Episode 58: Dami Tanimowo - IR Under Pressure: Building Trust When Markets Wobble

In this episode of Enquire, Dami Tanimowo, Head of Investor Relations at Robert Walters, shares a candid perspective on building and leading an IR function under pressure. From establishing IR from scratch to navigating activist interest and AI-driven valuation concerns, Dami explains how clarity, consistency and strategic alignment build trust when markets are unsettled. The conversation explores investor psychology, disclosure strategy, board engagement and how IR success is measured when sentiment shifts. A practical and thoughtful guide for IR professionals operating in today’s complex market environment.

In This Episode

• How to transition into investor relations from finance and strategy
• What it takes to build an IR function from scratch
• Why human psychology plays a central role in market behaviour
• How IR adds the most value during moments of stress
• How to adapt IR strategy across very different sectors
• What AI means for sentiment and disclosure in recruitment
• How to think about analyst coverage in a constrained environment
• Ways to gather and interpret investor feedback effectively
• How to engage boards with clear, relevant IR insights
• Why clarity and consistency matter more than ever in IR

Quotes

• “A strong IR function comes into its own in moments of stress.” 
• “Challenge yourself to explain why the company exists in as few words as possible.” 
• “We are still in the foothills of understanding how AI will reshape the labour market.” 
• “IR credibility comes from connecting market signals to strategic decisions.” 

Resources

Connect with Dami on LinkedIn 

Transcript

What Great IR Looks Like In Crisis

SPEAKER_01 0:00

I think a strong IR function comes into its own, I think, when you have those moments of stress, right? So be that an assertive activist that comes out the woodwork or an industry-wide issue that's perceived to have negative implications for all the players in the sector, or maybe more specific to the company where there's an execution or misstep. So, in those moments, for me, success in IR looks like how quickly are you able to re-establish the investment case in the market's mind in ways that are seen to be consistent with everything you've been saying? To what extent can you showcase the depth of strategic thought and rigour that shows that management is on top of the key issues?

Guest Background And Career Path

Clara Melia 0:42

Welcome to Inquire, the Investor Relations podcast. In this podcast, we speak with senior IR professionals on their career experience, to share knowledge and learnings around IR strategies. We also speak with portfolio managers and self-ide analysts to explore their view of investor relations and what constitutes best practice. Today's interview focuses on a head of IR who is relatively early in their IR career. Dami Tanimo is head of investor relations at Robert Waters. After qualifying as an accountant and gaining post-qualification experience in a range of commercial, finance and strategy roles in the retail and insurance sectors, Dami moved into in-house investor relations around six years ago. Initially, this was as IR manager at Home Emergency Assistance Business Home Serve, before he moved to Robert Waters, a global talent solutions business, to establish the IR function as their first ever head of investor relations. Welcome to the podcast, Demi, and thank you very much for joining me today.

SPEAKER_01 1:50

Thanks so much, Clara. Great to be here with you. Thanks for having me on.

Clara Melia 1:53

So firstly, I'd like to start by congratulating you on your expanded role that was announced in early January. We'll come on to talk about that in a moment. But first, let's start by understanding more about your background and your experience. So first tell us about your transition into investor relations and why you chose to work in investor relations.

