.jpg)
gwunspoken
We know that now more than ever, there is a growing disconnection between parents and their teens, corporates and their employees, and human interactions in general.
This can cause stress, frustration and many arguments within families and the work environment.
gwunspoken looks at the challenges people of all ages have in their relationships with one another and provides experience and advice, allowing all parties to have a voice.... and feel heard.
Join us to hear corporates, parents, educators, teens and the latest advice of how we can in fact live the life we love, in making authentic interactions, because we know... authentic connection is everything.
gwunspoken
Turning the Tables: A Candid Journey of Fatherhood, Identity, and Resilience
What happens when the teacher becomes the student, the interviewer becomes the interviewed? Join us for a special edition of gwunspoken where Nigal DeMaria steps in to turn the tables on our regular host, Garry. Candid insights and heartfelt stories unfold as Garry opens up about balancing fatherhood and professional commitments while his wife is away. His journey doesn't stop there—Garry shares his dreams of launching his own business and the unwavering tenacity that keeps him moving forward. The episode takes a reflective turn, exploring the profound impact of educators in shaping not just minds, but character.
This installment offers more than just personal anecdotes; it's a thoughtful exploration of themes like personal growth, self-awareness, and the evolving landscape of modern masculinity. Garry discusses understanding love languages and personality traits as tools for personal development and touches on the importance of trauma-informed practices in education. We navigate the complexities of identity as Garry shares his experiences marrying into a First Nations family, offering unique perspectives on cultural awareness and the ongoing journey toward understanding.
As we wrap up this engaging conversation, expect a heartfelt discourse on life’s deeper meanings. Garry and Nigal reflect on creating genuine connections in a tech-saturated world and the legacy one hopes to leave behind. Humour and gratitude pepper the conversation, from contemplating the effects of political correctness to what one might do with only $20. Throughout, this episode promises to be both thought-provoking and deeply personal, inviting listeners to ponder along with us.
www.in8code.com
Welcome to another edition of GW Unspoken, where we discuss stuff we don't typically talk about but probably should. And I've got my Nigel DiMaria back, maria back, and what's happening here, mate, this is making me really nervous. Today. This is a first on GW Unspoken what's happening here?
Speaker 3:So we're flipping the switch or the. What do we say? We're flipping the switch, we're flipping the coin, we're changing it all up for Gary tonight. Gary, you're now going to be sitting in the chair where I'll be interviewing you.
Speaker 2:I'm actually sitting opposite. You've taken mic one, you've taken over control. You look like you're pretty happy over there. I'm loving this.
Speaker 3:I'm loving this, Like you know the old principle in me is coming back, like I'm in the big high chair sitting back with the curved desk.
Speaker 2:I'm in power. I feel like a psychologist. I've got no idea what you've written on that sheet.
Speaker 3:I've got some good ones here. I had your daughters have a look at them tonight. They've highlighted one that they want me to ask that they reckon you're going to really struggle with.
Speaker 2:That's great. That's really comforting. Thank you.
Speaker 3:But, gary, you've been doing how many of these podcasts do you think?
Speaker 2:you've done now, where you've interviewed people. What are you up to? Last year we did one per week. Yep, I can probably around 50 guests now 50 guest speakers yeah, okay, great, all right, let's start with some basics. Yes, go.
Speaker 3:Let's start with the format that you started, because I've copied you a bit here.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 3:Mate, tell us how you're going. One to five.
Speaker 2:One to five.
Speaker 3:And tell us why.
Speaker 2:I'm probably four at the moment.
Speaker 3:Four. Four hang on, tell the listeners who Rachel is. Rachel's my wife, yeah.
Speaker 2:She's over in Canberra doing some good work out there and yeah, I'm with the girls, but I enjoy being a father. That's just sort of making sure I get everything done. I haven't forgotten a girl and got the dinners ready and taken them to the right places and that kind of stuff.
Speaker 3:Oh mate, sometimes it can be like herding cats, can't it? Yes, it can. Yeah, you're juggling like 18 balls and you've lost 16. You're thinking what am I going to do? Where am I next?
Speaker 2:Yeah, and you don't actually get the same thing every single day, so they probably think that with an old man too, that's okay. Mate, what would put you up to a five? I think? Having my own time in creating this business, yeah, that would be it. Okay, pick and choosing.
Speaker 3:Well, we're going to get into that tonight as well?
Speaker 2:Are we To see where you want to head? Ooh yeah, I'm really interested. This is yeah, right.
Speaker 3:Yeah, thanks. So another thing, mate what are you thankful for? And don't give me the standard bullshit answer oh, I'm thankful the sun rose.
Speaker 2:I'm thankful that I've got my family. What's, gary, thankful?
Speaker 3:for today. I'm thankful for my personal resilience. Okay, is that okay? No, that's crap.
Speaker 2:Oh, I'm a three now.
Speaker 3:Let's open up a bit more. What do you mean about your personal resilience?
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 3:Why are you thankful for that today?
Speaker 2:I think that, no matter what's happening in life, I still have that tenacity to keep going and I'm not going to stop. I that, no matter what's happening in life, I still have that tenacity to keep going and I'm not going to stop. I'm not going to stop for anybody, and nothing's going to actually get in my way of achieving what I'm going to do or get through a day, no matter how hard it is.
Speaker 3:And did something happen today where that personal resilience sort of kicked in and you went. You're able to go. I'm glad I've got that.
Speaker 2:Today was a bit different. There was a few little things came up today. There's a few little things came up today.
Speaker 3:Yeah, probably work-wise it did. Do you want to share one of them with us?
Speaker 2:Probably just a way of seeing a couple of staff members working with kids. I could overhear that in corridors and out in the playground. So it sort of frustrates me after sort of literature and research around stuff and wondering if different ways could connect with kids.
Speaker 3:So people are probably sitting here going. We don't understand what you're doing. Listening to staff in corridors. What do you actually do? What's your?
Speaker 2:job. Yes, I'm a teacher at the moment, so I've been teaching for 26 years. I've run my own business in sport with my wife and also in an alternate school arrangement, but in the wellbeing space. So teach health, teach PE, sport and rec. Life skills class are designed with a past deputy and I look after the student engagement and well-being as well.
Speaker 3:Okay, is it an informal kind of role you've got, like you've got a little classroom teaching load, or are you more in the administration, the leadership road? What is your job actually comprised of?
Speaker 2:Yep, so half-time teaching, half-time working in a Middle Eastern role.
Speaker 3:Okay, now you're hearing staff talk to kids today. I'm assuming you're hearing them talk probably negatively authoritarian-like, et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 2:Authoritarian yep.
Speaker 3:Yep, yep, yep. It's funny you say that because the first thing I thought about was an internal conversation I was having with myself today was how horrible I've heard staff talk to kids over the years Like you know now. Why did you do that? You need to know better. I don't understand you. You don't understand what you're doing. This is absolutely wrong. The question I always ask is would a teacher or a staff member accept that from their principal if they were spoken to like that. What are your thoughts on that?
Speaker 2:I think they'll be straight in for grievances. I think they'll be pointing out the loophole of calling the union up. Yeah, yeah, I don't think it would be taken well at all, and I think the problem is too that you know if you've. The worst thing about the teaching profession, I find, is that when teachers get together, all they talk about is school, and so if you ever go out for dinner and stuff and you're with people or your partners who aren't teachers, it's very obvious. Yeah.
Speaker 2:And it's a profession where your job is to judge, and so I don't know whether, when you think about it, I don't know if it's a really healthy thing to do in real life. Like, does it impact you in real life? I wonder that question.
Speaker 3:It's interesting when you say that when teachers go out socially, I can pick a group of teachers at a table, restaurant, pub, at a coffee shop so easily because they look the same, talk the same, they've got the same mannerisms and typically the conversation is still the same.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, and not all teachers Like on teachers. There's some really great teachers out there too, but, yeah, there's some teachers who probably need to do a little professional reading, I think. Okay, be supported to be a little professional reading, I think.
