The HeathenMachine Chronicles
The HeathenMachine Chronicles
Episode 33-Wisdom of the Havamal
Riding on the wings of the god Odin, we soar through ancient Norse wisdom, landing right in your modern lives. This episode is a treasure chest, filled with pearls of wisdom from the Havamal, an Old Norse poem with timeless lessons. We dissect its profound teachings, discuss its relevance in our daily existence, and offer you thick slices of wisdom to chew on. From fitness to finance, relationships to self-awareness, this episode covers it all, sprinkling ancient wisdom on contemporary issues. Join the Circle.
All right, what's going on? Join us today as we talk about the wisdom of the Hava Mall. We go over some of the stanzas we expound on and expand on how they can apply to our lives, as the knowledge from Odin is timeless. So join us and enjoy the show. Be the machine out. All right, man, let's go, live, let's go. Oh, my God, I've cheers. My man, how are you doing?
Speaker 2:What's up, man? I'm living the dream. I'm just happy to be here. Yeah, yeah, how about yourself?
Speaker 1:Pretty good man. We did some jits yesterday and I've got slightly injured. Look, this is the thing that I now have to just come to terms with, and I've been pretty good about it. I'm better. I'm better with it when it comes to, like, my strength conditioning set, like warming up, dude, I can't, and I do this to myself, like yesterday, you know, is like we got there and we and a Cooper's like let's work on wrestling, immediately, Immediately, and I'm like and I know better I'm like, ok, I should warm up. And what do I do? I don't warm up, I just jump right into it, jump right in the mat and, like my Achilles was hurting today, I hit my head on his brother's knee and you know like I get that weird nerve pain, so there's probably a pinched nerve now. Yeah, man, that's the price we pay.
Speaker 2:I suppose it's been a while since I've had anything go wrong, so I guess it was fitting.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, it goes like that, though right, like like I have nice long stretches where I won't get hurt or I'll feel pretty good, and then bam, it's like, oh well, we got this competition coming up. Of course, this is the thing that's happened. And so it's like I've been training pretty hard for it. You know, we've all been training pretty hard for it and I'm kind of feeling it. Yeah, I'm like I'm glad today was my off days, like my day off. You know I worked on my breathing exercises my cool little O2 breath trainer, you know. So that helps, I think it's helping. So this is, I think I'm well in about the third week and like I can definitely tell it's strengthening my diaphragm. You know, I like I feel like my cardio has been really good for jiu-jitsu, you know, and it probably also has been helping that. But doing some before and after work, like Gabe dude, we went 30 straight minutes that was crazy.
Speaker 2:But we didn't go all over boxing, wasn't it yeah?
Speaker 1:It was why you guys were kickboxing, yeah, and it was like, but it was like really cool, it was like a really good back and forth give and take, not like not trying to smash but just move and Flow roll. Yeah, it was really cool Cause I think, like you, just I think there's certain people you can do that with, you know, because not, I don't know, not everybody, I think, understands that everybody. So many people want to win, you know, and it's like that's not what it's about. I mean, sure, if you're competing, yeah, of course you want to win, but that's the only time it really matters.
Speaker 1:It's like getting tapped and training who the fuck cares? It's training. It's going to happen, man. Yeah, it's going to happen. That's how you get better and even when you're the best, you're probably still going to get tapped, because there's going to be things you want to work on. Like I know a lot of these, these high level guys like they will literally start from like an arm bar position, arm stretched out. Jesus, you know, or you know they're like hey, all right, get on my back, get this choke sunken, and then they fight from there and I mean, I think there's a lot to be said about it, but If you train for the absolute shittiest spot and get good from there like yeah, how is someone going to stop you exactly?
Speaker 1:Well, because it seems to be the consensus that, like the Hodger Gracie, you know a lot of the top level grapplers John Donner, her they all seem to echo the same thing in that when you're, you're should be fundamentally sound at escapes, because if you can escape from any position, then your confidence will be such that you can be more willing to Attack, because you're like Okay, put me in a triangle, I'll just get right out of it. Okay, put me in an arm bar, I'm going to get out of it. Okay, take my back, I'm going to get, I'm going to, I'm going to get out of it. Right, you know. So it's like it's that and I because I think a lot of people just want to learn how to attack and and like the fun part, you know, that's the part, yeah, yeah, nobody wants to start getting crushed inside control on an American, I know.
Speaker 1:Maybe more, just weird, because like I actually, I feel like I enjoy fundamental stuff more.
Speaker 1:No, I can see that and sinking it in, and maybe because I'm a bit older, so like I'm just adapting. Well, okay, so like you know, still have strength and athleticism, but I'm thinking like long term, it's like I should probably focus on a game where, like I should like play to my attributes now and then what are going to happen? So I'll be a little less explosive and it's just like leverage and position and just getting good at that shit.
Speaker 2:I mean, you can get really good at throwing an arm bar, you know. But also if you understand fundamental concepts like regaining inside position when you've lost it, like that's going to carry you a lot further than an arm bar, because you're not always going to be able to throw an arm bar, you know, but you always are going to need to know like, hey, right, I've got to get an elbow back in here, knee in here, or something you know.
Speaker 1:Well, and then Audrey Gracie says something interesting that when he trains defense or when he wants to work in his defense, he rolls with purple belts. Because he says a lot of black belts and he's not the first one I've heard say this, but he says a lot of black belts get so comfortable with being the hammer that they, they, they kind of stop working on their defense and stuff because they're so used to just being able to. When you're hammer, everything looks like and except for when you roll with Audrey Gracie and suddenly you're nothing, you're getting tapped. However, he wants to do it, you know, because a lot of those black belts aren't working defense and he's like they're dope. He's like they.
Speaker 1:Like the guy that Buchetcha that he beat. He's like he, he, he didn't do the fundamentals that you would want to do for defense and Buchetcha is the top. He's like a fucking elite grappler, like there's levels man. Like like if Hodger Gracie hadn't a beat in him in 2017, buchetcha would be like people, be like that's the most talented, you know, accomplished jujitsu guy. But they're like no, hodger Gracie, he literally like fundamentals. You beat him with fundamentals and Buchetcha lost because he was lacking on his fundamentals. It's crazy to hear that At that level, it's like, no, it's crazy. It's crazy to hear that. So, yeah, man, I think well, cause I like I'm liking this positional sparring that we've been doing and and starting these, you know, uncomfortable positions, like I think that's going to help my game longterm. You know, it helps everyone else too. So, what, cool man, all right.
Speaker 1:So what's the topic today? Today, okay, so, when we sat down to record our very first episode, it was going to be on the Hava Mall and we had like a specific topic we were going to talk about. Let's just say, look, the it went off the rails and you know, we didn't end up using any of the audio because it just wasn't. It just wasn't it, it was. We call that a practice session, yeah, so, um, I want to come back to the Hava Mall and talk about the Hava Mall and maybe some of the wisdom it can impart, even though, um, geez, you know estimates of when this was written. Certainly, I mean 400 AD, maybe earlier. But but everything in the Hava Mall, I think is is very relevant because it's got like those you ever, you ever heard of Evergreen content.
Speaker 2:I can understand what the idea is so like.
Speaker 1:Evergreen is timeless stuff like ever. Like say, you're writing articles and they're like you need to write an Evergreen article. So then you're like okay, top 10 tips for hiking, that's an Evergreen article.
Speaker 1:It's going to always be like exactly, and I think a lot of the wisdom in the Hava Mall is Evergreen content, because it doesn't speak to anything specific. It doesn't speak to time periods. It speaks to, I think, like the human condition. It speaks to our vices right, it speaks to because it talks a lot about abstaining from alcohol. A lot of the wisdom is about abstaining from not just alcohol but things that will like slow our mind down and things like that. And it's really funny because we look at our society today and like what's happening? Like people are getting big, getting fat. I feel like, cognitively, we're like we're not. I don't think we're like dumber, but I just think we're so distracted that we're like forgetting things. We're our tensions getting worse.
Speaker 2:So here's my theory for that. So in time of the Hava Mall, I don't think you had an option to be lazy or not like, be on point, ready to go, because at any point in time their life could be in jeopardy. And you know you could say that for our time period. But I mean we go and order our food from Amazon or here's the thing.
Speaker 1:We don't need to do anything, I think that their society struggled with the same things ours did. I mean, I guess the only thing that's changing is technology, but, like, I think that's why things like the Hava Mall or the Bagad Vagida or Sun Tzu or Laos you know any of these, these like ancient philosophies that we use, you know, all the time. They're timeless, they're evergreen content because they're speaking on the human condition. They're talking about the things that we will probably always have to struggle with excess greed, lust. You know, because it even talks about, like coveting another guy's, you know, like basically about cheating on another. You know, like a friend's wife and bad friendships. So it covers all these really cool topics. So I figured we could kind of dive into what the Hava Mall is, and there's some. We'll read some of the stanzas and, you know, just maybe stretch them out a bit, talk about them and see how they can apply to, I don't know, maybe, what we're dealing with today. Have you ever have you read the Hava Mall?
Speaker 2:Do you know? I've read some excerpts with you, or you know, of course, on the episode you mentioned, and I've heard a few of them.
Speaker 1:yeah, so okay, so everyone listening I'm going to be referencing. It's called the Wanderers Hava Mall, written by Dr Jackson Crawford, and if you don't know who Jackson Crawford is, he is probably right now. He's like I'd say he's the world's leading expert on Old Norse anything. I think he advised on Assassin's Creed Valhalla that is fucking sweet. And I think he also advised on the God of War, ragnarok yes, I knew this one. Yeah, I want to say he was involved with both of those.
Speaker 1:So he's very, he's like very academic about his approach to Norse mythology and that's got. I think that's why I like him. He's not, he doesn't. He calls him basement wizards, right, like I don't know, like I don't want to fucking down people for the things they like to do, but I think I think Viking culture is becoming very like cartoonish, like it's it's. It's getting cringy man, like you know. I don't want to dive too deep into that, but I think a lot of people will know what I'm talking about. But it's just gotten. It's gotten like weirdly commercial and it's like, yeah, it's like, oh, shut the fuck up dude when she gets mainstream man.
Speaker 2:this is what fucking happens.
Speaker 1:Everything gets ruined, yeah. And then the mainstream you might as well just abandon ship because it's going to suck. That's why I like death metal. It will never be mainstream Metal, thankfully, will never be mainstream. People are like well, what about slipknot? That's not the kind of slipknot's like I don't, I don't, I, they're okay, I don't, like, I don't mind slipknot, I mean that's not my go to, but I'd say they're like. I'd say they're more like really hard rock with bits and pieces of metal thrown in there, like kind of harsh vocals. Sometimes, you know he can toss from the screen, he can, but so can James Hetfield, you know Metallica. So it's like yeah, that's pretty much it, that's Metallica, bro. Like sweet guitar yeah, he plays a baritone guitar.
Speaker 2:You know no shit. I seen him live. I didn't even know the baritone.
Speaker 1:I don't know if he does it all the time, but he a lot of times he uses a baritone because it's in the shape of a. I don't know, is that an explorer style, that's?
