Silence the Bully, Amplify Your Voice: Empowerment at Work

Ever felt like your office turned into an episode of "Mean Girls"? You're not alone, and it's high time we address this together, head-on. In this empowering episode, we delve into the strategies for overcoming office harassment, asserting your rights, and creating a sanctuary of mental wellness in your professional environment. Join our insightful conversation with seasoned mental health advocates, Randi Owsley and Jessica Bullwinkle, as they guide us through assertiveness training, coping strategies for workplace stress, and ways to foster healing after facing workplace abuse. If you're among the courageous women navigating these murky waters, let's unite under the broad canopy of Workplace Bullying Awareness and march towards a future where respect and equality aren't just optional—they're expected. Tune in to transform your professional challenges into stepping stones for empowerment and peace.

 Together, let's explore how we can weave a tapestry of Empathy and Support Networks at Work, creating an ecosystem where every woman feels seen, heard, and respected. As we dive into strategies for Creating Safe Work Spaces for Women, we're not just talking about physical safety; we're crafting environments where emotional and psychological wellness flourish.

We acknowledge the stress—that uninvited guest in our professional and personal lives. Together, we're going to Build our arsenal of calm amidst chaos, equipping ourselves with Coping Strategies for Workplace Stress. It's about more than surviving; it's about thriving, finding peace and power in places we least expect.

Your inner peace is your strength, the quiet yet profound rebellion against the grind. In the face of adversity, we stand tall, Building Resilience Against Work Bullying. It's not just about weathering the storm; it's about emerging stronger, with our spirits intact and our resolve unbroken.

Join us as we empower, uplift, and transform the narrative around women's mental health in the workplace. Your journey is our journey, and together, we'll break the stigma, building a future where every woman’s mental health is not just a footnote but a fundamental pillar of her success and well-being.

#ProtectYourPeaceNow #EmotionalWellnessMatters #FindYourInnerCalm #PrioritizeYourMentalHealth #HealthyBoundariesHappierLife #StressManagementStrategies #AnxietyReliefTips #ResilienceBuildingJourney #MindfulnessMatters #SelfCareEmpowerment

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Transcript

Randi: 0:14

Welcome back to the women's mental health podcast. I'm randy. I'm And I'm Jess. And we are two licensed psychotherapists, and this is a safe space where we talk about mental health, well being, and strategies for coping with life's challenges. And how all of this is normal, and you are not alone. Today we're addressing a topic that unfortunately many women face in the workplace. How to deal with bullies at work.

Jess: 0:37

And it's such a good topic because it's so hard to tell, especially being women. If these are bullies and we constantly talk about bullies with our kids, but we never think about it. With ourselves and with the people we work with

Randi: 0:50

right and I mean there's lots of situations where it can happen And this kind of parallels what we talked about last week in our episode on burnout This can go like hand in hand with that Exactly, so you can find us and more information and our past episodes at women's mental health podcast comm Have you ever had these thoughts? What constitutes bullying in the workplace? Is workplace bullying a common experience? How can I tell the difference between tough management, somebody just talking to me straight, and bullying? What

Jess: 1:24

should I do if I'm experiencing bullying at work? Can men be victims of workplace bullying, too? That's a great question. How can workplace bullying affect mental health?

Randi: 1:36

What are the legal options for dealing with workplace bullying, especially if it's gotten out of control and you don't, you're not getting any help like at work? We'll talk about that.

Jess: 1:46

How can I support a colleague who is being bullied? Can a workplace culture be changed to prevent bullying? bullying. And that is such a, there's a whole entire thing about like organizational psychology. Yes. It's all about that. Where can I find resources and support in dealing with workplace bullying?

Randi: 2:03

So we'll answer these. thoughts about this topic towards the end. Workplace bullying can feel overwhelming and very isolating, especially for women, but you are not alone. So we're going to get into what this looks like and how you can take back control.

