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We know that now more than ever, there is a growing disconnection between parents and their teens, corporates and their employees, and human interactions in general.
This can cause stress, frustration and many arguments within families and the work environment.
gwunspoken looks at the challenges people of all ages have in their relationships with one another and provides experience and advice, allowing all parties to have a voice.... and feel heard.
Join us to hear corporates, parents, educators, teens and the latest advice of how we can in fact live the life we love, in making authentic interactions, because we know... authentic connection is everything.
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Beyond the Field: Wisdom from a Sports Pioneer
Join us for a captivating conversation with renowned strength and conditioning coach Steve Nance as he shares insights from his illustrious career working with elite teams like the Brisbane Broncos and the Australian Wallabies. Discover the pivotal moments that shaped his journey from a PE teacher to a mentor for top athletes and coaches. Steve opens up about the highs and lows of his career, from winning the World Cup with the Wallabies to his fulfilling teaching experiences at Ipswich Grammar School. His commitment to fitness and movement reveals the core principles that have guided him through decades of sports excellence.
Steve's athletic journey is nothing short of inspiring. Hear firsthand about his experiences in rugby union, rowing surf boats, and competing in triathlons, underpinned by a transformative encounter with strength training at the University of Texas. He reflects on the role of perseverance and attitude, sharing anecdotes from legendary sports figures, to illustrate how work ethic often trumps raw talent. Steve also delves into the evolving landscape of sports nutrition and training, stressing the importance of mastering the basics while being wary of an over-reliance on technology and data.
In a heartfelt exploration of life beyond sports, Steve discusses personal reflections on family, life choices, and the legacy he hopes to leave. His thoughts on mentorship, both given and received, highlight the satisfaction derived from nurturing the next generation of athletes and coaches. Through stories of camaraderie with iconic teams and musings on life’s simple pleasures, Steve offers a perspective that transcends sports, celebrating the fulfillment of a life dedicated to passion and purpose. Join us as we explore the wisdom and experiences of a man who has left an indelible mark on the world of sports and beyond.
www.in8code.com
Welcome to another edition of GW Unspoken, where we discuss stuff we don't typically talk about but probably should. And I've got a very special guest on the line. I've got Steve Nance. How are you?
Speaker 1:Good Thanks, mate. Yeah, pleased to be here.
Speaker 2:Yeah, thanks for joining. I was going to say if I was checking I know you've had a bit of a busy day If I checked in with you today and one's terrible and five's awesome, how are you feeling right now?
Speaker 1:Probably about a four. Okay, nice, yeah, not too bad. I'm a bit tired. I'm getting older, work knocks me around a bit more, but I did a bit of training this morning before work, so I got up early to get it done and we just took the dog for a walk this afternoon. So I've had a pretty busy day really.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'll bet on you, that's good.
Speaker 1:What's something that Steve Nance is really grateful for at the moment? Just my health, just trying to keep on top of things. You know, a lot of my mates at my age are either they want to work and they can't work, or they want to go on holidays and they've got plenty of money, but they can't get around the place. So I've kept myself risen and I still work, and I do good work. So it's not hard. So that's probably what I'm grateful for.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's fantastic. I know, and we're doing a podcast series at the moment about the importance of movement and one of the first guys I thought about was yourself, and I know you helped me through my Cert 3 and Cert 4 with fitness and I've definitely used that. But for the audience out there who may not know of Steve Nance which may be rare, but if they don't, how would you sum yourself up in a minute or two? Who are you?
Speaker 1:Well, I was a PE teacher in an early part of my life and became a strength and conditioning coach, fortunate enough to work at a lot of big and successful clubs. I had 10 years in three different stints at the Brisbane Broncos, the Cowboys. I worked with the Wallabies probably the highlight won the World Cup in 1999. I worked for the Reds. I went overseas. I worked for two clubs in France, lived in France. Then I went to the EPL, worked at Fulham Three years in the premiership, three years up in Leeds with Leeds Carnegie and Leeds Rhinos, worked at the LTA, ran the tennis program for a year in London and I just consult now back in Australia, but I haven't had any big gigs, as you call it. Yeah, I've had a pretty eventful life. I've enjoyed it. It's been hard work, a lot of time you have to go away from home, but it's been very rewarding really.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I was looking through some of the past things you've done and I was actually going to say to you you know which one of those rep teams or the people you've worked with, what stood out the most, and you said it was the Wallabies.
Speaker 1:Well, the Wallabies were the biggest deal. I mean I didn't expect to ever go to Carter Farm. I was telling someone the other day go to Carter Farm's park and get a gold medal whacked around my neck by the Queen and it was a definite highlight, you know. But other things have been just you know I won't say just as important, but very important. I mean I was involved in three premierships at the Brisbane Broncos which you know. A lot of clubs and a lot of players and a lot of strength and conditioning coaches never get involved in one and involved in one and I was involved in three. You know, when I coached rugby at Ipswich Grammar School, we won four GPS premierships and that was a big deal because I hadn't won it when I first started coaching in 50 years. So it's a big highlight of my career, my time at Ipswich Grammar. You know I found out the other day they had only ever won it eight times. So I was involved with half of them.
Speaker 1:So I was pretty pleased with that. But yeah, they've all been good. Sometimes you don't win but you still have a good time, like the time up in Leeds was great. They were a good mob of blokes. It was a really good place to live in Yorkshire. But yeah, no, they've all been good, they've all been different.
Speaker 2:That's awesome and we're going to get into that more fitness stuff too. But whereabouts did you actually grow up around the Brisbane area? I?
Speaker 1:grew up in Sydney. I was born in Sydney. We lived in like a working class family from the western suburbs out in Parramatta out in Parramatta actually. I grew up in walking distance from where Parramatta Oval is now or where the stadium is now. We used to walk to the old Cumberland Oval and then that was until I was in grade six in primary school, and then we moved over to the northern beaches to a suburb called North Curl Curl and I was then walking distance to Brookvale Oval to watch Manly train and that's where I got my desire to get involved with. I used to love going. My father used to take my brother and myself down at night after work and quite often go down and watch them do their training, because they're all amateur players. They're not amateur players, they've got money but they all work, so they trained after work. So I used to love going down there and watching people through their faces. Yeah, wow.