Speaker 2:got that like it's like the offset flying V kind of thing.
Speaker 1:It's not flying V, but I think that's the explorer I think that's what they call those.
Speaker 2:I actually have one body in that body shape. That's really fucking an LTD. It's awesome.
Speaker 1:Look for everyone listening. I do play guitar. It's been a while, but so like I'm surprised they've been, we're both. We're both probably re-ass and I'm gonna love it. Yeah, totally All right. So the hovel mall. I'm gonna read a little excerpt. This is basically explaining what the Havimal is. So Havimal is an old. Okay, again, this is from Jackson Crawford's translation called the wanderers Havimal.
Speaker 1:So the Havimal is an old Norse poem attributed to the God Odin himself and Preserved together with other poems about the Norse gods and heroes in a collection called the poetic Eda, written down in Iceland around 1270.
Speaker 1:Linguistic evidence, as well as the pagan contents of the poem, suggests that it was composed orally at a much earlier time, probably in the 900s in Norway. The title Havimal may be translated as Words of the high one or potentially words of the one-eyed either one, a reference to its authorship by Odin. Havimal is largely made up of stanzas that use pitchy, concrete language to encourage wise and practical living, but also contains the only extent account of Odin's mysterious sacrifice of himself to himself as well, and as account of his magical capabilities. So I want to like highlight the part here that says it uses pitchy, concrete language to encourage wise and practical living, which that's literally what this is about. It's like, it's like the Viking version of Proverbs right is, is, is the Havimal, and I'm gonna go ahead and we're gonna. We're gonna pick, I think, a random stanza and we're gonna kind of let's see what we got here.
Speaker 2:Um, we'll fucking break it down, man. Yeah, man dissect Odin's wisdom.
Speaker 1:Here we go. So this is stanza five, and so this one's touching on wisdom and I think I think that's something I think maybe the world's kind of lacking right now. Oh yeah, so this is what it says a man Needs wisdom if he plans to wander widely. Life is easier at home. He'll be laughed at if he sits among the wise and has nothing to say. Hmm, it's pretty good now, from my experience, I think Of all the things I've done in my life, of going to school you know I'm getting my masters right now I think the best education I had Was getting to travel Kind of all over the world in the military.
Speaker 1:You know, it was like we grow up, you know Americans, we grow up in this country, right, and we get this very narrow view the world. And I remember I think it was like one of the first middle. I don't know if it was like Dubai or guitar, guitar, cutter guitar. Yeah, it's, there's different ways. I guess people announce it, but I just remember Visiting like, and then not even countries like that, but like, being in Africa and in Afghanistan and just where we're at now Shabu, jibouti, africa. You know, the joke continues. It's funny because today I posted On Instagram I posted the thing about Because we did a, we did a water course, so we did a land and water course, yeah, and with the foreign Legion, and so today I actually had a really good picture of the course.
Speaker 1:I've seen that. No, no, it was the all the instructors setting it up. Oh my god, they're getting it Also. Yeah, they would the fuck dude. It sucked, bro. We're gonna diverge for a minute. But Because this kind of goes to the wisdom and and all that stuff, so it's out in the fucking ocean and it was the. The current was very strong because they got to like open this thing out. You know, these, these, these, these Obstacles are floating on barrels. So we're in our camis and they take us out on this little dingy boat and we jump in and, bro, I remember jumping in and I was like it sucked because your camis suck to you. They're like they suction to your body, and then you're in the ocean and there's sharks and shit, and we're right off the coast of Africa.
Speaker 1:Man, it's like and and not only that, but as we're like you're navigating the obstacles, these, if there's instructors that are in the water and they will pull, they pull you under and they'll like, drag you down a little bit Just to fuck, yeah, man, and like, yeah, dude, so you, it was challenging and I'm not the greatest swimmer, but I'm not a terrible swimmer. Yeah and I, it was hard because you had to tread water too, like they would make you tread water for X of how long I forget, but it was long enough to be like alright, can we just fucking go and do this already, because that tires you out. And then you have to pull yourself up out of the Water, which is very fucking hard. I'm sure those get heavy when your water logged and like you're, it's like the, it's like you're being sucked into concrete, you know, trying to pull yourself up on rope and stuff and it's all wet, but yeah, so that was um thousand intensive spirits.
Speaker 1:But that whole time I was getting to experience the way other people lived and it just it like made me more appreciative. I can't, I can definitely imagine, dude, I was like, and that's only so many veterans, I think. I Think that's why so many vets will come home, especially like combat vets that come home and really like Understand what it is we have Versus what other people don't have and, like a lot of vets get frustrated with people civilians, who maybe haven't had that experience and Like we see the shit they're complaining about. And so suddenly we're like man, if you only knew how good you had it to be able to be upset over something like that.
Speaker 2:Yeah fucking up your Starbucks drink is like the least of your concerns.
Speaker 1:Well, I mean even politically, even with, like the LGBT Moot, like there are countries that would never let that happen. I would get stoned, a fucking yes and and and just all kinds of stuff. Like even you know I said, I've said this over like even the homeless in this country are better off, then, like most of the people in Haiti or Africa, like you know, at least the homeless people here, they go dumpster dive and they're still getting food, they're getting handouts, are getting government programs, getting liquor. Get it said. I said the mud puddle. Yeah, what's the? What is the drug they're substituting for the? The meth, methadone.
Speaker 2:Got their methadone. It's supposed to help. Yeah, it's supposed to help get them off of it. Yeah, I just hooks them on it. Yeah, another, another drug. And to speak on that because I am obviously from here and I've never really lived in any other place but here, but I definitely see Others around me I'm sure I'm missing some of myself. I see how, like these people who actually never leave and never see anything, yeah, like how, how do you understand anything about the outer world?
Speaker 1:So you're right, I don't mean to interrupt, but you said something before we started about being able to pick a story that I told I was telling him a story before we started recording just something I did when I was younger. And that goes back to what this is saying, because it you know You'll be, he'll be laughed at if he sits among the wise and has nothing to say, right? So, basically, you know, with that Wandering wisdom, you know you, suddenly you accumulate all these stories. You know cuz, like right now I could, I could sit down and Fill hours worth of stories just on me living on the road, like, am I time living on the road, the people I met, the places I went to, the things I got to see, like things I haven't written or talked to anyone about, like you know, working at the mall, like I got all kinds, I got tons of stories that are like they're crazy, like that, and then military, and then I think what it does is Like I think when you have that that want, I think wanderers, knowledge is a pretty good term because you can tell when someone's been to a lot of places, because they're like telling all these stories right and they didn't. It's like it's very engaging and it's helped me over the years, especially because I've moved around so much.
Speaker 1:Even growing up I went to three different grade schools, three different high schools, like lose so much. Well, military, and then my I don't know, my parents were restless. Yeah, you know a blank. I mean obviously they just kept, I don't know, we just kept moving. But but now you know, I can look back and I've got all I can. I come, even now I can plug myself in to somewhere and Having the experiences that I've had has like allowed me to connect with people, like all kinds of people, like I go to jujitsu and I can connect with everyone, because I've had like Kind of all these multifaceted experiences that someone there is going to be into, you know, whether it's comics or Guitar or or any of these other.
Speaker 1:You kind of just fit the the vibe of jujitsu, you kind of naturally Now I mean now I am know my cauliflower, or your solo guy like the hippie marine.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like you look like the hippie, like the hardcore combat people to combat people. Like, yeah, you kind of fit the whole.
Speaker 1:So I think there's a lot to be said about that, because you know a lot of people Nowadays, a lot of people have a lot to say and I think that, like they don't back it with any wisdom. Right, it's. It's easy, like when you look at what people are saying about, like our country, you know the United States like yeah, it's terrible, they're the worst. You know where you don't deserve, and it's like that's super easy to say when you have every luxury that the rest of the world wish they could have. Yeah, you know, it's one of those things and I think I think people that wandered around I think they appreciate what I mean. Is it perfect? Like no, dude, of course it's not.
Speaker 2:No it's like and I'm sure there's you know other countries that do some things better yeah, something that's obviously like it's the case. But you know you can't just say like this is not fucking Haiti, this is not like Holy shit, did you? You live within a stone throw over grocery store. Yes, you might get a you know a good check in the mail every month. You know like you can fucking survive here.
Speaker 1:You know well. And then like here's another one, right, so the bit the first portion of the Hava mall, like these. First, geez, I'd say almost 20, at least. First 20 stanzas deals with wisdom in some way, and traveling, like here's stanza 10. He said you know. It states a Traveler cannot bring a better bird and on the road than plenty of wisdom. It will provide better than money in an unfamiliar place. Wisdom is the comfort of the poor. Oh, wow, yeah, and so like, okay, here's an interesting story.
Speaker 1:So I was on the road and I was at Deming, new Mexico, which is like 30 miles north of the Mexico border. So Let me get right on the border, didn't you? Oh, yeah, yeah, I was down there. Um, so I was lost. I went just driving through Las Cruces, new Mexico, and it just so happened that that that same time a state trooper had gotten shot and killed on the highway. So like they started shutting down everything, all right, and I finally get back on the highway. I think that's 70. I got on 70 East or West, get on the highway, get down to Deming and like traffic is backed up for like 10 miles, literally 10 miles. So I'm like trying to find alternate route. I get off the road, well, my fucking RV breaks down. Breaks down, dude, and like it was my alternator and I was like, fuck, dude. So I'm trying to get things situated, you know, because I'm living on the road. I got a, I got a. I got to figure out how to get the fuck off the road and Find a place to stay and then find him a can't like I'd. So I had a bunch of shit. I had a fucking nightmare right there, dude, yeah. So I Finally get a tow. It's like 10 at night. So I was there probably five hours on the side of this road tow truck comes. Well, the guys, a Marine, yeah, man. So we hit it off right off the bat and like so it's funny, read this right. So this wisdom when you're an unfamiliar place. So I, I already been shitty situations anyway. So I mean, it sucked, but I was like whatever, dude, I'll be fine. So I get to a truck stop, they, you know they. I was able to charge my battery enough that I could. I could then drive the 20 miles in the town to get to the truck stops because I was gonna sleep the night in the parking lot. So I did that, woke up the next morning, got the RV to the mechanic and so like they're trying to figure out what's going on and that look like it Was looking like that I was probably be there for a few days. So again, it just so happened.
Speaker 1:Because I like to talk and I'm like talking about all kinds of shit in the shop, this guy comes in who? He's not an employee of the shop, but he's like friends with the owner. Okay, well, he was in the Navy, Retired from the fucking Navy, so mean him, start talking, fucking, hit it right off the bat. All the same interests with all kinds of like Tom, about deployments and and you call, come to find out I had to stay so well, he's like dude, I've got an RV pad. He's like you can fucking crash on it for as long as you need.
Speaker 1:And in this unfamiliar place. Man, because I was able to connect with all these strangers through the experiences I had and all the the places I've been and Because I was able to be engaging. It sounds weird but I feel like people will help people like that. Like, like dude, this guy's really cool man Like I really want to help him, like I want to like, and I'm not like Meeting me. I'm just saying, like that person, who's like dude, this guy's really interesting, like I'm gonna help, I want to help this guy out. He's really cool, like he seems like a cool guy. So like this guy's name was Eric. So, yeah, dude, for two days he let me, I was, I crashed his place, you I mean fucking awesome like didn't charge me anything, and then I finally got it fixed and I was on the road and that was that. It was like it. It turned in us like I'd say what this stanza is saying right, a traveler can't bring a better burden on the road.
