Remastered Episode: Dr. Amie Hornaman ON Mastering Thyroid Health

In this episode of the Ketones and Coffee podcast, host Lorenz  welcomes Dr. Amy Horneman, a renowned thyroid specialist and weight loss expert, to delve into the intricacies of thyroid health. Dr. Amy shares her personal journey with thyroid misdiagnoses and explains the critical importance of comprehensive thyroid testing. The discussion covers the impact of the thyroid on overall health, the relationship between thyroid function and weight loss, and actionable steps for optimizing thyroid health naturally. 

The episode also highlights the significant role of environmental toxins in thyroid disorders and offers practical advice for those struggling with thyroid-related symptoms. Don't miss this insightful conversation aimed at empowering you to take control of your thyroid health.

00:00 Welcome to the Ketones and Coffee Podcast!

00:41 Announcing Our Partnership with KetoCon!

02:20 Meet Our Guest: The Thyroid Fixer

05:44 The Journey to Diagnosis: A Personal Story

11:07 Understanding Thyroid Health: Basics to Know

18:44 Optimizing Your Health: Beyond Normalcy

21:38 The Importance of Lab Testing for Thyroid Health

22:27 Understanding Thyroid Function and Hormone Testing

23:15 The Importance of Comprehensive Thyroid Testing

23:28 Exploring T3 and Reverse T3 in Thyroid Health

25:30 Hashimoto's and Hypothyroidism: A Deep Dive

26:31 Why Thyroid Issues Are More Common in Women

28:06 The Missteps in Traditional Thyroid Treatment

30:57 Taking Control of Your Thyroid Health

36:56 Natural Ways to Support Thyroid Function

39:34 Addressing Environmental Toxins and Thyroid Health

41:59 First Steps in Thyroid Health Recovery

43:38 Closing Thoughts and Resources

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Transcript

0:49

Welcome to the ketones and coffee podcast with Lawrence Monague, where we explore the ketogenic lifestyle and how it can improve your physical and mental health. Each week we bring you valuable insights and advice from experts to help you on your journey to a healthier lifestyle. This episode is brought to you by BasicKetogenicLifestyle. com, where Lawrence coaches individuals with depression to reverse their symptoms and achieve a healthier, Happier life using an evidence-based approach. So sit back, relax, and join us as we dive deep into the world of ketones and coffee. Subscribe to the Ketones and Coffee podcast today and never miss an episode. Hey guys. Before we start the episode, I'd like to announce our partnership with Keto Con, the Science and Stories of Keto this summer from July eight to 10 in Austin, Texas, held at the Palmer Event Center. KetoCon is an annual health and wellness event, and is the largest event in the U. S. focused solely on the science and stories of living a ketogenic diet and lifestyle. With 50 plus speakers, medical professionals, researchers, bloggers, technology developers, fitness experts, and everyday people like you and I who have used a ketogenic diet and lifestyle to improve their health. With 230 bedded exhibitors as well. People love this event because it's all about the community. Attendees are incredibly passionate about their health and the ketogenic low carb lifestyle. It is a three days of non stop motivation and inspiration, learning, networking, making new friends, sampling all the latest innovative products on the market, and enjoying the city of Austin. For discounted tickets, go to ketocon. org and click on the get tickets button. Use the discount code ketones and coffee at checkout and receive a 10 percent discount code on a three day full conference passes. Alright guys, enjoy the episode. Hey guys, this is Laurence, and welcome back to the Ketones Coffee podcast. And thank you so much for tuning in. I know everyone here that's listening are here because you want to create a sustainable, healthy lifestyle through the ketogenic diet. And every single week I try to bring in guests. That not only has the knowledge, but these individuals has also been through the same trials that we all have been through when it comes down to our search for a better health. We get together in hopes to assist you on your own journey. I'm so excited for this guys. Our guest today is a renowned Thyroid specialist and a weight loss expert, and has a doctorate in clinical nutrition. She is also known as the thyroid fixer, on a mission to optimize thyroid patients around the world and give them their lives back through her work. proprietary transformational program called the fix method. She's also the founder of the Institute for thyroid and hormone optimization. And I'm not done. She's also the host of the podcast thyroid fixer, a show for hypothyroid disorder sufferers who are, who are fed up with the symptoms such as fatigue, weight, uh, hair loss, weight gain, and brain fog. I'm so excited for this. I'm here with Dr. Amy Horneman. Doctor, welcome to the show. What is up? Thank you for that beautiful intro. You did better than I can ever do. So thanks. I disagree, but, uh, thank you so much for that compliment. So in all transparency, when I was doing my research, I thought I knew about this topic, you know, the topic of all things thyroid until I did my research and listen to your podcast, I went, huh. Maybe not much, right? But, um, there's a lot to it. I am. There's a lot to it. And I am as newbie as they come in terms of, you know, overall impact of our thyroid, um, to our overall head. So on this show, we are all about optimizing, taking, Uh, control of our own health because, you know, as we know, our lifestyle is a big factor that plays into the thyroid issues. So, having