SPEAKER_01 2:12

Thanks very much for your congression on the new role. Yeah, I guess in terms of transition and think about coming to work in IR in 16 odd years, joined one of the big four cancer firms straight out of uni. Generally, I was fascinated by the corporate world and financial markets, studied economics, part of my degree. And I guess I knew then that I wanted exposure to that world in some way in terms of my working life. I joined the restructuring service line of EY in Birmingham. That was a really interesting time for restructuring because it was an eventful time for the UK and indeed the global economy. So if I think Northern Rock, that was nationalised during my second year at uni. Lehman Brothers went under right at the start of my final year. So I graduated in 09, right in the teeth of what, of course, we now know as the GFC. If I think about the exposure that I mentioned before that I wanted, certainly did get that in my time there during three years at UI, worked on projects for businesses as diverse as logistics, distribution, retail, leisure, nightclub sector, professional services, even an elderly care home operator at one point, even back then when frankly I didn't really know that IR was a thing. That fascination with sort of different industry sectors, the business models that operate within them, and how they're impacted to a greater or lesser extent by the external macro environment, that fascination was there. As many graduates who joined the big four also do, you know, I find myself departing after about three years, having learnt lots, but with a desire to continue learning within a business rather than as an advisor. Ultimately, I ended up joining Halford's listed provider of motoring and cycling products and services. And it was there that the seed of interest for IR was first planted. Within a few months of me joining Halford's, the person who brought me in, they actually moved on internally from heading up the commercial finance team that I was part of to be head of IR and was able to sort of just keep that relationship going with that individual. So they chatted to me from time to time about the realities of analyst interactions, buy side interactions. They sent me the odd sell side note. And I guess as a member of the finance function, some of my outputs and things I was working on ultimately rolled up into our disclosures in trading updates and results. Had the opportunity over four and a bit years at Halford's to do a few roles. And the last one was as an analyst in the sort of group strategy function, which again was a great learning experience, super helpful for IR. But then the time came for me to move on from Halfords back in goodness, 2018 now. And I had real clarity at that point that if the opportunity ever came up to go into IR, I definitely want to pursue that. So then moved on from Halford's to do a joint commercial finance, business partnering and strategy role at the home insurance division of Legal and General. An IR manager role came up at HomeServe, which is a home emergency assistance business, which at that point was near the top of the FTSE 250. That was a number two role reporting into a comms and IR director who then reported into the group CFO. And really, that was an ideal opportunity. And look, I'd say after six years of IR experience now, really, really happy to say it's absolutely lived up to expectations.

Clara Melia 5:25

So tell me how you went about learning more about the IR profession. Obviously, you touched on it in your previous roles across finance and strategy. Any sort of advice around how to get up to speed for someone new into investor relations?

Market Psychology And Crafting The Equity Story

SPEAKER_01 5:38

In terms of the structured stuff, personally, I did the certificate in IR fairly early on. So within my first six months of the role at HomeServe. Look, the curriculum was really great, it was a really great framework, massively practical in terms of helping contextualize the new concepts and the terms that I was encountering in those first few months. And I would certainly really commend that to anyone. And then I think in terms of learning on the job, every you know, the everyday element, I was fortunate enough in the role at HomeServe to just start living and breathing IR from day one. So had the opportunity to roadshow in London, Amsterdam, Geneva, and Zurich within the first few months, you know, meeting a mix of mostly non-holders in that flurry, seeing what was top of mind for them. I was speaking up, answering questions in investor meetings within relatively short order, which was really, really sort of good confidence boost. Within those first few months, we had Credit Suisse, perhaps they were at the time sort of initiate coverage. So that was a great little project, interacting with the sell side. But then also, I think importantly, in order to to a certain extent hold the hand of that analyst through that initiation, that certainly required me making sure that my knowledge of our business model, of our strategy was definitely sort of really sharp.

Clara Melia 6:53

Well, six years into your IR career, what has surprised you the most about working in investor relations?

Building A New IR Function

SPEAKER_01 7:00

Yeah, sure. Probably the thing that continues to be most surprising, interesting is I think how much of IR is still ultimately dependent on human psychology. Someone much more eloquent than me has put it this way that what the heart wants, the head will rationalise. In terms of what I mean by that, obviously in IR, you're speaking to the buy side, you're speaking to the sell side, you're necessarily dealing much of the time in what makes sense rationally. But I guess the enduringly surprising thing is that at the aggregate level, the market is far more a product of what we want to be true in our hearts than we would perhaps care to admit. And I think, you know, in terms of how that shows up in IR, most listed PLCs will obviously have their investment case or more generally the equity story. And for sure, one of the really great aspects of my of my target robot water so far has been helping to shape that in a fairly major way. But I think in terms of the human psychology element, I think where that really plays out for me, and I think a takeaway that I'd maybe commend is do be continually challenging yourself and trying to get to the absolute core of why the company exists, how it delivers value for all its stakeholders and making that communicable in as few words as possible.

Clara Melia 8:16

I always think one of the best IR roles is actually where you go in, and no one's held that function before, so be it pre-IPO or a company that's not had IR previously, because you have the opportunity to really build everything from scratch. So maybe just talk a little bit about what it was like for you setting up a brand new IR function and how you went about this.

SPEAKER_01 8:37

Absolutely echo your sentiments there. I certainly one instance of that that sticks in the mind was being like four weeks in, new into the business, and having a bit of a sort of an induction and chat with the CEO who had stepped into that CEO role sort of nine months previously. And effectively, I guess giving my sort of first impressions of IR, literally four weeks in in the process of coming to join the organization. There'd been a process of doing my homework and reading around not just the company but but the sector as well. So hopefully those first impressions were relatively well informed. But yeah, I think to your point around starting with a relatively clean slate, that is one instance that sticked in the mind because it was a case of saying to CEO, well, you know, these are my impressions. Here's sort of X, Y, and Z of how and why I think we might want to do things slightly differently. And then it was that fantastic thing of, okay, fine, yep, get it, on you go, deliver it.

