Ketones and Coffee Podcast with Lorenz
Ketones and Coffee Podcast with Lorenz
Episode 179: Dr. Shawn Baker Talks Carnivore Diet and Metabolic Health
In this episode of the Ketones and Coffee Podcast, host Lorenz interviews Dr. Sean Baker, an orthopedic surgeon, international speaker, best-selling author, and world champion athlete, known for his advocacy of the carnivore diet. Dr. Baker discusses the impact of his 2017 Joe Rogan podcast appearance that popularized the carnivore diet, his handling of criticism, and his past legal battles with a hospital over lifestyle treatment of patients. He shares insights into the systemic challenges within the medical field, the limitations of traditional healthcare, and his efforts to promote lifestyle-based care through his company, Revero.
Dr. Baker also provides practical advice on adopting a carnivore diet and emphasizes the importance of patient support and community. This episode offers a comprehensive look at Dr. Baker’s journey and the broader implications of dietary and lifestyle changes in healthcare.
00:00 Welcome to the Journey with Lawrence
00:11 Introducing Dr. Sean Baker
00:43 Impact of the Joe Rogan Podcast
03:12 Handling Criticism with Professionalism
07:58 Early Days as an Orthopedic Surgeon
12:52 Legal Battles and Medical License
16:15 The Business of Healthcare
18:46 Carnivore vs. Vegan Debate
25:36 Cholesterol and the Carnivore Diet
26:28 Cholesterol Concerns in Carnivore Diet
26:41 Evaluating Metabolic Health
28:11 Environmental Factors and Cholesterol
28:40 The Debate on Cholesterol Levels
32:09 Challenges in Healthcare System
38:22 Patient Frustrations and Success Stories
45:50 Practical Advice for Starting Carnivore Diet
49:35 Support and Community in Carnivore Journey
51:13 Conclusion and Final Thoughts
Connect with Dr. Shawn Baker
https://carnivore.diet/shawn-baker-links/
Call to action for listeners: Follow ketones and Coffee Podcast on Instagram ( https://www.instagram.com/keton.esncoffee ), Youtube ( https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsZZmBEenvZnU8tA1npAODA )
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Hey guys, I'm Lawrence and I'm so grateful to have you joining me on this journey. Every week I bring in guests to have the knowledge and experience to help you on your own journey to a better health. So outside of this guy, stick around today. We have an honor of hosting a man that needs no introduction, an incredible figure of health, a role model for a lot of people. Dr. Sean Baker, an orthopedic surgeon, an international speaker, best selling author, and a world champion athlete. He is widely recognized as a leading authority on nutritional therapy and its impact on chronic diseases. It's an honor. Dr. Baker, welcome to the Ketonesink Coffee Podcast.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:thanks for having me. I'm excited to get to chat with you and chat with your audience. So I appreciate you giving me the opportunity. Thank you.
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Awesome, man. You know, I want to start us with, you know, many years ago, you did an interview 2017 changed a lot of people's lives on the Joe Rogan podcast, talking about the carnivore diet took the world by storm, completely shook the health community. A lot of people now swears by it talks about how they first started. Uh, when they saw that interview. Were you surprised about how that was, uh, received? Like, just looking back, uh, on that time.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:Yes and no. I mean, I, you know, when I went on Rogan's podcast for the first time, I didn't realize the impact that he had. I didn't really, I wasn't really paying attention, honestly, to his podcast, really any podcast to that degree. I mean, while I knew what I was experiencing and seeing was very powerful and had the potential to impact a lot of lives, which it has. And I certainly understood that at the time. That's one of the reasons, know, I talk about it and talked about it then and still talk about it today. Uh, but yeah, I mean, it was, it was, it was kind of very rapid the way, you know, all of a sudden you, you go from someone who's relatively obscure to now a lot of people know who you are and like, yeah, they all have opinions about you. Many people. in fact, even today, most
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah. Heh heh.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:kind of nutty, stupid. I look ugly. I smell bad, whatever. I mean, I get all these sort of things put my way. But yeah, I mean, it's, it's been, uh, a fun, interesting, entertaining sort of thing. This experience, I mean, to be honest, I mean, I've gotten to, sort of talk to all kinds of people around the world from, from politicians to professional athletes to and celebrities to, you know, and, and of course all the just day to day people, which, which I certainly enjoy talking to. So it's been, uh, it's, it was definitely a life altering in a way that I would never expect it. You know, if you had asked me 10 years ago, I'd be doing this stuff, I'd say I wouldn't have. In my
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:have anticipated what I'd be doing today, you know, I mean it's yeah life is funny that way I guess
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah, yeah, you know, I interviewed a lot of people here, you know, some of the leading experts on the ketogenic lifestyle metabolic therapies. They all, a lot of them talk about how they found your interview and started their journey. Uh, at that time, which is, you know, that interview has a lot, uh, had a lot of attention to it. Changed a lot of people's lives. Also with that, with attention, you know, also comes a lot of negativity that he talked about. But what I love about it is the way you handled it. You know, even though I thought some of these questions do not deserve your attention, you stayed professional. You know, you're cool, but I want to ask, like, how are you able to treat each criticism with just calmness, man, and patience, like to give even a detailed rebuttal, right? What, what do you get out of it? Like some of these people are you know, like you, you mentioned earlier, a few things, but, uh, you know, just you answered it with such professionalism, man. Well, what do you get out of that?