Speaker 3:Okay, be supported to be a bit more strength-based, if we can put it that way. I think so.
Speaker 2:I mean in our world now we talk about positive psychology and restoration and restorative practices and things like that. But I don't know. A lot of people still want revenge. They want to be right, they want to get consequences. They want consequences now and if it's not enough, punitive consequences, then I want more justice, but doesn't that work, you know?
Speaker 3:doesn't that work for kids, teachers and the like, please, you know the answer to this question.
Speaker 2:You know the answer to this question.
Speaker 3:It depends. I want to hear your answer. Oh look, I want to hear what's Gary's position on this Attachment relationships.
Speaker 2:Okay, you give me the the smartest teacher in the world and they can't build relationships, they might as well not teach. Okay, and I'm passionate about that point. I'm telling you now, if you're a parent out there listening, if you're a ceo, you're in charge of a company working with staff, even if you're, if you're a staff member working with other staff yeah build a rapport, build a relationship, think of others, and it'll work. I guarantee it'll work.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's not easy, but it'll work so let's wind back a bit, because we're jumping forward and back here, and that's what this is going to be like tonight, because if you and I are doing things the way I think we do things, our minds kind of work in four different spaces at once. Tell me about your family, your current family here with Rach.
Speaker 2:Okay, yeah, so we have five kids between us. Yeah, five, Five kids. I thought it was only four. No, four is what you see, so five. We've got Decky, who's 22 this year, yeah, right. So he's out at Canberra studying international business and law and he's very switched on young lad, Good leadership qualities.
Speaker 3:So he was your first.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he was Rach's first.
Speaker 3:Oh, Rach's first. Okay, gotcha.
Speaker 2:And then, when we got together, she had two girls and I had two girls in very similar ages, because what the audience might not know is Rachel is your second wife. That's right. So she's second wife. But yeah, it's full on, it's busy, but I love it. Yeah, great.
Speaker 2:Yeah, people actually say to me what are you into footy and that kind of stuff, like do you wish you would have had the boy? I see Decky when he comes back so we kick the footy around and have those male bonding moments. But the girls love going to footy, the girls love wrestling around the mud, they love going camping. So, good, yeah, I wouldn't change it.
Speaker 3:It's so interesting. I've got two girls, georgia and Abby. Georgia's eight, abby's ten or about two. If I asked them what their ages are, they'd say nine and three quarters seven and three quarters.
Speaker 3:It's got to be really precise it what their ages are. They'd say nine and three quarters, seven and three quarters. It's got to be really precise, it's got to be running up. Yeah, but I was always really worried about having girls. How am I going to dad girls? Because I grew up on a farm, grew up with brothers, went to an all-boys school and I would say the best thing about having girls is that it softened my heart. Yeah. And it made me become. It taught me how to become aware of myself and other people.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was so interesting, it was so beautiful. It is good, isn't it? It's awesome, it's awesome.
Speaker 3:So what's something you once strongly believed in but since now have changed your mind about?
Speaker 2:Ooh, you are getting in there, aren't you? I was actually trying to find it hard to sit on the side of the table with a control freak. Maybe it's about being a control freak, I think. Before I started doing a lot of work around emotional intelligence, I thought my way was the only way, and if people weren't following that way, then why are they so lazy? Like, if you've got something to do, you just get done. So what are you doing? Why are you waiting so long? And then read those books. Like you know, the five love images and personality plus and skills with people is a big one, and I just think it changed me. It was like, oh my gosh, you've been arrogant all these years. You've got a lot of work to do on yourself.
Speaker 3:Do you reckon you could have burned some bridges in relationships by having that attitude?
Speaker 2:100%, 100%. Look back now and think, like, especially with kids, like when I worked for a neuroscience mob called Stronger Brains and I learned so much from them. I'm really grateful for that opportunity.
Speaker 3:Was this the mob that did a bit of stuff around trauma-informed practice too? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:That's right. So going into schools and I was mentoring staff and students and learning on the run, but it was unbelievable. Where you know, I used to have a control freak sort of nature, nigel, where people would. If kids were seeing the unquietly and they were looking and they looked attentive, then they were great. So, for example, a student would get out of their place. Well, a student would get out of their place grade nine student, we're doing a theory lesson. They get up and they walk away to sharpen their pencil. I'm like what are you doing? What are you doing? I'm just sharpening my pencil. I said who gave you permission for that? No one gave you permission to get out of your chair. Come and sit back down, you can do whatever you want here, and then I'd leave that classroom going. Gary, you do realize that one in four, one in five people have these high ACE scores where they actually have trauma in their life.
Speaker 3:Do you want to tell the audience what ACEs is?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so the Adverse Childhood Experience. So basically there's a test they did with over 1,000 people I think it was white, anglo-saxon people in America middle age, I believe and what they did? They did a test and the test was either 8 out of 8 or 10 and basically every time there was a traumatic experience you get a point, and what they found out was that it's not unrealistic for people to have points and my girls have got a point because they've been through a divorce family that's one. If you've experienced violence, a death in the family, they add up to points, and so points are not uncommon. But what they're saying is that one in four kids in your class a very high chance are that there's four or five students who have an A score of four or five. Wow, which means that they are more chances of having heart disease, lung cancer, all these stress-related responses from their fight and flight and freeze response the adrenals, even if they don't drink or don't smoke. Okay.
Speaker 2:And so I'm just scared the crap out of these kids by being an authoritative and saying you will do as I say, because I'm a control freak and I think that this is a good class. They'll probably crap on themselves because they probably had people at home who might have been hitting them and acting the same way.
Speaker 3:It's a real scary thing, isn't it Like, when you think about the position people like yourself and I have been in being an ex-teacher myself is that we can effectively make or break the character of a young person by being completely insensitive to who they actually are, but first not even trying to figure out who they are.
Speaker 2:That's right. That's right, yeah. And I think, just reflecting on those conversations today, I understand, for some of the conversations I heard today, I would have been the same if I didn't have that education. And I think I still struggle, I still fail, I'm still learning. I don't think I'm the best out there, yep, but there's definitely ways where you can shape or break a kid.
Speaker 3:So that actually leads me to my next question. I want to ask you Okay, If you could fully understand one thing about yourself, what self? What would it be?
Speaker 2:These are hard questions. I like these questions If I could fully understand myself.
Speaker 3:One thing about yourself. So give you an example. I was speaking to my partner and I was running these questions through with her, and I said to her if you could understand one thing about yourself, what would it be? And she just said why I'm always late. I don't understand why I'm always late. She goes sometimes. I'll come and meet you in order for a coffee and you're five minutes down the road, but I'll be 15 minutes late.
Speaker 2:Yeah right.
Speaker 3:So, as an example, what would you like to understand?
Speaker 2:I think I'd like to understand why I have to always be on.
Speaker 3:What does on?
Speaker 2:mean no resting, no relaxation. I mean I can chill and watch the cricket on the holidays, but I'll feel guilty, I'll be sitting around too much. Okay, so I need to be on. I need to be working hard. I need to get up at 4.30, work on this business. I've got to go to school. Do my best, I've got to be on.
Speaker 3:So what we've slowly established about you you're a control freak who's always on. Jeez, I'm like, I'm still Wow we need to get the couch out.
Speaker 2:We need to start charging for this session. Conversations on the couch. I have the couch in my little parcel, my office room. I call it Conversation on the Couch. So they'll come in have a seat. Conversation on the Couch. Let's go.
Speaker 3:What is this for kids who are struggling?
Speaker 2:they come in in the arm with you.
Speaker 3:Yeah, excellent. Is it kind of like a bit of an open door. They just wander Some email me.
Speaker 2:Some will actually see me in the morning. Often I'll try and bring them with a friend so they feel more comfortable, not just one-on-one. I don't want them feeling intimidated. Door's open, obviously, but yeah.
Speaker 3:So here's another question for you Are you the stereotype teacher?