Speaker 1:Then I got posted to Grafton in northern New South Wales as a teacher. Then I got a scholarship to go to Texas. I did my master's degree, so University of Texas, and when I did my master's degree I came back and worked at a special school and then I got a position at Ipswich Grammar where I became subject master and year master and coached their first 15. So I've had a pretty varied time, but the last 20 years I've lived overseas for half of it. But yeah, it's been good.
Speaker 2:So does that mean, Steve, if you're trained to be a PE teacher or teaching, does that mean you're sort of well-behaved in school yourself?
Speaker 1:No, no, I wasn't. I got sent away to boarding school in grade 11 and 12. Did you? I'd gone from 7A, which is where you started in high school, and it was stream classes. And by the time I got to grade 10, I was in 10D. I'd gone down, and so I got sent away to a school up in Bathurst in western New South Wales.
Speaker 1:But it was a turning point because I studied hard, I got a scholarship to go to Sydney University and I wasn't a badly behaved man. I wasn't that interested in school. I was more interested in sport, and I tell that story because you know, when I applied myself, the potential was. You know, even when I went to university I wasn't that interested. I just did enough. But when I did my master's degree, I pulled my finger out and really got stuck in. I ended up with what they call in America a four-point grade average. So I got A's for all my subjects in my master's degree and I actually got a scholarship then to do my PhD. But I didn't ever go back. But yeah, it's different, but no, when I was at school I wasn't the greatest student, unfortunately.
Speaker 2:And so you said that sport was your passion. Did you do a lot of? Was it mainly around rugby league and rugby union for yourself?
Speaker 1:No, I never really played rugby league. I had a couple of games at uni I played. I had my first game of rugby when I was about five and I was too young. I was about five and I was too young. I was under 10s and that and I just used to love getting dressed up in the kit and going to my older brother with my older brother. But my father wasn't a bad hockey player and he was a good squash player. One of my brothers was world squash champion, one of my younger brothers, and we played a fair bit of squash, but I wasn't as good as that. But I ended up being a reasonably good hockey player and I ended up playing for New South Wales oh wow. But at the same time I played rugby union at school.
Speaker 1:I went to boarding school. I couldn't play hockey, so I ended up playing in the first 15 at school in rugby union. And then, when I left school to teach, I started playing rugby. But in the interim I got involved in surf, life-saving quite heavily and rowing surf boats. And that's where I met Rod McQueen, the coach of the Wallabies that offered me the job and ended up rowing for Queensland.
Speaker 1:When I moved up here, I were in the Queensland State team in 84, which is a long while ago now, but yeah, so I played a fair bit of sport. I did the triathlon series in the mid-'80s, so you know my best finish, I think I came 43rd in the World Triathlon Championships, which wasn't bad for a guy who was just a part-timer. Yeah, no, I prided myself on being able to be involved in a lot of sports. I wasn't exceptionally good at anything, and one of the biggest things, the difference that I had is I was always the fittest in the team because if I wasn't, I wouldn't have been picked in half the sides I played in because I didn't have that much skill, you know, as much as a lot of my counterparts.
Speaker 2:I was talking to a bloke the other day Ian Webster, and he's played a bit of FedEx for 42, but he was saying the same thing. He said he didn't have that much natural talent but it was all for him. He grew up in St Helens. He said it was just all work ethic. I just had to keep working hard and I knew I could outwork other people. I'd often get picked for the side, yeah.
Speaker 1:If I hadn't have been the fittest, I wouldn't have been picked in hockey teams, in rugby teams, in rowing teams, because I wasn't as big as a lot of the surfboard rollers and you had to be reasonably big and you know and powerful and stuff. And I made it up most of the time because I was just fitter and if I wasn't, I wouldn't have got a start. I knew that. I was honest with myself.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So you've obviously done a lot Like an educated man, moved away from home, you know. And here we do find your passion, your purpose and you knuckle down, you can study, you excel, obviously. So what was it that got you into the fitness? Was it seeing with your dad the footy players and going, yep, I can see that's a drive for me, that's exciting for me.
Speaker 1:What was the thing that got you right into the fitness avenue? Look, I think it was role models. You know your PE teachers at school and I lectured a whole lot of teachers the other day about how important physical education staff are at high schools. And I had a couple of role models when I was down at Mountie Boys High School in Sydney and one was a first-grade rugby league player, a guy called Lenny Dyde, who just unfortunately has passed away, but he'd also played for the Wallabies. And another guy was a guy called Johnny Bain, which was a first-grade rugby union player, played a bit of New South Wales rugby, but they both, to me, epitomised fit men, good guys, you know, they did everything, they enjoyed themselves, and so I always wanted to be a PE teacher.
Speaker 1:And once I got into PE teaching I sort of wanted to get fitter and fitter. You know, when I was a kid I didn't really look after my fitness very well. I just used to go along and do stuff. And then, when I turned about probably 18 or 19, I started to say, right, let's get into it. And I haven't stopped. I've been going for nearly 50 years.
Speaker 2:That's crazy. Yeah, and you're saying like you're still training this morning and still walking the dogs this afternoon. Has it been like a consistent regime that you've done over the time, like have you always done strength training, for example? Have you always done aerobic work? What's worked for Steve Nance?
Speaker 1:Yeah, oh look, I've always. I didn't ever do any weights when I was a kid. No one did. No one did any weights. There was no gyms or weights rooms. There was one bodybuilding gym when I grew up, but no one ever went to it. It wasn't until I went to the University of Texas and one of the guys I was teaching swimming to people that couldn't swim adults that couldn't swim as part of my scholarship and stuff, and the guy that worked at the pool, he worked in the gym as well at the university and he said come and do some weights, because he knew I was playing rugby over there, and so he took me for a weight training program and I remember doing it and he actually flogged us and I couldn't brush my teeth that night. I had to move my head, held my hand up and move my head up and down to brush my teeth. My shoulders and arms were so sore.