Speaker 1:The wisdom like that was a situation where All the accumulated experiences I had up to that point came in really handy because I had it, I could, I could reach, I could connect with the guy on the shop. You know, because a lot of people were just intrigued that I was living on the road to begin with. You know, just, it was me, my dogs and I think people were intrigued by that, just by itself. But then, on top of that, I was very personable, I'm like, and then, like I'm, I don't hold anything back. I will reveal my darkest secrets to a stranger because, like that shit doesn't own me. You know what I mean. Like that shit's not me. If you fucking put it out there, what are they got? You know exactly. So it's like and I think people will pick up on that like whoa, do this guy's really like, really honest? Like they sell all these stories and like, okay, cool.
Speaker 1:So I think I think there's a lot to be said about that and I as weird as it sounds, it seems like and correct me, you know, I don't know, maybe, maybe I'm getting older. I just feel that with, like, the rise of social media, I think less and less the people are Trying to go out and get these experiences. They're just the kind of living through a Screen and they're allowing that to inform their view of the world, which is gonna be very narrow, right, I mean fucking toxic and narrow, yeah, I mean. Yeah, I mean, think about like it's, it's an algorithm, it's just gonna like feed you what you're mindlessly clicking, yeah. And so suddenly, now we have a, we have a whole generation of People who are literally only informed by social media. I think they I don't know what the statistics are, but I think someone was saying that something that like Almost a good majority of people to get their news from social media.
Speaker 2:And I think I've seen it on Facebook.
Speaker 1:Bro, that's terrifying. What do you think about it? That's terrifying, dude. Like we now see how easy it is to manipulate everything. I got AI and like Did you see? Did you see the? Uh, so they took, I guess, like back when Dylan Mulvaney you know, dylan Mulvaney the Bud Light, fiasco, the oh, the rebranded ends woman.
Speaker 2:You know the that controversy rebranded the Bud Light cans right.
Speaker 1:And they did an overlay of Obama on I Don't don't Dylan Mulvaney and it's the funniest thing I've ever seen, because it was Obama talking and moving like like that. So it was really funny. But that's just. The point is is People are getting their worldviews through a fucking screen and that doesn't work. Like that's why I think that's why it becomes so easy for people to be judging and it's like everybody wants to be angry now because they're never getting the full story, like there's no wisdom to be found through these screens at all. It's like you gotta have these actual varieties of experiences to, I think, like Accumulate that wisdom, because what kind of wisdom are you accumulating through social media? Extremely biased.
Speaker 2:If you can remember it. Yeah, like think I mean how much you dump out like a shit. Yes, yes, absolutely.
Speaker 1:So again, it's like the Hava mall, just it goes into this, this evergreen mindset where I don't think there's ever a time where wisdom isn't helpful. I mean that's, it'd be nice to think that Wisdom always comes with age. But I think we can see, like some of these people running our country, you know, are very wise. And see, here's another one. This is stands 18. Only a man who is wide traveled in his wander for and has wandered far, can know something about how other men think such a man is wise. So again, that's just another Take on just the the value of wisdom, and not just with because Odin was like he was a god of thieves and travelers like that was like because he, you know, odin, was the wanderer, you know, you just wandered around and accumulated knowledge. So it's like it makes complete sense that this first part of the Hava mall is basically all about you know wisdom. But so here is we talked about like our vices, oh yeah. So this is funny.
Speaker 1:This is stands at 20 and it says a gluttonous man, unless he watches himself, will eat to his own detriment. Wise men will often ridicule a fool on account of his belly. Let's think about this. Oh shit, okay, this was written or not written, but this was, like I said goes. This goes back a ways like thousand years, thousand plus Right easily. So Even in this passage they are talking about the detriment of being overweight. Even in this culture that is over a thousand years old, they understood that being Well, having a huge belly, that was the mark of a fool and that's fucking crazy. Like yeah, so think about it. Like we're supposed to be a more advanced civilization, right, we're supposed to be a more advanced society. Our medicine is supposed to be more advanced. So we're supposed to be more advanced Society, our medicine is supposed to be more advanced. But yet I it's like obesity is at all time high complacency. What sort of look for not laziness, but Just people aren't moving around sedentary. That's where I'm sorry.
Speaker 2:I'd say laziness is at all time high man. I think, okay, I think it'd be safe to say but here's the problem with that.
Speaker 1:Here's why. It's because when you say lazy, people will respond with well, it's not lazy, you know. It's always like mental health, right, like that's the mental health is like the new Fucking thing to blame everything on. It's like crutch yes, this is new crutch. It's like, oh my god, adhd, or I got this, and it's like I'm no, you just you don't have discipline. Like you can call it whatever the fuck you want, you just don't have discipline. Cuz like I got that shit too. All right, I got PTSD and I'm dying, like didn't rehab, but I don't blame any of my shortcomings on any of that, none of it. I never will. Your responsibility, man, that's exactly. It's like I'm ultimately still responsible man and I'll be god damned if I give that away to some fucking Acronym. You know, yeah, three letter, four letter word. It's like the fuck out of here. So I just think it's. And it shows you that they, I think they obviously valued some kind of fitness as well.
Speaker 1:I mean, like you said, like back in that period, especially the classical Viking age, that there was no fat dessert. No, how could there be? No, you know they didn't have. But obviously the glutton gluttony was a thing because it's being written about. But again, here's the other thing this was written in the 1200s by a Christian. So how much of this is truly authentic to that pre-Christian mindset, who knows. But I'm willing to. I'm willing to give it the benefit of the doubt and say that there's a lot of that. They dealt with these things and it was probably. I mean obviously, if, if he's pointing out the fact that, you know, a fool has a big belly man, that's fucking, that's reaching across the ages to us being like you know how fat we are.
Speaker 2:The poke poking us in the pills, very doble and fucking.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and it's really interesting because I can never overstate the importance of. I mean, we talk about how the fitness, obviously all the time, and we're both into it and so much of my social media is based on that. So, even you know, in the Hava Mall, here it's talking about the wanting to avoid that. You know, because, let me see, I think it goes on. So the next stands immediately and it's funny because, remember, the Hava Mall is very tongue-in-cheek it's like dry humor, I would say, because this is the next stands immediately, immediately following that one, even cows know when they should go home and leave behind the fields, but an unwise man does not know the measure of his own appetite, so he's.
Speaker 1:So, basically, odin is saying that look, even cows stop eating, right, where a fucking, only a fool. They've got like four stomachs and they still know when to fucking stop Right. Even a fool of a man will just eat and eat and eat and eat and like, think about buffets, dude Bro. Like the people that eat a buffets should not be eating a buffets. Like the very people who who should be avoiding those are the ones that are just piling on their place.
Speaker 2:What the fuck. If I'm gonna go to Golden Corral, I want my money's worth. Man Like fuck Wow.
Speaker 1:Okay, every now and then I'll head up a buffet. I'll be like a Chinese buffet. Dude, Chinese buffet is fucking hard man, but it's funny because I always feel so out, Like because, like, look man, there's like a lot of healthy people that are not really eating there. I totally don't give a fuck, I just I cheat, you know. I'm like, yeah, I'm gonna get you some. I'm giving me like 18 crab brand foods.
Speaker 2:Fuck. Yes, dude, that's my signature. That's my last thing.
Speaker 1:I'm always getting a few crab brand foods, but but you better believe I paid for that and I you know what I mean. Like I earned that Span burns fucking calories right here. I earned that shit, so you'll never see that happening. It's just, you know my whole life, dude, like well, not my whole life. When I was younger, I don't a lot of people didn't understand my I don't know if it's obsession is the right word, but a lot of people, I don't think really fixation.
Speaker 1:Well, I don't know, they didn't understand why I was so dedicated to health and fitness, like because I took to it and like I got really serious about I got I've lightened up drastically over the years because, like, you can only maintain that kind of discipline for so long before you're like, okay, look, I gotta like lighten up a little better, else I'll fail, because it just gets almost too monk like.
Speaker 1:But like now I'm 41 and and look, I'm not I hurt, you know, I have pains and I have aches. Not every day's a great day, but when I compare myself to the average 41 year old, I'm like fucking Michael Jordan, I mean. I mean I might as well be compared to the average 40 something, because they're just horribly out of shape and I'm still able to do a lot of really good stuff even now. And I attribute that. I attribute that to kind of taking to health and fitness at a young age and and sticking with it and so that I guess there's there's wisdom. There's wisdom in that and I think that's what I like about this. I'll them all.
Speaker 2:I think the selfless plan it takes to take care of yourself is going to translate to a lot of other portions of your life. Absolutely, I'm not trying to be like Jordan Peterson but you know you're right Cleaning your room, you know, like stuff like that.
Speaker 1:Like it translates yes and it sounds stupid to clean your room, but here's the point of that you have to start somewhere. And that is the like, the essence of his message. It's like, okay, you want to make these big life changes, but like you can't. You can't like do a major thing right off the bat. You've got to start with little things first. It's got to be incremental. It's like when we start your jitsu, we're not. We don't know what the fuck we're doing. We're not throwing flying triangles no, not at all. You know we're getting smashed or tapped, whatever's tapped and getting submitted, but it's a process. You got to start, you got to show up every day and like that's, you're making your bed, and so that's the whole point of that.
Speaker 1:And I don't know, I think I think taking a fitness at a young age helped, like you said, and it carried into a lot of other parts of my life and I'm probably yours as well. So, yeah, here's there's a lot of funny ones in here and like they're a lot of them are kind of harsh, but like this is. So this is stands a 22. It says a stupid man and an undisciplined one laughs at everything. He hasn't learned a lesson that would do him good. He himself isn't flawless. I don't know I can, I can. You know, what I take away from this is that, like this seems like a self-control thing. You know, like some people can't control themselves and just laugh at everything without really understanding what they're laughing at. You know, and clearly you know, because it ends with he himself isn't flawless.
Speaker 1:So, like this person's probably always pointing out the you know like they're hypocritical, they're pointing at laughing at others, absolutely Not looking in the fucking mirror, and I think everyone knows a person like that.
Speaker 2:If you can't, if you can't like acknowledge your own shortcomings, like come on, man, you gotta be able to laugh at yourself a little bit.
Speaker 1:So, like I said, I, I, I'll, I'll. When I meet a stranger, I'll, like I'll, put all my cards out there and I think it's. It's like I said, cause like that doesn't. You know, that doesn't own me. I'm aware of my flaws, like, and I will admit them, cause, like, as long as I can admit them, I'm always aware of them and I can always work on them, Like, and it's not going to be perfect, that's not always going to work out, but you know, as long as that intention stays there, like it will. I mean that is something you know, get, you know, get worked through. So, yeah, that's an interesting cause, like I.
