288-PuttingYourResolutionsIntoMotion.mp3
Terry [00:00:11] Hello and welcome to the Giving Voice to Depression podcast, produced in partnership with the AB Korkor Foundation for Mental Health. I'm Terry, the creator and co-host of this podcast. I've lived with depression most of my life, and I know how easy it can be to feel all alone in the experience. I'm not alone, and you aren't either.
Anita [00:00:32] And I'm Dr. Anita Sanz, a licensed clinical psychologist with a number of my own diagnoses, all of which bring a certain amount of anxiety and depression along with them. There is great power in shared experiences. We share our own as we engage in intimate and candid conversations with our weekly guests, exploring different perspectives on and experiences with depression.
Terry [00:00:56] We keep it real because depression is real. We keep it hopeful because there truly is hope in spite of what depression tells you. Hi, Anita.
Anita [00:01:10] Hi, Terry. You know, the word resolution is inextricably linked to New Year's. As if by default, they come as a package. But resolutions are actually pretty tricky things. And most of us have heard that less than half of the promises that we make ourselves in the New Year, new ME category, are actually kept for longer than a few months.
Terry [00:01:32] But what you like me might not realize is that of the people who want to make changes but don't state their goals as official resolutions for the new year. The non resolvers, as they're called in a Journal of Clinical Psychology study, only 4% or practically none successfully achieve them. So be official about our intentions. Writing them down, announcing or sharing them with someone does encourage us to follow through. More than not doing so.
Anita [00:02:01] And we'd like to encourage you to prioritize your mental health for 2024. That can mean learning more about your depression, anxiety, bipolar disorder, or other conditions, seeking out peers who can share what works for them. Starting group or individual therapy. Making necessary boundaries, practicing mindfulness and self-compassion, and talking more about mental health in ways that let others know they're not alone in their struggles.
Terry [00:02:33] And at the suggestion of today's guest, Dr. Adel Korkor committing to move more in whatever ways are possible for you. Here now is Dr. Korkor giving his voice to depression. Edel says when recently asked what kind of resolutions he wants to make for this year, his answer came quickly.
Dr. Adel Korkor [00:03:01] And I said, You know what? I want to be more self-compassion. I want to be more self-congratulatory. I want to I want to I want to say to myself at all, you did a good job at this. I want to be patient with myself. I want to I don't want to be I don't want to be so critical with myself. And those are a type of resolution that can be so important for your mental well-being, because it really reduces the amount of stress that you have with every interaction in every situation that you're in. So being self-compassion and and give yourself a break when you fail is really important. And I think that transcends into our relationships, you know, with the people that we're in love with and with our friends is that we can't always be perfect. We they can't always be perfect. We need to allow for for, for compassion, for brave, for sympathy and empathy that things aren't always going to work well and things aren't always going to be perfect. And and we should give ourself a break as we give our others a break.
Terry [00:04:22] Self-compassion is so foreign to so many of us. You know, we don't treat ourselves the way we would treat someone else. And if we saw someone else try and fail, we would say, Hey, you try. Next time, maybe you'll do better or yay for even getting out there. We don't do that to ourselves.
Dr. Adel Korkor [00:04:42] Yeah.
Terry [00:04:44] Practicing self-compassion is just one of the tools Adil plans to use to manage his mental health when it's challenged in the New Year. He's learned over decades of lived experience that doing nothing changes. Nothing.
Dr. Adel Korkor [00:04:58] You know, we all have our ups and downs. But for me, when I'm down, I'm really down. I just like, okay, I just, uh. And that's when I feel like I got to do something. I can't get over this. I have to get out the door. I have to do something.
Terry [00:05:21] And for him, that something is running.
Dr. Adel Korkor [00:05:24] Why do I get up in the morning and run every day? Because I'm not doing it for my body anymore. I'm doing it for my brain. I'm doing for the. For the fresh air that I inhale for that cool, crisp air. I live in Wisconsin, so it's a it's like that now. The temperature in the thirties and forties. But I love that, you know, that nice, crisp, cold air that comes into my body just gives me that sense of invigoration that I can go in there and spend the rest of my day in the office or work and indoor whatever.
Terry [00:05:57] You have shared publicly, including in your TEDx talk that you use emotion and in your case, running to deal with your anxiety and I wonder chicken/egg: do you run so that you don't experience anxiety? Or if you start to experience anxiety, do you lace up?
Dr. Adel Korkor [00:06:15] That's a good question. It's actually both. I mean, I have panic disorders and I've had many, many, many thousands of panic attacks in my life. And even now I still periodically experience them. And I'm in my seventies, so and I started having them when I was a teenager. You know, they're never going to go away. They're part of who I am. But I've learned that was running. I can control them. But sometimes I do run because I'm really feeling down as symptoms, like I've had quite a bit in the last year, stressful experiences of which, you know, I just had to go run. So sometimes it is it is an answer to the state of mind that I am in, but I do it regularly just to stay fit and and keep my panic attacks under control.