Speaker 2:Oh really.
Speaker 1:And I'm never going to go back again and do that. Anyway, two days later he said you're coming back and I, oh yeah. So I got hooked on it and ever since then I've been lifting. But I've always been involved in aerobic activities. I was a decent runner. I used to go on a lot of fun runs the triathlon, the running was my best part and I still can't run anymore.
Speaker 1:I get too many busted joints, but I still cross-train three or four days a week. I get on the stepper, the cross-trainer. I've built some grinders. I've got a grinder rower. I do all that stuff. I used to do a lot of boxing. I haven't got anyone to box with at the moment that I can do consistently, but I like that sort of stuff and I swim most mornings, like I did an hour in the pool this morning before I went to work, and it's very enjoyable, especially in the warm weather. Mate, I've always done it. It's always been. Even when I go overseas, I try to book in hotels that have got a gym or I look somewhere where I can hire a bike or even go for a walk. We're going overseas next year and I've got it all organized About swimming. I'm taking another guy going away, another guy that swims a lot, so I know we're going to be doing a lot of swimming, but yeah, it's always been a part of my life.
Speaker 2:So obviously it's happened with you and it's become habit forming for you and I guess part of who you are as a person that's probably putting a spot here. But what's your advice for people who are maybe 30, 50, 60, middle-aged? How do we get them moving? Because we know the importance of movement. We know how it is for everything, so how do we get them going?
Speaker 1:That's a really good question. How do you turn that? I call it turning the light on. What's the light turning moment? And sometimes it's almost impossible. But you've just got to find out what makes them tick.
Speaker 1:And I've had some good success with people. But I find people let themselves go in those middle-aged years and when they get to 50, 60, they're overweight, they haven't exercised regularly for a long while and they're starting to get health problems and then they find it so hard then to get involved in it. And I think people miss that important era when they stop playing sport and they stop exercising. And you know I work a lot with you know, when I was running a high performance unit in Toowoomba and the Darling Downs and we had a big contract with breast cancer ladies that are recovering from breast cancer surgeries and stuff and we're looking after their exercise and their rehabilitation, I wrote a lot of programs for these ladies.
Speaker 1:A lot of them breast cancer wasn't going to kill them, it was going to be heart disease or type 2 diabetes or osteoporosis and they'd let themselves go for that long period of time. You know, when we scanned them they were morbidly obese and it's just a shame to see people like that because they were probably young and fit at some stage and then gradually, just in our society, they just let themselves go on. And, to answer your question, I honestly don't know. There's no one answer for everybody.
Speaker 1:I can't really answer your question.
Speaker 2:We know the importance, like if you're talking to some people now or you're trying to encourage people, like what have you found over time for yourself? What's the main benefits for exercise for you?
Speaker 1:Well, you know you talk about movement. You know if you don't move you'll lose as you get older. You'll lose your ability to move and it's one of the worst things you can do is become sedentary and then try to have to move again, especially after a long period of time. And my advice is for people not to stop. No matter how sick you are or what sort of injury you've got, you can always do something, and that's my philosophy. I mean, I've got a lot of joint problems. I've got two busted hips, one bad knee at the moment, I've had two shoulder reconstructions, but whenever I've done something wrong I can find something else I can do and I know I'm motivated to do it and other people aren't. But a lot of people just don't see it. It's just so easy to go and drink alcohol, to smoke, to eat bad food and lead a sedentary life. It's too easy for us and they don't realise until it's too late. So, mate, the advice is don't ever stop if you can help it.
Speaker 2:Does Steve Nance ever have any flat days?
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, mate. Even a couple of days ago I trained a little bit too hard, I'd over-trained a little bit, and sometimes I usually have one day off in the week, if I can usually Saturday or Sunday. Occasionally I have a midweek day off.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:I still go for a walk or something, but I don't do a difficult session. But no, I plan my week out. I've got weights and a little bit of cardio tomorrow, I'll swim on Saturday. I'll probably go for a walk and maybe a bike ride or something on Sunday and I'll get back into my normal routine next week. Three days a week of weights, you know. Three or four days a week of, you know, interval training with cardio stuff. But I do have to. I get too tired. I just get fatigued. You know my muscles get sore and I don't recover. It's probably because I haven't recovered. You know I've got to give myself a little bit more time to recover these days. But I enjoy it. I miss it if I don't. That's what I like about it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, what, like I know, like you're doing your Masters and stuff, so you know we could probably talk about this for ages. But how much has fitness and the knowledge of the fitness industry changed in the last decade. Even has it changed a fair bit from the principles of training to what they are now.
Speaker 1:The principles of training don't change much. The components of fitness don't change much, but the understanding of those is getting better and better as we're able to use more science to look into how the body works. You know things are constantly evolving. But you know, I tell people in sporting context, you know the young strength and conditioning guys. You know we're going to try this and try this and try that. But I say to them look, you get the 98% right, the hard work part right, and then you can try the 1% or 2% stuff. But if you don't get the 98% right, it's not good. Don't worry about giving them special supplements, don't worry about using a GPS monitor to see how they're going, because you're not getting the bulk of what's happening and there's no evidence to suggest that any successful team hasn't worked hard. It's a very important part of it. But with science we don't take shortcuts. But we're able to change the way we approach things. Instead of doing hour-and-a-half sessions, we might be able to do three way we approach things. Instead of doing, you know, hour and a half sessions, we might be able to do three-quarter hour sessions and still get the same benefit out of it. But it's changed, mate. It's constantly evolving. You look at, we don't worry about skin folding anymore in teams. They get DEXA scanned. We don't worry about trying to think how powerful they are. We've got machines that measure power, just like we can measure how strong they are. Everyone wears heart rate monitors. Everyone wears GPS units. When they're trying, we know exactly how fast they accelerate and decelerate and so forth. We didn't know that before. We just sort of guessed what it was and you knew what worked. You know, I knew what worked. So that session will work no matter what data you get out of it. But you know, unfortunately, in professional sport I personally believe that we've gone a little bit too scientific. We've got too many people working.