Speaker 1:If you were to break this down into major categories, I guess, like we said, you'd have one that talks on wisdom, right, types of wisdom, talks about gluttony and abstaining from doing too much. Cause I'm still we're at, it stands at 25 and it's still talking about kind of like wisdom and things of that nature. And then Odin was not kind of women at all, like he's got a very, very hot take on. If it were up to Odin that you just would never trust a woman and never give her money or anything. He's pretty harsh, damn open. All right, let's see here. All right. So this is. Stands at 30 and says no one should ridicule anyone else, even if he comes visiting. Many a man seems wise if he has never questioned and he gets to brood with dry skin. It's interesting one.
Speaker 2:It is interesting.
Speaker 1:I'm trying to process that one Well yeah, I guess the what I would take from it is mind your own fucking business, it's gonna boil down to us Well that's what a lot of these boil down to.
Speaker 1:A lot of these are like that Cause. Then look at, this is the next one proceeding. A man may seem wise if he pokes fun at another, and a man may seem wise if he pokes fun at another and disdains a fellow guest. But the man who talks behind another man's back knows little, even if he laughs with men.
Speaker 2:Damn. It's like said to my face motherfucker, that's kind of where that one's going. Yeah, yeah, to respect it.
Speaker 1:The little kernels of wisdom, man, the Havimal. It's like again. It's timeless right and humans will always have, we're going to always have relationships with each other. They're always going to be messy, you know, as long as Neuralink isn't involved, but I guess, I guess that might, that might change a whole lot for us. That shit goes through, man, yeah, okay. So I want to get to. This is one of my favorite ones.
Speaker 2:Maybe one day we'll do the podcast just using our minds. We don't have to talk at all. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Do you guys get it? It's pretty good, wasn't it? All right, stands at 35. You should keep moving. You should never be a guest forever at any one place. You're welcome or wear out if you stay too long beneath another's roof.
Speaker 2:Very, very good.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think this can apply to a lot of things. It can not just apply to literally, like hanging out at someone's place, but I think this can apply to things like maybe you're I don't know, maybe you have some kind of goal set and it's just not working. Yeah Right, don't stick with it for too long because it's just you're going to get burned out and then you're just going to quit. Right, you got to learn to, maybe about face or pivot or try a different angle. But it's funny because you know I bought this.
Speaker 1:I bought this literally before I hit the road. I bought it so I could read it on the road. And when I came across this one, this one was like near and dear to me, because I visited a lot of people on the road but and I knew I just I didn't want to invade their life, I didn't want to be there too long. So, like I always slept in my RV, like I had my own room, even though everyone's like no, no, no, like we have a bedroom. Like just I'm good man, like I got my space, you just want to visit a little bit.
Speaker 1:You got your space, I don't have to be up your ass and get you get annoyed with me. And so, like that was, I always had that in my mind when I'd visit people because, like I had people come stay at my place and my old place and you know, we had some situations where people stayed too long and suddenly it's like all right, look man, yeah like it was such a hard situation.
Speaker 1:I know Especially if you're friends or but look, dude, I think you want to say John Donner, her and Lex, even though I had this conversation because they were talking about immortality and whether or not you'd actually want to be an immortal, and I think they were right in that. The beauty of life, the beauty of experiences, the beauty of friendships, relationships, are that they will come to an end and like it sounds a kind of weird encounter, intuitive. I think that that's what makes life beautiful. But if we knew that that would always be there, would we really appreciate it? No, probably not. Right?
Speaker 1:It's like even now, even though we know things are finite, we know our life is finite, we take it for granted, like all this time yeah, man, especially relationships, like it's really easy to take like a partner, whatever girlfriend, boyfriend, partner, whatever you want to call it. Like it's easy to take that person for granted if they're always there for you and they're like and you don't appreciate that, you know. I think that that's yeah, I don't know what's going on. Where was I going with that?
Speaker 2:Well, we were talking about staying under other people's roots, yes, and actually I think our very first episode, the one we totally scrapped, I think I told the story and if you don't care, I'll just tell it. Let's hear it, man. Okay. So when I was in high school playing basketball, everything else we had a younger guy on the team who was maybe he may have been like a couple, two or three years younger than me Big fucking guy, man, tall like six, seven, like Jesus, big, good, yeah, really tall kid. And anyway I didn't know anything that much about the time, but you know, like I'd been around him, just shot the shit, you know nothing, big. And he approached me after practice one day and was like, hey man, like look, I really like can't go home right now. Like I died, I really would need somewhere to stay for a night. Like is there any chance I could just ride home with you and stay for a night and then maybe I can go home tomorrow? And I was like, okay, you know what time I was like I'm gonna call my mom see if this is cool, you know, because I really don't fucking know this kid very well. And yeah, so called mom was totally cool with it and this, this situation. Obviously you see where this is going. It didn't do so, I think so. I think it's going.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so night two rolled around and you know this is it's. It's fine man. It's in the beginning, you know, like, look, I've been an only child my whole life, so I didn't have any brothers or anything, you know. So I'm used to having my own space, sure, but it's cool. You know, like I had him over man, we play, like go down to the Xbox. You know, we chill out, maybe like day three or four. I remember I walked down to the bathroom and I seen my mom was getting him his own personal toothbrush head for my electric toothbrush.
Speaker 2:Oh no, and it was at this point I knew I'd fucked up, right. So this turned in from like a like, maybe, like supposed to be a one day thing, and this guy stayed with us for about three or four months. Oh my God, no, let me. Let me take this. So obviously you're going to get annoyed with someone if they lived with you for that long. That's just part of life, right, right. So I acknowledge that. But the other part was this this kid man, he was very fucking lazy. That was the bad part. Is he like he didn't want to help with anything around the house? Me and my dad farmed at the time.
Speaker 2:And so he did not want to do anything he would take. He would take clothes on my closet and wear them.
Speaker 1:Oh no, yeah, I mean get the fuck out of here. Yeah, me and him, we definitely we started clashing.
Speaker 2:But you know, like his, his home life was really really poor. Like he, I mean they, his four fucking family, they literally like stayed in town for like a part of the summer, like I mean, like I get it, you know. But he also had siblings at home that he just kind of abandoned and turns out he'd been house hopping quite a bit in the area and, man, I felt bad and we finally got something worked out with his grandparents who would take much better care of him and got him out. But I'll never forget just that, that, that shifting feeling of like you know, this is okay, I guess. And then realizing this fucking guy is not going to leave and he went so far past his welcome that all of us were just kind of ready for it. You know, I'm glad he's doing better now, I think, and it's good for him. Yeah, I'm glad he's gotten a better situation. But Jesus Christ, man like that was.
Speaker 1:I mean, you know it sucks, because I think that's what keeps a lot of people from doing good things, because in my experience, whenever I do something good, it seems like it just keep fucking punished for it yeah or yeah or just not worth it. You're like it just becomes, especially if, like you help someone and then like law enforcement, like then that just you're like I wish I just never would have gotten a ball, because then it turns in because the justice system is a fucking circus and it's just like no, I will not, I'm not, I didn't see anything, so I'm not, I'm a witness to nothing, I said, and that sucks. It sucks to be that way.
Speaker 1:But I mean, whenever you try to help, you get taken advantage of that, so yeah, yeah, yes, it sucks and we shouldn't look at it that way, but, like, I mean, it's just the way it is sometimes. Yeah, you know, but I think this is one of those stans is that for me it meant a lot more than just, you know, being somewhere at someone's place for too long. But it's funny because the one before it we actually talked about this one before too, so it actually it kind of connects into that stands at 35. So this is stands at 34. And it says it's a long and crooked walk to a bad friend, even if he lives nearby, but it's an easy road to a good friend, no matter how long the journey.
Speaker 1:And I think that ties in well with you should keep moving. Never be, you know, a guest forever, because that guest forever is probably going to be that crooked friend who's like like, what are you doing? Are you getting your life together? Like, are you? Do you have a plan? Do you just? Are you just going to be a fucking bum and hang out here and like, wear my clothes and like, like, what's going on here? You know?
Speaker 2:okay, and just to clarify, I know I mean like my mother got him all his own shit Just to, just to I'm not trying to go back to it but like he literally had all his own clothes. She bought them all that and it's like, you know, I don't know, it's damn. I was like very nice.
Speaker 1:Yeah, my mom's a fucking G dude. That's too bad, because like that's just a total lack of respect. I think that's a but, but you know, I guess if you don't, you haven't seen what respect is. You know how the fuck are you going to know? Yep, you just, oh, she's just getting me the stuff. Okay, cool, you know, like I'd be fucking farming and like I'll cut the grass so I'll do some laundry, man, like I'll do my own laundry, at minimum.
Speaker 2:I mean, oh hell, no, dude, she'd ask him to help with the dishes and he'd run to my room and I got that. Sucks, dude.
Speaker 1:Yeah, miserable man, that really sucks.
Speaker 2:I don't know. It's one thing to like need help and to like and other people help you and you'd be appreciative and be, you know, gracious, like thank you so much. What can I do to help you? But just to be so unappreciative that you can't even like yeah?
Speaker 1:but that's how people are, man, I know, and like I think it's getting worse. I just, I don't know, like it's. It's like it seems like there's like this value shift going on and I don't know. It's like it seems like, you know, I don't think being decent to each other is such a hard thing to do, but it seems like it's. It's. It's very hard. Yeah, it's like no one, no one's wanting to like.
Speaker 2:Well, so many people capitalize on people being kind Like it's. It's a, it's almost a vulnerability, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so like, uh, it's funny because the Havimal talks a lot about friendship too yeah, um, like we went over that one, uh, so there's like a lot of and again, that's why you know, stuff like this goes across time because, again, as long as there's going to be people, there's going to be relationships and they're going to be bad relationships. You know you're going to have bad friends. You're going to have good friends, you're going to have, like, you know, bad, like personal relationships and and and you're going to have good relationships. And it's like and I guess, when I, you know, when you read this, it's like it's like guide on what kind of what to look for, Um, and kind of how to deal with it. And even though this is over a thousand years old, close to it, again, it's applicable to I don't know man, it's applicable to where we're at now, it's applicable to our relationships today, which is why I think it's like all of it's like really relevant. You know, friendships Um cause like, uh, let me see Like.
Speaker 1:Stanza 41 says friends should provide their friends with weapons and clothing. This kind of generosity shows generous mutual living is the key to lifelong friendship. So, basically, you can even take away like giving your friends weapon and clothing and just replace it with give them support and stuff like that, where, um, I think a lot, of, a lot of people have friends who uh shit on their dreams, who are like, dude, I really want to do this. And they're like really, do you really like I don't know if you, you know, like they fucking down them instead of being. You know, even if it's crazy, you know you can be positive and still be like dude. That sounds super cool. I mean, if you thought about it like, like, like how would you go about doing it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Like there's ways you can be where, like I just think, a lot of friends, um, they, they, I don't know friends think they're being good friends when they do shit like that. But there's definitely tactful ways, you know. And then there's friends that they're just they suck, they just don't want you to succeed, they bring you down to their level. Yes, and like when I read this it's funny, friendships, rather friends with weapons and clothing. Like again, we can, you know, it can be a literal. I'm sure it was literal in that day. It's like well, my brother, my bro, gave me like a fucking shirt and a sword, dude. Yeah, pretty cool, I know I got to get him, so I'm gonna get him an axe.