Jess: 2:20

We know what bullying is, but let's talk about what is it in the workplace. What this is repeated and harmful behavior directed at an employee that's intended to intimidate, humiliate, or undermine them. It can come in the form of verbal abuse. Exclusion, sabotage, or even physical intimidation. So unlike conflicts that arise from occasional disagreements, bullying is ongoing and has a power imbalance, which is huge right there. So like you said,

Randi: 2:51

repeated, repetitive. ongoing. So this is like a constant. It's not like this happened, once, upon a time. This is ongoing. And it can be very subtle, too. For example, someone might start spreading rumors. They could, Constantly be like criticizing your work, maybe to others or even to you, they might exclude you from important meanings and projects and then play it off Oh, I just forgot, but when you start seeing this pattern emerge, then that their intention is to chip away at your confidence. And take you down at your place on the rung in the ladder in the workplace, maybe they feel threatened by you.

Jess: 3:37

Or what they're trying to do is block you from moving up. I've seen that before too, where they block you and you don't know that they're blocking you until way later that you're like, that's why I couldn't get

Randi: 3:50

out of the department. That's why I didn't get that promotion or, I didn't know that there was a job opening and things like that.

Jess: 3:56

Exactly. And what they're really doing oftentimes, too, is trying to keep you there because it serves them a purpose. Because maybe you're doing part of the job that they don't want to do. And so if you move, they have to step up and do it. And so sometimes it's the intimidation is there because it serves, well, it always serves them a purpose. But yeah, I've seen that. it's important to understand that workplace bullying is a problem. isn't just having a bad day or a single argument.

Randi: 4:22

Yeah, it's not a once off.

Jess: 4:24

No, and there are times people get in fights the most common I hear about is the AC. Somebody wants it colder than somebody else. Like how many offices have you been in where they actually have a freaking lock? on the AC thing because that is the thermostat because that is the biggest fight people have. That's not bullying.

Randi: 4:40

Yeah, it's not surrounded around your workplace or your career. Exactly.

Jess: 4:45

What it is a pattern. What Randy was talking about is this pattern that makes you feel unsafe, Disrespected or devalued in your work environment. Oh, that's such a powerful word. Devalued. I like that.

Randi: 4:58

Devalued. So where does workplace bullying come from? Like where can we see the patterns or the origins of this? Where did it all start from?

Jess: 5:09

this all starts from power dynamics. Somebody wants to be in power. They might feel threatened by you, by your skills or your position. They want to assert dominance. They want to compensate for their own insecurities. Their tiny penis. Small dick. I like that small dick energy. Okay. Okay. But what this is, in some toxic work environments, the culture may even unintentionally encourage bullying by rewarding aggressive or competitive behavior instead of being collaborative, I think of those old car sales, where they do those competitions. Yeah, I think

Randi: 5:47

of, like, when I watch, too on Netflix a lawyer show or something. Yeah. They set each other a standard. Yeah, against like you're making partner and you have to take on so many cases and work 5, 000 hours and put in all this extra time and then maybe we'll consider you and it's and often, especially women, since we are paid less and often seen as less as a person as our male colleagues. Counterparts that we are always trying to overexcel and overextend ourselves and do more than is necessary. that can feed into this, behavior.

Jess: 6:24

Well, and that's like the Clinton suit, We got to all wear pantsuits. You can't dress feminine if you're in an executive position. I've seen women do that where. They dress a little bit more manly at work, and I don't want to call it manly or not feminine, because they're trying to, More unisex. There you go. That's so much better. Thank you. Yes, more unisex. Because they're trying to make it so they earn it. They didn't sleep their way to the top, but they're trying to play with what we used to call the big boys,

Randi: 6:53

Yeah. Or the boys club and that leads into the societal, components of things that there is like a norm, that women should be seen a certain way or women shouldn't be in the workplace as like history had laid out before. And it's no, we're here. We're powerful. We're important.

Jess: 7:12

Ooh, wait, hang on. Everybody who's listening. I just want you to say we're here. We're powerful. We are important. We're here. We're powerful. We are important.

Randi: 7:24

I'm just, I had to repeat that right there. Yeah. And so this kind of leads to, in some cases that bullies target women specifically because of these gender stereotypes or because they perceive those stereotypes to be true. Maybe they've been raised a certain way and they're using tactics to undermine your authority or your professional standing.

Jess: 7:47

Well, think about it. You just recently went and purchased a larger item recently and the sales person, Oh, she's like cringing and trying to breathe. The salesperson didn't talk to you, but went to your husband and your husband turned around and said, Oh, no, I'm not the one buying it. You need to talk to her, her money. And he still talked to him over

Randi: 8:06

me. Yes. And then we ended up going to a different person to purchase something and that was all fine and dandy. But then we went to the financing department. We hadn't met them before. And I'm literally writing the check. Everything is only in my name only. My partner and my kids are there with me, cause they were excited. And He's sitting there ignoring me and talking to him and asking him, so what do you do for work?