Speaker 2:Absolutely not. Why? What sets you?
Speaker 3:apart, not in a good way, not in a bad way, because we're not here to bag teachers and bag teaching professions, because you know, like everywhere, there's the good ones, there's the bad ones. But what sets you apart from not being the typical teacher that you? Well, if you're like me, I have a sense of pride that I was never the typical teacher. I liked being a bit different than Norm. What were the things that made you? That make you different?
Speaker 2:I think again, it's relationships first. So no matter what happens and if someone's struggling, I'll find out. You know, I can still lose it, I can still say I get outside too loud and I'll go oh, I just jumped too fast and like he's probably had a bad morning or she's probably had a bad morning. So I think I usually put the kids first, no matter what. It's not about a power over at all, okay. No matter what. It's not about a power over at all, okay, okay. But that is frowned upon in the profession, I feel. I feel like and I'm going to be very careful here still being employed as a teacher, but I feel like there may be some people out there thinking that I might be soft or lenient or whatever, which I'm actually not, by the rules, kids do pretty well under my guidance, but yes, I guess I can always ask the question is what are you going to be remembered for?
Speaker 3:as a teacher you remember for being that teacher. Like when people think back and they go oh yeah, I remember Mr Woodford. I remember Mr Woodford. He was really good. He always sat down and listened to me, or they're going to remember you as I remember Mr Woodford. He wasn't always the oldest, he didn't give us any, any relaxation whatsoever, was always hard on us. It's kind of like what memory do you want to be remembered for?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I think all of us kindness, friendship, well, not friendship, you know what I mean. Like building rapport.
Speaker 3:Yeah, friendly, but not friends.
Speaker 2:That's right yeah 100%.
Speaker 3:Hey, let's wind back to Rach. Yep, where did you meet Rach?
Speaker 2:I met her when we had us. Well, she was starting a sports business and came into the school, and so she was looking for a rugby league coordinator to run a program called League. Tech Okay. And so it looked too good to be true. I was very sceptical.
Speaker 3:Sorry, sorry. League Tech looked too good to be true or Rachel looked too good to be true. Both yeah both.
Speaker 2:Yeah, she was switched on new issues going bubbly personality and yeah, I was just like I don't know about this, so I went and saw her again. In the city it was pouring down rain. It was like four hours drive getting home because it was flooded.
Speaker 3:More interested in seeing her or more interested in finding out more about the program?
Speaker 2:Both, both, both, yeah, yeah both.
Speaker 3:Does she know that?
Speaker 2:I think so. Yeah, yeah, I think. So I'm pretty open to that stuff. Yeah, I'm a pretty emotional guy, so we often talk about stuff like that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, great, yeah, yeah, but it was different. It was completely different. And then, where did it go from there?
Speaker 2:Did you ask her out or did she ask you out? No, it was sort of mutual. And I found out she was like on the same page with the direction she was going to go and like always in for people, always out for an adventure, that kind of stuff.
Speaker 3:So I was like yeah, tell me about your girls.
Speaker 2:Well, they are 13 this year and turning 15 this year. When is this year? Love them to death. They are redhead and a blonde, and so you used to call them Elsa and Anna growing up and they used to be really cool, but now it's not cool because it's not funny at all, dad, no, so.
Speaker 3:Not until they bring out the real life motion picture action version.
Speaker 2:Then they can go for it and they'll get the role straight away. Like we'd go through Kmart, for example, when Frozen 2 was going nuts and I'd stay, and we'd go past like Frozen little merchandise and I'd say, hey, you two, stop there, stop, hang on, I can't even tell the difference Shut up.
Speaker 3:Did the song Frozen get played? Oh my gosh, Let it go. What it was called Frozen Books, Frozen everything.
Speaker 2:Mine, too, Frozen everything. So yeah, so they love my life, do anything for them. Still want to build them through resilience, so I give them everything. So why?
Speaker 3:are you a good dad? Because you strike me as a good dad. I saw you tonight with your interactions and there's probably been some tricky stuff for teenagers and I saw the way you're handling it and the calm manner, but also I saw a real sweet connection.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:Tell me why you're a good dad.
Speaker 2:I think I real sweet connection. Yeah, yeah, tell me why you're a good dad. I think I give them time. I think when we do our love language test at school, a little quiz with our year sevens and eights the license class 80% of the response is quality time and I think a lot of people are missing out on that, whether it's because they're working so hard and there's two incomes or a split family and people trying to make ends meet. I think I give them quality time. I think I give them empathy and try and think what it's like, you know, from their perspective.
Speaker 3:So when you're sitting down with the girls and I'm sure you've probably had something like this happen how do you define success?
Speaker 2:With the girls.
Speaker 2:Yeah, or how would you? I'm going to go back to John C Maxwell here and talk about failing forward. I think a lot of times these days our kids don't allow them to fail, and I'm not saying being strict or harsh or not nurturing or guiding I love that word, guiding but I think at the moment we just try and move the helicopter parents or whatever bulldozer parents they call. Now I think we've got to let them fail and get through, break through that resilience wall and achieve success, and then they can keep going forward.
Speaker 3:Did you ever struggle with trying to do too much, trying to protect them from the big, bad world and become that helicopter parent? Or were you pretty good at keeping yourself on track with that, teaching them resilience, failing forward? Keep the effort up, keep trying, it's okay.
Speaker 2:I think there's still times I reflect and go. I didn't do that too well and I'm happy to go and tell the girls too, like your dad really probably failed you on that thing, like I'm happy to own that when they were young I did. I was very protective when they were young, especially winter when she was young, I was always. You know, if she was crying too much with their nan or something, I'd just give it to her. I know how to fix it. Just give me, I'll do it.
Speaker 3:That's a protective ad coming.
Speaker 2:Yeah, maybe, maybe I just think, because I probably went a bit overboard there, but that was there.
Speaker 3:It's hard, it's very hard not to Like. I'll say to people I am definitely wrapped around my little girl, my girl's little thing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah Like 100%.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and it's very hard for me to say no to them. Yeah, and I struggle to do that. But it's also that protectiveness. Sometimes you just want to wrap them up, but then sometimes you want to go hey, if they fall forward here or fail forward here, that's okay. Yeah, what's the worst thing? That's going to happen. I often say to them is it blood or vomit? Yeah, and they'll go. Neither I go. Well, we're going to be okay.
Speaker 2:That's right.
Speaker 3:It reminds me of another time I was doing parent-teacher interviews You'd probably love parent-teacher interviews as much as I do. They're fantastic moments and I walked into the classroom, I'm sitting down and the teacher had all the stuff ready to go on Abby, and she's about to start taking me through it. And I said, oh, I'm not really interested in any of that. And she goes. What I said can you just tell me, is she trying her best, she happy, she got friends and she respectful? And the teacher goes oh yeah, she is, she's great. And I said, well, tell me about that. We went down that path.
Speaker 3:That was the stuff that was really nice to hear, that's nice.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think you get too nice or like maybe I'm a bit overboard here, but I'll know when I go to the girls' parent-teacher nights, know how they're going and you know what are some of the rules. And as soon as the teacher says, well, in my class, I just start saying, well, you're wrong. Yeah, 100%, it's actually your class. It's not your class, it's actually together. It's our class. Yeah, and these are my rules and this is how I want the kids to do.
Speaker 3:And this is how I'm sitting here listening to you about some pretty cool, I guess, philosophies and ways of being that you've got as a dad. You've got some great ideas and ways of being and actions that you do as a teacher. Um, I'm seeing a mismatch. Why are you still in education?
Speaker 2:it's that the theory of, and the listeners out there you'll you understand this, hopefully, if I say this properly, connect me properly. But they talk about the dog that sits on the pin and the dog will just sit there. You know they'll just put up with it. They'll put up with it because it's not too uncomfortable. But once that pin gets too sharp or the dog gets too old, it goes. I'm out of here.