Speaker 2:Do you notice how it says, like give them a weapon, but don't like you're not hunting for them, Right?
Speaker 1:So it's like well and it's it's. They're talking about a mutual, a mutual thing. So, like that, it's like the health of a friendship comes from mutual giving and it doesn't have to be material items. It's just talking to each other, like bouncing ideas off each other, being supportive, and like, maybe, when that you think that friend is like fucking up, you just don't, you know, maybe just be tactful about it. Like, dude, I'm worried, man, you know I'm supporting you, but I just maybe, you know, maybe you know, you should be a little bit less retarded, maybe you should be less of a fucking idiot, which is fine. Yeah, like, hey, man, like, if people heard how we talked to each other, like when you're in the Marine Corps, you guys are friends. Yeah, even at jujitsu sometimes it's like yeah, dude, like it's, it's how we talk, it's a sign of kinship, yeah, it's like friendship, we can.
Speaker 1:So this kind of unrelated, but there's funny because there's certain jujitsu moves like the muffler yeah, that I was. I've watched so many videos and everyone was like look, if you're going to do this, do it to your friends. Yeah, like, do it to people that you know are. I told you it was like two weeks ago, tommy did it to me. He was like I was just testing you, man. He was putting you down. I was like I know he's fucking right over my mouth.
Speaker 2:Fuck it was all good, though I got chain doing shit Like yeah, I got to do is open your mouth.
Speaker 1:It's like I got to do yeah, Open your mouth.
Speaker 2:But first day, tommy's not going to be doing that to any of you, bro. No, no, no, no, no.
Speaker 1:It was, it was yeah, I mean yeah, so it's funny because it's like but that's that mutual friendship, it's, it's, there's that give and take. Even even in that it's weird as it sounds, uh, I think I don't know, man, that's just the basis of all relationships is a give and take, and I was just really I got to touch this because he cracks people.
Speaker 2:So you know, you know how Roland was shamed. You know, obviously, like he like, just like you know he's absolutely destroys me. For the first little bit I finally knew I was like getting somewhere with him is when he had me in some sort of like he had control of my head and neck, I remember, and he was basically just holding me there and I was uncomfortable, but he just like reached his index finger up and went boop, grab my nose.
Speaker 1:I was like what the fuck Shit? Oh my gosh, I don't know if I would have to be worried or terrified, or like what he's about to do. Bro, it's so fucking funny dude.
Speaker 2:He'll get you completely controlled and they'll just fuck with you Like like, honk your nose Like, oh God damn Shane.
Speaker 1:That's how he was man. He's made me better, exactly, he's made my top game better. He's made me more aware of getting swept, because he loves the sweep. He is the fucking human bro man. He's been really good about that. So, yeah, man.
Speaker 1:So they're touching on friendships, but you know, it's just, I think relationships in general, because of, like, right after stands a 42 says be a friend to your friend and repay each gift with a gift, or pay laughter with laughter but repay treachery with treachery, shit, okay, that went south. I wouldn't say no forgiveness. Well, hey, man, it's, it's, yeah, dude, it's like a tit for tat kind of thing. Like if they pay you treachery, then you might as well. Just, I don't know about that. I mean well, but here's the thing if a friend fucks you over, I mean the chances of doing it again are probably pretty good, especially if there's no repercussions. Exactly Like bro, go, fuck off dude.
Speaker 1:So I, like, I had a situation we talked about it, but I'm not going to go into detail but I had a guy, a guy served with my old place, overstated as welcome, and dad, dude, went. It just went totally south and let's see cause. Treachery is like a strong word, but I guess I could say like the relationship ended like on a mutual fuck you. You know, like okay, fuck me, well, fuck you. So and then we've literally never talked since.
Speaker 1:And we never will, which is okay. It just was meant to be that way, and that's the other thing is sometimes man. So touch on relationships. A lot of you know. Something I talk a lot about is cutting off people like that, like getting out of those shitty friendships and being able to like well, you stick with that, you know? Um, so I'm losing my train of thought.
Speaker 2:No, no, come on, you're on to something. Dude Relationships. Let me see here, fuck, damn Fucking. Dementia is already in the way.
Speaker 1:I only ate a 10 milligram gummy.
Speaker 2:Seriously, did you fuck anyone for this? I did, I'm selling.
Speaker 1:Yeah, um, but I guess what I was saying is um, I don't know. That's all right, though. That's how it goes sometimes, and we don't have the luxury of just going back and like I'm gonna lose because I'm not ready. This is staying in. It's totally staying in. Fuck it, fuck it. It probably wasn't a good point. It probably sounded good.
Speaker 2:It sounded like you were seriously on to something.
Speaker 1:I was, but I just went off the rails.
Speaker 2:We'll go to another, go to another stanza and some crazy.
Speaker 1:All right, let's see. I mean, well, a lot of this is uh, so this is all going to be geared on friendship. Um, like you know, if you have a good friend and you trust him and you want it good uh, I want good to come in your friendship you should speak your mind with him, exchange gifts, visit him often. You know, like that's pretty, that's a pretty thing. A good thing for a relationship is kind of that nurturing thing. Um, okay, so this is funny because this is like kind of like, uh, the previous stanza where it says this same friend, if you mistrust him and suspect him to be false in his words, you should talk with him, laugh with him, but repay just what he gives you. So again, it's like give back what he's fucking given you.
Speaker 2:So it's like it's not like treat others how you want to be treated. It's treat others how they treat you as kind of the yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1:Well, it's like dude, you don't want to be anyone's fucking whipping post. No, you know what I mean. It's like people and I know people that are in. They have like friends that are in friendships like that where they're like the. So I had this guy I served with and he was in a leadership position and like when he was in work he came off as like pretty intimidating, you know like well, I got to hang out with him off hours. You know, we moved my while ex-wife and now we moved out to where like him and like the people that hung out there on the Marine Corps they're all like sergeants and stuff. Well, I see him out of work and I see him out of the work environment and I and he was that whipping post friend and I was like what the fuck? Like he was just letting him, like he'd let him just talk shit to. Like it was the weird. It was weird.
Speaker 2:And not like friendly shit, like actual shit it just not.
Speaker 1:I thought it was harsh man. I was like I would never hang out with people that said this shit to me Even, even you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'd be like dude, there's no fucking way and I would. Or if they started doing that, I'd be like, if you say something like that, I'm gonna fucking punch you in your mouth, like I just wouldn't take it. I like to joke around, but like they were, like he was like the whipping post, you know, like he was like the, you know, in the pecking order with chickens, like he was the one they were pecking on, and I'm like that's so weird, cause like he had this totally different persona at work. It's probably where he compensates, I know, well obvious. Cause I saw it. I'm like that's fucking not cool at all. So, again, it's like you repay what they give you, so, but then it's like, but that that's just not a friendship you want to have. So it's like you got to cut that shit off. And I think that's what I was getting at with with what I was going to say earlier about cutting people off, like cutting your friends off.
Speaker 2:Do you think if one, you think one actual transgression is enough to justify that? It depends, I think, it depends on the level of transgression.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean you should obviously talk to him about it. Yeah, big look, dude, that's not I don't like, don't why you all fight. Like I maybe not be super hostile in beginning, but I think when you just allow it to happen and allow it and allow, it becomes a pattern, becomes a habit and suddenly, like that's your role, you're just, that's who you are and there's no respect for you. There's no yeah, and well, that's like where's the self respect? Yeah, and all of that. But I was going what I was talking about with relationships earlier and I lost my train of thought. I came back.
Speaker 1:It was like people have to be okay with cutting people out of their life. Like you have to be okay with that. Not only do you have to be okay with that, like you have to stick with that Cause. Like a lot of times it'll happen. It's like a friend will do something really shitty man, and there's a period of time they don't talk and suddenly they're back and then the friend does the same thing at another point. And it's like people like when you really want to take charge of your life, you got to like cut the people out that are fucking dead, weight, toxic, and like you cannot look back Like you got to be okay with it. Like I said about that guy, like we'll never be friends again and I'm okay with that, I don't wish he'll will on him Like I don't.
Speaker 2:I just like the table. Thing.
Speaker 1:I don't want him to starve, but he can't eat at my table. Perfect, yeah, and like. That sums it up perfectly Like, and I think that's okay to. It's okay to like look at it that way when you cut someone out of your life, be like look, dude, I don't want you to starve, but you can't come here anymore. Like you're done, Like I don't, I don't want you to fail, but like our path together is gone, Like it's, we're going different ways now and it just that just has to wait. It has to be because I know so many fucking people it.
Speaker 1:It drives me nuts because there's a lot of people that allow themselves to stay in shitty friendships and the shitty like relationships. Oh God, Because I just think there's like a. There's this level of comfort people get with and, as fucked up as it sounds, it's like yeah, people get used to being treated like the whipping post, Like they become the person that they just everyone dumps their shit on. It's like a, a, a Migo the devil. He's a, a, a singer, he does. They call it murder folk, His, his genre. Yeah, Migo the devil, there's a line. There's a line in one of his songs. It goes basically like I'm always, like people are always taking a piece of me and putting it back the way they want it to be. Like like they're turning him into what he's not and like that's what. That's the fucking danger. You play with yourself and like, when you're around those people, yes, and they turn you into like somebody you don't want to be because you're not, you're not giving that shit back. So, yeah, cut those shit out, Get out of those relationships and just don't look back. There's a lot of people need to hear that yeah, yeah man, oh, okay, here's an interesting one. I don't this see. This is. This is good because I struggle with this one, right? Okay, so this is stands a 48 kind.
Speaker 1:Brave people live best. They never nurture a grudge. But a non-wise man worries about everything he treads, even repaying a gift. I guess the thing I struggle with this is the grudge because, like I hold grudges. Yeah, and let's be honest, I think most people hold grudges yeah, At least a little bit. Yeah, maybe not like to to the point where it's like detrimental to your life, but like we all have one person when we think about like, hmm, man, if I, just if I saw that and I'm like I'm gonna hit him and punch him in the mouth, or maybe not, but but, but like there's, there's things that are years back that I still think about and I'm like it makes you fucking mad thinking that yeah, Like I still have kind of a grudge and I know that's the shortcoming, Like I get it. Like like he says you know, kind brave people with best thing never nurture a grudge, but I don't think that's actually very realistic. I mean, that's probably one thing. I think it's back on this.