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:Well, I mean, I mean, I think some people are asking for a general sense of curiosity. I just don't understand. I've been taught in a way that is not consistent with what we're what we're seeing under observation. I mean, there's some people are just malicious, and I kind of more or less just kind of dismiss them or ignore them. But I think you know, I mean, criticism. I mean, it's words. I mean, you know, you know, the old sticks and stones may break my bones. You know, it's it's care. I mean, I've been in a lot worse situations where, you know, there was real threat to harm of, you know, myself and others. So, you know, I put that in perspective. So somebody, you know, saying, saying negative things about me, it doesn't, it doesn't bother me. I mean, I could care less. It's just, it's more of a reflection on that person than it is on me. I mean, I'm generally out here trying to help people. people. I'm generally out here trying to I'm, and I'm not perfect and I don't know everything and I make mistakes and I'm wrong about plenty of things, I'm sure. But the, the, the, the is, is, is genuine. And I think I've, know, I mean, and a lot of people, there's a lot of people credit this, but I think I've generally helped a lot of people and I want to continue to do that. And so, you know, in the beginning, obviously it was so new that a lot of people, you know, we're not scurvy. What about, you know, where, how do you go to the bathroom? I mean, these, these set of questions, which, I mean, it's, I mean, I'm not dead. I mean, it's like, it's, it's like one of these questions where it's like, like, it's totally out. Then you, you talk, you know, you can kind of speculate as why it may be going. We don't really know for sure. All we know is what happens, you know, what, what, what happens, what doesn't happen. And so, obviously as a physician, my whole life is. that's part of what being a doctor is. It's educating people. I mean, that's, that's the, that's the origin of the word. And so even when I was practicing as a surgeon, I mean, half of my practice was educating people on their condition, educating on why it's happening, educating them on what can be done about that. And so it's just, it's just a natural evolution of that. Now, like I said, I tend to have fun sometimes, you know, sometimes I, you know, I got I like to goof around. I like to have fun. Sometimes I you know, and I respond sometimes in ways people don't like me to. They think I should only talk this way and be a certain, they have a certain sort of expectation for what it is. But, know, uh, sometimes I disappoint people. It's, it is what it is. I mean, you can't, you know, I think there's one of those things where you can't please everyone. If you try to please everybody, you end up pleasing no one, particularly yourself. So try to be as, as real as I can because it's, you know, I'm, I'm, I think people that meet me, You know, our, our sort of not, maybe not surprise. I mean, social media is interesting in that it, it's, it's a weird platform. You know, things like Twitter, where you got a hundred and what used to be 140 character characters, and all you had time to say something. It's tough to project nuance and, uh, So I certainly enjoy doing these longer form sort of things so I can kind of elaborate on a position because a lot of people will make an assumption and that's the way it about anybody. You look at one video, a 10 second clip out of a video taken out of context and people make these, you know, huge assumptions. And that's the way this social media stuff works. A lot of people reacting to some Sort of a fragment of a, of a situation and, and, and getting in, you know, becoming outraged or feigning outrage or whatever it might be. So I don't, I don't mind. I mean, so some of the, like, like for instance, engaging with a lot of these sort of ethical vegans is, is kind of a waste of time outside of and entertainment purposes only. Sometimes I'll engage in it, but I used to, I used to make a good faith effort effort to try to, you know, answer the questions. Cause then I realized they weren't done in good faith and it was just, it was just them just. You know, kind of spewing their, their propaganda and, and so I don't do that so much anymore, but you know, and generally sometimes the questions I get are, are so odd or I've already answered them and people just don't even read the thing I post or listen to the video I put out there. So but I try my best.
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:You know, I'd love to confess, like I enjoy following your content, especially versus vegans. But, uh, like you said, you know, you're just being real and that's what we need. You know, a lot of people just want to say what you want to hear. Right. And that's what I love about, you know, just following your, uh, following your content. I want, I want to go back in time with you as a young practicing orthopedic surgeon. Particularly at the point where when you discovered the high fat, uh, carnivore, uh, diet, or maybe when you started ketogenic diet transformed your health for the better, uh, matter of weeks. And as excited as you were to tell the world about this, you soon found that the world didn't share that enthusiasm. Of course, you had, you know, You know, the, the battle, the legal battles versus the, the very hospital that you work for, they told you that you were giving your patients too much options, which is so, so funny. And at the time, instead of going through surgeries, you took the time to teach your patients how to, you know, change your lifestyle and the hospital you work for didn't like that. Looking back, what would you have done differently, if at all, you think?
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:Oh gosh. A lot, a
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Just curious. Yeah. Mm.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:when I went. I mean, I was a guy that, I still am, I'm a guy that believes that doing the right thing generally is what we're supposed to do, right? I mean, I think that's the way it is. And, you know, in medical practice, you know, as long as I try to do my best and do the right thing for the patients, that is, you know, what you're supposed to do when and, but you know, when I found out that if you try to do the right thing and it doesn't make a lot of money. a hospital, then that's a problem, which was very, very shocking to me. So I would have, you know, I would have, you know, gotten lawyers involved earlier than I did. I didn't know, you know, I was just, you know, this whole process, I mean, and basically, just a quick recount of the story. I mean, I was, We were trying to get patients to lose weight so they could have knee replacements because they were too, you know, too obese and they're having complications. So we decided, well, lose weight at any way you can, whatever, you know, it didn't matter. They said, just get them to lose weight. And so I had opted for using a ketogenic diet at that time. This is way back in 2013, 2014, something like that. And know, my patients were losing. Some of them were, were, I mean, many of them lost weight. A lot of them didn't do the diet, which, you know, It's, you know, I mean, that's just the way it is. A lot of people won't change their diet, but I mean, a lot of them were actually, uh, even without losing much weight, we're seeing that their pain was gone, you know, or essentially gone or minimized to the point that surgery became unnecessary in my view. And, so that was, I thought a great thing. You know, but the hospital said, no, that's not a great thing that we need the revenue. So we bet. So we pay for the pediatrics department, you know, and so on and so forth. And so,
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:so anyway, I mean, the, the, the long, you know, I ended up a long legal battle. I ended up surrendering my medical license. I ended up getting it right back, you know, after, after I got into a true independent review on the whole situation. But yeah, I mean, so it left a really bad taste in my mouth, so to speak for medicine in general and how it is. And, and, and so, I mean, if you look at the way, I mean, I think there's great physicians and most physicians are good people wanting to do the right thing and they're very smart, but they're just in a system that is just, it's set up to give people procedures and pills. I mean, that's all we're set up for. I mean, you think about, I just, in fact, I just did a video on youtube about this. I mean, as an orthopedic surgeon, I had an entire It's a multi million dollar facility, clinic, nurses, you know, nursing assistants, x ray technicians, a lab, physical therapists, an operating room, which costs 200 a minute to run, uh, recovery room, anesthesia staff, you know, guys standing around and x ray, you know, with lead aprons on, they'll stand there for three hours taking x rays while I'm doing surgery. I mean, this, this is all set up so I can do this one damn procedure, right? when you think about. What do you have if you want to have somebody do live cell? What do you have to, what kind of support do you have for that? Well, maybe you might have a dietician that you can send somebody to, who's going to give them, you know, FDA, you know, the USDA food pyramid. And that's it. If the insurance company, because you, you've gotten almost no
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Mm.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:dedicated to lifestyle as a position, nothing to support you. So it's hard to do anything, even if you want to do it. why I started Rivero. I mean, this is what our company does. We have, you know, we have coaches, we have, uh, uh, we have, you know, round the clock monitoring. We have, you know, daily feedback, you know, we have, uh, physicians that are open to get it there that want to do the lifestyle stuff. So it's, it's, you know, it's a matter of just. What we're set up for is a health care system and we're not set up for a lifestyle. And you know, I think if we were to
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Mm.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:gosh, even 10 percent of the financial resources in the lifestyle, we could literally completely change the outlook of chronic disease in this country. You know, most of the procedures, most of the surgeries I did were unnecessary. I mean, in retrospect, I mean, they could have
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Mm.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:I mean, yeah, you let it go long enough and it becomes end stage. Yeah, you're kind of stuck, but most of that should have been taken care of years, if not decades ahead of time, if we had a good health care system, but we don't. And that's.
