‘Absolutely deadly’: Ontario’s northern highways in desperate need of a fix

Welcome to a special road-trip edition of Village Media's Closer Look podcast.

On tonight's episode, we catch up with members of the provincial NDP who've spent some quality time over the past week driving along Northern Ontario highways.

The MPPs are on a campaign-style tour, meeting with local residents and hearing ideas about how to improve the state of Ontario's northern highways.

Joining us from their car is Ontario NDP Leader Marit Stiles and John Vanthof, who represents the riding of Timiskaming-Cochrane.

The Federation of Northern Ontario Municipalities (FONOM) has previously called on the federal and provincial governments to invest in the so-called 2+1 model for widening highways.

You can learn more about that HERE.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

It's a it's a kick in the teeth, you know, frankly, when they won't spend uh money here to deal with these absolutely deadly roads.

SPEAKER_02 0:26

Back on closer look with Michael Friscoletti. I'm Scott Sexmith on this uh Wednesday, the eleventh day uh of March. Uh people still uh talking about last night's uh episode about the Algo Center Mall in LA Lake.

SPEAKER_03 0:37

It was a very powerful episode, uh a big piece of history uh that I think a lot of people remembered, even though they they don't remember all the details. Yeah. When that was back in the news, people remembered exactly what was going on because I think we gave we got this across yesterday was there was a the whole country was watching the rescue effort on the news because they had heard the two people were trapped. They were trying for three, four days to get to them, and they were all hoping and praying, obviously, that someone would be pulled out alive, which tragically wasn't the case. But that's what gave it so much attention, right? I mean, if this I always used to think if this had collapsed in the middle of the night when nobody was there, there would have never been a public inquiry. Of course, two lives would have been saved, which would have been great. Yep. But we would have never really known the history of why that happened. I think a lot of people would have got off, but it just did happen. And the craziest thing, as you saw in the video that we showed last night, was it was a beautiful summer day. Yeah. Like so the irony is that this structure was hammered for 33 years by salts, you know, road salt, slush rain seeping into the structure and just eating away at the the the steel beams and columns and the welded welded connections. But it was a beautiful summer day when it fell down. It was crazy. So many, so many sad parts about that story. Um but we mentioned Jack and Elaine Quinty. They owned a restaurant, they ran a restaurant in the Hungry Jackson called Hungry Jackson. They're they're the lead plaintiffs on the class action lawsuit. And I remember there was a photo we talked about it last night of these two like icicle-sized chunks of concrete that fell. And actually, David O'Connor sent me an email last night with the photos. We're going to show them if you're watching the video and not listening, you can see them. These fell down thirteen months before the mall collapsed. And as we know in the public inquiry, they went to the city, they went to the owners, and nothing was done about it. Well, when you sent them to me last night, I responded to you and said, Oh my god, that would kill you.

SPEAKER_02 2:19

Yeah, like if that fell hit you on the head.

SPEAKER_03 2:20

Yeah, like if you were cooking in the stove, and that fell on your head, it would have been And again, it and and the other craze is that fell overnight. She showed up, they showed up to work, she did, and her coworkers, and it was on the ground, right? So just so many warning signs. And you know, just rereading the inquiry report just talked about that. But there'll be more to come on this. We're gonna we are gonna talk more about this because the hearing date is set for April 10th. And as uh you asked, David, last night as well, there's still a process to go. If this settlement's approved, there's still gonna be months of of, you know, uh an independent adjudicator looking at the claims and then figure finding it's gonna be a while before the check actually comes in the mail. Yeah. But it will be quite a day. It'll be probably like 15 years after the collapse by the time that happens. It's crazy. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 2:59

Uh today on the program, uh we're hitting the road, literally. Yes.

SPEAKER_03 3:04

I mean not you and I, but this is a this is a fun idea. I like this idea. So obviously the NDP is uh is pushing for more attention on northern highways, northern highway safety improvements. Um, we live in the north and it is an issue we care about. But as we've talked about on the show as well, there's a huge economic reason why that corridor between, you know, Toronto and heading into Manitoba. All the way up past underpaid to Manitoba. It's a huge economic pipeline. Like, you know, things are moved across the country on that and it's pretty dangerous, and there's a lot of accidents, and it's really not where it needs to be. So the NDP's gone on a road trip to kind of draw attention stopping in different communities, and we thought, wouldn't it be fun to catch up with them on the road as opposed to um having them just stop in the studio? So we're gonna uh uh see who's uh where they are where they're at and what what they're hearing.