Clara Melia 9:34

And let's talk in a little bit more detail around your role and responsibilities now at Robert Walters. So obviously, you've worked in two very different industry sectors. How did you manage the transition?

SPEAKER_01 9:44

Digging a bit deeper on my specific transition between HomeServe and Walters, absolutely right to say the two are very, very different sectors. Maybe I'll just dwell on one aspect of that in terms of forward visibility, given the extent of forward visibility that you have in a company will impinge quite a bit on how you do IR. So at HomeServe, there was lots of forward visibility versus Robert Walter's, where it's much more limited. HomeServe, in terms of some of those external metrics to benchmark performance, those were relatively hard to come by. So HomeServe didn't really have an absolute courses for courses here that did pretty much exactly the same mix of things commercially. Whereas if I compare to Robert Walters and the recruitment subsector more generally, there is a raft of metrics to benchmark performance. And actually, to a certain extent, the challenge here is more saying, right, which are the really important ones because you're not lacking in them. If I think about forward guidance, our forward guidance, given the forward visibility, is comparatively limited, forward guidance for us really is more about talking about our controllables. So we don't typically guide lots on the top line. And in terms of our profitability, our medium-term target is expressed in terms of profit margin rather than absolute pound notes. I think the key is understand where some of those contrasts are, if you do find yourself making a transition between industry sectors, really try and understand where some of those key contrasts are going to be. Just invest the time in bringing a good, solid conceptual framework to bear on understanding the competitive landscape as you're going in.

Clara Melia 11:22

Tell us a bit more about your expanded role. So congratulations again on your recent promotion. Tell us what this entails.

Expanded Role Into FP&A And Metrics

Annual IR Planning And CMD Follow-Through

SPEAKER_01 11:30

Yeah, sure. Look, I think one of the reasons IR is so enjoyable, at least for me, is that it draws on quite a few other strategic functions within a company, be it group strategy, be it FPA. As I look around peers, I think that's probably given rise in part to more and more IROs, particularly at small and mid-caps, taking on responsibility for things like FPA strategy, corporate development, and so forth. The CFO at Robert Walters, who I report to, I think he similarly detected such things and yeah, in our conversations over recent months, been mentioning that quite a few times. And so after, I guess, a few quarters of me in a bid to make our disclosures as insightful, as helpful as possible. And in order to do that, frankly, sustaining a bit of a cottage industry, trying to develop more rigor around how we looked at things like lead indicators for our largest business, which is specialist recruitment. The thought was let's do this properly. So late last year, I did a proposal to management on what that would need to look like in terms of in recognition of the fact that in the course of doing investor relations, we do need to speak as well as we can to this division of our business that drives 80% plus of fees. What does that need to look like in terms of developing more of that sort of FPA way of thinking? So, look, in summary, I'd say it's great that as well as explaining to the market where we're going, how we plan to get there, and the short, median, and long-term financials, it's really great to be able to contribute to shaping the answer to those things in the first place. And in a nutshell, I think that's what the expanded role will look like.

Clara Melia 13:13

So we're recording this in January 2026. So it's a good time of year to be thinking about planning ahead and your objectives for the year ahead. Tell us a little bit about how you go about planning your IR strategy. How far ahead do you go about planning? And how do you think about setting objectives?

SPEAKER_01 13:32

Yeah, sure. So look, I think in terms of IR planning, I'd say it's something that we're actively beefing up, as it were. We have six scheduled instances a year where we're speaking to the market, and more than that, disclosing financial and operational KPIs to the market. And again, very quickly, maybe sort of contrast that with HomeServe, where even though we're talking to the market four times a year, two of those were an AGM and a pre-closed trading update, respectively, which were exclusively sort of qualitative in nature. So now we're at Walter's six scheduled interactions, and that naturally gives something of a structure to the year. We did a CMD back in September of 24. And one of the great aspects of doing that, and absolutely would highly commend waiting until you have meaningful new things to say before you do a CMD, is that to an extent, then the medium-term messaging aspect of the IR program really becomes about demonstrating execution against the plan that you've set out. That's where we are, and we'd like to think that you know we're starting to see some early proof points against that plan for sure. We're in this happy place of the strategy clearly being set out. We've got these six scheduled interactions, and that does sort of govern the framework that I think about IR planning. Again, to an extent, the question of how far ahead to plan, I think that is driven by how far your business model really permits that. As mentioned already, talent solutions recruitment insists that I think we have a degree of humility and that frankly it's quite difficult to have a sense of specifically what we'll be saying 12 to 18 months out from now. But we have a clear conceptual framework post that CMD, as I say, and in that sense, that should ensure that we've got a good, consistent logical flow to our communications.