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Mm. And I mean, looking back, right, you, you regained your license back eventually started, uh, the carnivore diet, right? Because, also, I want to go back because you could have taken them to state court, right? And you probably could have won,
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:mean, it's
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:but what happened was,
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:but
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Mm.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:was, it was
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:you know, I mean, the hospital suspended my privileges in, in basically what's called a peer review process, which is really kind of, it's, it's a really weird thing because you have, you don't even know what they're accusing you of. They just can accuse you of
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Mm.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:And they don't even, they don't have to tell you who the accusation comes from. They don't have to share any of the data with you say. We think you did bad
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Wow. Mm.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:And this all came as a result of me, you know, as
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Mm. Bruh.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:I'm doing a lifestyle, I don't care that you don't like it or not, that then I got hit with this peer review thing. And you know, it was, it was one of those things where, I mean, I, the details are pretty long and lengthy. I don't know if that this podcast is the best place to go there. Cause it's about an hour long story, but
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Mm hmm. Yeah!
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:Know, it was, it was, You know, I mean, like I said, it was, you know, the state, the state said, Hey, you know, the state license said, Hey, look, we've got a complaint from you. you can certainly contest this at the state board level, the medical board level. Uh, we're booked out for about a year and a half. So you're gonna have to wait a year and a half. It's going to cost you about a quarter of a million dollars to do that, which is a lot of money. I didn't have that
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Mm Meh.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:around. So they said,
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Mm hm. Mm hm. Mm.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:just go, we'll, we'll independently evaluate this at this facility that does that, you know, they're, they're nationally, they, they, they, they, they see, that's what they do. They, they're set up for the situation and I strongly felt that I was doing the correct thing. So I was, I was independently interviewed. Uh, you know, reviewed and they went through, you know, it funny. I was neuropsychological testing on me to make sure my brain was working right. And look through all my records and
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:no way!
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:it was a long, it was, it was a three day intense process. And at the end of it, they came out and said, look, man, there's no, no, you go, go back to work basically. But you know, then I had to reapply for my license, which took another almost a year by the time they got around to doing it. So, so I mean, you know, at that time, you know, it'd been like three or four years that had elapsed between the initial. suspension and me getting my license back, which takes a long time not to operate on people. And at that point I was like, you know, I can't just walk and it's like, you know, being a professional quarterback, not playing for four years and expect to start in the
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:You can't do that. You got to go back and, know, kind of re rev everything up and train
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:and I, you know, at that point I'd already, I'd already formed the other company and I was like, you know, I'm done with this stuff. So anyway, that's, that's water under the bridge at this point. I'm, you know, I'm I'm happy about what happened, but at
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:time, ultimately it's been a blessing for me because I
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah,
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:able to, you know, I mean the impact that I, that I feel that I've had and, and, and I mean, honestly, more so that the number of people that have actually been helped is. Because of that is, is actually immense.
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:yeah, yeah, you definitely paved the way from, for other practitioners to follow suit that there's another way if, uh, also do it more of, more so learning from your own, from others experience, like your experience going another route maybe not going directly at, uh, you know, uh, Um, you know, advising people with lifestyle, you know, they're willing to protect, they're concerned about keeping the way they are or what they're, what are they concerned about? What, what's, uh, what were your assumptions there?
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:Uh, well, I mean, medicine is, is healthcare is, is a business. I mean, it is, I mean, even, even nonprofit hospitals, the CEOs are still making 3 million a year. So, I mean, it is very much a business and that business depends upon sick patients having procedures and, and so on and so in utilizing the resources. And if you
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Mm.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:that, they're going to lose money. And people are going to lose their jobs. Uh, I mean, that's just the reality, you know, and so that, that's, I think that's it more than anything. I mean, you know, and obviously
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Mm.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:a human greed always comes into these things, but I mean, I think it's unfortunate that we have an entire industry that is based upon the suffering and misery of others and, and, and in a way keeping them. As repeat customers, you know, if you cure people and they go away, Hey, you're soon then you become, you become superfluous
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:and it's, you know, like I said, the whole
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:to just continue the, you know, it's, it's, it's disease management now. That's what we call it. It was no longer curing disease. It's disease management. How am I going to manage your disease for the rest of your life? Uh, you know, you know, semi annual appointments. medications, procedures, tests, you know, it's just continue taking tests, continue taking drugs, take, you know, continue taking new drugs, you know, continue, I mean, it's, that's what we're set up for.