Speaker 3:So am I hearing there's a shelf life on you and teaching.
Speaker 2:Yeah, definitely. I think this year's changed. I'm turning 50 this year. You know that Brené Brown thing sticks in my head all the time. That Rach sent to me. You know she's got to send me quotes when I need them. But that thing saying that you're 50 years old and part of my friends just say have you worked it out? Now Life's not going to fucking stop. What are you going to do now? And I just think I think getting back to your question a bit long with the answer, sorry, but it's that I love being with the kids. I love being with the staff, even though there's challenges there, I just love getting there and connecting with them and seeing them as like even a 13-year-old or 12-year-old to an 18-year-old and just hopefully being that little guide in their life if they don't have that. And I think it fills that cup and I love that. And I love teaching life skills. I love teaching PE. I still love it. I'm 50 years old, I still love it. Yep.
Speaker 2:It's got a shelf life this year.
Speaker 3:Okay, where are you going to go? What are you going to do?
Speaker 2:What does an ideal day look like for me in the future? Can I answer that way? I'm doing podcasts like this full time. I'm going around helping in the mental health space for and I don't mean that like flippantly, I mean whether it be blokes or women on a mine site out in the middle of Idaho, you know whether it's getting kids into a podcasting event they want to create. You know from a studio and do a barbecue program where they connect with me and they have a feed, and then you know, parents sign slips and they can come up and do what we're doing, open up, put their headphones on and they feel like they're the only person in the world and someone's listening to them. And then I can triage them into people who've got the proper credentials to help. I'm really passionate about to help teachers. After the experience I've done with now and also in neuroscience, I want to help teachers connect with their kids, because it's a hard profession out there. It's getting harder. I feel it's getting harder why.
Speaker 3:Why is it?
Speaker 2:getting harder. I think you know I'll ask this question to people who are seven-year-old teachers and I'll say, nah, it was actually harder for us, like it's actually easier for you than it was 20 years ago for us. But I don't think there's the same family dynamic anymore. I don't think there's the same connections, because technology has taken that over. We've got a lonely society who's addicted to phones and they don't have those true connections. I want to teach the skill set based on neuroscience and mentor people about that. I want them to. I can influence so many people, but if I can influence teachers, who can influence a multitude of people, I'll be happy.
Speaker 3:So what's your thoughts on the new policy that's sort of come in this year across a lot of schools, especially the state ed policy? Is that no phones at school? What do you think about that?
Speaker 2:It's like the no social media. It'll be. What did David Gillespie say If you're an alcoholic and you said no more alcohol and they had a glass cabinet with a padlock on it, what do you think would happen? They'll eventually find a way. So it's like it's any cheek. It's like if parents are working together or step parents are working together. As soon as there's a weak link, they'll find a way. So I think it's great what they're trying to do. I think it's awesome that we're supposed to do that. Is everybody doing that? Am I doing that? Am I putting my year 12s coming to class and they sneak a phone out and say, wait, that should be in the office. Am I seeing the office? Because I'm a middle leader, I should be doing that.
Speaker 3:It's interesting. I was at a school last year kind of north of here and um, not last year, the year before, and it was. They were talking about these pouches that could only be unlocked with a magnetic, unbreakable. Yeah, and, and the principal's up there talking about how wonderful, how supportive it's going to be and the kids won't be able to break into them. I jumped on youtube how to break into blah blah pouch. Within within 30 seconds, I already had the manual. Yeah, couple of kids are probably showing you how to do it.
Speaker 2:I think they're trying the right thing. It's costing our society. Our kids are growing up way too fast by the influence of social media. Even movies Singer-songwriters look at some of the lyrics. They're talking about mate. Our kids are being changed and people might say look, gary, old fuddy-duddy, that's how they connect these days. Yeah well, how's that going for you? I'm asking you out there, how's that going for you? Because if you're going to be their best friend, it's okay. See how that goes for you as well. Yeah, you know.
Speaker 3:So, gary, we're sort of going more into who you are as aer. You strike me as a quiet rebel in the education space I like that. Yeah, what's a part of your life. You think people misunderstand.
Speaker 2:Oh part of my life that people misunderstand. I reckon that I'd hate to think this about what people think, but I reckon it would be easy for people to see me and if I've got connections with kids think that I know everything. Okay. And I hope that's not the case, because I'm definitely the first person to own my mistakes or say I'm continuing learning about stuff.
Speaker 3:Have you ever been criticised for having good relationships with kids?
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 3:What does that look like?
Speaker 2:That criticism. Look, it's hard for me not to judge and think that's just a jealousy thing.
Speaker 3:Judge away. I'd be really interested to hear your honest thoughts, and I'd also wonder if I can ask you a question here. Is it hard sometimes to answer questions about your teaching and your working experience because you're still employed effectively A hundred percent?
Speaker 2:I'll be very careful how I answer some of these questions, obviously. What's the fear.
Speaker 2:I don't want to be unprofessional and I don't think I am unprofessional and there's got to be respect there, like in a day they're an employer of me, yeah, and I do respect my job and position I've got and I really appreciate the position I've got. Okay, but I don't. I'd love the thought that people think, oh, look at you know, nick name's Woody. Woody thinks he knows everything, but he's just been nice. The kids just like him because he's just been nice. He's actually not tying the line, okay, but you know, interview the students, see what they say.
Speaker 3:And what would they say?
Speaker 2:What would the students say about you? I think they'd say that it's really hard talking about yourself, isn't it? I think they'd say that he understands us, he connects with us, he has like an empathy towards how we're feeling or how we're at each day. Yeah, easygoing, happy to work for him. What I read recently about, if you do that with kids and build a really good relationship with them, that you can build the emotional currency, and so when you do need to pull them in line, they can walk past and say hey, come on boys shirt's in.
Speaker 2:Look, I have to have my shirt in. I've got flabs, you've got abs. At least you've got abs to show off through that shirt.
Speaker 3:A bit of joke, a bit of fun, and they'll do it and they'll be like get lost, sir.
Speaker 2:Or take the front end, walk 10 metres and take it off.
Speaker 3:Yeah, what's something you can actually hold your hand on hand, on heart, and go that you've built, either physically, emotionally, that you know will outlast you.
Speaker 2:I think with my children I'd say the man and father that I am. I think if something happened tomorrow they would understand. They would understand how much I was there for them and, no matter what, I was a great guide for them.
Speaker 3:So what's going to be your legacy?
Speaker 2:My legacy is to change the impact that authentic connections have been lost. So I'll rephrase that. We're going through a stage now where people get the next device. They're excited about the next lot of Nike shoes or especially the next iPhone 25.
Speaker 3:They line up 48 hours when the Apple shop. Suddenly they've got money.
Speaker 2:Suddenly, families have got money to buy these things, right? Yeah, I want to be a disruptor in that space. I want to be a disruptor in that space. Yeah, I want to be a disruptor. I want to go back to what we're doing tonight. I want to do authentic connections. I want to look belly to belly, chat about how we're feeling. Let's be vulnerable. Once we're vulnerable, we belong.
Speaker 3:We're part of a culture part of a group, all that stuff. Do you think you'll get there?
Speaker 2:Is that?
Speaker 3:your legacy, or is that the legacy you want to leave?
Speaker 2:That's the legacy I want to leave. Okay, and that'll be. I cannot do that alone. I can't do it alone. Okay, it's massive. It's massive to try and change around what we're doing right now. Okay.
Speaker 3:Is Gary where he wanted to be 15 years ago?
Speaker 2:15 years ago he would have said yes, when he decided to get over his arrogance and start reading and realising, holy hell, his way is not the only way and there's more to himself than himself out there and put others first. He'd be very frustrated and think what are you doing? That's what he'd be thinking. He'd thinking why? Like, teaching is still great, it's admirable.
Speaker 3:I still have a respect for profession, but, yeah, business earlier to create great different outcomes, yeah and it makes me think that I didn't ask you a question that probably should have started the study why teaching? Why did you end up in the teaching space? Because you're not a typical teacher. It's a bit embarrassing.