said that, we have to go back to the basics on this show today. Um, I'm going to ask the basics and the lowdown explanation, um, of what all of this means. You know, the thyroid, uh, issue, the condition. That's why I'm so happy to have you on and, uh, to shed some light on this topic because not a lot of people are talking about this topic and a lot, and I was listening to your podcast and what I'm getting is there's a lot of mis misleading information out there. A lot of misdiagnoses, uh, that leads to frustration and leads to more stress on the body. So I want to preface this to our listeners. Um, If you are fatigued, gaining weight, losing hair, constipated, you know, moods are up and down. Thyroid has a direct effect on the body because it affects every cell in every organ, which can use this problems, can cause this problem. So stick around until the end because we will discuss those later on. But, um, before we get to that, tell us how you got here, because I can tell that this is more than just a career for you. When I listened to your speak about. Uh, your patients. I feel that emotional connection between you and your patients. And even outside of that, you're answering questions from people just who just needed help. So where does that passion come from doctor? Oh, thank you. Thanks for picking up on that. And it, and it is a passion. I think a lot of us in this space come here because of a pain to purpose story. Maybe we went through something that we want to now help others. And that's my story. So I was also misdiagnosed. You talked about a lot of misdiagnoses in this area. I was misdiagnosed six times. And it started with, it started back in my 20s when I was doing bodybuilding competitions and I was doing the figure part, so not beefy bodybuilding, but the figure part. And I had done this many, many times, dieting down, getting on a stage, getting in front of the camera, doing fitness modeling. And there was one particular moment where, one particular show prep, where the scales started going up instead of down. And I thought, wait a minute, this doesn't biologically make sense. With what I was doing. And how my body was responding. It felt like my body was literally rebelling against me. So I went to what we all do. I went to my doctor. I said, this is what's going on, the scale keeps going up, up, up. Once it passed 20 pound gain, I stopped weighing myself. So it could have gone higher than that, but I know I gained at least 20 pounds, very, very rapidly. And I go to the frisker, and they told me I am normal, air quoker, normal, everything is fine, just eat less and exercise more. I was like, are you kidding me? I can't eat less and exercise more, not more than what I'm doing already. I was already going to the gym twice a day. So, I go to doctor number 6, they all tell me the same thing. Now, how many of us would stop? How many of us would stop at doctor number 2 because we put our trust in conventional medicine and what my doctor says must be the case, so I guess I'll just have to learn to live fat, bald, and tired. No, that's not what you should do at all and that is my mission in telling people they have to have hope and they have to keep going. And part of that, that persistence. And getting the answers is listening to your own body. So, doctor number seven finally diagnosed me, finally said, you have Hashimoto's, you have hypothyroidism, and here's a pill. So she gives me a pill, I walk out of the office, and of course I'm excited, because I'm like, yay! There's a pill, and now I'm going to lose weight. That didn't work. I gave it five months. I went back to her. I said, you know, there has to be something else in this, this T4 medication that you're giving me. There's this thing called T3 over here. It sounds like it's pretty powerful. She goes, I don't do that. I said, well, I'm going to find someone who does. So my lifesaver. was a functional medicine practitioner back then. I think we use the term integrative and I went to him. He saved me. He changed my life. He became my mentor. He changed my career path. And that's why I am here today helping others because I knew that frustration I went through other people are going through it too. I knew if I had to beg to find an answer, if I had to be that persistent. and go to seven different doctors. Other people are dealing with this as well. So that's why I am now helping patients find an answer and get absolutely optimized to get their life back. You know, what I got from that is you were so nobody's going to stop you finding out what's going on because you'd like you said you've been to many many doctors and you didn't stop with one. You didn't stop with two. You were somebody that was hell bent on finding out what's going on, right? So. And many people are not like that. Not like you that is so, um, aware of what's going on in their body. Maybe because, yeah, awareness is key here. If you don't know what's happening, What you're looking for. And it becomes very hard. Are you, were you always that, um, curious or were you always sensitive with, you know, what your body's feeling? And, or were you able to develop knowing my body? Yeah. You know what I would say that's developed. I, but I think that that's a key component to, and it's something that we all have to tune into and learn is listening to your body. And now I always tell. My listeners, my patients, that your body gives you a sign, whether it's weight gain, you can't lose weight, fatigue, hair loss, constipation, depression, anxiety. Those signs are red flags that your body's saying, hi, hello, there's something going on. This isn't right. This isn't how you were