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Mm. I also want to bring up, there's a sworn oath, right? Where you can't turn your back on like, An evidence such as, you know, let's say the ketogenic diet, you have like a lot of success with your clients to those who Really followed through the diet lost weight. It didn't have didn't have to do surgeries, right Which is you know another topic in itself, but it's funny There's a sworn oath, but a lot of people, you know, you know, turn a blind eye You know, obviously it's, uh, they don't want to risk their career over, over that, uh, their work for a system, like you said, which is unfortunate, uh, uh, for some, but, uh, yeah, again, like you said, it's a business with your recognition, you, you know, you. You said you started your own business, started your own thing. Of course, you're one of the most recognizable in the carnivore world. And certainly when you appeared on the Joe Rogan podcast, certainly brought all kinds of people to this space. And I would argue you are the face of the carnivore lifestyle. Carnivore people come to you for wisdom, but they'll also come with, you know, criticism, especially you thought we talked about earlier, the vegan community. I mean, I don't think anyone could have handled that. Better than you, like, I mean, it's quite enjoyable to watch. Like I said what I want to ask, what do you take away from that back to back, back and forth with them? And what do you hope to achieve? You know, just having that communication, uh, with, with, with that community. Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:of illusions that I'm going to, uh, convert a bunch of vegans to carnivore. Now it happens, certainly, and I, and it's kind of funny, some people that are my most vocal critics, to me two or three years later and say, man, you were right. I'm sorry. You know, and that's fine. I mean, I, I don't really, I mean, they're, they're, they're really, I mean, the reality is they're such a small part of the community. I mean, they're, they're, they're, you know, 1%, 2 percent of the population at most in most places. So they're, they're really kind of, you know, yeah. Kind of insignificant in number. However, they're very vocal and they've, they've, they definitely have had an impact and they are able to convert people, albeit mostly for a short time. Most people end up leaving as I'm sure you're aware, I'm sure they're aware as well. So I think that. You know, I don't care what somebody, I really don't care if somebody's a vegan or carnivore or Mediterranean diet or whatever they want to choose to eat. That's up to them. It's not my desire to, to convert a certain percentage of the population. I would like people to be healthy. I mean, I think we do better as a society if we had more healthy people and whatever gets you there. I'm, I'm, you know, I mean, uh, some people have been very critical of guys like Ted Naiman and Andres. I'm filled in the low carb community for doing their I said, Andres, if it works, good for you, man. More power to you. I hope, I hope you help a lot of people. Anything we can do to, to, to not have so many sick people because a bunch of sick people is a sick society and it's not good for, it's not, it's just not good. You know, I mean, my criticism with regard to the vegan community is, you know, more directed at what I think is information that is. You know, perhaps misleading in many ways, perhaps, you know, they, they, they often will tell part of the story. It's, it's, you know, they, they, they sort of mischaracterize a lot of, a lot of things and, you know, and they're, and, you know, they've got a lot of money behind them. I mean, they're very well funded. I mean, they've got, you know, Adventist Health Group, which is a multi billion dollar organization. helping them to generate studies, you know, organization like PETA and physicians committee for responsible
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah. Mm
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:college of life. So I'm all these multimillion dollar organizations that constantly putting out date, you know, doing studies and, you know, obviously bias studies in my view doing propaganda And, and we don't really have that much on our side. Even the meat industry itself has been very reluctant to, sort of, you know, do what I think is necessary to help promote this, this sort of carnivore or carnivorous or animal based way of living, which I think is, is, is a viable option for a lot of people. And it could be very beneficial. And I think you could end, end Ultimately, uh, uh, you know, significantly impacting millions, probably billions of lives at this point. So, I mean, it's, it's something that you know, like I said, you know, it's like there's an old saying, no man is useless. You can always serve as a bad example.
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:hmm.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:I use some of the vegan nonsense to say this is a bad example
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:point that out. And again, it's, you know, social media is. In many ways about entertainment. I mean, you know, no one
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Right.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:stuff. So you, and I, and I, you know, I get it. Some people just do outrageous stuff and flashy graphics and make controversial, outrageous statements just so they can get eyes on some of that. I disagree with some of it. I, you know, but I mean, again you know, I mean, it's, it's. It's fun sometimes because they say such ridiculous stuff, and it's sort of,
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Right.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:to, it's easy to sort of, you know, characterize them a certain way, and I mean, just like people will characterize carnivores as like, you know, the liver king, you know, here's a guy that's a carnivore. You know, acting
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:eating raw testicles, which is totally unnecessary. I mean, it's total garbage in my view. I mean, I think some of the stupidest stuff from the carnivore side, too. I mean, quite honestly. And, uh, you know, it's, you know, like I said, I, I, I. Anyone who listens to me over a long period of time knows that I'm fairly not as extreme as people
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah. Mm
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:I'm, I'm, I'm much more non dogmatic about things. You know, I get it again at the end of the day, as a physician, I just want people to be healthier and I don't care. a vegan diet gets you there, good for you. I would say,
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:hmm.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:But you know, to sit there and say, I'm a murderer or rapist or worse than Hitler because I eat too much. Steak is, is just, know, that to me is, is, is ridiculous. But anyway,
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah. Yeah. For the most part, I see you as a fair guy. Like, on both sides. Maybe we should do something fun with the vegans, right? Uh, what better to do a show of fitness and health than sports? Like maybe Kyber versus vegans? Uh, no, a game of basketball? What do you think? Dr. Baker. Yeah. Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:you know, I mean, well, I mean, I mean, that's, you know, I did, uh, there's a, there's some comedians, uh, got named Chad and JT, JT, par and Chad, uh, Kroger. And they did a little documentary on Netflix about, I don't know, two years ago, maybe a year ago, I can't remember, I went out and shot a video for that. And it was carnivores and vegans. Uh, we had three carnivores
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Mm,
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:and we all did some sort of weird pool, pool challenge. It was fun, they were nice, we were nice, it was fine, I mean. I don't know. I mean, you know, you again, I mean, with sports, I mean, it depends how good you are at the sport and you take somebody that's every day of their life does one thing. They're going to be really good at it. It doesn't matter what their diet is. You know, it's just like, you know, like there was an MMA fight. Well, if you got somebody who trains his whole life to be a fighter, I don't care what diet they're on versus somebody who's untrained. The fighters is. You know,
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:right.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:who spends time, I've been very fortunate that I've had success at a very high level in a number of sports. And I can tell you, it takes
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:amount of effort and time and work and expertise to get at a world class level. You know, I mean, so, I mean, you know, I mean, outside of entertainment and whatever, I mean, you know, I mean, because people like to be on their team, I don't know what good it would do. I mean, you know, I could see where it'd be fun, you know, like I really like, you know, the carnivores are going to win because of this and that, or the vegans are going to win because of this or that. Who knows?