Speaker 2:My nana, who used to live in Chinchilla, my mum when I was a little tiny boy, like four years old. He'll either be a church minister or a teacher. Now I'm at a Catholic school and I own a church. Yeah, this is true.
Speaker 3:You have that beautiful space up at Mount Me, if anybody has not seen the church up at Mount.
Speaker 2:Me, it's just gorgeous, yeah.
Speaker 3:And it's a piece of history too, sorry, it's a beautiful piece of history. You've got your hands on there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, we often go up there and just camp out under the stars. And anyway, the reason why I became a teacher was, I remember, sitting down for my grade 10 interview you know a little set planning and rather than say how do you want to live your life when you're older, they asked this question what do you want to be when you're older? And that stuffed me up, because they should be asking the first question how do you want to live your life? Anyway, I said I think I want to be a teacher and the English head of department said anything else. But, to be honest, I love sport. I had some great mentor PE teachers and when I saw them rock up to school and they had their four-drive and their Oakleys on and their cap on and their surfboard, I went I want to be cool like that and I want to play sport all day with the kids and get paid for that. I'm in, I'm in.
Speaker 2:So, good, and that's all it was. It was that small thing where I think you know they say if you want to live your life, look at the person in your profession five or ten years down the track. That was probably lucky for me, yep, because I saw that and thought I wouldn't mind doing that fun sport. But when you get to about 50, you're like I'm reffing from halfway. So if it wasn't going to be teaching, I couldn't do it every single day. I couldn't do that every single day. I don't know, I don't know Honestly. No, it's a bit sad, isn't it? When you think you've been studying university since you were 18 and governed by bills and timetables all that time, it gives you that, really that employee mindset.
Speaker 3:So tell me about let's get to know a bit more about Gary with this next question your biggest fear. If it came true, what would it be? How do you think you'd handle?
Speaker 2:it, surrounded by snakes, would be number one yeah.
Speaker 3:Well, we're not going to be helping each other out at all. I'm like you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I'm up in the mountains too, so it's crazy, they're everywhere yeah. Sn.
Speaker 2:I'm up in the mountains too, so it's crazy. They're everywhere. Snakes, sharks you know I surf. That would freak me out seeing a shark, so those kind of things would scare me. The biggest fear I have right now that drives me every single day of getting up early to work is that I suddenly get a terminal injury or illness and I'm on my deathbed and I said I should have and it will just, it will grate on me. I'll go to my grave so regretful that I didn't have a crack and helping people to know I know if I get a good team we can make a difference. It sounds a cliche. It sounds really wanky. I know that, but I'll regret it.
Speaker 3:Well, it's interesting what you say, but it sounds like a cliche. They're cliches for reasons.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:You cliche. They're cliches for reasons. Yeah, you know they're good sayings that have been born out of some sort of experience that's been grounded, that is probably grounded in adversity and challenge.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's true, that's true. But yeah, I'd hate that, I'd hate to have regrets. I think that's why that little Brené Brown thing's on my mind at the moment.
Speaker 3:Okay, anything else you want to share about us before we kind of move into the I don't know the controversial fun part.
Speaker 2:I thought this was controversial. No, I appreciate this. I actually find it really hard to talk about myself. To be honest, I find it very, very awkward to be on this side, because even when we started the business, I was like you have to have your photo on Instagram. I said I don't want to do that. I want it to be about what we're about and it's not about me. And she's like no, you've got to, and so I've been struggling with that. So, no, mate, I just let's have another interview in six months' time and see where we go, because I think there'll be some big changes.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's exciting to hear, because what the listeners don't know is I've had the privilege of you know four or five times. You and I have got together and we solved the world's problems, so I get to hear some of the stuff you're dreaming about, some of the wheels in motion that are kind of starting to spin. It sounds bloody brilliant and it sounds so worthwhile what you're going to try and do.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and like an ideal day for me would be to take the podcasting studio, you know, make it out of a tiny home no one out there can steal this idea, by the way, copyright but you know, your little bathroom and one end and toilet and a little bed that folds up in the middle. You can have a little table and chairs and a few little drinks and that, so you can socialise, Then step up to the podcast and make it feel special up there and drive it around to schools and mines and sites and out west or wherever, and really connect with people and get them to open up and talk so that guest speaking about the stuff we're talking about tonight, do some online modules for people who maybe there's some parents out there who don't want to, you know say I'm struggling. They can click in and write some questions and ask some questions and we can get some experts to help them out.
Speaker 3:I'm like so looking forward to seeing where this goes. Hopefully we can do something together in this space. This would be pretty cool.
Speaker 2:I think it would be too yeah. Yeah, It'd be like on Good Cop, Bad Cop, but I don't know who'd be what.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's a tricky one, we could probably switch it out Like have you ever seen that scene out of the Other Guys with Will Ferrell?
Speaker 2:and Mark Wahlberg yes.
Speaker 3:Where he plays Good Cop, Bad Cop, but Will Ferrell thinks he means Bad Cop, Badder Cop. And then Will Ferrell just goes stupid, screaming and throwing himself across the table. I couldn't do that. Okay, let's go for some other things. Let's dig a bit more deeper into this stuff, mate, and I was about to say participate by choice on this, but I'm not going to let you. Current affairs and social affairs. Okay. What do you think about the Sam Kerr verdict from today?
Speaker 2:Okay, Again, this is going to be where the listeners think that I'm very naive and I'm maybe I don't know the word's, not intelligent, but not with it. But I actually don't really follow affairs. I don't follow the news. I don't follow any of those trends. The only thing I used to do was get the newspaper and look at the sports section. Don't follow it. Someone told me today about it and I said what are you talking about? What happened? And they told me. And then obviously everyone has their opinion, of course.
Speaker 3:So did you get a small opinion for yourself? Were you kind of like I don't know enough about it? It would be ignorant of me to put forward an opinion when I haven't really been delved into it too much.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I probably thought I need to think more about this because they gave me their biased opinion about what they thought. Okay, so it was like yeah. So yeah, I mean, everyone makes mistakes. Role model A lot of people join soccer or football because of her Natural leader, national leader, big mistake. If you go by, you know what I've heard today. Everyone deserves a second chance. No one's perfect. What do you? Think.
Speaker 3:I sit in two places with it. I was reading some information on the ABC today that spoke about what some of the high-profile lawyers over in London their comments were and theirs was about like this shouldn't have even made it to court.
Speaker 3:Yeah, right, this shouldn't have even been here. Like this is such a trivial matter. But then I come back to thinking of it from this thing If we flip the cards on this, flip the switch, what if it was a white man saying that to a black female police officer? You know what would be the what would be now? It's not a fair playing field, because we've got to talk about power and we've got to talk about prejudice when we talk about discrimination.
Speaker 2:And history, and history, and history, yeah, but it's pure essence.
Speaker 3:I kind of look at it like that, but then I kind of whack myself on the back of the head and go hang on, contextualise it. There's a lot more to it than that, I think. The thing I found probably most tricky about it, most of it, was seeing her say that. Yeah.
Speaker 3:You know the video recording of what she said and we won't delve into the reasons as to why or what was going on for her, but that I found really confronting. Yeah, and it also saddened me a lot too. Yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, so no, that's what I thought about it, yeah.
Speaker 2:Okay, yeah, do you like how I just put that back when you like that? Yeah, I did I. Okay, yeah, do you like how I just put that back when you like that? Yeah, I did I like the switcheroo. That was good. Yeah, yeah, 1-0.
Speaker 3:Well, let's switch it up with another section. Is Australia becoming too woke?
Speaker 2:What does woke mean?
Speaker 3:This is open for your own interpretation, Gary.
Speaker 2:Does that mean soft?
Speaker 3:It could be. Yeah, that's one way.
Speaker 2:That's one way some people would. This is actually the question your daughter said you'd struggle the most with Is Australia becoming too woke?