Terry [00:07:14] Describe, if you will, the difference in the way down feels to you and post-run feels to you.
Dr. Adel Korkor [00:07:22] I I'm invigorated post-run. I am. I'm more able to focus. I tell you that I can read my emails much more efficiently after my exercise that I do beforehand, and when I'm down, I can't do any of that. I struggle with it. And if I go through a period of time of which I'm inactive or haven't done a whole lot or and, you know, I can sense in everything that I do, whether it's cooking or reading, even reading, you know, when I I'm not in the right state of mind. I have a hard time. Yeah.
Terry [00:08:08] It's interesting because for many of us, when we feel down is when we feel like we can't do anything. And that inertia can really stop us from getting to a place like where you get post exercise. Because I don't think I'm really I think my depressions coming back. I've got to get outside and take a vigorous walk. I can just as easily find myself drawn like a magnet to the bed. So I'm asking you this as a doctor and someone who uses motion to control your emotions, where does that incentive come from? .
Dr. Adel Korkor [00:08:45] It came from training. It came from many, many years of going through the same phase that you're talking about, which I don't want to do it or, you know, I am too tired or finding an excuse, but then realizing after years of doing it that I'm able to fend off the you know, I don't know. I don't know if you've experienced a panic attack or anybody have, but it is extremely fearful sensation in your body. And you're you know, so I've learned that getting out of it is the only way I can really live a functional life. I know I can't break this boundaries of fearfulness, of dying from panic attacks without really making a move, without doing something.
Terry [00:09:41] Literally a move in your case.
Dr. Adel Korkor [00:09:44] The (?) is really a sense of I need, I need to be better off than what I am when I'm trapped in my own emotions.
Terry [00:09:52] Yeah, absolutely.
Dr. Adel Korkor [00:09:54] You know, some people go and have a drink and some people go to the bar and some people, you know, do something like that or take a cigarette. I choose not to. And I don't think that's healthy to do because I don't think any of it really helps at the end of the day. I honestly think that physical activity is the most effective means of of enriching our brain and our emotion. I truly, truly believe that. Not based on my own personal experience, but based on thousands of studies that have been published.
Terry [00:10:28] One such study and we will link to several with this episode is summarized in a recent Mayo Clinic article on the role that exercise plays in easing depression and anxiety symptoms. It has a handy list of realistic tips to use to help us get started and stay motivated. They include identifying what you enjoy doing. Is it a jog? Shooting some hoops, taking a bike ride, yoga, pickleball or something else? The specific activity is less important than the fact we become active. Another tip is to analyze your barriers. Figure out what's stopping you from being physically active or exercising. The article says, for instance, if you're self-conscious about moving in front of other people, do it at home in private. If you have trouble following through, find a partner who enjoys the same activities you do. Mayo Clinic also advises making reasonable goals to set yourself up for success. Try to avoid the mindset that exercise means committing to a gym membership or training for a triathlon. Gardening, washing your car, taking the dog for a longer walk are all literal steps toward a healthier body and mind. And speaking of research, it's widely proven that we cannot wait until we feel like doing something to start moving in that direction. We have to start even when starting is the last thing we want to do and the momentum will build from there.
Dr. Adel Korkor [00:11:59] It takes that one massive amount of energy that they have to get over and get out of their apartments, get out of their house, get out of there, and then do something simple. It doesn't have to be running a marathon. It doesn't have to be running 1k. It could only be going around the block. It can only walk in the park. It can only be going up the few steps of stairs two or three times a day. It doesn't have to be a lock. It's just that the minute they do it, they're going to feel different. And I think once they feel different about it, they're going to start doing more and more of it.
Terry [00:12:36] That mind body motion, emotion connection is so fundamental to Dr. Korkor that he's made it his life's and foundation's mission to spread the word.
Dr. Adel Korkor [00:12:47] Physical activity does help your overall mental health. They are intertwined. They are connected through hormonal factors, through direct effects of hormones that are released from your muscle into your brain, activate your brain cell growth and connectivity. So I think if we understand that whatever we do for our body really helps our brain is really is something that is so intuitive in our own in our own existence as a human body because we're not disconnected. Our body doesn't our head does not sit, you know, a mile away from our body. They're all connected. That blood flow up and down when the heart beats, you know, half of the blood flow goes into our brain. There's a reason for that. And when we run faster, the amount of blood supply that goes into our brain substantially increases. It improves cerebral flow. That isn't going to happen when we're sitting down on the sofa.