built. We were not built to walk this earth. Fat frustrated and tired. That's not how we were meant to live. So when you have those symptoms Tune into your body and listen to it because it's giving you a signal It's giving you a signal to say find out what this root cause is find out what is causing This symptom in you that is not right So I really think that's important for everyone. Mine was definitely home because when you are competing and going through that very strict, I mean it was a strict diet, that's why I say it doesn't biologically make sense that I put on 20 pounds because I was eating chicken and fish and asparagus and green beans and doing all the things and working out and doing strength training and cardio and I knew my body well enough to know, yeah, this isn't right. So you have to listen to your body and don't push off the signs and signals your body is giving you. Don't chalk it up to getting older or, oh, I'm just going to have to learn to live this way. And those are quotes from actual doctors to my patients that have then come to me and said, please help. These are what those quotes are, what their doctors told them. You're just getting older. Learn to live with it. You just have to deal with it. You're a woman. Just deal with it. And I just, I want to pull my hair out when I hear things like that. So, what would you have done different if you were to go back to that time you were struggling with, uh, your thyroid? What would you have done different? Because it did took you a while now to discover that, right? And I just want to figure, I just want to figure out why do you think it took that long for you to discover? Is it, is it not available for people? Like, is it not, are the doctors not, um, testing your thyroid when you're going in, or is this just awareness for, um, education for people? A little bit of both, but you nailed it with the testing. So if I could go back and I knew then what I know now. I would have demanded thorough testing. So what I always tell my listeners is, you know, chances are when you go into your doctor and you ask for a full thyroid panel, let's say you, you hear me on this podcast, you go in, you're like, you know what? I heard Dr. Amy talk and I want a full thyroid panel. You can't do that because chances are you're only going to get two markers. You're going to get TSH and you may or may not get free T4. And if I could go back and look at my labs, I would bet money. That's all they tested on me. But there's so many more markers that we have to look at to really get that full picture of your thyroid health. We have to test free T3. We have to test reverse T3 and we can go into what these mean. Okay. We have to test for Hashimoto's, which are the TPO and TGA antibodies. We have to do that thorough testing to really get that accurate picture of your thyroid health. So I would say if I could go back, I would have made sure doctor number one did that full panel. I would have demanded it. And my rule of thumb to everyone is if your doctor says no to testing. It's time to get a new doctor because if your doctor will not even test it is no money out of their pocket There's no skin off their back to write another test on that little script that you're gonna walk into the lab If they don't even want to see the answers if they don't want to see you and and have all of you Answers in front of them so that when you go to them and put your trust in them and you're saying hey doc I am struggling right now I am in the depths of this. I am depressed. I am frustrated. I am gaining weight. What the hell is going on with me? And your doctor won't even test to get that full picture. Time to go. It is time to go. You want to run, not walk away from that doctor. My concern is how do we help people quicker? Um, how do we find you quicker? Right. Um, it seems to me that you must be frustrated already in the system. You must be able to take control of your own health, meaning you must know what's really going on in your body. So you now can then direct your doctor to getting you the right testing done. Right. Yeah. Because in the beginning you might not know that, you know, obviously if I'm having these emotional symptoms and physical symptoms. I don't know what's going on. Like if I'm just a normal Joe that doesn't, it's not, you know, well versed in, in the space, then I, I, I don't know any better. Right. I just want to know, like, how do we help people a lot more quicker? Because so having said that, all of that, we have to really be aware of our physical, emotional symptoms. That's what we know. Like you found keto because of your own struggles. You're not because of your doctor telling you to go keto, right? We know, would I, would I look out for, so I can know to go to my doctor about getting some testing. Now, what, what are the telltale signs now? That I have a problem with my thyroid. Yeah. So it's really interesting when we talk about the thyroid, because the thyroid is the master gland. So it's going to control a lot. Well, here's what can be tied back to it. And we don't want to sound cliche like, Oh, that's a thyroid problem. That's a thyroid problem. But it just is true. When we think of it as the master gland, it has control over your insulin. So one of the big things with keto and thyroid that I'll actually be talking about at KetoCon, busting the myth that keto is bad for hypothyroidism. Is that most of the time, 99 percent of the time, if you have a thyroid problem, you're going to have an insulin problem because the thyroid is a master and it's signaling insulin. It's giving a signal to all of your hormones. So your sex hormones, progesterone, estrogen, testosterone, DHEA, and