Speaker 3:Maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe. Why maybe?
Speaker 2:Is Australia becoming too woke?
Speaker 3:Like, let me give you an example. Would you feel comfortable to call me a greasy dago, because I'm Italian? No, no.
Speaker 2:Okay, okay, no, people get sued for everything around here. These days you can't speak your mind. I'm trying to be professional on this podcast.
Speaker 3:I know what you're trying to get at I'm going to keep chipping.
Speaker 2:Listeners are reading between the lines. Don't worry so if I don't have a job in a couple of weeks, it's all right.
Speaker 3:Well, we can do a shout-out to your principal after this. How wonderful. I actually have a lot of respect for him.
Speaker 2:That's fair? Oh look, I think yeah we are. Yeah, we are, everyone's getting sued, or you can't say anything for anybody. Everyone has opinions. They're always going to have opinions. We should be voicing our opinions. I don't know. At the end of the day, we judge people.
Speaker 3:So if we're judging people, which we all do to human nature, we just judge. What are your thoughts on this teacher down on the south side of Brisbane, Miss Purr, have you been?
Speaker 2:following this Was it Mr or Mrs Purr? Was it Mr?
Speaker 3:I'm not too sure actually.
Speaker 2:Someone was telling me about this again.
Speaker 3:I didn't hear about it, and someone told me that so the story goes that it's a state school down on the south side of Brisbane. I've been told it's Marsden State High School. That could be wrong. So hey, please keep the letters off me, solicitors that a teacher down there has cat ears, purrs, hisses, licks the back of her hands, carries on and says it and identifies as a cat in the classroom, how would as a parent? Let's take your educator hat off yeah go and let's put your parent hat on.
Speaker 2:Is this the unspoken bit where we say stuff we probably should, yeah or shouldn't. I wouldn't like it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, why wouldn't you like it?
Speaker 2:Because people can be part of a minority group and the issues of being part of a minority group this is, the issues for people in a minority group is that they become a group of people who are still minority and although they feel accepted and part of a group in that, they're still the minority. So I'm not saying it's wrong. I'm not saying that they are probably worse off. They're still going to be worse off in that minority. Do I want someone who goes? Why are children going to a school where the role model is portraying as a cat when I know they're biologically born as a human? The answer is no. I do not want my children influenced or around a person who is identifying as a cat.
Speaker 3:But if this person's a really beautiful, caring person.
Speaker 2:I still wouldn't like it. I still wouldn't like it and I don't know whether that's my biased opinion about how I grew up. Non-verbals are more important than verbals. Probably a great person, but I want them as a role model, as a teacher for my kids.
Speaker 3:no, and that's your right to be able to say that as a father. Yeah, yeah, 100%. So put your teaching hat on, or? Your leadership hat on. What's your opinion on it from a professional position?
Speaker 2:So if I was a colleague or a principal or they were working for me and they were part of a leadership team, I still wouldn't like it. I still don't think because, just because they're not my children in front of a teacher like who's I don't know, if I was a cat, I wouldn't not like that. That's the role model or shape that the children are exposed to. And look, I'll cop some flack for that, but I wouldn't like it. Maybe I need to move the times, I don't know.
Speaker 3:No, I don't think you do. I don't think you do. I think one of the most interesting things for me about the woke movement is that if you're not on board, then you are discriminating, you're insulting, you're offending and what tends to happen is that your own personal opinions and the respect of those gets lost.
Speaker 2:Yeah or questioned.
Speaker 3:And question doesn't get considered. Yeah, so you're kind of getting challenged or you're getting criticised for doing what they're doing.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:In reverse, and that to me just screams hypocrisy in some ways.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I mean I think like you want to be your authentic self, right, but even my authentic self to go to schools would be to be in board shorts and a T-shirt and stuff like that. Like I know it's probably completely opposite what we're talking about, like those extremes, but I still have to dress in a professional way to hold the reputation of the school. Exactly, in the profession of teaching, do I think someone who's identified as a cat appropriate as a leader for students? I'm not quite sure.
Speaker 3:Well, you said you weren't, you didn't think I wouldn't like my kids, I wouldn't like yeah, and I wouldn't like part of a leadership.
Speaker 2:In my perspective, if it was a school that I was working with or leading, I would not feel comfortable with other students as that person being a mentor and I would not be comfortable with the parent body like that, yeah, okay.
Speaker 3:So let's step it up to another question. We often hear the term toxic masculinity. Yes.
Speaker 3:And what really upset me towards into last year was this great ultra marathon runner. Did you ever see this guy? I think he ran 1,600 kilometres Ned, I think his name was Crazy crazy and they showed some footage on some other programs of the actual sheer pain that he was going through. And it was fundraising. I think it was fundraising for cancer, Don't hold me to that, but he was fundraising for a wonderful charity. But there was a reporter who criticized him and said this is nothing but an example of toxic masculinity. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Okay, that's not my question about that, and we hear this term toxic masculinity quite a bit as a bloke who's got a pretty colourful past in the sense of you know, you've lived life, you've had some experiences, you've had some ups and downs and I've been privileged to those because you and I share some of our stories together. Is there such a thing as toxic femininity?
Speaker 2:100%.
Speaker 2:Okay 100% it works both ways. Okay, 100% it works both ways. I mean, define toxic masculinity for me. If we had to define that, I'll define it for you. Ready, you're an alpha male. You're an alpha male who has an opinion. I'm really careful here. Like you know, people are going to say I jumped in my throat here, but if you're an alpha male, these days you are under the microscope, I feel.
Speaker 2:You see our teenage boys out there. They are struggling and we know that girls particularly like to be part of a group, and social media and friends is everything I get. All that. I can talk about that forever. That's the stuff I learned about. But our boys are confused. Our boys are confused.
Speaker 2:We go to parties and we went to a 40th birthday or 30th birthday party recently with the old guys there and next door to us was an 18-year-old birthday party, and so it was so weird seeing it and these girls were dressed in next to nothing, skin tight.
Speaker 2:You know, if they'd been there to pick something up, you'd see everything I mean everything and boys rock up in long skateboard shorts, hat back to the front and just a shirt, not even trying to dress up, and Rachel and I go. What do you think is happening there and we're like well, I just don't think they know their place. I don't think boys, young men, know their place. There's no rites of passage these days I'm stereotyping a bit, but there's no rites of passage program. When do boys become a man? When they do become a man, if they're an alpha man who's headstrong and want to protect and that kind of stuff, when does that become toxic? I mean, you know, if we talk about being, you know what they say smarter, kinder, wiser, stronger that's. You know, that's one of the biggest parts to be a great male a great someone looking after another person.
Speaker 2:Am I toxic if I've noticed four things? Or because I'm kinder, it's a little gentle, it's looked different. So I think you've got to be really careful in that space. I think there's a lot of males out there who don't know their place and I know there's a lot of guys who there's a lot of guys who don't even open up with their emotions, mate, because sometimes, when we don't become as what we stereotype as being masculine, it sometimes gets us back in the face, and that could be sometimes.
Speaker 3:I'm just trying to think of how to wrap that up, but I haven't got a good way to go. Hey look, thank you for your opinion on that, but I think you made some really interesting points. It does scare me at times. Sometimes I kind of sit down and I go can I say this? Can I do that? Am I going to get criticised for toxic masculinity? And then also, I think I'm raising two little girls. What influence am I having on them? What role model is daddy setting for the man if they move into a heterosexualized world when they get older? What role model am I setting for them?
Speaker 3:And that often plays over in the back of my mind.
Speaker 2:Was.
Speaker 3:I being a good role model? Was I being a good man? And then the question of what is a man? It's changed and it seems to be always shifting. One week we've got a definition like this. The next week we've got another definition or an expectation. Yeah. But I think that happens across the board in many areas, for people too, for women too, like I think the changing of definitions, which creates a changing of expectations, which then creates confusion, can be, quite difficult.