Terry [00:13:56] Yet. That's where many of us find ourselves. If we get out of bed during particularly dark times. And the suggestion that we'd feel better if we moved can be met with resistance. But movement or exercise is another tool that has been proven effective for many. And we need to be aware of and stockpile anything that might work as a weapon in the fight for our mental health.
Dr. Adel Korkor [00:14:20] I think what we do for our body, what we do for our muscle, what we do for our physical wellbeing, really impacts our emotional being. And I know the challenges that you were referring to. Terry was someone who was depressed, deeply depressed. The last thing they want to do is, is get out of their house to get out of the way. They are in their enclave and really face, you know, the challenges associated with physical activity. But truthfully, from everything I have read in preparing for my TEDx Talk, I came up with the conclusion that it only takes one small step that people make when they are within that cocoon, within the fearful structure of their emotional existence. But we should all you what it takes us to make one step out of it, and then that they can see the light. They can see there's an intruder. There's a seed, a little bit of a tunnel of light out there. Once they break down and do it one time, they're going to see the value of it as they do it more and more and more.
Terry [00:15:26] The challenge for many of us is getting started since depression manifests physically by causing disturbed sleep, reduced energy and other symptoms that result in less motivation to exercise. The best advice to break from that cycle. Start. Start anywhere. Start slowly but start and build up from there.
Dr. Adel Korkor [00:15:48] Yeah, I think it's a form of true word that we're offering ourselves a small reward. I mean, in the same way we try to reach for a piece of candy or a piece of chocolate or for it to get that is that reward. I think we can treat our body by stepping outside, taking a little walk. I mean, honestly, this is a treat that you're giving to your brain, to your emotional well-being. It really is. And I think if we can if you can think of it that way, maybe that's one thing that we could be that we could be helpful in making those decisions to move and make things happen.
Anita [00:16:35] So, Terry, what I really got out of this, in addition to the fact that, yes, exercise is a it's a really good treatment for depression, has to do more with how do we think about if we're going to set intentions or we're going to set resolutions for ourselves. How do you actually make it work? Your intention or your your goal must be very specific and it needs to be realistic.
Anita [00:16:57] So we're not shooting for where we'd like to be in December of 2024 when we set an intention or a resolution in January. You just figure out what's the first realistic step that I can take towards that goal, and then we'll set that as as our intention. And then you got to track it so we can say anything we want. But unless you can see that you're actually doing it, proving it both to yourself and to anybody else, it's almost like it will not happen. So you get a calendar, you put smiley faces on the days that you take those, again, very realistic steps and see if we can get a trend going, you know, see if we can do more days in the first week than, you know, last year and then the second week of the new year. Can we keep that keep that trend going? But I just I think trying to make a resolution at the beginning of the year and hoping that that's just going to maintain throughout the year. I've never seen anybody do it unless they did these steps, made it specific, realistic track it.
Terry [00:18:02] It was going to ask you as a therapist, when I talk about exercise, it seems to be received in the same way that talking about meds is. It's like if you already move, if you already run, if you already walk, if you already exercise, or if you already take meds, you know it helps. You need zero convincing. You know, walking helps me. Antidepressants have helped me. But if you don't, you don't want to hear it. Like it seems to almost upset people. Hmm. Why do you think those two things are like that?
Anita [00:18:38] First of all, that's partly human nature, and I definitely try to challenge that. I challenge it with myself. I challenge it with other people to say, Can you speak from experience? Have you experimented with it? Have you given it the good college try? And can you speak from experience to say, Yes, I've done this, I've tried this. That didn't work. So I tried this. If you can if you can again, through accountability, show me these don't work for me the same way they work for other people. Then that's fine. But the problem is, if you're laying on the couch and somebody says, exercise is really good for you, and you're like, Yeah, that's not for me. That's not okay. You can't speak from experience. You can't say, I've tried that and it doesn't work for me.
Anita [00:19:23] So I usually try to say, Why don't we just set things up as experiments, which honestly, I think this is a wonderful way actually to manage intentions and resolutions is to say, Let me see what might work for me at the end of this year. I should be able to say, Well, in January I tried drinking more water. In February, I tried yoga. In March, I decided to try journaling and we give ourselves a month just to experiment, see if we like it, see if at the end of that month we go, You know, I actually think this this helps a little. I think this makes me feel a little bit better because like you said, if you are doing it and you know it works for you, you don't have to have anybody hammer you, convince you, you know, anything like that.
Anita [00:20:13] That's that's my preferred way of working through change is to say, what experiments would you like to perform this year? Would you like to see if exercise has any impact on your mental health? Mm hmm. Would you like to see if drinking more water actually gives you more energy and reduces your headaches? You know, just setting it up as an experiment, Then we experiment just like good, good lab techs. We we keep notes. So? So we write down what what we did and what we drank. And we develop just a really quick and easy rating scale. You know, on a scale of of 1 to 10 after exercise, you know, what's my number? What was it before? I think running those experiments is is what really shows people whether things work for them or they don't. And I'm not going to hammer on anybody who says I you know, this doesn't work for me. If you can if you if you've tried, you've experimented and you've proven it to yourself, that's fine. I don't need it. I don't need to try to convince you. Mm hmm.