insulin is a hormone. So it's signaling that insulin secretion from the pancreas. And oftentimes what we see is insulin resistance or pre diabetes in hypothyroid patients. So right there, if you are having any of those symptoms, if you are gaining weight, if you can't lose, if you're tired, if you're constipated, if your joints hurt, if your hair is falling out, if your skin is dry, if your nails are breaking, all of those things. Our symptoms are signs that are pointing back to the thyroid. Now, it can have an effect, you know, we could say, oh, look over here, you have low testosterone. Look over here, you have insulin resistance. But, again, if there's a thyroid problem, and that's at the top, once we start optimizing your thyroid and really getting you into that optimal space, not just normal, then everything else down below it starts to come into play. So, yeah, I mean, definitely, when you're doing keto, you're improving your insulin, You're also taking down extra functions. Now the thyroid's functioning better, now the insulin signaling is better, now your sex hormones are better. So every symptom that you have can point back to the thyroid. How do people know for sure? It's about testing. How do people know where to get the testing? That's what you and I are here for, really. Is to just throw out this education as much as possible. And when people hear it and they stop and they go, You know what? I think that's me. Then they're gonna take that next step to demand testing or find a new doctor who will. Or search, search functional medicine. And find someone who will get to that root cause and be able to give you an answer and proper direction. You know, it's about education. That's what we're doing. Hey guys, let me tell you about this delivery service that's been a total game changer for my lifestyle. Did you know that it's now possible to get local, fresh groceries delivered right out your doorstep? Well, Instacart gives you unlimited grocery delivery for one low monthly fee. And if I can avoid buying non keto friendly items from supermarkets, Who psychs you into buying unhealthy foods? Plus, if it saves me a lot of time and money, sign me up. Instacart is hand selected by shoppers based on your preferences, so no more rock hard avocados, and they will keep your eggs safe too. And Instacart will find everything you usually buy, and get smart suggestions for new items. And you can get your first order today delivered for free when you purchase over 35 by following the link on the show notes below to let Instacart know that I sent you And to help to support the show, Instacart never stepped foot in the grocery store. I was listening to your podcast, uh, the other day. And, um, you said this surround yourself with people that get you like this podcast right here, surround yourself with, with your tribe, that the word that you, you said, and then you said, we don't have to remain where we are because there is hope, absolutely. There's hope a lot of people out there have no clue what to do. Yeah. Right. Um, so let's step back for a second and really get into what it means to be optimal because people got used to being normal or got used to be having the, this thing is common with this age, uh, in their fifties, in their forties, it's just common for people like. When you when you age you're supposed to that's what that's the common thought right? Oh, i'm supposed to feel bad because i'm getting older Right. No, no, that's not the case at all. And that's what we have to look at What it like you said what it means to be optimal and I jokingly talk about optimization land I always invite everyone to come over and live with an optimization land because it's a great place to be but that's why I want To be there. I know everyone should be there, right? It's a great great place So we don't have to give in to the status quo of aging We now know that supporting hormones thyroid hormones sex hormones supporting your hormonal system is key to anti aging so when we're looking at Degradation of joints Degradation of your brain, the neurological diseases of aging, cancer, I mean, all of those point back to Optimizing your hormones and and a lot of that again not to be cliche and tie it in but I love keto I love the keto lifestyle we can see with keto and living that keto lifestyle, how that also ties into decreasing those diseases of aging. So if you do both, if you optimize your hormones, and you implement a low carb, low sugar, keto lifestyle, my god, you can age and be a rock star. And we see that in, in certain people. And, you know, I, I, I challenge you to Go ahead and go to a park, go to the mall, go, go sit at a restaurant, right? And look around at the people around you and you will maybe, maybe pull out one or two older people who look good, who have muscle, who don't have a ton of wrinkles, who look really, really good for their age. Those are the people who have optimized their hormones. Those are the people who are anti aging as those numbers show. Go up 65, 66, those numbers are going up. They're getting older, but biologically. They're still young. And then at the same time, you can look around that room and you can pull out 20 and 30 year olds that look like they're 50 because of the, the hormonal decline because of the processed foods, because of the inflammation in their body. So it really is about, about that hormonal status and keeping things in the optimal range, not just normal, not just standard lab normal, but in that optimal range. To truly live your best life, to feel your best, to look your best, to perform your best, to anti age as you age. That sounds wonderful