Clara Melia 15:19

And what about external factors that might impact your investment case for next year, across markets, regulation, or specific to your sector? Can you talk a little bit about how you're planning for those?

SPEAKER_01 15:29

Yeah, sure. We are early days of 2026, and I think no podcast anywhere is probably complete without some consideration of AI. Robert Walters and our subsector peers, we are continuing to sort of sit on 15 to 20 year valuation lows, in part because of concerns that artificial intelligence is driving or will drive the permanently low requirement and therefore lower demand for the white-collar professional talent that remains much of our specialism. And look, needless to say, I'm very happy to delve at length into all the reasons why we feel we still have an exceedingly strong value proposition for clients and candidates and well-functioning of labor markets. But with that context, certainly one of the biggest external factors pertaining to investor sentiment on AI as a theme and the extent to which the market perhaps reappraises, as I think it ought to, how well understood or easy to forecast precisely how AI will reshape the job market in the near term. That is that that is figuring very heavily in my thinking. You know, if I think to just in early December, we had a situation where we, I think within the course of space of three days, we had two dodge bracket banks both come out with their AI labor market bear theses. I'm speaking to you today in my inbox at 7 a.m. this morning, duly dropped another. So it's clearly a super hot topic for investors, and so would fully expect that we will be talking about that even more as the year progresses.

Analyst Coverage: Realities And Outreach

Clara Melia 17:02

Does it come up quite regularly in all your investor meetings then? What would you say the level of understanding by the buy side is?

SPEAKER_01 17:09

Yeah, so I think I'd contrast it this way. So if I think about our prelim roadshow in 2025, which was in March, so prelims of 24, and then our interim roadshow in August of 2025, there was an absolutely discernible significant increase in the number of meetings where impact of AI came up. So in the course of five to six months, whereas in the March came up in a few meetings, in August came up in every single meeting. What's the level of understanding? Look, I think this is an interesting one. And I'd absolutely put myself in this bracket, which is to say, look, I think we are three and a bit years post-Chat GPT. So many column inches have been devoted already to AI, and it's clearly moving at a rate of knots. But I think it is always helpful to just take a step back and to recognize that yes, this is a transformative technology, but we're still in the relative foothills of its development, and therefore, I think still in the relative foothills of truly understanding how it's going to play out in all sorts of walks of society, not just the labour market. However, look, investors are they're time poor, they need to take a view, and naturally they need to find proxies for things. So we understand that, and yeah, to a certain extent, whether or not we like where the debate is going, we need to be able to speak into it. And look, I think for us, what that looks like is some work we've been doing recently of sort of saying what are the two or three really essential disclosures that we're probably going to have to move to to enable the buy-side to understand in the context of the labour market is clearly a very diverse spectrum and different roles and skill types, etc. But what are the disclosures we can give to help them understand specifically where we play and therefore hopefully help them understand our conviction that however the AI revolution plays out for the labor market, we fundamentally believe that it will be a tailwind for businesses like ours.

Gathering Feedback From Investors And Analysts

Clara Melia 19:14

What about analyst coverage? How has that trended for you? And are you trying to actively expand coverage? It's not particularly easy these days.

SPEAKER_01 19:22

Expanding coverage. When I started, we had coverage of five. That's now down at three. And look, it's worth saying we're really happy with the three. You know, I think across them we've got two which are our house brokers, but across all three, there's very good representation of the investment case in the market. But naturally, not least for things like a bit of a richer consensus, it would be good to have a few additional reference points out there. So, yes, there's definitely a bit of a campaign ongoing. I think what I'd say is to your point on it not being easy, there clearly has to be a business case in the analyst's sort of institution to initiate coverage. And that isn't controllable, particularly for me. But what it absolutely is controllable for me is I think removing something of a barrier in the analyst's mind, insofar as demonstrating that if they did look to initiate, they would have a really approachable, hopefully knowledgeable and insightful IR that therefore helps to make their job a bit easier.