Terry [00:21:10] So I like that building it up ideas. But again, the idea of sitting there and thinking, I can't do anything. This is just the way I am now. For me, I have to challenge it. I have to fight back because I learned how long I can stay in that pit if I don't do much of anything. And it was long.
Anita [00:21:27] Yes. This is where my experience with having chronic fatigue syndrome, I think really helps in terms of my working with clients with depression. And that's because, you know, I just came off of a of a bout of a post-viral, you know, response. And and so my normal, you know, getting up and doing some kind of physical activity every every day or, you know, 5 to 7 days old could go for me. I couldn't do that. And so I had to very, very slowly kind of get back to that place. And that meant some days all I could do was some yoga for chronic fatigue, which is 14 minutes of barely moving any muscles, but just sort of reminding my my body that I do have them like keep keep the nerves kind of go and oh, yeah, we do have some muscles there but not working them out, not doing something that would be too hard. So I get how important it is to take what I call, like the first step.
Terry [00:22:22] You're saying "duh steps" like d-u-h steps?
Anita [00:22:27] Duh. I'm from the eighties.
Terry [00:22:29] Got it. Duh, I can do.
Anita [00:22:30] That. It's a duh step. Duh. If somebody wants to get exercising and they're depressed, the first step is not go walk. It's go get your walking shoes. Go find those. That's the duh step. Could you go get the shoes and get them out of the closet? If you're like, Duh, I think I can handle that. Great. That's the first step. The second step is you're going to put them by the front door. That'll be step number two. People are going to be like, Yeah, but I'm not walking. I'm not doing anything. I'm like, You're actually preparing to do it both mentally. And we're removing any barriers because you're laying on the couch and you're thinking, I should go walk.
Anita [00:23:12] We've got all these little steps before we have to have the right clothes. We have to get those things done first. And you shouldn't, like, cram that all together. So we pull apart those steps into the dust steps. So these are the steps that I encourage people to take because then we have some winds that are building up. So what a lot of people do is get discouraged. Like unless I have taken a 15 minute walk, I don't get any credit, I don't I haven't done anything important. And it's like, no, all of these steps that it takes to get to that point where you're going to head out the door and walk down to the mailbox and back, whatever it is that you can do today. If you can do that, we will always be trending in a positive direction.
Anita [00:23:57] So it's so important not to set this bar the goal so high and maybe it wouldn't be high for anybody else. I get this. You know, maybe maybe a 15 minute walk for other people is like, that's my warm up. But if you're dealing with a physical or mental health issue, working up to 50 minutes is what we may be doing. And you want to give yourself credit for all of those steps that lead up to that.
Terry [00:24:22] Good advice. And it's a nice thought to not be beating yourself up because you haven't done it the Big 80 yet. And that you're right, there are a lot of steps. It's getting up, getting your size, going, your shoes going into and getting in here in Wisconsin. It's getting your your hands and your. Yeah, it is interesting. I have read some really nice New Year's intention more than resolution suggestions. Listen to what your body needs. Be kind to yourself. Create and maintain healthy boundaries. Get the rest you need. Forgive yourself more quickly. Spend time in nature and accept yourself. I love those kind of things.
Anita [00:25:02] Those are beautiful. I don't just do one New Year's intention. I do a monthly intention. You know what? What do I want to work on this month? What could be helpful this month? But one that I that I had last month that I really like. And it's in the vein that you're saying is choose the path that is most in alignment with your higher good. So that's a great intention and I will print that out. I'll look at it every day and then it informs my decision making. So should I do this or should I do that? Should I say yes or should I say no? Then I can look at this and it says, Choose the path that's most in alignment with my higher good. And that's how I'll do an intention like that.
Terry [00:25:42] It does give focus, which I appreciate. I want to end this episode saying in full disclosure, the AB Korkor Foundation. Dr. Korkor, who you've just heard, fully funded this podcast and our social media for the past two and a half years. So we want to say that and thank Dr. Korkor.
Anita [00:26:05] We truly hope that our podcast brings a little more understanding. Helped you better articulate and reflect on your own experience with depression or better understand how to support someone else who is struggling.
Terry [00:26:19] If this episode has been of comfort or value to, you know that there are hundreds of others like it in our archive, which you can easily find at our website. Giving voice to depression dot com. And remember if you are struggling. Speak up even if it's hard. If someone else is struggling, take the time to listen.