to me. Um, let's, let's talk about, uh, let's go back to, um, lab testing for a second. And I really had to look these terminologies. And I urge our listeners, um, to really take notes. And I'm going back to re listen to this. And so So I can make sure that I don't miss anything. Let's say we check all the boxes and we decide to finally approach our doctor about getting some testing done. And I know you've mentioned a few, um, tests in the beginning, but what thyroid labs should we ask for? our doctors for. Yeah, let's break those down. So the number one, the one that you're going to get if you ask for a thyroid panel is TSH, a thyroid stimulating hormone. It's important to note that that's a pituitary hormone that is not an actual thyroid hormone. So our pituitary hypothalamus in our brain talks to our pituitary, then our pituitary talks to our thyroid. So pituitary releases thyroid stimulating hormone, TSH. Because it's kind of like, I like to give analogies so listeners can understand. It's kind of like when your kid is doing something wrong and you start off by kind of just, you know, talking in a normal voice. Like, Johnny, can you please pick up your toys? And then he doesn't listen. So you get louder, right? Come on, Johnny, let's pick up your toys. And then you get loud and you start to yell because you're really getting pissed off that Johnny's not picking up his toys. So as that TSH gets higher, It's yelling at the thyroid. It's saying, thyroid, you're not doing your job. You need to wake up, you need to do your job. So as that gets higher, your thyroid is getting lower. More hypo, low and slow. That's one marker. Now here's the problem, is that often times that TSH will be within normal limits, WNL, air quotes, and there's still a problem going on. That's why we have to test more. test deeper. We have to go deeper here. So now we go on to T4. T4 is the inactive thyroid hormone, totally inactive. There is not one single receptor site on your cells for T4, but there is receptor sites on your cells for T3. So we want to test free T4, free meaning unbound, ready to be used, ready to be converted in the body. T4 has to convert to T3. So we test free T4. We test free T3. Because T3 is the active thyroid hormone. That's what's going to give you metabolism and grow your hair and strengthen your nails and allow you to poop every day and make you feel good. That's T3. Because that's getting to the receptor site on the cell. Now, we also want to test reverse T3. Another analogy I'm going to throw at you, reverse T3 is the antithyroid hormone. It is like a bouncer at the club. It is sitting outside your cell door and telling T3 it can't get in. So T3, you can't get in, you can't get in, you can't get in. And it's blocking the active thyroid hormones. Action on cell when reverse T3 is high and it's reverse T3 is built into us as a survival mechanism. We want it there because if you're laying in the ICU or the ER with an injury, a trauma, whatever, fighting for your life, reverse T3 goes up because our bodies are so intelligent. It knows that we don't have to burn fat, feel good, grow your hair. When you're lying there hoping to survive, when your body is trying to shuttle its energy to healing whatever is injured. The last thing we want, however, is reverse these three be elevated when you're walking around trying to live life. When you're going to work, and you're trying to raise a family, and you're trying to get things done, we don't want reverse T3 high. So we have to test it, because if that's high, we have to find out why. We might have to change your thyroid medication, if you're on thyroid medication, you might have to dig deeper to find out underlying conditions, or insulin resistance, or estrogen dominance, all those things that can push reverse T3 up. We have to find out the why. So we test that. Then, last two, I mentioned earlier TPO, which is thyroid peroxidase, TPO, and thyroglobulin, TGA. Those are antibodies that tell us whether or not you have Hashimoto's. Now when we're talking about hypothyroidism, 95 percent of the time, 90 5 percent of hypothyroidism is the autoimmune form Hashimoto's that's when your body is attacking your thyroid gland because it thinks it's an invader. So other autoimmune conditions you think of Hashimoto's is an autoimmune condition. where your body is attacking your thyroid. That's what we see most of the time. Now, another 5 percent can be just hypothyroidism caused from, you know, disordered eating, starvation diets, um, chemotherapy, radiation, those kind of things. But that's only 5, about 5%. Most people with a thyroid problem have Hashimoto's. So we want to test that. We want to see where your antibodies are. We want to know. And that's all information that gives us that full picture of your thyroid health. Why is it that 95 percent of women are affected by, uh, by hyperthyroidism? Why is it most of it is for women? Most of it's women, yeah. And it's because we have, we have higher amounts of estrogen and lower amounts of testosterone. So elevated estrogen and just even just our fluctuating hormones, because our hormones are changing throughout a 28 day cycle. So our fluctuating hormones make us more prone to autoimmune disease. And then low testosterone, which I talk about a lot. I'm a big proponent of having optimal testosterone in men and women. Because when your testosterone levels are low, that actually kind of opens the door for that autoimmune switch to turn on. The other tie back to women are the, the big hormonal shifts. Pregnancy is a big one. So, I, I can't tell you the amount of women that come to me and go, you know, it was after my first kid, or