Speaker 2:I think it's hard to define a man like that circle of trust. They say those four things bigger, wiser, stronger, kinder. Who measures that as well? And I've never had a physical fight in my life. And if I'm a toxic male, am I a guy who gets drunk and stereotypically punch people on and stick up? And I'm a real man? I don't know. I think if someone was taking the girls I think I'd be pretty aggressive physically, yep, but yeah, tough one. But I think there's it's a very, very dangerous space and I think we're losing our males. I think we're losing our support for our men out there.
Speaker 3:Okay, yeah. So let's move on to another topic, and what people might not know is that your wonderful Rach is First Nations. She is.
Speaker 2:Where's her country? Well, she's actually from melbourne um, so she was born in melbourne but she was raised in sydney.
Speaker 2:Okay, um, but yes, but she's in doing the uh. She's going for the sorry day tomorrow. She'll be representing there. I actually talked to a bunch of kids today about four, I think. She said uh 16 to 24 year olds and trying to get them to open up about where they want to go in their indigenous heritage. So looking forward to talking to her tonight. See how she went. Very frustrating space, but she's a great role model for that space, lovely.
Speaker 3:Has. Being married to a First Nations lady and someone who's as articulate, as intelligent and just as lovely as Rach is, did that change your opinions on a lot?
Speaker 2:of that in that First Nations space. It taught me a fair bit More around that we talked about this being an unconscious bias. I didn't know what that meant, yeah.
Speaker 3:Very powerful, isn't it?
Speaker 2:But I'm saying stories like you know those people? And she goes those people, really, who are those people? And I'm like, oh, the Indigenous people. And she'd go, okay, yeah, keep going. But I kept still categorising those people.
Speaker 2:And it was really weird, nigel, because I taught in Cloncurry 40% Indigenous population. I taught in Normanton 90% Indigenous populations, no problems, no issues, got along. I was the only white guy in a footy team so I'd run the ball up and I'd go here. He is Like obviously I'm belted. You know, I think when I went to Normanton I was the only white guy playing cricket and the Indigenous population accepted me, and that was before I knew Rach. So I've had a Rach reckons I need to get a DNA test actually. But yeah, definitely wide my eyes open.
Speaker 2:I was always often thinking you know, why do we have so many this is going to sound really terrible so many. You know, respect to country days or every time we have to have like a ceremony day, like why do we keep doing this? And then I looked at the at least model and what happened in the stolen generation and Rach sat me down and maybe we should grab a proof fence and maybe blow my eyes out. And then I started, you know, then I started the same conversation with teachers and students saying so you think it's gone a bit too far. Now, like you think we've gone too far with the acknowledgement country and that kind of stuff, I'd say, well, I know you don't have kids yet, but if someone took your baby away, would you ever forgive them? No, no, frigging way, I said.
Speaker 3:Well, I think we still still a bit to go, haven't we? And just gonna think, you know, I know it's more than more than that, but that's a pretty significant event interesting how you put that and it's like it's really nice actually to hear the kids response, because they make that connection.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, we showed something the other day on it. We had a big house day because sports swing car was coming up. We're talking about the stolen generation and there were so many students who came out and just said, oh my gosh, this just makes us and everyone was just quiet. It makes us think. Imagine if we were taken away from our family, like yeah.
Speaker 3:Okay, let's move out of the heavy stuff.
Speaker 2:Mate, that was pretty full on that was good.
Speaker 3:I enjoyed that, did you? I enjoyed your candor too. You're very open, very honest. I'd still have a job to play, I don't know. I don't know, I might have a relationship. Maybe we should give a butter up to your principal Mr. Campbell. Yeah, Mr Campbell. Now, from what I understand, Mr Campbell is like one of these wonderful human beings.
Speaker 2:He's just the leader of leaders off the chart beautiful. Like you were telling me earlier about this bloke, I was getting a bit sick of it actually. I'm sorry, yeah, yeah, I feel like.
Speaker 3:I know this guy personally, I feel like I've grown up with him.
Speaker 2:He's a good bloke. He's ex-footy head. Yeah, has to look after four schools A tough gig, wow. So easily could be criticised, for you know where is he, why isn't he present, and that kind of stuff. But ex-English head of department articulates things very well, very intelligent man and actually love listening to him speak at assemblies or inaugural mass or whatever it is, because he's always got something to say. It's quite inspiring. I actually respect him. Great yeah.
Speaker 3:Favourite movie.
Speaker 2:Oh, I can't go past Rocky 1. Yeah, you and I have had this Great yeah Favorite movie. Oh, I can't go past Rocky 1.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you and I have had this chat. Yeah, I saw the frame picture in there with Rocky and Adrian.
Speaker 2:If you look down here on your left-hand side down low, you might see there I've actually got the VHS set and the CD set and now it's all on Netflix and stuff. So Rocky's the underdog mate.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:The underdog.
Speaker 3:Such a great movie, yeah, favourite car.
Speaker 2:See, rachel's the car girl. I'm not really a cars person, I don't really care. But I told her I'm going to buy a Tarana one day. She goes well, we'll get a divorce, so I get a Tarana. So I'd have to go a Lamborghini, matte black. Okay, why it's fast? Yeah, it's fast and it looks pretty good.
Speaker 3:Yeah, okay, very superficial. I saw the bike in the shed.
Speaker 2:Yeah, cbr1000. Yeah Again, I was going to say everything seems to be going black in my life, but be careful what I say there. I love you, sweetie.
Speaker 3:So yeah, it's a nice bike I'm actually test riding the Diavel at the moment V4, ducati. It's a nice bike that's got some berries about it.
Speaker 2:It's between a sports bike and a tourer and a cruiser, but I've had two different bike shops, two different. I had Rachel at the back one time and just me on the other time. So yeah, Okay.
Speaker 3:That's what's going to hit you up? We should look at going for a ride this weekend, because I wouldn't mind getting out if you're around. Yeah, sounds good. Yeah, I'm free all weekend. The kids are with their mum this week this is mum's week, so yeah, Okay, yeah, we might go ducking out there. That'd be.
Speaker 2:I need a dog.
Speaker 3:Why.
Speaker 2:Look, you can't really take your cat for a walk, can you Well?
Speaker 3:you can. It probably won't walk properly, will it?
Speaker 2:Take it for a drag. We used to have this cat. My sister would love this. We were growing up and my house, my mum and dad's house I'd be the first bedroom you'd come to, and outside my bedroom was a veranda. We had this cat called Backo, after Sam Backo the footy. Wasn't he great. He was good, and every time the cat would catch a mouse he'd be going meow, meow, full on, full on, until eventually he'd go. Fine, I'll go out there because I'm closest to go out there. There'd be a half-mangled mouse there, pat its head good back, and he'd be quiet. Yeah, it just annoyed the hell out of me. Yeah, yeah, and yeah, I just don't think it's an infection, Unless you think it's going to go to sleep. It purrs up to you all once. Food, that's it. Dogs are always loyal, isn't it?
Speaker 3:Yeah, what's the old saying? Dogs have masters, cats have slaves.
Speaker 2:Ooh, that's from Nigel and Murray Very good. If you could live forever.
Speaker 3:Why you want to live forever? Because of fear of death, like you know, regardless of what your belief system is.
Speaker 2:But you know, I have a big fear of death, big fear of permanent injury. I know where that came from. Actually, I just hate the feeling of you know, logically it makes sense If you go to sleep, you never know when you wake up, anyway, right. But if I actually go to bed tonight and I put my head and go, imagine going to sleep now and never, ever in your whole life, ever waking up, ever again, and even now thinking about it, it just freaks me out. Yeah, like I don't want to die. No matter how hard life is, I don't want to die. So, yeah, I'd live forever. Is it the blue or the red pill? What did Matrix take it's?
Speaker 3:one of those. I don't know which one it was, yeah, but I remember that yeah.
Speaker 2:I don't think I want that big thing back ahead with them, yeah yeah, I'd like to be able to fly a Chinook helicopter.