Clara Melia 20:21

And how do you approach feedback from investors?

SPEAKER_01 20:25

I approach it slightly differently, I think, with both of those, well, slightly different. If I think investors on one hand and then maybe broaden it out to Alice as well. But just start with the buy side. So I think, yeah, you know, our joint brokers will conduct feedback exercise after results and also pass on things if a particular trading update has got tongues wagging. But yeah, look, many institutions now have a no-broker feedback policy. So I think an integral part of investor feedback is one that I sort of personally conduct. And look, I think quite a lot of that is actually during investor meetings, actually, be that where a buysider will explicitly offer feedback. But actually, I think even more than that, it's some of the most telling, insightful feedback is actually really doing active listening to the questions and thinking to yourself, okay, they're still asking that thing that they've been asking for the last 12 months. So clearly something is not translating, as it were. If I think about the sell side, I think that's much more straightforward. If I might say I think they tend to be pretty forthcoming with offering up that view. And typically, when I have any sort of longer form interaction with them, will definitely be one of my questions in terms of what are you seeing hearing from your conversations with the bike side.

Clara Melia 21:32

And the key challenge in IR is how to measure success. So, do you have any thoughts around this? Do you set KPIs for your IR program?

Measuring IR Success Under Stress

SPEAKER_01 21:40

My two pence on that would be that I think a strong IR function comes into its own, I think, when you have those moments of stress, right? So be that an assertive activist that comes out of the woodwork or an industry wide issue that's perceived to have negative implications for all the players in the sector, or maybe more specific to the company where there's an Executional misstep. So, in those moments, for me, success in IR looks like how quickly are you able to re-establish the investment case in the market's mind in ways that are seen to be consistent with everything you've been saying? To what extent can you showcase the depth of strategic thought and rigor that shows that management is on top of the key issues? And then when the board needs to listen, which is all the time, frankly, but how quickly and succinctly can you convey those messages and help shape the board's thinking in the implications that has for running the business? So all those things are quite intangible. That is not to say that there won't be some quantitative things you can point to, but you know, I think the proof of the pudding will likely be within the weeks and months following and gleaned from a composite of yes, things like the share price, but also how are investors thinking, how's the market more widely thinking, and how has IR helped to shape that.

Clara Melia 22:58

And you touched on board communication there. Do you have anything additional to share around how you interact with your board and any advice for our listeners when it comes to getting that presence and credibility with board and members and non-execs?

SPEAKER_01 23:13

So if I think about on one hand, the more formal, scheduled, monthly IR board updates that I'm sure most, if not all, our IRAs are doing. And then on the other hand, the more ad hoc communications, where I think there's something of which it's really important for the board to be aware of or I know that they have an interest in. At Roboters, I think, in a really fortunate position to have a very engaged board. So the board chair, in particular, they were a FTSE100 CEO in their own rights, and they currently also chair another FTSE business. And so, in that sense, pushing on an open door in terms of their receptivity to what IR is saying. I'd echo the advice that another of your guests on the podcast has given in that in terms of the information and reporting that the board gets ahead of its meetings, there's an awful lot of it. So your advice would be IR updates, keep those as concise as possible, whilst obviously you're also trying to give the holistic update on the key changes to the landscape and how investor sentiments your company specifically or the industry more generally might have shifted. And then importantly, as well, do give them the insight of how the market is thinking about your company and how that then relates to the board's key areas of focus and then deliberations. I think as much as possible, try and understand the backgrounds of each of the board members will inform what are their key focus areas and what are the ways that they're really seeking to add value around that table. And then I think that will go a long way to you then being as effective as possible.

Clara Melia 24:39

Do you use any tools and technologies? And we touched on AI and its impact on your investment proposition. Are you using any AI tools for investor relations right now?