Jess: 8:35

I've had financing guys do that too, where I'm sitting there putting, my husband's social, I'm doing everything, I'm filling it out and I'm, working it out. And yes, he is the mathematician and he does all the math. And the guy was like, Oh, your wife knows all this. He goes, Oh yeah I'd be lost without her, but she's probably not going to be lost without me.

Randi: 8:52

Even when I went with my husband to buy something with him too, he still said, you have to get through her for me to make this final decision. So don't treat her like crap. And they still are like, what color do you want? And I'm like, I don't, that's not what I'm here for. Do you know there's

Jess: 9:09

a mirror in the visor and you're like, Do I care? How fast does this go? Yeah. I

Randi: 9:15

was like, tell me about the engine. Tell me about the warranty. Anyway, so this workplace bullying, how does it affect us as women via our mental health?

Jess: 9:26

When we, as women are bullied in the workplace, it has such a huge impact. On our mental health, it leads to chronic stress and anxiety and depression, even PTSD. And if we could diagnose it, we would probably call it compound PTSD, CPTSD. It is not a diagnosis yet, but that is when all of this just builds and builds. And we get this compounded PTSD, this constant. feeling of being under attack. It will erode your self confidence and it's going to really make it. So not only are you occupationally burnt out, listen to our podcast that we did on that. You're not going to be able to enjoy your work and you're going to leave. And that's what they're trying to do. They are trying to make your life miserable and make you leave. Because they don't want you there anymore. And unfortunately, sometimes there's nothing you can do. We'll talk later about this, but sometimes you have to leave because it isn't going to change, right?

Randi: 10:21

If it's unhealthy and it's toxic, exactly. You have to take like these steps to protect yourself. And especially as women, we often internalize these experiences. So instead of like letting it out. We pull it in and that makes us question our ability, question our career, like feeling sometimes like we're the problem. Almost like we're being, gaslit and that we start thinking like, is it me? Is it them? Is it me? And then we start singing Taylor Swift songs. It's me. I'm the problem. I'm the problem. And I don't know. Sometimes I feel like that song, even though I love her, did a disservice because I think we're taught that we are often the problem, but we are usually not the problem. And we will always say sorry first, always say sorry. Listen to our other podcasts about saying no and stop saying sorry. all these things compounded can lead to feelings of self doubt feeling helplessness, feeling hopelessness, and this can spill over then from the workplace into your personal life, your personal relationships. It can affect your sleep. Yes. It can affect your physical body. It can affect your overall just well being. It, bleeds over into everything.

Jess: 11:38

And honestly, we are already exhausted for the most part. We're caring for our family. We may be managing our own health issues, going through perimenopause. At this point, most of us are starting to hit these different hormonal things, dealing with basic societal pressures. And then we got to deal with this crap at work too. And so this is where it becomes so overwhelming You have to like, find relief or escape.

Randi: 12:02

that's hard when you get to that point where you're just like, I can't handle it anymore because, again, these things that can lead into other mental health issues and addictions. Over shopping. Over spending. Like drinking.'cause you're trying to, eating, yeah. Overeating. You're trying to escape this reality that you feel like is out of control. And so you're trying to take back control of things, but then it can spiral out of control. So how do we start to take back control and cope with workplace bullying? Something I learned, very young age, is document everything. Oh yeah, a calendar, a day planner, anything, notes in your phone. Do not keep

Jess: 12:42

it in your work computer and work file because if they fire you, they take your laptop, they shut you down, you can't get to your emails. Always blind copy yourself at home in a separate email that you know you just keep for this Or just a separate file so you have your copies, Keep record of the incident, the date, the times, what was said or done, any witnesses, what your involvement was, if you know what caused or started this. Documentation can help you build a case if you decide to report the behavior to HR or if you're going to go get legal help. If you don't have documentation, You have no proof. It is. He said, she said, and you have to document.

Randi: 13:26

Yeah. And it's really hard to recall things to at a later date. Yes. They even say like somebody who just witnessed a crime, they go in and say what happens and it's not even 24 hours later and. So if you're thinking back, six months or a year and you're like, I think this happened, I think this person was there. I think this, that's just even more stress. So if, once you start noticing this is happening, definitely document it.