SPEAKER_02 3:49

All right, and uh today we have uh NDP leader uh Mart Stiles joining us as well as uh Temiskaming Cochrane MPP John Vanthoff. In a recent 10-day stretch, eight people were killed on Northern Ontario highways, part of a longer pattern of deadly crashes along the Highway 1117 corridor, a route connecting communities across the North that critics say hasn't kept pace with safety needs. In the North, highways aren't just roads, they're lifelines. And when a crash or bad weather shuts them down, there's often no alternate route. Ontario NDP leader Marit Stiles has been touring the North with members of her caucus on a trip called Our Roads, Our Safety. Marit joins us now from the road riding shotgun with Tomiskaming Cochrane MPP John Vantoff. Welcome to Closer Look, Marit. Good to see you again.

SPEAKER_00 4:42

Great to be here.

SPEAKER_02 4:44

Okay, uh, Mart, a lot of serious questions and things to talk about today, but I want to get this question out of the way first. A long road trip with a colleague isn't always a recipe for success. How are you and John getting along? Is everything okay with the two of you?

SPEAKER_00 4:59

Well, so far, so good, I think. You have to ask John that. But uh I will say I joined up a little later. So uh John Bantoff and Gy Bourgwin and Saul Mamaka, they've been on the road already for about a week. And I gotta tell you, uh, I I would say things things were getting a little tense there. No, they're they're having a lot of fun, but they also uh they've they've shared some details that I don't think I can share on the content.

SPEAKER_03 5:28

We'll keep that out. That's great. Just give us a quick zoom of the care. This we see John, he can wave everything. So he's actually trying to keep your eyes on the road, be careful. Oh no, don't look. Don't look, don't look, John. Good stuff. It's a 10 and two. Good stuff. Honestly, don't you guys with all the negative things going on, just wonder whether you should even drive back to Queen's Park, just keep going somewhere else?

SPEAKER_00 5:46

You know what? I gotta say, it is it is one of the nice things about this road trip is it sure is not is nice to be out on the road and talking to real regular people instead of having to deal with Queen's Park. But uh, but we are going back on the 23rd of March, and that's part of why we're doing this, right? Is we want to be able to bring the voices, the stories of Northern Ontarians, especially around highways and the safety issues here. Uh, we want to bring it back to Queen's Park with us uh when the house comes back.

SPEAKER_02 6:17

All right, let's uh get to uh those serious issues, Marit. You're at the uh tail end of a tour that has taken you to a number of different uh communities where you're talking highway safety. What have you been hearing from people?

SPEAKER_00 6:28

Well, gosh, uh we've we've heard from hundreds of people, uh, whether it's like stopping in at Tim Hortons or uh we had a big town hall in uh in Thunder Bay a few days ago. And every single stop that we've made, we hear, you know, just terrible stories. I so many, I don't think you need a person up here who hasn't been impacted by some kind of tragic loss uh or terrible accident from a lot of first responders uh about the toll it takes on them. Uh just last night in Bawa, we heard from you know emergency room doctors and we've heard from paramedics and uh firefighters, and everybody has a store, a terrible story to tell. But the other thing is, you know, that like everybody has close calls happening all the time on highways 11 and 17. And so we we know that they've been raising the alarms about this for years. Like this is not new, but it's just gotten so much worse uh over recent years, like you said. And and so people are looking for solutions now. And I think that's one of the things that we're hearing the most is you know, there are things that can be done right now around uh road maintenance, uh, around inspections that would help immediately. And then, you know, no question that we have to uh we have to have more four-lane highway uh with medians, or we're gonna continue to lose a lot of lives.

SPEAKER_03 7:56

Can you speak a little more to that, Mart? And if you were the premier today, what would be the first thing you do to improve Northern Highways?

SPEAKER_00 8:01

Well, my first thing I do is what uh John Vantoff here is is uh is gonna be doing, which is he's brought forward a motion that speaks to the fact that these highways fixing this link, because let's be clear, you all know this. Uh, but a lot of people around Ontario don't realize that uh Highway 11 and 17, like this is this is part of the Trans-Canada Highway, and that there are choke points where you know, if anything shuts down, I need to trust it out all the time, uh, then we don't have goods, services moving across this country. Everything just stops. And so, you know, we need to declare this highway and the maintenance and expansion of this highway uh a matter of provincial significance, and I think a nationally significant project, like what Mike Marcani has been saying he wants. Uh, this should have been on the list of our priorities as a province. And John's gonna bring that to a vote when the House comes back. So the government has a chance to do the right thing, declare it that, and then let's get moving and let's start addressing this. Because we know that the road, the highways are lifelines for northerners. That there's no question. Uh, but if the government doesn't think that's a good enough reason to fix these roads, then for goodness sake, let's like talk about it as a matter that impacts our economy uh nationally.

SPEAKER_02 9:24

Uh that's a great point you bring up, uh Mart, the uh the national point, because these roads do have a huge uh economic impact, not only uh for the province of Ontario, but for the entire country. Could you maybe speak to that a little bit?