it was after my second kid, that handbasket. Because that's when I started feeling like garbage and the weight started coming on. And it's those hormonal shifts that will turn that autoimmune switch into the on position. With any autoimmune, we have that genetic predisposition. The question is, what's gonna flip it on? What's gonna turn the light switch on? And hormonal changes, stress, pregnancy is a stress, even though it's natural, it's still stress, will turn that switch on. So you have been misdiagnosed, um, in the past and, uh, given, uh, mistreatments. What, what are the more, most common mistakes doctors make, you know, treating their patients with thyroid? Using T4 only. So that's what I was given. So remember T4 is inactive. When we give you T4, that has to convert over into the active form, T3. Now, T4 has two paths it can choose. It can choose the path to convert to T3, which we hope it does, or it can choose the path to convert to reverse T3, the antithyroid hormone. We don't want it to do that. Now, the problem with giving T4 only, and this is just part of conventional medicine thinking, it's what they were taught in med school. is that, oh, no problem, we know that most people convert. Well, if you really look at the biology, and you look at the fact that a healthy thyroid gland produces roughly 80 percent T4 and 20 percent T3. It's kind of a guesstimate, but that's a rough guesstimate. And then, just, let's use common sense logic, right? And then, someone's thyroid, craps the bed, not working really well, is destroyed because of Hashimoto's. Maybe it's taken out, maybe you have a total thyroidectomy, or you had a partial thyroidectomy, or you have radioactive iodine to destroy your thyroid because of a cancer that was found. I give you T4. Mmm. Wait a minute. If the thyroid gland once produced T4 we give you T4 only, how does that make sense? Why would we give you T4 and T3, which is what the body was producing originally when the thyroid gland was healthy and active and working properly. So it doesn't even make sense to give T4. And the other thing we have to remember is that conversion to T4 to T3, I, I liken it to running a marathon with hurdles, you know, kind of like doing like three Ironmans. There's a lot that can get in the way. If you are insulin resistant, if you are estrogen dominant, if you are anemic or you have low ferritin, if you don't have enough iodine, zinc, magnesium, or selenium, vitamin D, if you have a conversion issue through a genetic snip, the DIO1 and DIO2 genetic snips, a variety of medications. All of those can interfere. I didn't even cover half of them. All those can interfere with T4 to T3 conversion. So you can see that it's really a tough job to do, but conventional medicine says, ah, you'll be fine. You got this. Wait a minute. No, I don't. I, you know, I know I want to take the thyroid medication that is going to work best for me. And when people ask me, what kind of medication is your favorite? I go, The kind and the dose and the combination that is going to optimize you and we have to find that There is no one size fits all There's no way i'm going to give the same person the same pill and expect them to be optimized. It can't happen We are unique individuals. Our bodies are all different. We have to find what's going to work for you now that's where the issue is because now if I You know, let's say for example, I I do have those symptoms and I go to my doctor asking You For, you know, more testing done and you're testing, you know, T3 or reverse T3. What if my doctor, you know, I know that you said that, you know, change your doctor. You gotta go. But in reality, like Matt, like I put a person puts a lot of trust in the doctor. That's, I think that's where the problem is. Like, um, I went to my doctor asking if keto is good for me. And they said, I, I don't recommend that. Yeah. They're all going to say that. So that, yeah, yeah, yeah, that, that's a problem right there for me. But, um, again, like you, you really have to take control of your own health. You really have to know your body and you really have to, uh, be sensitive to what you're feeling. And if you're not feeling great after taking T4 only, then that's when you ask yourself a question and then go to your doctor, you know, Um, why I'm not getting better. Cause some people will just take that and, and go home with it. Right. And keep, keep taking it until like, um, when did you realize that, you know, T4 is not working and you had to rethink or re, frame your mind that it's not working and go to, and went to your doctor. How long did you had to take T4 until you realized, or what, or was it like something that let's just click right away? I gave it five months. I gave it five months and then no symptoms were changing. I did not lose a pound. I did not feel better. Yeah. Just nothing was, was shifting and changing for me. So that's when I started doing my own research. Like we all do, right. We go to Dr. Google. Yeah. And we start researching, we start learning and we go, Hey, now, I mean, this is 20 some years ago. Now we have so many more resources for people so they can jump into a Facebook group and they can post a question. And I see this all the time because I do have a Facebook group called Love Your Mirror and that's for the public and the public will come in and I'll see people post over and over and over again. Oh my gosh, I feel this way and I'm struggling and these are my labs and this is what my doctor put me on and it's usually T4 only. And there's a lot of education that has to go on and a lot of handholding for people kind of coming into the thyroid space, really searching