good question. They're looking for the payday the IPO payday.

Speaker 1

Yes, the founders are definitely looking for an exit strategy this is that right, that's really, I think, what the important part of um, the grayscale one, is. Um, when I saw it, like I was surprised, but also I was like, no, not too surprised. Mike norvitz is like he's the. He's the guy that founded it and yeah I guess you know, as a former founder myself, like it's a um. You appreciate the hustle the guy went through, but I just don't like him as a, as a person personally, um.

Speaker 1

But anyways, politics aside, it's, it's a um you know, I guess he's put that put in the time. So, um, I think the one that's more interesting to talk about, though, is circle. So circle um is the largest us-based stable coin. Um, usdc Um, they have. I think we talked about it in the last podcast or maybe it was the one that I was sick that we were going to talk about it on but we um, um. So they had said that they started their IPO process.

Speaker 1

Ripple came in and Ripple was trying to purchase, uh, or buy them outright. Um, circle, originally, was trying to IPO on the street. The rumor was between $7 and $10 billion valuation. Ripple had come along and negotiating. They said, oh, we'll pay $5 to $8 billion. At one point, the rumor rumor which seemed at the time absolutely bananas that they offered 20 billion um, obviously it didn't happen. Circle is now public. Okay, right, um, holy bananas. Did the? The stock go on a tear at launch? So it priced at 31 a share. It opened it, I think, in the high 60s, so 100 pop immediately, and then in the preceding couple weeks it ran all the way up to 298 dollars. Wow, um, it's. Granted, it's not been open, uh, for 12 months, but its current pe ratio is 2400, jebie.

Speaker 3

Jr. It makes internet stocks seem like a bargain. Preston Pysh.

Speaker 4

Jr.

Speaker 3

That's price to earnings. You're buying it 2,400 times its earnings. That's insane, trey Lockerbie Jr, basically 2,500.

Speaker 1

And here's the thing is. You start to wonder like well, where do they make money? They offer a stablecoin that is only worth a dollar every time you buy it.

Speaker 4

Right In theory.

Speaker 1

So the way these stablecoin companies or issuers are making money is they hold the assets in this case treasuries, dollars, dollar equivalents and they're getting interest.

Speaker 3

Yeah.

Speaker 1

Right now we have a relative. I mean granted not long-term, but in the last 20 years we have a high interest rate environment.

Speaker 3

Right.

Speaker 1

When that comes down, cause it will, right Like the margins on this business get squeezed. The other thing that a lot of people don't realize about this is circle. I think it's just over 50 of their revenue is contractually obligated to go to coinbase because coinbase has been a big pusher of using stable usdc yeah, so 50 of your profit immediately is out the door are there?

Speaker 3

are there other verticals that this company might create that make? That would push that valuation?

Speaker 1

I I maybe something maybe somebody knows something they must be really creative, because I haven't come up with it um and it just seems bonkers to think that investors are bidding this up. If you want to be, if you want to have equity exposure to the crypto industry, there's very few options, and maybe that's the reason.

Speaker 1

Yeah, I mean, you have Coinbase, you have Circle, you have I guess you could also buy into Square. Sure, they have a little bit of crypto exposure, but they're more traditional payments. There's not tons of options, paypal, paypal, but they have a stable coin that no one uses. So I don't know. It just seems weird, um, I at this point. So it was up at 298, it's at $198 as we speak right now. Um, it's kind of been in this channel of 170 to 200. At some point you would think that the market wakes up and just kind of does the math on this and be like, yeah, what's going on? Um, but we'll see. Um, there's other, um, uh, companies thinking about going public. I've heard kraken is about to file kraken's another exchange, um, another big one. That will be interesting to watch. I don't think that they're going to be this year. Probably next year is when ripple decides to do it.

Speaker 1

um, they likely potentially have a bigger valuation than coinbase because, as of yesterday, coinbase now has a hundred billion dollar market cap okay um it has almost done a full circle from uh in circle not the stable coin um a company, but it's done full circle from their ipo in um march or april of 2021 right they were super high. They came down way low. They were down 90 percent from their peak. Now they're back up, um, because I actually own some um coinbase stock and I uh went back. I'm like, oh, I'm almost back to even almost back to you.

Speaker 3

Yeah, there was a lot of negative crypto news.

Speaker 1

That happened, yes, a tremendous amount um so, but anyways, um I you're just going to see more of these companies going public. There's a lot of them. They've been waiting for a more um a favorable environment, so yeah.

SEC vs. Ripple Settlement

Speaker 3

Um, speaking of favorable environments, let's talk about sec and ripple. Is this? Is this done now? Is it? Is it now closed and we can? Are they having trouble buttoning this thing up?