Speaker 1:You go down to get in the Broncos and have a look at how many people are working on the field. You know I was there. I had one other coach and we had a big squad. You know, when I was at the Wallabies, I was the only person. You know a squad of 32 players. I was the only person that went to the World Cup. It was a strength and conditioning coach.
Speaker 1:And now they'll be on tour now and they'd have three or four people involved in that and you know there's 20-something people involved in collecting data. A lot of them are university interns and so forth at the Broncos and I mean I honestly don't know what they do or where the data goes. I don't know. But to answer your question, yeah, it's changed and it's constantly evolving. And it's a good thing, science. But it's got to be used properly and you've got to use the data. You collect data. You've got to use the data. You collect data. You've got to use it. It's no good just collecting it and having it on the computer and then not giving it to anybody. So you've got to use it, but yeah.
Speaker 2:So you touched on that a little bit about you know supplements and that kind of stuff, like a lot of kids who are at school now and you get the kids who are like year 10, 11, 12 and so typically the boys are still asking how much can you bench and all this stuff. And then they're asking me about protein powder and creatine and that kind of stuff. Do people at that level need those supplements?
Speaker 1:Well, they definitely don't need it if they've got a good diet, a good balanced diet and there's no better way to get your nutrients than have it in food a good balanced diet and there's no better way to get your nutrients than in food, in good food. The use of supplements is essential in some areas where kids don't get that or not anyone doesn't get that nutritional component or they don't have enough of something. There's a massive push in our society for protein, but protein is not the be-all and end-all. Um, you know protein is a. You know repairs and and builds um damaged muscle and repairs damaged muscle and so forth.
Speaker 1:But most of our energy comes from carbohydrate you know, carbohydrate, the only thing we can get glycogen in our three energy systems, the only one that permeates all our energy systems, and the other thing with kids, especially now when I've worked at schools with rowing programs or rugby programs or whatever. You train at 6 o'clock in the morning or 5 o'clock in the morning, you quite often need supplementation because you can't get those supplements that early in the day. You can't eat normal food and it's very difficult then to recover if you don't have a supplement, unless they have a big breakfast program. But I'm not a big advocate of supplements, even though I owned a supplement company for a while with one of the ex-Wallaby guys. But no, I think they need it and they don't need it. They need it if their diet's not balanced or the timing's bad. If they get the timing right and they've got a good diet at home, they shouldn't need too much supplementation.
Speaker 2:Okay. Well, I'm going to ask you a bit of a specific question here. If I've got some students come up to me and they say they're 16, well, I'm going to ask you a bit of a specific question here. If I've got some students come up to me and they say they're 16, 17, and they say they want to either bulk, tone or decrease weight using weights, is there a stereotypically a formula for that? So, if I'm building muscle, is it like three sets of 10? If I'm trying to lose weight, is there a formula that you use that's like still a base that kids are recommended to have?
Speaker 1:Well, if I'm looking at building muscle, I mean you should be looking at eccentric loading and time under tension, and that's scientifically proven to be the best method still of increasing muscle size, because you get the fissure tearing of muscle cells and their repair mechanisms is far more efficient. See, most kids get in the gym and they lift as heavy weights as they possibly can, but they're better off reducing the weight, doing slow movements, eccentric movements, when the muscle's getting longer under load than they are, with trying to just push heavy weights all the time. I mean you will get bigger pushing heavy weights, you will get stronger, but if you can get your muscle fibre width thicker, then you've got potential to become bigger and stronger that way. There's no magic formula. I think you've just got to monitor your program. You've got to have you know I've been talking about it today you've got to have a periodised model, a model that goes into a muscle building phase and a strength phase and then a power and strength or power endurance phase or whatever. If you don't have a plan and just go to the weights room and just do whatever you want, you will not get any benefit out of it. So you've got to have a plan, a scientific, scientific plan of you know, most kids, most blokes, you know well, they want to get bigger, you know like you say, but they go about it the wrong way. And girls, they want to tone up. Well, they're not going to get as big as the blokes because they don't produce testosterone, but they still can get musculature, you know, and they still can look very athletic and lean and slender and so forth.
Speaker 1:The beauty about weight training is that you don't get a massive caloric burn off whilst you're doing it. In other words, it's not like aerobic training. You do an hour of aerobic work. I can set my watch and I'll do anywhere from 3,000 to 4,000 kilojoules in an hour, hard interval training when I cross-train and stuff. And I do a weight training session and I'm lucky to do 1,500 calories or kilojoules sorry, yeah, kilojoules, but the residual effect I get when I go to sleep and the muscle repair, the energy required for that, is an adjunct to my aerobic training. So if I do aerobic training, I get the benefit straight away. With the resistance training. I usually get the benefit over the next couple of days if there's a repair mechanism that goes on during my sleep, which a lot of kids don't understand that.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:A lot of adults don't understand it. It's a that. Yeah, a lot of adults don't understand it. It's a fact.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So you're saying periodization, is that even more important than I don't know if they just go side by side or not. But there's some kids saying, well, I might just go and do every single muscle group every second day, so I've got a rest period, or do I do a split program and do five or six days a week?
Speaker 1:Is that an individual thing? Yeah, there's evidence on all that sort of stuff. But periodization is a plan. A bad plan is better than no plan at all. A bad plan will modify it.