Speaker 3:use all those firearms and do Kung. Fu.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:If they could transport that to me, that'd be great. I wouldn't mind being Keanu Reeves he seems like a pretty top bloke too, and she said yep, but only if my kids got to stay with me. Oh, that's nice yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, she's a lovely mum.
Speaker 2:Great mum.
Speaker 3:Hey, karina. Okay, so if you could live one day of your life exactly as it happened, but without changing it.
Speaker 2:What day would you choose From now?
Speaker 3:No, you get the opportunity to go back and go. I want to just live one day. Yeah. This is one day You've been gifted this by the genie in the bottle or whatever.
Speaker 2:So it hasn't actually happened, but you're going to? No, it has happened, okay.
Speaker 3:What is one day in your life that you would go? I want to live that day again. I think, the day my daughter's born. Yeah, it.
Speaker 2:That was a day when I was there for the birth. It was really weird because we didn't want to find out if it was a boy or girl. I had tattoos organized. It was going to be a girl's name was going to be Winter if she was born a girl and then slayed it as a boy and then so the tattoos were ready to go. I just had that mark on my body for the rest of my life and always wanted to be a father and I wanted to do it right as best I could. That was my number one goal still is in my life. And I was there for the birth.
Speaker 2:And then when she came out the birth of Canal I basically shoulder-bathed the doctor out of the way, apparently, and my wife at the time said well, is it a boy or a girl? And the doctor said well, ask your husband because he knows more of what we do. And I just remember well, ask your husband because he knows more of what we do. And I just remember I was holding her for probably an hour or 45 minutes straight and she wasn't crying. I was looking at my eyes and I was looking straight down and I was like I might not ever forget, wow, and I don't know what happened the rest of the day.
Speaker 2:But I remember going and I had a dream the night before that she was going to be born at 3 am and it was. I was going to be a girl. She was born at 2.30 am it was a girl at Radcliffe Hospital and I walked down to the car park at 5 in the morning to get my phone to text or ring my parents and I was actually like you know, when you finish a finish line and put your hands up. I was like an idiot mate. I was like no one's in the car park.
Speaker 3:I'm just like cheering, just hands up in the air. No one, yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm thinking. You made me think about one of the most memorable moments when my daughter was born. She was six weeks preemie. It was all pretty emergency. She was in a special care nursery.
Speaker 3:She was in a special care nursery for like two weeks afterwards. So you have to get home every night. You can't take her home. But I remember I had this wonderful moment where and I was there her mum and I were the only ones allowed to, other than nurses, able to touch her.
Speaker 3:Put your hands inside the humidity crib and I remember she was crying one night and I put my hand inside very gently on her chest she started to go to and the next thing, a little hand kind of moved over and grabbed onto my finger. Oh, no way, and she stopped crying. Oh stop it so beautiful.
Speaker 2:That's awesome.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, that's good. So you asked me this question Revenge questioning, can I?
Speaker 2:just say that you're doing a good job. You're actually making me squeeze a bit over here like squirm a bit. You're doing a good job.
Speaker 3:You're loving this, aren't you? I'm loving every moment of this. Tj Unspoken's gone. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:So I'm going to tell your name over now.
Speaker 3:This is good, okay, so you're very open. I like the way you think, I like what you're doing, I like the way you reflect on stuff.
Speaker 2:Thank you, mate, that means a lot coming from you.
Speaker 3:I like the dad you are too. Actually, I really admire the dad you are.
Speaker 2:Thank you dad you can see a lot.
Speaker 3:I often say you can tell a lot about a man by you've got great kids.
Speaker 2:I can see that yeah, they all have their challenges and that's I think that's one of the biggest, toughest things in your life, I think is that you get that balance right, and it's never right.
Speaker 3:Just do your best and be there for them so let's finish up on this one tonight for the listeners. You've got 20 bucks left. What do you spend it on?
Speaker 2:yeah, see, there's a guy, ian Webster, came on the show and he changed my thinking because he goes that's easy, woody, what I do is I just buy $21 Cokes and sell them off for $5 each and keep doing that and make a lot of money. And I thought that's smart. Like that's business entrepreneur. I love that. Answer $20, oh look, I just love coffee. I know I shouldn't. I got told today I drink too much coffee. I go up to 4th Avenue and I look for an instant coffee and everyone goes. That's disgusting, I love instant coffee?
Speaker 3:I don't know what it is, but yeah, at least what I find about instant coffee that's so great. If you know how to make your own instant, you make it perfectly to your taste.
Speaker 2:There's nothing wrong, and it never changes.
Speaker 3:It's not like you go to one coffee shop, you get a different bean from this coffee shop to that coffee shop, the yeah.
Speaker 2:Rachel likes the plunge and I just get sick of that after a while. So I think a coffee would be there. We charge for coffee five or six bucks these days. You'd probably get do like a chicken cheese, navajo toasty. Yeah, okay, it'd probably be food If it was by myself. It'd be food If it was with the kids. I'd get a couple of pieces of sushi and then share it up, probably. Yep, yeah, I had one today. Can I ask you a question now?
Speaker 3:Yeah, go for it Please do.
Speaker 2:One of the kids had these cards. He had a bit of a brain break and she had these cards year 12 girl and she says so I'm going to ask you some questions and I have to be very careful because I'm very personal, so pick and choose, but you've got 15 minutes to live. What am I here in Scarborough at the school I go, am I here? Yep, what are you doing 15 minutes? And I said, oh, obviously you'd probably ring your parent, ring everyone you know, but you wouldn't have much time.
Speaker 3:But what do you think you'd do? Well, it always goes to my girls. Couldn't get them, I'd just make a recording. Yeah okay, I'd make a recording, a video recording of me.
Speaker 2:Yeah, saying your farewells.
Speaker 3:And just passing on some Nigelisms. Yeah. Hey, live by this stuff, Give it a go. Yeah, you know it might only go to my girls, but hey, that's fine yeah that's good. That's probably what I'd do. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a tough one, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:So Coffee, is it an avo and cheese sandwich? Chicken cheese and avo toasty, but don't you find the avocado tastes different?
Speaker 2:when it gets cooked.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's so good. Oh no, I hate it. I can't stand it.
Speaker 2:This relationship's over.
Speaker 3:Oh, it was good while it lasted.
Speaker 2:I don't know, yeah, sometimes you just love those comfort foods and that. Yeah, yeah, great Good on you, yeah.
Speaker 3:Well, I've got to say, Marta, I've had a great fun. Me too, I didn't know how this was going. I've been thinking about it all day and I don't know if it was nerves or preparation nerves and I wasn't nervous about it. But I have been thinking about it all day and putting together questions and finding out what might work, what might not work. But I want to thank you for letting me do this. It kind of gave over the reins and away we go, and I hope your listeners get a bit out of getting to know who Gary is. You know you're now the guy. Is it behind the mic or in front of the mic? Which one are you now?
Speaker 2:I don't know how they say it? I don't know. I'm behind the mic. Yeah yeah, yeah, but you've done a good job today, mate, and the listeners need to understand this too. We we're being candidly honest here, but we had the interview probably four or five days ago, weren't they about a week four or five days ago?
Speaker 3:That was last Thursday, yeah, last Thursday night, so nearly a week ago.
Speaker 2:And then you've messaged me at 6 o'clock this morning and I've got that message on the way to school around 8, and I've gone okay, I'm free. What did I say next week or otherwise tonight? And you go okay, let's do it tonight and I'm going. Right, yeah, let's go. You're very respectful waiting outside because my girls are home and even though they've met you before, you're very respectful, I appreciate that. But yeah, mate, chicken and the roast chicken sandwiches are out again.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we did it again. How good are they Mate.
Speaker 2:thank you and yeah, thanks for making me be vulnerable and I really appreciate you coming in and turning the screws and making me squirm.
Speaker 3:Such a good opportunity. Good on you, mate, Thanks mate Thank you.