for answers and searching for help. And that's where we just have to educate them and say, you know what? No, there's, there's more than one way of, of healing this and feeling better. You know, I look at you and you talk about how we can feel superhuman. And I look at you and you are an example of somebody that's very passionate in what you're doing. Very focused on what you're doing and that's where I want to be like you are a an example of somebody that's Really, you know energetic and really passionate that passion that came from you Also struggling and that now became your mission to help other people succeed as well So I really love what you're doing in your mission and Huge part of the reason why people find out about keto is weight loss, right? Um, it is known to induce rapid weight loss, obviously. And if, if done correctly, so. You've you've talked about the relationship of thyroid and weight loss on your podcast a lot and for our listeners Why should we check our thyroid if we are not losing weight? That's your metabolic furnace, right? That's the master gland That's what's gonna start everything. So I always say you could be doing things perfectly You could be doing keto the right way. You can be working out the right way You could be, you know, eliminating all of the endocrine disruptors, and you're changing your products, and you're getting the water in, and you're doing this, and you're doing that, and if you are not losing weight, that's when it's time to check your thyroid, because that is your metabolic furnace. That's your master gland. That is going to control whether or not you lose. And again, what biologically makes sense. We know what keto does to the body. We know it shifts you into being a fat burner. We know it allows your body to tap into your fat stores for fuel. It's trying to do that, but if you don't have a metabolism, there's no fire there. There's nothing there to allow the burn to happen. So it's not that Keto is bad for you. It's not that you're doing anything wrong. It's just you have to go back to the source of your metabolism and check that first. And a lot of your listeners, I don't know if you get into testing, but if they are testing, There are ketones at all and you're not seeing much love there and you're not seeing yourself getting into ketosis again That comes back to the thyroid controlling insulin. It's not even allowing your insulin to go down I can't tell you how many patients that I have worked with who have been doing keto for a long time And we check their insulin and it's elevated and it all comes back to the thyroid Once we start treating the thyroid then the insulin starts coming down and Now, we see the insulin signaling responding how it should respond. We see the glucose coming down, we see ketones going up, and it all comes back to optimizing the masterland. I have now a, I have now a new appreciation for the thyroid gland, because I've, uh, I, no, I thought I knew a lot about the thyroid, but when I listened to you, I was watching, just browsing through your YouTube channel. Man, there's a lot that gets affected from just this small gland that we have in our bodies. So, I want to know, like, what are some natural ways or lifestyle changes that we can do today so we can start that process of reversing? So big ones are number one, going gluten free because we know if you have a thyroid problem, if you have Hashimoto's, any autoimmune condition, really, that gluten acts as a molecular mimicker. So when you, here's another analogy, right? I always call those autoimmune antibodies soldiers. And your soldiers are going out and they're beating, they're starting a war, they're beating up your thyroid gland. Whenever you eat gluten, it actually looks chemically alike to the thyroid gland. So your soldiers go, hmm, okay, wait, there's that invader again. It's coming in. We gotta go start a war. So the soldiers are gonna go out and when you eat gluten, you're actually spurring on an autoimmune attack. You are causing those soldiers to go out and beat up your thyroid more. So, again, I ask, if I came over and beat you up, would you be a good worker? Like, would you be able to get through your day effectively? Probably not. You'd be laying in the corner all like, curled up in pain, just wanting to sleep. Well, that's what your thyroid gland's doing. When you allow it to get beat up, it's not going to work very well. So it's not going to produce those thyroid hormones that your body needs. Eliminating gluten is a big one. And again, I mean, not to be cliche, but I love keto. I love keto. I love low carb eating for everyone, but especially thyroid patients because you're reducing inflammation. You're taking down the insulin, you're doing your best to, like we said, we have to optimize your thyroid, but you're doing your best to lower that insulin response, to lower that, that insulin surge and lower inflammation. We know. So, the diseases of aging come from that high insulin. So whether it's cancer, Alzheimer's, dementia, Parkinson's, we, we were now calling Alzheimer's type 3 diabetes. That's all from high insulin. Insulin is that inflammatory. If you want to age quickly, keep your insulin levels up. If you don't want your thyroid to work properly, keep your insulin levels up. So if we do the opposite and we do everything we can to lower that inflammatory hormone, i. e. through low carb eating and keto, then it just makes sense. That low carb eating and keto is going to help the thyroid work better because it doesn't have that inflammatory burden on it all the time. So there's a lot here that we need to unpack, but I am really, really thankful for you being