Speaker 1:If you've got a plan, if your end result you want is getting bigger or you're getting more powerful or whatever you want to become, then you've got to have a plan to get there. You can't just say I'm going to become more powerful and do some power weights and think you're going to become more powerful straight away and you know I want to run faster. You can't just do some speed work and not think you're going to run faster straight away. The best way to do it is have a plan and it's not going to happen overnight and people are impatient. They don't see that it's going to take a period of time and everything needs to be planned.
Speaker 1:And that's where the principle of periodisation is very, very important. And it can be as simple as following a sequence of hypertrophy work getting muscles bigger followed by a strength phase, followed by a power strength phase. That might be simple. It isn't do eight weeks of each. The end result's going to be a lot better. That's 24 weeks. The end result's going to be a lot better than if you go into the gym and you do a bit of power stuff and then you do a bit of something else and you do something else and you might see someone in the gym doing heavy weights Another day. You might see someone in the gym doing heavyweights. Another day. You might see, you know, someone doing a whole lot of endurance work and you sort of pick and choose what you're doing. That's when you're going with no periodized plan and that's where you won't get the results. Fair enough.
Speaker 2:Yeah, okay, so structured plan. I'm just going to jump around a few questions, if that's all right, just thinking about your history and stuff. So do you think there's a number one secret ingredient to being a professional athlete? We go to the professional side of things. Is there a number one thing that you've seen that consistently this seems to be the ingredient that gets them to success as a professional athlete.
Speaker 1:When I was at form we were benchmarked by the AIS as a world-class training facility, which I was a bit chuffed about it, and we had visiting coaches from all different codes of sport. We had a lot of AFL coaches came over and I had the ex-Sydney Swans I think he was in another couple of clubs Rodney Eade, and he was a famous player, famous coach, and I asked him that question what's that magic thing you look for in the young kids in the player draft when you go to the player draft? And he said, steve, the good guys can all run pretty fast over 40 metres. The timing gets there and they've all got pretty fast times. The midfielders have got good engines. They can run, you know, three-minute 30Ks for 3Ks or thereabouts. They're all pretty strong. Their vertical jumps are good.
Speaker 1:I look at their attitude, I look at their psychological profile and if there's a kid who's got slightly better physical preparation or physical development over a kid who's got not quite as good but has a good attitude, prepared to train and listen, I take the second kid and I've thought about that and I can see it. You know, I was at the Broncos when a lot of those kids came from the country, the young kids, not so much the country, the country and the city and they'd come there and they'd get into that full-time environment and some of them were superstars, you know, captain of the Australian schoolboys, and they went by the bike because the difference was their attitude. It was nothing to do with their physical performance. So that's my big thing. I like seeing young people prepared to learn and listen. I like anyone prepared to learn and listen. But yeah, there's no magic thing. I don't think.
Speaker 1:But I don't forget what Rodney East said the day I was talking to him about it. I've spoken to a couple of other coaches about it. I spoke to a guy from Geelong and he said the same thing. This was quite a few years ago. He said exactly the same thing. We've got to look at guys that are going to fit into the way we want to play. Rod McQueen had the wallabies. He had what we call it. The All Blacks picked it up, but he had a no-dickhead policy and in the early days we didn't have a massive pool of players. He didn't pick a couple of guys that probably should have been picked. I thought they could have been picked, but only because he knew they wouldn't fit into the culture that he was trying to create. Oh yeah, I get it, and I've never disagreed with that Fair enough.
Speaker 2:We had. I remember being lucky enough when one of our boys out west, teaching in Cloncurry, and he got part of the sort of part of the development squad of 14, 16-year-olds with the Bulldogs and we were at Lennox Head I think it was for a training camp weekend and we'd obviously have a dinner at the end, away from the boys, and we'd chat as coaches and it was more of a learning curve for me because I was like a sponge loving it and I think it was the Hughes brothers was running it and they said so, gary, who do you think is going to be the number one we'll pick? And there's a little halfback. There is just an absolute freak. I've never seen him like that. I said he's number one for sure. He said we're going to let him go tomorrow. He said we just can't coach him at the moment. His attitude's terrible and we just at this stage, we've tried everything but we can't and it won't be in our system. And it was just wow. You know, it's just like yep.
Speaker 1:Well, you've got to have the ability, not only the attitude, but you've got to be prepared to work hard too. I've seen a lot of people that aren't very gifted that worked hard and got there and I've seen a lot of really gifted players that were very gifted that weren't prepared to work hard and didn't get there. The days are gone that you can get by on natural ability. They're gone by the by. They're never going to come back again, unfortunately for them. You've got to be prepared to roll your sleeves up Sometimes. You've got to be prepared to do extras. You know I was telling a story to these people I was lecturing today about.
Speaker 1:I went to the state of origin camp and I was talking to Alex Corbo who was the ex-Melbourne Storm strength and conditioning coach and worked at the Broncos. But he was also at the State of Origin and Australian strength and conditioning coach and he was saying, even when he was working at the Melbourne Storm, when they came into Origin camp, he said every program had a different program, but the Melbourne Bucks they basically managed themselves, they did their weights meticulously and they used to get into each other if they didn't do it properly and then one of the melbourne players would take it upon himself to do extras after the weight session. So they'd go out and do extra ab work and extra glute work. And when the other guys had gone back to the hotel, these guys, I watched them. They were on the lawn Cameron Smith and Billy Slater, and those guys in those days they were all doing extras on the grass for about 15 or 20 minutes after the other guys had left.
Speaker 1:And that tells me that you know hard work, dedication goes way above ability. You know, I remember when I was at Fulham we played Manchester United and Ronaldo was playing for Manchester United and I used to take our boys out for a recovery session which was like pulling teeth because they didn't want to go back out on the field. And I'd take them back out and there's Ronaldo. Of course he'd only come on as a substitute, he only played 20 minutes. He did an extra 40-minute session of conditioning with the strength and conditioning coach and he was up there doing intervals, 100 repeats and 50 repeats and so forth by himself, and everyone wondered why he was such a good player and I said look at that, that's the guy that's only played 20 minutes and he's coming back out here and he's working his bum off, you know, and he's one of the best players in the world, yeah.