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah. Who know? It's all for entertainment. I mean, get, uh, vegans off the streets, carnivores off the streets, just battled out and there's already a video out all for it. I didn't know that. I wanna ask you now about the Carver diet, the, the number one dietary enemy. For the past, what, half a century has been cholesterol, you know, shape, how we see, you know, lifestyle led to, you know, the rise of cholesterol, lowering drugs like statins. You probably answered the question about this, but about cholesterol, right? Hundreds of times, probably. I mean, it's one of the biggest reasons why the idea of eating an all meat diet can be, you know, An issue for a lot of people and many people report increased cholesterol levels starting in a carnivore diet How should people interpret that
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:Well, you shouldn't ignore
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:you think?
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:say, Hey, I'm on a carnivore diet and high cholesterol is nothing to worry about. I think that is, I think people that are given that space within the carnivore community are perhaps doing some people a disservice. I think it should be something you get more information about. I mean, honestly, I mean, it, it certainly could be that if you are quote unquote metabolically healthy, you know, no, no hypertension, you have normal, you Trigly, low triglycerides, high HDL, you know, you have low inflammation, you're lean, you don't smoke, you don't drink, you're not diabetic, you have normal glycemic control. It could be that having all those things means that the, the elevated LDL cholesterol, the elevated ApoB is pretty high. Fine. I mean, it could mean that. I mean, I can't say for sure it does. I know there's people that out there that proclaim it has nothing to do with it. You're fine. As long as you're, as long as you're truckless ride ratio, truckless ride HCL ratio is fine. You're fine. You don't have to worry about anything else. You know, I mean, I, I see where there's a lot of merit to that particular argument. However, I don't think it is something that you could just say, To every single person and everyone's going to be fine. I just don't think that's the case. I mean, let's just say that perhaps you are, you know, you're on a healthy carnivore diet and you've seen all these improvements in your metabolic health. You've lost weight, you've gotten leaner, you feel great. And, but yet your LDL cholesterol is through the roof, right? Could be that you're fine, you know, and I would suggest you get some sort of serial imaging to, you know, maybe it's CAC, CAC score, maybe it's cardiac, you know, CT angiography or whatever. There's different ways to measure this. it over time. See how you're doing, you know, and, and take the appropriate actions and what that is, what that might be. It's going to vary from person to person depending on what they're, you know, what they, what they are willing to do. I think that, you know, let's just say. You do eat a diet, but what if you live in Los Angeles and it's smoggy out all day and you're sucking in, you know, smoke all day long, you know, indoor air pollution that's causing some vascular inflammation that you don't, that you, you can't control through, through diet. What about those people? What are their cholesterol up high? Well, I don't know. Maybe, maybe it is a problem. Maybe, maybe it's an, maybe it's not enough to give you. It's not a pure metabolic disease, but it is cause enough to cause, some level of vascular, some low level of vascular inflammation. So I mean, I think it's something that we can't just flat out ignore, you know, like, like some people would tell you. And I think there's some people that, that are, that are you know, I'm, I'm willing to take a risk with myself more so. Then somebody I don't know, you know, I'm not, you know, like I said, I'm not here to tell people, Hey, just, know, go carnivore. Who cares if your cholesterol goes high? I'm not going to say that. we may get information down the road. I mean, as you're probably aware, you know, Matt boot officer, you know, UCLA study, Dave Feldman helped to organize this, got some data out there. That's interesting towards this. But you know, we're, we're, we're, we're, I think the science does not yet show that you can ignore it. In, in my view, and
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Mhm.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:it myself, I mean, my cholesterol isn't super high. I mean, it's higher than, like, would be standardly accepted, you know, by most cardiologists. However, it's not ridiculously high, like I see some people. So I mean, I think
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:it's one of those things where, you know, you, you just have to get more information. it, it could be that it's fine. And I, I mean, you know, like I said, on, in, you know, on the, on the lean mass hyper responder study, I mean, there are people with LDL cholesterol 600 that don't have heart disease. So, I mean. Yeah, I mean, it's, it's, it's, it's certainly possible, but, uh, to, to, to sort of even physicians out there saying you don't need to worry about it, me, I, I'm not willing to say that at this point.
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah. Are you willing to say that it isn't a great indicator of health? Because some people, some physicians now only look at cholesterol as the only indication of, uh, heart health.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:No, I don't think that's true.
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:I think cardiovascular disease is multifactorial. I think most people understand that. Uh, some people say it's a large, some people say it is the Number one thing you can affect because it's because you can give people a drug and lower it, right?
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Right.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:it you know, I look at it like this I mean, it's it's like, you know, yeah, I mean I could get rid of sexually transmitted I could get rid of sexually transmitted diseases if I cut my penis off. I mean, yeah, that's gonna work, but Is there a downside to that? I would argue. Yeah, that's for sure.
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Mhm.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:I mean, it's, you know, you know, it's, it's one of those things that you know, there's guys out there. They'll say, Hey, we get, know, we used to have, you know, used to consider up to 300 milligrams per deciliter. Total cholesterol is fine. That was normal. That was 2 40. Then it was 200. Now it's 1 90. And people pushing lower and lower and lower and lower because it didn't work. We lowered it from 300 to 2 40. No difference. 2 42 100. No difference to 200 to 1 90. No difference. And, you know, really heart disease incidents, but we just gotta keep going lower and lower and lower. That's, you know, it's like they're doubling down on something that's never worked in the first place. And
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Mhm.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:point where, you know, like I said you know, you can eliminate, uh, kidney disease by cutting people's kidneys out, right? And put them on dialysis. They won't have kidney disease anymore. But I mean, you know, I mean, I'm obviously, I'm making these preposterous It's essentially what they're trying to do. We can lower your cholesterol down to effectively zero. Yes, you won't have heart disease, but what else is going to happen? We don't know. I would argue we clearly don't know. I mean, they'll use called A beta lipoproteinemia, which is a genetic disorder where people have very, very low cholesterol, and, you know, saying, well, these people live normal lives. I'm saying, well, it's not the same thing. Genetic disease is not the same as a lifestyle or drug induced state. They're just not the same. And so, anyway, my thoughts on that in general.