SPEAKER_00 9:36

Sure. I mean, you think about the Nippegan Bridge, right? For example, um, when that opened, what, 2017, I think it was. Uh that's just just a bit south of uh Thunder Bay, when that opened uh and then shut down almost immediately. Some people remember that. Uh everything ground to a halt. And so it is actually like a joint, a choke point. And we we need to address that. So that's like a very good specific example, but the road closures are happening all the time. And that is, you know, every time a road closes, uh, everything stops. So not only are people able to not able to get to work, to hospitals or healthcare, to appointments, to school, but they're also goods are not, are not moving through that corridor. And like, let's be honest, a big part of the reason why we are seeing so many closures, so many issues is down to road maintenance. And I would argue the privatization of road maintenance by uh, you know, road services by the previous liberal and conservative governments. Um, but also the sheer number of trucks that are driving these highways is is is through the roof. And so while we want to see that moving, uh it is a real safety issue. And we're seeing some really horrendous uh collisions, a lot of loss of life, as you you all know too well here.

SPEAKER_03 11:00

Yeah, it seems like there's a headline every day about it. It's it's it's tragic. We see some of the families that have been impacted. And like you said, you've met a lot of them uh on this tour. How many people have brought up the 401 tour in Northern Ontario or the 401 tunnel in Northern Ontario?

SPEAKER_00 11:13

I think I think that comes up at least once a day, many times a day. Uh yeah, it's like I think the reason that people talk about that is that was a project that Doug Ford listed as one of his nascent building priorities that he gave to Mark Kearney, which is just ridiculous. And also speaks to the fact that, you know, uh you're they're treating Northern Ontario uh like a second-class citizen. Like Northern Ontarians are taken for granted by this government. I feel very strongly about that, and I know our northern MPPs feel that way. And look, I should be clear, you know, John here with me, John Bantoff and Guy Bourgwen and uh and and Saul Mamakwa and and folks like Franz Delina and Jamie West and Lise Baugeois as well, like they're all northern MPPs. They know these issues, they live it every day. And so they ride, they drive these highways all the time. So this was really about documenting the stories of the people up here. Because we know it, but we need to take those stories and we need to share them with the premier, with people in southern Ontario. Because I think the other reason why Doug Ford is so obsessed with that tunnel is that when he talks about it, he hits a million people sitting in congestion on the 401 listening. You know, there's a lot of voters who care about that down there. I don't think it's a solution. And it's certainly for people in the north, like it's a it's a kick in the teeth, you know, frankly, when they won't spend uh money here to deal with these absolutely deadly roads.

SPEAKER_02 12:42

Marit, the uh province is also pushing uh development in the north, including the ring of fire. Can the region support that kind of development if the main highway corridor is still this dangerous?

SPEAKER_00 12:53

Yeah, well, we don't think so. And uh that was another point that a lot of people have been raising with us. And actually, you know what? I'm gonna turn the camera over to John because he stopped driving.

SPEAKER_03 13:03

Yeah, right on the right.

SPEAKER_00 13:03

I think he may want to tell you a little bit about the the trip they took to the road. Hold on.

SPEAKER_03 13:08

Absolutely great. Thanks, John. Hey, John.

SPEAKER_01 13:10

Hey, how are you doing? Good, good, good. So we uh we drove up to where the new Ring of Fire Road is supposed to start. So it's about 100 clicks past Geraldton. And as you know, Geraldton's on Highway 11. And we made a video there that's gotten uh a couple hundred thousand views, and and basically said, okay, so the ring of fire road is gonna dump onto Highway 11. And Highway 11, I believe, was closed last year in 2024 363 times. Wow. And uh in highway, or they could take highway 17, and I think it was closed, I'm going off memory, 886 times in 2024. So and and we've here heard from mine owners from that that they're having to shut down their operations because we can't keep those highways open and safe. So, you know what? Before we really can talk about the ring of fire, how about it we we make sure the highway is safe for the the businesses and the people now, the people who live here now?

SPEAKER_03 14:15

Thanks, John. I can see you guys have stopped. I think you're stopping in Sault Ste. Marie for uh for a little scrum. We'll let you go in a second. Um, John, why we have you on the call too now that you've stopped. So sorry, Martin. Uh I love this. This is the best kind of road trip conversation. Um, can you what story sticks out the most for you, John, on this tour that you've when you've been talking to so many people, is there a story or two that stick out for you?

SPEAKER_01 14:35

Uh yeah, so actually uh one from my own riding and one uh I guess but one that stuck out the most that was the hardest. Uh we interviewed someone in Kekabeka Falls, uh Nathan, who lost his wife on uh January 29th on uh in a highway accident. Uh she uh had a head on with uh a transport. It wasn't the transport's fault, and it wasn't her fault. They did everything right. Um, but she hit ice and and yeah, that was so tough. And what moved me, um, she was prepared they were very have a very strong community there, and they held a procession and they closed they closed the highway and to take her ashes home to her to her home, they closed the highway. And that that struck a chord, I think that it it was that was really, really tough. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 15:41

Uh when you get back to uh Queen's Park uh after this tour in the uh ledge resume sitting, what's the message you want the uh government uh government to hear loudest uh from the north? And either one of you can take that question.