Speaker 2:All that stuff people don't see, probably behind the scenes. Yeah, all right. Well, here's one for you. You've probably been asked this a thousand times, so this is going to be 1,001 for you. Steve, do you have a top three or top one impressive athlete you've ever coached in conditioning? Have any freaks out there?
Speaker 1:Some blokes are freaks in different ways. I like the guy who's good at everything. It's got that beautiful muscle fibre type that makes him an endurance athlete and makes him an anaerobic athlete as well. But I look at and probably it relates back to, you know good attitude. I mean the Broncos.
Speaker 1:If I look at the Broncos players over the years, you've got to look at people like you know, wendell Saylor, who had a massive amount of ability. He wasn't a great trainer, he knows I say that about him. Darren Lockyer was a great athlete. He had a good engine as well as he was exceptionally good at certain things. I've got Brad Thorne. They were all sort of big Shane Webke. He came as not a great athlete and ended up being one of the best front rowers Australia's ever had. But I look at the Wallabies, guys like David Wilson, the back rower. He didn't get the plaudits that everyone else got, but he trained hard. He did well at all his profiling. He worked on stuff he wasn't good at and I like that about players. But you had guys like Joe Roth on the wing, ben Tune. They were exceptional athletes. They got better and better. They were dominant. They'd probably be the picks. But I just like the blokes who don't give you any trouble, it's to your job.
Speaker 1:You're not the most popular person sometimes when you're the S&C coach and you do end up in arguments why in the hell are we doing this for? And so forth. But yeah, I've been pretty fortunate. I've had mostly, you know, good blokes. They'd be probably my picks.
Speaker 2:And Steve, do you still get an opportunity to go and do some mentorship or some S&C for the teams, or is it more like you're doing now, lecturing to teachers Like what's the main role you do now?
Speaker 1:I've just finished mentoring a whole lot of strength and conditioning coaches on the Darling Downs. That was my main job and so I was up there two or three days a week setting up a high performance centre, and I met with them, you know, basically regularly and watched them work, gave them feedback, helped them with writing programs and so forth, which is, you know, enjoyable. But that's come to an end. I probably did too good a job. I've sort of gone past my years by date, so they're sort of not, you know, self-sufficient now, but I still enjoy talking to people. You know people think as you get older, you, uh, you become a bit of a dinosaur, but I, I like to think I keep up to date with what's going on.
Speaker 1:I still go around and look at people training I, you know I was telling the young people you know these young strength conditioning coaches up there, what have you done this year that's improved your knowledge of strength and condition? And a couple of them said, oh, I read a couple of journals, or you know. I said I'm, you know, I've been, I've been doing this for 40 years. I went to the Brisbane Lions, I went to the Cowboys, I went to the Broncos and I went to the Firebirds and watched them train and sat with the strength and conditioning coach and talked to them and I said I picked up so much stuff talking to those guys and the Cowboys I don't know if I mentioned the Cowboys, but you know I sat and spoke and what's the latest trends, what's going on, and people wonder how you know that sort of stuff?
Speaker 1:Isn't it Because I still have the ability and I still have the desire to want to learn what they're doing? You're never going to get involved in it again full time. It's too big a job and it's too hard a job for me. Yeah, I hope that answers that question yeah, yeah, 100% yeah.
Speaker 2:And do you have any regrets over your time there, like over your time with S&C?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I probably should have sort of pulled my head in a few places. When I was in France I got sacked, not as a strength and conditioning coach, I got sacked as a head coach and I should probably stay as a strength and conditioning coach. I got sacked as a head coach and I should probably stay as a strength and conditioning coach instead of taking a promotion to government. So I was doing a lot of assistant coaching and that was a regret that I've always had. And probably when I was at Fulham I didn't realise how big a theatre it was the EPL, and I wasn't a soccer tragic. So I didn't sort of get off at going to games and going away. So I used to send the young blokes away because they used to love going to hotels on an expense account and go and run on the field or be on the sideline and warm them up. I sort of didn't really enjoy that part of it and I probably should have put more time into that part of it.
Speaker 1:But no, generally I've been fortunate that I've challenged myself with different jobs. You know some of the jobs have been hard. You know you think you've got to uproot your family and go and live in Europe. You send them, put them in schools, and it's been hard. It's been hard on my wife, you know, and my kids have enjoyed it and I'd say now they talk about what an experience it was, but for them, as you know eight and nine and ten-year-olds it was pretty bloody hard. But I don't regret really doing anything. Probably one of the biggest regrets I have is leaving teaching because I really enjoyed it. You know I really enjoyed being a PE teacher. I couldn't do it now. There's too much marking and too much assessment and too much. I just like getting out there and, you know, getting it moving, like we talked about before. You know that was a really, really enjoyable part of my life.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I mean, you don't have to, old mate, you can jump back in there, you can come and no, that's not right.
Speaker 1:Well, what's your? Do you have a five-year plan? Now I'm looking at and I've just said it's beyond me. I was helping Brisbane State high out last year in the rugby union with Todai Kefu, Stevie Kefu and I've agreed to go back and help them again for the next season and we've been discussing it. I don't know if it's going to come off, but to go in and do a day's relief teaching on the days. I go in and do the coaching in the afternoon, not only to pick up a bit of money but to make my day a bit more worthwhile. So I don't know whether I'm going to go through with it or not, but that's my plan the next couple of years. But that plus keep doing my consulting work and I'll gradually not do any work at all, I think, and just spend my days doing a bit of fishing and maybe a bit of surfing and swimming.
Speaker 1:I've got a house down the beach in northern New South Wales. I take people down there and setting it up as a B&B and having people come down and train and that, but just enjoying myself. You know I like still overseas travelling. So I've got a big trip. Next year I'm going to have a big one in 26, because a lot of my mates, believe it or not, they don't want to travel anymore because they can't walk too far and they can't get on and off buses and stuff. And I still like to get over there and rent a car and drive and look around the place.