Speaker 1

Well it? I think there's two answers here. They did have some trouble buttoning it up. It didn't button up the way that SEC and Ripple wanted. But I believe that this is probably our last time talking about this.

Speaker 4

We've talked a lot about this, right.

Speaker 1

So, rewinding a little bit, the SEC and Ripple, under this new administration, obviously a little more friendly. They got together and Ripple's 125 million dollar fine was reduced. Um, the sec agreed to reduce it down to 50 million dollars. Um, and the injunction that ripple was going to have on them about selling securities, which basically says I'm not going to break the law okay, that's kind of a silly one. But whatever, um they reduced, they were going to suggest the court remove that as well. Um, those are the two headlines of it. Ripple and the SEC are in agreement. They had to go back to the court and ask for what they call an indicative ruling. Basically, he's asking the court to amend what the court thought was best and say you know, this is what we think is best. Court, can you please accept this?

Speaker 3

Yeah.

Speaker 1

Highly unusual, and the first time they went back the judgeres uh was like there's not enough details here. Buzz off. Um, they had the ability to come back again. They added more meat to the bone, came back and she's like too bad. She's like in some way you could, you can kind of side with her. The sec effectively wasted four years of her life right um and maybe she's a little irritated about that, sure.

Speaker 1

So it kind of got to the point where, all of a sudden, what did they do? Um, the sec and ripple have both said that they're going to drop their cross appeals. This thing is dead. At this point, ripple is going to pay the 125 million dollar fine, which the money was already sitting in there in escrow. Um, and the injunction stays in place again. The injunction is rather immaterial. It sounded more scary, I think, than it really was, because it basically says you're not going to sell unregistered securities without first telling the SEC.

Speaker 3

Well duh right, which is the law.

Speaker 1

Yeah, so anyways, yes, this thing is done. The SEC, the commissioners, still have to vote on this, but it sounds like this is a done thing at this point. If anything else comes up, I would be shocked, and I'm happy to never talk about this again.

Speaker 3

Sounds good. So, as we wrap up here, we've had a big market rally in Bitcoin I probably other cryptos as well. Is this a top? Is this the push higher? What? Do you think?

Speaker 1

Not necessarily a prediction, but just more so. What my gut tells me is I think that you know. So. Bitcoin is at 117,000 today. It's been up as high as 123 in the last three or four days. It went from 105 to 123, like pretty much a couple of days.

Speaker 1

I think Bitcoin does push higher through the end of the year or towards the end of Q3 and Q4 type of timeframe. Then, once that kind of rolls over, alts kind of get their chance to do the blow off top and so not to say this is a buying opportunity, but it's it's. It's a bit of a cooling off of some of the technicals on the charts. Some of them have gotten a little overbought, but I think we're about to have some fun. I wrote in my newsletter back in the spring when things were going really well it's like this is why you buy into crypto. You don't buy into crypto for all the crap in between.

Speaker 1

The days where it's up 10%, 20%, those are the fun days, and that's why you put up with all the mess in between.

Speaker 3

All right, Well, thanks for listening to today's episode. If you're interested in learning more about Wiser Wealth Management, I want to schedule a consultation with one of our fiduciary financial advisors. You can do so by going to wiseinvestorcom. You can also click in the episode notes to find a link to Robert's company, Teton Crypto Capital. We have other episodes related to this To this. Episode 281, crypto updates. We talk about tariffs, ripples, victory and what's next for investors. Episode 286, how can I evaluate crypto as a potential investment?

Speaker 4

Thanks for listening today and we'll see you guys soon. Thanks for listening to a Wiser Retirement Podcast. We hope you enjoyed today's episode. Make sure to subscribe wherever you're listening. That way you don't miss any new episodes. We'd also appreciate if you could leave a rating and review. If you have any questions about anything that was discussed today, head to wiserinvestorcom and reach out.

Speaker 4

This podcast is strictly for informational purposes only and is not to be considered as investment advice or solicitation to buy or sell any financial products, securities, digital assets or any other investment vehicles or a basis to make any financial decisions. Wiser Wealth Management Incorporated is a registered investor advisor with the SEC. The host and or guests may personally own securities, digital assets or other investment vehicles mentioned on this podcast. Neither the host nor guests of the show are compensated for their participation and no referral fees are paid to or received by any host or guest for clients, listeners or similar interests. Investments involve risk and, unless otherwise stated, are not guaranteed. Be sure to first consult with a qualified financial advisor, tax professional, insurance professional and or legal professional before implementing any strategy discussed herein. Past performance is not indicative of future performance.