Jess: 13:51

The other thing for documentation too, in addition to writing some states, check with your state, you can record without the other person's permission. maybe you want to take and make a recording of what is happening or the conversation. So you have it. But again, check with your state laws because some states it's illegal and so you can't use it unless you say, I'm recording you, but in a lot of states it's legal. So it's all fair game to record that kind of stuff. What else, Randy?

Randi: 14:20

You should, as we always talk about, set boundaries. So we have a podcast about that too. We have lots of articles on it on our website. So first start to see if you can limit your interactions with the bully. Okay. If that's not possible because you're working, your boss, it's your coworker, your colleague, you're a day to day action. That's hard. You don't have to engage in their behavior. You don't have to accept their mistreatment of you. You can still be professional and say, no, I won't allow that. Use assertive communication. Don't apologize. Yeah. Stand your ground without being confrontational. It's really hard because we, as women are taught like you're so emotional and this that and the other, like when you even just, yeah, talk about things that are bothering you when you're trying to be professional, people can twist it. So just tell yourself, stay calm. And set those boundaries, write down what you are not going to accept and try to implement them. And then next, Jess, what should you do? As

Jess: 15:28

always seek support. If You think this is what's happening. I want you to talk to someone that you trust. It could be your partner. It could be a colleague at work. It could be your boss. It could be anybody that you trust because you don't have to face this alone. What I want you to do is get the support system and have it in place. Place and have yourself grounded so that way you can get a different perspective and really look at the situation. And I don't mean to say that as women, like we don't have perspective, but sometimes having the validation that, yeah, that is an okay to say. Having extra support can really help you learn how to be assertive and learn how to stand your ground. Yeah,

Randi: 16:08

especially if they have eroded your confidence or somebody in your past life has. Yes. And you do question yourself. This is a good starting place to say, Hey, I was told this, or this was said to me what do you think of this if you were in my situation, and then, like you said, getting that validation and understanding it, or maybe seeing it from somebody else's perspective can really help you. Move forward through this.

Jess: 16:33

The other thing is to know what your rights are. That is so huge because they vary

Randi: 16:39

from state to state. Yeah. And company to company and some companies too, like their headquarters is in a different state than the state you're in. And those lines can converge too. So you need to do research.

Jess: 16:51

And it really actually does boil down to your state. If you have, if their headquarters are in one state, that's great. Yeah. If you work in a different state, they have to follow that state. And so that's where everything gets really weird about it. But you should know, you're right. Educate on your company's policies and procedures regarding bullying and harassment and workplace conduct. If you. are getting bullied and it does persist, you might have to take it up the ladder to H. R. Or to upper management. There are words such as workplace retaliation. That is a huge red flag in businesses because somebody is retaliating against you. Those are things that they look for. Just be careful before you say those words that you have your

Randi: 17:36

evidence. Right, and that you can trust the person that you are speaking to. Yes. They aren't somehow connected to the person not that I'm not saying that's your fault because it's not I'm saying that Sometimes you just never know what somebody else's intentions are. So to always protect yourself and be sure of

Jess: 17:58

who

Randi: 17:58

you are speaking your vulnerability to.

Jess: 18:02

And honestly, I'm going to tell you this. HR is not really there for you. A lot of people think that they're there for the company. They're there, their assets, not yours. Exactly. People are like, well, HR, no human resources gets paid by the same person you do, and they want to keep their job. Yes. They are there to make sure the laws are being followed. And yes, they're there to provide assistance in the grand scheme of things. They are there to protect the company, right? That

Randi: 18:27

corporation and limit their windfall. So remember that, yeah, you always need to be your number one advocate. Nobody else is going to go to bat for you a hundred percent like you are. And then the next thing too, that we always. again and again is practice self care because this takes a serious toll on your mental health, your physical health. So you need to take time to unwind to prioritize things that you love so you can recharge and you can fill up your cup, whether that's meditation, exercises, hobbies. This will help you manage that stress. A

Jess: 19:06

mental health day. Take a day off to do whatever you want or do nothing. Go play in your garden or blow bubbles. Whatever it is that you need if you were being harassed at work. If you have friends or family that are being bullied at work, All of this that we are talking about, you can help provide support in the same way. You can tell them, the same thing. The first thing is listen to them without any judgment, validate their feelings and let them know that they're not overreacting, which is a huge piece right here. They are not overreacting. Especially

Randi: 19:38

as women, because we are often told, again, that we are overreacting. Yeah, you're

Jess: 19:42

being

Randi: 19:42

so dramatic. And it's no, I'm just really upset.