Speaker 2:It's okay. Yeah, I mean, I've heard this terminology before. I think you can kind of like maybe forgive it in your mind, but don't ever forget yeah, like, yeah, like, just yes, like if somebody fucks you over, don't let that shit happen again. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, because I, you know, when you think about it, wouldn't a grudge cause a like? It almost seems like the fuel that propels a lot of people end up being really successful is a grudge, because someone was like fuck you, never you're gonna, you're gonna be a failure. You're a fucking loser. Yeah, like you're a loser, like, like people, their teachers telling them this, like think about that. So they're like, they thought about that teacher for 15 years. All the while they're grinding away and they blow up and they're fucking just super famous and rich, and all because they had that grudge. It's a nice little fire under their eyes.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think I agree with this so much. But I do think If you let it consume you, that's the problem. Yes, exactly, that's where it becomes an issue and then that's when it ends up in like murder. That's when like, like grud, that's that's the worst they can get is like motherfuckers. It consumes their life to the point where they physically act on that grudge, whether it's assaulting them or murder or just something you know horrific. So yeah, I guess there's varying levels to that, you know, like I think I think a grudge cannot. I think a grudge can be kind of healthy, if you know if you've got okay. So if you can convert it to motivation, yes, okay, yeah, if there's like a focal point you can point that grudge to, where you're not taking it out on people, yourself or the person you're like. He said I can't do this, fuck, watch me, motherfucker, I'm going to do it. And then like, because that's that, that's saying what a success is the best revenge, absolutely.
Speaker 2:Because you had a grudge. Someone says you're a weak pussy. Okay, bench 315. Okay, I'm going to bench 315.
Speaker 1:And then I'm going to be a fucking jujitsu black belt. I'm going to come on and break your fucking arm.
Speaker 2:I might not do that, that might be a little too much.
Speaker 1:Yeah, That'd be. That'd be taking the grudge probably a little too far.
Speaker 2:But if they ever like, I don't think they would fuck with you. If they would not.
Speaker 1:They'd be like and they probably. You know it's funny because a lot of bullies when they're like years years later when they're confronted by the people they bullied, they're like almost every like, almost every time they're, they're almost ashamed. You know that they did that. Like George St Pierre was bullied, seriously, yes, and he confronted his bully and like the dude was like obviously I'm very sorry, but it was one of those things, but he was a part of why George St Pierre became who he was is because, like I bullied him and he was like I'm never going to let someone do this to me, like fuck that guy.
Speaker 2:That's good. He uses it the right way, but they take people like like to walk into school with an AR-15. You know, that's another fucking problem. That's the problem, but I think that's. I mean you get poor mental health on top of just like an amalgamation of just fucking like people treating like shit, like I don't know. People respond to negativity in different ways. Some people they let that shit beat them down and fucking make them just full of hate, and some people can use it, like George St Pierre did, and turn them into one of the best fighters of all time. I don't know.
Speaker 1:And there's a lot of. It's funny because there's a lot of stories like that where, like, people got bullied and it propelled them to do crazy, awesome things, you know, and that's why, like, there are people who will say that even fat shaming, like you know, even supple is he had he played in American history X. I've seen him.
Speaker 2:The fat guy in it, oh, the one who sings the song in the band. Oh shit, he lost a ton of weight.
Speaker 1:Oh damn really. He's like 180 pounds now and he said a lot of that was because of fat shaming. He's like I use that as fuel. He's like it sucked to hear that and they were right. He's like and I lost all the weight. Now he's healthy as fuck and like works out like crazy. Like you know, like randomly, you know who else works out a lot. Now is a man, he's a, he's a rapper.
Speaker 2:Was he fab before?
Speaker 1:Yeah, she had a cooking show on vice.
Speaker 2:The only rapper I can think of with a cooking show was Snoop Dogg. No, snoop Dogg, always. I'm gonna forget. I shouldn't.
Speaker 1:Man, it's so annoying Because he's like really big into kettlebells and macebells and stuff. Now, like he's he's really he's like really into working out.
Speaker 2:Some people do that and some people kill themselves. So it's like it's a. It's a pretty a thin line. You know you put pressure on someone, they're either gonna crumble or, you know, turn into a diamond, you know.
Speaker 1:Yes, um, it's all right. So we're gonna go, let's see. Let's see what else we got in the some other little tidbits of wisdom the Hava mall can impart our way, because there's quite a bit I want to say. In total there's 160 stanzas, but not all of them are actual, like pieces of wisdom. It's like like towards the end he goes into the spells he knows, you know, which isn't really practical for modern day living A stoffer, you always a never casted spell sir.
Speaker 1:I'm gonna make your edged blade blunt. I kind of know if that's going to work. For me it's like a simple one, and this is stanza 65. You will often get repayment and kind for the words you speak to others. So it's like and I wouldn't even take it as literal as words it's like the actions. The actions, you know what you do, the things you say is how people are going to perceive you and they're going to react. You know.
Speaker 2:so if you're fucking asshole, I guess what literally like Nordic karma, is what that literally is, yeah, like people are going to be assholes back.
Speaker 1:It's like it's basically saying like look, man, if you want to establish good relationships, good rapport with people, if you want to have good friendships, if you want to be a widely traveled person who can make friends, however, then it's going to.
Speaker 1:It's going to come down to how you talk and treat other people and like you look around now, where so much of our communication is done on social media, and what's the one thing I think almost going to agree on is that it's incredibly toxic because, like there's no personal touch to it anymore. It's like you're literally just typing onto a screen and so everyone is like super shitty to each other. So it's like this. But I think I see it like spilling out into the root and you know, do you remember like it was just like five, 10 years ago? People would be like, well, that's not, that's not real life, you know. Or now it's like social media is becoming people's real life and so spend all day on Twitter, yeah, so I think, like you're seeing people interact with people on social media like assholes and then they go out in public and they're assholes Because they think they can get away because now they're used to it.
Speaker 1:You know, and I just think it's this weird self perpetuating cycle where, uh, I don't know man, eventually they're going to learn their lesson.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I guess. Yeah, they will probably, most definitely. But it's like this weird slippery slope we're going on. But that's just an easy little piece of wisdom. It's like look, treat others how you want to be treated. That's literally. That's that right there the karma. So yeah, it goes on about kind of stuff like that, but this is an interesting one. This is one that's really good. It stands at 70.
Speaker 1:Better to be alive, no matter what, than dead. Only the living enjoy anything. I saw a fire burning for a rich man and he laid dead outside the door, and I like this one because I think again, you point to social media. I think people see the lot these fake ass lives, a lot of these like influencers are living. So everyone's like dude, I wish I lived like that, I wish I had all this money, I wish I had this, all the girls, all the cars, all the fucking, rather than just being like, holy, fuck, dude, I'm alive and I get to experience this weird like waking dream we call like consciousness, because this is it Like. We're probably not like. I don't know what comes after, but I've got this feeling that it's just going to be nothing. It's going to be like it was before I was born. Nothing like the world was fine when I wasn't here. It's going to be fine when I'm gone.
Speaker 2:It's been probably in well, maybe a generation or two. You're not there. No one's going to know who the fuck you are. I mean your great grandmother. How much did you, how much did she influence? You know, I didn't hardly know mine, you know it's.
Speaker 1:I'm, she, my great-grandmother was pretty big influence Really. Yeah, she was, she lived close and like she was Polish, so it was always interesting. Yeah, so she always make like dill, pickle soup and stuff, like she always make traditional Polish meals and because she came over like 1914 or something, but I don't know man, I just think a lot of people Like I think we talked about earlier about taking things for granted and just like being alive, it's easy Again, man, because of social media, it's easy to look around and be like, oh my God, this world is awful fucking climate. I'm going to melt everything. We're doomed Like that's, it's fuck, that's all everything is. Now. It's like you need to be scared of this now. Like no, you need to come over.
Speaker 2:Let's be scared of something else.
Speaker 1:You know you can't eat oatmeal, it's bad. Like you can't do that, like it's always this fucking bullshit, like what you can't do. And people are like, look man, I don't give a fuck, I'm alive. Like I'm just going to enjoy this experience. You know it doesn't. Yeah, it sucks sometimes, like that's part of life is something yeah, dude, like the relationship's ending or yeah, fire, death.
Speaker 2:Absolutely.
Speaker 1:We're going to lose stuff in life, we're going to gain stuff in life. It's like and yet people focus on the bullshit and, like I get it. It's easier said than done. We all get caught in it. I'm not saying I don't, but I really try to make an effort for when I find myself, slip it into that where I'm like, dude, what are you doing? Like look at this life you have, like it's awesome. Like I've got little responsibility. Dude, I got a couple of dogs, I got chickens, like I got a pretty, pretty cool life going, yeah. And so when I start fucking feeling sorry for myself from get like that you know where I'm I for I lose sight of that gratitude. I stop and like, okay, I'll go sit out on that, my screen and porch, it's fucking awesome, I love it. I'll just sit there with nothing and just listen to like the birds and like, okay, this is good, this is good. I don't feel like I have to get to the experiences and it kind of rebalances me.
Speaker 1:So, you know, I don't know, I think I think sometimes like we just gotta embrace the simple, simple, simple shit and then like it's better to be alive, no matter what. He's. So true, because so do you know, there's a guy going around right now. He uh, so he tried to commit suicide. He jumped off the Golden Gate Bridge and live he's one of the few that live Wow. And he said the minute he jumped off, he was like oh my God, I fucked up. I fucked up.
Speaker 1:And I want to say there was like there's a couple of suicide survivors that they all have that same thought, like they're like just immediate regret because they lose sight of that. Like I lost a friend. Like his casket flag is right there, he killed himself because he I mean, among other things that was happening, it was just. I think people like that lose that appreciation for life and they get. They get so fucking hyper focused and all the problems, yes, and all the things that's dragging them down. They don't stop to pick Okay, look, I'm alive, I'm good, I can get out of this family. Yeah, man, like dude, yeah, and well, that's like a case like Julian, like he fucking survived combat, yeah. And here to come back and like this is gonna, this is what takes you out. It's like you could have worked, like I mean, there's a lot to unpack on that.
Speaker 1:Maybe sometime we'll talk about it, but it's like it's just one of those things where you know that's the danger of losing sight of that is is apathy, apathy for living, and then like when you don't care about living, then that's dude, that's a problem, you know, because then you don't have motivation and I kind of feel like a lot of people are getting into that state of lethargic state, like people don't want to leave their fucking house, right, and it's like, I don't know man, people would rather spend their time kind of immersed in digital worlds, which is cool and fun, sometimes Pretty good hobby. Yeah, I don't know man, I just think you lose sight of the bigger picture. You just kind of stop appreciating shit and you stop appreciating life. So I don't, maybe I'm just getting old, sound like.
Speaker 2:Fucking boomer, fucking boomer dude, goddamn social media.
Speaker 1:Damn kid. I just don't understand them anymore, Fucking tweeter. So this is and again like this comes back to wisdom, right Stands a 75. The ignorant man does not know how little he knows. You become foolish by listening to fools. One man is rich, another man is poor, and neither has the other to blame.
Speaker 2:There's a lot going on in that one that's like three different wisdoms and one.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, the ignorant man does not know how little he knows. And how true is that?
Speaker 2:Oh, God, holy shit, the stupidest fucking people Again social media is giving voice to these people.
Speaker 1:As a matter of fact, I say that they are the loudest on social media, the people who have. They don't know anything and they're always the fucking loudest. And they don't even know that they don't know. Like that's the fucked up thing. It's like I don't know if you're noticing this anymore with like people, but like for me, even when I'm just out in public, I really feel like people are losing, like their sense of self-awareness, being aware of not only themselves but being aware of their environment. Like because everyone's literally staring at their goddamn phone and walking through stores. Like it's just, it's really weird. Like 15 years ago I never would have, you know, I never would have like thought that like that.