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:So, but what is, what is So you talk about the CAC scan, calcium, uh, score test, which, you know, is probably hard to get for, uh, for anybody because I, I had a friend that, uh, asked his physician about a CAC scan and almost, the doctor almost, uh, was, uh, Offended just because what, what were you saying? Like, I haven't talked to you about that. I was just doing my own research and it's almost like the doctor was taking offense with, uh, requesting a CAC scan. Why, why do those things happen with, uh, physicians? And what are your assumptions? Do you think that, uh, may cause that, uh, reaction from a doctor? Right. Right. Mm hmm. Mm hmm.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:even know anything about this. I mean, there's many people in that situation. Some people, uh, in many cases, if a physician says, you know, to get a CHC scan and there's not like an insurance approved reason for that, that means they've got to sit on a phone for an hour. with insurance companies to get approved, and they just don't have time for that. So like, look, it's, I would, if, if I'd, you know, as a physician when you gotta see, you know, 40 patients a day and, and then somebody says, well, you now you gotta spend an hour on, on, on the line, on hold with a stupid insurance company, they're not gonna do it. It's just, it's just too much work for'em, quite honestly. I mean the good news is in most places. You don't need a physician to get a CAC scan, you can just go online and order it yourself. I mean, there's little pop up clinics that do it. I mean, there's little even mobile CAC scan places that can do this, so. You know, I mean, you gotta pay for it out of pocket. It might be 100, 150, it's usually pretty cheap. 200 at the highest I've, you know, that I'd seen recently. So, I mean, you can do that thing, but yeah, I mean, most physicians, I mean, even like ordering an insulin level. I mean, I, I, you know, it's kind of funny when I was practicing with peak, I was ordering fasting insulin on levels on people with carpal tunnel syndrome, which literally has no indication for it. But I was just curious. I said, I bet this purpose, purpose, person is hyper insulinemic I was able to get
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Mm-Hmm.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:After a lot of jumping through a lot of hoop and sure enough, these people were in that head carpal tunnel syndrome had hyperinsulinemia, which I, which I expected to see based on what I believe was going on physiologically. So, but I mean, it's, mean a lot, like I said, it's ignorance. It's the system. It puts up roadblocks to prevent it from happening. So yeah, I mean, there's, I mean, it's not always a physician being the bad guy. It's, it's sometimes, like I
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:the whole system just sucks. I mean, the system literally is just not designed for what, for
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:this sort of paradigm. It's just not designed for it.
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah. I mean, there's so many things that we don't know that goes on within the walls of healthcare system. You know, especially like, you know, somebody like me who, you know, didn't work for the system, uh, itself. As someone who has his own fair shares of run-ins with them, what is it that causes too much friction when it comes to. You know, you, you already mentioned a few things you know, when it comes to offering lifestyle change and diet change for patients, because that's what I ultimately want to see is getting more options for people. And you certainly did that, but, uh, it didn't went very well, but, uh, what do you think that causes too much friction for them, aside from the business side of things or is that the only one?
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:you know, one, most people, most physicians are trained in it. They don't know. I mean, it's, it's, it's not, there's not what you spent, you know, 10, 12, 15 years training about. I mean, you know, when I, as an orthopedic
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Right. Yeah. Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:I mean, that's 13 years of training and none of it was designed on how to provide lifestyle and nutritional counseling for people. So what, I don't know what I'm doing. I mean, you know, I'm an expert in something that this isn't it. I had to learn that on my own and become an expert outside of the system. You know, I took a long time to do that. There's that. And then there's no support, you know what I mean? Like I said, let's say I want, okay, let's say, Hey, we're going to, we're going to treat your diabetes with lifestyle. We're going to send you to health coaches and we're going to contact you every day. And we're going to get follow your feet, your lab feedback and we're going to have nutritionists that can really be on the ball that doesn't exist. There's no one to send them to. you're left to, Hey, go read this book. You know, good luck. I mean, there's, there's, there's this, and there's no, no financials and I don't get, and I don't even get paid for that as a physician. I'm like, so I mean, it's like, if, if, if you were, you know, you, a car mechanic and people paid you to, to repair their car and you said, Hey, I want you to mow my grass for free. You know, it's like, well, you know, that doesn't make sense, right? So, that, that's, that's, that's really the issue. I mean, there's no facility, there's no, there's no way to set up. So again, once again, I'll point out Rivera is what we've done. I had to create that cause it didn't exist. Uh, and, and so that's what's going to take. It's going to have, it's going to have to be, it's going to have to take patients willing to adopt this, willing to go there because most patients are like, you get sick, you go to the doctor, know, you, you go to the doctor for your animal visit. He tells you what, what your labs say and tells you what drugs should be on. I mean, this is, this is what people have been trained to do. We've trained the populace, we've trained the physicians and we've been trained by the pharmaceutical industry. It's true. The pharmaceutical industry has trained. I mean, we're, we're constantly inundated with TV commercials. You know, ask your doctor about blah, blah, blah. You know, I mean, you watch TV. I don't, I really watch actual like live TV anymore, but every time I do, I'm in a hotel, I'll put on a TV channel. every second or third ad is. It's this or that drug, you know, your problem with your psoriasis, your diabetes, your depression, your tardive dyskinesia because you took this other antidepressant, you know, it's on and on and on. And it's, it's, we're inundated with that stuff and, and that's, what the society is, is, is come to. So we got to fix it.