on and sharing your story and sharing your knowledge for our listeners. Um, my last question for you is, um, you know, Dean, you, you talked about, um, you talked about how our environment also affect affects. Our, uh, our thyroid, you know, lots of stressors around us. Um, Talk about how does environmental toxin plays in a role in the thyroid optimization. So we're right now we're living in a world that is more toxic than it ever has been. So to lose weight in 2022 is not the same as losing weight back in 1995 because we have such a heavy toxic burden on us now. Yeah. Food is being sprayed. There's pesticides everywhere. I mean, just even, you know, your, your laundry detergent, the, the, the body wash and body lotion that you put on. I mean, the, the sheets that you're laying in the carpeting in your home. I mean, we are just exposed to toxins ad nauseum and these toxins are actual endocrine disruptors. So they fall into a, a, a class of chemicals or toxins that we know impact the endocrine system. So we start to see Thyroid dysregulation just hypothyroidism left and right Hashimoto's that stress burden is going to flip that switch on that We talked about with Hashimoto's with any autoimmune condition and then there's the hormonal disruption, too So we know again that high estrogen interferes with t4 t3 conversion How many xeno estrogens fake estrogens are we exposed to I mean plastics BPA? Um, just, uh, the, the bad oils, canola oil, I mean, that will jack up your estrogen, uh, pesticides. I mean, the hormones in your meats, it's all of those are, are xenoestrogens that will falsely elevate estrogen in the body. Now you might not see that on a marker, but it's definitely going to impact how your body functions and how your thyroid functions. So I really think it's, it's the world that we live in that we really have to start changing as much as you can change. You know 80 20 rule 80 percent you can't control 20 percent you can't so as much as you can't control You have to do that and take that burden off of your body. I lied and I have another question for you. Okay So You're you're also a coach, right? I want to know what is your protocol for the first week for somebody that's you know You know, having issues with their thyroid and they don't know a lot about, you know, the issue, but, um, they, they approach you and, you know, obviously wanting you to help them with their issue. What's the first step for them? Um, what will be your first week for them? very first step is test. Don't guess. So your body tells us your, your labs tell us a lot about you. And that's when people will ask me, like, well, what will I be eating? I say, you know, your labs will tell us because that's really where we have to start to know what do we have to fix biologically? Because again, it comes back to, I can put you on the perfect diet. I can put you on the perfect sleep regimen. I can put you on the perfect exercise regimen. It doesn't matter if your thyroid is off or if your hormones are off. So we really have to start with testing. Testing, treatment, and then everything will work together. So I have a theory that, well, it's not really a theory, it's just a saying that I always say on my podcast, both and. So that's why I treat my patients, both and. We're not just going to work on your thyroid. We're not just going to implement keto, low carb, or whatever diet is meant for you. We have to do both and, because when we do both and, then everything works together. Now your thyroid's optimized. Now you get some bang for your buck for actually busting your ass doing the perfect diet, and getting to the gym, and sleeping well, and everything works so beautifully together. So the very very very first step is test. Don't guess I love it. Um, well, I had a blast. Thank you so much for coming on for sharing your story I want my listeners to be able to find you Um, where can people find you? Absolutely. So, like you said in the beginning, you can find me on all podcast platforms on the Thyroid Fixer podcast. You can also go to my website at DrAmyHorniman. com. If you are interested in working together, you can click, book a call, book a free assessment call. We'll go over your health and we'll kind of see where we're at now and see if you are right fit for any of my programs. And then of course, all social media, uh, Instagram is at DrAmyHorniman. You can find me, DrAmyHorniman on YouTube. So anywhere you go, you can find me. Awesome. Dr. Amy Horniman, thank you so much again for coming on and sharing your story. Your mission is, is something that, you know, I, I've, I've have learned a lot today from, from listening to you and your passion is really contagious. And just, I was really excited to have you on today and, you know, talk all about, um, thyroid. So I really learned a lot and I will really listen to this. So I make sure I don't miss anything. Dr. Amy. Thank you. Thank you very much. I appreciate it. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for tuning in to another great episode here on the ketones and coffee podcast. And we've had such a pleasure of hosting yet another amazing guest here, guys. If you're eager to learn ketogenic lifestyle, Be sure to check out the show notes. As a special treat for our loyal listeners, I'm offering an exclusive opportunity for a free consultation call. Discover how you can achieve success on the ketogenic lifestyle by simply referring to the details provided in the show notes. Take advantage, guys, of this unique chance to enhance your journey to a healthier you. And stay tuned for more captivating episodes. And until next time, guys, keep embracing the power of ketones.