Speaker 2:That's where it'd be and people like would like going across walks. I've been looking at traffic.
Speaker 1:Nobody's aware. I just feel like people aren't aware of anything, like we're. It's like, okay, so it's like in bowling, right, you go bowling and you put those little bumper things out. So you don't, so you don't go off into the fucking. Don't tell me you use those motherfuckers. No, no, no, no. But that, no, I don't.
Speaker 1:But what I'm saying is is like our society is getting surrounded by these bumper things, so it's like we're almost allowed to be so completely unself-aware because of technology, because like we're living in this weird nanny state where everything's oh, we got you man. And like it's just, I think it's making people, I just think it's making a lot of people lose their sense of self-awareness, cause like I'll be in the store and I'm always like alert, you know, like civilians walking in the door. Civilians can say it's like PTSD, but it's just that is that anyone who served in military and even anyone who has that awareness. It's like I want to kind of be aware of my surroundings. Like I don't think that's a weird thing to want to be. I mean, yeah, you see that motherfucker like he looks really shady, yeah, he would like.
Speaker 1:And so I just you see more and more people like not paying attention, not being aware, or anything like that, and so I think that I think it all ties into this ignorant man does not know how little he knows when it's like. Yeah, man, we're losing self-awareness, I feel like it, or it's just nobody.
Speaker 2:I don't know Well who like when you're around, like people like who are just a random group, who's usually like talking the loudest and talking the most.
Speaker 1:I mean, it's the people who don't know anything.
Speaker 2:It's just people who like those people never shut the fuck up. That's the problem.
Speaker 1:Well, because they're just stating their opinion, right, and their opinions usually not informed. But the problem is they don't know that, right Cause are they read literally like we're at a point now where people will read a headline of an article and that's it and that's their source of information. It's like did you read the article?
Speaker 2:No, then shut the fuck up man. Yeah, cause, especially news sources are really bad about like eye-catching crazy you know titles that might not even technically be correct.
Speaker 1:And they know that, like the people writing these know that they know people aren't gonna click on them, they just get you know, outraged and the article has nothing to do with the title, like that's pretty much how it is now, but, and then that's followed by you become foolish by listening to fools and I mean that's timeless. Again, that's something that you don't have to be viking or live in that time to even understand. That it's just. And again, I think we live in a time where there's so much access to information that you have a lot of fools listening to fools. It's like the blind leading the blind. You know there's a lot of echo chambers on the internet. Yeah, and like okay, that's cool, I guess You're insulating yourself from any kind of opposing ideas. But then it's like is that doing any good? All it's doing is reinforcing your very, your opinion.
Speaker 1:That can be very wrong, like, and if you're not willing to admit that, that's a fucking problem. Guess what? You do not have wisdom. You're the fool with the belly Everyone's laughing at. Look at that fool with his belly. And you don't even have to be physically fat, it's just you lack knowledge. So you are that person. You've got a big belly and not even physically. Just you're fucking stupid. Like Odin says, you're dumb.
Speaker 2:He has one eye and he can literally see how stupid you are.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so here's a good like. He goes into reputations as well, right, reputation is a big thing in here, like a legacy you leave. Costanzas 76 says cows die, family die. You will die the same way, but a good reputation never dies for the one who earns it. Well, so, live a good life, right, create advice. Yes, live a good life, be good to people. Try, or at least okay, I mean try to be good to people. Right, that should be your default, cause we're not gonna be perfect. But, in a nutshell, yeah, it's like live a good life. Try to be honorable, try to have courage when you need it. Take care of yourself, take care of your community, your friends, your family. And, yes, granted, when we die, I mean we won't be remembered by a lot of people, no, but then, but, we might have an impact to where that's the important part, yes, where we do. When we do die, our reputation will live on through the people we impacted, which that's awesome. Yeah, I mean like that's a cool thing.
Speaker 2:No matter how sure you are or how religious you are, there is no guarantee to what comes after. So, like what you leave behind, the relationships you've built, like you said, the impact you've made, that is what will be remembered, man, and you know what dude.
Speaker 1:It feels like Joe Rogan says this. You know, a lot of times he's like you know I feel selfish because he's like I like being good to people because it makes me feel good and I'm like you know I don't. Ok, you can say that selfish, but If being good to people makes you feel good, then that's just a win-win.
Speaker 2:Yeah, who's losing in that scenario?
Speaker 1:Exactly. It's like you're still being good to people, you're still being kind, you're still like you're still going to give your shirt you know, the shirt off your back to someone who needs it. I mean him. I'm just saying in general, like you know, that's, that's pretty standard. Just live a good life. And actually it's funny because I love the movie Gladiator. I watched that last night.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I asked OK, OK, OK. So in the beginning, where he he's like talking to his guys in the in the forest, he's like what we do, what we do now, we'll let go for it ever, you know, in eternity, and like that's the same thing. He's like what we do, our actions, are going to speak for us when we're gone. So live a good fucking life, man Be good to people.
Speaker 1:Yeah, be good to people, share your knowledge freely. That's the other thing. Like about the Hava Mall is like to own and knowledge is currency. Wisdom is currency and like, like the example of me living on the road, so you know, because of the experiences I had and the people I was able to connect with, that was currency for me because it got me a place to stay, it got me like the mechanics like totally hooking me up, not charging me for stuff, and like it really helped me out. Right, that was fucking currency because I didn't have to get a hotel, I didn't have to worry about food, like dude, I got hooked up.
Speaker 1:Man, yeah, and like a lot of that goes back to this knowledge and wisdom is currency and I'd be cool if people kind of saw it like that now. But I don't know, man, I think I think we're just getting a little thin on wisdom, man, I think we're. But then I see I sound like an old fucking man I don't know my rent or fucking old kids, fucking. They're ruining everything? No, they're not. But hey, man, times change, it's different man, society changes, bro, it's like you got to change with it or you don't have to, but then it's like you got to just find your place.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you kind of make yourself. Yeah, I did.
Speaker 1:Yeah, this is funny. I talk about like relationships and stuff. This one and the Havama also talks a lot about like money and finances and like being being responsible with your money. So this stands at 79. If an unwise man chances upon money or a woman's love, he will grow more arrogant, but not more intelligent. He will be deceived about his own worth. So that's an interesting one, right. It's like is she with him because he's like a good guy? Is she with him because he's got money right and like in our society? Now the sad thing is is that, like a lot of those rich people, they're not. They're actually not like, they're not smart. Right, Like it seems to be like, because I've come across a lot of people that have a lot of money and they're like, they're kind of dumb sometimes.
Speaker 2:Well, I mean. A lot of times those people are kind of like, you know, trust fund babies, Like they're going to be the one to, or money is going to, breed money, you know, and like if they already have a fucking hedge fund set up for them, you know, before they're even fucking, you know 21 years old.
Speaker 1:Obviously it's not that hard to be successful if you start that way Well, and then there's a huge difference between people that accumulate their wealth through I started my business from scratch versus the person who's like oh, I got a small loan of a million dollars. Donald Trump, yeah, I had it hard. He gave me 10 million, that was it. It was a struggle, yeah.
Speaker 2:What do you mean? I mean I'm not going to get pulled over. I mean he obviously does have a good business tactics but still, Well, it's even like Jeff Bezos.
Speaker 1:They're like he started Amazon in his garage yeah, attached to, like his parents, 5,000 square foot house. Like you know, he definitely had some resources.
Speaker 1:Of course, all of that didn't sucker all those people. They exponentially creased it. All these people that are super wealthy like very few of them started from the bottom, the very bottom, even Elon Musk, because that is rich as fuck, like oil, diamonds, you know all that stuff. So it was like cool man, you know good for you. But there's something to be said about the one who earned it the hard way, like there's definitely a different mindset. Oh yeah, fucking hungry man, yes, yeah. So basically what he's saying is hey, man, even if you have money and you can't like, that doesn't mean shit. It means actually you're just going to be arrogant and you're not going to be any smarter because you didn't earn that. You know, because that's what he's saying. If an unwise man chances upon money, so Take lottery for inheritance.
Speaker 2:Take the lottery, for example. How many fucking people lose all their shit?
Speaker 1:They lose all their money. The percent is really high. Yeah, because what they end up doing is they spend on a bunch of dumb shit and then they start. They typically start businesses that always fail, and then they just blow through the money, which is crazy Because, like dude, you just have some fucking discipline.
Speaker 1:Man, like just set some of that shit, as I know, isn't that crazy. Yeah, how like like that's, how much, like that's how powerful money is, is it? Just it makes people nuts, literally makes people crazy. People do crazy shit for money, kill people fucking. I was listening to a Jocko podcast today and he was so. Smedley Butler is like an iconic figure in the Marine Corps. He was a. He got two medals of honor but in 1934, he wrote a book called War as a Racket. He was very anti-war and it's a scathing rebuke of how the US has used wars to profit, and so that episode is basically just talking about you know that, profiting profiting from from war and all that stuff. And yeah, I don't know, that's a tough one because that shit pisses me off.
Speaker 2:And people can just blow through it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and it's like OK, so the US spent like a trillion dollars in Afghanistan over 20 years and what did we get for it? Nothing. And how's nobody upset about like that? That boggles my mind. Like so, technically, our government is that unwise man. It's like we have not learned anything. Yeah, you know, over these failed wars that we fought. So here we are fucking just all will print more money. That'll fix it. I think that'll fix it, sure, so, yeah.
Speaker 1:So these people are usually deceived by their own worth, right? So they got all this money. They think they're worth, but they're not because they didn't earn it. So look in life, this is the value of busting your ass and earning shit, because it just feels better and you get wisdom from it. Like you, you know that's a lot of what the Zen and Zen and the art of motorcycle maintenance talks about, kind of talks about it. He goes into why it's very important to be OK. So let's like, look at the motorcycle. Like the value of knowing how to repair your own motorcycle. He's like you will learn more than a mechanic that's trained to do more. Like train to work on motorcycles. If you troubleshoot your own bike, you do your own stuff you're going to inevitably know way more than the other mechanic does, because you know your bike now. So I think you know, I think that all kind of ties into this, like there's, there's wisdom that comes from struggle, right? So someone changes upon money. They didn't struggle to get it and you don't respect it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, look at our society now, dude. It's like, look, you know, it's easy, every generation was shits on the other. But like it's safe to say that the last couple of generations have undoubtedly had benefited from the previous ones and we've had it so good. And look what it's done. It's made everyone feel entitled as fuck, everybody. I don't give a fuck who you are, what you race, your nationality is, if you're living in the United States, you were entitled, entitled as fuck. But don't you know, don't tell the social justice where is that? Because they'll fucking cry Rage against the machine we need communism, yeah, you go, go to fucking socials countries.