Speaker 1:But yeah, so that's my plan mate, living life. Well, you know, I'm fortunate. You know I can blend myself into retirement instead of stopping, which I think a lot of people make the mistake. But also, whilst I'm working, I'm not working because I have to. I work because I want to, and that part of it I really because I enjoy it. I'd hate to be doing a job, a menial job, that you didn't enjoy and you had to turn up for work because you needed the money still to put in your superannuation or whatever. I'm doing it more for the fact that I enjoy working, but that's my plan mate. Whether it comes off, I don't know. I I enjoy working, but that's my plan mate. Whether it comes off, I don't know. I don't know about the teaching it looks a bit hard.
Speaker 2:Come in for a day, mate. We'll look after you there, no worries. We'll put our kids to their paces. All right, mungo. Have a bit of a few little fun questions for you. If that's all right to round up, yep, appreciate all that knowledge Is. Is there anything else that I sort of miss, that you want to add value to that I want to talk about with movement, or strength and conditioning.
Speaker 1:I've touched on a lot of it. Again, my advice is for strength and conditioning coaches and for people involved in fitness programs don't take shortcuts. Follow strict guidelines and principles. There's no benefit by going away from those guidelines. There's plenty of ways to do things.
Speaker 1:I'm not saying don't be adventurous and try other ways of doing stuff, but if you follow sound scientific guidelines with your training, you can't go wrong. But the other thing is, if you want a benefit out of it, you've got to prepare, to put some work in. You can't just go and look at a heart rate monitor and think you're going to get fitter or whatever, or stronger. You've got to actually do it. And the more time that you have in between when you don't do it, you just lose what you've put in.
Speaker 1:And so you know, get yourself a, get yourself a plan, get yourself a program that's well prepared, uh, with an end goal. Because, uh, I I still haven't seen anybody that hasn't achieved, uh, high standard of high standard of sport or high standard of fitness, that hasn't worked hard and had a good plan. But that would be, that would be, my advice if I had to give any. Yeah, I like that. That's awesome. It's awesome, mate. Nuggets of gold everywhere. So thank you hard and had a good plan, but that would be my advice if I had to give any.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I like that. That's awesome. That's awesome, mate. Nuggets of gold everywhere. So thank you. Now I'm not going to let you off the hook too easy here. This is some really serious, hard-hitting questions. Are you ready for these? These are going to be quick answers for these ones.
Speaker 1:Thank you though. Favorite food Probably Italian.
Speaker 2:What would be your favourite drink?
Speaker 1:Red wine.
Speaker 2:Favourite song or song type.
Speaker 1:My favourite song is MacArthur Park. A lot of young people would never have heard of it, but I've always loved that song. It's an old song but it's fantastic and that and King of the Road Okay.
Speaker 2:Did you want to sing it right now?
Speaker 1:No, I sang it Whenever I get karaoke not very often, but every five years. It's the only one I ever sing. King of the Road by Roger Miller.
Speaker 2:All right Beautiful, steve's favourite leisure time activity.
Speaker 1:Probably training.
Speaker 2:Okay, what about your favourite sport?
Speaker 1:Look, I'd have to say rugby union only because I played it. More than a rugby league, I sit and watch any sport, as long as it's good quality and it's enjoyable. I watch the netball, I watch baseball, I watch American football. I watch the whole lot, but I'd say rugby union only because I played baseball. I watch American football, I watch the whole lot, but I'd say rugby union only because I play there. I like watching surf carnivals, I like everything, everything I've been involved in, but yeah, all right, nice.
Speaker 2:What about? Do you have a favorite holiday? You said you like traveling a fair bit. Do you have a favorite holiday destination or place in the world?
Speaker 1:Well, in Australia we've got a house down in a little village called Red Rock down in northern New South Wales. 150 people live there. I've got a house there. That's the destination I used to go to for myself and my family and the extended family. But overseas I'm a bit of a Francophile. I like going back to France. I like going back to the southern part of France. I lived there for three years. I can speak reasonable French and I really enjoy it. But I like Italy, I like Spain or Portugal, but yeah, they've been my favourites.
Speaker 2:Okay, what about now? You've had a couple through the podcast. Have you got a favourite saying or slogan?
Speaker 1:Yeah, the one I like. If you do the same thing today as you did yesterday, you'll wake up exactly the same tomorrow, and so challenge yourself a little bit today with something you know. For me it's computing skills. I mean I'm hopeless on the computer. I still am and I still work on it. I mean I'm literate, but I'm not very literate and I like to learn different. Guys showing me something different today, and I like to learn different. God has shown me something different today and I like to learn about it instead of getting someone to do it, but do something a little bit better or a little bit harder, so you learn something each day, and that's my favorite.
Speaker 2:That's good. Look, we talked about some of the athletes you've seen and you know. You talked about the power and the strength they've had. But have you had a favourite athlete or a team you've worked with?
Speaker 1:I have to say the Wallabies. But that would be closely followed by the Broncos. If it was followed by them they'd be on par. But the Wallabies, we were very successful. Mate McQueen had an 81% success rate. That's nuts and for a Australian rugby coach that's unheard of these days before or after. And we just had a great time. We just had a really fulfilling time when I was there. But you know, I say the same thing about the Bronx. We had good times too. We had good times at the Cowboys. Just we weren't very successful when I was there. You know, the success came later. But yeah, I'd say the Wallabies Okay.
Speaker 2:Do you have a favourite go-to exercise?
Speaker 1:Well, I'm big on glute work, on control work, lower abs and glutes. But later on in life, like now, I'm very big on flexibility work, because I'm not very flexible and I now bring flexibility work into my training regime daily. Okay, and it's made a difference just in the last couple of years. I'm not a flexible person anyway, but it's helped a hell of a lot. It aches and pains.