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah. And what, what does it take to fix it? I mean, you talked about a willingness to make a change, right? What does it take to become a willing patient? I mean. I've interviewed a lot of people who had success on the carnivore diet and ketogenic diet and what I felt, I feel like, uh, everyone has is that they're fed up with the system. So sort of, uh, they were failed by the system almost, right? Like myself, I, uh, you know, I had a major depression, you know, five to six years ago and I was, I was sent to, you know, Doctor after doctor, specialist after specialist, wanting me to, you know, take medication. But there's something in me that didn't want to take medication. I want to take another route to you know, alternative health. And so I, you know, dabbled into the ketogenic diet and then, you know, All of a sudden, and that was, you know, just for weight loss. I wanted to do it for mom, but then, you know, energy lifted and almost accidentally symptoms of depression went away, went carnivore rest is history. But that's because I, You know, I felt like the system wasn't, you know, doing it for me or, uh, I was fed up with with all these medications that's, you know, presented to me or, you know, it's, which is unfortunate. You gotta get to a point where you're fed up. And what, what have you seen with your patients that come to Rivero that, uh, made them so successful? I mean, you talked about a lot of success stories on your podcast. Uh, what, what, what's a common, uh, ground with those people, you think?
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:I mean, you know, part of it's similar to what you mentioned. A lot of them are fed up with the system. They're tired of having physicians that don't
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah,
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:them. And there's nothing worse than, you know, I mean, discovering on your own, Hey, this diet has really changed my life. I feel really good. I don't need these medications anymore. I've lost this weight. I don't, I'm no longer depressed. I'm no longer in pain. And to get to a doctor that says, you know, I don't think you should be doing that, you know, you know, great. But. you need more fiber, add your vegetables back in, or you need to cut back on red meat or, you know, whatever. I mean, that, that to me is, is one side of the frustration that people have. And it's just, it's sort of obvious if a patient is doing well, leave them alone, man. In a lot of cases. I mean, that's a, that's some, sometimes the case. Think a lot of patients You know, they have to make that decision themselves. I mean, there's a lot of people out there that just, you know, I mean, I've cut people's legs off that won't give up drinking Coca Colas and eating cookies. I mean, I mean, that's just the way it is. There's some people that, that, you know, you have to make a decision that, Hey, am. of being the sick person and I'm gonna do whatever it takes and it you might have to grind 10 years I mean, you know, you you mean if you sat on the couch and stuffed your face full of garbage for 40 years ain't undoing in in six months I mean, you're gonna probably you know, you need to grind for 10 years and then it never stops I mean you got to understand that you know, the only reason I'm healthy today at nearly 60 is because I Every day do what it takes. It's, it's, you don't, you just don't sit there and like, oh, you achieve something. And then you just kind of coast. It doesn't happen. You're going to continue. You've got to
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:yeah,
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:got to accept that day, you know, or almost every day, you're going to have to put the work in. And there's no shortcuts. There's no, there's no I mean, that's another, that's the latest thing that, you know, most people are going to, they're going to quickly become disillusioned with three or four years into it when they found out that, you know, I, you know, if I still don't put in the work, I'm going to still be sick and I mean, I might be skinny fat now and sick, or I might have some autoimmune disease or something else, or some God awful, you Intractable long term side effect, but you know, it's, it's, I think it's people that, I mean, it's some people that are, you know, like I said, this is a grassroots movement. I mean, there's no, I mean, whoever the next president is going to be is not going to suddenly sit up there and say, Hey you need to be on a, you know, a diet of non ultra processed foods and God forbid you eat meat and stuff like that. isn't happening. I mean, I mean, you know, like, like you, you know, like there's no corporation that's going to do that because it's not in their benefit. So it has to be grassroots and we need, uh, The people that want to make a difference to support what we're doing as a community, as a, as a, as a company, other companies like ours, you need to support us, you know, if this is what you truly want to see a change, not going to happen without the support of the people and, and as a, you know, individually, we're all relatively weak, you know, you think, what can I do against Bill Gates, what can I do against, you know, uh, Google or
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:You know, and, and that's what has to happen. so until enough people get fed up with it until enough people support people doing the right thing and what they feel is the right thing, still going to be, you know, I could tell people, you know, we got a big election coming up here in 2024 all around the world. There's like 45 major. countries having elections. It's huge, significant, but you get to vote every single day of your life and what you put in your mouth and what you buy and who you support, who you choose to support. And so every time you go to the store and you buy garbage, guess what? You give those people more power. All right, empower them more to take more control over your life. And know, once you realize that you're like, I don't, I don't want to give these guys any more money. They've already, they've been screwing us over for too many years. Why? Why? Why continue to do the, Oh, it tastes good. Oh, my kids want to treat. That's, a problem that really is. And so, until people wake up and do that in mass, it's, it's, it's not going to go away. And, you know, like I said, hopefully, hopefully people will. I'm, I'm pushing as hard as I can, you know, but like I said, I need help.
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah, no, absolutely. I love how you're sharing a lot of the success stories with, uh, your patients, uh, on your own podcasts and, you know, seeing that, you know, for everyone to see, especially with your, uh, with your pool, with your platform, it's really powerful for, for a lot of people, especially it's empowering for me. And, uh, hope for a lot of people. And, uh, just, you know, sharing, sharing your information, sharing your own success stories. I mean, if someone is listening if you are, you know, success on the carnivore diet, that helps too. Right. You know, sharing your condition. I continue to share my my, my journey from having a major depression to you know, relieving symptoms of depression to this day, because I, you know, I want that next person to know that, Hey, you know, there's hope. And I, if I could do it, you, you could, you could too. But again, the flip side to it is that, uh, you have to really give, give up a lot of things that you, that got you there in the first place, you know, like seed oils, grain sugar, processed foods, that's, uh, that's causing harm. And you have to realize that you have really have to accept that. Have to accept that you know, those foods are actually the ones that's causing harm in your body. You know, if, if you continue to do that and you continue to consume these foods whilst knowing that these are the foods that's causing inflammation, causing you problems, then you know, there's nothing we could do, really. Because you, you the person have to realize that. And accept that these foods are, you know, you're giving these foods, food companies control over you, right? Which is, uh, you know, you're taking away your power. Well, one last question for you, Dr. Sean Baker. Really appreciate you coming on here, uh, and, uh, you know, giving insights about your story. Your knowledge, wisdom about the carnivore diet. If anyone is, uh, Wanting to start a carnivore diet really willing to give this thing a try. What practical advice would you give to someone who wants to start?