Speaker 1:How you do, buddy yeah that's not going to fucking, that's not going to work. I'm not going to worry how to get it. They talk about all gone here, but I'm trying to find where he I guess we kind of probably are to cover that with the weight. You know what? With glottening I mean, I like a little bit yeah yeah, but it just goes back to the indulgence and stuff like that. But it's funny because he gives up other weird advice. So here's stands at 82 chop wood when the wind blows, roll your boat on a calm sea, court of lover at night time. For the day has many eyes. Value is shipped for its speed, a shield for its protection, a sword for its sharpness and a woman for her kiss.
Speaker 2:Hmm, yeah, that's an interesting one, so just appreciate. Yeah, thanks for what they are.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, it's like I think the funny. It's funny chop wood when I know that there's probably something specifically rooted in that culture that would chop, because, like, I wouldn't chop wood when the wind's blowing because, like, if I'm cutting trees down, that means those fucking trees are going to be blown down. Hmm, fucking falling down on me, but I definitely want to row a boat on calm sea. Yeah, these are all just little tidbits of like I don't know, court of lover at nighttime, obviously, especially if you want to keep it secret and, of course, you value ship for speed.
Speaker 2:So value things for what they are. Yes, If it works smarter, not harder. I feel like it's kind of You're right, that's exact.
Speaker 1:You know what You're right Chopping wood, because the window blow the rest of the tree down, so you don't only have to chop a little bit of it I know he's referring to that or if it helps keep you cool, well, I could. It could, I'm sure.
Speaker 2:I'm scanning.
Speaker 1:Maybe it's not like it's hot, they're cold as shit anyway, but I like it. You're that could be onto something, but it can mean that, look, it can mean whatever the fucking, whatever you interpret it. To me that's the cool thing about the Hava mall. It's like, even though it's just like old thinking, it's like it's still very relevant thinking because again, we are like we're humans and even though our technology changes, I think fundamentally, who we are will just never change. Ok, so I told you Odin had some negativity to say about women, so we're going to jump into stands.
Speaker 1:84. The sexist shield. Let's go, yeah. No man should trust the words of a girl, nor anything a woman says. Women's hearts are molded on a wobbly wheel. Faithlessness is planted at their core. First listen, I'm not condoning what Odin said, but I don't. Who hurt you? I know he got hurt bad. Yeah, he got her real bad. You know it's fucked up because, like he's talking to a witch, a female woman, he woke her ass up from dead. You know it's like why got to be a dick bro, you just woke this woman up from her eternal sleep and you're just talking shit about women. It's like, trust me, you for shit. I mean look man, it's you know you can replace that with Got man. I mean it's like yeah, men and women are like that. It's definitely not just girls or women, because there's plenty of dudes who are just shitty.
Speaker 2:I mean a lot of them are. You think maybe he's just I know he's definitely being sexist, obviously, but maybe just the the core differences and emotional differences between men and women, like you think.
Speaker 1:I could be like me if we were to like bring him forward in a modern day. Yeah, sure, yeah, I could. It's yeah, I would probably not even just have it specific for agenda. I just like like, maybe you don't always want to necessarily trust the word of everybody, like, yeah, you don't, you don't know, you know you don't, and that's like. The other thing with social media is like it's hard to tell what's real and what's not. Who's telling the truth, who's not as old as your motives? Right, it's like nowadays it seems like everybody's got a motive for something, like for some reason, and that gets tiring though. Yeah, doesn't it? That's what this shit gets, so tiring. I don't know. I thought you want to me. Yeah, what the fuck do you want from me? Man, really, quickly, how long have we been going? We're like we're only about an hour 45.
Speaker 2:Oh seriously, I felt like maybe this is we talked beforehand. Yeah, we did.
Speaker 1:So before we started recording I was taking Kiersani, sonic Journey, some metal and some music, some of my own tunes that I've made. Yeah, fucking, dj Hayes, dj Hayes, that's right, dj Hayes, the machine. I don't know if that would work. Dj Hayes, that would work so much. So there's a lot going on in the Havah Mall.
Speaker 1:I would recommend Jackson Crawford's the Wanderers Havah Mall. It's like you can literally take it within your small. I got it when I went on the road because I just thought it'd be a kind of a neat thing to have with me because it's called the Wanderers, the Wanderers Havah Mall. So because he even goes further into each stanza and kind of breaks down maybe what it's saying and, man, it's like really intense. He goes into the linguistic nature of Old Norse, because you can actually read it in Old Norse on the one side and then it's translated in English yeah, so it's Old Norse on the one side, holy fuck, that is yeah. And then, and then the other side, the English translated version. So, yeah, man, you can really get involved with this. I don't know, man, you know the Havah Mall, like so many books like this, it's just the knowledge in the parts is, I think, something that can you know you can. You can just pick it up one day and look through it and find something that's relevant for your life at the moment.
Speaker 2:And I can't help it. I got to compare this. I know a lot of people say that the Bible is like stuff that carries over over periods of time, and I feel like there's definitely some comparisons. Maybe you could be drawn, but imagine the Bible only, like you know, eight times shorter and not as convoluted with a bunch of fucking stories. That provides very similar wisdom. Yeah, like you know, don't be gluttonous. The Bible is like it's pretty convoluted.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I understand it doesn't act. That's why I like the Havah Mall and like even the whole Nordic outlook was always just so much simpler. Yeah, it's very like, very to the point, very blunt, very, you know, without all the trimmings on it, but it had its artist, had like an artistry of its own, it had a cadence of its own right, you know, because this is, it is a poem. I mean, it is written in a deliberate way. So I guess that seems to be the thing about, about the Havah Mall, you know. So that's how it differs from the Bible, I think. Yeah, the Bible is trying to, it's good, you know, talk about parables and things like that, and the Havah Mall is just like hey look, this is a modem. And like this is a good way to live.
Speaker 1:Yeah, stay away from drinking too much, don't eat too much, travel widely, gain knowledge and wisdom, treat your friends your, treat your friends with respect and give and take. Don't be anybody's bitch though. Yeah, don't take shit from nobody. Gator, don't take no shit from no one. That movie's been in my head for some reason. The other guy.
Speaker 2:OK, this is my gym.
Speaker 1:It's a good movie. I think it's kind of underrated yeah, one of those under the radar kind, but damn it. So I think it's timeless.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's like the Havah Mall and it's time he's compared fucking welfare movie to the Havah Mall. Holy shit.
Speaker 1:I mean, so that's like the Havah Mall in a shell man, it's just. It's just guide on simple living and, you know, appreciate the life you've got, because this is it man. You know, like that's the thing that I think. So, with a lot of Norse mythology, at the end of Ragnarok they say that it is reborn and Thor's children repopulate the world. But I, there's people out there that think that that's maybe a later edition because it's very Christian sounding. Yeah, and that's not where the original Norse worldview is. That looks things end and that's just the way it is Like like they didn't really. I mean they had a concept of hell, but not like it wasn't a punishment Just if you didn't die in combat. You just you go to hell and you just like you know you're not being punished.
Speaker 2:But you're more like a purgatory Is actually not even a purgatory.
Speaker 1:It's just there's no, no, it's nothing. It's just you die and you go there. It's like you just don't go to Valhalla because you didn't die in combat. That's the other cringy thing I always hear. People are like what's someone nowadays dies like to Valhalla? And it's like stop, stop saying that, dude.
Speaker 2:Like the motherfucker choked on his chair.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that that place is exclusive for people that died in combat. Yeah, it's pretty specific. Yeah, the pretty specific about who gets into Valhalla Like he ain't it.
Speaker 2:Sorry, your buddy. Your buddy had a fucking heart attack.
Speaker 1:I'm sorry crash on a motorcycle and die. You're not Sorry, bro, You're going to hell Like you're just hanging out the normal people that died of old age. Yeah, because dying of old age was like kind of like frown upon. Yeah, because you didn't die in combat. So it's like it's crazy. It is crazy but it kind of shows you that the life they lived right and it shows you the things they valued, Like, obviously, Marshall prowess was like very important being able to fight and like Die honorably where, yeah, I mean very different culture, I think you know so. So, yeah, that's the hoveball in a shot. I think that's all we're going to really think.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I feel free to check out some standards yourself.
Speaker 1:Yeah, man, dr Jackson Crawford's the Wanderers hoveball. It's definitely like my go to, and a lot of people have this copy because it's very clear, it's very concise. Yeah, man, so you got. You got anything else? No, sir, I'm good man, I think we.
Speaker 2:I think we did a pretty good job. What do you think? Yeah, I mean I've been wanting to cover the hoveball, the first one, that first episode we did was just this, didn't go through to it.
Speaker 1:It was practice, let's practice.
Speaker 2:And we needed to do it because we did get some shit figured out, like oh, we got a third microphone.
Speaker 1:Yes, sir, yeah. So like in the very near future, we're going to start having guests on. I think that's going to be pretty cool. That'll probably make our episodes longer, which would be really cool. Absolutely yeah, because we'll have left. I think we're going to have some interesting people and and we can fucking do phone calls. So we still have to start that. I am going to start reaching out.
Speaker 1:I think we'll have to figure a way to test that out. Yeah, I think. Oh, we got. We got a competition coming up August 12th, right? Yes, sir, you're going to do Bluebell. Yeah, are you doing Gia Nogi, or just what do you know, gia Nogi?
Speaker 2:OK, cool.
Speaker 1:I think we're going to have some interesting people. What do you know? Gia Nogi, ok, cool, I think that's what I'm going to do. White belt Um, I was, I was thinking about doing the, the challenger, but if I'm, yeah, I would. If I'm going to be in middle weight, I'm just going to do Gia Nogi because, like, I'm just saying, yeah, that's enough matches Dude, I just don't feel like grappling someone with 250 pounds. Then I come, I mean I will, but maybe, maybe I'll do that.
Speaker 2:A blue belt or something like I'll Get a better skill set, yeah, you know we'll just challenger's just that's what I've seen people do all three and it's a very, very hard day, Like you get a lot of matches doing for. I told him that's a lot. That's like even for him. Like, if he has like which I think he will If he has multiple people in each bracket, he is going to be suffering Like by the end.
Speaker 1:I support it but, ok, man, toughest fucking nails, fuck dude. And he's young and hungry, disciplined, ready to get it. Like that's the kind of person like all right, man, like I can't keep up with them, but I'm going to try. Yeah, just kind of hang on, man, I'm going to try, but I don't know it makes us all better. So, yes, sir, yeah, so check the podcast out. It is always up on all the major podcast streaming platforms like Spotify, apple Podcast, google Play, audible, amazon Music Game. It were there. Pod Podbean, podchaser, yeah man, yeah man, all of them uses Podbean. I think we've got a couple that do.
Speaker 2:OK, shout out to those people.
Speaker 1:I'm sorry, I feel like, because, like you know, on the stats shows, you know, like the platforms, obviously the biggest one is Spotify and Apple's second. So it's like that's obviously, and Spotify is, I think, the biggest podcasting platform. It took over Apple, I think Wow. So so, yeah, keep up to date. You know again, we're we. We chop episodes every other Wednesday. Again, appreciate the support, we're going to keep bringing episodes your way. And we're, yeah, man, we're just going to keep moving forward.
Speaker 2:Yeah, thank you guys very much for listening.
Speaker 1:All right, thank you all and we will see you all next time.