Speaker 2:That's awesome, all right. All right, here's our next segment. This is called Word Association. So I'm going to give you one word and you have to give me one word back that's associated with that word. Okay, I feel like I'm a teacher now here. All right, here we go, coffee.
Speaker 1:Sorry, say that again.
Speaker 2:Coffee, coffee.
Speaker 1:Coffee.
Speaker 2:Coffee is in the morning. You drink coffee.
Speaker 1:Coffee tea.
Speaker 2:All right.
Speaker 1:A cold beer. A cold beer Refreshing, early morning starts.
Speaker 2:Hard Lazy trainers Disappointing.
Speaker 1:Social media, beappointing Social media. Be careful. Music Very important the NRL Dolphins.
Speaker 2:Good team. Queensland Maroons Good team.
Speaker 1:I was going to say you're a blues man, aren't you? No, not really. I've. Really. I've lived in queensland longer than I've lived in new south wales and I've having all the boys playing for. You know, we had, we had 10 blokes one year playing for queensland out of the broncos. It was pretty hard to barrack for the other team and Alf and Kevian they're there. Queensland have played above their weight. I don't care what anyone says they have in the past, it's caught up in them a little bit, but those years they had the best team by far.
Speaker 2:They won't. I thought I was thinking some blues. I was trying to irk you up a bit, that's all right. Good answer, all right. We've just got a last statement here.
Speaker 1:So if you're down to your last 20 bucks, Steve, what are you doing with it Last 20 bucks? I'd probably call a few people that I haven't spoken to for a while that meant a bit to me and be in contact with them. If it was the last $20 and I was going to disappear, that would be what I'd do. Yeah, probably the last $20. I'd make sure I bought some nice wine and some nice food to eat and drink. Wouldn't get you much these days.
Speaker 2:All right. What if you've just inherited $5 million? What do you do with the money?
Speaker 1:We were talking about that the other day. If I just got a million bucks and five million, I probably don't need it now. I'd like to disperse it amongst family and probably do a few things, but nothing special. I'm not money-driven. You've got to have it. I know you've got to have it, but I'm not. I'd help the kids out and the grandkids out, pay some school fees and stuff like that, which are pretty hard these days. But no, I don't really know. I'd probably travel a bit more business class when I go overseas and try to do a bit of beach.
Speaker 2:Nice, all right. What if you were down to your last meal? What would it be?
Speaker 1:Look, I would think a barbecue. I used to eat a lot of steak. I don't eat steak as much, but a nice barbecue chicken or barbecue pork or a nice steak, whatever's there, and some vegetables, that'll do me Okay.
Speaker 2:Would you prefer one wish now or three wishes in five years' time?
Speaker 1:Probably three and five.
Speaker 2:You know what you'd wish for.
Speaker 1:I think to maintain health, that would be the biggest one. Maintain, you know, family health, not just myself, everybody, and probably, you know, being able to go out with a bang and not a whimper, you know. I don't want to end up in a hurtful game. I want to keep my health as long as I possibly can and so that when I finish my career and life I'm still doing stuff I really want to do. That would be my greatest wish, I reckon.
Speaker 2:Yeah, nice, all right. This is like I always get funny responses to this one, so I'm looking forward to your answer here. If you're stuck on a deserted island and you only have three other people with you and they can't be your family members, who are they and why?
Speaker 1:Deserted island Jeez.
Speaker 2:I must admit.
Speaker 1:I've had some crackers here.
Speaker 2:I've actually had one person say I'd only invite two because there's a chance of us having more food and we'll live longer, but anyone known past you don't know who's the three people and why.
Speaker 1:Well, I was always really impressed by Nelson Mandela A lot of people say that and I was like we were actually supposed to meet him on one of our tours and he was sick so we couldn't. We were supposed to go and have either lunch or morning tea or whatever with him. I'd like to spend some time with him. I admire, you know, famous sporting people, Don Bradman, I'd just like to see. He's a bit of a conflicting character and probably someone in the movie world, probably someone like I used to always watch Charles Bronson movies when I was a kid, yeah.
Speaker 1:Maybe someone like that would be a good company to see what made them tick. But yeah, they'd be my three at this stage.
Speaker 2:Yeah, all the Death Wish movies and that kind of stuff you talk about, yeah, yeah, I remember those, I would manage to watch them too. All right, here's your last question. It's a bit of a deeper, meaningful one, but we'll round it up with this one. If I said to you now, what does Steve Nance see when he looks in the mirror? I'm not talking about physically.
Speaker 1:As a man. What does Steve Nance see? Probably, if I had to sum it up, you know I've had a good person, a caring person, a person who helps other people I'd say that would be one thing. Probably didn't reach my full potential as a sporting person, but yeah, I'd be pretty happy, you know, looking in the mirror and saying, you know, you've done a lot of things. You don't realise you've done so many things until you actually sit down and talk about them. But I'd be pretty happy with my life. I'm pretty happy with my family and stuff and I'm pretty happy. I'm very happy and I've got, you know, three kids, a good wife, eight grandkids. I'm really. I look in the mirror and think, you know, I'm part of that and we're not rich but we've got enough money to do things and stuff and we're all pretty healthy. So that would be the thing I'd be looking at and saying, yeah, that's me in the mirror.
Speaker 2:Yeah, unreal. Well, look, mate, it's just been a pleasure and I'm so grateful to get so much time. Look, I've probably only met you probably half a dozen times, but I know every time we went to you know a couple of days, we did our fitness course with you and around the sports academies and I was always in awe, just feeding off your knowledge, just loving to be in your space and I just think those people you're around from the sporting teams earlier on and no doubt you work with lots of individuals as well and mentoring teachers in your consultancy and, look, I just think you've made the world a better place, mate, and people are definitely drawn to what you're doing. So, well done to you and, like I said, thank you for being on the podcast and sharing all your wisdom today.
Speaker 1:Thanks very much, gary. I enjoyed it. Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you.