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:Uh, you know, I, I mean, have fun with it. I mean, God, it doesn't have to be, you know, just sit down and eat ground beef every day. I mean, think in the beginning, particularly in the beginning, just, you might want to ease into it. You might want to have a quite a bit of variety, you know, when you start just to, just to sort of, uh, get there. I think don't under eat. I think, well, I mean, here, here's what I would, I think is one of the more important concepts that I like to talk about is, you know, I don't know why someone's doing a diet. Many people want to do it cause they want to lose weight or they have some sort of health issue and that health issue, if it's related to food was not from, you know, it was probably from eating. Who knows what some sort of garbage, probably most likely for most people you got to change the relationship with food. Why you eat? I mean, why do we why? Why do we have to eat? Well, we have to eat because we have certain requirements. We need essential proteins, essential fats. We need energy. need vitamins and minerals, water. That's essentially why we eat. You know, there's some. There's some conditionally beneficial, you know, nutrients that are out there. But I mean, why we have to eat are those things. And why do why have to get those things? But why do many people eat? Well, they're eat because they're bored. They're stressed. They're guy on the TV told him to because it's five o'clock in the afternoon and we're supposed to, you know, lunchtime or dinnertime rather. So you have to change the relationship with food. And, and. A lot of people, a lot more people than, than are willing to, were willing to admit have true sort of addictive problems with food and the food is designed to be that way. I mean, we've got an entire food system that has made addictive products and they know it and it's been, it's done by intention. Um, and in order to, to free yourself from that, and it really is, I mean, people talk about how it's a restrictive carnivore is, I see it as a very liberating diet. It frees you from this sort of constant, intrusive. unending desire to eat this stuff. It's always there. It's ubiquitous. It's cheap. It's, it's pushed upon you. It's marketed to you. It's propagandized to you. Um, so you've got to eat enough. I mean, you just got to eat like people out. How much should I eat? We'll eat enough. So you don't want a damn cupcake. I mean, I mean, it's simple as that. I mean, nutrition should not be a hard, doesn't have to be hard. And yet we make it hard. You know, we've got all these you know, calorie counters and nutrient analyzer devices and, and, you know. step trackers and just to, just to not be sick. I mean, it's like what other animal on the planet has to do that? None. I mean, there's no, no animal out there checking their Fitbit or looking at an app, figuring what the hell they're supposed to eat. So, I mean, it, it,
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Yeah.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:to be that way. So it can be simple. I mean, you know, like I said, there's all kinds of criticisms about this diet, but I mean, what I'll tell you is it's, it doesn't, doesn't provide you a bunch of ultra processed garbage provides you very high quality bioavailable nutrition. It provides you those essential amino acids and essential fats and oh, by the way, there's phytonutrients in meat, which most people don't know there's bioavailable, lots of bioavailable phytonutrients in meat. Most people don't even think about that, but it's clearly in there and there's clear studies that demonstrate that. So, you know, get some support, surround yourself with a supportive environment, make it easy. You know, don't make it hard for yourself, make it easy for you. You might have to, I mean, you might have to, you know, like find a different friend circle. I mean, you know, I mean, honestly, sometimes it takes, it takes that, you know what I mean? Again, they don't have to, they do not have to spend any time in your body if you're sick and suffering. You know, they're not going to be there when you're, when you're in bed and you can't sleep because you're damn, you're in too much pain or you, you, you, you, you know, you, you're poor. Too depressed or whatever it is. So you've gotta, you've gotta be a little selfish about it. And you've gotta, you've gotta, like I said, position yourself in a way that um, maximizes your chances for success. Join a community. I mean, we've got one at Carnivore Diet. I mean, there's, there's all kinds of other ones out there. As you guys are probably well, well aware of. A lot of people have their own communities right now. That's important. You know, get a, get a supportive physician. You know, I mean, I've got data on, you know, 12, 000 people on the diet, you know, the ones that had supportive physicians and, and, and families and friends were like 30 percent more likely to be successful. It's a huge difference. So get us, get supportive physician. If you don't have a physician coming to come to Rivero, we will get you on, you know, so you know, we're licensed in all 50 states. So, I mean, you get on our waiting list and we'll, we'll get you there. We've got a lot of people, 000 plus people on the waiting list right now. We're, we're bringing them in as fast as we can, but you know, it's one of those things that Put put as many things in your favor as possible.
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Awesome. Dr. Baker. That was a, such a insightful. Tip for our listeners here today. How can they, how can they, uh, enlist on, on the waiting list if they want, if they choose to
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:R E V E R O So R E V E R O dot com Rivero dot com. I'm just going there and it says, you know, I think it's a sign up on our waiting list We'll get you in there. We're working on me. We started in Texas in Florida We're you know, we're going next to New Mexico. Sorry We're going to New York, California, Washington We're in a bigger popular states and then we'll be going to the smaller states, you know As we Scale up because we have to, you know, we have to kind of hire, hire physician. We've got physicians that want to work for us. We can't hire them until we have enough patients. So it's kind of one of these, to grow at the same rate. So as we get more patients and we can hire more physicians and more physicians, we can take in more patients. So, so that's going to be, you know, it's going to be over the next, you know, several months, you know, the rest of this year probably where we start to, to ramp up all those patients. But if you want to, you know, if you want to get into that where you have a supportive physician then, then that's where you can go. So rivera. com is, is a great place to check out.
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:awesome Rivera. com we'll link down it down to into the description box below. So you guys can check that out. Dr. Sean Baker. Thank you so much for your time. Coming on, sharing your story with us today.
squadcaster-1ej1_1_06-24-2024_080624:the opportunity. Thanks so much.
lorenz_1_06-24-2024_110624:Awesome.