Tools, IR Websites, And LLM Readability

SPEAKER_01 24:50

I fear I'm not going to say anything that's super cutting edge, but I might major on the IR website just because that was a key feature in terms of building out the IR function here. And then I guess coming on to the AI element of the question, and again, maybe in terms of the IR website, more and more I do hear fund managers saying that they have in-house applications of a large language model, many different flavors are available, that that will do that job of summarizing your 7 a.m. announcement into a format where if they've got seven or eight companies reporting that morning, it gives a nice summary of essentially fine, you need to look at this one a bit more, etc. So I think I'm keenly aware of that and then keenly aware of things like over time, does a PDF? Is that the best way to do things? I think the early answer so far as I've gleaned on that is that clearly the PDF will always be with us. But actually, in terms of making things as easy for your large language model audience, having your results as a bit of HTML on the actual page is increasingly sort of looking like the way to go. I'd hazard to very quickly follow that up to say that's not something we've yet implemented achieved. But definitely these are the sorts of things that are floating around in my mind as to how we make sure we're as easy to find for the buy side in a world where more and more there is an AI sort of filter that they're using to get across their coverage.

Clara Melia 26:18

And just as we start to wrap up the conversation, interested in your broader sort of career perspective and recommendation. So you're relatively early in your IR journey. Can you talk about maybe what or maybe who has inspired you the most in your career so far?

SPEAKER_01 26:35

Personally, for me, it was great to just be able to learn from someone so experienced and just in that sense, just begin to formulate my own view of what best practice looks like. More generally, I think the inspiration and motivation comes from those moments when you see the value of your work. So when that blue chip investor says unprompted in a meeting that the strategy absolutely makes sense, or when the board, thank you for helping them get up to speak quickly on a market narrative, or equivalently, internally, when you see the knowledge that you have of investor sentiment, then helping the ex go in their thoughts on how to run the business. So I think you know, those sorts of things are what continues to provide the motivation for me and the drive as to the added value that IR brings.

Clara Melia 27:21

And would you mind sharing your thoughts on improving diversity within the IR profession?

2026 Outlook: IPOs, Activism, Targeting

SPEAKER_01 27:27

I think, you know, on diversity, it could well be a place for more comprehensive initiatives to attract wider pools of talent, albeit that clearly that takes time and it takes a lot of organizations working together in concert to achieve that. So I think, you know, more immediately and in the day-to-day, maybe let me just suggest one piece of something to think on for a piece for those already in the profession and then those looking to break into it. So I think for those already in the profession, I'd say do be receptive to when you've got a bright but perhaps still early in career individual who is demonstrating a clear interest in IR where you can, be prepared to give them a little bit of your time as you never know where that spark of interest with the right encouragement and guidance could end up going in terms of being quite significant in that person pursuing an interest in IR further. And then if I think about those looking to break into the profession, I'd say show an interest. Why not ask the head of IR if you could have a coffee with them or whatever to pit their brains? I almost certainly guarantee you that they will not decline that request. And then I'd say, you know, any opportunities that you've got to support IR outputs with a bit of analysis or whatever, then do put your hand up to do that. I think you know those sorts of things will get you noticed. And when a more formal role perhaps opens up, then you're much more likely to be in the conversation for that.

Clara Melia 28:46

And I'll just add to that as well, I think as a leader in investor relations, making sure you're communicating about your role within the organization. I used to run lunch and learn sessions when I was head of IR internally, and it's a great way to increase access to a role that most people wouldn't naturally sort of have much knowledge or understanding of what it entails. And final question, is there anything you would like to ask me?

SPEAKER_01 29:10

Here we are, as you said, in the first few days of 2026. So I wonder what your key conviction cause would be, as it were, on the shifts that we'll see in how IR is perhaps done over the course of this year. That'd be interesting to know.

Closing Thanks

Clara Melia 29:24

I think in the UK we're coming out of a cycle, and I think what we're seeing is starting to see the IPO market opening up. So I'm confident we're going to see more companies coming to market this year. I think an ongoing challenge for listed companies, however, is low valuation and therefore the threat from both takeover offers, take privates, as well as an increase in activism. That was a really recurring trend that we saw in 2025. And I think that's only going to continue in 2026. So I think a real theme for IR professionals this year is making sure you understand your defence proposition as a listed company, be prepared in advance of an activist approach. I think in terms of targeting, continues to be, particularly for larger listed companies, our clients are accessing much more global investor base. We're continuing to see strong demand from US investors, for UK listed companies, a lot more marketing across continental Europe and also Asia and Australia as well. So we're seeing a broader road show schedule, particularly for the larger listed companies. So I think it's never a dull year in investor relations, but certainly one where being proactive rather than reactive and preempting maybe some of the more challenging situations that companies might come across will put IR teams in a really strong position for the year ahead. Davi, thank you so much for joining me today. I really appreciate your time and really enjoyed the conversation. No, likewise. And thank you for joining Inquire, the Investor Relations podcast. Please look out for our next episode.