Jess: 19:46

Exactly. Especially, oh, I get so mad. When I get mad, I cry. And I hate that, because then I feel like I'm being weak, because you know I don't like crying. Yeah. And then when I cry, because I'm upset, I'm like no, I'm really just pissed right now. So what else can we do for our friends and family, Randy?

Randi: 20:00

Same kind of steps that we talked about. If this was happening to yourself, you would want to offer them the same thing, make sure they talk to HR, if that's important, that they're talking to a therapist, if they need more support, that they have legal counsel, if that's the way that this is going, just really offer to help them to like research things if it's overwhelming and be there for them. If they want to vent.

Jess: 20:25

Exactly. The other thing too is a lot of companies will offer EAP, which is, I can't remember the ding initials, what they stand for, but it is therapy that usually get three to five sessions covered through your, through a provider and they can't check on those notes. They can make sure though that everything is being taken care of. So we, I used to do a lot of the EAP therapy, employee assistance, since program, Oh, you're

Randi: 20:51

so good. Anyways, late to the game, but yeah. Yeah. So that's just another way to get out there and vent to somebody that isn't directly involved with your work environment.

Jess: 21:02

But be careful because sometimes if you're using EAP, they will ask for you to give a release so they can, the therapist can provide it back to the workplace. Say hell no. Especially, and that's what sometimes people do. As a therapist,

Randi: 21:15

I am big on. Protecting people's confidentiality and that notes aren't used against you. Okay. I'm going to get off my soapbox.

Jess: 21:22

let's go through and answer our, have you evers,

Randi: 21:25

Randy. Okay, Jess, what constitutes bullying in the workplace?

Jess: 21:30

Okay, so because it can be such a gray area, it includes actions that are unwarranted, invalid criticism, exclusion, being singled out for different kind of treatment or any form of intimidation. It's about looking for the patterns, not, one offs. It's not a bad day. It feels like you are being targeted. It feels persistent. And so it is worth taking a look at this very seriously. Randi. Is workplace bullying a common experience? Yes,

Randi: 22:02

unfortunately. While the depth of the bullying may vary, many individuals, especially women have faced some sort of bullying or intimidation at work, not even at work, just in life in general, like I've been bullied by strange, men at the store or things like that. So you are not alone in this. You have to realize that it's a reflection of the bully. Yes. And their feelings, their inadequacies, not yours.

Jess: 22:35

And again, I want to go back to exclusion. Oftentimes we think bullying is something else. Exclusion is part of stonewalling. It is a form of abuse. I recently talked about some things going on at the teen school and it was exclusion, which again, This happens at work all the time is you don't get invited to not just like hanging out after work, a project, they don't choose you, they're choosing other people besides you. And it's obvious

Randi: 23:02

elementary school in the playground when your shows last for the team what is this?

Jess: 23:06

Exactly. And so that is exclusion and exclusion is a form of bullying. It is a form of abuse and you do not have to put up with that.

Randi: 23:18

So just how then can we tell the difference between somebody that's just like a tough manager or, somebody who has a certain type of personality and maybe they come off like a little abrupt versus somebody who is intentionally bullying you.

Jess: 23:34

tough management is about pushing for performance in a way that's respectful and it is supposed to help you grow. It is supposed to encourage you. Bullying feels very personal. It is demoralizing. It lacks any constructive purpose. It is a power play rather than looking for productivity. They are trying to show you that they are more powerful than you. They are not trying to show you. How to get ahead. They want to say they're better than you or that you are less than them. Yeah, it's not helpful. It's harmful. I like that. Randy, what do we do if we're experiencing this at work?