SPEAKER_01 15:53

The one thing that we when we talk to the mayors, we talk to it's not that the solutions aren't there. We've all you know, there's been study and studies and and task forces all with great solutions. The message we want the government to hear is let's just get it done. We've been promised enough times. We've been, you know, and start start with the things you can do right away. Change highway maintenance. Highway maintenance is not working. More there, the section of highway than 11th section of highway, there's like 200 and some kilometers where there's no place for a truck to pull over. And you wonder why truckers fall asleep and and cause head-ons, right? Like there's so many things we could do right away, and we have to actually go ahead and change Highway 11 and 17 so they were no longer the weak link in the Trans-Canda system. We're supposed to be the most powerful province, and yet somehow Manitoba can have four-lane highways across the across their province, and Quebec can have it, New Brunswick can have it, and for some reason, Ontario can't do it. I don't buy that. We need to develop whoever's in government has to have the political will to actually get that done.

SPEAKER_03 17:17

Thank you, John. Marr, last question. I know you have to run, but I do want to ask you about the school trustees because I think it's on the agenda today. Uh Doug Ford and Paul Calandra are having a press conference. I don't exactly know what they're saying at this point, but lots of worry among school boards across the province about trustees being cut for good. What are you hearing and what's your response to all this chatter?

SPEAKER_00 17:34

Yeah, well, we've been worried this was coming. Uh, I don't know what they're gonna announce today, but I know a lot of people that I'm talking to are are really afraid that they're gonna dissolve school boards altogether. And I wanna be really clear about what that looks like then. Uh, because I think for Northerners particularly, um, or anybody really in like rural or small town Ontario, uh, you gotta think, do you want your schools to be run by uh some consultant in Toronto? Because that's what's gonna happen if they do that. And I I have seen already the results of some of these boards being taken over by these consultants who don't know anything about education and don't know anything or have any connection to those communities. And it is not good, and I think it's gonna be bad for our kids and bad for our communities. Uh, and you know, already we we know our kids are not getting the supports they need uh in schools. So I I think, but I think it's gonna affect northern communities in a really different way than some other places, and I'm very concerned about it, and I think people should be very worried about what this means. Uh, because Doug Ford and his government, I don't think they're really all that interested. No, they've shown that. They're not all that interested in the issues that people face up here. So I I'm very concerned about it. I think there's a good reason to have like local voices at the table to stand up for our communities and be a good connect for parents, too. So I'm I'm worried about it. Uh we'll see what they come up with. Uh, but I know that uh people here are also telling me that they're really worried about that.

SPEAKER_02 19:04

All right, from the road today. There's Tamiskomin Cochrane. Uh, MPP John Vantoff is there, uh, NDP leader Marit Styles. And uh shout out to Astrid in the backseat who quarterbacked this whole thing. Uh good to see you uh all and uh safe travels the rest of the way.

SPEAKER_00 19:19

Thanks a lot. Take care.

SPEAKER_02 19:23

Uh we know they were they're just pulling into uh Sault Ste. Marie. Wait till they see the potholes. Yeah it's a whole other story. Good grief. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 19:30

We're gonna get some uh emails about that.

SPEAKER_02 19:32

Uh good chat though, and uh certainly some uh some more than valid points.

SPEAKER_03 19:35

It was a great chat. Just for everybody who's wondering, too. Um we would we've invited Doug Ford on the show all the time. He's uh has an open invitation, the premier, to jump on the show. We love this idea because they're on the road. We'd catch up with them on the road trip. We'll catch up with the conservative road trip too, or anywhere else you want to talk, if you want to jump on the show, uh the invitation is open to Doug Ford and all his cabinet uh members.

SPEAKER_02 19:55

And I want to be clear, we have repeatedly asked the Premier's office for the Premier to come on the program for sure. Uh to uh to no avail to date.

SPEAKER_03 20:03

Trevor Burrus, Jr. And he's a busy man for sure. But the invitation's open, even if and you see now we can do it from the car. So if you're driving and you want to jump on your phone, we're here. He's got a driver. I'm sure I'm sure at least I hope so.

SPEAKER_02 20:14

All right, that's uh it for us tonight. Closerlook at villagemedia.ca. What do you think about the uh highways around the province? Let us know. We'd love to hear from you. And check us out at closerlookpodcast.ca for Derek Turner, executive producer of this evening's program. Michael Friscolati, our editor-in-chief. I'm Scott Sexmith. Thanks for your time. We'll see you tomorrow night at seven right here on Closer Look. Fresco and Scott's wardrobe, provided in part by Moore's Sault Ste. Marie.