Randi: 25:05

First, know that your feelings are valid. Whether you're stressed, you're upset, you're mad, you're angry. That's valid. Then again, like we said document. Seek support from others. HR, if that's necessary, start understanding your rights and remember that your mental health, your physical health, take precedence over all this BS and seeking that external support, like counseling. Or a friend event too can be a really Empowering and powerful step that you take

Jess: 25:39

And I guess I want to go back and preface that hr isn't bad I don't want you to think your hr is bad I do want you to go to hr if that's where you need to be Hr is there to help you. They are there to mitigate any issues between people at work and within the company because that is also protecting the company I just want people to realize that they're not always there just for you. There's just good

Randi: 26:01

to always be self aware of. All the way. Probably because Jess and I are overthinkers,

Jess: 26:07

that No, we just don't trust nobody. Yeah, we don't trust nobody. No,

Randi: 26:11

no,

Jess: 26:11

that's really what it comes down to. That's true.

Randi: 26:15

Sorry if we're coming off really negative sometimes. No. We've just been through a lot. No, we're not sorry. No. No, okay. You're right. We're not sorry. Don't say sorry. So Jess, when it comes down to it, can men also be victims of workplace bullying? Yeah,

Jess: 26:28

absolutely. 100%. Bullying does not know a gender. I have known men who have gotten blocked from promotions or leaving departments because their boss was intimidated by them and they did not want them to be successful. So it doesn't just focus on women. Anybody can be bullied in the workplace, and so it is really important to be aware of that and find support, whether you're a woman or a man listening. And we do have them out there, by the way. We do. We do.

Randi: 26:58

Okay. Hi. Hi, men. We appreciate you being here and trying to be more self aware, helping your partners. We love that.

Jess: 27:05

We do, actually. Randy, how can workplace bullying affect the mental health? The mental health. The mental

Randi: 27:12

health. The whole shebang. Anxiety, depression, post traumatic stress. It's not just like light stress. This is when it is significantly impacting your wellbeing, how you function, how you feel about work, how you feel about yourself. And so really start to then acknowledge that this is happening and that you deserve to heal from this. Now, Jess, if this is just something that is so overwhelming, what are legal options for dealing with workplace bullying?

Jess: 27:44

There are varied legal routes. You have to check with your state because they go by state Some states really protect the employee some states don't give a crap And so you have to figure out what state you're in I know we talked about this in the occupational burnout piece of it I know that There are certain bigger states that, the employee has the right if an employee gets fired, even if, they have, I've had an attorney tell me this. He was like, Well, hopefully, even though you documented everything and they really did deserve to be fired. If they come after you, we could probably just pay 10 grand and, their legal fees and my legal fees to make him go away. And I was like, I'm sorry, what? Yeah. I can't believe that. So you might need to file a complaint with your local authorities. Find a legal, like a lawyer representative. Yeah, an employment attorney. Yeah, who can help you walk through that. They will know what your options are. And there's no reason that you can't just get a consultation to see if there's a problem. This is something that you can do. And lots of them will offer a free consultation or a hundred or two hundred dollars for an hour And you can go in with all of your questions And ask your questions and just write everything down bring your documentation and run it through them They will know way better than I would

Randi: 29:01

Yeah, or go to your state legal aid if it's hard to get ahold of somebody or like money is a huge issue for a lot of people. So see if there's maybe some resources there that are a more affordable option.

Jess: 29:15

And some of your employees will, or employers will also provide a consultation. They will not be able to say what it is, or they will not need, be able to go back to your employee employer, but you can get. Consultation some of the unions will offer that kind of a or bigger corporations. Well, okay, Randy can a workplace culture be changed to prevent bullying?

Randi: 29:38

Yes If the workplace is really committed to their leadership and investing in it and have a zero Tolerance policy towards bullying things can really change in a toxic work environment Cultures are built through actions and policies that promote respect, diversity, and open communication. So when I got my master's I am a master's of social work, but like we had a whole policy side to what I learned too, and it was all about implementing policy change from like the bottom up to have your voice heard and, to advocate. And that's really what it comes down to is that. The workplace or the corporation really needs to learn about how to advocate for their employees. Maybe you need to start teaching them about it, maybe you need to make them aware about it if it's not happening. So it can change, but it takes a lot of time and a lot of hard work to change that. But like we always say, change starts with us. So be that one voice. And maybe if you start talking about it, others might open up about experiences they're having too. And then you can be more powerful together. There is a

Jess: 30:50

whole psychology called organizational psychology. And this is what addresses the psychology and how organizations work, how they function, how this change happens. I actually almost went and did my master's in it. I just didn't want to go to Ohio for it. So I was like, yeah, I'll change it. A lot of times organizations, when they're having frustrations within departments, a lot of organizations will reach out to hire a therapist or hire a social worker to come in and teach them and figure out where this

Randi: 31:24

dysfunction is and how can they can reframe how their system works. Is and how

Jess: 31:29

to make it better. Exactly. And also, unfortunately we do see mass shootings in the workplace. We hopefully eventually we'll get a control of this, but even after that they will have a therapist come in. And talk to people and help them work through this process or this trauma. And so organizations really are starting to reach out to the mental health experts on how do we make these changes? What do we need to do globally? What do we need to do in this justice department to make this function better? Because they really want you to work well and work well together and to collaborate.

Randi: 32:11

Yeah, and if you find that you just can't get away from this toxic work environment and it's They're not willing to change and they're not putting in the effort to make it a respectful place to work, then you have the right to leave that environment too. I know sometimes it's hard because, change is hard and, financial situations can be really tricky, but sometimes you have to put yourself first when these situations are just so harmful to you.

Jess: 32:37

Mhm. And there is nothing wrong. Honestly, you should always have your resume up and running. There should always, you should always have your feelers out to see what is out there. And you should always just say, okay, if this isn't working, I need to make a change. And maybe that change is And does the bully win? I don't know. Cause sometimes, we don't want to be like, don't give up. But how many times have we've moved our children from schools because it wasn't working for them. And guess what? When we do change them most of the time after a little hiccup of a new start, it works out really well. And then they're happy again. And so we want you to be happy.

Randi: 33:11

Yeah. And though this can take a heavy toll on your mental health. You do not have to do this alone. That's why we're talking about that. Randy,

Jess: 33:20

how can I support a colleague who is being bullied?

Randi: 33:23

So to support a colleague that is going through this, maybe you see that they're stressed out or you can see that somebody is undermining them, really listen to them or even reach out like, Hey, I saw, this was happening. Am I reading this situation right? Do you need support? Like I'm here for you.

Jess: 33:40

Or even saying, Hey, you seem a little off your game, or you seem a little off what's going on. Let's go grab lunch or let's go for a walk and let's walk and talk.

Randi: 33:47

And then same thing. If you find it, To be, more that there is some bullying going on. Encourage them to document it. Encourage them to seek help. Sometimes the other person just needs to know that somebody else is there in their corner. And that is an ally. And that they're seen. Yeah. And that they're seen and they're heard and they're validated. And that's incredibly empowering. So Jess, where can I find more resources and support for dealing with workplace bullying?

Jess: 34:15

There's a lot of resources out there. Obviously we can just Google, just to start looking it up there. And now the AI will tell you everywhere you want to go. Frickin AI, but you can look at mental health support lines. You can go to counseling services, legal advice. There are workplace mediation services out there. There are a lot of options and really you should always start with your HR department to A, inform them and B, see if they have other resources that can help you because again, HR isn't always the bad guy. They're just there to mitigate any issues within the organization to protect the organization.

Randi: 34:55

There's also work. Workplacebullying. org and stopbullying. gov, which is like more for kids, but they have other resources too that will expand to adults as well.

Jess: 35:07

Okay. Hopefully, none of you are dealing with this, but honestly, I know it is out there. So I really want you to take this serious because being bullied in the workplace, it's going to take such a heavy toll on you and your mental health and you are not alone and you don't have to face it alone. Whether you're going to go through documentation or support or self care, there are so many ways that you can regain this control of this power imbalance that is going to protect your wellbeing.

Randi: 35:36

And if you found this episode helpful, please subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave us a review. We want to help you guys navigate these challenges and come out stronger and more empowered on the other side.

Jess: 35:49

So nobody deserves to be bullied at work. I want you to keep that in your head. Nobody deserves that. I want you to advocate for yourself. I want you to seek support and don't hesitate if you need to make changes because once we make those changes, yes, it gets a little rocky, but then normally it starts being so much smoother for you and your family and your work environment, you can grow. Yes. It is an opportunity for growth when you can advocate for

Randi: 36:15

yourself. Thank you for joining us today. Until next time, take care of yourself and your mental health because you matter.

Jess: 36:22

Bye. Thanks for listening